Sci Fis vs Warhammer 40k.

People whom might be interested @detrolord@tparks@deadmanwalkin@reikai@doom_phd@boringperson@diredrill@force_echo@mrunsmiley@animephantom@umbranox@citizensentry@jwwprod@killerwasp@jmarshmallow@eisenfauste@dottiestmoon@cjdavis103@vortex14@thedailybagel@wolfrazer@okayalright_44@i_like_swords@penderor@imboredletsdebate@wut@monsterstomp@jestersmiles

@aressword:

40 k easy

@cjdavis103: reasons?

Sci Fis.

@aressword: I'm not as familiar with WH40k. But I know they're haxed.

@aressword: mess affect is a nonfactor due to their ships not having the punch to take on the imperium in the straight battle if this was a campaign to be able to wage a better fight due to other trips but they can Pull but in a single battle they don't have the wait to be anything other than support ships

The CIS and republic fleets fare better And in a campaign they would be able to wage a much better war do two more reliable FT drive. That said again they don't have to punch or the numbers the standup to the entire Imperial Navy even if you throw in the Jedi and the Sith orders

The Borg don't fare any better then the republic or CI S fleet their best bet would have been adaption but that is a campaign long progress and not applicable in the first meeting scenario

The resources the Imperial Navy can bring the bear vastly outweigh and outnumber the allied fleet if this is a campaign I could see them waging a much better guerrilla war for ages essentially and maybe wearing down the imperium to the point where they could win But Ina straight up fight it's not going to happen there going to get their ass kicked

@hatemalingsia: care to explain?

@cjdavis103: Did you read the op? All sci fi fleets vs those specific fleets in the 40k universe. ITs not the whole Imperium fleet, its just those two fleets.

@aressword: how big were those fleets where the major campaigns? Because if it was a minor campaign then I can see the team winning a straight fight at heavy losses

Sci Fis overwhelm Warhammer by a lot.

Too close to call. The imperium is outnumbered, the team is outgunned.

Unless....

The team utilizes kamikaze tactics to take out the Imperium ships.

Mass Effect & Reapers, easily.

Both "fleets" were freaking huge!

3rd War for Armageddon.

Battle Fleet Gothic of the 13th Crusade.

Numbers!

28 Battleships

More info on Battleship types. http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Battleship

183 Cruisers from Grand to Light

(Cruiser Squadrons range around 3 a squadron on average with the occasional Grand Cruisers and/or Battle Cruisers by themselves) More info on Cruiser types. http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Cruiser

348 Escorts from Frigates to Destroyers

(Squadrons range from 2-6 ships. Used average of four for a rough estimate) More info on Escort types. http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Escort

35 Space Marine Battle Barges

(Space Marine Battle Barges hold up to 300 of the best Space Marines of that chapter the Barge belongs too)

253 Space Marine Strike Cruisers

(Strike Cruisers hold up to 100 Space Marines of that chapter the Cruiser belongs too)

35,800 Space Marines

(This is a huge factor as Space Marines are made for ship boarding thanks to Thunder Hawk Gunships and Boarding torpedoes they use)

Ship sizes to all other Sci Fi ships?

Conclusion?

Utter Spite stomp :)

AI hacking? Doubt it would work as easy as one may think on the Machine Spirits of the Adeptus Mechanicus ships.

Each ship as an advance self aware AI with its own personality, and each AI can be bolstered or out right advanced with the presence of any Ad Mech or Tech Marine in the system with it.

It be as easy for them to shoot down Reaper Code as it was for Shepherd to do the same for the Geth/Quarian Home World in Mass Effect 3.

Hmm I can see Imperial Navy winning here.

In all the Navies here Imperial Navy have the firepower supremacy

But the CIS,Republic and Borg have advantage in maneuverability unlike the Imperial Navy who uses warp to get through the galaxy The Sci-fi team can set up ambushes or make a use of hit and run tactics to combat the Imperial Navy.

