could go either way
Superman vs Silver Surfer
@leo-343: why does it matter, you said he is slow and i told you he has ftl combat and nanosecond reaction.Besides, you are talking like Superman fight ftl characters all day.
@mezame: Lol what? Combat speed doesn't equal movement speed, can you run faster than you punch?
Combat speed refers to how fast you fight, react and counter and SS isn't great in that department.
it seems like you don't quite understand the concept of the marvel speed, so allow me to enlighten you, but i must warn you...... it might rustle your jimmies and the jimmies of other people who read it, because it goes against their current beliefs
http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100228175929/marveldatabase/images/2/24/OHOTMU_Stat_Reference_1992.jpg
look in the lower right corner.... reflexes....... that's for marvel characters....... it states that superhumans and metahumans pretty much have instant reflexes...... which is the reason why someone like the hulk, who is a metahuman, has higher than normal reflexes and can tag someone like the gladiator, who can move faster than the speed of light....... so every time someone on the battle boards calls pis when someone like the hulk tags someone like gladiator..... it's not how marvel writers view it, since in their opinion gladiator's reaction times are instant and he will tag gladiator no matter what........
but that has only to do with combat speed, where logic is thrown out of the window........ i'm talking about movement speed...... the ability to move your body...... you MOVE your arm from left to right...... your arm doesn't really travel that distance per se..... you know what i mean? so in theory hulk is not capable of perfoming high level speed feats, because he does not have the needed movement speed....... hulk needs 40 seconds to run from the horizon to the spot you're standing at........ because he moves slow........ but if you're gladiator and you try to blitz him from that point on on the horizon, he will react to you, because marvel comics....... and that attempt from gladiator would be traveling speed, which is again something else entirely........ gladiator has been traveling 100 times faster than the speed of light, but nothing indicates that he can move his arm from left to right 100 times faster than the speed of light......
I think Superman has higher striking power but Silver Surfer has faster reactions so I doubt Superman could be able to tag him and surfer will just harness the power cosmic(given to him by Galactus) into one massive punch and incap Supes.
@leo-343: He's probably referring to this. Best I'm aware of it's the only time he's exhibited it(in combat), though.
Making it basically the textbook definition of "inconsistent". If we were to abide the same rationale, every match featuring The Flash against anyone as or less powerful than Crisis on Infinite Earths Anti-Monitor would end with him effortlessly running through/trashing them.
Because he did it once.
i still see it difficult for Superman to take down Surfer in H2H fight, Superman has superior strength, but still Surfer has FTL reflexes, above supernova level durability.
i don't see how Superman gonna hurt Surfer. IMP? nah, surfer has FTL reflexes he will dodge it. Moreover Surfer has his board he can use it as projectile with hundreds of millions of times FTL it will knock Superman probably, he can also use his board as a shield.
so let's sum it :
- Superman can't hurt Surfer who can withstand supernovas
- to my knowledge, Superman doesn't have FTL reflexes, so Surfer will be dancing around him
- Surfer can liquify his body in a H2H fight, any Superman punch landing on Surfer will be usless.
- Surfer has his board to use as a shield and make his defense even more difficult than it already is for Superman
- Surfer while not flying can lunch his board with hundreds of millions of times FTL speed, not sure if such hit will knock superman but i think maybe it can, specially if Surfer keep doing it repeatedly
so in the end, i'm not sure how durable is N52 superman but if surfer can't hurt him either then this a stalemate, if not than Surfer wins
1. It was never indicated in any way how fast The Runner was going.
2. He wasn't "fighting" The Runner, so much as getting embarrassed and outpaced by him(when Runner didn't simply choose to tank whatever Surfer dished out) on his own board, which The Runner proceeded to jack from him.
Again, with NO indication of how fast The Runner was going while doing all this.
If that's what counts as an impressive showing, I'd hate to see what you'd consider a bad one.
@xiix: board steal is bull, if i remember right he says several times that his board answers only to him.
hmm i suppose if you nerf Silver Surfer this much than Superman might actually be able to win a few... however Surfer still wins a majority due to his way way way superior durability
I completely agree with "Serrure". You took away all the things that make Silver Surfer, Silver Surfer. Seems like this is just to make Superman look good, because you know in a regular one on one fight Silver Surfer would mop up Superman reletively easily.
Like how about you make a thread New 52 Batman vs New 52 Superman under a Red Sun so Superman doesn't have any powers any it just a 1 v 1 fist fight. Obviously Batman would win easily he knows like every form of martial arts and just the art of fighting in general, and Clark is very reliant on his powers so he doesn't know really how to fight that good, specially without his powers.
@jedixman@sc@saren Look at how much nerfing he did just to make Superman look good.
Right.
So why not change it to make it a more even fight?
Look at all the debate going on, instead of just "Silver Surfer stomps." These types of threads are made to get people to debate.
still usable, he also fought himself
So is Flash dismantling The Anti-Monitor.
Still inconsistent.
And really? "He fought himself"?
I don't think I've ever seen a more outstanding example of circular-logic in my entire life.
You basically just said that "Surfer is evidently that fast, because he fought a guy that's as fast as he is".
That's just...................wow.
still usable, he also fought himself
So is Flash dismantling The Anti-Monitor.
Doesn't mean you should use it.
And really? "He fought himself"?
I don't think I've ever seen a more outstanding example of circular-logic in my entire life.
