#1 Posted by BigCimmerian (7559 posts) - - Show Bio

- This is arm wrestling match

- Prime during Infinite Crisis, current Thor ON WARRIOR MADNESS

- Thor is angry because he thinks Prime killed Sif, who wins and why?

#2 Edited by Equonox (956 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime. Even regular Superman has strength feats that put him out of WM Thor's range, SBP is just overkill.

#3 Posted by Inconvenient_Truth (2362 posts) - - Show Bio

but...but...Thor, Thunder God, Son of Odin.

lol

SBP deeeeestroys him

#4 Posted by BigCimmerian (7559 posts) - - Show Bio

@equonox said:

Prime. Even regular Superman has strength feats that put him out of WM Thor's range, SBP is just overkill.

So you say that Superman is 10 times stronger than Thor?

#5 Edited by AllStarSuperman (15747 posts) - - Show Bio

SBP so dang easy. I say he breaks Thor's hand...

New 52 superman would still win easy.

Pre flashpoint supes wins with little trouble.

The only superman that Thor could possibly beat is post crisis/pre zero hour.

#6 Posted by rolldestroyer (3508 posts) - - Show Bio

prime easily

#7 Edited by Ancient_0f_Days (10235 posts) - - Show Bio

lol this isn't a battle ...... even if it was, the thread starter knew it'd be a blowout anyway.

#8 Posted by texasdeathmatch (13171 posts) - - Show Bio

Should've given Thor speed force :P

#9 Posted by Immortal777 (5886 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime.

#10 Posted by BigCimmerian (7559 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't know that Prime is 10 times stronger than regular Superman and Thor lol.

#11 Posted by turoksonofstone (13194 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime. Old DC is gone forever though so give it up.

#12 Posted by TifaLockhart (13828 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime was significantly stronger than Superman.

#13 Posted by russellmania77 (13586 posts) - - Show Bio

optimus prime wins here

#14 Posted by AnotherVillain (33 posts) - - Show Bio

prime very easy

#15 Posted by dondave (26585 posts) - - Show Bio

Prime ftw

Online
#16 Posted by NeonGameWave (7205 posts) - - Show Bio

Superboy Prime.

#17 Posted by Malevolent1 (1072 posts) - - Show Bio

Until the thunder god becomes bonafide FTL in speed/reaction feats? This is a molly whop.

SBP for the win.

#18 Posted by Killemall (16958 posts) - - Show Bio

Was the OP edited? Where is the whole talk about speed coming from when its an arm wrestling contest.

If Warrior Madness Thor is really 10 times stronger than Thor, which well description says yes, then I am with Thor here.

While i believe Superboy Prime is in fact stronger than Thor, 10 times stronger, not really no..

#19 Posted by russellmania77 (13586 posts) - - Show Bio

dude your so lucky cuz i made a thor n superman vs prime battle and i still got super flamed

#20 Posted by King Saturn (222794 posts) - - Show Bio

I am going with Superboy Prime based on the fact that we don't have a lot of power lifting feats from Thor... nothing like him moving planets at least.

#21 Posted by Equonox (956 posts) - - Show Bio

@equonox said:

Prime. Even regular Superman has strength feats that put him out of WM Thor's range, SBP is just overkill.

So you say that Superman is 10 times stronger than Thor?

I mean I don't have a number, but New-52 Supes could hold the weight of the earth for 5 days straight without sunlight. Prime is even far above him. WM Thor has no strength feats close to that...

#22 Posted by Bossmonster (1959 posts) - - Show Bio

@equonox said:

Prime. Even regular Superman has strength feats that put him out of WM Thor's range, SBP is just overkill.

#23 Edited by BigCimmerian (7559 posts) - - Show Bio

@equonox said:

@bigcimmerian said:

@equonox said:

Prime. Even regular Superman has strength feats that put him out of WM Thor's range, SBP is just overkill.

So you say that Superman is 10 times stronger than Thor?

I mean I don't have a number, but New-52 Supes could hold the weight of the earth for 5 days straight without sunlight. Prime is even far above him. WM Thor has no strength feats close to that...

Well, WM Thor stalemated Thanos.

#24 Posted by Stronger (4948 posts) - - Show Bio
#25 Edited by hart7668 (2109 posts) - - Show Bio

This is the arm wrestle between Thor and Hercules. I believe it says "enough force to knock the whole planet out of orbit." Warrior's Madness amplifies this force 10 fold? MMm, I don't think SPB wins this so easily.

#26 Posted by Bo88gdan (4374 posts) - - Show Bio

Тор побеђује јебено пусти ове ретарде

#27 Posted by Saren (24310 posts) - - Show Bio

@equonox said:

@bigcimmerian said:

@equonox said:

Prime. Even regular Superman has strength feats that put him out of WM Thor's range, SBP is just overkill.

So you say that Superman is 10 times stronger than Thor?

I mean I don't have a number, but New-52 Supes could hold the weight of the earth for 5 days straight without sunlight. Prime is even far above him. WM Thor has no strength feats close to that...

Well, WM Thor stalemated Thanos.

He had this useful little trinket called the Power Gem with him at the time.