If team decided to make use of that They might win in a long run. Only if Imperial Navy doesn't have access to Imperial Forge Worlds(Repairs/Resupplies/New Construct)

@cmcmcmcm:

actually no there is only 28 battle ships while the rebulblic has many ships the sise of a star destroyer.

I think after reviewing the numbers that the team can pull a win

Reaper and ME ships run close combat their small size and EW war fare will play havock against the Imperail systems ( each reaper has advanced AI hacking and they have the Geth who are all seintient level AI now ) their small size and In battle FTL will allow them to harras and use cyber warfare to disrupt shields fire solutions and more. there are quite a few ships that the mass effect universe can filde and their small size means the only things that the Iperium can hit them with is point defenses. tryin to hit them with main guns would be like trying to hit a fly with a slege hammer

using this chaos the Star wars combined fleets will advance the CIS droid tech upgraded by the combined efforts of the Borg, reaper and Geth giving them a much more effective fleet. adding in various super weapons that the CIS can filde ( Ion cannon for example) they can become a serious threat for this fleet. their number are much higer then the imperium so they can throw ships to burry the imperium. this is also right on their door step so any planetary resources and defenses can be used to turn the tide

I'm not as familiar with the borg but they can run support broad casting signals for the reapers and the Geth increasing Indoctrination and electronic warfare's power by a large amount while simultaneously adapting the allies tech to the imperium

lets also look at the Normandy there is not a ship in the entire imperium fleet that can hit her she can use EW and point blank Tharix cannon attacks as well as stealth drives and if the imperium uses a psychic attack on them EDI can fly the ship on her own

the team could pull a win here massive casualties on all sides and corrisant will most likely break but the few survivors will be allied

Um what? I stated 28 Battle Ships. Each Battleship has way more firepower, shielding, and size on any of the other ships. Thats not including the 35 Battle Barges which are all equal to a Battleship in power. Add to this the hundreds and hundreds of Cruisers to Escort ships that all match the most powerful ship of the Star Wars franchise in firepower and void shielding.

What would be more helpful if you can give me the ship numbers for Star Wars Clone Wars, I highly doubt there is more than 200 ships total at play there from the TV series portrays it :/ According to Wookiepedia there was 73 listed Jedi Generals. In the Clone Wars show every general seems to have 3 Republic Warships. That only a mere 219 warships that are easily match by the 40K Escorts alone. That is not even a 5th of the total power of the Imperium being used here. And the Star War ships are by far the most powerful of the Sci Fi ship fleets.

As for AI hacking I addressed this. You seriously believe for one second Geth AI or Reaper AI is anywhere close to Necrons and Reality Warping Chaos Ad Mech hacking? Machine Spirits bolstered by Ad Mech/Tech Marines is no joke in the novels when Hacking had became a issue.

None of this matters as much as it should thanks to Space Marines. 10 Space Marines will cut through any warship with ease from the inside out thanks to Teleporters and Boarding Torpedoes. There is literally over 30,000 Marines at play here.

Psychic Attacks, Mind Reading, and Precognition are all things not being accounted for here with the Space Marine Librarians, and Sanction Psykers on board these ships. The 40K Fleet has a better chance to ambush or know an attack is coming than the Sci Fi team.

Also no way the Tharix canon harming a Cruiser or above at all. Those void Shields tank city busting blasts by the droves before falling. One canon strike from a cruiser destroyed a whole city in First Heretic, yet those same canons bounce of the Void Shields over a half hour battles in all novels.

Could swarming their best ships work? Maybe, but I highly doubt it with the other facts into play, and the fact SW/ME/Borg all have way weaker weapons than the Terra Ton tanking Void Shields can and do tank. none of the other ships will last long against Vortex Missile that rend time and space, or the Terra Ton energy blasts of the 40K ships. or the Space Marine boarding parties.

As a knowledgeable expert in 40K, there is some points I can drop here as well.

One the Sci Fi team have no way tracking 40K ships in Warp Space, which is another universe. In the Warp the Psychics can and do sense what is in real space, giving them the ultimate surprise attack edge in any battle.

