#1 Edited by torzone (500 posts) - - Show Bio

X-Women vs. Ladies of the Avengers...

5 Mins to prep Who Wins?

50 Feet Away from Each other:

NO BFR

Emma's Telepathy can be used for anything EXCEPT Killing and KO;

Other than that...everything else allowed...

vs.
#2 Posted by THUNDERBOLT30 (11409 posts) - - Show Bio

Depends on team 2's TP resistance. With BFR, She-Hulk can be removed by Storm, and unless Carol has stong TP defenses Emma mind rapes her into a coma....again.

#3 Posted by BarelyAverage (1202 posts) - - Show Bio

The Hulk family has always had good resistance to TP. Team 2 for the win, Ms Marvel could potentially solo.

#4 Posted by Roddy010 (5802 posts) - - Show Bio

If Ms. marvel doesn't speedblitz then team 1 takes it....

#5 Posted by Lemonadez (13 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2 wins...
Team 1 body isn't capable of taking huge physical attack. -.-
 
Storm can be knock out easily by physical attack.

#6 Posted by czarny_samael666 (17181 posts) - - Show Bio

What is the distance between them?

#7 Edited by Godabed (354 posts) - - Show Bio

Emma and Storm wins, She-Hulk is highly susceptible to mind control and  Ms. Marvel doesn't have immunity to telepathy.  Neither She-hulk or Ms. Marvel are fast enough to counter the psionic abilities of Storm or Emma.
 
Team 1 wins this easily.
@Lemonadez said:

Team 2 wins... Team 1 body isn't capable of taking huge physical attack. -.-  Storm can be knock out easily by physical attack.

also two things.  Emma's diamond skin makes her invincible and enhanced strength, also she can't be killed in this state, although she can be shattered if the proper pressure point is found.  Storm can erect pressure force fields, that can handle physical attack.  So both actually do have means to stay off physical attack.
#8 Posted by DeathsHead2 (1739 posts) - - Show Bio

Carol goes Binary and takes out ALL 3 of the others! ;)

#9 Posted by Godabed (354 posts) - - Show Bio
@DeathsHead2: carol can't go binary, and hasn't since she lost those powers.
#10 Posted by czarny_samael666 (17181 posts) - - Show Bio

Again:
 
@czarny_samael666 said:

What is the distance between them?
#11 Posted by Godabed (354 posts) - - Show Bio

I'd also consider Storm casting heavy fog or mist as prep, lowering the team 1's visibility to nothing.  Which would make a speedblitz impossible.

#12 Posted by Nefarious (27255 posts) - - Show Bio

@torzone: Starting distance?

#13 Posted by torzone (500 posts) - - Show Bio

@czarny_samael666 said:

What is the distance between them?

About 50 feet away from each other---

#14 Posted by czarny_samael666 (17181 posts) - - Show Bio
@torzone said:

@czarny_samael666 said:

What is the distance between them?

About 50 feet away from each other---

So something about 150 meters... Than I belive that Ms. Marvel can't take them both before Emma will shut her down or Storm will freeze her (at least slow her enough to take her in other way).
#15 Edited by Vance Astro (89465 posts) - - Show Bio
@Godabed said:

She-Hulk is highly susceptible to mind 

Since when? 
 
@Godabed said:

I'd also consider Storm casting heavy fog or mist as prep, lowering the team 1's visibility to nothing.  Which would make a speedblitz impossible.

Ridiculous tactic. 
 
@Godabed said:

Emma's diamond skin makes her invincible and enhanced strength, also she can't be killed in this state, although she can be shattered if the proper pressure point is found.  

Emma is not invincible with Diamond skin...Bullseye penetrated her with an arrow and her strength is irrelevant because in that state She-Hulk and Ms.Marvel are both still immensely stronger than her.Neither She-Hulk or Ms.Marvel would even have to fight her in diamond form.They are both faster and way stronger than her she could be easily BFR'd.
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#16 Posted by czarny_samael666 (17181 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vance Astro said:
@Godabed said:

She-Hulk is highly susceptible to mind 

Since when? 
 