Sorry mr for saying it like that.And i posted that to show he can fight at high speed, so spare me.
@ghostrider2: Spare you what?
You're the one who posted it........
I never said it was impressive just that he could keep up with him... He fights at ftl speeds is what I was saying... The runner > ss > the flash...... The AM feat is crap... that was a whole team of heroes and the AM was being attacked magically,,, psychically,,, and physically... it wasn't just flash vs the AM... and when I say crap... it was crap writing... Flash should never ever be able to vibrate through the am armor ever ever
@scouterv: But this is just completely unfair, man. Especially since the OP said Pre 52 Superman which has hand 2 hand feats while Surfer has like none. If he really wanted to make it fair he should only have used New 52 2014 Superman to make it actually even. Some people here are making some interesting debates though, that I will say.
@xiix: and you were quickly to judge.
@scouterv: But this is just completely unfair, man. Especially since the OP said Pre 52 Superman which has hand 2 hand feats while Surfer has like none. If he really wanted to make it fair he should only have used New 52 2014 Superman to make it actually even. Some people here are making some interesting debates though, that I will say.
Really? I hadn't noticed it was Pre-Flashpoint, so I agree with the use of Post-Flashpoint Kal. Even still, the thing is, almost no version of Surfer that I know (granted, I don't know many,) has no striking/hand-to-hand feats because that's not how he handles things.
I suppose in retrospect, it's unfair because we're kind of dealing in Supermans' specialty but there's really no way things can be fair and even in a fight between Surfer and Super. Someone would kind of be screwed.
@ghostrider2: Yeah.
Hopefully this won't come as a shock, but that's the whole point of the forum..............
Even this handicapped SS can win here, as he can amp his strength to a high enough level to surpass Clark, and he already possesses the superior duarability and invunerability...
SS wins, in a very good fight IMO...
This.
Surfer doesn't have just that one FTL feat......contrary to what people seem to be assuming
He has a couple of microseconds and nanoseconds feats, searched the planet in the time it took Dr Strange to finish a sentence, processed a 1000 years of information in 0 001 seconds, made a gauntlet grab across more than a light year in the time it took Cap to throw a punch
And thats without even going to his best feats, feats such as crossing entire dimensions on speed alone, and moving through time multiple times on speed alone, including while hes actually fighting someone, moving to the singularity, a dimension/ being that existed before the universe itself on speed alone
That certainly blows past Clarks reaction speed what with him explicitly shouting out " im not FTL!" and having to be lent speed to achieve the same and/ or fainting from trying to travel through time
As far as nuClark goes, the guys slower than Barry whos slower than light.
In any case surfer can just amp his stats/ can repair any damage done
Superman should stomp.
Jmarshmallow
This is correct
Superman
hmm i suppose if you nerf Silver Surfer this much than Superman might actually be able to win a few... however Surfer still wins a majority due to his way way way superior durability
Superior durability? Care to show those?
I don't see the point in this, it's like doing wolverine vs Hector Hammond with no psychic powers. Surfer will not have sufficient feats as his power base is so varied he doesn't just fist fight his way through everything.
This is just getting rid of pretty much all the things Surfer would use to beat Supes, so Kal'el takes this one. Nerf someone this much and they can be beaten by a lot of people. This is pretty much taking someone from Herald standard to Captain America standard.
I'm inclined to think that Superman is physically stronger, and more durable, than Surfer, and while i very rarely see Superman actually using any proper fighting skills he is supposed to possess them, whereas i've never seen Surfer be skilful in hand to hand combat. I've seen him throw some seriously powerful punches, but not with any martial prowess. He had a close combat fight with World War Hulk and has exchanged blows with Thor on a several occasions, and he's obviously extremely fast, but Superman has flown through moons, pulled the Earth around, held a star in his grip, etc, all things Surfer can probably mimic in his own way, he's busted planets before but, if i recall correctly, only with energy attacks, but in this fight scenario i see Superman winning.
Surfer is not helpless in H2H though.
Never take anything in that era of X-Force and X-Statix seriously. They were all horrible.
Superman probably takes this he often Fights his enemies with his physical speed and strength while silver Surfer prefers to use energy projection and Manipulation abilities not to mention Supes has close combat Training from batman and superman is also stronger than surfer his punches will hurt surfer However silver Surfer might a have chance by enhancing his Phyiscals though it is a matter of time
@misterwhisper: Nah. I think they are fine.
The Surfer can use the Power Cosmic to enhance his strength to incalculable levels, which potentially surpasses Superman substantially. Considering his other abilities are not in use, strategy and cosmic awareness dictate he must do whatever it takes to over power this opponent. Also, Surfer is more durable. He survives black holes, while Superman runs away from them.
He's not as skilled as Superman, but he has a lot of experience. Especially after the Planet Sakaar incident. And while he isn't as skilled, he's tougher, and can augment his strength levels.
Clark has this.
people keep talking about surfer strength potential like its some sort of limitless strength thingy
Supes Combat speed :
superman He is considered the leader of the Pax Galactica, a group of powerful cosmic warriors :
His reputation as a vaunted warrior is well known across the cosmos:
Superman is the greatest warrior Frankestein has ever met, and he is centuries old :
Single handle the Pax Galatic demonstrating some hand to hand skills :
here superman is fighting with a (magical) japanese god of war,using some hypersonic kung-fu moves :
superman training Kryptonian Martial Arts ... :
Power nullification :
I Think Clark Take's It .
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