Solid Snake vs Deathstroke

@nickzambuto:Yes they do

http://www.destructoid.com/metal-gear-jesus-religious-parallels-in-the-metal-gear-solid-series-89609.phtml

they consider him a god

>_>...talk about hard core fans.

@celtic said:

@nickzambuto:Yes they do

http://www.destructoid.com/metal-gear-jesus-religious-parallels-in-the-metal-gear-solid-series-89609.phtml

they consider him a god

>_>...talk about hard core fans.

No one is calling him God. They're pointing out biblical representations of the characters; plenty of movies, games, and comics have biblical analogies and metaphors, and while I don't personally believe any of that was intentional, there's nothing wrong with making the comparisons. Especially considering that entire article was made in jest, as per the authors own admission.

It's a known fact that Deathstroke has some of the most fanboys next to Batman. Not once have I seen any member of this site besides myself hype up Snake in anyway. The article you linked, God forbid an article about Metal Gear Solid have Metal Gear Solid fans post in it.

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

As I said, Slade's got nearly indestructible armor, and he's survived a submarine getting thrown at him telekinetically. That's some pretty powerful endurance feat right there.

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

As I said, Slade's got nearly indestructible armor, and he's survived a submarine getting thrown at him telekinetically. That's some pretty powerful endurance feat right there.

Is Slade's head armored?

@nickzambuto said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@Cable_Extreme said:

@Lantern Prime:
Here are a few scans showing the speed of Deathstroke. I will start from easiest to hardest feats. This is why Deathstroke is super human.
He tags the flash on a regular basis, he dodges superman and moves so fast he couldn't have time to shoot him with his X-Ray vision, and he effortlessly dodges bullets and so forth. This is what seperates "Super Humans" to peak level humans.

It's been established 10 times over that Deathstroke tagging Flash is PIS. Same goes for Superman.

Snake is Slade's equal, if not superior in speed, reflexes, skill, and durability. DS has strength, but this is a close fight.

That's not true, Deathstroke tagging Flash is no more PIS than Karate Kid tagging and fighting "Superman" level beings despite him not having enhanced stats to do so. Deathstroke has shown multiples times to be able to accomplishes such feats so I don't believe it is entirely out of his abilities if the writers have shown him to be able to react and calculate on a superhuman level, comics don't abide by human logic and physics if they did you won't have Flash traveling at FTL or Superman flying all around Metropolis at FTL.

I have seen more impressive feats in terms of physicality and skill for Deathstroke, he regularly fights teams of characters that would have no problem dispatching Snake individually. The only thing that Snake really has going for him in terms of physicality is the whole Railgun showings which I believe is being overplayed, but no offense. I haven't seen any weapon specifications that suggests that the Railgun that was being used in the video has Super Sonic velocity in terms of firing speed (The Railguns the US Military is much more bigger than the one presented in the Metal Gear Solid video), and based off the video Snake didn't actually dodge the blast itself, but he was able to jump out of the radius of the blast before it made impact. What you are failing to realize it that it took time for the Railgun to adequately charge in order to release the blast and the blast had to gain speed before leaving the barrel before it was able to travel at full velocity.

We've been having a big argument over whether Slade tagging Flash is PIS in that one thread. If Flash was truly traveling at high speeds, he could of just gone right through the explosion with no ill effects. There's also the fact that Wally reacts to the femto second; a few billion of those passed during the time it took you to read up to this point.

It's PIS.

As for the Rail Gun showing, he dodged after the blast was fired. I already showed you the video, he saw the blast with his eyes and evaded it. The in-game description of the Rail Gun once Snake aquires it states that it fires projectiles at hypersonic speeds, not to mention real life Rail Guns can easily reach speeds of mach 20.

Snake also weaves through near point blank machine gun fire, dodges close range bullets after they've been fired, and defeated a 100 tonner in H2H, who was fast enough to do this.

Show me a non PIS, non prep time feat of Slade's that shows him being faster than that.

1) If there is a consistency then its not PIS, that is the common rule here on Comic Vine. Plenty of characters have been able to do things that should be possible for them i.e. Karate Kid and most street levelers in general have feats that shouldn't be possible such as Cassandra Cain dodging bullets after they are fired despite them traveling hundreds of meters per second, the reason why these feats aren't discarded is because there is a consistency in terms of her speed regardless or not if it makes sense. Feats don't have to make logical sense because many of the most used feats on these forum are highly unrealistic compared to real life.

2) I have already addressed this. The Railgun requires a sufficient amount of charging before it is able release the blast which is visually noticeable and the blast is pretty audible once it leaves the barrel which based on the video is what prompts Snake to look and jump on of the blast radius. Like I said before the blast that is released from the Railgun has to gain some momentum through traveling through the air for a extended period of time before being able to reach its peak velocity. As we can see in the video Snake jumps out of the radius before the blast made impact which suggest that he merely anticipated the incoming blast and acted accordingly. And most modern Assault Rifles in general have a velocity that is in the hypersonic range, people with inferior stats have been able to dance around those i.e. Nightwing, Batman, and Cassandra Cain.

3) Based off what I have heard from other respected debaters Deathstroke has also been able to deflect bullets and I have also seen scans of him being able to dodge bullets at point-blank range as well, Deathstroke has been able to keep up and toy around with characters like Cassandra Cain who is much faster than Gray Fox and Snake. Fighting Gray Fox is a nice feat, but what has he done skill-wise other then beating terrified fodder soldiers? And based off what I have been hearing Gray Fox's suit what malfunctioning which could of had an impact on his combat performance.

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

As I said, Slade's got nearly indestructible armor, and he's survived a submarine getting thrown at him telekinetically. That's some pretty powerful endurance feat right there.

Is Slade's head armored?

Oh, sorry, I didn't realize you were unfamiliar with Deathstroke.

Yeah, his head is armored, here's a couple pictures of his most recent incarnation:

Slade wins by superior stats

                   

@Cable_Extreme said:

@Lantern Prime:
Here are a few scans showing the speed of Deathstroke. I will start from easiest to hardest feats. This is why Deathstroke is super human.
He tags the flash on a regular basis, he dodges superman and moves so fast he couldn't have time to shoot him with his X-Ray vision, and he effortlessly dodges bullets and so forth. This is what seperates "Super Humans" to peak level humans.

It's been established 10 times over that Deathstroke tagging Flash is PIS. Same goes for Superman.

Snake is Slade's equal, if not superior in speed, reflexes, skill, and durability. DS has strength, but this is a close fight.

                   

               

                   

@nick_hero22 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@Cable_Extreme said:

@Lantern Prime:
Here are a few scans showing the speed of Deathstroke. I will start from easiest to hardest feats. This is why Deathstroke is super human.
He tags the flash on a regular basis, he dodges superman and moves so fast he couldn't have time to shoot him with his X-Ray vision, and he effortlessly dodges bullets and so forth. This is what seperates "Super Humans" to peak level humans.

It's been established 10 times over that Deathstroke tagging Flash is PIS. Same goes for Superman.

Snake is Slade's equal, if not superior in speed, reflexes, skill, and durability. DS has strength, but this is a close fight.