Moderator
#28 Edited by Killemall (16958 posts) - - Show Bio

I am going with Superboy Prime based on the fact that we don't have a lot of power lifting feats from Thor... nothing like him moving planets at least.

He has a nifty arm wrestling and nearly moving a planet out of orbit on his normal power level, besides Superman himself without an amp has never moved a planet on his own.

Superboy Prime has but really, really dont think that itself makes him anywhere close to 10 times stronger than Thor,

#29 Posted by King Saturn (222794 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_saturn said:

I am going with Superboy Prime based on the fact that we don't have a lot of power lifting feats from Thor... nothing like him moving planets at least.

He has a nifty arm wrestling and nearly moving a planet out of orbit on his normal power level, besides Superman himself without an amp has never moved a planet on his own.

Superboy Prime has but really, really dont think that itself makes him anywhere close to 10 times stronger than Thor,

Well Pre Crisis Superman has moved Planets before... so has Superboy Prime during Infinite Crisis IIRC. The thing is some of the best Strength Feats of Thor lifting something was probably the Midgard Serpent or when he lifted Asgard... but neither one of those items are equal to the Earth in mass. It might actually be possible for Superboy Prime to be 10 times stronger than Thor. I mean the Earth weighs essentially 6,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 tons. So what do we know of Thor lifting that was over 600,000,000,000,000,000 tons ?

#30 Edited by isaac_clarke (5448 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't know that Prime is 10 times stronger than regular Superman and Thor lol.

He isn't. The guy had issues with Superboy for Pete's sake.

#31 Posted by Killemall (16958 posts) - - Show Bio


Well Pre Crisis Superman has moved Planets before...

Not sure how that is relevant King, the power level after Crisis has been retconned. After all Kara is from the same pre-crisis universe as Superboy Prime and so was Earth 2 Superman, none of them are at pre-crisis level, you cant use pre-crisis feats and apply it to Superboy Prime.

Yes he has, a planet of unspecified size, which i myself mentioned earlier but not while replying to you, that doesnt actually automatically make him 10 times stronger than Thor.

Ah! but the point wasnt about lifting Mig-guard Serpent or moving it but rather over-powering the serpent who was about to crush the earth.

It actually take more strenght to crush something rather than move it.

I know at times it feel hard to swallow, but lets see i can push a fridge around, i cant squeez and blow it up with my strength. I can push a metal ball of 1 kg around, i cant crush it with my arm.

Think of it the other way around, can you think of 1 thing that you can crush with your hand but cant move?

Also note that its easier to move things on space then on earth, thanks to the existence of earth's gravity.

It doesnt have to be, in fact neither Superman nor Superboy has lifted Earth, in fact you cant lift earth under gravity as Earth is in space, you can only move it.

Scientific fact: moving earth on a constant acceleration takes exactly the same amount of force required to dislodge earth for the orbit, in fact when you are moving the earth or any other planet you are doing 2 things and 2 things only:

1. Overcoming the gravitational force of attraction between Earth and its star, i.e. the sun. When you are producing enough force to dislodge a planet from the orbit you are doing exactly the same.

2. Overcoming its inertia , which is exactly what you would need to do in order to dislodge earth from its orbit (move it on the side of the orbit, overcoming its inertia of motion which is revolving around the sun)

In fact you can actually calculate how much force is required using F= (G x m1 x m2)/ (r squared) thing is all the variable would be exactly the same for moving the earth or moving the earth out of its orbit.

I think by now you are beginning to see what i said, its a bit astro-physics, lets try and summaries it :

1. Superboy prime did not LIFT the planet he moved the planet, different. I can move my car i cant lift it, assuming its the same for you too.

2. The mass of the earth is going to be same for Marvel as well as DC, and Superboy did not move the earth, but lets assume the planet he moved was exactly as heavy as Earth. What do you get:

a. Superboy having to physically push to move the planet.

b. Thor and Hercules arm wrestling, and as a side effect threatnind to dislodge the planet out of orbit (move it outside its orbit)

I could say pretty comparable feat, in fact Thor feat looks before.

Midguard Serpent example: thor overpowered the grip of Midguard Serpent who was about to crush the earth, more force is required to crush a planet then to move it, as more force is requred to crush anything rather than move it (unless its sticking to a pole :p but hey thats cheating..).

There is really nothing one can argue that Superboy Prime, or Superman was 10 times stronger than Thor.

#32 Edited by King Saturn (222794 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_saturn said:

Well Pre Crisis Superman has moved Planets before...

Not sure how that is relevant King, the power level after Crisis has been retconned. After all Kara is from the same pre-crisis universe as Superboy Prime and so was Earth 2 Superman, none of them are at pre-crisis level, you cant use pre-crisis feats and apply it to Superboy Prime.

Yes he has, a planet of unspecified size, which i myself mentioned earlier but not while replying to you, that doesnt actually automatically make him 10 times stronger than Thor.

Ah! but the point wasnt about lifting Mig-guard Serpent or moving it but rather over-powering the serpent who was about to crush the earth.

It actually take more strenght to crush something rather than move it.

