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#1 Edited by SMXLR8 (1094 posts) - - Show Bio

Both sayians are fully powered and can fuse with unlimited time

Rules - no prep , no BFR , in character , no cosmic mat , comic buff to match only

Location - hyperbolic time chamber

note - this is a random fight

#2 Posted by TheCerealKillz (10266 posts) - - Show Bio

Do DBZ characters have any answer to intangibility. If not, Silver Surfer with TP wins.

#3 Posted by Hksaru (463 posts) - - Show Bio

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

#4 Posted by TheCerealKillz (10266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

#5 Posted by xeon1cs (1479 posts) - - Show Bio

So basically this is two people vs someone that is literally impossible for them to destroy and a man on a surfboard who is a pacifist when incharacter.

#6 Posted by RudeBomberBoy01 (1445 posts) - - Show Bio

Oh for the love of God!

#7 Posted by Hksaru (463 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

What do you mean not again? Do I have to re-watch the entire series for you to pinpoint when these things are stated/evidenced or shall you just watch it for yourself? Buu and Bibidi nearly destroyed the universe and wiped out the Kais.

#8 Posted by TheCerealKillz (10266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Hksaru said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

What do you mean not again? Do I have to re-watch the entire series for you to pinpoint when these things are stated/evidenced or shall you just watch it for yourself? Buu and Bibidi nearly destroyed the universe and wiped out the Kais.

Buu did that, not Bibidi. And Dabura was hardly a threat.

Anyways, Surfer has much better feats than Bibidi.

And even if we aren't gonna use TP, Surfer is a lot faster and is fine with absorbing everything they throw at them.

#9 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

What do you mean not again? Do I have to re-watch the entire series for you to pinpoint when these things are stated/evidenced or shall you just watch it for yourself? Buu and Bibidi nearly destroyed the universe and wiped out the Kais.

Buu did that, not Bibidi. And Dabura was hardly a threat.

Anyways, Surfer has much better feats than Bibidi.

And even if we aren't gonna use TP, Surfer is a lot faster and is fine with absorbing everything they throw at them.

surfer has a limit to his absorption ability, if Goku and Vegeta go Gogota it would be f**king easy for them to blow both SS and Doc M

#10 Posted by TheCerealKillz (10266 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

What do you mean not again? Do I have to re-watch the entire series for you to pinpoint when these things are stated/evidenced or shall you just watch it for yourself? Buu and Bibidi nearly destroyed the universe and wiped out the Kais.

Buu did that, not Bibidi. And Dabura was hardly a threat.

Anyways, Surfer has much better feats than Bibidi.

And even if we aren't gonna use TP, Surfer is a lot faster and is fine with absorbing everything they throw at them.

surfer has a limit to his absorption ability, if Goku and Vegeta go Gogota it would be f**king easy for them to blow both SS and Doc M

How would they blow something they can't even hit?

Also, Surfer would probably just use TP.

#11 Posted by comicace3 (1984 posts) - - Show Bio

Well I'm gonna say team DBZ.

#12 Posted by Sethlol (1296 posts) - - Show Bio

Surfer solos yet again.

#13 Posted by tomlikesfries (4526 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2 quite easily.

#14 Edited by mypasswordis1234 (1106 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

What do you mean not again? Do I have to re-watch the entire series for you to pinpoint when these things are stated/evidenced or shall you just watch it for yourself? Buu and Bibidi nearly destroyed the universe and wiped out the Kais.

Buu did that, not Bibidi. And Dabura was hardly a threat.

Anyways, Surfer has much better feats than Bibidi.

And even if we aren't gonna use TP, Surfer is a lot faster and is fine with absorbing everything they throw at them.

Bidibi created Buu, and he controlled it while he could, so basically the old Kaioshins death was caused by Bidibi.

Also Dabura killed Kibito, changed Piccolo and Krillion into stone, almost Gohan too, after they had a decent fight, and Dabura still had more potential. If they appeared sooner, in the Cell saga, they would have screwed, so the "hardly a threat" is not true imo.

The "lot faster" isn't true either, he doesn't have so good combat speed, at least I haven't seen here.

#15 Posted by GhostRider2 (3014 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sethlol said:

Surfer solos yet again.

#16 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCerealKillz said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

What do you mean not again? Do I have to re-watch the entire series for you to pinpoint when these things are stated/evidenced or shall you just watch it for yourself? Buu and Bibidi nearly destroyed the universe and wiped out the Kais.