While Warp Space may seem slow, it only takes a few months to travel the Galaxy, which is still Massively FTL speeds.

common tactic too in 40K ship battles is to hide ships in the Warp, on stand by, and when the ships in real space get attack, the ones in Warp Space drop out to swarm or launch a devastating salvo. All tricks the Sci fi team cannot counter at all.

Most Ad Mech fleets that accompany these fleets are traveling Forge Worlds in their own right, for those extended campaigns in alien territory. Meaning they can resupply or strip a planet for resources with no effort.

@cmcmcmcm:

Um what? I stated 28 Battle Ships. Each Battleship has way more firepower, shielding, and size on any of the other ships. Thats not including the 35 Battle Barges which are all equal to a Battleship in power. Add to this the hundreds and hundreds of Cruisers to Escort ships that all match the most powerful ship of the Star Wars franchise in firepower and void shielding.

Ship for ship 40K is stronger in raw fire power I acknowledged this repeatedlythe key here is numbers that's 63 ships that are that strong and 183 cruisers and 348 escorts this is 6 civilizations of ships each have thousands of ships the imperium is vastly out numbered.

What would be more helpful if you can give me the ship numbers for Star Wars Clone Wars, I highly doubt there is more than 200 ships total at play there from the TV series portrays it :/

that's the TV series alone... that's like using animated superman and compareing him to the silver age version

As for AI hacking I addressed this. You seriously believe for one second Geth AI or Reaper AI is anywhere close to Necrons and Reality Warping Chaos Ad Mech hacking? Machine Spirits bolstered by Ad Mech/Tech Marines is no joke in the novels when Hacking had became a issue.

well neither of them are machines foucoused on tech they use magic to "Hack" and there is the fact that engineers( sorry Tech priests heh) for the Imperium use terms like "Machine spirts" most engineer of every other race here would point and laugh at such simpleminded ideas. they are a middle ages people who are bumbling with tech they have no idea how to use. a competent qurain hacker should out hack a machine spirt and it's assistants. a quarrain hacker that Borg enhanced connected to a network of seintient geth with reaper code will program circles around them. the only hope the imperium has here is that they brute force a win before the allies break the 40 K tech barrier

None of this matters as much as it should thanks to Space Marines. 10 Space Marines will cut through any warship with ease from the inside out thanks to Teleporters and Boarding Torpedoes. There is literally over 30,000 Marines at play here.

EU jedi can defeat Space marines quite soundly Borg and reaper enhanced troops will be more then enough to bog the marines down and take them down with them. ( Im just thinking of the horror a Biotic, Borg and Reaper enhanced heavily armored Krogan dual wilding Light sabers will cause)

and ten space marines vs the Normandy's crew? not a chance in hell

Psychic Attacks, Mind Reading, and Precognition are all things not being accounted for here with the Space Marine Librarians, and Sanction Psykers on board these ships. The 40K Fleet has a better chance to ambush or know an attack is coming than the Sci Fi team.

Can that work on machines? cause that's what almost everyone here will be and they will all be synched by the Geth networking and Cybernetics of the borge and Reapers. I imagen mind Screwing a few billion people at once ( including sentient ships and Jedi and sith ) would prove a daunting task

also want to point out any psycers being used to attack will not be used to navigate

Also no way the Tharix canon harming a Cruiser or above at all. Those void Shields tank city busting blasts by the droves before falling. One canon strike from a cruiser destroyed a whole city in First Heretic, yet those same canons bounce of the Void Shields over a half hour battles in all novels.

that's great that stops the Normandy from fireing at the windows at pint blank ranege how? they have to drop their shields to fire and send out ships so the Normandy and countless fighters can use that opertunity to get in close and play hell with the imperiums ships vital points like say the choir that holds their FTL?

Could swarming their best ships work? Maybe, but I highly doubt it with the other facts into play, and the fact SW/ME/Borg all have way weaker weapons than the Terra Ton tanking Void Shields can and do tank. none of the other ships will last long against Vortex Missile that rend time and space, or the Terra Ton energy blasts of the 40K ships. or the Space Marine boarding parties.