I know at times it feel hard to swallow, but lets see i can push a fridge around, i cant squeez and blow it up with my strength. I can push a metal ball of 1 kg around, i cant crush it with my arm.

Think of it the other way around, can you think of 1 thing that you can crush with your hand but cant move?

Also note that its easier to move things on space then on earth, thanks to the existence of earth's gravity.

It doesnt have to be, in fact neither Superman nor Superboy has lifted Earth, in fact you cant lift earth under gravity as Earth is in space, you can only move it.

Scientific fact: moving earth on a constant acceleration takes exactly the same amount of force required to dislodge earth for the orbit, in fact when you are moving the earth or any other planet you are doing 2 things and 2 things only:

1. Overcoming the gravitational force of attraction between Earth and its star, i.e. the sun. When you are producing enough force to dislodge a planet from the orbit you are doing exactly the same.

2. Overcoming its inertia , which is exactly what you would need to do in order to dislodge earth from its orbit (move it on the side of the orbit, overcoming its inertia of motion which is revolving around the sun)

In fact you can actually calculate how much force is required using F= (G x m1 x m2)/ (r squared) thing is all the variable would be exactly the same for moving the earth or moving the earth out of its orbit.

I think by now you are beginning to see what i said, its a bit astro-physics, lets try and summaries it :

1. Superboy prime did not LIFT the planet he moved the planet, different. I can move my car i cant lift it, assuming its the same for you too.

2. The mass of the earth is going to be same for Marvel as well as DC, and Superboy did not move the earth, but lets assume the planet he moved was exactly as heavy as Earth. What do you get:

a. Superboy having to physically push to move the planet.

b. Thor and Hercules arm wrestling, and as a side effect threatnind to dislodge the planet out of orbit (move it outside its orbit)

I could say pretty comparable feat, in fact Thor feat looks before.

Midguard Serpent example: thor overpowered the grip of Midguard Serpent who was about to crush the earth, more force is required to crush a planet then to move it, as more force is requred to crush anything rather than move it (unless its sticking to a pole :p but hey thats cheating..).

There is really nothing one can argue that Superboy Prime, or Superman was 10 times stronger than Thor.

1. Your exact words in the previous post was "Superman Never Moved a Planet on His own" that's why I said Pre Crisis Superman has moved Planets before... I don't care if it was retcon or not. Superman at one point could move planets on his own and that was the point.

2. Usually the thought was that the Planet was around Earth size level... why should we suggest it was smaller anyways ? It could have been larger.

3. Even though the Serpent was trying to crush the Earth... Thor was not... so Thor moving something that was trying to crush the Earth is still essentially a Moving feat not a feat of Crushing... so I am not sure why you went on that tangent there.

4. But we have never seen Thor do any Planet moving feats at all... IIRC, he struggled to hold up Asgard when lifting it. So I don't think he is as strong as you are letting on or thinking he is physically.

5. Thor and Hercules supposedly threatened to move the Earth out of it's Orbit... it could for all we know be hyperbole on the part of the writer... but SBP actually moved a planet... and when we go back to Thor struggling to hold up Asgard... the average of Thor's strength may not be as impressive as folks would like to think.

6. Superman was 10 times stronger than Thor... especially back in his Silver Age Superman days when he could sneeze Solar System away and hold several planets and tow them with a giant chain. Superboy Prime is more of the latter days of Pre Crisis Superman in strength though.

#33 Edited by Killemall (16958 posts) - - Show Bio


1. Your exact words in the previous post was "Superman Never Moved a Planet on His own" that's why I said Pre Crisis Superman has moved Planets before... I don't care if it was retcon or not. Superman at one point could move planets on his own and that was the point.

Yes of course, but its pre-crisis Superman in question here, not sure why you would use pre-crisis Superman feats.

Current Superman, or perhaps i should more aptly say post crisis, pre -flashpoint version of Superman, which is the only we should be talking about because we are comparing him with Superboy Prime, has never move the planet, thats was the point.

2. Usually the thought was that the Planet was around Earth size level... why should we suggest it was smaller anyways ? It could have been larger.

Why would we automatically assume the planet was the same size as the earth, when nothing about the planet was shown. Thats actually new to me.

Also if you see my whole argument was based on us assuming the planet was in fact the same size of the earth and still doesnt change the view.

3. Even though the Serpent was trying to crush the Earth... Thor was not... so Thor moving something that was trying to crush the Earth is still essentially a Moving feat not a feat of Crushing... so I am not sure why you went on that tangent there.

Come on King why would Thor try and crush the earth.

Point was Serpent was coiled around the earth, with a grip that was going to crush the earth, while Thor was able to over-power the same grip of Serpent.

Moving Serpent wasnt Thor feats, we have no clue how heavy Serpent was, what thor however did was yank the serpent, against his wishes, who was firstly griping the earth and hence trying to crush the earth.

Do you see a tangent now?

Essentially what happens King is that if a snake is say encircling an apple as hard as it can, and you can physically pull the scan out of the same grip, you are essentially over-powering the grip of snake.

