Silver surfer vs Superman + Thor

Ok, i'm convinced that without WIS or PIS Superman has a legitimate shot at soloing Surfer. My reasons are thus..... Surfer is hugely powerful... about the only things he can't (or at least shouldn't be able) to do is raise the dead, create life, or (and this is where it starts.....) fight FTL. By definition of powers he can travel and move 99.9% light speed, but once he hit's that 100% level he enters hyperspace. That's how is travel speed's higher than Superman's but necessarily his fight speed must remain below the speed of light or instantly he's in a different dimension.... which could be good or bad depending... he can travel faster than Supes but there's nothing he can do to affect him or be affect by him.

Superman on the other hand, again by definition of powers has no real limit on his speed, be it travel or fight. He can go FTL and beyond without automatically entering some other dimension. A second neat aspect to going FTL is that no known energy exceeds the speed of light.... it just flat can't. Surfer can play with all the energy he wants, but that energy still has that Speed Limit. Surfer can try to drain energy, produce radiation, whatever, but none of that should really do a thing to an FTL Superman, as he's moving significantly faster than any energy.

Surfers best bet to beat Superman is to put some distance between them and somehow teleport him into a Red Sun or something, but even there it's questionable as to whether he could even "Lock On" to something going faster than energy itself. For those reasons I think Supes has a legitimate shot at Surfer, and for Surfer to win he needs to think tactically because going toe to toe with Superman is not a winning proposition for him.

@god_spawn:

And at the same time there are many clear examples that Thor is much faster than any of those guys you claim outrank him in speed.

Thor has many showings of great speed so you can't act like Thor has nothing but guys like Cap and Spidey telling him he's slow.

Looking at the big picture, instead of snap-shot judgements, Thor isn't definitively proven to be slow. Thor bering slow is not even something that's firmly backed up by writers as one the characters core characteristics.

And another thing, Stating a character is moving faster than you while you aren't going full speed does not mean the opponent is faster then you.

It not even like Thor was trying to injure or kill any of them as he easily could have. Against guys of that level, Thor could flex his pinky finger, and end up killing them (except Wolverine).

@dum529001: You reach a lot, twist things out of context and ignore a lot of evidence, don't you?

@god_spawn:

Not really.

I do point out that you aren't being honest though.

I'm not the one doing the twisting here. I just told the truth.

@dum529001: Hmmm, not really.

Why are we using Thir's low end showings to justify saying he's slow? He has engaged Silver Surfer in direct combat multiple times. Silver Surfer isn't blitzing him. End of story.

@cochise said:

So you justify not using Thor's low showings by using Silver Surfer's low showings?

Perfect logic.

@sheenlantern: true that, as for this fight SS kills.

Not sure you were aware but if required i can quote you on panel evidence that Thor is slow (more than 1 set of scans of course), a bio clocking his reaction as pretty slow (although travel speed was pretty good) and a marvel staff (Tom Brevroot, Editor but not very reliable guy though) commenting on Thor's speed, or lack of it there of.

Also most of Thor feats are actually matched by Iron Fist really..

Thor was, under Stan Lee, pretty freakin fast. There are odd instance where Thor is written as pretty fast, one that comes to mind, Blood and Thunder, but there is good evidence to suggest he is slow.

That being said, i understand and respect your opinion because Thor "abilities" is something marvel apparently cant seem to agree, and goes up and down drastically.

Superman is useless against Surfer.

Post-A Surfer wins, as he did with BRB. Pre-A loses, since Thor will sedn more and more powerfull lightnings and he already KOd Surfer with them.

Out of character, Surfer would win thanks to his abiltiy to use his powers in nanoseconds.

If Surfer takes it seriously from the start then he should win.

I can't believe the haters saying that Superman is a non-factor, despite the fact that Superman has beaten Thor.

With morals on, the team takes this easily; heck either could probably solo.

Morals off, Surfer wins because of his speed.

??? How could Superman defeated Thor if they never met? Cross is non-canon to Thor, ergo, at best Superman defeated some alternate version of Thor. And later he couldn't lift Mjolnir anymore, so I wouldn't use that fight as a prove of anything.

Besides, Superman is non factor, because Surfer can one-shot him in few different ways, like depower him or shoot kryptonite beam on him.

Superman is not an enemy for Surfer. Period.

A viner of your caliber should not be such a downplayer. Yes, if Surfer uses kryptonite, it's over, but he doesn't know about it.

If morals are on, Superman is more than an enemy for Surfer.

@logy5000:

It is not about Superman himself, rather about type of his powers. Surfer once met Gladiator and in first second he knew what kind of radiation will put him down. Surfer will know it thanks to his energy-senses and Cosmic Awareness. With blink of the eye (literally) he changed structure of ships that couldn't ran from planet that Galactus was eating, but thanks to Surfer its gravimetric energies were no longer a threat to this people.

If Surfer can summon 1/5 power of our sun with one gesture, he can remove it from Superman even easier. If this would be someone with just Superman's powers, but without his weaknesses, then yeah, it would be much better fight. But Superman is like open book for Surfer and he can do nothing to defend himself from Surfer's powers.

Even Thor has a chance with Surfer only because of magic orgin of his powers, since Surfer can't control magic.

You r Hilarous my friend :D :D :D Supe is non-factor in this fight ha ?!? :D :D :D He is harder, faster, stronger, better ;)

Supe is the main factor in this case ;) ...

Read my post - he is non-factor.

@czarny_samael666 said:

No! He should read my post on why he's a non-factor >:(

Ok.. ok.. we get it... you guys are both pretty :p chill...

(P.S. Read my post instead of their, mine's so much better :p )

I dont need to read your or your post.. I know how superman is and ı think your ''supe=0 in this fight'' idea just hilarious ;) Thnx

Tears are coming to my eyes...

@utkanflash said:

If you think Superman stands any sort of chance against Surfer, then you reallydo need to read our posts.

He is non-factor and its not about being faster(he is not) harder(arguably) stronger(you got this one right) its about the power sets Superman's power set is horrible against Surfer he can see his krypto. and red sun weaknesses instantly with cosmic awareness and can manipulate that energy instantly.

@marlboroman: @sheenlantern: ım never say '' harder,faster,stronger,better against surfer'' always ı was mean Supe against Thor... Your ıdea real thread in this fight against surfer Thor ..You said this...This is your argument right ?!? and ı say..Supe is a big factor in this fight..Just this... Go and get some fresh air men ?!?

@utkanflash: Supes means nothing to SS and he is not faster than SS.

@utkanflash: We've already proven how SS could exploit Superman's weaknesses and kill him in 1 hit, he is not a 'big factor'.

Yeah yeah right... You prove ha :D :D ... Hilarous ... .. If Thor has chance agaisnt Surfer in this figh ( ıthink yes he has)... then Supe has to....

@utkanflash: WHY WON'T YOU LISTEN

According to your logic, if Rock can beat Scissors and Rock gets beaten by Paper, then Paper beats Scissors.

Your argument is incorrectly predicated. SURFER BEATS SUPERMAN BECAUSE HE EXPLOITS HIS WEAKNESSES, THOR DOESN'T HAVE WEAKNESSES, THAT'S WHY THOR STANDS A CHANCE AND WHY SUPERMAN DOESN'T.

Team wins any day. Thor alones beats Surfer

Probably the Team.