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#1 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

Second match of Comic Vine's newest tournament, based around the famous short story, "The Most Dangerous Game."

Here's how it works. Pretty simple really, to anyone who's read the book. First things first, our power players in this match.

Mr_Ingenuity/Esquire

BuckyCap (Cap's Shield, SHIELD Handgun, Bionic Arm, Frag Grenades)

Taskmaster (Katana, Dual Pistols, Energy Gauntlet)

Once upon a time, these two men were on opposite sides of the law. But, as times change, so do people, and somehow they ended up living together on a mysterious island in the middle of the ocean. Enter team, err, Young Vence Z...?

NickZ/YoungJustice/CadenceV2

Solid Snake - OctoCamo

Revolver Ocelot - Duel Revolvers

Ultimate Hawkeye - Arrows and Bow

Ultimate Black Widow - Dual 1911 Colts

Solid Snake, in a standard Philanthropy mission, has been sent to this island after rumors of Revolver Ocelot constructing a new Metal Gear started swirling. Meanwhile, the two SHEILD agents have been sent to stop, not Ocelot, but Snake. Under secret orders from the Patriots, SHIELD was tricked into sending it's top agents to kill the soldier.

But that doesn't matter now.

What's important, is that these four have come together.

Some would say fate has brought these four together.

Those people are wrong.

Something much more simple than fate has decided these four men shall come together on this island.

And that, is the will of the hunt.

**********

Time: 12:34 A.M. Day: Unknown.

Taskmaster and Bucky prowl through the jungle. 5 miles away, Snake, Ocelot, Hawkeye, and Nastasha have joined forces to pursue a common goal.

Survival.

Armed with only the bare essentials: An empty canteen, a box of crackers, standard military fatigues, a survival knife for each of them, and whatever one weapon they decided to bring with them, these four are up against a move-stealing mercenary and a wannabe Cap.

Who shall come out victorious?

Rules:

Everyone is in character (internal squabbles may arrise, but everyone is deadset on working together to survive)

Jungle is 10 miles in diameter

Opposing forces do not know the location of their opponent

Win is determined by death. Nothing more.

Ehh?

#2 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not gonna be the at my best debating currently, no computer, but I'll do my best.

#3 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

Interesting, back with debate soon.

Online
#4 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: @YoungJustice:

Don't know your setup, but here is mine.

Note: This is a solo set up, a team set up will be posted if Bucky accompanies Taskmaster.

Taskmaster will take the high ground (tree tops) to prevent the most probable ambush , with the acrobatics of Daredevil & Spiderman, Peak Human stamina & the energy gauntlet mimicking a web shooter, covering a five miles distance is childs play.

1st is acrobatics 2nd web.

But unfamiliar with the terrain he wouldn't be any less than circumspect in his pursuit.

Note this scan on how he will avoid ambush.

Having Bullseye's superhuman accuracy and Captain America Shield skills will make for the best offence/defence in confrontation, not mentioning the other amount of copied abilities.

With movement down I'll let you guys take a shot, at the set up.

Online
#5 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

Though I can only speak for myself at this point, our team has a, though very obvious, also very effective strategy, that couldn't be easier to use, given each character's similar training and background.

A common trait each of our characters share is their amazing skill and adeptness at the art of stealth. Snake and Ocelot can speak for themselves, what with being the two main characters in the video game series that first popularized the stealth genre in the first place, and also being the two most highly regarded agents in all of their world. Hawkeye and Black Widow meanwhile, are similarly SHIELD's two top agents before Cap came along, and have extensive training in espionage and sneaking.

Both Ocelot and Widow are armed with duel weapons; whoever's willing can just hand one off to Snake so that he's armed, and then we can carry on.

With the king of sneak himself in the lead, our characters will sleuth through the jungle canopy, all but invisible. Snake can literally vanish from thin air (above) and has plenty of experience making fools of genetically engineered super soldiers; with Hawkeye and his enhanced eyesight following right behind, it's only a matter of time until we spot the muscle bound mercenary dressed in a bright white cape hopping from tree to tree. He won't exactly be very hard to spot, given the scenario you threw out, plus Hawkeye's superhuman eyesight which allows him to snipe accurately from a mile away wielding an RPG of all things.

Two of our characters posess super human accuracy, so once we spot Taskmaster, we'll just pop him and be done with it. He'll never see it coming, unless you think Taskmaster can be more sneaky than Solid Snake?

Next we have Bucky. What happens with him depends on whether he tagged along with Taskmaster or not. If he did, we just pop them both at the same time. If not, then we simply repeat the process until we find him, and finish him in a similar fashion to his buddy.

If this were to develop into an actual fight, I wouldn't be nearly as quick to claim a win. However, unless you can say that Taskmaster or Bucky are capable of outstealthing one of the sneakiest characters in all of fiction, who's tagging along with a top SHIELD agent capable of seeing through a one-way mirror, then I think we have this wrapped up.

#6 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: G2G but this is not how it ends. ◔_◔

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#7 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

@Eightworldwarriors: Despite you being extremely wrong (It shouldn't even be put up for debate), it is extremely rude and disrespectful for you to join a debate that does not concern you. Do not do this again without permission. Flagged.

#8 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@YoungJustice said:

@Eightworldwarriors: Despite you being extremely wrong (It shouldn't even be put up for debate), it is extremely rude and disrespectful for you to join a debate that does not concern you. Do not do this again without permission. Flagged.