That's not true, Deathstroke tagging Flash is no more PIS than Karate Kid tagging and fighting "Superman" level beings despite him not having enhanced stats to do so. Deathstroke has shown multiples times to be able to accomplishes such feats so I don't believe it is entirely out of his abilities if the writers have shown him to be able to react and calculate on a superhuman level, comics don't abide by human logic and physics if they did you won't have Flash traveling at FTL or Superman flying all around Metropolis at FTL.

I have seen more impressive feats in terms of physicality and skill for Deathstroke, he regularly fights teams of characters that would have no problem dispatching Snake individually. The only thing that Snake really has going for him in terms of physicality is the whole Railgun showings which I believe is being overplayed, but no offense. I haven't seen any weapon specifications that suggests that the Railgun that was being used in the video has Super Sonic velocity in terms of firing speed (The Railguns the US Military is much more bigger than the one presented in the Metal Gear Solid video), and based off the video Snake didn't actually dodge the blast itself, but he was able to jump out of the radius of the blast before it made impact. What you are failing to realize it that it took time for the Railgun to adequately charge in order to release the blast and the blast had to gain speed before leaving the barrel before it was able to travel at full velocity.

We've been having a big argument over whether Slade tagging Flash is PIS in that one thread. If Flash was truly traveling at high speeds, he could of just gone right through the explosion with no ill effects. There's also the fact that Wally reacts to the femto second; a few billion of those passed during the time it took you to read up to this point.

It's PIS.

As for the Rail Gun showing, he dodged after the blast was fired. I already showed you the video, he saw the blast with his eyes and evaded it. The in-game description of the Rail Gun once Snake aquires it states that it fires projectiles at hypersonic speeds, not to mention real life Rail Guns can easily reach speeds of mach 20.

Snake also weaves through near point blank machine gun fire, dodges close range bullets after they've been fired, and defeated a 100 tonner in H2H, who was fast enough to do this.

Show me a non PIS, non prep time feat of Slade's that shows him being faster than that.

                   

               

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

As I said, Slade's got nearly indestructible armor, and he's survived a submarine getting thrown at him telekinetically. That's some pretty powerful endurance feat right there.

Is Slade's head armored?

Oh, sorry, I didn't realize you were unfamiliar with Deathstroke.

Yeah, his head is armored, here's a couple pictures of his most recent incarnation:

Well, this thread was made before New 52, so we should be using Pre-52 Deathstroke. Was his head armored then?

@Cable_Extreme said:

That video is PIS there im doing what your doing now.

That's completely different. 99.9% of comic book readers call Slade tagging Flash PIS. It's not just me.

@nick_hero22 said:

1) If there is a consistency then its not PIS, that is the common rule here on Comic Vine. Plenty of characters have been able to do things that should be possible for them i.e. Karate Kid and most street levelers in general have feats that shouldn't be possible such as Cassandra Cain dodging bullets after they are fired despite them traveling hundreds of meters per second, the reason why these feats are discarded is because there is a consistency in terms of her speed regardless or not if it makes sense. Feats don't have to make logical sense because many of the most used feats on these forum are highly unrealistic compared to real life.

2) I have already addressed this. The Railgun requires a sufficient amount of charging before it is able release the blast which is visually noticeable and the blast is pretty audible once it leaves the barrel which based on the video is what prompts Snake to look and jump on of the blast radius. Like I said before the blast that is released from the Railgun has to gain some momentum through traveling through the air for a extended period of time before being able to reach its peak velocity. I we can see in the video Snake jumps out of the radius before the blast made impact which suggest that he merely anticipated the incoming blast and acted accordingly. And most modern Assault Rifles in general have a velocity that is in the hypersonic range, people with inferior stats have been able to dance around those i.e. Nightwing, Batman, and Cassandra Cain.

3) Based off what I have heard from other respected debaters Deathstroke has also been able to deflect bullets and I have also seen scans of him being able to dodge bullets at point-blank range as well, Deathstroke has been able to keep up and toy around with characters like Cassandra Cain who is much faster than Gray Fox and Snake. Fighting Gray Fox is a nice feat, but what has he done skill-wise other then beating terrified fodder soldiers? And based off what I have been hearing Gray Fox's suit what malfunctioning which could of had an impact on his combat performance.

Thing is, Slade tagging Flash is inconsistent. A guy that nearly gets beaten by Batman, does get beaten by Batman sometimes, shouldn't be tagging FTL characters.

And I don't know what you're basing this on, but I've never heard of Rail Gun's needing to gain momentum. Snake was looking in the direction of the blast, and saw it coming towards him and dodged accordingly. He can't go off sound, because the blast is faster than sound.

And the Rail Gun feat is a pretty low end reaction time feat for Snake. Missile surfing still reigns supreme.

Deathstroke can deflect bullets, but he's not as fast as Gray Fox, who did it so fast he appeared to stand still. Before he hit puberty, Frank Jaeger was an experienced killer, easily defeating dozens of armed men while he only had a knife.

And no, his suit was not malfunctioning. You really shouldn't believe the words of trolls when you KNOW they're trolls. Dex_Starr was IP banned for a reason.

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

As I said, Slade's got nearly indestructible armor, and he's survived a submarine getting thrown at him telekinetically. That's some pretty powerful endurance feat right there.

Is Slade's head armored?

Oh, sorry, I didn't realize you were unfamiliar with Deathstroke.

Yeah, his head is armored, here's a couple pictures of his most recent incarnation:

Well, this thread was made before New 52, so we should be using Pre-52 Deathstroke. Was his head armored then?

@Cable_Extreme said:

That video is PIS there im doing what your doing now.

That's completely different. 99.9% of comic book readers call Slade tagging Flash PIS. It's not just me.

@nick_hero22 said:

1) If there is a consistency then its not PIS, that is the common rule here on Comic Vine. Plenty of characters have been able to do things that should be possible for them i.e. Karate Kid and most street levelers in general have feats that shouldn't be possible such as Cassandra Cain dodging bullets after they are fired despite them traveling hundreds of meters per second, the reason why these feats are discarded is because there is a consistency in terms of her speed regardless or not if it makes sense. Feats don't have to make logical sense because many of the most used feats on these forum are highly unrealistic compared to real life.

2) I have already addressed this. The Railgun requires a sufficient amount of charging before it is able release the blast which is visually noticeable and the blast is pretty audible once it leaves the barrel which based on the video is what prompts Snake to look and jump on of the blast radius. Like I said before the blast that is released from the Railgun has to gain some momentum through traveling through the air for a extended period of time before being able to reach its peak velocity. I we can see in the video Snake jumps out of the radius before the blast made impact which suggest that he merely anticipated the incoming blast and acted accordingly. And most modern Assault Rifles in general have a velocity that is in the hypersonic range, people with inferior stats have been able to dance around those i.e. Nightwing, Batman, and Cassandra Cain.

