This is definitely not a curbstomp to either side. I've always seen classic ion as one of the most powerful beings ever invented in DC. He is after all one of the few characters that no one has ever dared directly challenge. As far as I remember he did all of his feats with mere thoughts. Honestly I think he's more powerful than beings like Mandrakk and Anti Monitor not because he has better feats but because he did his feats with more ease. ION seemed MUCH more like a TRUE "Omnipotent" being than others who may have had better feats than he did. ION just seems more impressive.
On the other hand Thanos was extremely impressive as well. The difference between Thanos and ION though, was that Thanos had both "omnipotent" feats and "fighting" feats.
If this were 10/10 then thanos takes 6 and ION takes 4.
Hm. Not sure. Ion displayed near-omniscience and near-omnipresence. Thanos did not display either. Ion was also near-omnipotent, showing the ability to casually alter time. The same can also be said of Thanos.
Hm. Not sure. Ion displayed near-omniscience and near-omnipresence. Thanos did not display either. Ion was also near-omnipotent, showing the ability to casually alter time. The same can also be said of Thanos. I say Ion for now.
The IG is perfectly capable of giving the wielder omniscience and omnipresence in said universe.
That and Thanos beat down Eternity (Even if Warlock did so with complete and utter ease by comparison), along with every other abstract worth noting in 616, most of them all at once.
The big difference between the two, IMO, is that Thanos actually took on the best his universe had to offer (minus LT), and kicked all their asses. Ion faced nobody of note. His greatest "opponent" was probably that fleet of aliens he dealt with; hardly the equivalent of the Cosmic Brigade Thanos fought, let alone Eternity.
Hell, even Nebula with the Gauntlet took them all down without much of a problem (minus Eternity that time, though Mistress Death was still there with the others).
It just seems to me like HoG suffers somewhat from "Dr. Manhattan syndrome." Everything he did, he did really easily. Therefore, people figure he can do anything easily. Granted, he operated on a larger scale than Manhattan, but again, what did he really run into that was so hard to deal with? Not much. It's a classic case of a Big Fish in the Little Pond.
About the strongest evidence I've heard involves his conversation with Hal Spectre, where people point out that Hal seemed scared of him, therefore he must be stronger than Spectre. Except people seem to ignore that Hal was possibly (far more likely, IMHO) scared for him rather than of him. Consider that all of Kyle's power at that point was actually the remnants of Parallax's power. And who had just been Parallax? Yup, Hal. And what happened when Hal was Parallax? Yeah, he went a little psycho, wiped out the Corps, and just about killed everybody. Then he died. Not really the high point of his career. And nobody thinks he's maybe a little concerned about Kyle going a little batty himself?
And on top of all that, of course Hal wouldn't want to fight Kyle. Kyle is responsible for the act that got him at least halfway redeemed (i.e. saving Earth). Kyle tried other times to redeem him as well, and was the torchbearer for the Corps. Of course Hal doesn't want to fight him and is concerned about him possibly being corrupted by his new power.
And on top of all that, what Kyle may or may not have been able to do with his power if he went over the edge is pretty speculative.
Now, of course, since Ion's power did come from Parallax, that actually means that theoretically his upper limit would be equal to Parallax, who was obviously pretty powerful. However, after Zero Hour he seemed less formidable, and it seemed to me that it was at least implied that the power Kyle wound up absorbing was just what had not dispersed when Hal died, rather than all he ever had, so I'm inclined to think that he was probably less powerful than ZH Parallax was.
IG Thanos for me due to the fact that Ion's powers would roughly equate to the central battery? I dunno. But Thanos showed much much more. But then again his showings was for a major event as opposed to HOG that was a single GL arc.
If only Sexy Merc would clear this up for everyone.
The big difference between the two, IMO, is that Thanos actually took on the best his universe had to offer (minus LT), and kicked all their asses. Ion faced nobody of note. His greatest "opponent" was probably that fleet of aliens he dealt with; hardly the equivalent of the Cosmic Brigade Thanos fought, let alone Eternity.
Hell, even Nebula with the Gauntlet took them all down without much of a problem (minus Eternity that time, though Mistress Death was still there with the others).
It just seems to me like HoG suffers somewhat from "Dr. Manhattan syndrome." Everything he did, he did really easily. Therefore, people figure he can do anything easily. Granted, he operated on a larger scale than Manhattan, but again, what did he really run into that was so hard to deal with? Not much. It's a classic case of a Big Fish in the Little Pond.