@Godabed said:

I'd also consider Storm casting heavy fog or mist as prep, lowering the team 1's visibility to nothing.  Which would make a speedblitz impossible.

Ridiculous tactic. 
 
@Godabed said:

Emma's diamond skin makes her invincible and enhanced strength, also she can't be killed in this state, although she can be shattered if the proper pressure point is found.  

Emma is not invincible with Diamond skin...Bullseye penetrated her with an arrow and her strength is irrelevant because in that state She-Hulk and Ms.Marvel are both still immensely stronger than her.Neither She-Hulk or Ms.Marvel would even have to fight her in diamond form.They are both faster and way stronger than her she could be easily BFR'd.
I know that You're a Carol fan, so I would like to know what You think: Can she take out Storm and Emma, before they will be able to slow or take her down? With mentioned distance? And if yes: Why?
#17 Posted by jojjimbo (2519 posts) - - Show Bio

@THUNDERBOLT30 said:

Depends on team 2's TP resistance. With BFR, She-Hulk can be removed by Storm, and unless Carol has stong TP defenses Emma mind rapes her into a coma....again.

@Roddy010 said:

If Ms. marvel doesn't speedblitz then team 1 takes it....

I agree, it does depend on who reacts first, and whether team 1 can resist Emma TP.

#18 Posted by desmond006 (611 posts) - - Show Bio

with a few minutes of prep team 1 wins. Storm fogs up the battle ground so team 2 cant see, then emma psychic attacks. If they survive those attacks Sorm gets high and takes shots at them.

#19 Posted by jeanroygrant (20442 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2

#20 Edited by Roddy010 (5802 posts) - - Show Bio

Well since they have prep I say team 1 has a much better chance of winning....

#21 Posted by progenitor (7552 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going with Storm & Emma, Emma could still potentially mindrape them without KOing or killing, and in diamond form she should be a match for She-Hulk, meanwhile, Storm could create whirlwinds, flash floods, all sorts of weather anomalies to incapacitate Ms. Marvel, or at least distract her while Emma uses TP, then Storm could just bombard Ms. Marvel with lightning.

#22 Posted by Death Certificate (5722 posts) - - Show Bio

What's stopping ms marvel from absorbing storms lightning?

#23 Posted by THUNDERBOLT30 (11409 posts) - - Show Bio

@Death Certificate said:

What's stopping ms marvel from absorbing storms lightning?

Agreed. Lightning is the last power Storm would want to use against Carol.

#24 Edited by Vance Astro (89465 posts) - - Show Bio
@Death Certificate said:

What's stopping ms marvel from absorbing storms lightning?

What makes you think she will attack Ms.Marvel and not She-Hulk? While Emma handles Carol...
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#25 Posted by Vance Astro (89465 posts) - - Show Bio
@czarny_samael666 said:
I know that You're a Carol fan, so I would like to know what You think: Can she take out Storm and Emma, before they will be able to slow or take her down? With mentioned distance? And if yes: Why?
I think this fight is very even and can be won based on which way either team approaches it.It would appear though that Storm & Emma have the upper hand.The only way I see Carol and Jen winning is if Carol can quickly make this 2 on 1 against Emma.I don't know how good Emma's telepathic abilities are but if i'm correct trying to mind rape a Hulk doesn't go over well.Unlike Storm, Emma isn't a great fighter.I don't know how she would react in a fight with two characters that could potentially one-shot her if she's not in diamond form.If she tries to go that route with She-Hulk she will be easily BFR'd.There is also the ideal of prep in this fight. If Storm and Emma know they are going to fight two powerhouses like She-Hulk and Ms.Marvel would they think they have what it takes and not use the prep or would both parties actually take the prep into consideration.I've never seen anyone in this fight prep for anything but I would assume that if they had the option and they thought there was a chance they could lose, they might consult people on their respective teams that are geniuses which makes this a whole different fight entirely.In short this could go either way. I don't think it's as black and white as "Team___wins".
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#26 Posted by rpgr (333 posts) - - Show Bio

The guys watching and cat-calling "round 1 is mud, round 2 is jello, round 3 is lubricant, etc."

