Spider-Man vs Wolverine (No claws-No webs)

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Deadcool

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#51  Edited By Deadcool

@deadpool6_6_6 said:

@pooty said:

@deadpool6_6_6: @Aphile: I'll say spidey. Without claws is Wolvie even strong enough to KO Spidey? Spideys agility and spider sense should win it for him. And Spidey has been shown strong enough to incapacitate Wolvie also.

wolverine is adamantium ( which is indestructable. ) so what exactly can spiderman do if wolverine cant die?

Throw a car at him (or something heavier), he would never be able to lift that.

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Aphile

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#52  Edited By Aphile

@k4tzm4n said:

oth characters can use any obstacles on each other.

We take away Spidey's webs and we take away Logan's claws, no weapons!!!!

Uh...what? So can or can't they use items in the environment as weapons?\

They can, I just meant that we take away Logan's claws and we take away Spidey's webs. The environment where they fight is New York City (just to make it fair for Spidey), so yes there are cars, people, poles, etc.

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#53  Edited By Aphile

@jashro44 said:

@deadpool6_6_6 said:

@pooty said:

@deadpool6_6_6: @Aphile: I'll say spidey. Without claws is Wolvie even strong enough to KO Spidey? Spideys agility and spider sense should win it for him. And Spidey has been shown strong enough to incapacitate Wolvie also.

wolverine is adamantium ( which is indestructable. ) so what exactly can spiderman do if wolverine cant die?

Drop something heavy on him.

No Caption Provided

He still incapacitates him under these conditions I would say.

Holy Molly, where did you get that scan? Cool by the way

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Strider1992

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#54  Edited By Strider1992

@BringnIt said:

Does no one care that Spider-Man can't knock him out? You know who else Spider-Man is faster than, more agile than, smarter than, funnier than, etc.? Black Tarantula. Morlun.

Op has stated its taking place in new York. There's plenty of things Spider-man could do to incapacitate him. Drop multiple cars on him for example.

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BringnIt

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#55  Edited By BringnIt

@Strider92 Not sure what OP you are reading, but it states "open environment." The post stating it takes place in NYC came well after my last post. That said, based on their encounters, Parker is faster but not so fast that Logan cannot tag him, and it takes time to pick up cars and toss them onto people, time where he could be left vulnerable. It's not exactly in character for Parker to go around throwing cars at people, either.

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Strider1992

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#56  Edited By Strider1992

@BringnIt said:

@Strider92 Not sure what OP you are reading, but it states "open environment."

Right here :) :

@Aphile said:

@k4tzm4n said:

oth characters can use any obstacles on each other.

We take away Spidey's webs and we take away Logan's claws, no weapons!!!!

Uh...what? So can or can't they use items in the environment as weapons?\

They can, I just meant that we take away Logan's claws and we take away Spidey's webs. The environment where they fight is New York City (just to make it fair for Spidey), so yes there are cars, people, poles, etc.

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BringnIt

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#57  Edited By BringnIt

@Strider92 That is hardly the original post, and again, took place almost five hours after my comment that you responded to.

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Deranged Midget

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#58  Edited By Deranged Midget

@deadpool6_6_6 said:

@pooty said:

@deadpool6_6_6: @Aphile: I'll say spidey. Without claws is Wolvie even strong enough to KO Spidey? Spideys agility and spider sense should win it for him. And Spidey has been shown strong enough to incapacitate Wolvie also.

wolverine is adamantium ( which is indestructable. ) so what exactly can spiderman do if wolverine cant die?

Rip off his head? Presuming only if there were no morals and they were fighting to kill.

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BringnIt

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#59  Edited By BringnIt

@BlueLantern1995 Read a comic where Wolverine and Spider-Man fight, please.

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Killemall

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#60  Edited By Killemall

@Nefarious said:

My money is Spider-Man.

Given you profile pic i though that was obvious :p :LOL.

Just kidding, Spiderman FTW!

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Strider1992

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#61  Edited By Strider1992

@BringnIt said:

@Strider92 That is hardly the original post, and again, took place almost five hours after my comment that you responded to.

Ah yeah sorry missed the timing.

@BringnIt said:

@Strider92 It's not exactly in character for Parker to go around throwing cars at people, either.

Its not out of character for him to use things. He does it quite a lot against durable opponents:

And unless i'm mistaken Pete dropped a building on Shathra during their first encounter. I'll try and find the scans.

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BringnIt

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#62  Edited By BringnIt

Can't see the scans on my phone, but I can tell two are Juggernaut, who is obviously more durable than Logan. Are any of them instances of him using such a tactic on heroes?