About the strongest evidence I've heard involves his conversation with Hal Spectre, where people point out that Hal seemed scared of him, therefore he must be stronger than Spectre. Except people seem to ignore that Hal was possibly (far more likely, IMHO) scared for him rather than of him. Consider that all of Kyle's power at that point was actually the remnants of Parallax's power. And who had just been Parallax? Yup, Hal. And what happened when Hal was Parallax? Yeah, he went a little psycho, wiped out the Corps, and just about killed everybody. Then he died. Not really the high point of his career. And nobody thinks he's maybe a little concerned about Kyle going a little batty himself?
And on top of all that, of course Hal wouldn't want to fight Kyle. Kyle is responsible for the act that got him at least halfway redeemed (i.e. saving Earth). Kyle tried other times to redeem him as well, and was the torchbearer for the Corps. Of course Hal doesn't want to fight him and is concerned about him possibly being corrupted by his new power.
And on top of all that, what Kyle may or may not have been able to do with his power if he went over the edge is pretty speculative.
Now, of course, since Ion's power did come from Parallax, that actually means that theoretically his upper limit would be equal to Parallax, who was obviously pretty powerful. However, after Zero Hour he seemed less formidable, and it seemed to me that it was at least implied that the power Kyle wound up absorbing was just what had not dispersed when Hal died, rather than all he ever had, so I'm inclined to think that he was probably less powerful than ZH Parallax was.
Quoted For Reason. Not to mention that Zero Hour Parallax suffers from same syndrom. Three things which people seems to forget about ZH Parallax are:
He started recreating universe because Guardians told him how to do it (not by his own power to be more precise)
He deleted timelines because he was messing with Timestream (so again not his own power)
DC at that time only had 1 universe. Different timelines are not different universes. So ZH Parallax for sure hasn't done anything on Multiversal scale. Neither did HOG Ion since again at that time DC didn't have multiverse.
Like HOG Ion Parallax also fought "rather unimpressive foes" (several top tiers and bunch of street levelers). The only thing good which he did was overcoming Spectre in Hal's body and than at the end of ZH he had 1 good shot at Spectre. Anyway it was Spectre at the end who finished him. So it's debatable who bested who actually. Not to mention that Parallax was drained very easily of his power and Spectre had Jim Corrigan for host and that Spectre is <<<<<<<<<<<< Spectre with Hal Jordan as host (most impressive feats Post Crisis).
Sorry for bringing this up but i just had to. Since someone would sooner or later use Parallax as bench mark so i cleared his feats before that happens.
Hm. Not sure. Ion displayed near-omniscience and near-omnipresence. Thanos did not display either. Ion was also near-omnipotent, showing the ability to casually alter time. The same can also be said of Thanos. I say Ion for now.
This is definitely not a curbstomp to either side. I've always seen classic ion as one of the most powerful beings ever invented in DC. He is after all one of the few characters that no one has ever dared directly challenge. As far as I remember he did all of his feats with mere thoughts. Honestly I think he's more powerful than beings like Mandrakk and Anti Monitor not because he has better feats but because he did his feats with more ease. ION seemed MUCH more like a TRUE "Omnipotent" being than others who may have had better feats than he did. ION just seems more impressive.
On the other hand Thanos was extremely impressive as well. The difference between Thanos and ION though, was that Thanos had both "omnipotent" feats and "fighting" feats.
If this were 10/10 then thanos takes 6 and ION takes 4.
@eisjfiejss: HOG Ion is nothing compared to Mandrakk in power lol. But as far as HOG Ion vs Thanos with IG, i would say stalemate.
@higher_evolutionary: Kyle first became Ion in Green Lantern Vol 3 145 and gives up the power in issue 150. Most of those are called "Hand of God Day _". Issues 144 and 145 are called "The Battle of Fire and Light," and shows his struggle with Nero over who will claim the power in the first place (Kyle wins, obviously). Issue 143 and the "Circle of Fire" miniseries also provide some important set up and background info for what's going on.
Some of the things you said are obviously indisputable but if I remember correctly parallax was defeated by green arrow, not spectre. Spectre just guided the recreation of the universe.
Also, while it is true that parallax was drained of his energy easily it wasn't done by the spectre. It was done by the other heroes while he was fighting the spectre but to me this seems to make parallax more impressive...since even while his energy was being drained he was still able to basically knock spectre out of the battle.
HOG Ion was omnipotent, nigh omniscient and omnipresent so much that he could even occupy different parts of time laterally, now Ion and the infinity gauntlet are both omnipotent but thanos's gauntlet was more external while ion's power was internal its easier to strip thanos of the gauntlet and i believe that is why he would lose here, and thats how he lost when nebula took it from him, so will you tell me that Ion being powerful as he is cannot use his powers and versatility to get the gauntlet away from thanos? i mean the thing is just on his arm how hard can it be for a being of similar power to rid it off his arm lol
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