#851 Posted by AllStarSuperman (21878 posts) - - Show Bio

@referee said:

Just one question..

Can Superman break out of Wonder Womans Lasso?

It's never been seen before except for in Superman: Red Son, where it was Diana who broke out of her own lasso to save Superman from the Red sun-lamps.

well Supergirl broke out of it in supergirl 17. so superman could too.

PreFlashpoint superman 7/10

New 52 Superman 10/10

#852 Posted by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

Freeze Breath.Fight is over.

#853 Edited by russellmania77 (15436 posts) - - Show Bio
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#854 Posted by valencourt (67 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman beats Wonder Woman 7/10 of the time.

#855 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@russellmania77: Actually,he only freezed he then stopped.

But is he continuously does it,he can use heat vision or punch her until she falls unconscious. Or something else.Superman wins.

#856 Edited by CalebHara (2329 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman.

#857 Edited by russellmania77 (15436 posts) - - Show Bio

@spidermeat101: ya but he didnt do that and thats cuz he thought it was doomsday and not ww. wonder woman has faster combat speed, as stated by her and batman

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#858 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@russellmania77:

All Superman has to do is continuously freeze her then do something with her.He's faster anyways.

#859 Edited by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@russellmania77: Actually,he only freezed he then stopped.

But is he continuously does it,he can use heat vision or punch her until she falls unconscious. Or something else.Superman wins.

None of that has ever worked before. She can block his heat vision easily as seen on panel. She can break out of any freeze as seen on panel and he's only been able to make her black out for a second once and he was near the Sun.

#860 Posted by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve: If he repeats it,she'll have to continue breaking out of it,meaning she'll be distracted.Then,Superman will be able to attack.

#861 Edited by russellmania77 (15436 posts) - - Show Bio

@spidermeat101: how is he faster than her?? maybe if its a race that would matter, but combat speed is relavent and she has more of it, and he's not gonna keep freezing her, she does a thing called moving out of the way and attacking him

ww wins

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#862 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@russellmania77:

Yeah.I know she's faster than him in combat.Also,it does not take 1 second for her to break out of his freeze breath.So,he'll be able to repeatedly freeze her.It takes her like 5 seconds maybe to break out.I think people overestimate her sometimes.

#863 Posted by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve: If he repeats it,she'll have to continue breaking out of it,meaning she'll be distracted.Then,Superman will be able to attack.

If he repeats it she'll be ready and knock him on his ass. She's not going to just stand there and let him wail on her. She's been able to hold off a blood lusted Superman a couple times. Image if she actually wanted to hurt him.

#864 Posted by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve:

Since I have limited posts,I'm going to have to continue with you tomorrow.

But anyways,I still fail to see how she'll be able to just quickly break out of that ice if he's using the icy breath for like a few minutes.Why not even throw her off into space into the sun?

#865 Edited by russellmania77 (15436 posts) - - Show Bio

@spidermeat101: she can and has sliced he's throat with her tiara he isnt gonna be able to hold her and take her to the sun, shes not the kind of character thats gonna just let people freeze her 100 times and take her to the sun, i think your underestimating her

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#866 Posted by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@russellmania77:

Yes she did.But.....nevermind

I will tell you tomorrow others ways he will win.

#867 Posted by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve:

Since I have limited posts,I'm going to have to continue with you tomorrow.

But anyways,I still fail to see how she'll be able to just quickly break out of that ice if he's using the icy breath for like a few minutes.Why not even throw her off into space into the sun?

Ok. He's tried all of these things before. She counters all of them. You're underestimating her. She's not just another pretty face.

#868 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve:

Superman has taken on and even beat people like Darkseid. Wonder Woman can't beat Darkseid. It's just proof Superman wins.Whether you like it or not.And I'm not underestimating her.I giving facts.Also,I'm not sure if you understand how I saying Superman will freeze her.In case you don't know,I'm talking about him doing it nonstop.Not freezing her then stopping and do it again.Superman wins.If Wonder Woman does win though,it might be due to bad writing or Superman holding back a lot.But in the end,he wins.I'm not underestimating her.

#869 Posted by ComicStooge (12888 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman wins. .

#870 Posted by Bronze_Surfer (2979 posts) - - Show Bio

I had a thought. When Superman fought Wonder Woman because of Maxwell Lord he thought she was Doomsday right? Well I don't think Superman would fight Doomsday the same way he would fight wonder woman.

#871 Posted by comic_book_fan (5654 posts) - - Show Bio

superman wins.