Same thing in the feat, he yanked Midguard Serpent right out of earth when the serpent was gripping around the earth nearly going to crush it, hence the tangent :)

4. But we have never seen Thor do any Planet moving feats at all... IIRC, he struggled to hold up Asgard when lifting it. So I don't think he is as strong as you are letting on or thinking he is physically.

My answer to that would be is there a difference between strength in the 2 feats we are considering?

1. Moving the Earth

2. Overpowering a grip that could crush the earth.

3. Armwrestling that nearly took earth out of orbit

Its still the same strength, its not different.

Why would we see one feat and see another different.

I could just say Superboy Prime has never nearly thrown earth out of its orbit because he was caught up in an arm wrestling as well see.

Then Asgard feat, problem is strength is going to be inconsistent. We have seen Wonder Woman moved 1/3 of the moon and struggle to lift a bridge. We have also seen the new 52 Superman lift earth weight for few days straight and yet Superman and Wonder Woman later struggled to lift a plane.

We are comparing high end feats arent we, you said you believe Prime was 10 times stronger than Thor because he moved a planet, well i can say he is not where close to 10 times stonger than Thor because :

1. He struggled with Superboy

2. He struggled with 2 Superman

3. 3 LOSH guys where every to hold him

There are plenty of instances that contradicts it.

See, strength is not going to be consistent in comics for anyone above planetary level.

Also i actually agree Superboy Prime is stronger than Thor, i just dont agree on the 10 times part.

5. Thor and Hercules supposedly threatened to move the Earth out of it's Orbit... it could for all we know be hyperbole on the part of the writer... but SBP actually moved a planet... and when we go back to Thor struggling to hold up Asgard... the average of Thor's strength may not be as impressive as folks would like to think.

Why bring up average Thor feat when you are comparing with TOP Superboy Prime's feat?

And was it a hyperbole? Maybe, you cant prove that either way can you.

The same thing comes from Midguard serpent.

6. Superman was 10 times stronger than Thor... especially back in his Silver Age Superman days when he could sneeze Solar System away and hold several planets and tow them with a giant chain. Superboy Prime is more of the latter days of Pre Crisis Superman in strength though.

Silver Age he was but i dont see how thats consequential to what we are debating. Also sneezing a solar system really really isnt a strength feat not sure why people claim so, towing planets however was, and it wasnt Superman but rather Superboy.

Superboy is more of a latter, perhaps, there is not proof either way. After all we have to go by feats he has performed, moving the planet by itself doesnt automatically make him 10 times powerful than Thor at all when Thor feats are equally impressive, at least some of his high end feat are.

#34 Edited by King Saturn (222794 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_saturn said:

1. Your exact words in the previous post was "Superman Never Moved a Planet on His own" that's why I said Pre Crisis Superman has moved Planets before... I don't care if it was retcon or not. Superman at one point could move planets on his own and that was the point.

Yes of course, but its pre-crisis Superman in question here, not sure why you would use pre-crisis Superman feats.

Current Superman, or perhaps i should more aptly say post crisis, pre -flashpoint version of Superman, which is the only we should be talking about because we are comparing him with Superboy Prime, has never move the planet, thats was the point.

2. Usually the thought was that the Planet was around Earth size level... why should we suggest it was smaller anyways ? It could have been larger.

Why would we automatically assume the planet was the same size as the earth, when nothing about the planet was shown. Thats actually new to me.

Also if you see my whole argument was based on us assuming the planet was in fact the same size of the earth and still doesnt change the view.

3. Even though the Serpent was trying to crush the Earth... Thor was not... so Thor moving something that was trying to crush the Earth is still essentially a Moving feat not a feat of Crushing... so I am not sure why you went on that tangent there.

Come on King why would Thor try and crush the earth.

Point was Serpent was coiled around the earth, with a grip that was going to crush the earth, while Thor was able to over-power the same grip of Serpent.

Moving Serpent wasnt Thor feats, we have no clue how heavy Serpent was, what thor however did was yank the serpent, against his wishes, who was firstly griping the earth and hence trying to crush the earth.

Do you see a tangent now?

Essentially what happens King is that if a snake is say encircling an apple as hard as it can, and you can physically pull the scan out of the same grip, you are essentially over-powering the grip of snake.

Same thing in the feat, he yanked Midguard Serpent right out of earth when the serpent was gripping around the earth nearly going to crush it, hence the tangent :)

4. But we have never seen Thor do any Planet moving feats at all... IIRC, he struggled to hold up Asgard when lifting it. So I don't think he is as strong as you are letting on or thinking he is physically.

My answer to that would be is there a difference between strength in the 2 feats we are considering?

1. Moving the Earth

2. Overpowering a grip that could crush the earth.

3. Armwrestling that nearly took earth out of orbit

Its still the same strength, its not different.

Why would we see one feat and see another different.

I could just say Superboy Prime has never nearly thrown earth out of its orbit because he was caught up in an arm wrestling as well see.

Then Asgard feat, problem is strength is going to be inconsistent. We have seen Wonder Woman moved 1/3 of the moon and struggle to lift a bridge. We have also seen the new 52 Superman lift earth weight for few days straight and yet Superman and Wonder Woman later struggled to lift a plane.