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henryarguelles5

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#63  Edited By henryarguelles5

This really isn't even a debate. In this scenario, Spider-Man is the powerhouse. Being generous, if you grant Logan a 1-ton strength level, and take Spider-Man at his base 10-ton strength level, Spider-Man is 9 times stronger than Wolverine. The same magnitude between Spider-Man and Hulk...and no way Spider-Man is going to overpower the Hulk. The claws and the willingness to kill are Logan's only real advantage...and without the claws, he really has no way to kill Spider-Man. Spider-Man wins this, and without much effort.

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BringnIt

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#64  Edited By BringnIt

Sweet, next time Hammerhead and Spider-Man fight, Spider-Man will just stand there and take everything because Hammerhead has never been able to hurt him due to his inferior stats. Also, nice math. Ten tons versus one ton is ten times stronger.

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ChaosMarvel

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#65  Edited By ChaosMarvel

Probably Spider-man due to the environment.

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#66  Edited By nefarious
@Killemall said:

@Nefarious said:

My money is Spider-Man.

Given you profile pic i though that was obvious :p :LOL.

Just kidding, Spiderman FTW!

Yep, my fanboyism is showing. lol
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#67  Edited By god_spawn  Moderator

@henryarguelles5 said:

This really isn't even a debate. In this scenario, Spider-Man is the powerhouse. Being generous, if you grant Logan a 1-ton strength level, and take Spider-Man at his base 10-ton strength level, Spider-Man is 9 times stronger than Wolverine. The same magnitude between Spider-Man and Hulk...and no way Spider-Man is going to overpower the Hulk. The claws and the willingness to kill are Logan's only real advantage...and without the claws, he really has no way to kill Spider-Man. Spider-Man wins this, and without much effort.

Wolverine is already at least a 1 tonner and did you just say Hulk is only 9x stronger than Spider-Man?

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Mortein

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#68  Edited By Mortein

with his powers Spiderman should be able to stomp wolverine.

He is fast and strong enough to grab his hands with one hand, and his legs with another hand, lift him, carry him to the nearest water, and submerge him under the water. Or to lift 10T heavy rock, and throw it on the wolverine. Or maybe even to KO him with few hundred punches

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darktiger

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#69  Edited By darktiger

@Mortein: exactly

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henryarguelles5

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#70  Edited By henryarguelles5

@god_spawn: Wolverine is not a one-tonner. His bones allow him to carry a greater amount of weight, but he can't lift 2000 over his head. At all.

I do apologize - my math was off. It should have been a 10..and if Spidey is a 10 tonner, then 10 X 10 is 100...which is the Hulk's range.

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#71  Edited By god_spawn  Moderator

@henryarguelles5: I've already seen plenty of Wolverine's strength feats to say yes, he is at least a 1 tonner.

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jeanroygrant

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#72  Edited By jeanroygrant

@Nefarious said:

My money is Spider-Man.
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jashro44

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#73  Edited By jashro44

@Aphile: Well if he goes into a punching contest, 1 punch could distance himself from wolverine which could buy some time to pick something up and drop it on wolverine. But I agree it will be tough. Also the scan is from shadowland #5.

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#75  Edited By Erik

@henryarguelles5 said:

@god_spawn: Wolverine is not a one-tonner. His bones allow him to carry a greater amount of weight, but he can't lift 2000 over his head. At all.

I do apologize - my math was off. It should have been a 10..and if Spidey is a 10 tonner, then 10 X 10 is 100...which is the Hulk's range.

Except when he lifted half a dozen men over his head with one arm, with absolutely no effort and threw them out a window right?

100 tons is not Hulk range either.

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god_spawn

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#76  Edited By god_spawn  Moderator

@Erik: Don't forget one arm tossing a dumpster like it was a baseball and holding an elevator by its cable with one arm and dangling from another cable with the other arm.

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#77  Edited By Erik

@god_spawn said:

@Erik: Don't forget one arm tossing a dumpster like it was a baseball and holding an elevator by its cable with one arm and dangling from another cable with the other arm.

Or throwing a Harley-Davidson like a baseball as well. Those things are not light. Ranging up to 1000lbs.

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god_spawn

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#78  Edited By god_spawn  Moderator

@Erik: Or snapping a raptor's neck and warping a pretty big sewer door with a single punch albeit claws sticking out.

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#79  Edited By Erik

@god_spawn:

Or kicking a stone block the size of a man's body with enough force to send it in a straight shot into an opponent several feet away.