SW weapons have giga to terra ton range weapons

Mass effect have Singularity based weapons that bend time and space

No idea on the borg not a Star treck fan

actally they can ME ships can use FTL on the fly and can do phsyicly impossible maniuverse by useing their Element zero to adjust the mass of their ships even the dreadnaughts can fly circles around almost any ship the imperium has and because they are so small they do not fit the targeting solutions the imperium uses again like hitting a fly with a slege hammer. I would bet good money ME cruisers and smaller could dance around 40 K attacks

SW and Borg can use hit and run tactics as well as their FTL is reliable in short distaince bursts as well

One the Sci Fi team have no way tracking 40K ships in Warp Space, which is another universe. In the Warp the Psychics can and do sense what is in real space, giving them the ultimate surprise attack edge in any battle.

Last I checked that requires that

1. they have acess to the warp which only extends to the 40 k universe which they are not in
2. they stay in warp space which has an army of hungrey deamons trying to kill them
3. they can precisely manage the trip which is not likely
4. that their warpspace is faster then ME FTL drives ,Hyper space jumps and Star treck FTL in short bursts
5. that the commanders would use it standard imperial policy is stand still and slug it out with opponent ( FOR THE EMPIROR!)

common tactic too in 40K ship battles is to hide ships in the Warp, on stand by, and when the ships in real space get attack, the ones in Warp Space drop out to swarm or launch a devastating salvo. All tricks the Sci fi team cannot counter at all.

Admiral Hacket: "any word on cracking their communications?""

Geth communicator: "Yes, there is a 98% chance they are going to launch an attack from these cordients from FTL"

Admiral hacket: "excellent place mines at the emergence point and tell our ships to move"

Handled Hacket out

Most Ad Mech fleets that accompany these fleets are traveling Forge Worlds in their own right, for those extended campaigns in alien territory. Meaning they can resupply or strip a planet for resources with no effort.

the reapers can supply themselves with no need for fuel or rest and creat new solders from the fallen and civains

Borg to can convert civains into solders and use basic materails to assimilate IIRC

SW has an established econemey in universe to use

@cjdavis103:

Ship for ship 40K is stronger in raw fire power I acknowledged this repeatedly the key here is numbers that's 63 ships that are that strong and 183 cruisers and 348 escorts this is 6 civilizations of ships each have thousands of ships the imperium is vastly out numbered.

Numbers mean what? Did you know one Battleship of WW2 can decimate thousands wooden ships with simple canons? Why is that? Superior fire power and defense. 40K Ships can dish out planet killing blows with no issue, and tank said blows as well.

that's the TV series alone... that's like using animated superman and compareing him to the silver age version

This is hilarious laughable since Clone Wars and the Movies are the only true canon to current Star Wars canon. Also have any proof the entire fleet of Republic out number the 40K cruisers alone? Any at all? No? Ok then.

Get real man.

well neither of them are machines foucoused on tech they use magic to "Hack" and there is the fact that engineers( sorry Tech priests heh) for the Imperium use terms like "Machine spirts" most engineer of every other race here would point and laugh at such simpleminded ideas. they are a middle ages people who are bumbling with tech they have no idea how to use. a competent qurain hacker should out hack a machine spirt and it's assistants. a quarrain hacker that Borg enhanced connected to a network of seintient geth with reaper code will program circles around them. the only hope the imperium has here is that they brute force a win before the allies break the 40 K tech barrier

Necrons are not machines? Do you know anything of 40K? Necrons have no psychic or "magic" abilities. Same with Tau. Both factions cannot "hack" the Machine Spirits like you think the Geth or Reapers will in 40K novels.

Until Quarians and Reapers master the ability to transverse time and space, or manipulate molecules on a battlefield scale via tech (Necrons) then your example of who is tech wise superior is flawed. Badly. Also anyone who can prevent hacking via " techno magic", thats a pretty good feat which the Imperials do regularly against Chaos forces. You have no case here, at all.