Buu did that, not Bibidi. And Dabura was hardly a threat.

Anyways, Surfer has much better feats than Bibidi.

And even if we aren't gonna use TP, Surfer is a lot faster and is fine with absorbing everything they throw at them.

surfer has a limit to his absorption ability, if Goku and Vegeta go Gogota it would be f**king easy for them to blow both SS and Doc M

How would they blow something they can't even hit?

Also, Surfer would probably just use TP.

just how intangibility is gonna make them win? by using it they can avoid non surprise attacks, but also they can't attack too. so intangibility is useless it will just buy them some time

TP won't work, both Goku and Vegeta are resistent to TP at planetary level, that TP is better than Xavier's TP. so how again SS is gonna hurt them by TP?

#17 Posted by xeon1cs (1479 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

#18 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

#19 Edited by Z3RO180 (5946 posts) - - Show Bio

really fed up of all theese threads :/

#20 Edited by xeon1cs (1479 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

#21 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

#22 Posted by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@xeon1cs said:

So basically this is two people vs someone that is literally impossible for them to destroy and a man on a surfboard who is a pacifist when incharacter.

Exactly! LOLOL! How can you put anybody against Silver Surfer in character? He's basically a pacifist. I guess this is his way of handicapping SS.

#23 Posted by xeon1cs (1479 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

Why would he be overworked from that? You act like he's just going to stand there and take it forever.

#24 Posted by never give up (9231 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2

#25 Posted by Bossmonster (1968 posts) - - Show Bio

What the @$#!

Is this &$%& serious??! Like how. How in the F!@^ are Goku and Vegeta going to hurt fu&%^*$ Manhattan? Just please explain this to me? How with they stop him from ripping them are part on an atomic level? This is so outrageous!

Team2 "WTF you've got to be FUC*&^! kidding me, GTFO here with that S!*^" Stomps to a level unseen in this life time.

#26 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

Why would he be overworked from that? You act like he's just going to stand there and take it forever.

no, he can try what he want, Gogeta SSJ4 or even SSJ2 is overwhelming in power, and i said even if he's not overworked, he still loses, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever.

#27 Edited by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

It always surprises me how much nonsense DBZ fanboys make up. First, IIRC Goku has never used the Evil Containment Wave in a battle. Second, unless specified by the OP characters have no equipment/objects except for objects they always use to fight, for example Hal Jordan and his Green Lantern ring. So, Goku does not have access to a denshi jar in this fight. Third, Dr. Manhattan can transmute matter on a subatomic level. I see no reason why he should remain trapped inside a bottle. That's just stupid.

#28 Posted by tomlikesfries (4526 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

Don't mean to interrupt your argument here, but you speak as though Manhattan and Silver Surfer would just stand there watching Goku/Vegeta beating the cr@p out of them. Surfer alone can destroy both. And Dr. Manhattan can become intangible, so the blasts wouldn't exactly work on him.

#29 Posted by jobbernos (1420 posts) - - Show Bio

manhattan solos effortlessly.

#30 Edited by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Dude, stop lying and learn to get your facts right. No character in DB/Z/GT has ever shown resistance to TP based attacks and no character in DB/Z/GT has ever used a TP based attack in battle. Babidi didn't use TP to try and control Vegeta, he used magic. He cast a spell/enchantment on Vegeta to try and control him. Magic =/= TP. What you've pointed out is a magic durability feat, no a TP durability feat. Second, Babidi was not a wizard of "universal threat." Babidi couldn't defeat the Kai's so he created Majin Buu. Majin Buu was the universal threat, not Babidi.

Edit: Also, in the manga, which is the source material, Majin Buu was not a universal thread. Even in the anime, he wasn't really a universal threat either.

#31 Posted by SpeedForceSpider (902 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sethlol said:

Surfer solos yet again.

#32 Posted by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

@TheCerealKillz said:

@Hksaru said:

Does intangibility grant immunity to energy attacks? Because if it works like the Flash's by vibrating the molecules or whatever, it wouldn't make a difference. It still might not otherwise but IDK

And they're as extraordinary in their mental durability as their physical, shown when Vegeta overcame Babidi, a wizard of universal threat who had the literal Satan of their universe, Dabura under his will, he who brought fear into even the Supreme Kai.

