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#1 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Green Goblin (Norman)

Green Goblin (Harry)

Hobgoblin

Jack O Lantern

Demogoblin

vs.

Batman

Robin

Batgirl

Nightwing

#2 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

my moneys on the Bat squad for this one...

Batman can take care of the strategy side, Batgirl and Nightwing can corner them in while Robin takes them down with smoke bombs and tripwires.

#3 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"my moneys on the Bat squad for this one... Batman can take care of the strategy side, Batgirl and Nightwing can corner them in while Robin takes them down with smoke bombs and tripwires. "

Demogoblin's glider is made from hellfire (i.e. Ghost Rider's fire). He also has Dark Pumpkin bombs that take away your hope and basically paralyse you. They all get trigger happy and are superhumanly strong. So knowing the Goblins, they'll wind up tossing bombs and shooting everything.

#4 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman doesn't have any hope left... he's faced down scarecrow's toxins so could probably deal with that.

besides, any damage done to batman now can be healed almost instantly

#5 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

No, like the Dark Bomb actually like takes you into the darkness and regret everything. You can look it up in Maximum Carnage. How does Batman heal instantly now?

#6 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

When Kara came back from Kandor, she brought Kryptonian healing technology with her and sold it to batman. it heals any injury and resets the mortal body back to how it was 'saved' instantly.

#7 Posted by Buckshot (18915 posts) - - Show Bio

That's not standarad gear. If prep was involved then that would be out there, but he obviously does't carry it (or even use it) all the time because he still gets hurt when he fights and doesn't instantly heal when he gets back to the mansion.

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#8 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Buckshot says:

"That's not standarad gear. If prep was involved then that would be out there, but he obviously does't carry it (or even use it) all the time because he still gets hurt when he fights and doesn't instantly heal when he gets back to the mansion."

fair enough... i'm just stating that it's there and he can bring it if he has the prep time to know to bring it

#9 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Eternal Chaos says:

"Ah. Alright. But would it work if he's dead (i.e. Goblin lobs all his bombs at him and shoots sparkler beams at him and at the end he's dead)"

and while he's focusing on batman, Nightwing takes him off the glider and Cassie (batgirl) beats him to death :)

#10 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Ah. Alright. But would it work if he's dead (i.e. Goblin lobs all his bombs at him and shoots sparkler beams at him and at the end he's dead)

#11 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"Eternal Chaos says:
"Ah. Alright. But would it work if he's dead (i.e. Goblin lobs all his bombs at him and shoots sparkler beams at him and at the end he's dead)"
and while he's focusing on batman, Nightwing takes him off the glider and Cassie (batgirl) beats him to death :) "

He's Superhumanly strong. He can take a few shots from her. Anyway, would that doo hickey work if he's dead like blown to smithereens?

#12 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Eternal Chaos says:

"Gàlen says:
"Eternal Chaos says:
"Ah. Alright. But would it work if he's dead (i.e. Goblin lobs all his bombs at him and shoots sparkler beams at him and at the end he's dead)"
and while he's focusing on batman, Nightwing takes him off the glider and Cassie (batgirl) beats him to death :) "

He's Superhumanly strong. He can take a few shots from her. Anyway, would that doo hickey work if he's dead like blown to smithereens?"

can't really say...

it hasn't been shown used in comics, it's Kryptonian tech though, so you can assume it's stupidly advanced level technology

#13 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

nope, not yet...

it's there and available to him, but i've not seen him use it though...

#14 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"Eternal Chaos says:
"Gàlen says:
"Eternal Chaos says:
"Ah. Alright. But would it work if he's dead (i.e. Goblin lobs all his bombs at him and shoots sparkler beams at him and at the end he's dead)"
and while he's focusing on batman, Nightwing takes him off the glider and Cassie (batgirl) beats him to death :) "
He's Superhumanly strong. He can take a few shots from her. Anyway, would that doo hickey work if he's dead like blown to smithereens?"
can't really say... it hasn't been shown used in comics, it's Kryptonian tech though, so you can assume it's stupidly advanced level technology"

True. So Batman hasn't been shown using in combat?

#15 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"nope, not yet... it's there and available to him, but i've not seen him use it though..."

Well IMO I don't think it should be used in this battle because of the fact that it has yet to be used and its regenerative power is unknown.

#16 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Does Goblin have access to those Dark bombs at all time, or Sparklers?

i'm just stating the sort of technology Bat's has at his hands, not to mention Cassies hand to hand skills or using EM pulses to completely destroy Goblins technology, which Nightwing has used before.

#17 Posted by Ice Skull (73 posts) - - Show Bio

Bat Squad owns the Goblins.