We are comparing high end feats arent we, you said you believe Prime was 10 times stronger than Thor because he moved a planet, well i can say he is not where close to 10 times stonger than Thor because :

1. He struggled with Superboy

2. He struggled with 2 Superman

3. 3 LOSH guys where every to hold him

There are plenty of instances that contradicts it.

See, strength is not going to be consistent in comics for anyone above planetary level.

Also i actually agree Superboy Prime is stronger than Thor, i just dont agree on the 10 times part.

5. Thor and Hercules supposedly threatened to move the Earth out of it's Orbit... it could for all we know be hyperbole on the part of the writer... but SBP actually moved a planet... and when we go back to Thor struggling to hold up Asgard... the average of Thor's strength may not be as impressive as folks would like to think.

Why bring up average Thor feat when you are comparing with TOP Superboy Prime's feat?

And was it a hyperbole? Maybe, you cant prove that either way can you.

The same thing comes from Midguard serpent.

6. Superman was 10 times stronger than Thor... especially back in his Silver Age Superman days when he could sneeze Solar System away and hold several planets and tow them with a giant chain. Superboy Prime is more of the latter days of Pre Crisis Superman in strength though.

Silver Age he was but i dont see how thats consequential to what we are debating. Also sneezing a solar system really really isnt a strength feat not sure why people claim so, towing planets however was, and it wasnt Superman but rather Superboy.

Superboy is more of a latter, perhaps, there is not proof either way. After all we have to go by feats he has performed, moving the planet by itself doesnt automatically make him 10 times powerful than Thor at all when Thor feats are equally impressive, at least some of his high end feat are.

1. Current Superman in the new 52 IIRC, actually held up the weight of the Earth on some device IIRC... so maybe Superman is back to his old levels. Point is you seem to say "Superman never moved a planet on his own" and left it open... as if he never done such a feat. I use Pre Crisis Superman as an example because I see PC Superman as an extension of Superman regardless of if he was retcon or not. But I get your overall theme now.

2. The same way folks claim that the planet Gladiator destroyed with his bare hands was the same size as the Earth... they assume it all the time when a planet level feat is done. The assumption is it's Earth sized or near it.

3. Okay, but overpowering the Midgard Serpent is like Thor's only high end strength feat that we can surely say he did... but I don't even know how it's comparable to moving a Planet... especially if it's not the base of Thor's strength anyways.

4. Yes, they are different Strength feats... but there seems to be a little more to suggest that SBP's strength is on that Planet moving level... and Thor's strength is not quite the planet shaking level as we would like to believe... I use the Asgard lifting feat, for a few reasons... 1. it's more recent than the Midgard Serpent or the Arm Wrestling Match feats of Thor 2. It's a strength feat that shows Thor struggling to hold something lessor than what we would consider with SBP moving Planets. As far as Inconsistency in Strength, well that's going to happen. But again, why should I think Thor is much higher than his Asgard lifting strength level considering this is the most recent of his Physical Strength feats and he does not have a ton of them to begin with ? I expect inconsistency with Superman or Superboy Prime, because they always do that with them. Having them get beat by lessor competition at times... getting tagged by bricks... but they have several high end strength feats... or at least they did.

5. Well it only makes sense to bring up Average Thor because we are looking for his Base Level of Power to work with before we do the other math... these supposed feats of him moving the Earth out of it's orbit and lifting the Midgard Serpent seem to be his high end feats... his power level could be near that if we did not have recent feats of him struggling to do lessor things physically. I use that Planet moving Superboy Prime feat because that is usually what high end Kryptonians are know for... moving Planets.

6. The point was there was a time when Superman was stronger than Thor. It's still possible that Superboy Prime could be 10 times stronger than Thor especially considering Thor's more recent Strength Feats in comparison to what we have seen done from Superboy Prime. No reason to bring up SBP getting beat by lessor foes... because at times even Thor got beat by lessor foes.

#35 Edited by AllStarSuperman (15747 posts) - - Show Bio

SBP moved a planet. Thor lifted a city. WM Thor could lift 10 cities. Planet >>>>>>>>10 cities. SBP wins easy.

#36 Posted by Killemall (16958 posts) - - Show Bio

SBP moved a planet. Thor lifted a city. WM Thor could lift 10 cities. Planet >>>>>>>>10 cities. SBP wins easy.

Not even in full warrior madness, Thor beat up Adam Warlock, Silver Sufer, Beta Ray Bill , Maxam and Drax with Power Gem, while Superboy Prime lost to teen titans so Thor stomps..

See.. you can look at one person's top feat and ignore another.


1. Current Superman in the new 52 IIRC, actually held up the weight of the Earth on some device IIRC... so maybe Superman is back to his old levels. Point is you seem to say "Superman never moved a planet on his own" and left it open... as if he never done such a feat. I use Pre Crisis Superman as an example because I see PC Superman as an extension of Superman regardless of if he was retcon or not. But I get your overall theme now.

Fair enough.

2. The same way folks claim that the planet Gladiator destroyed with his bare hands was the same size as the Earth... they assume it all the time when a planet level feat is done. The assumption is it's Earth sized or near it.