3) Based off what I have heard from other respected debaters Deathstroke has also been able to deflect bullets and I have also seen scans of him being able to dodge bullets at point-blank range as well, Deathstroke has been able to keep up and toy around with characters like Cassandra Cain who is much faster than Gray Fox and Snake. Fighting Gray Fox is a nice feat, but what has he done skill-wise other then beating terrified fodder soldiers? And based off what I have been hearing Gray Fox's suit what malfunctioning which could of had an impact on his combat performance.

Thing is, Slade tagging Flash is inconsistent. A guy that nearly gets beaten by Batman, does get beaten by Batman sometimes, shouldn't be tagging FTL characters.

And I don't know what you're basing this on, but I've never heard of Rail Gun's needing to gain momentum. Snake was looking in the direction of the blast, and saw it coming towards him and dodged accordingly. He can't go off sound, because the blast is faster than sound.

And the Rail Gun feat is a pretty low end reaction time feat for Snake. Missile surfing still reigns supreme.

Deathstroke can deflect bullets, but he's not as fast as Gray Fox, who did it so fast he appeared to stand still. Before he hit puberty, Frank Jaeger was an experienced killer, easily defeating dozens of armed men while he only had a knife.

And no, his suit was not malfunctioning. You really shouldn't believe the words of trolls when you KNOW they're trolls. Dex_Starr was IP banned for a reason.

1) Its not PIS if its consistent, Cassandra Cain has trouble with Batman who is peak human, but based off her feats she would have to be hypersonic if we're using real world logic.

2) All projectiles need to gain momentum in order to travel at full velocity, no offense but it is completely ludicrous to think that projectiles instantaneously achieve full velocity right out of the barrel. And the charging of the Railgun is audible as well (if has a static-like sound attributed to its charging) and is clearly visible too, the blast doesn't instantly start off traveling at hypersonic speed once it leaves the barrel.

3) None of these skill feats suggests that his combat prowess in on par with Deathstroke, so essentially Gray Fox is cyborg with superhuman strength and reflexes and speeds that are comparable to Deathstroke. Deathstroke has fought much more impressive foes in larger groups than Gray Fox.

4) I'm just saying, I have heard this multiple times in the past as well. Yes, Dex_Starr was banned for a reason.

@nick_hero22

1) Its not PIS if its consistent, Cassandra Cain has trouble with Batman who is peak human, but based off her feats she would have to be hypersonic if we're using real world logic.

But it's not consistent. A guy that can fist fight the Flash isn't almost losing to Batman, or Cassandra Cain, or Nightwing. A guy that can tag the Flash doesn't get shot in the leg, but Slade did.

2) All projectiles need to gain momentum in order to travel at full velocity, no offense but it is completely ludicrous to think that projectiles instantaneously achieve full velocity right out of the barrel. And the charging of the Railgun is audible as well (if has a static-like sound attributed to its charging) and is clearly visible too, the blast doesn't instantly start off traveling at hypersonic speed once it leaves the barrel.

Crying Wolf was 100 yards away, it's quite obvious Snake didn't hear the charging.

And I really don't know how long you think it's gonna take for the blast to reach full speed. Maybe a nanosecond or two. A blast that can reach speeds of up to mach 20 isn't going to start out at 100 MPH, then accelerate for no reason after traveling 50 yards.

3) None of these skill feats suggests that his combat prowess in on par with Deathstroke, so essentially Gray Fox is cyborg with superhuman strength and reflexes and speeds that are comparable to Deathstroke. Deathstroke has fought much more impressive foes in larger groups than Gray Fox.

Killing several dozen armed men at the age of 12 isn't impressive?

Ok.

Deathstroke has trouble with bullets, hence why he usually opts to dodge instead of deflect, and sometimes gets shot either way. Frank was faster than him, before even becoming a Cyborg.

4) I'm just saying, I have heard this multiple times in the past as well. Yes, Dex_Starr was banned for a reason.

You've heard it multiple times in the past by Dex_Starr. If you're taking his word on anything, then we're done here.

@nickzambuto said:

@nick_hero22

1) Its not PIS if its consistent, Cassandra Cain has trouble with Batman who is peak human, but based off her feats she would have to be hypersonic if we're using real world logic.

But it's not consistent. A guy that can fist fight the Flash isn't almost losing to Batman, or Cassandra Cain, or Nightwing. A guy that can tag the Flash doesn't get shot in the leg, but Slade did.

2) All projectiles need to gain momentum in order to travel at full velocity, no offense but it is completely ludicrous to think that projectiles instantaneously achieve full velocity right out of the barrel. And the charging of the Railgun is audible as well (if has a static-like sound attributed to its charging) and is clearly visible too, the blast doesn't instantly start off traveling at hypersonic speed once it leaves the barrel.

Crying Wolf was 100 yards away, it's quite obvious Snake didn't hear the charging.

And I really don't know how long you think it's gonna take for the blast to reach full speed. Maybe a nanosecond or two. A blast that can reach speeds of up to mach 20 isn't going to start out at 100 MPH, then accelerate for no reason after traveling 50 yards.

3) None of these skill feats suggests that his combat prowess in on par with Deathstroke, so essentially Gray Fox is cyborg with superhuman strength and reflexes and speeds that are comparable to Deathstroke. Deathstroke has fought much more impressive foes in larger groups than Gray Fox.

Killing several dozen armed men at the age of 12 isn't impressive?

Ok.

Deathstroke has trouble with bullets, hence why he usually opts to dodge instead of deflect, and sometimes gets shot either way. Frank was faster than him, before even becoming a Cyborg.

4) I'm just saying, I have heard this multiple times in the past as well. Yes, Dex_Starr was banned for a reason.

You've heard it multiple times in the past by Dex_Starr. If you're taking his word on anything, then we're done here.

1) Its not PIS, PIS is essentially a inaccurate representation (terms of powers and abilities) of a character i.e. Daredevil flipping a limousine. If Deathstroke has been shown to accomplish these feats for like the past decade based off various of writers wouldn't that mean it is apart of his standard characterization and not inaccurate in terms of his ability? You can't hold comics to real world logic.

2) The farther away the shooter the longer it takes the bullet to travel to its target (100 yards is equal to 91.44 meters) and you can obviously hear the kick-back and recoil from the Railgun. It should be pretty obvious that due to the way that Snake jumped out of the way that he was responding to a audible or visual cue if he was dodge the "blast" itself we would have seen him forward and side-stepping the blast in order to escape its blast radius not jumping out of the way for dear life.

3) Deathstroke has beaten more skilled opponents, Cassandra Cain was killing trained Mercenaries when she was like 5 and tagging Bronze Tiger as well.

4) I didn't say that I was talking his word, I'm just curious.

OK.

I'm chiming in.

Deathstroke destroys Snake. Plot ain't coming to save the day ... nor are 'gameplay' mechanics.

CGI enhanced graphics (even dated ones) are always more visually impressive than comic book art and tend to mislead a debate.

As I've said before, Deathstroke tagging the Flash is not PIS when placed into context. He finds Wally predictable, thereby staying one step ahead more so than being faster per se (example of him using 90% of his brain). That and Flash was moving no where near top speeds. I liken him to a Quicksilver type character in those showings. If there is consistency, then we have to acquiesce to Deathstroke pulling it off under said context IMHO.

