Sage of Six Paths Naruto vs Sage of Six Paths Madara

I've been seeing this from quite a number of people saying that Naruto and Sasuke have surpassed Sage of Six Paths Madara but has they really?

Location

Valley of The End

Conditions

Madara has a full set of Truth Seeking balls and has both his Rinnegan along with his Third eye while Naruto also has a full set of Truth Seeking Balls.

Scenario I

Both sides are in Character and Infinite Tsukuyomi is restricted

Scenario II

Both sides are Blood lusted and Infinite Tsukuyomi is unrestricted

Have Naruto and Sasuke finally surpassed Madara or is Madara still superior?

In my Opinion Madara just one-shots with Infinite Tsukuyomi like he did in cannon except Sasuke isn't here to save him this time.

Madara.

Naruto with the So6P's power?

He was holding his own against Kaguya who is >>>> So6P Madara.

Naruto wins.

If Naruto doesn't have Sasuke's left eye he isn't winning Sasuke having to shield him shows he is vulnerable to the mugen tsukyomi but even when they were fighting Madara Naruto and Sasuke both needed to get through his Limbo clones too many here for Naruto alone

Naruto already beat Toneri who's moon level. Naruto stomps Madara

If this is pre EoS Naruto then Naruto gets stomped

@minaruto: Naruto wasn't holding his own. He was just tricking her with Shadow Clones. Lol!

Let me remind you that Madara can also make both Mokuton and Limbo clones and he can tell the difference between the Clone and the original. Mokuton also comes in handy here. Madara can make mokuton clones and he can send back Naruto TBB right back at him.

@josephgomes619: Just to tell you that Naruto isn't nowhere near as strong as the Naruto that faced Sasuke in fact he would get one-shotted.

Let's see Naruto didn't use his strongest instead he used BSM and he didn't even use his Kurama avatar and he beat Toneri by just a Punch while a weaker version of Madara took the Eight Gates Head on and still survived. The Naruto is nowhere near as strong as Six Paths Naruto. By the way Toneri he's way below Madara's level.

Madara can't use Infinite Tsukiyomi, that takes a lot of prep time and perfect timing.

As for the "Tricking her with shadow clones" excuse, tell me, could he not do the same to Madara? He clearly restrained Madara's limbo clones, and Naruto could very easily take on Madara himself, especially with the power he displayed. He might not have been fighting Kaguya evenly, but Madara was far weaker than what Kaguya was.

@conner_wolf: Madara just creates a Barrage of Chibaku Tensei like he did before and Limbo clones will keep Naruto's clones busy while Madara goes and cast Infinite Tsukuyomi and this time Sasuke isn't there to save him.

The reason that wouldn't work against Madara is because Madara can tell the difference between Shadow clones so he'll just go after the original which if he hits the Original hard enough all the other clones will dispel plus he can counter them with Limbo Clones and Mokuton Clones or Madara can just eradicate them all at once with Shinra Tensei which would make all the clones dispel.

Didn't The Sage himself Amp Naruto's Power?

@darkslumber: Do you realize how many clones Madara would have to make? It's not like he can just make clones forever if he needs time to create the Infinite Tsukuyomi, especially since Naruto could just make even more clones, and even more clones after that, and send all the attacks in the world Madara's way.

And you're assuming he can hit Naruto hard enough to dispel the clones in one shot, if Kaguya couldn't tell the difference with the Byakugan, how could Madara?

And Naruto can send any number of Rasenshurikens his way to decimate himm.

@conner_wolf: Madara could already tell the difference between clones when he and Naruto clashed. It's something that only he can do.

Madara has more than enough Chakra to make a shit ton of clones. In his Edo form he could make 25 Wood Clones using V3 Legged Susano'o. In his Final form he could very well replicate that feat except by using Perfect Susano'o due to the fact he pretty much has an external source of Chakra and Naruto who has way less Chakra than Madara was able to make 3 Kurama Clones. For each Clone Naruto makes they get weaker since he has to divide up the Chakra so there not as strong as lets say if Naruto made 5 Clones.

Shinra Tensei would dispel the clones instantly and would stop and Rasenshuriken coming at him. Plus Madara can absorb most of Naruto's attacks.

http://i26.mangareader.net/naruto/601/naruto-3582823.jpg

Right here he instantly can tell that Naruto is a clone.

BSM Naruto beat Toneri who is equal to Juubidara. Rikudou Naruto takes this.

@etheral_dreams: It was never stated that Toneri was equal to Madara. Madara was never even mentioned in the Movie. BSM Naruto in the Movie is weaker than Six Paths Naruto who fought against Madara plus Madara was also taking on both Six Paths Naruto and Rinnegan Sasuke at the same time.

@darkslumber: More than enough Chakra, yes, but Naruto can make just as many clones to the power of ten. That's like, his go-to ability, and if you want Madara to use the time to summon a tree, then you have to know he can't just sit there, you can't just sit there in a fight no matter how many clones you create.

Remember when Pain tried to destroy all the clones like that? Yeah, didn't work.

And Naruto could come in and break through the Susanoo, his attacks were clearly able to damage Sasuke through his own Susanoo.

And Wood Clones vs Kurama Clones are two very different things.

@conner_wolf: Yeah but the problem is Naruto's clones become weaker for each clone he makes. Infinite Tsukuyomi parallelizes you first which means Naruto won't be able to move so the tree just comes over there and swoops him up.