Yes that sounds just like assumption without really anything, buts its a different topic than we are debating.

I never liked people just assuming stuffs, but meh! i dont make the rules

3. Okay, but overpowering the Midgard Serpent is like Thor's only high end strength feat that we can surely say he did... but I don't even know how it's comparable to moving a Planet... especially if it's not the base of Thor's strength anyways.

There are few other here and there:

1. Thor has resisted the gravity akin to that of a neutron star.

2. Physically manage to survived being crushed under a score of planets (i.e. 20 planets)

3. Arm wrestling and nearly moving the planet out of an orbit.

4. Fighting and actually winning against Drax the destroyed with power gem who has essentially one shotted a planet buster with ease, both planet busting feat and drax one shotting champion who did the planet busting happened in the same issue.

So there are odd extremely high end feat here and there.

Also i dont understand whats Thor base strength... he is not Hulk, he doesnt get progressively powerful.

Its his high end feats, much like moving planet is Superboy Prime's highest feat.

4. Yes, they are different Strength feats... but there seems to be a little more to suggest that SBP's strength is on that Planet moving level... and Thor's strength is not quite the planet shaking level as we would like to believe... I use the Asgard lifting feat, for a few reasons... 1. it's more recent than the Midgard Serpent or the Arm Wrestling Match feats of Thor 2. It's a strength feat that shows Thor struggling to hold something lessor than what we would consider with SBP moving Planets. As far as Inconsistency in Strength, well that's going to happen. But again, why should I think Thor is much higher than his Asgard lifting strength level considering this is the most recent of his Physical Strength feats and he does not have a ton of them to begin with ? I expect inconsistency with Superman or Superboy Prime, because they always do that with them. Having them get beat by lessor competition at times... getting tagged by bricks... but they have several high end strength feats... or at least they did.

I dont think i agree with this at all.

Why should the most recent feat dictation your power level.

Most recent feat from Superboy Prime was getting beat up by Teen Titans, so that doesnt say much either.

Then lifting earth weight was one of Superman's feat, but his more recent feat was struggling to lift a plane alonside wonder woman (in new 52), are we going to say thats what Superman strength is now. Struggling to lift half the weight of a plane?

The thing you used for Thor, more recent, struggled to lift a smaller weight, applies spot on for Superman there..

See things fall apart.

Had there been a retcon i would understand, else its both high end feat.

Despite all that, and i know for a fact that Thor resisting the weight of 20 planets is a feat unmatched by even Superman Prime, the amped up version, i am not claiming Thor is stronger.

Consistent portrayal does show Superboy Prime is stronger but no where close to 10 times stronger.

5. Well it only makes sense to bring up Average Thor because we are looking for his Base Level of Power to work with before we do the other math... these supposed feats of him moving the Earth out of it's orbit and lifting the Midgard Serpent seem to be his high end feats... his power level could be near that if we did not have recent feats of him struggling to do lessor things physically. I use that Planet moving Superboy Prime feat because that is usually what high end Kryptonians are know for... moving Planets.

By high end Kryptonians you mean Kryptonians before the retcon, that seems counter-productive because it has been retconned.

Superman himself has never moved the earth on his own, apart from 1 time with the help of GL lantern and there is a huge loophole, it was retelling of one of his pre-crisis story arc.

So which other Kryptonian in the continuity we are talking about has moved a planet.

Also if we are going to say only use Thor average feat, which i would agree, then i would say why not use the average feat from Superboy prime as opposed to an ambiguous feat, because we dont have the 2 biggest variables to actually calculate how much force it takes to move the planet:

i.e. 1. Size of its star and 2. Distance from the said star.

Being able to move a planet is more of a one time feat anyways, after all he is not normally shown 10 times stronger than Thor, or Superman heck even Superboy.

He however is shown stronger than all of them individually.

Thats a different thing.

6. The point was there was a time when Superman was stronger than Thor. It's still possible that Superboy Prime could be 10 times stronger than Thor especially considering Thor's more recent Strength Feats in comparison to what we have seen done from Superboy Prime. No reason to bring up SBP getting beat by lessor foes... because at times even Thor got beat by lessor foes.

1. Superman being stronger than Thor at some point isnt really relevant to the debate as it is retconned.

2. More recently doesnt change, after all more recent feat of Superboy Prime isnt impressive either. And someone 10 times stronger than Thor with speed and heat vision is really, really not going to lose against Teen Titans, and thats the most recent.

3. Point was if you are going to compare average feat, can you show me SBP consistently doing something like moving a planet, ever showing that kind of feat every again.

The reason i bring up him beating beaten is the same reason you are brining up his Asgard and other feats, its because thats show a consistency.

You can say lets use Average Thor and then compare with Superboy Primes best feat.

Thats contradiction.

Use average from both, you should come to the same conclusion, SBP is indeed stronger than Thor, nothing even remotely elludes him being 10 times.

You can say he moved planet, Thor has matched those high end feat as well, in fact far bettered those feats, why should we not look at Thor's best feat when we are looking at SBP's best feat?