Ugh, not again with the universal threat things.

What do you mean not again? Do I have to re-watch the entire series for you to pinpoint when these things are stated/evidenced or shall you just watch it for yourself? Buu and Bibidi nearly destroyed the universe and wiped out the Kais.

Buu did that, not Bibidi. And Dabura was hardly a threat.

Anyways, Surfer has much better feats than Bibidi.

And even if we aren't gonna use TP, Surfer is a lot faster and is fine with absorbing everything they throw at them.

surfer has a limit to his absorption ability, if Goku and Vegeta go Gogota it would be f**king easy for them to blow both SS and Doc M

Again, stop with the lies. Silver Surfer has so much energy projection that he's created a singularity a.k.a. a black hole. If Silver Surfer has a limit to his energy absorption, then post scans showing us what that limit is.

#33 Posted by dondave (27230 posts) - - Show Bio

SS or Dr Manhattan solo

#34 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

It always surprises me how much nonsense DBZ fanboys make up. First, IIRC Goku has never used the Evil Containment Wave in a battle. Second, unless specified by the OP characters have no equipment/objects except for objects they always use to fight, for example Hal Jordan and his Green Lantern ring. So, Goku does not have access to a denshi jar in this fight. Third, Dr. Manhattan can transmute matter on a subatomic level. I see no reason why he should remain trapped inside a bottle. That's just stupid.

firstly, if you call yourself respectable person, stop using names!!

that technic should be no problem to Gogeta, Goku learned kamehameha in an instant, the land of fight wasn't specified so Gegeta can teleport and teleport back in an instant and bring a bottle. and it's not stupid that Dr M stay confined there, transmutation matter or teleportation won't work as it didn't for Satan and Kami.

#35 Posted by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

Why would he be overworked from that? You act like he's just going to stand there and take it forever.

no, he can try what he want, Gogeta SSJ4 or even SSJ2 is overwhelming in power, and i said even if he's not overworked, he still loses, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever.

Again bro, stop lying. First, there is literally no such thing as SSJ 2 Gogeta. There is no media--either manga, anime, or movies--showing SSJ 2 Gogeta. The character is completely fan made crap. Second, SSJ 4 Gogeta is absolutely featless. The character appeared for 10 minutes in 1 episode and did absolutely nothing. It's ironic because most people claim that Dr. Manhattan is relatively featless, but SSJ 4 Gogeta has less feats than Dr. Manhattan; SSJ 4 Gogeta literally has 1 feat, which is easily kicking away a planet busting attack. That's it. Here's the entire featless fight between SSJ 4 Gogeta and Omega Shenron.

But none of this matters, unless OP specifies, fighters fight as they are. So, Goku and Vegeta fight separately.

#36 Posted by Parallax_Hal_Jordan (372 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

SS or Dr Manhattan solo

This

Online
#37 Edited by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@uberhikari said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

It always surprises me how much nonsense DBZ fanboys make up. First, IIRC Goku has never used the Evil Containment Wave in a battle. Second, unless specified by the OP characters have no equipment/objects except for objects they always use to fight, for example Hal Jordan and his Green Lantern ring. So, Goku does not have access to a denshi jar in this fight. Third, Dr. Manhattan can transmute matter on a subatomic level. I see no reason why he should remain trapped inside a bottle. That's just stupid.

firstly, if you call yourself respectable person, stop using names!!

that technic should be no problem to Gogeta, Goku learned kamehameha in an instant, the land of fight wasn't specified so Gegeta can teleport and teleport back in an instant and bring a bottle. and it's not stupid that Dr M stay confined there, transmutation matter or teleportation won't work as it didn't for Satan and Kami.

I called you a liar because that's what you are. You're lying, and you should stop it before I flag you. First, IIRC Goku never learned the Evil Containment Wave. At comicvine, characters enter the fight with all their techniques, abilities, and feats. They can't learn new techniques once the battle starts. If they haven't been shown to use a technique before, then they don't possess that ability in vs. matches. Second, just like I told you before, unless specified by the OP characters don't have access to any equipment that they don't normally use to fight. At comicvine, a character can't teleport somewhere, grab some equipment, and then continue to fight. These are the rules, now follow the rules or I'm flagging you.

Edit: It's stupid to say that Dr. Manhattan can be trapped in a bottle because no character in DB/Z/GT has matter manipulation powers. Neither Satan nor Kami possess matter manipulation powers. Dr. Manhattan can just transmute the bottle to escape.