#18 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"Does Goblin have access to those Dark bombs at all time, or Sparklers? i'm just stating the sort of technology Bat's has at his hands, not to mention Cassies hand to hand skills or using EM pulses to completely destroy Goblins technology, which Nightwing has used before. "

Yeah Demo has access to his Dark Bombs and the Green Goblin's do have access to their sparklers. It's in the gloves. Ok, Cassie has crazy hand to hand skills, but Goblin is superhumanly strong and fast. No matter what both all the goblins can take damage. Demogoblin's glider is made from hellfire so it doesn't really involve tech. The other Goblins can do all types of crazy things.

#19 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman, Batgirl and Nightwing have constantly taken down metahumans before using technology and fear tactics...

#20 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"Batman, Batgirl and Nightwing have constantly taken down metahumans before using technology and fear tactics..."

The Goblins feel no fear. They have tech too.

#21 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Eternal Chaos says:

"Gàlen says:
"Batman, Batgirl and Nightwing have constantly taken down metahumans before using technology and fear tactics..."

The Goblins feel no fear. They have tech too."

they don't feel fear... but can ya make up your mind... either they use tech, or don't use tech...

Eternal Chaos says:

"Demogoblin's glider is made from hellfire so it doesn't really involve tech. The other Goblins can do all types of crazy things."

one or the other, the bat squad use EMP's as standard, so that takes them out if they use tech...

if not they can use standards tactics and acrobatics in conjunction with batarands and tripwires to stun and siable the goblins

M

#22 Posted by Apparition (11349 posts) - - Show Bio

are the other goblins super powered too? goblin could match up with spider-man so all alone he should give the bat squad fits.

#23 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Apparition says:

"are the other goblins super powered too? goblin could match up with spider-man so all alone he should give the bat squad fits."

meh, Batman as a member of the JLA has taken down foes stronger that Spiderman and the goblins...

Nightwing as leader of the outsiders has taken down stronger foes, hell he used to train with Donna Troy so we know he's got at least Amazon level skills if not strength.

Cassie taken down metahumans of various degrees before... i'm not sure where to place her though

#24 Posted by Apparition (11349 posts) - - Show Bio

yeah i guess that's believable. how in the world could someone who has superhuman quickness and can lift ten tons going to be able to beat three highly trained human beings.

#25 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Apparition says:

"yeah i guess that's believable. how in the world could someone who has superhuman quickness and can lift ten tons going to be able to beat three highly trained human beings."

?!?

#26 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"Eternal Chaos says:
"Gàlen says:
"Batman, Batgirl and Nightwing have constantly taken down metahumans before using technology and fear tactics..."
The Goblins feel no fear. They have tech too."
they don't feel fear... but can ya make up your mind... either they use tech, or don't use tech... Eternal Chaos says:
"Demogoblin's glider is made from hellfire so it doesn't really involve tech. The other Goblins can do all types of crazy things."
one or the other, the bat squad use EMP's as standard, so that takes them out if they use tech... if not they can use standards tactics and acrobatics in conjunction with batarands and tripwires to stun and siable the goblins M"

The Goblins are intelligent, and the tech they normally use is like Bombs and stuff. Not really like normal tech that you can stop.

#27 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

if it uses electronics, it can be rendered as useless as a paperweight.

#28 Posted by Apparition (11349 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"Apparition says:
"yeah i guess that's believable. how in the world could someone who has superhuman quickness and can lift ten tons going to be able to beat three highly trained human beings."
?!?"

just saying that in an actual fight where the writers arent trying to tilt it in favor of batman and his family, they wouldn't win most of the fights they have against superhumans.

#29 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"if it uses electronics, it can be rendered as useless as a paperweight. "

Can a bomb be considered tech? I don't think so, so the bombs are still in play.

#30 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

most of the fights are actually won through planning and technology... it's very rare that Batman will actually engage a metahuman villian in hand to hand...

though saying that he's fought hand to hand with Bane on several occasions and has come out on top more often then not.

#31 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Eternal Chaos says:

"Gàlen says:
"if it uses electronics, it can be rendered as useless as a paperweight. "

Can a bomb be considered tech? I don't think so, so the bombs are still in play."

does it use a timer or any kind of circuitry?

if so, it's a paperweight.

an EMP will destroy any kind of electronics, from a computer down to a LED light on a pen knife.

#32 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"most of the fights are actually won through planning and technology... it's very rare that Batman will actually engage a metahuman villian in hand to hand... though saying that he's fought hand to hand with Bane on several occasions and has come out on top more often then not. "

An Impressive feat, next statement. I didn't say there was preptime.