This is a true troll right here. Ignore him. He'll get banned eventually, only to come back with another account.

#9 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto said:

Though I can only speak for myself at this point, our team has a, though very obvious, also very effective strategy, that couldn't be easier to use, given each character's similar training and background.

A common trait each of our characters share is their amazing skill and adeptness at the art of stealth. Snake and Ocelot can speak for themselves, what with being the two main characters in the video game series that first popularized the stealth genre in the first place, and also being the two most highly regarded agents in all of their world. Hawkeye and Black Widow meanwhile, are similarly SHIELD's two top agents before Cap came along, and have extensive training in espionage and sneaking.

Both Ocelot and Widow are armed with duel weapons; whoever's willing can just hand one off to Snake so that he's armed, and then we can carry on.

With the king of sneak himself in the lead, our characters will sleuth through the jungle canopy, all but invisible. Snake can literally vanish from thin air (above) and has plenty of experience making fools of genetically engineered super soldiers; with Hawkeye and his enhanced eyesight following right behind, it's only a matter of time until we spot the muscle bound mercenary dressed in a bright white cape hopping from tree to tree. He won't exactly be very hard to spot, given the scenario you threw out, plus Hawkeye's superhuman eyesight which allows him to snipe accurately from a mile away wielding an RPG of all things.

Two of our characters posess super human accuracy, so once we spot Taskmaster, we'll just pop him and be done with it. He'll never see it coming, unless you think Taskmaster can be more sneaky than Solid Snake?

Next we have Bucky. What happens with him depends on whether he tagged along with Taskmaster or not. If he did, we just pop them both at the same time. If not, then we simply repeat the process until we find him, and finish him in a similar fashion to his buddy.

If this were to develop into an actual fight, I wouldn't be nearly as quick to claim a win. However, unless you can say that Taskmaster or Bucky are capable of outstealthing one of the sneakiest characters in all of fiction, who's tagging along with a top SHIELD agent capable of seeing through a one-way mirror, then I think we have this wrapped up.

My Name is CadenceV2 and I approve this message.

#10 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: @nickzambuto: @CadenceV2:

Clearing things up. This is the armor of Taskmaster I'm using. The reason is he does not break the durability limit, the other armor protected him against Doom's attack.

Now in terms of stealth he does not use it much so there is no debating with it, but you must consider he is a team buster for other reasons.

Now with your team on the ground it will be better for Taskmaster because he is well above everyone in speed, agility, acrobatics, & fighting skill. I would also gladly debate reflexes against Ultimate Hawkeye.

Speed & reflexes in these scans. Easily blocks bullets with chains and catches a projectile.

Speed & agility in this scan. Taskmaster moves fast enough to run clear up a wall to the second floor after blitzing some guard.

Speed, agility and acrobatics here.

Fighting skill here.

For those who have forgotten, Taskmaster has Daredevils style.

Captain America & Bucky Cap vs Taskmaster. This fight is interrupted

Here is a good reason why Captain America tagged in Bucky. This fight was not finished, after Cap shows his energy shield both fall into the water.

A brief but notable fight with Iron Man.

And lets not forget his energy gauntlet. Which has offences of web, claws, & shield.

Before you go "he got shot in that scan". consider the following. It's more consistent of him being a bullet timer which is proven.

With all this I believe two or three are going down by Taskmasters hands, then he dodges the rest until Bucky has entered the fight.

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#11 Edited by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

I must say, that post scares me. Taskmaster is indeed beastly, in a one on one fight, Hawkeye and Ocelot are the only ones who stand a chance, and that's only thanks to their weapons.

That's why I'm ever so thankful that I chose Solid Snake as my power player, and also equipped him with his OctoCamo suit.

That suit can mimic the color, pattern, and even the surface texture of walls and floors.

Basically, it's an all purpose camo outfit. Whatever surface Snake is lying on, the suit autimatically copies it, making him all but invisible.

Snake was already a top tier stealthsman without the suit, but with it, nobody is finding him. You already admitted Taskmaster doesn't have the stealth skill to keep up with the opposition, so there's really nothing stopping my original plan from progressing. Regardless of the mercenaries combat prowess, if he can't see his opponent, he can't stop them from popping him in the back of the head.

There's not much more to say on that front, but for the sake of the debate, I'll continue. Worst case scenario is Taskmaster and Bucky somehow reduce this to a fair fight. I already stated that none of my guys can beat either of them one on one, with the possible exceptions of Hawkeye and Ocelot, but where our advantage lies, is in the fact that there won't be any one on one fights. We outnumber you guys 4 against 2, optimally, Snake and Ocelot can double team Bucky while Hawkeye and Widow do the same to Taskmaster.

Starting with the two SHIELD agents, Taskmaster's death will be secured by our unparalleled teamwork, if anything. Hawkeye and Black Widow have been working together since, like, forever, and as such have developed an almost supernatural level of teamwork.

The plan is simple; Taskmaster has never had the chance to study Widow's style before, so she'll be the one to go after him. It's been proven that Taskmaster can be thrown off by a new opponent, and with Nastasha's million dollar SHIELD enhancements, she's more than capable of holding the mercenary while her partner sleuths around to the side and pops him in the head.

Hawkeye doesn't miss. He fires his arrows almost at automatic speeds, and kills large groups of enemies before any even knew what happened. Taskmaster will never see it coming.

Meanwhile, we have Snake and Ocelot taking on Bucky. Our strategy will be relatively the same; fight off the enemy, then pop them from behind. Only difference this time is, BOTH of our combatants will be taking Bucky on.