#38 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@tomlikesfries said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

Don't mean to interrupt your argument here, but you speak as though Manhattan and Silver Surfer would just stand there watching Goku/Vegeta beating the cr@p out of them. Surfer alone can destroy both. And Dr. Manhattan can become intangible, so the blasts wouldn't exactly work on him.

based on what SS beats both of them?

just how intangibility is gonna make them win? by using it they can avoid non surprise attacks, but also they can't attack too. so intangibility is useless it will just buy them some time.

Evil Containment Wave is based on surprise, Gogeta with his speed will take the advantage and use the technic on Dr Manhatan.

Silver Surfer is a planet buster, Gogeta is far far away above planet busters. i don't see SS having any chance even bloodlusted

#39 Edited by xeon1cs (1479 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder: To even suggest Goku/Vegeta/Gogeta has anyway to avoid getting pulled to and then destroyed on the Astral Plane, stop a black hole from being generated inside of them or simply prevent themselves from getting mind-wrecked is absurd. Yes, in character Silver Surfer probably isn't going to do much unless he's forced to. But when he's forced to, it's over.

Regardless, they don't possess the ability to stop Dr. Manhattan.

#40 Posted by Warlock12 (79 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder: oh wow i love when DBZ fans claim that any character from Z to GT is anything above planet buster first of all no one in DBZ/GT has ever destroyed anything bigger then a planet and saying they can is pure speculation since if any of the villians could blow up a galaxy then why did they not you know blow it up. Yes everyone passed the Namek Saga is a planet buster but that is it also why would would Goku or Vegeta use the Evil Containment Wave since you know it requires a person's life force to use it and if they used it they would either die or be to weak the fight off the other one. SS and Dr wins they are more intelligent then either Vegeta and Goku and also im not really sure how they could kill Dr. M since if he dies he would immediatly create a new body and also both of them have molecluar control and while SS might not do it Dr will and could just turn them to glass or ashes.

#41 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@uberhikari said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Why are you even entertaining the idea they possess the ability to defeat Doctor Manhattan?

They don't.

hilarious :D i ask you the same question. what make you think they couldn't?

Hilarious? They're going to "kill" someone who can come back from a single subatomic particle? Do you even know who Dr. Manhattan is?

i know him, but still Gogeta can blow him all day while drinking soda, Dr. Manhattan will be overworked from rebuilding his body every time, and even if he don't,when they finish their drink, they can use on him a special technic (the one Piccolo used against Kami) and imprison him in the bottle for ever. (because there is no rule in this thread that say victory should be by killing)

It always surprises me how much nonsense DBZ fanboys make up. First, IIRC Goku has never used the Evil Containment Wave in a battle. Second, unless specified by the OP characters have no equipment/objects except for objects they always use to fight, for example Hal Jordan and his Green Lantern ring. So, Goku does not have access to a denshi jar in this fight. Third, Dr. Manhattan can transmute matter on a subatomic level. I see no reason why he should remain trapped inside a bottle. That's just stupid.

firstly, if you call yourself respectable person, stop using names!!

that technic should be no problem to Gogeta, Goku learned kamehameha in an instant, the land of fight wasn't specified so Gegeta can teleport and teleport back in an instant and bring a bottle. and it's not stupid that Dr M stay confined there, transmutation matter or teleportation won't work as it didn't for Satan and Kami.

I called you a liar because that's what you are. You're lying, and you should stop it before I flag you. First, IIRC Goku never learned the Evil Containment Wave. At comicvine, characters enter the fight with all their techniques, abilities, and feats. They can't learn new techniques once the battle starts. If they haven't been shown to use a technique before, then they don't possess that ability in vs. matches. Second, just like I told you before, unless specified by the OP characters don't have access to any equipment that they don't normally use to fight. At comicvine, a character can't teleport somewhere, grab some equipment, and then continue to fight. These are the rules, now follow the rules or I'm flagging you.

Edit: It's stupid to say that Dr. Manhattan can be trapped in a bottle because no character in DB/Z/GT has matter manipulation powers. Neither Satan nor Kami possess matter manipulation powers. Dr. Manhattan can just transmute the bottle to escape.

waaaaw!!! you attacked 4 replies in less than a minute, you hate DBZ/GT to that point!!! and i only see here one big liar when he's insulting and calling others liars, again, make yourself respectable and stop insults or i'll flag you!!

you said :

Again, stop with the lies. Silver Surfer has so much energy projection that he's created a singularity a.k.a. a black hole. If Silver Surfer has a limit to his energy absorption, then post scans showing us what that limit is.