#33 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

then without preptime it's down to technology and fighting ability.

while the goblins are stronger, the bat squad works as a team to take down the enemy...

#34 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Gàlen says:

"Eternal Chaos says:
"Gàlen says:
"if it uses electronics, it can be rendered as useless as a paperweight. "
Can a bomb be considered tech? I don't think so, so the bombs are still in play."
does it use a timer or any kind of circuitry? if so, it's a paperweight. an EMP will destroy any kind of electronics, from a computer down to a LED light on a pen knife. "

No timer. just normal "pull out pin, and toss while we wait for combustion"

#35 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

Eternal Chaos says:

"Gàlen says:
"Eternal Chaos says:
"Gàlen says:
"if it uses electronics, it can be rendered as useless as a paperweight. "
Can a bomb be considered tech? I don't think so, so the bombs are still in play."
does it use a timer or any kind of circuitry? if so, it's a paperweight. an EMP will destroy any kind of electronics, from a computer down to a LED light on a pen knife. "

No timer. just normal "pull out pin, and toss while we wait for combustion""

then thats still in play

#36 Posted by Apparition (11349 posts) - - Show Bio

Cassie likes to go hand to hand so she would die first. Goblin only has to hit her once. After that the others may wise up and try to stay away but that just keeps them alive a little longer.

Gàlen says:

"Eternal Chaos says:
"Gàlen says:
"if it uses electronics, it can be rendered as useless as a paperweight. "
Can a bomb be considered tech? I don't think so, so the bombs are still in play."
does it use a timer or any kind of circuitry? if so, it's a paperweight. an EMP will destroy any kind of electronics, from a computer down to a LED light on a pen knife. "

I thought his pumpkin bombs were more like grenades than electronics. he shouldn't need anything else.

#37 Posted by Buckshot (18915 posts) - - Show Bio

I can see the bat family taking it. Once the Goblins are down (EMP takes out mechanical gliders) they won't be tossing around bombs since they could hurt themselves or each other, and strength or no, the bats are better fighters and team players, good enough to overcome the physical advantages of the goblins. The one on the magic glider can be taken own with tripwires, acrobatics and the combined genius of the team. And it's not like the bat team doesn't have explosives and other devices that can harm the goblins from a distance. The goblins won't expect the level of ability that the bats will have, and by the time they realize the formidabilty of their enemy, any remaining goblins will be outnumbered and for the most part, disarmed.

Moderator
#38 Posted by Apparition (11349 posts) - - Show Bio

if all of the goblins have super strength and quickness then they should still be more likely to win. even blocking a punch or kick would either leave a broken batperson or a dead one. and they don't know the goblins are that strong right? so they would be surprised too in this fight.

#39 Posted by Methos (40103 posts) - - Show Bio

The Bat family are never surprised... not by anything...

#40 Posted by Apparition (11349 posts) - - Show Bio

yeah right.

#41 Posted by Buckshot (18915 posts) - - Show Bio

Pressure points and correctly placed attacks are still plenty effective, and the bats have more experience with metas (especialy crazy ones) than the goblins do with incredibly skilled martial artists and geniuses. The genius part is important, and not just scientific genius, but brillant minds when it comes to battle. It makes it more than just a straight up strength/speed vs strength/speed fight. Improvisation, teamwork, use of the environment, gadgets, misdirection and the aforementioned experience mean that the goblins aren't just fighting normal humans that can fight. And they won't be surprised. You really think none of the bats will be able to tell straight away that the goblins are superhuman? And even if they aren't entirely sure, they're going to be cautious and not treat them like normal criminals.
Post Edited:2007-07-30 22:25:49

Moderator
#42 Posted by Apparition (11349 posts) - - Show Bio

Buckshot says:

"Pressure points and correctly placed attacks are still plenty effective, and the bats have more experience with metas (especialy crazy ones) than the goblins do with incredibly skilled martial artists *and* geniuses. The genius part is important, and not just scientific genius, but brillant minds when it comes to battle. It makes it more than just a straight up strength/speed vs strength/speed fight. Improvisation, teamwork, use of the environment, gadgets, misdirection and the aforementioned experience mean that the goblins aren't just fighting normal humans that can fight. And they won't be surprised. You really think *none* of the bats will be able to tell straight away that the goblins are superhuman? And even if they aren't entirely sure, they're going to be cautious and not treat them like normal criminals.
Post Edited:2007-07-30 22:25:49"

how could you tell? they're wirey! :) if they don't do anything showing their strength and speed until goblin breaks cassie's arm when she tries to block his attack, i would think they would be surprised. i dont think cassie's big on caution, at least not in the books i've seen her in.

their teamwork would be a big plus but i still dont see how they would win. if they are trying to get in pressure point strikes the goblins' speed should allow them to keep that from being effective. i would think the bats would need to rely on their weapons to try and win. but that's just my opinion.