Ocelot is an extrordinary hand to hand combatant who dents steel with his bare fists and jumps 40 friggin feet in the air. Snake is his dead equal, with metahuman reaction time and durability. Together, these two will give Bucky the toughest fight of his life.

The two agents also possess an incredible level of teamwork, but in a different way. Watch as they throw out the exact same move, at the exact same time, literally matching each other at every turn. They're so totally in tune with each other, it's only natural that it would transcend into perfect teamwork.

So while these two are fighting, keeping Bucky on the ropes, Ocelot will wait for his chance, then spring the finisher.

A young Ocelot shows off his shooting skills by killing an entire KGB platoon in a nanosecond without anyone even reacting, nailing a few neat trick shots in the process. He's only gotten better with age, quote, "I understand the bullets you see. I make them go where I want."

Bucky may have a shield, but once Ocelot bounces a couple bullets off a tree, the wannabe Cap can say goodbye to his ribcage.

#12 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Added to this is Black Widows Skill and Speed herself.

BW Saves her 2 Soilders and jumps on the Blackbird tacking off to plant mines. Thats Speed and Skill. She also lands without a Parachute.

As Seen her Peak Human Speed is enough to blast away Aliens while running Olympic Gold Sprint and Jump the distance from Building to Building. During Landing she Snipes the Aleins for Hawkeye on the slide.

Girl got skills.

#13 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

My computer is back! I will be debating soon.

#14 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: You misunderstood me.

You already admitted Taskmaster doesn't have the stealth skill to keep up with the opposition, so there's really nothing stopping my original plan from progressing. Regardless of the mercenaries combat prowess, if he can't see his opponent, he can't stop them from popping him in the back of the head.

Taskmaster does not use his stealth option in fights but it does not mean he cannot detect stealth opponents. Or react to bullets without for warning.

Secondly he will by no means engage your team on the ground.

1) He would lose the option of cover.

2) He would lose the option of mobility, unable to launch continuous attacks from different positions.

Plus he can disarm your whole team with cap skills and has the convenience of the shield reforming due to energy gauntlet.

Or web every one up.

The web is strong enough to support Taskmasters weight in full swing so I doubt anyone here breaks threw it.

All this while keeping in the tree tops.

A young Ocelot shows off his shooting skills by killing an entire KGB platoon in a nanosecond without anyone even reacting, nailing a few neat trick shots in the process.

Considering it take the human brain around 80 nanoseconds to perceive that light bulb has been turned on & we perceive it as instant I challenge this statement(mostly the bold).

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#15 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

I like how Cadence tagged himself instead of me. As if he needed to be alerted he was making a post.

Anyway...

Taskmaster does not use his stealth option in fights but it does not mean he cannot detect stealth opponents.

Never to anyone of Snake's caliber. I refer you to the video in my first post, where through a crowded battlefield Snake knew that soldier was coming at him without even looking, then proceeded to pretty much teleport behind him.

Or react to bullets without for warning.

He had plenty of warning in that scan. He was staring right at her as she whipped out her gun.

If everything goes according to plan, Taskmaster won't even see Hawkeye as he pulls back his quiver, and thus will never react to the silent arrow as it glides towards him.

Secondly he will by no means engage your team on the ground.
2) He would lose the option of mobility, unable to launch continuous attacks from different positions.

So you're saying that if Taskmaster spots us, he'll just jump around the trees and try to take us all out at range? That should actually make this a lot easier for us, as I seriously doubt Taskmaster can beat any of our guys in a shootout, let alone all four of us.

If Taskmaster wants to keep this at range, Hawkeye can take him solo, considering he can spin around, aim, and fire four arrows with perfect accuracy before these two police officers can even twitch their fingers.

Plus he can disarm your whole team with cap skills and has the convenience of the shield reforming due to energy gauntlet.

What? Ok, beating a few random guards is a lot different from effortlessly defeating four of the greatest agents... ever. You say Taskmaster can just jump around and disarm us all as if it's no big deal - it is a big deal, something he won't be able to do when facing 4 characters all with superhuman reaction time.

The web is strong enough to support Taskmasters weight in full swing so I doubt anyone here breaks threw it.

So the web can support about 200 pounds? I'm decently sure our guys can snap that... pretty easily. If it tags them at all that is.

Considering it take the human brain around 80 nanoseconds to perceive that light bulb has been turned on & we perceive it as instant I challenge this statement(mostly the bold).

It was a hyperbole, but I could just as easily say normal men don't become master martial artists by watching Bruce Lee movies. My point was that he killed them all before any could even process what had just happened. Ocelot can even autofire at high speeds by pulling the hammer back and then pushing the trigger in rapid succession.

9:14

In conclusion, if your plan is to keep it a distance and try to have a shootout with Solid Snake, Revolver Ocelot, Ultimate Hawkeye, and Ultimate Black Widow all at once... you're going to lose. Taskmaster's best bet is to come in as close as possible for hand to hand, but as I explained above, we should still win either way.

#16 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Old Snake beets Rebels 4:00

Point is Solid Snake is a Master CC Fighter as well.

Task Master is not winning this Easily in CC either.

#17 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Bamsky

#18 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

Bamsky

Well, I already posted the Old Snake vs Liquid Ocelot fight, and I was saving the other two...

But thanks.