1 - SS absorbed part of solar energy, and was so overloaded to the point he lost his mind and body was close to blow, go read Infinite Crusades

in the face, who's the liar now!!

Again bro, stop lying. First, there is literally no such thing as SSJ 2 Gogeta

2- Goku can go SSJ2, Vegeta can go SSJ2 (if you deny that go read the manga or watch anime, because everybody knows that) if both can go SSJ2, then only a retarded won't accept that Gogeta can go SSJ2.

Second, SSJ 4 Gogeta is absolutely featless. The character appeared for 10 minutes in 1 episode and did absolutely nothing. It's ironic because most people claim that Dr. Manhattan is relatively featless, but SSJ 4 Gogeta has less feats than Dr. Manhattan; SSJ 4 Gogeta literally has 1 feat, which is easily kicking away a planet busting attack.

3- SSJ4 Gogeta is not featless, he proved to be stronger than omega shenron, this latter was so powerful that only a Universal Genki Dama (life force of all universe) was able to beat him.

But none of this matters, unless OP specifies, fighters fight as they are. So, Goku and Vegeta fight separately.

4-OP didn't say that, who's liar now, he said they can fuse, and it's a team fight not one on one fight. pfffff

Edit: It's stupid to say that Dr. Manhattan can be trapped in a bottle because no character in DB/Z/GT has matter manipulation powers. Neither Satan nor Kami possess matter manipulation powers. Dr. Manhattan can just transmute the bottle to escape.

5- Kami have matter manipulation, as Piccolo has, he proved the ability to change clothes, and it's illogical to think matter manipulation can get you out when even teleportation can't.

SPIT.

#42 Posted by Floopay (7700 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder:

I dunno if you are arguing for DBZ team or Comic team, but.

I do not believe Surfer can absorb spiritual energy of any sort, not even psionic energy as far as I know. So him draining Ki energy seems ridiculous as it's pretty much spiritual energy.

And the DBZ team has no answer to Doctor Manhattan. Honestly, he's witness events so small, and so fast they can hardly be said to have happened at all (I haven't read the graphic novel in ages, but I think that's in both IIRC). To be honest, I doubt they could speed blitz him, and they have no means of killing or even BFRing him.

They can shrink or trap him wherever they want, he can just reform and travel somewhere else, or he can multiply into several copies of himself, or become the size of an ant or the size of a skyscraper. But at the end of the day, he could simply explode them with a thought. Plus he can see his own past, present, and future simultaneously, so he should be more than capable of countering anything they do to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

#43 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: To even suggest Goku/Vegeta/Gogeta has anyway to avoid getting pulled to and then destroyed on the Astral Plane, stop a black hole from being generated inside of them or simply prevent themselves from getting mind-wrecked is absurd. Yes, in character Silver Surfer probably isn't going to do much unless he's forced to. But when he's forced to, it's over.

Regardless, they don't possess the ability to stop Dr. Manhattan.

DBZ fighters can use astral plane with ease, as Piccolo did, and weak and inexperienced Gohan did too.

Regardless, they do or not possess the ability to stop Dr. Manhattan, they will keep blowing him until they finish SS. then it's useless for Dr M to do anything.

@Warlock12 said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: oh wow i love when DBZ fans claim that any character from Z to GT is anything above planet buster first of all no one in DBZ/GT has ever destroyed anything bigger then a planet and saying they can is pure speculation since if any of the villians could blow up a galaxy then why did they not you know blow it up. Yes everyone passed the Namek Saga is a planet buster but that is it also why would would Goku or Vegeta use the Evil Containment Wave since you know it requires a person's life force to use it and if they used it they would either die or be to weak the fight off the other one. SS and Dr wins they are more intelligent then either Vegeta and Goku and also im not really sure how they could kill Dr. M since if he dies he would immediatly create a new body and also both of them have molecluar control and while SS might not do it Dr will and could just turn them to glass or ashes.