#37 Posted by AllStarSuperman (15747 posts) - - Show Bio

What's the point of this debate? We know SBP wins. Your just argueing that Thor is weaker but by how much...

#38 Posted by King Saturn (222794 posts) - - Show Bio

@king_saturn said:

1. Current Superman in the new 52 IIRC, actually held up the weight of the Earth on some device IIRC... so maybe Superman is back to his old levels. Point is you seem to say "Superman never moved a planet on his own" and left it open... as if he never done such a feat. I use Pre Crisis Superman as an example because I see PC Superman as an extension of Superman regardless of if he was retcon or not. But I get your overall theme now.

Fair enough.

2. The same way folks claim that the planet Gladiator destroyed with his bare hands was the same size as the Earth... they assume it all the time when a planet level feat is done. The assumption is it's Earth sized or near it.

Yes that sounds just like assumption without really anything, buts its a different topic than we are debating.

I never liked people just assuming stuffs, but meh! i dont make the rules

3. Okay, but overpowering the Midgard Serpent is like Thor's only high end strength feat that we can surely say he did... but I don't even know how it's comparable to moving a Planet... especially if it's not the base of Thor's strength anyways.

There are few other here and there:

1. Thor has resisted the gravity akin to that of a neutron star.

2. Physically manage to survived being crushed under a score of planets (i.e. 20 planets)

3. Arm wrestling and nearly moving the planet out of an orbit.

4. Fighting and actually winning against Drax the destroyed with power gem who has essentially one shotted a planet buster with ease, both planet busting feat and drax one shotting champion who did the planet busting happened in the same issue.

So there are odd extremely high end feat here and there.

Also i dont understand whats Thor base strength... he is not Hulk, he doesnt get progressively powerful.

Its his high end feats, much like moving planet is Superboy Prime's highest feat.

4. Yes, they are different Strength feats... but there seems to be a little more to suggest that SBP's strength is on that Planet moving level... and Thor's strength is not quite the planet shaking level as we would like to believe... I use the Asgard lifting feat, for a few reasons... 1. it's more recent than the Midgard Serpent or the Arm Wrestling Match feats of Thor 2. It's a strength feat that shows Thor struggling to hold something lessor than what we would consider with SBP moving Planets. As far as Inconsistency in Strength, well that's going to happen. But again, why should I think Thor is much higher than his Asgard lifting strength level considering this is the most recent of his Physical Strength feats and he does not have a ton of them to begin with ? I expect inconsistency with Superman or Superboy Prime, because they always do that with them. Having them get beat by lessor competition at times... getting tagged by bricks... but they have several high end strength feats... or at least they did.

I dont think i agree with this at all.

Why should the most recent feat dictation your power level.

Most recent feat from Superboy Prime was getting beat up by Teen Titans, so that doesnt say much either.

Then lifting earth weight was one of Superman's feat, but his more recent feat was struggling to lift a plane alonside wonder woman (in new 52), are we going to say thats what Superman strength is now. Struggling to lift half the weight of a plane?

The thing you used for Thor, more recent, struggled to lift a smaller weight, applies spot on for Superman there..

See things fall apart.

Had there been a retcon i would understand, else its both high end feat.

Despite all that, and i know for a fact that Thor resisting the weight of 20 planets is a feat unmatched by even Superman Prime, the amped up version, i am not claiming Thor is stronger.

Consistent portrayal does show Superboy Prime is stronger but no where close to 10 times stronger.

5. Well it only makes sense to bring up Average Thor because we are looking for his Base Level of Power to work with before we do the other math... these supposed feats of him moving the Earth out of it's orbit and lifting the Midgard Serpent seem to be his high end feats... his power level could be near that if we did not have recent feats of him struggling to do lessor things physically. I use that Planet moving Superboy Prime feat because that is usually what high end Kryptonians are know for... moving Planets.

By high end Kryptonians you mean Kryptonians before the retcon, that seems counter-productive because it has been retconned.

Superman himself has never moved the earth on his own, apart from 1 time with the help of GL lantern and there is a huge loophole, it was retelling of one of his pre-crisis story arc.

So which other Kryptonian in the continuity we are talking about has moved a planet.

Also if we are going to say only use Thor average feat, which i would agree, then i would say why not use the average feat from Superboy prime as opposed to an ambiguous feat, because we dont have the 2 biggest variables to actually calculate how much force it takes to move the planet:

i.e. 1. Size of its star and 2. Distance from the said star.

Being able to move a planet is more of a one time feat anyways, after all he is not normally shown 10 times stronger than Thor, or Superman heck even Superboy.

He however is shown stronger than all of them individually.

Thats a different thing.

6. The point was there was a time when Superman was stronger than Thor. It's still possible that Superboy Prime could be 10 times stronger than Thor especially considering Thor's more recent Strength Feats in comparison to what we have seen done from Superboy Prime. No reason to bring up SBP getting beat by lessor foes... because at times even Thor got beat by lessor foes.

1. Superman being stronger than Thor at some point isnt really relevant to the debate as it is retconned.

2. More recently doesnt change, after all more recent feat of Superboy Prime isnt impressive either. And someone 10 times stronger than Thor with speed and heat vision is really, really not going to lose against Teen Titans, and thats the most recent.