#872 Posted by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve:

Superman has taken on and even beat people like Darkseid. Wonder Woman can beat Darkseid. It's just proof Superman wins.Whether you like it or not.And I'm not underestimating her.I giving facts.Also,I'm not sure if you understand how I saying Superman will freeze her.In case you don't know,I'm talking about him doing it nonstop.Not freezing her then stopping and do it again.Superman wins.If Wonder Woman does win though,it might be due to bad writing or Superman holding back a lot.But in the end,he wins.I'm not underestimating her.

That's ABC logic and doesn't apply here. Wonder Woman has beaten Ares and Circe. They would both destroy Superman. It doesn't matter how you're saying he would freeze her. She's not going to stand there and let it happen. She's taken him on more than once. He was out to kill both times and she held him off without trying to hurt him. If you aren't underestimating her than you might just be in denial. She can and has kicked his ass before.

#873 Posted by ComicStooge (12888 posts) - - Show Bio

@spidermeat101 said:

@pokeysteve:

Superman has taken on and even beat people like Darkseid. Wonder Woman can beat Darkseid. It's just proof Superman wins.Whether you like it or not.And I'm not underestimating her.I giving facts.Also,I'm not sure if you understand how I saying Superman will freeze her.In case you don't know,I'm talking about him doing it nonstop.Not freezing her then stopping and do it again.Superman wins.If Wonder Woman does win though,it might be due to bad writing or Superman holding back a lot.But in the end,he wins.I'm not underestimating her.

That's ABC logic and doesn't apply here. Wonder Woman has beaten Ares and Circe. They would both destroy Superman. It doesn't matter how you're saying he would freeze her. She's not going to stand there and let it happen. She's taken him on more than once. He was out to kill both times and she held him off without trying to hurt him. If you aren't underestimating her than you might just be in denial. She can and has kicked his ass before.

Wonder Woman needs prep to fight Ares. Without his magic vulnerability, Superman would crush Circe.

Regardless, Superman is stronger, more versatile, has better durability, his reflexes are enough to counter hers, he has superior senses and is smarter. Wonder Woman's fighting ability won't save her.

#874 Posted by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve:

Have you forgotten Superman is completely vulnerable to magic?Which those two have?

Also,Superman holds back a lot.I'm pretty sure Wonder Woman was only alive because a bloodlusted Superman isn't thinking clearly.But,if he uses his powers to their full use,he would destroy Diana.He can move planets.Wonder Woman can't.He is superior to Wonder Woman.And like I said,I'm not underestimating no one.I'm actually telling the truth.If you can't accept them,why continue arguing? I guess that since Wonder Woman has been given god powers and trained in combat,means she can beat anyone for some people.

#875 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve said:

@spidermeat101 said:

@pokeysteve:

Superman has taken on and even beat people like Darkseid. Wonder Woman can beat Darkseid. It's just proof Superman wins.Whether you like it or not.And I'm not underestimating her.I giving facts.Also,I'm not sure if you understand how I saying Superman will freeze her.In case you don't know,I'm talking about him doing it nonstop.Not freezing her then stopping and do it again.Superman wins.If Wonder Woman does win though,it might be due to bad writing or Superman holding back a lot.But in the end,he wins.I'm not underestimating her.

That's ABC logic and doesn't apply here. Wonder Woman has beaten Ares and Circe. They would both destroy Superman. It doesn't matter how you're saying he would freeze her. She's not going to stand there and let it happen. She's taken him on more than once. He was out to kill both times and she held him off without trying to hurt him. If you aren't underestimating her than you might just be in denial. She can and has kicked his ass before.

Wonder Woman needs prep to fight Ares. Without his magic vulnerability, Superman would crush Circe.

Regardless, Superman is stronger, more versatile, has better durability, his reflexes are enough to counter hers, he has superior senses and is smarter. Wonder Woman's fighting ability won't save her.

Thank you!

#876 Posted by Jgames (1686 posts) - - Show Bio

Only way I see Superman winning is if Wonder Womean is going for the kill while superman being too much of a boyscout, doesn't go all out. And in the end of the battle, Superman head is choped off, and Diana roaring about her victory, until superman somehow comes back alive. And then she kneeling down for mercy. The end.

#877 Posted by ComicStooge (12888 posts) - - Show Bio

@jgames said:

Only way I see Superman winning is if Wonder Womean is going for the kill while superman being too much of a boyscout, doesn't go all out. And in the end of the battle, Superman head is choped off, and Diana roaring about her victory, until superman somehow comes back alive. And then she kneeling down for mercy. The end.

You act as if Superman is just going to sit back and let Diana cut him.

#878 Posted by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder Woman needs prep to fight Ares. Without his magic vulnerability, Superman would crush Circe.