And Deathstroke splitting a bullet is still pretty damn impressive. It means he can. I don't see Deathstroke eating a bullet every now and then as a knock against him being able to dodge them, and having dodged them, more often than not. Slade's senses are also enhanced, so I'm not liking Snake's chances of just 'sneaking up' on Deathstroke easy peasy like that.

I think context is being dangerously overlooked here.

@Super_SoldierXII said:

OK.

I'm chiming in.

Deathstroke destroys Snake. Plot ain't coming to save the day ... nor are 'gameplay' mechanics.

CGI enhanced graphics (even dated ones) are always more visually impressive than comic book art and tend to mislead a debate.

As I've said before, Deathstroke tagging the Flash is not PIS when placed into context. He finds Wally predictable, thereby staying one step ahead more so than being faster per se (example of him using 90% of his brain). That and Flash was moving no where near top speeds. I liken him to a Quicksilver type character in those showings. If there is consistency, then we have to acquiesce to Deathstroke pulling it off under said context IMHO.

And Deathstroke splitting a bullet is still pretty damn impressive. It means he can. I don't see Deathstroke eating a bullet every now and then as a knock against him being able to dodge them, and having dodged them, more often than not. Slade's senses are also enhanced, so I'm not liking Snake's chances of just 'sneaking up' on Deathstroke easy peasy like that.

I think context is being dangerously overlooked here.

I agree with you on everything you said. I don't think anyone believes that Deathstroke can tag a Flash that is moving at optimal speeds, I hope not anyway.

@Super_SoldierXII said:

OK.

I'm chiming in.

Deathstroke destroys Snake. Plot ain't coming to save the day ... nor are 'gameplay' mechanics.

CGI enhanced graphics (even dated ones) are always more visually impressive than comic book art and tend to mislead a debate.

As I've said before, Deathstroke tagging the Flash is not PIS when placed into context. He finds Wally predictable, thereby staying one step ahead more so than being faster per se (example of him using 90% of his brain). That and Flash was moving no where near top speeds. I liken him to a Quicksilver type character in those showings. If there is consistency, then we have to acquiesce to Deathstroke pulling it off under said context IMHO.

And Deathstroke splitting a bullet is still pretty damn impressive. It means he can. I don't see Deathstroke eating a bullet every now and then as a knock against him being able to dodge them, and having dodged them, more often than not. Slade's senses are also enhanced, so I'm not liking Snake's chances of just 'sneaking up' on Deathstroke easy peasy like that.

I think context is being dangerously overlooked here.

Speed or no, Flash's reaction time should of allowed him to see Deathstroke move, spend a few hours in his head thinking over what to do, then easily dodge.

And I suggest you do the Snake vs Punisher debate before you go around claiming Snake gets "destroyed" ;)

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Just so we're clear, I never said Snake would win ;)

@Floopay:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake.

Maybe, but I'm having a good ole time riling Mr. zambuto up for our imminent Punisher versus Solid Snake debate.

@nickzambuto:

Speed or no, Flash's reaction time should of allowed him to see Deathstroke move, spend a few hours in his head thinking over what to do, then easily dodge.

Honestly, the way Flash is written seems to have greatly evolved over the past decade. Especially since Morrison started touting his "Flash facts". Writers started exploring the endless possibilities. I'm no Flash expert, far from it, but the way he executes his powers seems to trigger to fit the need more and more ever since - growing increasingly more powerful and diversified.

Deathstroke used 90% of his brain to predict where Flash would end up. Wally was probably not hitting anywhere near top speeds (speed of sound maybe), and was tagged like a prepubescent idiot by a hidden blade and a hidden Bo staff. I don't care who thinks what of those feats anyway. We all know Flash would destroy Deathstroke in well under a nano second so I don't see what the big deal is. I don't see this as a speed feat. I see this feat (and use it) as an example of Deathstroke utilizing his purported 90% activated brainpower to monopolize on his studied opponent's predictability and standard modus operandi - and thereby avoiding that part of his power-set as remaining only within the realm of hyperbole.

And I suggest you do the Snake vs Punisher debate before you go around claiming Snake gets "destroyed" ;)

Here I am, being generous and allowing you complete your ongoings at YOUR request ... and you go smack talking me for it. Sigh. That's what you get I suppose ... I'll save you trouble and simply state "Frank wins". The rest of the journey is just detail. :P

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Show me someone in real life dodging or anticipating gunfire in the heat of a gun battle. What studies proved this?

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Show me someone in real life dodging or anticipating gunfire in the heat of a gun battle. What studies proved this?

REMO WILLIAMS FTW!!!

What? He's a fictional character you say? Pshhhh ...

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Show me someone in real life dodging or anticipating gunfire in the heat of a gun battle. What studies proved this?

For one they did a study on the popular TV Series "Superhumans" with Stan Lee.

This particular moment is with an airsoft BB, but you get the point. They proved this guys reflexes were barely above normal, I can dig up some more studies later if you'd like.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

@Super_SoldierXII said:

Here I am, being generous and allowing you complete your ongoings at YOUR request ... and you go smack talking me for it. Sigh. That's what you get I suppose ... I'll save you trouble and simply state "Frank wins". The rest of the journey is just detail. :P

Forget all those other debates. This is my main priority now. Ready WHENEVER you are.

@nickzambuto said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

What is this crude drawing you posted?

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber. I could tell someone I'm going to shoot them in their leg and still hit regardless of me telling them or not, so anticipation is a moot point.

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

He's saying very few characters actually bullet dodge, they just aim dodge. That's why Batman easily stomps 12 goons all armed with Machine Guns, yet Deadshot is one of his most difficult adversaries.

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

Yet someone cut a BB in half with a samurai sword....honestly, if you can see where your opponent is going to be firing, a well trained person can simply not be in the line of fire. That's how dodging a bullet works. You get out of the way BEFORE the trigger is pulled. That's how people do it in real life, that's probably how it's done in comics. You don't need hypersonic reflexes, you just need to be aware of where your opponents gun is, and it's approximate trajectory, and stay out of that firing zone.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@nickzambuto said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

He's saying very few characters actually bullet dodge, they just aim dodge. That's why Batman easily stomps 12 goons all armed with Machine Guns, yet Deadshot is one of his most difficult adversaries.

I believe he was talking about normal humans have the ability to anticipate and react to bullets in some kind of studies.

I dodge bullets.

True story.

Avoided my angry girlfriend all evening.

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

Yet someone cut a BB in half with a samurai sword....honestly, if you can see where your opponent is going to be firing, a well trained person can simply not be in the line of fire. That's how dodging a bullet works. You get out of the way BEFORE the trigger is pulled. That's how people do it in real life, that's probably how it's done in comics. You don't need hypersonic reflexes, you just need to be aware of where your opponents gun is, and it's approximate trajectory, and stay out of that firing zone.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) You need to compare the velocity of a freaking BB gun to a modern firearm to actually understand what's being said here, you have fundamental misunderstanding.