:P

#19 Edited by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

As much as Cadence claims the contrary, it's apparent he doesn't actually know much about MGS.

Here's the real Snake vs Liquid fight.

#20 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: You were using my Stash so I used yours lol.

#21 Edited by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@nickzambuto: You were using my Stash so I used yours lol.

I like how you made your post, then came back an hour later just to say "bamsky"

#22 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: Been drinking.... alot tonight... little slow. Using Spell check like no tommorow. Need to go to bed with wife.

#23 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2 said:

@nickzambuto: Been drinking.... alot tonight... little slow. Using Spell check like no tommorow. Need to go to bed with wife.

You're always drinking.

#24 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: ...... yes i am.

#25 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: @CadenceV2:@YoungJustice:

Never to anyone of Snake's caliber. I refer you to the video in my first post, where through a crowded battlefield Snake knew that soldier was coming at him without even looking, then proceeded to pretty much teleport behind him.

Considering most if not all street level heroes are above Snake in all physical areas I doubt that. You should also note he has that eye patch that maps out surroundings. he has skills but none of those skills put him anywhere near Taskmaster who could take on Batman in a random in counter. Although you did admit none were a match solo (until later).

He had plenty of warning in that scan. He was staring right at her as she whipped out her gun.
If everything goes according to plan, Taskmaster won't even see Hawkeye as he pulls back his quiver, and thus will never react to the silent arrow as it glides towards him.

Actually he did not. He had spent two pages prior performing his double speed technique, while bleeding out, just to beat a bullet timer.

Here are the scans. In the last panel matches up to the first in the scan above with him looking away.

See below

.

So you're saying that if Taskmaster spots us, he'll just jump around the trees and try to take us all out at range? That should actually make this a lot easier for us, as I seriously doubt Taskmaster can beat any of our guys in a shootout, let alone all four of us.
If Taskmaster wants to keep this at range, Hawkeye can take him solo, considering he can spin around, aim, and fire four arrows with perfect accuracy before these two police officers can even twitch their fingers.

He did that will fighting the avengers and it worked out great with regular equipment.

Reacts to 616 Hawkeye's arrow. Who is not far behind in skill of Ultimate Hawkeye. Arrows are not a problem.

What? Ok, beating a few random guards is a lot different from effortlessly defeating four of the greatest agents... ever. You say Taskmaster can just jump around and disarm us all as if it's no big deal - it is a big deal, something he won't be able to do when facing 4 characters all with superhuman reaction time.

Sarcasm? ¯\(°_o)/¯

Range would not increase your chances of beating Taskmaster. It would surely decrease with Taskmaster copying there gunplay skills (if they are any good):P and picking you off with his equipment. And all I see is superhuman reaction time on two counts. It's nothing that suggest Taskmaster can't dodge.

The web is strong enough to support Taskmasters weight in full swing so I doubt anyone here breaks threw it.
So the web can support about 200 pounds? I'm decently sure our guys can snap that... pretty easily. If it tags them at all that is.

At 5 mph 200 lbs turns into 447.04 lbs of force.

This scan shows him escaping an exploding restaurant.

If he if he swings out at the the speed of 20mph that is 1788.16 lbs of force. Now you can call all this speculation but it is inferred that this is just as strong as Spiderman's web.

In conclusion, if your plan is to keep it a distance and try to have a shootout with Solid Snake, Revolver Ocelot, Ultimate Hawkeye, and Ultimate Black Widow all at once... you're going to lose. Taskmaster's best bet is to come in as close as possible for hand to hand, but as I explained above, we should still win either way.

Taskmaster works in an equalizing way. If once he disarmed most if not all of your guys/gal he would engage in hand to hand.

But do not forget Bucky Cap has yet to enter the fight. Which will not be favorable for your guys. (•‿•)

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#26 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

Considering most if not all street level heroes are above Snake in all physical areas I doubt that.

...........Hardly. Something tells me you have some serious misgivings about the man who makes the impossible, possible. Do you even play MGS? Do you even lift?!

Solid Snake is a fine human specimen and a true model for what the American Special Forces want to produce, he has incredible endurance, strength and speed, has been trained in the use of various fire arms, is a stealth and hunting expert, wide variety of knowledge and skill in hand to hand combat, knows multiple languages, and won't break under torture.

David can dodge close range gunfire with little or no prior warning, making his reflexes superhuman. He weaves through machine gun fire, and while repelling down a tower from a rope, can dodge chaingun attacks and missiles launched from a helecopter 5 feet away from him. Even in his old age, David proved capable of seeing, and reacting to a mach 40 Rail Gun blast, soldifying his reaction time as hypersonic.

15:20

In addition, Solid Snake possesses an inhuman level of stamina and durability; while the average height a human can fall into water from without breaking bone is 90 feet, Snake took a dive off Arsenal Gear, which would be pushing 300 feet, outswam a giant robot, placed a tracker on his brother, swam miles back to shore, ran all the way to Federal Hall, all in time to give Raiden a speech about memes. And he wasn't even out of breath.

50 second mark.

That is but a fraction of the testicular fortitude possessed by the man known as Solid Snake. Trust me, if he was as grossly outmatched as you make him out to be, I wouldn't be using him in this tourney.

You should also note he has that eye patch that maps out surroundings.

Those ignorant of a series should not try to point out facts. Throughout his four decade long military career, and the hundreds of missions he undertook, Snake used the Solid Eye once. So no, he's hardly that reliant on it. His senses are far more crucial, as have been noted several times.