EU jedi can defeat Space marines quite soundly Borg and reaper enhanced troops will be more then enough to bog the marines down and take them down with them. ( Im just thinking of the horror a Biotic, Borg and Reaper enhanced heavily armored Krogan dual wilding Light sabers will cause)

and ten space marines vs the Normandy's crew? not a chance in hell

WOW.... epic fail. :) in no way can you begin to compare feat for feat at all EU Jedi to Space Marines canon of Black Library and Games Workshop. At all.

Can that work on machines? cause that's what almost everyone here will be and they will all be synched by the Geth networking and Cybernetics of the borge and Reapers. I imagen mind Screwing a few billion people at once ( including sentient ships and Jedi and sith ) would prove a daunting task

Prove it. Your so full of crap man. Untill you can show me how all these races will work and share tech, its all fan boy dreaming. You have no real proof how effective, or even if all the factions here will work like you think. I mean Krogan with Lightsabers? Really? We are really desperate here to find even ground with 40K.

also want to point out any psycers being used to attack will not be used to navigate

This means what? The only people who navigate are the Navigators. All the attacking Psykers are all Sanction Psykers and Librarians. Not the Navigators who have no offensive ability for Psy powers anyway. Do you know anything at all of 40K lore? You seem not too.

that's great that stops the Normandy from fireing at the windows at pint blank ranege how? they have to drop their shields to fire and send out ships so the Normandy and countless fighters can use that opertunity to get in close and play hell with the imperiums ships vital points like say the choir that holds their FTL?

I never seen 40K ship "drop shields". Show me any quote or proof they do? They never been reference to drop Void Shields ever while firing their weapons. Same for Titans in their novels too :/

SW weapons have giga to terra ton range weapons

Proof? Show me one Star Wars battleship (mass produced one at that) one shotting cities, or destroying a planet. Please do, because I know you cannot :)

Mass effect have Singularity based weapons that bend time and space

I played Mass Effect, not once, not ONCE was a singularity used to that size to beat a ship up, hell they cannot even kill armor troops. Nice try.

No idea on the borg not a Star treck fan

You know little of 40K as well.

actally they can ME ships can use FTL on the fly and can do phsyicly impossible maniuverse by useing their Element zero to adjust the mass of their ships even the dreadnaughts can fly circles around almost any ship the imperium has and because they are so small they do not fit the targeting solutions the imperium uses again like hitting a fly with a slege hammer. I would bet good money ME cruisers and smaller could dance around 40 K attacks

Dance around beams of light? Not seeing it anymore than the Eldar, Necrons, or Tau ships that all do not use the Warp, but have Massively FTL speeds dance around Imperial ships. Failed argument.

SW and Borg can use hit and run tactics as well as their FTL is reliable in short distaince bursts as well

No different than Tau, Eldar, or Necrons. Move on.

Last I checked that requires that

1. they have acess to the warp which only extends to the 40 k universe which they are not in
2. they stay in warp space which has an army of hungrey deamons trying to kill them
3. they can precisely manage the trip which is not likely
4. that their warpspace is faster then ME FTL drives ,Hyper space jumps and Star treck FTL in short bursts
5. that the commanders would use it standard imperial policy is stand still and slug it out with opponent ( FOR THE EMPIROR!)

1. LOLOL OMG OMG. Bias much? Not a neutral universe? Wow, your so bias then to think this cannot be set in a neutral universe. Way to gimp 40K to make a point. Failed.
2. Thats why Geller Fields are made. They keep deamons and other Warp creatures out of ships in the warp. I already stated how in novels it is not uncommon for ships to be in the Warp for months with no problems.
3. Its happen many times in novels with ship warfare. I see no reason why a person with little to no knowledge on 40K like yourself thinks otherwise.
4. It took a few months for one ship to traverse over most of the galaxy to a different battlefield in the Last Chancers novel. Your opinions < facts.
5. This is drivel. Space Marines and Imperial Commanders of fleets in MANY Novels I own have shown crazy skill of ship to ship warfare, and the standard creed "for the emperah" of low level ground forces does not change this.