2) Again anticipating is pointless if you can't react to what being shot at you, the link and quote I posted confirmed this. This works in comics, but it doesn't work in real life, humans are way to slow. I mean like seriously, if you are so sure that you can anticipate the trajectory of a bullet then by all means show us because their are people who have a much higher level of physicality than me and you that wouldn't be able to effective dodge a bullet by anticipating its aim or even a arrow for that matter. That's pretty silly.

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

Yet someone cut a BB in half with a samurai sword....honestly, if you can see where your opponent is going to be firing, a well trained person can simply not be in the line of fire. That's how dodging a bullet works. You get out of the way BEFORE the trigger is pulled. That's how people do it in real life, that's probably how it's done in comics. You don't need hypersonic reflexes, you just need to be aware of where your opponents gun is, and it's approximate trajectory, and stay out of that firing zone.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) You need to compare the velocity of a freaking BB gun to a modern firearm to actually understand what's being said here, you have fundamental misunderstanding.

2) Again anticipating is pointless if you can't react to what being shot at you, the link and quote I posted confirmed this. This works in comics, but it doesn't work in real life, humans are way to slow. I mean like seriously, if you are so sure that you can anticipate the trajectory of a bullet then by all means show us because their are people who have a much higher level of physicality than me and you that wouldn't be able to effective dodge a bullet by anticipating its aim or even a arrow for that matter. That's pretty silly.

Granted a BB travels at 1/3 the speed of a bullet (going by a BB rifle against modern handguns, assault rifles, submachine guns, and some snipers), but your point is flawed. You are making the assumption that the person you are firing at is automatically going to be where you are aiming when the trigger is pulled. However, if someone is not where your gun is aimed, then the bullet will not hit, because they will not be there... Therefore, if you can anticipate where your opponent is aiming, and simply avoid being in that spot, then they will miss...aka you dodged a bullet. You can claim all day how "impossible" that is, but you are talking about something that at best a centimeter in diameter trying to hit someone who is constantly moving.

Again, anticipation, not actual reflexes, are what allows people to dodge bullets. When you hear a gunshot, and you want to dodge gunfire, would you stand there while they pointed the gun at you and try to dodge the bullet after you hear the gun go off? Absolutely not, that's ridiculous. You would attempt to avoid having the barrel of the gun being pointed at you. Aka, you would try to avoid being within the bullets estimated trajectory (in front of the barrel). Now even a toddler can figure out that logic, you would think a very well trained individual would have a better concept of where a bullets trajectory may be depeding on the weapon used to fire it than your average Joe Schmoe who wants to simply "not be where the gun is pointing".

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

Yet someone cut a BB in half with a samurai sword....honestly, if you can see where your opponent is going to be firing, a well trained person can simply not be in the line of fire. That's how dodging a bullet works. You get out of the way BEFORE the trigger is pulled. That's how people do it in real life, that's probably how it's done in comics. You don't need hypersonic reflexes, you just need to be aware of where your opponents gun is, and it's approximate trajectory, and stay out of that firing zone.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) You need to compare the velocity of a freaking BB gun to a modern firearm to actually understand what's being said here, you have fundamental misunderstanding.

2) Again anticipating is pointless if you can't react to what being shot at you, the link and quote I posted confirmed this. This works in comics, but it doesn't work in real life, humans are way to slow. I mean like seriously, if you are so sure that you can anticipate the trajectory of a bullet then by all means show us because their are people who have a much higher level of physicality than me and you that wouldn't be able to effective dodge a bullet by anticipating its aim or even a arrow for that matter. That's pretty silly.

Granted a BB travels at 1/3 the speed of a bullet (going by a BB rifle against modern handguns, assault rifles, submachine guns, and some snipers), but your point is flawed. You are making the assumption that the person you are firing at is automatically going to be where you are aiming when the trigger is pulled. However, if someone is not where your gun is aimed, then the bullet will not hit, because they will not be there... Therefore, if you can anticipate where your opponent is aiming, and simply avoid being in that spot, then they will miss...aka you dodged a bullet. You can claim all day how "impossible" that is, but you are talking about something that at best a centimeter in diameter trying to hit someone who is constantly moving.

Again, anticipation, not actual reflexes, are what allows people to dodge bullets. When you hear a gunshot, and you want to dodge gunfire, would you stand there while they pointed the gun at you and try to dodge the bullet after you hear the gun go off? Absolutely not, that's ridiculous. You would attempt to avoid having the barrel of the gun being pointed at you. Aka, you would try to avoid being within the bullets estimated trajectory (in front of the barrel). Now even a toddler can figure out that logic, you would think a very well trained individual would have a better concept of where a bullets trajectory may be depeding on the weapon used to fire it than your average Joe Schmoe who wants to simply "not be where the gun is pointing".

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Here, now you guys don't have to quote me anymore.

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

Yet someone cut a BB in half with a samurai sword....honestly, if you can see where your opponent is going to be firing, a well trained person can simply not be in the line of fire. That's how dodging a bullet works. You get out of the way BEFORE the trigger is pulled. That's how people do it in real life, that's probably how it's done in comics. You don't need hypersonic reflexes, you just need to be aware of where your opponents gun is, and it's approximate trajectory, and stay out of that firing zone.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) You need to compare the velocity of a freaking BB gun to a modern firearm to actually understand what's being said here, you have fundamental misunderstanding.

2) Again anticipating is pointless if you can't react to what being shot at you, the link and quote I posted confirmed this. This works in comics, but it doesn't work in real life, humans are way to slow. I mean like seriously, if you are so sure that you can anticipate the trajectory of a bullet then by all means show us because their are people who have a much higher level of physicality than me and you that wouldn't be able to effective dodge a bullet by anticipating its aim or even a arrow for that matter. That's pretty silly.

Granted a BB travels at 1/3 the speed of a bullet (going by a BB rifle against modern handguns, assault rifles, submachine guns, and some snipers), but your point is flawed. You are making the assumption that the person you are firing at is automatically going to be where you are aiming when the trigger is pulled. However, if someone is not where your gun is aimed, then the bullet will not hit, because they will not be there... Therefore, if you can anticipate where your opponent is aiming, and simply avoid being in that spot, then they will miss...aka you dodged a bullet. You can claim all day how "impossible" that is, but you are talking about something that at best a centimeter in diameter trying to hit someone who is constantly moving.

Again, anticipation, not actual reflexes, are what allows people to dodge bullets. When you hear a gunshot, and you want to dodge gunfire, would you stand there while they pointed the gun at you and try to dodge the bullet after you hear the gun go off? Absolutely not, that's ridiculous. You would attempt to avoid having the barrel of the gun being pointed at you. Aka, you would try to avoid being within the bullets estimated trajectory (in front of the barrel). Now even a toddler can figure out that logic, you would think a very well trained individual would have a better concept of where a bullets trajectory may be depeding on the weapon used to fire it than your average Joe Schmoe who wants to simply "not be where the gun is pointing".