Regardless, Superman is stronger, more versatile, has better durability, his reflexes are enough to counter hers, he has superior senses and is smarter. Wonder Woman's fighting ability won't save her.

She didn't need prep in their first encounter. Lol without her piercing weapon vulnerability she wouldn't need to block bullets.....what's your point? He is stronger but not enough to where it will be a factor. More versatile yes but his vision and breath powers won't help and she's already showed she can cripple him using his hearing against him. He is not smarter than her. Wisdom of Athena.

@pokeysteve:

Have you forgotten Superman is completely vulnerable to magic?Which those two have?

Also,Superman holds back a lot.I'm pretty sure Wonder Woman was only alive because a bloodlusted Superman isn't thinking clearly.But,if he uses his powers to their full use,he would destroy Diana.He can move planets.Wonder Woman can't.He is superior to Wonder Woman.And like I said,I'm not underestimating no one.I'm actually telling the truth.If you can't accept them,why continue arguing? I guess that since Wonder Woman has been given god powers and trained in combat,means she can beat anyone for some people.

I have not forgotten. Have you forgotten Wonder Woman IS magic? She holds back too. Same thing can be said if she was using her powers to their full extent. He can't move planets pre N52 without help. He isn't superior enough for it to matter. People have a hard time with the fact that she can beat him. She can't beat anyone but she can beat him and again, she has. She has better reflexes, the strength to hurt him and the skill to get it done.

#879 Edited by ComicStooge (12888 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicstooge said:

Wonder Woman needs prep to fight Ares. Without his magic vulnerability, Superman would crush Circe.

Regardless, Superman is stronger, more versatile, has better durability, his reflexes are enough to counter hers, he has superior senses and is smarter. Wonder Woman's fighting ability won't save her.

She didn't need prep in their first encounter. Lol without her piercing weapon vulnerability she wouldn't need to block bullets.....what's your point? He is stronger but not enough to where it will be a factor. More versatile yes but his vision and breath powers won't help and she's already showed she can cripple him using his hearing against him. He is not smarter than her. Wisdom of Athena.

@spidermeat101 said:

@pokeysteve:

Have you forgotten Superman is completely vulnerable to magic?Which those two have?

Also,Superman holds back a lot.I'm pretty sure Wonder Woman was only alive because a bloodlusted Superman isn't thinking clearly.But,if he uses his powers to their full use,he would destroy Diana.He can move planets.Wonder Woman can't.He is superior to Wonder Woman.And like I said,I'm not underestimating no one.I'm actually telling the truth.If you can't accept them,why continue arguing? I guess that since Wonder Woman has been given god powers and trained in combat,means she can beat anyone for some people.

I have not forgotten. Have you forgotten Wonder Woman IS magic? She holds back too. Same thing can be said if she was using her powers to their full extent. He can't move planets pre N52 without help. He isn't superior enough for it to matter. People have a hard time with the fact that she can beat him. She can't beat anyone but she can beat him and again, she has. She has better reflexes, the strength to hurt him and the skill to get it done.

Could you post scans? Anyway, ABC logic isn't always correct. I'm saying that when given protection from magic, he easily deals with magical threats he couldn't otherwise. Basically, Circe is bad example. Of course it'll be a factor, he's stronger by a significant margin and is a capable fighter in his own right. His versatility could come to play as he could create a wide enough beam so she can't block it and his breath powers can slow her down. Superman heals very quickly, so the 'crippling using his hearing against him' won't last long. Wisdom does not equal intellect. He could simply use x-ray vision and locate her pressure points to nerve strike them. Not to mention he can vibrate through her attacks.

#880 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve said:

@comicstooge said:

Wonder Woman needs prep to fight Ares. Without his magic vulnerability, Superman would crush Circe.

Regardless, Superman is stronger, more versatile, has better durability, his reflexes are enough to counter hers, he has superior senses and is smarter. Wonder Woman's fighting ability won't save her.

She didn't need prep in their first encounter. Lol without her piercing weapon vulnerability she wouldn't need to block bullets.....what's your point? He is stronger but not enough to where it will be a factor. More versatile yes but his vision and breath powers won't help and she's already showed she can cripple him using his hearing against him. He is not smarter than her. Wisdom of Athena.

@spidermeat101 said:

@pokeysteve:

Have you forgotten Superman is completely vulnerable to magic?Which those two have?

Also,Superman holds back a lot.I'm pretty sure Wonder Woman was only alive because a bloodlusted Superman isn't thinking clearly.But,if he uses his powers to their full use,he would destroy Diana.He can move planets.Wonder Woman can't.He is superior to Wonder Woman.And like I said,I'm not underestimating no one.I'm actually telling the truth.If you can't accept them,why continue arguing? I guess that since Wonder Woman has been given god powers and trained in combat,means she can beat anyone for some people.