Your truly are new to 40K lore arnt ya?

Admiral Hacket: "any word on cracking their communications?""

Geth communicator: "Yes, there is a 98% chance they are going to launch an attack from these cordients from FTL"

Admiral hacket: "excellent place mines at the emergence point and tell our ships to move"

Handled Hacket out

LOL your not hacking Astropaths newbie. Astropaths are the Psychic communications of the Imperial Fleets. They use Astropaths to communicate to and from the warp. Uuugh....

the reapers can supply themselves with no need for fuel or rest and creat new solders from the fallen and civains

Borg to can convert civains into solders and use basic materails to assimilate IIRC

SW has an established econemey in universe to use

So in your words......

The ME team and Star Wars team will let the Reapers and Borg kill off or pervert all life? Something they are not in character for allowing at all?

Also if Star Wars gets their galaxy to use as commerce, then so should 40K? Unless we want to be bias and find ANY excuse for the Star Wars and other Sci Fi teams win this case at all?

You really have little understanding of the lore of 40K, and show the most bias forming of debating I seen in awhile. I mean, your in rare form today.

@cmcmcmcm:

I don't have time to make a full response but I have to point this out

Area of the fight; Battle over Coruscant; Starting distance is 300,000 km away from each other.

Tell me in which universe is Corouscant located?

If the intention of the OP is to be SW universe, then i give it to the Sci Fi team easy. The loss of the Warp, and the economics play are way too much then. @aressword is this a neutral universe? Or Star Wars Universe?

@cmcmcmcm: still a single battle they can't FTL but they can still fight so they will still inflect damage

@cjdavis103: they would inflict some damage, but there ultimate tactics of using the warp for communications, travel, and attacking a foe that can run and gun all they want is a easy win for the Sci Fi team.

Warhammer should win but starwars and possibly the Borg could give them trouble

@citizensentry: no just no their a non factor

Let me guess, you don't like ME so you low ball as usual. K, gotcha.

Is no one gonna mention the torpedos 40k is equiped with and how destructive they are?

@citizensentry: Are you serious....................... Let me place it again in your terms.

1 MASS EFFECT IS A WEAKER SCI FI THEN PEOPLE THINK. You act like megatons is a BIG THING, WARHAMMER and STAR WARS ARE IN THE GIGATON/TERATRON RANGE depending on the era and weapons. Most ships are for warhammer are in the HIGH GIGATON-TERATON range ( at least for the IoM ) , so how on gods green planet are they going to die to something that only kiloton damage.

2 Cjdavis as well has already pointed out that The Reapers wouldn't even be able to solo the last time u tried to say they would in the 3 vs 3 galaxy war. Why do u think they'd do any better here especially by themselves?!?!

3 Dont even dare pull this "i lowball cause i hate ME" No I strongly dislike the fanboys that are so ignorant and think their sci fi is so AMAZING that it solos stuff that would ONE SHOT THEM.

all in all either provide proof or STOP WANKING ME.

@zombiemowlcher: I would, but knowing the people whom think ME would solo, its simply not worth it.

@killerwasp: there also a stronger universe than you expect in pure tonnage they are much smaller and weaker than most universes however their speed Sublight and maneuverability Far surpasses any other universe due to the element zero affecting their mass

They also make large uses electronic warfare and there they can fight on par with if not better than most high tier sci-fi stories(. Halo Star Wars that kind of level) The reapers indoctrination and subversive tactics make them Great at gurrilla warfare and their foot soldiers are nothing to laugh at either

In a straight battle they don't have the punch the stand up to other science-fiction stories it's only when you get into other means of warfare do you find out that they can actually wage an effecttive war