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) Again you are overestimating human capabilities! In order to do what you are saying it would require the person to move out of the firearm's path compared to the shooter who only has to squeeze the trigger of the gun which would require less effort and take less time than physically moving your entire body out of the way. Anticipating is pointless because it requires the victim to assess the whole situation and plan a course of action while fighting off the effects of fight or flight (your body would be rushing with adrenaline) and then move out of the path of the bullet which would require several seconds to do so while the shooters only pulls the trigger to release the bullet from its chamber which would happen in a split-second. A course if someone is already running the shooter would have a harder time hitting them due to have take into account things like his accuracy, wind conditions, and etc., but them running for dead life and pumped with adrenaline has nothing to do with anticipating gunfire. Your whole argument is ridiculous and asinine, if you honestly believe that a person is capable of taking several seconds to assess, anticipate, and move out of the way before a shooter has pulled the trigger you need to log off of Comic Vine and the Internet in general because that is ludicrous.

2) Again this is asinine and ridiculous, you are not taking into account the time necessary to react to the whole entire situation not just the gun if someone points a gun out you most people will be paralyzed with fear including myself. Their is no logic in any of your posts so please stop now because this is ridiculous, you obviously have some misunderstandings in this thread.

Thanks for reading,

Nick_Hero22

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

Yet someone cut a BB in half with a samurai sword....honestly, if you can see where your opponent is going to be firing, a well trained person can simply not be in the line of fire. That's how dodging a bullet works. You get out of the way BEFORE the trigger is pulled. That's how people do it in real life, that's probably how it's done in comics. You don't need hypersonic reflexes, you just need to be aware of where your opponents gun is, and it's approximate trajectory, and stay out of that firing zone.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) You need to compare the velocity of a freaking BB gun to a modern firearm to actually understand what's being said here, you have fundamental misunderstanding.

2) Again anticipating is pointless if you can't react to what being shot at you, the link and quote I posted confirmed this. This works in comics, but it doesn't work in real life, humans are way to slow. I mean like seriously, if you are so sure that you can anticipate the trajectory of a bullet then by all means show us because their are people who have a much higher level of physicality than me and you that wouldn't be able to effective dodge a bullet by anticipating its aim or even a arrow for that matter. That's pretty silly.

Granted a BB travels at 1/3 the speed of a bullet (going by a BB rifle against modern handguns, assault rifles, submachine guns, and some snipers), but your point is flawed. You are making the assumption that the person you are firing at is automatically going to be where you are aiming when the trigger is pulled. However, if someone is not where your gun is aimed, then the bullet will not hit, because they will not be there... Therefore, if you can anticipate where your opponent is aiming, and simply avoid being in that spot, then they will miss...aka you dodged a bullet. You can claim all day how "impossible" that is, but you are talking about something that at best a centimeter in diameter trying to hit someone who is constantly moving.

Again, anticipation, not actual reflexes, are what allows people to dodge bullets. When you hear a gunshot, and you want to dodge gunfire, would you stand there while they pointed the gun at you and try to dodge the bullet after you hear the gun go off? Absolutely not, that's ridiculous. You would attempt to avoid having the barrel of the gun being pointed at you. Aka, you would try to avoid being within the bullets estimated trajectory (in front of the barrel). Now even a toddler can figure out that logic, you would think a very well trained individual would have a better concept of where a bullets trajectory may be depeding on the weapon used to fire it than your average Joe Schmoe who wants to simply "not be where the gun is pointing".

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) Again you are overestimating human capabilities! In order to do what you are saying it would require the person to move out of the firearm's path compared to the shooter who only has to squeeze the trigger of the gun which would require less effort and take less time than physically moving your entire body out of the way. Anticipating is pointless because it requires the victim to assess the whole situation and plan a course of action while fighting off the effects of fight or flight (your body would be rushing with adrenaline) and then move out of the path of the bullet which would require several seconds to do so while the shooters only pulls the trigger to release the bullet from its chamber which would happen in a split-second. A course if someone is already running the shooter would have a harder time hitting them due to have take into account things like his accuracy, wind conditions, and etc., but them running for dead life and pumped with adrenaline has nothing to do with anticipating gunfire. Your whole argument is ridiculous and asinine, if you honestly believe that a person is capable of taking several seconds to assess, anticipate, and move out of the way before a shooter has pulled the trigger you need to log off of Comic Vine and the Internet in general because that is ludicrous.

2) Again this is asinine and ridiculous, you are not taking into account the time necessary to react to the whole entire situation not just the gun if someone points a gun out you most people will be paralyzed with fear including myself. Their is no logic in any of your posts so please stop now because this is ridiculous, you obviously have some misunderstandings in this thread.

Thanks for reading,

Nick_Hero22

It's much harder to aim a firearm than you may think. Especially when trying to keep your eye on somebody who is moving erratically Someone has to do more than just "squeeze a trigger", anyone who has handled a firearm knows that especially. It's actually much more difficult to hit a target than one might think, even when hunting where you have complete advantage over your target, it's not always easy to line up and take a kill shot. Someone who is constantly moving, and moving erratically would be a very very difficult target to hit. If a guy can cut a BB in half, which is 1/8th the size of a bullet (granted, the BB was moving at 1/3rd the speed of a bullet) with a samurai sword by anticipating the location of the BB and the approximate time the gun will be fired (as proven, he would have had to start swinging before the trigger was pulled), then I think someone can dodge a bullet.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@nick_hero22:

Oh and by the way, you can make split second decisions without stopping and taking several seconds to assess a situation, people do it in combat situations all the time.

@CadenceV2: You have some military training, would you like to shed some inside on this?

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22 said:

@Floopay said:

@Super_SoldierXII:

I doubt Deathstroke could stomp Snake. Realistically this would more than likely come down to gear more than anything. But I do think Deathstroke would win most times.

@nick_hero22:

Most people view bullet timers as unrealistic, but honestly, dodging a bullet has been prove to have almost nothing to do with base reflexes, and moreso a persons ability to anticipate another individuals next move. And yes, there are real studies proving this.

@nickzambuto:

I think Snake would be able to win this with the right arsenal. Standard equipment, I dunno, but if he was able to carry some high caliber weaponry, or that RPG of his with some ammo, and he was hunting Slade and this wasn't just a 1 v 1 match, I would give this to Snake. But as is, in a random encounter, both starting 25 ft apart (according to the Battle Forum rules, unless stated otherwise these are the conditions) with no knowledge. I just don't see Snake taking it. Again, if he had a few hours of prep to grab the equipment he thought he'd need against Slade, and he were hunting/tracking Slade and setting up an ambush, I'd give it to him.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

The average bullet travels at 2,500 feet per second (around 1,700 mph). If you reacted to the sound of the gun going off and required 0.20 seconds (twice that of the fastest Olympic sprinters) to react, then you would need to be at least 500 feet away to successfully dodge a bullet. The problem is that sound travels at 768 miles per hour (1,126 feet per second)—about half the speed of the bullet. In this case, the bullet would hit you before you even heard the gun fire off.

http://www.mythbusterstheexhibition.com/science-content/dodge-a-bullet/

Again, I'm talking about anticipatory functions, not reflexes. That was the entire point of my post.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Anticipating is pointless when you are not capable of reacting to the bullet before it leaves its chamber.