#27 Posted by PhoenixoftheTides (3813 posts) - - Show Bio

@Vance Astro said:

@czarny_samael666 said:
I know that You're a Carol fan, so I would like to know what You think: Can she take out Storm and Emma, before they will be able to slow or take her down? With mentioned distance? And if yes: Why?
I think this fight is very even and can be won based on which way either team approaches it.It would appear though that Storm & Emma have the upper hand.The only way I see Carol and Jen winning is if Carol can quickly make this 2 on 1 against Emma.I don't know how good Emma's telepathic abilities are but if i'm correct trying to mind rape a Hulk doesn't go over well.Unlike Storm, Emma isn't a great fighter.I don't know how she would react in a fight with two characters that could potentially one-shot her if she's not in diamond form.If she tries to go that route with She-Hulk she will be easily BFR'd.There is also the ideal of prep in this fight. If Storm and Emma know they are going to fight two powerhouses like She-Hulk and Ms.Marvel would they think they have what it takes and not use the prep or would both parties actually take the prep into consideration.I've never seen anyone in this fight prep for anything but I would assume that if they had the option and they thought there was a chance they could lose, they might consult people on their respective teams that are geniuses which makes this a whole different fight entirely.In short this could go either way. I don't think it's as black and white as "Team___wins".

I agree. Some fights are just dead even, with the tie breaker being how it plays out. It's easy to confuse strategy (which is often set during prep and governs how each side approaches the fight) with tactics (how characters react when the battle starts and their carefully laid plans go awry). Some characters just cancel each other out pretty easily, especially if one character does something extraordinarily well that negates what another character can do.

I think this can be dead even depending on a number of factors.

#28 Posted by butterflykyss (4257 posts) - - Show Bio

@Vance Astro said:

@czarny_samael666 said:
I know that You're a Carol fan, so I would like to know what You think: Can she take out Storm and Emma, before they will be able to slow or take her down? With mentioned distance? And if yes: Why?
I think this fight is very even and can be won based on which way either team approaches it.It would appear though that Storm & Emma have the upper hand.The only way I see Carol and Jen winning is if Carol can quickly make this 2 on 1 against Emma.I don't know how good Emma's telepathic abilities are but if i'm correct trying to mind rape a Hulk doesn't go over well.Unlike Storm, Emma isn't a great fighter.I don't know how she would react in a fight with two characters that could potentially one-shot her if she's not in diamond form.If she tries to go that route with She-Hulk she will be easily BFR'd.There is also the ideal of prep in this fight. If Storm and Emma know they are going to fight two powerhouses like She-Hulk and Ms.Marvel would they think they have what it takes and not use the prep or would both parties actually take the prep into consideration.I've never seen anyone in this fight prep for anything but I would assume that if they had the option and they thought there was a chance they could lose, they might consult people on their respective teams that are geniuses which makes this a whole different fight entirely.In short this could go either way. I don't think it's as black and white as "Team___wins".

i can agree with this

#29 Edited by Godabed (354 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vance Astro said:

@Godabed said:

She-Hulk is highly susceptible to mind 

Since when? 
 

@Godabed

said:

I'd also consider Storm casting heavy fog or mist as prep, lowering the team 1's visibility to nothing.  Which would make a speedblitz impossible.

Ridiculous tactic. 
 

@Godabed

said:

Emma's diamond skin makes her invincible and enhanced strength, also she can't be killed in this state, although she can be shattered if the proper pressure point is found.  