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darktiger

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#80  Edited By darktiger

Spider man Outclasses wolverine is smarter and faster and stronger he wins and is better strategist

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Super_SoldierXII

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#81  Edited By Super_SoldierXII

I still LOL at everyone stating Wolverine can't touch Parker when he's done so numerous times, consistently, and with relative ease in actual showings.

Off the top of my head, Wolverine, with his fists, has KO'd Caliban (a 15 tonner), Roughouse (a 50 tonner), and Domina (who gave a team of X-Men a run for their money). Here's a telling pic and a very strong hand to hand showing for Wolverine;

Logan's got huge knockout power in his adamantium laced fists. Not to mention;

I'm on the fence as to who would actually win ... but I'd really like to clear up 1) the fact that Wolverine can tag and has (multiple times) tagged Spider-Man and 2) his skill coupled with adamantium laced knuckles and enhanced strength sees him KO'ing heavy hitters often enough. He has the KO power needed to knock Spidey on his webbed buttocks.

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jashro44

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#82  Edited By jashro44

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

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#83  Edited By Erik

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

Wolverine has showed that a mere flick of his finger can hurt Peter. I do not see why taking an adamantium fist to the head is to be considered a low showing.

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BringnIt

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#84  Edited By BringnIt

I can't really see the scans well, but it looks like a cheap shot. Lot easier to knock someone out that way. I can't see Logan one-shotting him otherwise, based on Parker's mid-to-high level showings. For the record, can't believe I of all people had to defend Logan in a battle against Spider-Man for the longest time mostly by myself. I feel dirty.

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jashro44

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#85  Edited By jashro44

@Erik said:

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

Wolverine has showed that a mere flick of his finger can hurt Peter. I do not see why taking an adamantium fist to the head is to be considered a low showing.

Because spider-man has super human durability.Venom threw a car at him and the car was dented and spider-man was still fine. In spider-island the queen of spider-island hit him in the face in her giant spider-form and spider-man was still conscious. Rhino once hit him and sent him flying through buildings and spider-man wasn't knocked out. There was a indecent where crime master was punching spider-man and he remarked punching him was like punching a stone wall, there was another time after spider-man lifted a huge piece of rubble off of him he let some thugs hit him because he was still tired and he stated that he recovered from the fatigue and he better start fighting back because they were beginning to hurt him. Eddie brock once hit spider-man with a chair and it broke. Scorpion has hurt his hand punching spider-man and stated that it was like punching a bulldozer. A heavy weight boxer once broke his hands hitting spider-man. I can post scans of all this if you want? I just don't think wolverine can 1 shot spider-man if he is paying attention. He can knock him out but it will take a few hits.

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BringnIt

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#86  Edited By BringnIt

He also has taken hits from Colossusnaut and (I think but am not certain) he took some shots against classic Marko, as well as taking shots from Hulk and that behemoth thing that killed Rulk in Avenging Spider-Man to name a couple high-end feats. Might be PIS, but it's consistent.

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#87  Edited By Super_SoldierXII

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

I think it can be disputed based off other showings from Parker to be sure. I wouldn't argue that. But it goes farther to show Logan can KO Spider-Man than the inverse.

Additionally, extremely skilled street levelers have been known to KO others outside of their pay grade. Like Mister X KO'ing Wolverine for instance in less hits than it took WWHulk. Some debate it's because they (top tier hand to handers) know both how and where to hit. Wolverine's knowledge in striking, coupled with the fact he's essentially hitting Parker with an indestructible metal mace (read: his fist), means I wouldn't bet on Parker soaking too many more of those haymakers.

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Super_SoldierXII

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#88  Edited By Super_SoldierXII

@BringnIt said:

I can't really see the scans well, but it looks like a cheap shot. Lot easier to knock someone out that way. I can't see Logan one-shotting him otherwise, based on Parker's mid-to-high level showings. For the record, can't believe I of all people had to defend Logan in a battle against Spider-Man for the longest time mostly by myself. I feel dirty.

Lol.

I'll have your back in a Spidey thread ... someday ... :P

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jashro44

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#89  Edited By jashro44

@Super_SoldierXII said:

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

I think it can be disputed based off other showings from Parker to be sure. I wouldn't argue that. But it goes farther to show Logan can KO Spider-Man than the inverse.