@cjdavis103: The only thing going for Mass effect is time. I'd agree prolly over time Reapers could out do some of the mid tier sci fis do note even warhammer is mid tier as a sci fi, the other ones being well doctor who level and up where galaxies are chucked at one another and so on. I think ME could beat most basic/standard Star Trek levels and so on, but in this battle doubtful, very doubtful they could solo even an Emperor class Warship which as I've said can throw out gigaton-teraton damage and intake that as well. On top of if allowed the proper starting distance would nail most before they even come within reach. Anyway with Mass effect FTL it isn't as advanced as other so to speak even the slow covenant in slipspace would out do the reapers whom IIRC going like 1.25 lighters/hour which is insanely slow. On top of that the damage at least for the SA is only but half of that of the UNSC, plus the slug thrown is outweighed by a lot. I don't hate ME as stated before, their just put way higher than they should be. A single IoM Battlefleet would win against most other fleets around the same number, and honestly i aint even an IoM fan. Problem is only the borg and star wars factions imo are a threat. IF he had allowed added GE i'd take a solid for the other sci fis due to all the GE fleet being there, but even if it wasn't all there a fleet from the GE isn't totally bad, and depending on who's in charge that GE fleet could beat a standard IoM fleet as well.

I don't know enough about the other races to comment. All I have to say is that 40k army is massive.

@strider92: which armies are you unsure of?

Let me put it this way. I dunno what the CIS Fleet is, I've never played Mass Effect or seen a single episode of Star Trek lol! I've seen them kicking around in the battle forum but I don't think passing knowledge on them qualifies me to debate this.

@strider92: oh XD

@strider92 said:

Sci-Fi. Just find the numbers of droids lol.

@killerwasp:

but in this battle doubtful, very doubtful they could solo even an Emperor class Warship which as I've said can throw out gigaton-teraton damage and intake that as well.

there are plenty of outher ships that need killing and yes direct methods are not likely but Hacking is a vaild option

On top of if allowed the proper starting distance would nail most before they even come within reach. Anyway with Mass effect FTL it isn't as advanced as other so to speak even the slow covenant in slipspace would out do the reapers whom IIRC going like 1.25 lighters/hour which is insanely slow

Long range FTL yes but for their small size they can pull movements that are impossible in sub space and 40K si designed to hit targets far biger then them

. On top of that the damage at least for the SA is only but half of that of the UNSC, plus the slug thrown is outweighed by a lot. I don't hate ME as stated before, their just put way higher than they should be. A single IoM Battlefleet would win against most other fleets around the same number, and honestly i aint even an IoM fan

I support that as I have said IOM has huge ships never denneyed that

. Problem is only the borg and star wars factions imo are a threat. IF he had allowed added GE i'd take a solid for the other sci fis due to all the GE fleet being there, but even if it wasn't all there a fleet from the GE isn't totally bad, and depending on who's in charge that GE fleet could beat a standard IoM fleet as well.

Mass effect is still a factor here due to the EW they can bring to bare and the harassing of Imperium ships

and because this is in the SW universe the IOM does not have FTL and loses many off their communications and psycic attacks

@cjdavis103: "there are plenty of outher ships that need killing and yes direct methods are not likely but Hacking is a vaild option"<-- hacking what exactly? Unless they have warp powers they can't hack anything. The ships are guided by warp powers/psykers while everything else is done by literally thousands of people even loading rounds take tons of people.

Anyway the ship is linked by as i said psykers and the machine spirit, both of which i dont see hacking happening, at least not from these sci fis other than the borg which is still very possible that it would not happen.

"Long range FTL yes but for their small size they can pull movements that are impossible in sub space and 40K si designed to hit targets far biger then them"<-- actually the Necrons and Orks are not that big or don't have that big of ships, heck even the eldar really don't have that big of ships besides their craftworlds. Granted they are most likely bigger than ME and the borg and little bigger than starwars, but in the end thats the big battleships we are talking about not the smaller ones which are still packing tons of fire power, so aiming wont be a problem especially when they have delt with other races and their fleets.