I have not forgotten. Have you forgotten Wonder Woman IS magic? She holds back too. Same thing can be said if she was using her powers to their full extent. He can't move planets pre N52 without help. He isn't superior enough for it to matter. People have a hard time with the fact that she can beat him. She can't beat anyone but she can beat him and again, she has. She has better reflexes, the strength to hurt him and the skill to get it done.

Sorry,but her skill isn't going to help her.That's like me saying she'll beat Galactus just because of her skill.Superman is faster than her.And I'm not talking about combat speed.I'm just talking about speed.That will help him.Also,most of the time,Wonder Woman has only her magical lasso in fights.I'm pretty sure this goes for this fight.And now you're pretty much starting to show ABC logic.She has defeated him but that doesn't mean it will happen again. Spider-man has beaten Firelord,but it doesn't mean it will happen again!Anyways,Superman has the speed to get out of the way if Wonder Woman is throwing the lasso.He can just travel to the other side of the world to dodge it.Heck, he can even sneak up on her and use heat vision IF he's lucky.Superman is stronger,more durable,and well just more powerful!Sometimes,fighting skill won't help.And it certainly isn't for this fight.Superman has super sense.He can hear when Diana is about to throw a punch,he can see her body movement.Superman may not be the best fighter,but he does have a little bit of skill.

#881 Edited by Ancient_0f_Days (12206 posts) - - Show Bio

I still say Wonder Woman wins, she's shown the ability to tank his attacks, deliver quick and skillful attacks right back at him and her magic equipment is more effective than his usual devices. Further more, her bracers can protect her like they did against Powergirl and the gods, she has magical lightning that has killed a god and injured a goddess, she can regenerate faster using the lasso when in contact with the earth ...... as long as she can regen, she can win. Her magical equipment and powers are gonna be more effective than Superman's punches, so his durability really doesn't mean all that much. They have him win in comics due to the fact of chauvinistic mentality along with the fact that Superman is the poster boy for the JLA and is on the cover of almost every major JLA issue standing in front, accept for a few where either Batman or Wonder Woman are... point is, feat and ability wise, Wonder Woman has just what it takes to beat Superman .... due to the closeness in their stats and a balance of power, strength and durability vs magic, skill and speed .... a stalemate would be the most accurate result. But in a fight to the death, Diana was brought up to be a trained warrior, tactician and scholar. Clark was a farmboy, not to say that his kryptonian heritage didn't catch up to him and make him an intellectual powerhouse and skilled fighter, but he's not a born warrior or a soldier, Wonder Woman was the best on Themyscira ...... and for all superman's super senses she has shown that she can get the drop on him mid battle while he's out for blood and she's not. In the end, due to the fact that they are similar in strength, speed, and durability ... Wonder Woman has the advantage in faster regeneration, unbreakable defense and magic....

#882 Posted by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicstooge:

Could you post scans? Anyway, ABC logic isn't always correct. I'm saying that when given protection from magic, he easily deals with magical threats he couldn't otherwise. Basically, Circe is bad example. Of course it'll be a factor, he's stronger by a significant margin and is a capable fighter in his own right. His versatility could come to play as he could create a wide enough beam so she can't block it and his breath powers can slow her down. Superman heals very quickly, so the 'crippling using his hearing against him' won't last long. Wisdom does not equal intellect. He could simply use x-ray vision and locate her pressure points to nerve strike them. Not to mention he can vibrate through her attacks.

Sure no problem. What specifically would you like scans of?

The wide beam heat vision won't work. She has her bracelets and has blocked a large blast from the Olympian Gods (or maybe just Zeus. I forget). When she turned his hearing against him it brought him to his knees. More than enough time for her to wail on him. He can locate her pressure point sure but it's doubtful he'll ever touch them. That's where her skill comes in to play.

@spidermeat101:

Sorry,but her skill isn't going to help her.That's like me saying she'll beat Galactus just because of her skill.Superman is faster than her.And I'm not talking about combat speed.I'm just talking about speed.That will help him.Also,most of the time,Wonder Woman has only her magical lasso in fights.I'm pretty sure this goes for this fight.And now you're pretty much starting to show ABC logic.She has defeated him but that doesn't mean it will happen again. Spider-man has beaten Firelord,but it doesn't mean it will happen again!Anyways,Superman has the speed to get out of the way if Wonder Woman is throwing the lasso.He can just travel to the other side of the world to dodge it.Heck, he can even sneak up on her and use heat vision IF he's lucky.Superman is stronger,more durable,and well just more powerful!Sometimes,fighting skill won't help.And it certainly isn't for this fight.Superman has super sense.He can hear when Diana is about to throw a punch,he can see her body movement.Superman may not be the best fighter,but he does have a little bit of skill.