1- the weakest version of vegeta in his first appearance was able to blow a planet with a finger, that makes him above planet buster, how cna you think with the heavenly inconceivable difference between Gogeta and 1st version Vegeta, how can you think Gogeta is only a planetbuster, it's hilarious!!!

2- (-_-) Piccolo used the Evil Containment with ease against Kami with no side effects

3- Molecular control will need you to be at least equal to your foe in power!! also Gogeta can do destruction at atomic scale as he did with janemba.

#44 Edited by Warlock12 (79 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder: Ok show me a clip from the anime or manga where someone actually blows up something bigger then a planet because unless you do then it is speculation and when Piccilo reversed kami's however Master Roshi died when he used it and Tien was saved because Piccilo blew up the pot before it was complete and Gogeta never destroyed Janemba he purified him of his evil and even if they destroyed Dr. M's body who is to say that is his only body he could have a dozen waiting or doing other things. Also wats to stop Dr. M from just you know turning them into ashes with a stare since no DBZ/Gt Charater is immune to transmutation.

#45 Posted by Floopay (7700 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@xeon1cs said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: To even suggest Goku/Vegeta/Gogeta has anyway to avoid getting pulled to and then destroyed on the Astral Plane, stop a black hole from being generated inside of them or simply prevent themselves from getting mind-wrecked is absurd. Yes, in character Silver Surfer probably isn't going to do much unless he's forced to. But when he's forced to, it's over.

Regardless, they don't possess the ability to stop Dr. Manhattan.

DBZ fighters can use astral plane with ease, as Piccolo did, and weak and inexperienced Gohan did too.

Regardless, they do or not possess the ability to stop Dr. Manhattan, they will keep blowing him until they finish SS. then it's useless for Dr M to do anything.

@Warlock12 said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder: oh wow i love when DBZ fans claim that any character from Z to GT is anything above planet buster first of all no one in DBZ/GT has ever destroyed anything bigger then a planet and saying they can is pure speculation since if any of the villians could blow up a galaxy then why did they not you know blow it up. Yes everyone passed the Namek Saga is a planet buster but that is it also why would would Goku or Vegeta use the Evil Containment Wave since you know it requires a person's life force to use it and if they used it they would either die or be to weak the fight off the other one. SS and Dr wins they are more intelligent then either Vegeta and Goku and also im not really sure how they could kill Dr. M since if he dies he would immediatly create a new body and also both of them have molecluar control and while SS might not do it Dr will and could just turn them to glass or ashes.

1- the weakest version of vegeta in his first appearance was able to blow a planet with a finger, that makes him above planet buster, how cna you think with the heavenly inconceivable difference between Gogeta and 1st version Vegeta, how can you think Gogeta is only a planetbuster, it's hilarious!!!

2- (-_-) Piccolo used the Evil Containment with ease against Kami with no side effects

3- Molecular control will need you to be at least equal to your foe in power!! also Gogeta can do destruction at atomic scale as he did with janemba.

Doctor Manhattan was disassembled at the atomic level and still survived.

How will containment be useful? DM can just sort of...teleport wherever. There's nothing to suggest he couldn't teleport the dbz crew into space where they'd suffocate, or just disassemble them.

Also, Vegeta destroying a planet with his fingers is non-cannon to the manga IIRC. That's an anime only thing. However, you are correct that he is above planet buster. Buu was able to destroy a planet ten times over with his biggest attack, which means SSJ4 Vegeta should be about that level.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

#46 Posted by SMXLR8 (1094 posts) - - Show Bio

um did anyone noticed the OP was changed?

#47 Posted by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder:

1 - SS absorbed part of solar energy, and was so overloaded to the point he lost his mind and body was close to blow, go read Infinite Crusades

in the face, who's the liar now!!

Wow... I can't believe this. This is a flat out lie. First, the name of the crossover was called The Infinity Crusade, not Infinite Crusades. You don't even know the name of the crossover this scan came from. Second, Silver Surfer did not lose his mind and he was not close to blowing up. He certainly beefed up but there was no evidence that he lost his mind or that he reached his limit.

Moreover, this is extreme low balling. Hulk is wearing equipment to breathe in space, LOL. And Silver Surfer is clearly a planet buster, but here he needs to absorb solar energy just to bust a moon. On the other hand, Silver Surfer has wrecked a solar system with the shock wave of his blows, has flown through stars, and here is Silver Surfer creating a singularity a.k.a. a black hole.

