Are we using Spectre at full power? Because I think Spectre in COIE would win. Outside of that.......its a push because ?I cant see LT erasing Spectres place in the Universe. Even Micheal mentioned Spectres place in all of things. LT is just a monitor of a Multiverse.......Spectres powers can out reach that of LT.
Are we using Spectre at full power? Because I think Spectre in COIE would win. Outside of that.......its a push because ?I cant see LT erasing Spectres place in the Universe. Even Micheal mentioned Spectres place in all of things. LT is just a monitor of a Multiverse.......Spectres powers can out reach that of LT.
"
Is that the issue when Michael forced his fathers will upon the Spectre, creating him?
Spectre is essentially the most powerful being second only to The Presence, he is easily of shattering entire universes. It is much like LT level. The reason that he seems so weak is because he is constantly limited by Presence to not use his true powers. That's because he was defeated by AM and Parallax.
The Spectre at his prime is at the same level of Living Tribunal. I say stalemate
Living Tribunal. Spectre is nowhere near LT. Don't come to me talking about that stupid crossover. The only reason they fought was because Spectre did LT's job in DC
Living Tribunal. Spectre is nowhere near LT. Don't come to me talking about that stupid crossover. The only reason they fought was because Spectre did LT's job in DC
I agree I dont think the Spectre has the power to defeat LT but the Spectre himself cannot be destoryed. He is after all a aspect of the Presence. My assumation is draw because the Spectre cannot truly die but the Spectre will not defeat LT here.
@AtPhantom said:
I love how you're presenting evidence of Spectre being better than LT with a scan of Michael wtfstomping him...
Maybe the defender was referring to Micheal saying Spectre is a formidable foe? Just a guess but it does seem silly he would show a scan of him losing?? @supermandefender said:
@comicdude23:
Are we using Spectre at full power? Because I think Spectre in COIE would win. Outside of that.......its a push because ?I cant see LT erasing Spectres place in the Universe. Even Micheal mentioned Spectres place in all of things. LT is just a monitor of a Multiverse.......Spectres powers can out reach that of LT.
Your aware that Spectre in COIE had all the Magic in the universe giving him power to match AM's Power????
lol, i know the Living Tribunal is second in power in the Marvel universe... in the DC Universe The Specter is the right hand of God... you know, God's Vengeance?
they don't come much more powerful than that
M
Spectre with a very large power boost lost to COIE Anti-Monitor.
lol, i know the Living Tribunal is second in power in the Marvel universe... in the DC Universe The Specter is the right hand of God... you know, God's Vengeance?
they don't come much more powerful than that
M
Spectre with a very large power boost lost to COIE Anti-Monitor.
@ComicVineAddict23: I dont think DC has any omnipotents that have made an appearance. They say even the Presence was created by something. If thats true, then DC omnipotents > Marvel omnipotents.
@ComicVineAddict23: I dont think DC has any omnipotents that have made an appearance. They say even the Presence was created by something. If thats true, then DC omnipotents > Marvel omnipotents.
According to some people, The Presence could be referring to the writers since it is left ambiguous. Though what truly shows that the Presence is not omnipotent is the fact he had to ask Lucifer to aid him (which directly contradicts the meaning of omnipotent) and he stalemated the Great Evil Beast (which shows he is not omnipotent).
LT > Every character and object in Marvel that doesn't somehow represent the writer(s) of the comic
The only possible exception I can think of is Pre-Retcon Beyonder and Molecule Man, who were never directly established to be above LT (though it was semi-implied in that scene with Death and the rose MM brings to beyonder) , and PR Beyonder could sort of represented Jim Shooter (then EIC) in some ways...or at least his will, depending on how you look at it.
Living Tribunal. Spectre is nowhere near LT. Don't come to me talking about that stupid crossover. The only reason they fought was because Spectre did LT's job in DC
I agree I dont think the Spectre has the power to defeat LT but the Spectre himself cannot be destoryed. He is after all a aspect of the Presence. My assumation is draw because the Spectre cannot truly die but the Spectre will not defeat LT here.
@AtPhantom said:
I love how you're presenting evidence of Spectre being better than LT with a scan of Michael wtfstomping him...
Maybe the defender was referring to Micheal saying Spectre is a formidable foe? Just a guess but it does seem silly he would show a scan of him losing?? @supermandefender said:
@comicdude23:
Are we using Spectre at full power? Because I think Spectre in COIE would win. Outside of that.......its a push because ?I cant see LT erasing Spectres place in the Universe. Even Micheal mentioned Spectres place in all of things. LT is just a monitor of a Multiverse.......Spectres powers can out reach that of LT.
Your aware that Spectre in COIE had all the Magic in the universe giving him power to match AM's Power????
Like Alex Luthor 3 said, it all depends on how much power Spectre is limitated by Presence to use his standard power. The powers of Spectre comes from The Logoz that is his bond to God, essentially they come from God's power. Spectre at his prime (without Presence's limitations on Spectre's power) has truly infinite power, above LT level since the Presence is more powerful than LT.
@Methos:Actually they do. Above the Spectre there is Michael Demiurgos and Lucifer Morningstar. Both have power beyond the Spectre.
Like Alex Luthor 3 said, it all depends on how much power Spectre is limitated by Presence to use his standard power. The powers of Spectre comes from The Logoz that is his bond to God, essentially they come from God's power. Spectre at his prime (without Presence's limitations on Spectre's power) has truly infinite power, above LT level since the Presence is more powerful than LT.