Against him, her skill HAS helped her. Superman is no where near a Galactus level threat. Travel speed isn't going to help him here. She's blocked his blitzs before. She does have trouble Lassoing him but it's been done. Her bracelets are her most important piece of equipment as they are unbreakable. Me thinking she beats him again because she beat him is not ABC logic. It's just logic. Him sneaking up on her is ridiculous. Hearing her about to throw a punch, seeing her body movement and his skill have never helped him against her before. Why would they now. I'm not saying she stomps him. Just that she takes a majority. 7 or 8 out of 10.

@ancient_0f_days:

I came pretty close to tagging you for this thread lol well said post.

#883 Edited by Ancient_0f_Days (12206 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve: Thank you, also...remember Heaven's ladder when the JLA went up against a Quantum Zealot (who is supposedly greater than a 5th dimensional being).

The blast was clearly wider than her, so anyone saying that Wonder Woman cannot block wide spread shots is uninformed .... I forgot to address that point in my post, but you can use this when you debate this argument.

His versatility could come to play as he could create a wide enough beam so she can't block it

#884 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicstooge:

Could you post scans? Anyway, ABC logic isn't always correct. I'm saying that when given protection from magic, he easily deals with magical threats he couldn't otherwise. Basically, Circe is bad example. Of course it'll be a factor, he's stronger by a significant margin and is a capable fighter in his own right. His versatility could come to play as he could create a wide enough beam so she can't block it and his breath powers can slow her down. Superman heals very quickly, so the 'crippling using his hearing against him' won't last long. Wisdom does not equal intellect. He could simply use x-ray vision and locate her pressure points to nerve strike them. Not to mention he can vibrate through her attacks.

Sure no problem. What specifically would you like scans of?

The wide beam heat vision won't work. She has her bracelets and has blocked a large blast from the Olympian Gods (or maybe just Zeus. I forget). When she turned his hearing against him it brought him to his knees. More than enough time for her to wail on him. He can locate her pressure point sure but it's doubtful he'll ever touch them. That's where her skill comes in to play.

@spidermeat101:

Sorry,but her skill isn't going to help her.That's like me saying she'll beat Galactus just because of her skill.Superman is faster than her.And I'm not talking about combat speed.I'm just talking about speed.That will help him.Also,most of the time,Wonder Woman has only her magical lasso in fights.I'm pretty sure this goes for this fight.And now you're pretty much starting to show ABC logic.She has defeated him but that doesn't mean it will happen again. Spider-man has beaten Firelord,but it doesn't mean it will happen again!Anyways,Superman has the speed to get out of the way if Wonder Woman is throwing the lasso.He can just travel to the other side of the world to dodge it.Heck, he can even sneak up on her and use heat vision IF he's lucky.Superman is stronger,more durable,and well just more powerful!Sometimes,fighting skill won't help.And it certainly isn't for this fight.Superman has super sense.He can hear when Diana is about to throw a punch,he can see her body movement.Superman may not be the best fighter,but he does have a little bit of skill.

Against him, her skill HAS helped her. Superman is no where near a Galactus level threat. Travel speed isn't going to help him here. She's blocked his blitzs before. She does have trouble Lassoing him but it's been done. Her bracelets are her most important piece of equipment as they are unbreakable. Me thinking she beats him again because she beat him is not ABC logic. It's just logic. Him sneaking up on her is ridiculous. Hearing her about to throw a punch, seeing her body movement and his skill have never helped him against her before. Why would they now. I'm not saying she stomps him. Just that she takes a majority. 7 or 8 out of 10

I beg to differ.Superman has fought people using his senses.That will help him even if you disagree.Superman is smart.He should be able to avoid her lasso wrapping around him.He should learn from his mistakes.Like the other guy said,he can use his X-ray vision to find her pressure points,hit all of them and that's pretty much it.You said he can't reach them,but he can.Superman wins.Just out of the majority though.

#885 Posted by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@spidermeat101:

I beg to differ.Superman has fought people using his senses.That will help him even if you disagree.Superman is smart.He should be able to avoid her lasso wrapping around him.He should learn from his mistakes.Like the other guy said,he can use his X-ray vision to find her pressure points,hit all of them and that's pretty much it.You said he can't reach them,but he can.Superman wins.Just out of the majority though.