So, I have now proven definitively that you are a liar. Congratulations, you get a piece of candy.

2- Goku can go SSJ2, Vegeta can go SSJ2 (if you deny that go read the manga or watch anime, because everybody knows that) if both can go SSJ2, then only a retarded won't accept that Gogeta can go SSJ2.

Dude, just stop it. SSJ 2 Gogeta has never appeared in any DB/Z/GT media--not manga, not anime, not movies. It is a speculative character with 0 feats and is merely the product of the imagination of DBZ fans. You can't speculate about the power of a character who has, literally, never existed.

3- SSJ4 Gogeta is not featless, he proved to be stronger than omega shenron, this latter was so powerful that only a Universal Genki Dama (life force of all universe) was able to beat him.

Do you even know what it means to be featless? A feat is a visual representation of a character's abilities or techniques. If you have no feats, then that means you have not displayed your power in a way that makes it possible for people to assess your strength/power. Powerscaling is not a substitute for feats. SSJ 4 Gogeta literally did nothing for 10 minutes in precisely 1 episode. Moreover, just because the name of the technique was Universal Genki Dama, that doesn't mean that it can bust or destroy a universe. It just means that it was made using the ki of living beings from all over the universe. It's basically impossible to know what the Universal Genki Dama can bust. The only thing we know is that it is probably planet level+ but that's all we know.

4-OP didn't say that, who's liar now, he said they can fuse, and it's a team fight not one on one fight. pfffff

The OP now says that Vegeta and Goku can fuse, but IIRC it did not originally say that. The OP merely edited the initial post to make it possible for Vegeta and Goku to fuse.

5- Kami have matter manipulation, as Piccolo has, he proved the ability to change clothes, and it's illogical to think matter manipulation can get you out when even teleportation can't.

First, show me scans of Kami and/or Piccolo changing their clothes via matter manipulation. Second, show me scans of Kami and/or Piccolo using matter manipulation in a fight. Third, even if Kami and/or Piccolo possess matter manipulation powers their ability is trash tier at best. Must I really point out that changing your clothes is not very impressive? Fourth, why would it be illogical to think that matter manipulation can get you out of a bottle? Are you serious right now? If you can manipulate matter on a subatomic level, then all you need to do is deconstruct the bottle you're in. Just because teleportation doesn't work doesn't mean matter manipulation won't work. You're using an associative fallacy here. Fifth, none of this matters anyway because neither Goku nor Vegeta nor Gogeta knows the Evil Containment Wave so they can't use it here. And neither Goku nor Vegeta nor Gogeta have access to a denshi jar.

#48 Posted by the_mighty_Beyonder (701 posts) - - Show Bio

@Floopay said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder:

I dunno if you are arguing for DBZ team or Comic team, but.

I do not believe Surfer can absorb spiritual energy of any sort, not even psionic energy as far as I know. So him draining Ki energy seems ridiculous as it's pretty much spiritual energy.

And the DBZ team has no answer to Doctor Manhattan. Honestly, he's witness events so small, and so fast they can hardly be said to have happened at all (I haven't read the graphic novel in ages, but I think that's in both IIRC). To be honest, I doubt they could speed blitz him, and they have no means of killing or even BFRing him.

They can shrink or trap him wherever they want, he can just reform and travel somewhere else, or he can multiply into several copies of himself, or become the size of an ant or the size of a skyscraper. But at the end of the day, he could simply explode them with a thought. Plus he can see his own past, present, and future simultaneously, so he should be more than capable of countering anything they do to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

nice reply buddy!! with respect and no names, and quite logical !! that's all i demand in this thread

i believe Gogeta did destroy janemba at atomic scale, janemba was not only able of atomic level regeneration, but also atomic level teleportation of parts of his body. but is it the same as Dr Manhatan i can't tell. anyway i can't see Dr Manhatan controling particules of foe who has more power than him, he will need to have more than Gogeta's power to break the power link in Gogeta's body.

the only trouble that Gogeta will have is the foreseeing of Dr Manatan which is not absolute and always reliable, as it was proven in the film.

#49 Posted by Floopay (7700 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@Floopay said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder:

I dunno if you are arguing for DBZ team or Comic team, but.

I do not believe Surfer can absorb spiritual energy of any sort, not even psionic energy as far as I know. So him draining Ki energy seems ridiculous as it's pretty much spiritual energy.