Yet someone cut a BB in half with a samurai sword....honestly, if you can see where your opponent is going to be firing, a well trained person can simply not be in the line of fire. That's how dodging a bullet works. You get out of the way BEFORE the trigger is pulled. That's how people do it in real life, that's probably how it's done in comics. You don't need hypersonic reflexes, you just need to be aware of where your opponents gun is, and it's approximate trajectory, and stay out of that firing zone.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) You need to compare the velocity of a freaking BB gun to a modern firearm to actually understand what's being said here, you have fundamental misunderstanding.

2) Again anticipating is pointless if you can't react to what being shot at you, the link and quote I posted confirmed this. This works in comics, but it doesn't work in real life, humans are way to slow. I mean like seriously, if you are so sure that you can anticipate the trajectory of a bullet then by all means show us because their are people who have a much higher level of physicality than me and you that wouldn't be able to effective dodge a bullet by anticipating its aim or even a arrow for that matter. That's pretty silly.

Granted a BB travels at 1/3 the speed of a bullet (going by a BB rifle against modern handguns, assault rifles, submachine guns, and some snipers), but your point is flawed. You are making the assumption that the person you are firing at is automatically going to be where you are aiming when the trigger is pulled. However, if someone is not where your gun is aimed, then the bullet will not hit, because they will not be there... Therefore, if you can anticipate where your opponent is aiming, and simply avoid being in that spot, then they will miss...aka you dodged a bullet. You can claim all day how "impossible" that is, but you are talking about something that at best a centimeter in diameter trying to hit someone who is constantly moving.

Again, anticipation, not actual reflexes, are what allows people to dodge bullets. When you hear a gunshot, and you want to dodge gunfire, would you stand there while they pointed the gun at you and try to dodge the bullet after you hear the gun go off? Absolutely not, that's ridiculous. You would attempt to avoid having the barrel of the gun being pointed at you. Aka, you would try to avoid being within the bullets estimated trajectory (in front of the barrel). Now even a toddler can figure out that logic, you would think a very well trained individual would have a better concept of where a bullets trajectory may be depeding on the weapon used to fire it than your average Joe Schmoe who wants to simply "not be where the gun is pointing".

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

1) Again you are overestimating human capabilities! In order to do what you are saying it would require the person to move out of the firearm's path compared to the shooter who only has to squeeze the trigger of the gun which would require less effort and take less time than physically moving your entire body out of the way. Anticipating is pointless because it requires the victim to assess the whole situation and plan a course of action while fighting off the effects of fight or flight (your body would be rushing with adrenaline) and then move out of the path of the bullet which would require several seconds to do so while the shooters only pulls the trigger to release the bullet from its chamber which would happen in a split-second. A course if someone is already running the shooter would have a harder time hitting them due to have take into account things like his accuracy, wind conditions, and etc., but them running for dead life and pumped with adrenaline has nothing to do with anticipating gunfire. Your whole argument is ridiculous and asinine, if you honestly believe that a person is capable of taking several seconds to assess, anticipate, and move out of the way before a shooter has pulled the trigger you need to log off of Comic Vine and the Internet in general because that is ludicrous.

2) Again this is asinine and ridiculous, you are not taking into account the time necessary to react to the whole entire situation not just the gun if someone points a gun out you most people will be paralyzed with fear including myself. Their is no logic in any of your posts so please stop now because this is ridiculous, you obviously have some misunderstandings in this thread.

Thanks for reading,

Nick_Hero22

It's much harder to aim a firearm than you may think. Especially when trying to keep your eye on somebody who is moving erratically Someone has to do more than just "squeeze a trigger", anyone who has handled a firearm knows that especially. It's actually much more difficult to hit a target than one might think, even when hunting where you have complete advantage over your target, it's not always easy to line up and take a kill shot. Someone who is constantly moving, and moving erratically would be a very very difficult target to hit. If a guy can cut a BB in half, which is 1/8th the size of a bullet (granted, the BB was moving at 1/3rd the speed of a bullet) with a samurai sword by anticipating the location of the BB and the approximate time the gun will be fired (as proven, he would have had to start swinging before the trigger was pulled), then I think someone can dodge a bullet.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

What does running around like a madman have to do with anticipating someone aim which would require the victim to analyze the situation and move accordingly before the shooter has pulled the trigger? And why do you keep comparing BB guns to modern firearms? Can please stop posting me as well because I shouldn't be even entertaining this idea.

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22:

Oh and by the way, you can make split second decisions without stopping and taking several seconds to assess a situation, people do it in combat situations all the time.

@CadenceV2: You have some military training, would you like to shed some inside on this?

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Insight = wear bullet proof vest.

@nickzambuto:

Here, now you guys don't have to quote me anymore.

Lol. Was about to do the same.

@Super_SoldierXII said:

@Floopay said:

@nick_hero22:

Oh and by the way, you can make split second decisions without stopping and taking several seconds to assess a situation, people do it in combat situations all the time.

@CadenceV2: You have some military training, would you like to shed some inside on this?

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

Insight = wear bullet proof vest.

@nickzambuto:

Here, now you guys don't have to quote me anymore.

Lol. Was about to do the same.

Sorry :)

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

As I said, Slade's got nearly indestructible armor, and he's survived a submarine getting thrown at him telekinetically. That's some pretty powerful endurance feat right there.

Is Slade's head armored?

Oh, sorry, I didn't realize you were unfamiliar with Deathstroke.

Yeah, his head is armored, here's a couple pictures of his most recent incarnation:

Well, this thread was made before New 52, so we should be using Pre-52 Deathstroke. Was his head armored then?

@Cable_Extreme said:

That video is PIS there im doing what your doing now.

That's completely different. 99.9% of comic book readers call Slade tagging Flash PIS. It's not just me.

@nick_hero22 said:

1) If there is a consistency then its not PIS, that is the common rule here on Comic Vine. Plenty of characters have been able to do things that should be possible for them i.e. Karate Kid and most street levelers in general have feats that shouldn't be possible such as Cassandra Cain dodging bullets after they are fired despite them traveling hundreds of meters per second, the reason why these feats are discarded is because there is a consistency in terms of her speed regardless or not if it makes sense. Feats don't have to make logical sense because many of the most used feats on these forum are highly unrealistic compared to real life.

2) I have already addressed this. The Railgun requires a sufficient amount of charging before it is able release the blast which is visually noticeable and the blast is pretty audible once it leaves the barrel which based on the video is what prompts Snake to look and jump on of the blast radius. Like I said before the blast that is released from the Railgun has to gain some momentum through traveling through the air for a extended period of time before being able to reach its peak velocity. I we can see in the video Snake jumps out of the radius before the blast made impact which suggest that he merely anticipated the incoming blast and acted accordingly. And most modern Assault Rifles in general have a velocity that is in the hypersonic range, people with inferior stats have been able to dance around those i.e. Nightwing, Batman, and Cassandra Cain.