Spectre at his prime (without Presence's limitations on Spectre's power) has truly infinite power, above LT level since the Presence is more powerful than LT.
No, it doesn't, and no, it's not.
@WillPayton said:
Yes.
I know many people disagree, but I'll say it again... The Presence is not comparable to TOAA, he's more like the Living Tribunal.
LT > Spectre
LT wins!
Where do you guys get this from? A single hilariously vague off hand line from a series which may not even be canon to the DC universe? Come on.
Spectre at his prime (without Presence's limitations on Spectre's power) has truly infinite power, above LT level since the Presence is more powerful than LT.
No, it doesn't, and no, it's not.
@WillPayton said:
Yes.
I know many people disagree, but I'll say it again... The Presence is not comparable to TOAA, he's more like the Living Tribunal.
LT > Spectre
LT wins!
Where do you guys get this from? A single hilariously vague off hand line from a series which may not even be canon to the DC universe? Come on.
He simply doesn't. Spectre has never demonstrated any sort of unlimited power. Even in his most powerful state there is still a number of being (Endless, Lucifer, Michael, Anti-Monitor among others) which could wipe the floor with him.
Spectre at his prime (without Presence's limitations on Spectre's power) has truly infinite power, above LT level since the Presence is more powerful than LT.
No, it doesn't, and no, it's not.
@WillPayton said:
Yes.
I know many people disagree, but I'll say it again... The Presence is not comparable to TOAA, he's more like the Living Tribunal.
LT > Spectre
LT wins!
Where do you guys get this from? A single hilariously vague off hand line from a series which may not even be canon to the DC universe? Come on.
This. And I have been trying to say this over and over again. Presence is by definition DC's supreme being, and therefore is equal to the supreme being of other comic realities.
Spectre at his prime (without Presence's limitations on Spectre's power) has truly infinite power, above LT level since the Presence is more powerful than LT.
No, it doesn't, and no, it's not.
@WillPayton said:
Yes.
I know many people disagree, but I'll say it again... The Presence is not comparable to TOAA, he's more like the Living Tribunal.
LT > Spectre
LT wins!
Where do you guys get this from? A single hilariously vague off hand line from a series which may not even be canon to the DC universe? Come on.
This. And I have been trying to say this over and over again. Presence is by definition DC's supreme being, and therefore is equal to the supreme being of other comic realities.
"By definition"? Who's definition? What evidence do you have that the Presence is omnipotent in DC?
One gets trolled on a regular basis and at full power was outmatched by the Anti-Monitor, the other exists beyond reality, holds megaverses in his hands and negated the IG. This is not a stalemate at all.
One gets trolled on a regular basis and at full power was outmatched by the Anti-Monitor, the other exists beyond reality, holds megaverses in his hands and negated the IG. This is not a stalemate at all.
He simply doesn't. Spectre has never demonstrated any sort of unlimited power. Even in his most powerful state there is still a number of being (Endless, Lucifer, Michael, Anti-Monitor among others) which could wipe the floor with him.
Exactly he didn't it doesn't mean he can't. It depends how much power The Presence fuels into Spectre.
Spectre at his prime (without Presence's limitations on Spectre's power) has truly infinite power, above LT level since the Presence is more powerful than LT.
No, it doesn't, and no, it's not.
@WillPayton said:
Yes.
I know many people disagree, but I'll say it again... The Presence is not comparable to TOAA, he's more like the Living Tribunal.
LT > Spectre
LT wins!
Where do you guys get this from? A single hilariously vague off hand line from a series which may not even be canon to the DC universe? Come on.
This. And I have been trying to say this over and over again. Presence is by definition DC's supreme being, and therefore is equal to the supreme being of other comic realities.
"By definition"? Who's definition? What evidence do you have that the Presence is omnipotent in DC?
The Presence is DC's supreme being, meaning he/she/it is equal to Marvel's TOAA in power.
He simply doesn't. Spectre has never demonstrated any sort of unlimited power. Even in his most powerful state there is still a number of being (Endless, Lucifer, Michael, Anti-Monitor among others) which could wipe the floor with him.
Exactly he didn't it doesn't mean he can't. It depends how much power The Presence fuels into Spectre.
He's appeared in Earth 22 universe and another universe, I remember during one of the Countdown mini stories seeing him in one of the alternative universes.
He is DCs most powerful being and the exact equivalent of Marvels Heart of the Universe, which in turn stomps Living Tribunal. Spectre is part of the Presence, which is the same as Marvels One Above All. Just as the Heart of the Universe might be connected to and part of TOAA, the Spectre is connected to DCs Presence.
Feats mean nothing to the Spectre. He does what the Presence wants him to do and so far it has not been to salvage the universe or omniverse from other psychopaths like Darkseid or Anti Monitor. Guys who are on Thanos's Crazy level and people the Tribunal needed to step in and take care of. DC's Presence doesn't really care. Marvels TOAA seems to care a lot. You can't base it on Feats, if you did then LT of course is the winner.
I get it from comics. That thing you two have never read before. Spectre IS PART of The Presence and a lot of people regard the Heart as PART of TOAA. The Heart > Tribunal. Classic Beyonder > Tribunal. Go read some comics.
I get it from comics. That thing you two have never read before. Spectre IS PART of The Presence and a lot of people regard the Heart as PART of TOAA. The Heart > Tribunal. Classic Beyonder > Tribunal. Go read some comics.
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