Snake went prone upon the gravel, and his camouflage shifted to blend in. Slowly, he crawled through the open streets like an inchworm. The area outside the base provided no cover, but Snake, utilizing Native American tracking techniques, gave the soldiers nothing to see and nothing to hear.

Of course the OctoCamo was a major factor in his success, but Snake's sense of connection with the world around him was even more crucial. He was part of his surroundings, a part of the world. By closely matching himself in with that baseline, he could be more stealthy then what might seem possible.

Snake's superhumanly accute senses and natural connection with the world are what's important, and what he's survived off of for this long. It's what let's him sneak up on invisible people.

Taskmaster who could take on Batman in a random in counter.

Completely subjective. That's a debate for another day. It has no baring on this match considering the two have never met before.

Actually he did not. He had spent two pages prior performing his double speed technique, while bleeding out, just to beat a bullet timer.
Here are the scans. In the last panel matches up to the first in the scan above with him looking away.

Either way, an arrow doesn't make a lot of noise, so Taskmaster can't go off that. Maybe if he saw his enemy he could avoid the attack - but he won't.

He did that will fighting the avengers and it worked out great with regular equipment.

All the Avengers did was try to bum rush Taskmaster, which is exactly what he wanted. Hawkeye has never been the up close type, so the same doesn't apply. If Taskmaster wants a shootout, against a far superior marksman, he'll get one.

Reacts to 616 Hawkeye's arrow. Who is not far behind in skill of Ultimate Hawkeye. Arrows are not a problem.

Actually, Ultimate Hawkeye is quite a bit above 616. Clint from 1610 fires his arrows like a machine gun, scores moving targets from a mile away with an RPG, looks through a one-way mirror, and assassinates a group of armed men with his fingernails, while tied up and being tortured.

Powers and explosions going off left and right, all out war is being raged, complete chaos envelops the area, and Hawkeye is still on target, midair, while dodging attacks, with shards of glass.

Range would not increase your chances of beating Taskmaster. It would surely decrease with Taskmaster copying there gunplay skills (if they are any good):P and picking you off with his equipment. And all I see is superhuman reaction time on two counts. It's nothing that suggest Taskmaster can't dodge.

Taskmaster can't copy powers, right? If not, he can't copy Ultimate Hawkeye's accuracy.

Yes, his shooting skills is literally superhuman.

I understand that it may be hard to read, so I'll explain it. Pretty much, the doc remarks how Olympic athletes spend thousands of hours perfecting their sport. But Ult. Hawkeye showed up at the qualifications, took a bow and arrow, and got a bullseye from 100 yards. This is because Ultimate Hawkeye had an unfair advantage. The doc explains how the normal human has a hundred and fifty million rod cells in their eyes. Clint has four million. On top of that, he has enhanced muscles around the eyes that allow for orb distortion, giving him the ability to focal length. Clint then explains that he also has fewer cones in his eyes and that he sees things in black and white--what's real and what's not real. Because of this, he knew that Nick Fury and a shield agent was right behind the glass mirror. (shout out to Fetts for that ;D )

Unless Taskmaster has a healing factor so advanced that he can grow extra rod cells while simultaneously dropping cones and mentally forcing himself colorblind, then he's not copying Hawkeye's accuracy.

The most he can do is probably not worth it, considering Taskmaster is already a good shot. As such, we're right back where we started - Taskmaster, up against four incredible marksman all at once. We've already established Hawkeye's accuracy. Ocelot is just a step off from him. Widow is a top SHIELD agent for a reason as Cadence showed on the last page. And then there's Snake.

Just watch the first few minutes. Snake easily avoids sniper fire by nothing but the sound of the shot alone, then proceeds to best Sniper Wolf in a duel. Sniper Wolf is the best shot in all of FOXHOUND, possessing near supernatural aim, having been in war since the day she was born.

Once Wolf shoots Snake's rifle out of his hands, he, uhh... just watch it. If that's not gun skill I don't know what is.

Now, all that said, there's still nothing preventing Taskmaster from being arrow sniped, and Bucky too for that matter.

#27 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: Hahahaha.

I'll respond to everything else later.

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#28 Posted by Esquire (3833 posts) - - Show Bio

@Mr_Ingenuity:

Okay, sorry it's taken me so long. I need to stop signing up for so much stuff. Or stop having a life. :P

Anyway, Bucky! He'll be following Taskmaster, keeping a little distance and using his Winter Soldier stealth training to keep undetected. This will give our team a far better chance of detecting yours, and since both of them have Bullet-Time reflexes, if you shoot at one you won't be able to get the other. Both have been shown to take a bullet or two without going down, and Bucky has Cap's shield to defend himself from damage.

Sorry this is short, I'll post some more later.

#29 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

I got Esquire guys ;)

#30 Edited by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: @CadenceV2: @YoungJustice:

Either way, an arrow doesn't make a lot of noise, so Taskmaster can't go off that. Maybe if he saw his enemy he could avoid the attack - but he won't.

A bullet a point blank range at his head and he simply grabs it. There is no way I'm letting you wave that off. Other than Daredevil, and Spider Man I can say without a doubt who could pull that off.

Geat scan of Ultimate Hawkeye. But Taskmaster dealt with superhuman accuracy before, he also has Bullseye's superhuman accuracy with household items & guns.

And lets not forget he has Spiderman's speed & agility and with Captain America's near perfect shield defences/offences.

Adding he is able to use most/all of his copied moves at the same time.