3. Point was if you are going to compare average feat, can you show me SBP consistently doing something like moving a planet, ever showing that kind of feat every again.

The reason i bring up him beating beaten is the same reason you are brining up his Asgard and other feats, its because thats show a consistency.

You can say lets use Average Thor and then compare with Superboy Primes best feat.

Thats contradiction.

Use average from both, you should come to the same conclusion, SBP is indeed stronger than Thor, nothing even remotely elludes him being 10 times.

You can say he moved planet, Thor has matched those high end feat as well, in fact far bettered those feats, why should we not look at Thor's best feat when we are looking at SBP's best feat?

1. okay

2. well this is what people seem to think... so I use the average for leverage in this discussion.

3. Those four examples you have made puts a better perspective on the battle... if all is true. Then perhaps Thor might be stronger than Superboy Prime possibly.

4. Not, most recent feat... most recent Strength feat. Considering this was one of the few times in recent years that we saw Thor actually using raw Strength to lift or move something I thought it was very valid to use here... but I also was unaware of some of the other examples you explained previously... hence I felt the feat was even more valid because of Thor lacking over Physical Strength feats in general. The point is not that we are saying Thor is just strong enough to lift up Asgard... it's just that his base ( average strength levels ) do not seem to show he is that of Superboy Prime's level, more so only a fraction of his strength. As far as Superman failing to lift a plane... well the whole Superman holding the weight of the Earth on his shoulders with that machine can cancel that out because it's also recent.

5. When I speak of High End Kryptonian feats I am speaking of what the Pre Crisis Kryptonians have done. Yes, it was retcon, but it seems that Superboy Prime was liken to them in terms of physical strength. Also remember, if we go by that recent new 52 Superman issue, Superman has lifted the weight of the Earth on his shoulder via that machine. Now that Thor holding the weight of 20 planets feat is something that is new. It brings a new dimension to the discussion... and I don't recall anyone using it before because it would give a lot of leverage to some of the other debates that have been had on here between Thor and Superman characters.

6. Yes, it was retcon. But PC Superman was stronger than Thor and since we often use the PC Superman character around here I thought it was okay to bring him up regardless if he was retcon or not.

Who said that Superboy Prime was 10 times faster or stronger with heat vision ? I am speaking strictly with physical strength... and that was before some of the more recent feats of Thor was brought up.

The point of bringing up Thor's average feat is to garner a measurement of Thor's overall strength at 1/10. His high end strength feats would not be a good average of what he can do physically because we know he has low end strength feats much below that. Now because of this I use the Asgard feat to garner a better average of what his overall strength at 1 level of strength would be against 10 times that to gain a better understanding of the math and if Superboy Prime is actually 10 times stronger than him or not. We use Superboy Prime's high end feat because that's his peak feat. So somewhere in the sextillions of tons we know SBP's strength lies... at least lifting wise. There is no contradiction... because the point is of trying to get an average of what Thor's strength would be at 1/10 of his power so we can know what he can do at 10/10 or 10 times stronger against what SBP can do at his peak levels of Strength.

#39 Edited by Wardemon32 (3603 posts) - - Show Bio

SBP light work

#40 Edited by spidermanandsuperman (259 posts) - - Show Bio
#41 Posted by dum529001 (1572 posts) - - Show Bio

#1.

There are plenty of high end and low-end feats for any character.

In debate, you tend to cancel out low-end feats for one in light of their many other high end feats.

When you're doing this, do it for both characters in order to be fair.

#2.

If we strictly go only by everyone's lowest of low-end feats we'll be taking all the "super" out of the superheros.

We'd have to reach the conclusion that nobody everyone has a complete lack of superpowers, which defeats what we are trying to do in the first place, which is comparing the characters' power-levels and seeing the differences.

#3.

You can't base a characters power-level entirely on low-end feats and you can't you their absolute greatest feat as the norm since it usually comes with a specific set of conditions or circumstance.

Not holding both characters you're comparing creates a logical fallicies. IT leaves yo unable to to compare and differentiate, wwhcih is what you sought to do in the first place. Don't abandon logic for personal favoritism. Partiality has no place in rational thinking.

We have to avoid logical fallacies to have a fair, balance and honest debate. Happy debating!

#42 Edited by baron2011 (1151 posts) - - Show Bio

prime wins

i mean this is the same guy that at his weakest brings people back to life and alter reality with his fists

and prime threw anti monotor with so much power that he flew over half of the universe in minutes

#43 Posted by BigCimmerian (7559 posts) - - Show Bio

@bo88gdan said:

Тор побеђује јебено пусти ове ретарде

Много ме нервирају са овим Суперменима, ок је лик, али ови су луди за њим.

#44 Edited by New_World_Order (11159 posts) - - Show Bio

Was the OP edited? Where is the whole talk about speed coming from when its an arm wrestling contest.

If Warrior Madness Thor is really 10 times stronger than Thor, which well description says yes, then I am with Thor here.

While i believe Superboy Prime is in fact stronger than Thor, 10 times stronger, not really no..