I'm not disagreeing. I'm telling you flat out they wiil not and have not helped him with her. The Lasso isn't an issue. He will not be able to hit her pressure points. He'll barely be able to hit her. This is not my opinion. This has been SHOWN ON PANEL.

#886 Posted by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@spidermeat101:

I beg to differ.Superman has fought people using his senses.That will help him even if you disagree.Superman is smart.He should be able to avoid her lasso wrapping around him.He should learn from his mistakes.Like the other guy said,he can use his X-ray vision to find her pressure points,hit all of them and that's pretty much it.You said he can't reach them,but he can.Superman wins.Just out of the majority though.

I'm not disagreeing. I'm telling you flat out they wiil not and have not helped him with her. The Lasso isn't an issue. He will not be able to hit her pressure points. He'll barely be able to hit her. This is not my opinion. This has been SHOWN ON PANEL.

So now Wonder is too untouchable for Superman?If so,then why was Superman able to hit her when they were fighting.No it's not shown on panel because he was hitting her on the panels.This has gotten no where for me.And can you prove to me that Wonder Woman's lasso will be able to catch Superman who is on the other side of the world?

#887 Edited by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve said:

I'm not disagreeing. I'm telling you flat out they wiil not and have not helped him with her. The Lasso isn't an issue. He will not be able to hit her pressure points. He'll barely be able to hit her. This is not my opinion. This has been SHOWN ON PANEL.

So now Wonder is too untouchable for Superman?If so,then why was Superman able to hit her when they were fighting.No it's not shown on panel because he was hitting her on the panels.This has gotten no where for me.And can you prove to me that Wonder Woman's lasso will be able to catch Superman who is on the other side of the world?

She isn't untouchable but he isn't going to be able to scan for pressure points, locate them, and then hit them all. She's not just gonna stand there while he's doing all that and now that I think of it, I don't think he's ever done that before. He gets hits in but it's on panel when she gets serious he has trouble hitting her AND that was when she was holding back. Stop worrying about the Lasso. It's a non factor here. But couldn't she just, I dunno, maybe follow him to the other side of the world if she wanted to Lasso him?

There strength, speed, and durability is all similar. His extra abilities aren't useful here. She has him out skilled and that's why she beats him. That's why she could always beat him.

#889 Edited by Spidermeat101 (260 posts) - - Show Bio

@spidermeat101 said:

@pokeysteve said:

I'm not disagreeing. I'm telling you flat out they wiil not and have not helped him with her. The Lasso isn't an issue. He will not be able to hit her pressure points. He'll barely be able to hit her. This is not my opinion. This has been SHOWN ON PANEL.

So now Wonder is too untouchable for Superman?If so,then why was Superman able to hit her when they were fighting.No it's not shown on panel because he was hitting her on the panels.This has gotten no where for me.And can you prove to me that Wonder Woman's lasso will be able to catch Superman who is on the other side of the world?

She isn't untouchable but he isn't going to be able to scan for pressure points, locate them, and then hit them all. She's not just gonna stand there while he's doing all that and now that I think of it, I don't think he's ever done that before. He gets hits in but it's on panel when she gets serious he has trouble hitting her AND that was when she was holding back. Stop worrying about the Lasso. It's a non factor here. But couldn't she just, I dunno, maybe follow him to the other side of the world if she wanted to Lasso him?

There strength, speed, and durability is all similar. His extra abilities aren't useful here. She has him out skilled and that's why she beats him. That's why she could always beat him.

I take that back.Actually,Superman has the speed to get a scan to do it to her.I never said she'll stop just for him to do it,but he's fast enough to do it.If you don't know Superman's speed,I suggest you read the comic where he races Flash.

#890 Edited by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@pokeysteve said:

@spidermeat101 said:

@pokeysteve said:

I'm not disagreeing. I'm telling you flat out they wiil not and have not helped him with her. The Lasso isn't an issue. He will not be able to hit her pressure points. He'll barely be able to hit her. This is not my opinion. This has been SHOWN ON PANEL.

So now Wonder is too untouchable for Superman?If so,then why was Superman able to hit her when they were fighting.No it's not shown on panel because he was hitting her on the panels.This has gotten no where for me.And can you prove to me that Wonder Woman's lasso will be able to catch Superman who is on the other side of the world?

She isn't untouchable but he isn't going to be able to scan for pressure points, locate them, and then hit them all. She's not just gonna stand there while he's doing all that and now that I think of it, I don't think he's ever done that before. He gets hits in but it's on panel when she gets serious he has trouble hitting her AND that was when she was holding back. Stop worrying about the Lasso. It's a non factor here. But couldn't she just, I dunno, maybe follow him to the other side of the world if she wanted to Lasso him?