He did it here.

He may not be able to completely copy Spiderman but it shows he's able to continually switch styles gaining the upper hand at every turn.

Meaning Ultimate Hawkeye's arrows will be met by a shield every time he goes for a kill shot. I have proven his reflexes in multiple scans.

Now you may keep going with arrow, and gun play but I understand before anyone gets tagged both will be out of ammo.

That will leave your team defenceless. While My team still has their melee weapons and webbing for range.

@Esquire: Great to see you.

With it now confirmed BuckyCap will be tagging along a lot is changed for the better. With Buky close it only will take moments for your forces to get divided.

So we no longer have to debate the better out of four on one.

And I've already come to the conclusion of range weapons. No matter what two Taskmaster is paired against.

It may still be debatable against BuckyCap, but I sincerely doubt it.

Online
#31 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

A bullet a point blank range at his head and he simply grabs it. There is no way I'm letting you wave that off. Other than Daredevil, and Spider Man I can say without a doubt who could pull that off.

The bullet was close range, but point blank would be if it was pressed up against his head.

Either way, I think we have a misunderstanding. If Taskmaster gets into a fight with Hawkeye, he'll dodge, snatch, and catch every thing he throws out. However, how do you expect him to defend himself from an arrow, when he doesn't even know Hawkeye is there? He doesn't even know the arrow was shot, until after he feels it pierce his skull.

Geat scan of Ultimate Hawkeye. But Taskmaster dealt with superhuman accuracy before, he also has Bullseye's superhuman accuracy with household items & guns.

Still, when Ultimate Hawkeye alone is arguably better than Bullseye, factor in three other amazing marksman and Taskmaster winning by webbing everyone up is seriously doubtful.

Meaning Ultimate Hawkeye's arrows will be met by a shield every time he goes for a kill shot. I have proven his reflexes in multiple scans.
Now you may keep going with arrow, and gun play but I understand before anyone gets tagged both will be out of ammo.

False.

Taskmaster's shield can only block in one direction. If four expert marksman shoot at him all at the same time, he'll be on the ropes until, eventually he either falls back, or gets shot.

Ultimate Hawkeye has tagged Ultimate Venom, Sabretooth, and even Spider-Man before, which is no easy feat considering the guy dodges lightning, dances around chaingun attacks, and avoids multiple police officers shooting at him while bleeding out.

It may still be debatable against BuckyCap, but I sincerely doubt it.

Tsk tsk, selling you're partner down the river so readily? For shame...

Do something ya no good lazy bums.

#32 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll be on it first thing tomorrow.

#33 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@YoungJustice said:

I'll be on it first thing tomorrow.

YOU ALREADY SAID THAT

#34 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: @YoungJustice: @CadenceV2:

The bullet was close range, but point blank would be if it was pressed up against his head.
Either way, I think we have a misunderstanding. If Taskmaster gets into a fight with Hawkeye, he'll dodge, snatch, and catch every thing he throws out. However, how do you expect him to defend himself from an arrow, when he doesn't even know Hawkeye is there? He doesn't even know the arrow was shot, until after he feels it pierce his skull.

Point blank is within a meter distance, but we do not need to discuss this.

The 1st check, 2nd and 3rd not what I said I have used those scans to prove his reflexes. In which you have down played from the being as if he's a swinging brick.

More reflexes. He's in the middle of a speech and causally grabs Moon Night's crescent dart.

1) We are meeting you head on & you have posted nothing to suggest otherwise. Stealth does not factor this out unless your team were to move to the edge of the island.

2) Taskmaster is traveling overhead with web. With trees providing a natural cover & using 616 Spiderman's speed (who is faster :P) agility and acrobatics. I still see know reason he cannot dodge or utilize Cap's shield technique. Or both (see above/below for proof).

Spiderman's speed, agility, and acrobatics. Punisher's gun skills.

And if you did not know he has complete knowledge of Cap's fighting style.

More scans of him using Spiderman's style.

And if none of that satisfies you here is Taskmaster fighting a piss off Spiderman.

Still, when Ultimate Hawkeye alone is arguably better than Bullseye, factor in three other amazing marksman and Taskmaster winning by webbing everyone up is seriously doubtful.

Web is an option I push the use of it because you have ignored it.

False.
Taskmaster's shield can only block in one direction. If four expert marksman shoot at him all at the same time, he'll be on the ropes until, eventually he either falls back, or gets shot.

We were just debate arrows and now it's all four. But it does not matter at this point I have confirmed reflexes, speed, agility, & fighting skill.

Plus Buky is traveling in a reasonable distance close in stealth. Meaning Taskmasters is confirmed to be covered. If he ever needed that option.

Tsk tsk, selling you're partner down the river so readily? For shame...

Once again

And I've already come to the conclusion of range weapons. No matter what two Taskmaster is paired against.
It may still be debatable against BuckyCap, but I sincerely doubt it.

This all mean I'm no longer interested in debating the better of range.

But you are welcome to challenge my partener in that area.

Clearing that up for you.

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#35 Posted by Esquire (3833 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: @YoungJustice: @CadenceV2: @Mr_Ingenuity:

Bucky has fantastic reflexes, as shown above. He can catch any arrows Hawkeye shoots at him, as well as blocking with his arm and shield.

He's an expert in stealth himself, having spent 60 years as an assassin during his Winter Soldier days. He was trained by the best of the best in Martial Arts and Espionage, and had an extremely successful career eliminating targets for the Soviets. After shedding the Winter Soldier mantle, his stealth didn't falter. He was even able to sneak up on Wolverine.