And the DBZ team has no answer to Doctor Manhattan. Honestly, he's witness events so small, and so fast they can hardly be said to have happened at all (I haven't read the graphic novel in ages, but I think that's in both IIRC). To be honest, I doubt they could speed blitz him, and they have no means of killing or even BFRing him.

They can shrink or trap him wherever they want, he can just reform and travel somewhere else, or he can multiply into several copies of himself, or become the size of an ant or the size of a skyscraper. But at the end of the day, he could simply explode them with a thought. Plus he can see his own past, present, and future simultaneously, so he should be more than capable of countering anything they do to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

nice reply buddy!! with respect and no names, and quite logical !! that's all i demand in this thread

i believe Gogeta did destroy janemba at atomic scale, janemba was not only able of atomic level regeneration, but also atomic level teleportation of parts of his body. but is it the same as Dr Manhatan i can't tell. anyway i can't see Dr Manhatan controling particules of foe who has more power than him, he will need to have more than Gogeta's power to break the power link in Gogeta's body.

the only trouble that Gogeta will have is the foreseeing of Dr Manatan which is not absolute and always reliable, as it was proven in the film.

Realistically Doctor Manhattans power is described as being able to bend energy and matter to his will. He's never shown any restrictions, and he has never shown any limits to his durability.

He was disassembled at the atomic level, twice. The first time made him what he is now, and the second time did nothing to him. He has walked the surface of the sun, and can alter his size as much as he wants. I see no reason why he couldn't alter his density or molecular make-up.

Over and above this Doctor Manhattan can multiple himself, and all versions of himself seem to be capable of functioning independently of one another, with no degradation in power level.

Add to this he can see his own past, present, and future simultaneously, which means getting the jump on him will be impossible. Add to this he is capable of viewing things that happen so fast, and are so small they can hardly be said to have existed at all. That's saying quite a bit, considering mankind has calculated the speed electrons travel, the speed of several molecular bondings, speed of light, etc. etc. As a scientist who is well aware of these facts, it's hard to discount what he is saying.

I just don't see how they could beat him to be completely honest.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

#50 Edited by uberhikari (1855 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_mighty_Beyonder said:

@Floopay said:

@the_mighty_Beyonder:

I dunno if you are arguing for DBZ team or Comic team, but.

I do not believe Surfer can absorb spiritual energy of any sort, not even psionic energy as far as I know. So him draining Ki energy seems ridiculous as it's pretty much spiritual energy.

And the DBZ team has no answer to Doctor Manhattan. Honestly, he's witness events so small, and so fast they can hardly be said to have happened at all (I haven't read the graphic novel in ages, but I think that's in both IIRC). To be honest, I doubt they could speed blitz him, and they have no means of killing or even BFRing him.

They can shrink or trap him wherever they want, he can just reform and travel somewhere else, or he can multiply into several copies of himself, or become the size of an ant or the size of a skyscraper. But at the end of the day, he could simply explode them with a thought. Plus he can see his own past, present, and future simultaneously, so he should be more than capable of countering anything they do to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

nice reply buddy!! with respect and no names, and quite logical !! that's all i demand in this thread

i believe Gogeta did destroy janemba at atomic scale, janemba was not only able of atomic level regeneration, but also atomic level teleportation of parts of his body. but is it the same as Dr Manhatan i can't tell. anyway i can't see Dr Manhatan controling particules of foe who has more power than him, he will need to have more than Gogeta's power to break the power link in Gogeta's body.

the only trouble that Gogeta will have is the foreseeing of Dr Manatan which is not absolute and always reliable, as it was proven in the film.

First, it doesn't matter what you believe. Gogeta did not destroy Janemba on an atomic scale. Here is the fight. All Gogeta did was purify Janemba's negative energy, which transformed Janemba back into the demon that he originally was. In the video you can clearly see that Janemba is not destroyed because the demon runs away from Gogeta at the end. Again, here is another perfect example of you manipulating information. Just stop it already.

Second, it's simply not true that you have to be more powerful than a DB/Z/GT character in order to transmute them. DB/Z/GT characters have no matter transmutation resistance feats. In the fight between Super Vegito and Buuhan, Buuhan was able to turn Super Vegito into a jawbreaker even though Super Vegito was clearly stronger. Here's the evidence.

Third, the movie version of Dr. Manhattan =/= graphic novel version. So, that argument won't work.