Emma is not invincible with Diamond skin...Bullseye penetrated her with an arrow and her strength is irrelevant because in that state She-Hulk and Ms.Marvel are both still immensely stronger than her.Neither She-Hulk or Ms.Marvel would even have to fight her in diamond form.They are both faster and way stronger than her she could be easily BFR'd.
-Since she has been mindcontroled on more than 2 occassions. Emma being an omega level telepathy would easily over take her or Ms. Marvel.
-A ridiculous tactic is stating a speedblitz as a means to win in the first place, especially when the character whom suppose to carry it out, is rarely if ever shown using that method at all, in majority of their fights.
-Bulleye? sorry i don't know the reference, but considering what Bulleye's ability is i could see that as possible. There are breakpoints in her diamond skin, because diamond aren't completely invulnerable, as explained by storm in xtreme x-men, and shown when emma was shot and shattered. But while in diamond form, Emma is essentially Immortal.  But that plays to Bulleye's powers, not She-hulk's or Ms. Marvel.  So i don't really understand your point in bringing it up.
#30 Posted by butterflykyss (4257 posts) - - Show Bio

@Godabed said:

@Vance Astro said:

@Godabed said:

She-Hulk is highly susceptible to mind

Since when?

@Godabed

said:

I'd also consider Storm casting heavy fog or mist as prep, lowering the team 1's visibility to nothing. Which would make a speedblitz impossible.

Ridiculous tactic.

@Godabed

said:

Emma's diamond skin
makes her invincible and enhanced strength, also she can't be killed in this state, although she can be shattered if the proper pressure point is found.

Emma is not invincible with Diamond skin...Bullseye penetrated her with an arrow and her strength is irrelevant because in that state She-Hulk and Ms.Marvel are both still immensely stronger than her.Neither She-Hulk or Ms.Marvel would even have to fight her in diamond form.They are both faster and way stronger than her she could be easily BFR'd.
-Since she has been mindcontroled on more than 2 occassions. Emma being an omega level telepathy would easily over take her or Ms. Marvel. -A ridiculous tactic is stating a speedblitz as a means to win in the first place, especially when the character whom suppose to carry it out, is rarely if ever shown using that method at all, in majority of their fights. -Bulleye? sorry i don't know the reference, but considering what Bulleye's ability is i could see that as possible. There are breakpoints in her diamond skin, because diamond aren't completely invulnerable, as explained by storm in xtreme x-men, and shown when emma was shot and shattered. But while in diamond form, Emma is essentially Immortal. But that plays to Bulleye's powers, not She-hulk's or Ms. Marvel. So i don't really understand your point in bringing it up.

excellent points! i would like to see feats of ms marvel speed blitzing to take characters out. People always point to this for speedsters, but you definitely make great points.

#31 Edited by Death Certificate (5722 posts) - - Show Bio

@butterflykyss:

Here are some examples

#32 Posted by Charmix (12083 posts) - - Show Bio

@Death Certificate: That last line is flawless lmao.

#33 Posted by torzone (500 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump

#34 Edited by God_Spawn (39245 posts) - - Show Bio

@Vance Astro:

Emma is not invincible with Diamond skin...Bullseye penetrated her with an arrow

I don't see how Bullseye could have penetrated Emma with arrow...like at all unless it was made of adamantium or some other high-grade substance.

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#35 Posted by stormphoenix (1012 posts) - - Show Bio

storm beats she hulk ms.m beats storm emma beats ms.m and emma gets knocked out because she used her powers to the fullest game over nobody wins LOL

#36 Posted by jhazzroucher (18267 posts) - - Show Bio

Do Ms marvel and She Hulk need oxygen to breathe?

#37 Posted by Iamlovewithin500 (1039 posts) - - Show Bio
@Death Certificate:  Why is Spider Woman's nips always poking out..Damn get a Bra Girl. 
 
This is why some women can't handle comics.we get degraded into Ass shots and boob close ups  -______- 
 
 
Anywho back on Topic, this could potentially go either way,but it's more in favor to the X-girls. 
 