3) Based off what I have heard from other respected debaters Deathstroke has also been able to deflect bullets and I have also seen scans of him being able to dodge bullets at point-blank range as well, Deathstroke has been able to keep up and toy around with characters like Cassandra Cain who is much faster than Gray Fox and Snake. Fighting Gray Fox is a nice feat, but what has he done skill-wise other then beating terrified fodder soldiers? And based off what I have been hearing Gray Fox's suit what malfunctioning which could of had an impact on his combat performance.

Thing is, Slade tagging Flash is inconsistent. A guy that nearly gets beaten by Batman, does get beaten by Batman sometimes, shouldn't be tagging FTL characters.

And I don't know what you're basing this on, but I've never heard of Rail Gun's needing to gain momentum. Snake was looking in the direction of the blast, and saw it coming towards him and dodged accordingly. He can't go off sound, because the blast is faster than sound.

And the Rail Gun feat is a pretty low end reaction time feat for Snake. Missile surfing still reigns supreme.

Deathstroke can deflect bullets, but he's not as fast as Gray Fox, who did it so fast he appeared to stand still. Before he hit puberty, Frank Jaeger was an experienced killer, easily defeating dozens of armed men while he only had a knife.

And no, his suit was not malfunctioning. You really shouldn't believe the words of trolls when you KNOW they're trolls. Dex_Starr was IP banned for a reason.

If we're using pre-flashpoint Deathstroke, his head isn't armored, but he has much better feats as well. He'd be able to detect Snake if he were stealthing, most likely, if he knew that he was fighting Snake. Batman has proven to be quiet enough to sneak up on Slade when he's focused on something else though, so it depends on the setting of the battle, I think; it could go either way.

50/50 for pre-flashpoint Deathstroke depending on setting, 100/0 Deathstroke/Snake if using New 52 Deathstroke, IMO.

@nick_hero22: No worries! I was actually reading the debate too ... so I shouldn't complain. Complaining is just so gosh darn fun! Lol.

@Super_SoldierXII said:

@nick_hero22: No worries! I was actually reading the debate too ... so I shouldn't complain. Complaining is just so gosh darn fun! Lol.

I know right :)

Deathstroke would stomp him

                   

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

@nickzambuto said:

@minigunman123 said:

Snake: Olympic athlete, genius tactician, weapons expert, stealth master, martial arts expert.

Slade Wilson: Superhuman, superhuman soldier/athlete, supergenius tactician, weapons proficiency (as they get more technological, Slade typically defers to his weapons expert), stealth proficiency (he often does not opt for stealth, we haven't seen any stealth feats from him in the New 52 yet), martial arts master, nearly indestructible armor, grenades that nearly vaporized Lobo, healing factor, experience taking down many metahumans, aliens, and mystical beings.

I'd say the odds are in Slade's favor. Snake is awesome, and might be more of a match for Batman than Deathstroke, because Deathstroke outdoes him in nearly every category that matters (stealth is possibly very useful for Snake, but what's he going to do, hide from Slade the entire fight? He has no way of harming or getting to Slade even if he's stealthier than Slade is.)

He could sneak up on Slade and pop him in the head at point blank?

As I said, Slade's got nearly indestructible armor, and he's survived a submarine getting thrown at him telekinetically. That's some pretty powerful endurance feat right there.

Is Slade's head armored?

Oh, sorry, I didn't realize you were unfamiliar with Deathstroke.

Yeah, his head is armored, here's a couple pictures of his most recent incarnation:

Well, this thread was made before New 52, so we should be using Pre-52 Deathstroke. Was his head armored then?

@Cable_Extreme said:

That video is PIS there im doing what your doing now.

That's completely different. 99.9% of comic book readers call Slade tagging Flash PIS. It's not just me.

@nick_hero22 said:

1) If there is a consistency then its not PIS, that is the common rule here on Comic Vine. Plenty of characters have been able to do things that should be possible for them i.e. Karate Kid and most street levelers in general have feats that shouldn't be possible such as Cassandra Cain dodging bullets after they are fired despite them traveling hundreds of meters per second, the reason why these feats are discarded is because there is a consistency in terms of her speed regardless or not if it makes sense. Feats don't have to make logical sense because many of the most used feats on these forum are highly unrealistic compared to real life.

2) I have already addressed this. The Railgun requires a sufficient amount of charging before it is able release the blast which is visually noticeable and the blast is pretty audible once it leaves the barrel which based on the video is what prompts Snake to look and jump on of the blast radius. Like I said before the blast that is released from the Railgun has to gain some momentum through traveling through the air for a extended period of time before being able to reach its peak velocity. I we can see in the video Snake jumps out of the radius before the blast made impact which suggest that he merely anticipated the incoming blast and acted accordingly. And most modern Assault Rifles in general have a velocity that is in the hypersonic range, people with inferior stats have been able to dance around those i.e. Nightwing, Batman, and Cassandra Cain.

3) Based off what I have heard from other respected debaters Deathstroke has also been able to deflect bullets and I have also seen scans of him being able to dodge bullets at point-blank range as well, Deathstroke has been able to keep up and toy around with characters like Cassandra Cain who is much faster than Gray Fox and Snake. Fighting Gray Fox is a nice feat, but what has he done skill-wise other then beating terrified fodder soldiers? And based off what I have been hearing Gray Fox's suit what malfunctioning which could of had an impact on his combat performance.

Thing is, Slade tagging Flash is inconsistent. A guy that nearly gets beaten by Batman, does get beaten by Batman sometimes, shouldn't be tagging FTL characters.

And I don't know what you're basing this on, but I've never heard of Rail Gun's needing to gain momentum. Snake was looking in the direction of the blast, and saw it coming towards him and dodged accordingly. He can't go off sound, because the blast is faster than sound.

And the Rail Gun feat is a pretty low end reaction time feat for Snake. Missile surfing still reigns supreme.

Deathstroke can deflect bullets, but he's not as fast as Gray Fox, who did it so fast he appeared to stand still. Before he hit puberty, Frank Jaeger was an experienced killer, easily defeating dozens of armed men while he only had a knife.

And no, his suit was not malfunctioning. You really shouldn't believe the words of trolls when you KNOW they're trolls. Dex_Starr was IP banned for a reason.

                   

               

@Cable_Extreme:Your scan of superman stating he couldn't react to deathastrokes scan is edited. The real scan says he didn't think to use it. And 2 out of 3 of your scans are out of context. Your first 1 deathstroke had prep, And your second one deathstroke blasted flash when he wasn't looking and than ran around the corner and when flash got up he didn't notice the staff and just tripped. I think deathstroke wins but those feats don't really prove anything.

@jashro44 said:

@Cable_Extreme:Your scan of superman stating he couldn't react to deathastrokes scan is edited. The real scan says he didn't think to use it. And 2 out of 3 of your scans are out of context. Your first 1 deathstroke had prep, And your second one deathstroke blasted flash when he wasn't looking and than ran around the corner and when flash got up he didn't notice the staff and just tripped. I think deathstroke wins but those feats don't really prove anything.

He's been spamming them in every Deathstroke battle thread he's taken part in. I've already dissected these showings numerous times to no avail. So as harsh as it sounds, I would save your fingers the effort it takes to type on this one ...