So he's got the stealth credentials to keep undetected while following Taskmaster. If he sees one of your team try to shoot Tasky, then he can throw his shield to block the projectile, as in the scans from my first post. He has the shield skills to do it, and he could even bounce the shield around to take out the guy who shot. Or multiple of your guys. In the scans below, he bounces the shield around to KO a guy, and shoots three other people before they can react. He's an excellent and rapid shot with his pistol, and equally effective with his shield. A couple more demonstrations of power and accuracy with the shield, as well.

Bucky has the experience and skills to keep himself and Taskmaster from getting ambushed. But even if he does get tagged, he can still be effective. Crossbones shoots him a few times, knocking him out a window, and how does Bucky respond? He shoots Crossbones several times, even after smashing into a car.

In h2h combat he can take anyone you've got as well, but I'll save that for later.

#36 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio
In which you have down played from the being as if he's a swinging brick.

I'm not downplaying Taskmaster at all. You're just saying that he can jump around and tactically disarm all four of our guys without effort, just like that.

No, he can't do that.

1) We are meeting you head on & you have posted nothing to suggest otherwise. Stealth does not factor this out unless your team were to move to the edge of the island.

What? How does that work? OP states we start 5 miles apart, from there we just have to find each other. Since we're using stealth and you're jumping around the trees, we'll spot you before you spot us, and Hawkeye can easily place an arrow inside Taskmaster's skull from behind without him even seeing it coming.

2) Taskmaster is traveling overhead with web. With trees providing a natural cover & using 616 Spiderman's speed (who is faster :P) agility and acrobatics. I still see know reason he cannot dodge or utilize Cap's shield technique. Or both (see above/below for proof).

Yes, Taskmaster can block with the shield (if he sees the attack coming that is, which he won't), but if the shield is protecting his torso, what's protecting his back? Or his side? Or how about his head? The shield doesn't block Taskmaster's entire body. He can dodge for a bit, but eventually, with four marksman of this caliber all aiming for him in perfect unison, something will slip through.

Bucky has fantastic reflexes, as shown above. He can catch any arrows Hawkeye shoots at him, as well as blocking with his arm and shield.

Dodging arrows from a playing around 616 Hawkeye isn't the same as avoiding fire from Ultimate Hawkeye, plus three other amazing marksman.

If he sees one of your team try to shoot Tasky, then he can throw his shield to block the projectile,

But how will he see them? We're not gonna leap to the sky as soon as we see Taskmaster and start raving about as we launch random attacks. Bucky will only see the attack, by the time the arrow is inches from either his, or Taskmaster's face.

Sneaking up on Wolverine is one thing, but with Hawkeye's enhanced eyesight, he's almost stealth proof. That's how he lands an RPG on a moving Ghost Rider from a mile away, spots Nick Fury through a one-way mirror and then breaks said mirror with a pen, and tags guys like Ultimate Kraven and Toad easily. He'll see Bucky before Bucky sees him.

and he could even bounce the shield around to take out the guy who shot. Or multiple of your guys.

Not likely, guys like Nick Fury and Punisher dodge Captain America's shield,

considering each of our characters posses superhuman reaction time, we'll be long gone before that shield hits. Hell, maybe someone can even catch it. Now whatchu got?

In h2h combat he can take anyone you've got as well, but I'll save that for later.

Doubtful without that Bionic Arm. Snake has beaten people H2H more troublesome than Bucky, and Ocelot is Snake's equal so...

#37 Posted by Mr_Ingenuity (7389 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: Get back to this later tonight.

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#38 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

Fighting and trying to escape Bucky and Taskmaster isn't either. It should take 30 min minimum. Even if he is interrupted, or needs to fight. He has his revolvers, and knife. He also has stealth and camo on his side. He likes torture, might as well express it (Get it).

#39 Posted by Esquire (3833 posts) - - Show Bio

@YoungJustice said:

Fighting and trying to escape Bucky and Taskmaster isn't either. It should take 30 min minimum. Even if he is interrupted, or needs to fight. He has his revolvers, and knife. He also has stealth and camo on his side. He likes torture, might as well express it (Get it).

The only camo he has is his combat fatigues, remember. No active camo or anything like that.

#40 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

I know, but due to us being in a jungle, the fatigues are pretty much minor camo.

#41 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@Esquire said:

@YoungJustice said:

Fighting and trying to escape Bucky and Taskmaster isn't either. It should take 30 min minimum. Even if he is interrupted, or needs to fight. He has his revolvers, and knife. He also has stealth and camo on his side. He likes torture, might as well express it (Get it).

The only camo he has is his combat fatigues, remember. No active camo or anything like that.

Snake has active camo.

Ocelot doesn't, but jungle fatigues are more than enough for him.

Everyone get yur last words in, we should wrap this up, as fun as it's been.

#42 Posted by Esquire (3833 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto said:

Snake has active camo.

Ocelot doesn't, but jungle fatigues are more than enough for him.

I know, I was just making sure that nobody got the wrong impression. Nobody's going to argue fatigues are as good as Active Camo. I'll try and get another post in by tomorrow evening at the latest. If not, I've made most of my arguments.

#43 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@Esquire said:

@nickzambuto said:

Snake has active camo.

Ocelot doesn't, but jungle fatigues are more than enough for him.