Additionally, extremely skilled street levelers have been known to KO others outside of their pay grade. Like Mister X KO'ing Wolverine for instance in less hits than it took WWHulk. Some debate it's because they (top tier hand to handers) know both how and where to hit. Wolverine's knowledge in striking, coupled with the fact he's essentially hitting Parker with an indestructible metal mace (read: his fist), means I wouldn't bet on Parker soaking too many more of those haymakers.

Fair enough.

Personally I never took the mister x punching wolverine out seriously. It was his first showing so I take it as mister x being faster or more skilled but in terms of durability I don't think mister x should be able to punch wolverine out. Its true he wont be able to just stand there and shrug them off but it wont be 1 shot that takes spider-man down.

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Super_SoldierXII

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#90  Edited By Super_SoldierXII

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII said:

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

I think it can be disputed based off other showings from Parker to be sure. I wouldn't argue that. But it goes farther to show Logan can KO Spider-Man than the inverse.

Additionally, extremely skilled street levelers have been known to KO others outside of their pay grade. Like Mister X KO'ing Wolverine for instance in less hits than it took WWHulk. Some debate it's because they (top tier hand to handers) know both how and where to hit. Wolverine's knowledge in striking, coupled with the fact he's essentially hitting Parker with an indestructible metal mace (read: his fist), means I wouldn't bet on Parker soaking too many more of those haymakers.

Fair enough.

Personally I never took the mister x punching wolverine out seriously. It was his first showing so I take it as mister x being faster or more skilled but in terms of durability I don't think mister x should be able to punch wolverine out. Its true he wont be able to just stand there and shrug them off but it wont be 1 shot that takes spider-man down.

I agree with it being his first showing and him having to make a splash. I don't really take it too seriously either. At best, it's a low level showing for Logan. However, looking at the fact he did knock Logan out, I wouldn't say Mister X did it due to him being more skilled and certainly not faster. It was solely due to him being able to map onto his opponent's brainwaves and react instantaneously to their moves.

Mister X is peak human in speed and strength. Wolverine is not. Sans Mister X's mutant ability, Logan would destroy him.

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henryarguelles5

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#91  Edited By henryarguelles5

Again, even granting Wolverine a one-ton range, which I did, that is nowhere near close to Spider-Man's strength level. So, facing an opponent with extremely superior strength, superior speed and agility, and a precognitive sense...how is Wolverine going to win without his claws?

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#92  Edited By Super_SoldierXII

@henryarguelles5 said:

Again, even granting Wolverine a one-ton range, which I did, that is nowhere near close to Spider-Man's strength level. So, facing an opponent with extremely superior strength, superior speed and agility, and a precognitive sense...how is Wolverine going to win without his claws?

And again, Spider-Man's strength is a non-factor against Wolverine. And this based off showings. A fight is based far more off skill than strength, and even speed. Blunt force trauma, meaning strength, is Wolverine's bread and butter - he soaks this form of damage like no ones business thanks to the healing factor and adamantium (indestructible and distributes impact shock).

And besides, he's shown multiple times that Spider-Man cannot even hurt him - Peter's cut loose on him multiple times. It took WWHulk seven consecutive point blank shots to the head to 'temporarily' knock Wolverine out.

Spider-Man's only hope has ever been to incapacitate Wolverine. In a brawl, he's in trouble. With or without the claws.

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jashro44

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#93  Edited By jashro44

@Super_SoldierXII said:

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII said:

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

I think it can be disputed based off other showings from Parker to be sure. I wouldn't argue that. But it goes farther to show Logan can KO Spider-Man than the inverse.

Additionally, extremely skilled street levelers have been known to KO others outside of their pay grade. Like Mister X KO'ing Wolverine for instance in less hits than it took WWHulk. Some debate it's because they (top tier hand to handers) know both how and where to hit. Wolverine's knowledge in striking, coupled with the fact he's essentially hitting Parker with an indestructible metal mace (read: his fist), means I wouldn't bet on Parker soaking too many more of those haymakers.

Fair enough.

Personally I never took the mister x punching wolverine out seriously. It was his first showing so I take it as mister x being faster or more skilled but in terms of durability I don't think mister x should be able to punch wolverine out. Its true he wont be able to just stand there and shrug them off but it wont be 1 shot that takes spider-man down.

I agree with it being his first showing and him having to make a splash. I don't really take it too seriously either. At best, it's a low level showing for Logan. However, looking at the fact he did knock Logan out, I wouldn't say Mister X did it due to him being more skilled and certainly not faster. It was solely due to him being able to map onto his opponent's brainwaves and react instantaneously to their moves.

Mister X is peak human in speed and strength. Wolverine is not. Sans Mister X's mutant ability, Logan would destroy him.