There strength, speed, and durability is all similar. His extra abilities aren't useful here. She has him out skilled and that's why she beats him. That's why she could always beat him.

I take that back.Actually,Superman has the speed to get a scan to do it to her.I never said she'll stop just for him to do it,but he's fast enough to do it.If you don't know Superman's speed,I suggest you read the comic where he races Flash.

That's travel speed and doesn't apply in a fight. Flash usually holds back in those races since they're for charity. Superman has no speed feats that put him anywhere near Flash. Especially Wally. Everyone has a speed feat against Flash. He'll be able to scan her but probably not hit her in the areas he needs too. And like I said before, I don't think he's ever done that. Neither has Supergirl or Power Girl against WW and Supergirl has some Amazon training from Artemis.

#891 Posted by Stronger (4948 posts) - - Show Bio

I can't believe this isn't locked.....

Bizarro has beaten her.

Mongul Jr has beaten her.

Doomsday has beaten her.

Superman has previously beaten all those three at least once.

#892 Posted by TifaLockhart (14051 posts) - - Show Bio

Bizarro was arguably non-canon. The Doomsday that Wonder Woman fought (the doomsday wars) was stronger than the one Superman beat (death of superman).

Superman is stronger and has range, but on the other hand, Wonder Woman is more skilled and can deflect his heatvision. I don't know, I say Superman for a majority, but its not a stomp.

#893 Edited by Lvenger (20035 posts) - - Show Bio

@stronger said:

I can't believe this isn't locked.....

Bizarro has beaten her.

Mongul Jr has beaten her.

Doomsday has beaten her.

Superman has previously beaten all those three at least once.

I think Superman wins as well but you can't use this method to justify him winning

  • Bizarro's win was in the non canon Batman/Superman/Wonder Woman: Trinity mini series. Bizarro also broke Wonder Woman's lasso which makes no sense.
  • You may be thinking of the Mongul Sr fight from For The Man Who Has Everything. If not then although Mongul Jr did get some good licks in on Wonder Woman during their fight in Infinite Crisis 1, there was no clear winner. Superman came in and beat Mongul Jr like a dog anyway so we have no way of knowing how Mongul Jr vs Wonder Woman would go.
  • Doomsday's win is legit but Doomsday's shtick is being able to evolve and adapt to defeat his foes or come back immune to what killed him last time. It's no surprise Wonder Woman got beat by Doomsday.


@pokeysteve:Won't be able to touch him? He has nanosecond reaction times and some very fast combat speed feats. I honestly don't see how he's not going to hit her multiple times. Plus the skill hasn't helped too much in most Superman vs Wonder Woman fights. Superman's overall versatility outclasses Wonder Woman's skills any day IMO.

#894 Edited by MPfly88 (156 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm a huge WW fan, and even I know Superman would win. Wonder Woman has never beaten Superman. Ever. WW fanboys like to bring up the Maxwell Lord incident, but fail to mention a few of things.

1. The tiara stopped him, it didn't defeat him. He didn't roll on his back like a dog. As soon as he recovered, which I promise you would not have taken long, he would have gone straight at her again. He also got taken by surprise by the Tiara because he didn't expect Doomsday to throw it at him, which leads to my next point.

2. Superman thought he was fighting Doomsday the whole time. And mind you, Doomsday is a very different fighter than Wonder Woman. How Superman fights Doomsday, is not how he would fight Diana.

3. Wonder Woman was NOT holding back during the fight. You're gonna sit there and tell me she wasn't trying against a bloodlusted Superman that was trying to kill her? Bull. Oh i'm sure Diana wasn't taken the fight seriously when he was in the middle of frying her face and breaking her wrist.

The point is, a clear headed Superman who isn't holding back would win. I'm not saying it's a curbstomp. But he'd definitely win 7-8 out of 10 matches.

#896 Posted by Pokeysteve (8304 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

@pokeysteve:Won't be able to touch him? He has nanosecond reaction times and some very fast combat speed feats. I honestly don't see how he's not going to hit her multiple times. Plus the skill hasn't helped too much in most Superman vs Wonder Woman fights. Superman's overall versatility outclasses Wonder Woman's skills any day IMO.

You've got to be kidding?! Her skill HAS helped her multiple times against him. The way you guys are building him up he should be unstoppable. She's stopped him. She counters all of his versatility.

@mpfly88:

1. The tiara stopped him, it didn't defeat him. He didn't roll on his back like a dog. As soon as he recovered, which I promise you would not have taken long, he would have gone straight at her again. He also got taken by surprise by the Tiara because he didn't expect Doomsday to throw it at him, which leads to my next point.