I know, I was just making sure that nobody got the wrong impression. Nobody's going to argue fatigues are as good as Active Camo. I'll try and get another post in by tomorrow evening at the latest. If not, I've made most of my arguments.

They are when Ocelot has them.

#44 Posted by Esquire (3833 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto said:

@Esquire said:

@nickzambuto said:

Snake has active camo.

Ocelot doesn't, but jungle fatigues are more than enough for him.

I know, I was just making sure that nobody got the wrong impression. Nobody's going to argue fatigues are as good as Active Camo. I'll try and get another post in by tomorrow evening at the latest. If not, I've made most of my arguments.

They are when Ocelot has them.

Bah. Proofs, my good man!

#45 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

Sorry, I have to drop this tourney.....can't debate for Ocelot. Should have stuck with Nikita.

#46 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@YoungJustice said:

Sorry, I have to drop this tourney.....can't debate for Ocelot. Should have stuck with Nikita.

*facepalm*

If we win I'll let you choose someone else. For now, I can carry Ocelot just fine.

Do me a favor though and edit your post on the first page. No offense, but I don't really think that's a good strategy :P

#47 Posted by YoungJustice (6719 posts) - - Show Bio

I am having a hard time with forming the debate FSR, but k.

#48 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@Esquire said:

@nickzambuto said:

@Esquire said:

@nickzambuto said:

Snake has active camo.

Ocelot doesn't, but jungle fatigues are more than enough for him.

I know, I was just making sure that nobody got the wrong impression. Nobody's going to argue fatigues are as good as Active Camo. I'll try and get another post in by tomorrow evening at the latest. If not, I've made most of my arguments.

They are when Ocelot has them.

Bah. Proofs, my good man!

I'll just give you his life story. Keep in kind, this is the hyper abridged version. Metal Gear is way to complex to actually go into detail.

I'll start with this: in a world populated by high tech super scientists, manipulative war generals, and hypnotizing Tao wannabes, Ocelot holds the title as the single most intelligent character in the entire Metal Gear Solid Universe. Not surprising from someone who had a mother literally called The Boss.

He started out as a high level NSA Code Breaker during the Cold War at a very young age (I think he was still in his teens). He soon defected to the Soviet Union however, and in a matter of months worked his way up to a high ranking GRU major in charge of his own division.

So as Operation Snake Eater progresses, we get caught up in this big dramatic struggle for a secret cash of funds called the Philosopher's Legacy, which amounts to.... about 30 billion dollars.

Long story short, epic clashes ensue, lots of drama, betrayal, death... finally we are led to believe Naked Snake has completed his mission, and made it away with the legacy.

Oh, woops, nope, looks like EVA stole it- huh? Oh, hold that thought, turns out the whole thing was a decoy the entire time. Ocelot secured the legacy all on his lonesome a long time ago.

So Ocelot turns out to actually be a double agent working for the KGB. Huh? No wait scratch that, he's really a triple agent, and in fact has still been working for the CIA this entire time.

So yeah, Ocelot is the numbero uno CIA agent, and back in the Cold War when the CIA was a big deal, that's something to brag about. He completed dozens of suicide missions easily, securing his rank as a badass.

Than the San Hierynomo incident happens. The FOX unit goes rogue, takes over a military base, and steals Metal Gear.

Turns out this is a CIA plot to prolong the Cold War because they need something to do. By pretending the FOX Unit defected to the Soviets, the U.S. can give them Metal Gear, thus solving Russia's financial problem (not much money needs to go to the military now that they have the demon weapon) and the Cold War will continue.

But Gene, the commander of FOX, pulled one over on everyone by actually rebelling.

So there's a big scare, lots of drama, Big Boss saves the world and we're good, right?

Mmm, nope. Turns out, yet again, Ocelot was behind everything, and he managed to manipulate all these players into doing exactly what he wanted them to do.

In the end, he moves on to larger things, and becomes a founding member of the Patriots, the secret organization that rules the Earth with an iron fist and literally dictates everything that happens.

When Zero and Big Boss split, Ocelot keeps his allegiance to Zero, but in reality is still up to his double crossing ways, as his loyalty belongs with Big Boss.

So Ocelot goes on to break the world record for double crosses by being a quintuple agent. Joins FOXHOUND, teams up with Liquid, really manipulating everyone for Solidus, turns out he was using Solidus too, goes with the Patriots, destroys the Patriots by using Snake to do it for him and thus brings Big Boss back to life after he died.

Somewhere in between all this he somehow managed to convince everyone the dead spirit of Liquid Snake took control of his body.

But he didn't.

Ocelot ushered in the world's first complete global cease fire in human history.

Ocelot is such a powerful threat, Washington sent out an entire joint U.S. Army/Marines Battalion made up of hundreds of soldiers just to apprehend him. One man.

As you can see at 5:40 when he starts fingerbanging helicopters, it clearly didn't work.

Cliffs-

Ocelot is ALMOST as good as Snake. That should be enough.

He's also got mad swag.

#49 Posted by Esquire (3833 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: ...What does the plot summary have to do with camo?

#50 Posted by nickzambuto (13307 posts) - - Show Bio

@Esquire said:

@nickzambuto: ...What does the plot summary have to do with camo?

That wasn't a plot summary. That was a brief description of Ocelot's intelligence. He's made fools of the government numerous times. He's made fools of the guys who make fools of the government. Hell, he's even made fools of the organization that secretly runs the planet from behind the scenes.