#43 Posted by Buckshot (18915 posts) - - Show Bio

First of all, they don't look human, they look like monsters. I think the bats would guess they weren't normal going by all the other things they've seen. That plus Batgirl's ability to read body language, and the goblins not being likely to hide the speed or strength they have and also the fact that Batman and Robin are two of the greatest detectives in the DCU and Nightwing's not bad himself. You don't think they'd be able to figure something out? And like I said, even if they don't know off the bat, under the direction of Batman, they could hold off really going at them until they know what they're capable of, or just bombard them without getting close. EMP to knock them off their gliders and disable some of their weapons; flashbangs, smoke pellets and sonics to confuse and disorient them; explosives, knock out gas, wires, and ice pellets to do some actual damage; and if any are still standing (that's not even their full arsenal) after this, then the bats swoop in under cover and fight them hand to hand as a team and bring them down while they're still recovering, then deal with the one on the magic fire glider.

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#44 Posted by Forever (4332 posts) - - Show Bio

Interesting fight. Good job coming up with it EC.

#45 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

QUESTION: IT WAS MENTION THAT BAT DOES NOT CARRY THE KYPOTON THING OR HEALER ON HIM? HOW DO WE KNOW THIS, FROM MY READING OF BATS NOONE REALLY KNOWS WHAT HE CARRIES TO A POINT, A NORMAL BATRANG MY BE A MINI CONTAIN NUKE?

I agree that the batman, especally batman has alot of experince dealing with meta humans, he on team with them. Also he nevers goes head in, he stales and lets his enemies expouse themselves.

Much less the bat clan are way more use to working with each other, and unstand each other tactics, with batman giving the directions it only get more effective.

The goblins do not seem to have that teamwork down, and that is a major weakness.

Nightwing and batman are tactican leaders, even young tim drake and his advance grasp of dectective work gives them a edge here.

I do not agree with prep time or not/ "imo" batman devours information and uses it like nuke or "big bang" His mind is that he uses all info, and tactial data to his max advantage, and that why prep time seems to come up, but more often than not if not as often he has had to make plans on the fly or modfiy right in the middle of battle. That what gives the bat clan it biggest adavantage here for the win.

All have face superstrong people, and beat or over come them, the goblins will be nothing new.

#46 Posted by Phorqe (2109 posts) - - Show Bio

So Batman essentially has a healing factor now? Lame....

#47 Posted by Sync (960 posts) - - Show Bio

no, i would not say that, but he now has another weapon, as far as we know he may use reverse enginerring to make it do the oppsite.

we will only know when they show his new bat armor with some of the tech in it...whoops i have spoken too much.

#48 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm back, anyway, say Bats does use an EMP, that's not going to stop Demo Goblin. His glider isn't electronic, so He'll be able to fly around and shoot at the Bat Squad. Gobby's dazzler blasts are very effective, and can cause some serious damage. Not to mention the Goblin's fighting ability. Also Goblin's original glider (before Gwen Stacy) wasn't really electronic, it worked like a mini rocket and was very manuverable so who's to say an EMP would even work on that. I still vote the Goblins. (Thanks for the compliment Forever)

#49 Posted by Buckshot (18915 posts) - - Show Bio

I said they could get him later. I don't think he'd do anything until the other Goblins are done fighting because he could accidently hit them(even if he were willing to hit his team, the area would be covered in smoke so the bats could attack without being seen), so he'd just wait until either the downed Goblins won, or until the bats did. And I mentioned ways (sonics, flashbangs, explosives, acrobatics, tripwires, smoke pellets) for the bats to take him down when it came time.

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#50 Posted by Eternal Chaos (22990 posts) - - Show Bio

Buckshot says:

"I said they could get him later. I don't think he'd do anything until the other Goblins are done fighting because he could accidently hit them(even if he were willing to hit his team, the area would be covered in smoke so the bats could attack without being seen), so he'd just wait until either the downed Goblins won, or until the bats did. And I mentioned ways (sonics, flashbangs, explosives, acrobatics, tripwires, smoke pellets) for the bats to take him down when it came time."

The Goblin's can just tail close to the ground and fire dazzler blasts (the normal goblins) and hellfire (Demogoblin). The Goblin's are really good at shooting so they can handle whatever the bat squad shoots off. Or they can fly at higher altitudes and fire away