@jhazzroucher:  Ms. Marvel can fly unaided In Space..so on not really 
 
I know Hulk doesn't really need to breathe,but She Hulk it a bit weaker so Who knows.
#38 Posted by Sherlock (7401 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:

@Vance Astro:

Emma is not invincible with Diamond skin...Bullseye penetrated her with an arrow

I don't see how Bullseye could have penetrated Emma with arrow...like at all unless it was made of adamantium or some other high-grade substance.

Diamond is far from indesctructable and can be easily cut with the likes of steel if you go with the grain.Bullseye definately has the aim to acoplish this
 
This is however irrelevant since diamond can be shattered via force (It just has to be a lot of it) Shulkie and Carol are more than strong enough to do this.
Now to the actual battle.Shulkie (As usual in all Storm Vs Hulk threads) can be BFRed.On the other hand Carol is fast enough to speed blitz Ororo and put her down before she can do anything.
 
Id give this to Shulkie and Carol 7/10
#39 Posted by God_Spawn (39245 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sherlock: Emma is NOT a typical diamond. Same as how Colossus is not typical steel. It doesn't matter what Bullseye's aim if he doesn't have a proper weapon and does not know Emma's shatter spot. Anything short of Marvel's higher metals an arrow should not pierce her. She is bulletproof, survived Genosha's collapse, tanked hits from an extremely amped Sebastian Shaw, took a shot from the Dreaming Celestial's head when controlled by Mr. Sinister and shots from WWH. In fact he had to slam her into the ground to take her out of the fight. If she was a typical diamond she would have been shattered by most of those attacks and would not have bothered to even attack the Hulk. I have seen nothing to suggest Ms. Marvel or She-Hulk can shatter her unless they knew her shatter point or had a chance to wail her on for a long time and even that I have hesitation saying. It took a mini celestial just to break off her arm, the same mini celestial shot Colossus across San Francisco and ripped a gouge in his chest and cracked him further along the torso and how often do you see that happen to him? Hardly ever. The best they can do is BFR her to end it quick.

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#40 Posted by torzone (500 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn said:

@Sherlock: Emma is NOT a typical diamond. Same as how Colossus is not typical steel. It doesn't matter what Bullseye's aim if he doesn't have a proper weapon and does not know Emma's shatter spot. Anything short of Marvel's higher metals an arrow should not pierce her. She is bulletproof, survived Genosha's collapse, tanked hits from an extremely amped Sebastian Shaw, took a shot from the Dreaming Celestial's head when controlled by Mr. Sinister and shots from WWH. In fact he had to slam her into the ground to take her out of the fight. If she was a typical diamond she would have been shattered by most of those attacks and would not have bothered to even attack the Hulk. I have seen nothing to suggest Ms. Marvel or She-Hulk can shatter her unless they knew her shatter point or had a chance to wail her on for a long time and even that I have hesitation saying. It took a mini celestial just to break off her arm, the same mini celestial shot Colossus across San Francisco and ripped a gouge in his chest and cracked him further along the torso and how often do you see that happen to him? Hardly ever. The best they can do is BFR her to end it quick.

I LIKE.

#41 Posted by Mercy_ (92772 posts) - - Show Bio

I think this is more cut and dried than people are making it. Emma EASILY handles Carol and Storm shouldn't have an issue with Shulkie.

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#42 Posted by ALdragon17 (126 posts) - - Show Bio

Ha, I love these girls, man. I love that picture of she hulk and ms marvel. Its like hey, you stole my comb and I want it back. :) Or let me hit you, cause that was my man :) lol. Ms. Marvel is like, oh no I going to get hit by she hulk :( lol

She hulk and Ms.Marvel
#43 Posted by Sherlock (7401 posts) - - Show Bio
@god_spawn said:

@Sherlock: Emma is NOT a typical diamond. Same as how Colossus is not typical steel. It doesn't matter what Bullseye's aim if he doesn't have a proper weapon and does not know Emma's shatter spot. Anything short of Marvel's higher metals an arrow should not pierce her. She is bulletproof, survived Genosha's collapse, tanked hits from an extremely amped Sebastian Shaw, took a shot from the Dreaming Celestial's head when controlled by Mr. Sinister and shots from WWH. In fact he had to slam her into the ground to take her out of the fight. If she was a typical diamond she would have been shattered by most of those attacks and would not have bothered to even attack the Hulk. I have seen nothing to suggest Ms. Marvel or She-Hulk can shatter her unless they knew her shatter point or had a chance to wail her on for a long time and even that I have hesitation saying. It took a mini celestial just to break off her arm, the same mini celestial shot Colossus across San Francisco and ripped a gouge in his chest and cracked him further along the torso and how often do you see that happen to him? Hardly ever. The best they can do is BFR her to end it quick.

To be honest i havnt seen the bullseye scan so i have no idea how it went down.All i was stating is that cutting a diamond is easy if you go with the grain.And sharpened tool in the hand of an expert can accomplish this.Since you are the risident Emma fanboy on the site im not gonna bother debating on her durability though id like to know what her strength cap is.If she isnt strong enough to hurt Jen or Carol then her durability is pretty moot
#44 Posted by mextli (649 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sherlock: her strength is 2 tons so its not enough to do anything for her. She would just get bfr'd if she went diamond.

#45 Posted by God_Spawn (39245 posts) - - Show Bio

@Sherlock: 2 tons and I've seen better feats from people weaker than her so no she does not have the strength to hurt them.

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#46 Posted by Mercy_ (92772 posts) - - Show Bio

@ALdragon17: So why do you think that they win (other than that you like them)?

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#47 Posted by ReVamp (23014 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Dark Huntress said:

@ALdragon17: So why do you think that they win (other than that you like them)?

I don't believe he said anything of the sort, did he?

#48 Posted by Mercy_ (92772 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@The Dark Huntress said:

@ALdragon17: So why do you think that they win (other than that you like them)?

I don't believe he said anything of the sort, did he?

I assumed he was saying they won...otherwise the post would have been completely off-topic and irrelevant.

Moderator
#49 Posted by God_Spawn (39245 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Dark Huntress said:

@ALdragon17: So why do you think that they win (other than that you like them)?

I can tell you why I think they win. Carol has blitzed people before and she knows what both can do, take out Storm, Emma might get Carol but Shulkie takes Emma. But on the other hand, Emma has telepathically assaulted Ms. Marvel easily and Storm can BFR Shulkie. I don't know who would gain the majority but I agree with what you and Vance are saying it isn't cut and dry. It just depends on who does what and does it more often that gets that extra win.

Btw do you have the Emma/Ms. Marvel scans?

Moderator
#50 Posted by ReVamp (23014 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Dark Huntress said:

I assumed he was saying they won...otherwise the post would have been completely off-topic and irrelevant.

He has 50 posts. I think its safe to assume that his post is off-topic and irrelevant.

@god_spawn said:

I can tell you why I think they win. Carol has blitzed people before and she knows what both can do

Isn't it possible that immediately when the battle starts that Emma tries to mindrape Carol before she gets anywhere? Because as far as I'm concerned all she has to do is think for that to happen, while Carol also has to think before she speed blitz. [To my knowledge, while her speed is great, her reflexes don't have any great feats]

take out Storm, Emma might get Carol but Shulkie takes Emma.

Is Shulkie resistant to TP?

But on the other hand, Emma has telepathically assaulted Ms. Marvel easily and Storm can BFR Shulkie.

I see this as being the more likely option, though I do understand the point you were making above.

I don't know who would gain the majority but I agree with what you and Vance are saying it isn't cut and dry. It just depends on who does what and does it more often that gets that extra win.
Btw do you have the Emma/Ms. Marvel scans?

She said it is cut and dry, lol. =P. But, yeah, from their instance we see that Emma dominates Ms. Marvel without much effort [even though Ms. Marvel isn't trying to attack her, nevermind speed blitz her.]