"I support that as I have said IOM has huge ships never denneyed that"<-- this was referring to "there also a stronger universe than you expect in pure tonnage they are much smaller and weaker than most universes however their speed Sublight and maneuverability Far surpasses any other universe due to the element zero affecting their mass"<-- me saying that again their not as strong in this fight is all. Also IOM ships are not that big actually their biggest i believe caps out at the Covenant's Assault carrier. Its the fire power that comes with each round they pack. Technically if we went by size to match power and durability, both star wars and halo would stomp, but due to the writers at least for halo weakens the covenant beyond believe, they don't stomp or win so much.

"Mass effect is still a factor here due to the EW they can bring to bare and the harassing of Imperium ships"<-- they can harass all they want, but in the end i have serious doubts that a fleet at least for SA of IIRC 5,000 is going to do damage to larger ships, i mean yeah i guess they could swarm them, but still. This was also employed by the thought that they would solo as well, so i was making it clear that they couldnt indeed solo.

"and because this is in the SW universe the IOM does not have FTL and loses many off their communications and psycic attacks"<-- this depends on if its in the warhammer universe or not. IF its not in the warhammer universe they can still physically move i do believe, but it makes life difficult as for communications I'm not seeing the force per say doing that because i dont recall jedi ever blocking thoughts from people during battle times but i could be wrong.

@killerwasp: I think you should. Also, the IoM always can access the warp. It's outside of space and time.

@killerwasp:

if everything is done via warp then the ships fall apart because this is the star wars universe and there is no warp

"Machine spirts" are not spirits they are AI or VI or however you want to call them "Tech priests" are people who have only been trained in glorified maintenance theey have no idea what they are dealing with tech wise

and if everything in a 40K ship is done manually then I see no reason why the Team can't just fly and shoot circles around them with far less effort

@zombiemowlcher: Well they do have basic warheads that do tons of weapons place lance guns and so on.

@cjdavis103: "if everything is done via warp then the ships fall apart because this is the star wars universe and there is no warp"<- Not everything is done by warp, its done by as i said a mix of manual stuff and has to be moved by psykers and so on. As i've said i never game them the win i was the one vote who put too close to call.

""Machine spirts" are not spirits they are AI or VI or however you want to call them "Tech priests" are people who have only been trained in glorified maintenance theey have no idea what they are dealing with tech wise"<-- i never said they were, as for the tech priests they were the best at mechs they aint glorified at all, furthermore what i said was thats whats operating the ship along with the Psykers.

"and if everything in a 40K ship is done manually then I see no reason why the Team can't just fly and shoot circles around them with far less effort"<-- starting distance, their own movements, their targeting systems just like anyone else would. My point is ME dont do circles heck they barely move when it comes to that, Star wars as I've said is known for tactics just like warhammer. ME is as well, but when u watch the cutscenes they dont do the tactics nor display them hardly ever. They do little formations which is fine, but nothing for an actual ship movement. At least in star wars they have displayed a decent amount of tactics and so on.

This is flat out wrong. While the common man of the Imperium have little clue to tech, the Tech Marines and Tech Priest have a huge understanding of technology.

There are the guys who make new tech, disassemble Xeno Tech, and maintain or repair current Imperium Tech. Sure both treat tech like Religious icons, but the fact is they show understanding of tech, able to repair it, reverse engineer alien tech, and in many cases able to create new tech like the Tech Marines in the Soul Drinker novels or the Marines of the Silver Skulls in another novel. The admech also showed the ability to create new tech to beat the Necrons in the Hell Forge novel.

So this misinformation of Imprium being totally clueless about tech is quite wrong.

@cjdavis103: @cmcmcmcm: @killerwasp: For the sake of the argument the planet is somewhere in the warhammer galaxy, unaffected by any outside force.

@cmcmcmcm: Well i guess u just show it anyway was gonna wait for the request for proof, but yep just throw it out there. XD

@aressword: If that's the case with a warp cleared up and such, the Navies of the IoM should not only be able to dodge easier, but should be able to most likely pull out a solid win against due to tactics and such.

Imperial Navy wins by a landslide.

With the Warp, I agree.