Agreed.

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#94  Edited By Erik

@BringnIt said:

He also has taken hits from Colossusnaut and (I think but am not certain) he took some shots against classic Marko, as well as taking shots from Hulk and that behemoth thing that killed Rulk in Avenging Spider-Man to name a couple high-end feats. Might be PIS, but it's consistent.

Colossunaut? You think Spider-Man being hurt from adamantium backed fists in a 1-2 tonner is ridiculous but tanking hits from an as of yet, incalculably high 100+ tonner seems legit?

@jashro44 said:

@Erik said:

@jashro44 said:

@Super_SoldierXII: The scans of him 1 shotting spider-man is a low showing for spider-man. I'm not saying he can't ko spider-man but 1 blow isn't going to do it.

Wolverine has showed that a mere flick of his finger can hurt Peter. I do not see why taking an adamantium fist to the head is to be considered a low showing.

Because spider-man has super human durability.Venom threw a car at him and the car was dented and spider-man was still fine. In spider-island the queen of spider-island hit him in the face in her giant spider-form and spider-man was still conscious. Rhino once hit him and sent him flying through buildings and spider-man wasn't knocked out. There was a indecent where crime master was punching spider-man and he remarked punching him was like punching a stone wall, there was another time after spider-man lifted a huge piece of rubble off of him he let some thugs hit him because he was still tired and he stated that he recovered from the fatigue and he better start fighting back because they were beginning to hurt him. Eddie brock once hit spider-man with a chair and it broke. Scorpion has hurt his hand punching spider-man and stated that it was like punching a bulldozer. A heavy weight boxer once broke his hands hitting spider-man. I can post scans of all this if you want? I just don't think wolverine can 1 shot spider-man if he is paying attention. He can knock him out but it will take a few hits.

He does have super human durability but so does a slew of other characters Wolverine hurts with strikes. Also, Astonishing Spider-Man and Wolverine was an extremely well written story that did both characters justice, so I find any suggestion that it was PIS to be fairly insulting.

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BringnIt

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#95  Edited By BringnIt

@Erik Did you just decide to pick and choose the contents of my post or what?

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Super_SoldierXII

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#96  Edited By Super_SoldierXII

It's fun debating for Wolverine versus Spider-Man in a thread with Erik involved.

It doesn't feel so ... lonely ... Lol.

Seriously, Spider-Man fans far outweigh the Wolverine ones on the Vine lately. Tough crowd.

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Erik

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#97  Edited By Erik

@BringnIt said:

@Erik Did you just decide to pick and choose the contents of my post or what?

What are you talking about? Every character you mentioned qualifies for the description I made. Are you choosing not to answer my question?

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BringnIt

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#98  Edited By BringnIt

@Erik I clearly stated that the moments I referenced were PIS. Just like Wolverine one-shotting Parker without a sucker punch would be. I also picked Wolverine to win this particular battle way before you did and made the case that Logan is skilled enough and fast enough to tag Parker, and that repeated blows could beat Parker due to his Adamantium. I even referenced Hammerhead being able to hurt Parker due to his adamantium. However, Parker's consistent durability to blunt trauma over the years is enough to say that Parker is not getting one-shotted by Logan. How you came to the conclusion that I think fights I called PIS are legit and Logan hurting Parker is not (when I had already made that case), I do not quite fathom.

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Erik

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#99  Edited By Erik

@BringnIt said:

@Erik I clearly stated that the moments I referenced were PIS. Just like Wolverine one-shotting Parker without a sucker punch would be. I also picked Wolverine to win this particular battle way before you did and made the case that Logan is skilled enough and fast enough to tag Parker, and that repeated blows could beat Parker due to his Adamantium. I even referenced Hammerhead being able to hurt Parker due to his adamantium. However, Parker's consistent durability to blunt trauma over the years is enough to say that Parker is not getting one-shotted by Logan. How you came to the conclusion that I think fights I called PIS are legit and Logan hurting Parker is not (when I had already made that case), I do not quite fathom.

You clearly said it might be PIS but then tried to justify them by saying they were consistent. So if you cannot quite fathom why someone might think you are trying to make a case with PIS examples, perhaps you should take more care in making your posts. I am sorry you are hurt I do not read every post you make. The one I replied to is the only one I bothered reading from you.

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BringnIt

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#100  Edited By BringnIt

Yeah, that makes sense. Justify your misinterpretation of things by admitting you chose to not take into context every single other post I've made in the thread. I know when I read a comic, I just read the last page and formulate all my debates that way.