The thing the real WW fans look at is way before the tiara. How the entire fight she takes everything he has. She dodges most of his attacks easily and he doesn't dodge hers. How when she drops him she chooses to go after Lord instead. She had plenty of opportunity during that fight to end him.

2. Superman thought he was fighting Doomsday the whole time. And mind you, Doomsday is a very different fighter than Wonder Woman. How Superman fights Doomsday, is not how he would fight Diana.

This argument is decent but flawed. Superman can no longer beat Doomsday in a physical fight. He has to find a way to BFR him or get rid of him. He was mad and went at him with all he had. Doomsday is a tougher opponent than Wonder Woman.

3. Wonder Woman was NOT holding back during the fight. You're gonna sit there and tell me she wasn't trying against a bloodlusted Superman that was trying to kill her? Bull. Oh i'm sure Diana wasn't taken the fight seriously when he was in the middle of frying her face and breaking her wrist.

Have you actually read the fight?

#897 Posted by Lvenger (20035 posts) - - Show Bio

You've got to be kidding?! Her skill HAS helped her multiple times against him. The way you guys are building him up he should be unstoppable. She's stopped him. She counters all of his versatility.

It hasn't helped her to a win. And for the record I do think Wonder Woman has a 4/10 chance of winning. It'd be close that's for certain. Skill has helped her in other fights but Superman's versatility and experience does balance things out. What you forget is that neither has taken a clear majority over the other. In that Sacrifice fight you're so fond of spamming out of context, Wonder Woman only holds off rather than beats Superman. Look at the next text box in that scan of yours. "I need to buy time." Do try and get the right interpretation of the fight. She's not going for the win, she knows she can only stall Superman. She suffered damage as did Superman. Plus the tiara slice was also nullified by Superman's healing factor too.

#898 Edited by Stronger (4948 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:

What are you talking about?Mongul Jr one-shotted Wonder Woman and then Superman came in and busted him.Then,after he is beaten,Wonder Woman comes and tries to kill him with her sword which Superman catches before it hit him.Mongul didn't even break a sweat on her.Mongul Sr has beaten the entire JLA team with Wonder Woman and Superman included.He has also lost to Superman once so we cannot take this into account.

I don;t know about which fight you mean with Bizarro,but I mean Matt Wagner's Trinity.I don't know if it's canon.I have just read the issue.

And WW's lasso can be broken or at least,there are many people who could or have escaped from it.For instance,Supergirl or the Queen of Fables.

And why does every WW fanboy bring up that fight with Superman when she threw the tiara at him slicing his neck.Superman thought he was fighting Doomsday.If he was bloodlusted and thought he was fighting her,it should count.Now it doesn't.Get over it........

#899 Posted by Lvenger (20035 posts) - - Show Bio

@stronger: That's not enough to tell us whether Mongul could have actually beaten her in a proper fight though. Besides the fact she comes back to finish him off is telling that she wasn't done with Mongul. Besides it's kind of ABC logic to argue like this. I can do the same to argue that Wonder Woman can beat Mongul. See Hal Jordan has pretty much walked over Mongul

Kyle is often considered to be above Hal based on feats. And Wonder Woman has knocked out Kyle.

Therefore, Wonder Woman can beat Mongul. It's flawed to do that isn't it? That's what you're doing to an effect with Superman and Mongul.

Yes that's what I meant, the Trinity mini series. And it's non canon. Supergirl's only time of breaking the lasso was in the New 52 due to her solar bursts. Don't know about the Queen of Fables one.

#900 Edited by Stronger (4948 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

@stronger: That's not enough to tell us whether Mongul could have actually beaten her in a proper fight though. Besides the fact she comes back to finish him off is telling that she wasn't done with Mongul. Besides it's kind of ABC logic to argue like this. I can do the same to argue that Wonder Woman can beat Mongul. See Hal Jordan has pretty much walked over Mongul

Kyle is often considered to be above Hal based on feats. And Wonder Woman has knocked out Kyle.

Therefore, Wonder Woman can beat Mongul. It's flawed to do that isn't it? That's what you're doing to an effect with Superman and Mongul.

Yes that's what I meant, the Trinity mini series. And it's non canon. Supergirl's only time of breaking the lasso was in the New 52 due to her solar bursts. Don't know about the Queen of Fables one.

Who said Hal can't to the same to her too?? Green Lantern would beat the crap out of Wonder Woman if he fought for real.

Hal has more feats than Kyle as a GL.In this scan you posted,Kyle Rayner didn't know WW was going to attack him and yet she first stole his ring before she knocked him out.She didn't play fair.

Also in the same issue,Wonder Woman is tossed around by Superman and she admits she can't beat him.