Pain is a very bad example because first of all that wasn't the same Shinra Tensei that Pain used to destroy the leaf. If Naruto got hit by that he'd be dead. Look at the difference between Pain's Chibaku Tensei and Madara's Chibaku Tensei. The same Difference applies to Shinra Tensei.

Madara's Susano'o in his final form would actually be stronger than Sasuke's. Like I said before the Match wouldn't even go that far. Madara uses Chibaku Tensei like he did in cannon have them rain while he goes and casts Infinite Tsukuyomi which would One-shot Naruto.

Wood Clones that can Potentially use Perfect Susano'o vs Kurama Clones aren't actually very different at all.

@darkslumber: But again, he needs time to make the tree

I confuse the two a lot, you'll have to forgive me for that.

And Wood clones have the same weakness as shadow clones, it dispels energy, the more energy Madara uses to create the tree.

And I stated this at the beginning, Madara would need to be performing this during the Full Moon at the same time, at night.

So what's that? A 1/56 chance of him being able to use this technique at all?

And then on top of that, Naruto can contain himself in his chakra, like Susanoo, which has a definite possibility of keeping him out of it, and it only stays there for a few moments. Should Naruto keep this up, he would be able to resist it.

How would it be stronger than Sasuke's? Please do explain why it'd suddenly be stronger than Sasuke's, especially when he had all of Madara's powers, and the Yin Power to make up for the lack of Kyubi.

And then there's the fact that only one fraction of Naruto's power was able to tear apart the tree.

And of course, Naruto still has his ability to merge natural energy with his most powerful attacks, allowing him to counter all of the attacks that normally wouldn't work on Madara.

@conner_wolf: It's not the moon that puts you in the Genjutsu it's the light that does. The Moon is always out it's just you can't see it and considering in the Last we have ninjas fighting in space Madara doesn't have a problem.

No Naruto Can't resist Infinite Tsukuyomi. The only reason Sasuke's Susano'o was able to keep out the light from Infinite Tsukuyomi because his Susano'o was working in conjunction with his Rinnegan which allows him to immune to Infinite Tsukuyomi.

It would be stronger than Sasuke's do to the fact that Susano'o becomes stronger and Weaker due to how powerful the persons Chakra is. Same thing applies to Naruto's Kyuubi avatar. After each of them getting 50% of The Sage of Six Paths Chakra Sasuke's Susano'o was cutting up Island sized Meteors like butter. Madara has Six Paths Sage Mode Boosting + Juubi Chakra + Sage of Six Paths Chakra boosting his Susano'o while Sasuke only has Sage of Six Paths Chakra making his Susano'o stronger. That would put him above Sasuke's regular Perfect Susano'o.

Wait a minute what tree are we talking about? I'm getting confused here.

@darkslumber: It needs to be reflected off of the Moon for it to work.

How does he had sage of the six paths mode, plus the sage of the six paths chakra? That makes no sense. At most he had Jyubi Chakra and Sage Chakra, but both were broken versions of the chakras.

Naruto has sage chakra, and chakra from all nine tailed beasts, plus if you wanna use modes, sage mode chakra, and sage of the six path mode chakra.

Sasuke's was clearly equal to Naruto's at this level.

The tree that Madara created, ya know, the one with the giant Sharingan in it or something that absorbed people's chakra.

Hmm, Goku.

@conner_wolf: It needs to be reflected off the Moon but when it's reflected it causes a bright light that encompasses the entire world and it can shine through anything except Sasuke's Susano'o and it affects everybody except somebody with a Rinnegan and Edo Tensei. It's the light that puts you in Infinite Tsukuyomi not the eye showing up on the moon.

You get Six Paths sage mode when you become the Ten Tails Host and when Madara awakened the Rinnegan he also got Sage of Six Paths Chakra. Hagoromo said it himself.

Naruto's Six Paths Chakra is what gives him Sage of Six Paths mode. There one in the same. If that was the case he would've been overpowering Sasuke's Perfect Susano'o but they were actually equal.

The God Tree was absorbed by Madara after he took the hit from Naruto Lava Rasenshuriken. After he absorbed it he gained a massive boost in power and he gained Immortality in which he would have to be sealed by the Moon and Sun Seals which Naruto doesn't have so the only way to defeat Madara is to pull the Bijuu out of him but that's not gonna happen when he would need to weaken him to a certain point but even if he try's to Madara will just interrupt him with Limbo thus stopping the process.

You're not understanding the way Infinite Tsukuyomi works is that the Light that encompasses the world which stuns you and catches you in the Genjutsu and then the Roots of the tree grab you and start sucking away your Chakra while your dreaming. It doesn't matter how long it takes to summon the tree Naruto's stuck in the Genjutsu either way.

@darkslumber: How do you know Sasuke's wasn't just that powerful?

Besides, it was made clear that Madara's own power was very artificial, it was very broken compared to the actual power of the sage, plus, Naruto has a legitimate Sage mode to enhance his abilities. Even the ten-tails wasn't at full power and his "sage chakra" was artificial, using combined Senju and Uchiha chakras, not the Sage of the Six Paths himself. The only thing of his own is the Rinnegan.

And Naruto was able to combat Obito with only the single Kyubi Chakra against the entire Ten-Tails Chakra, the Rinnegan, and the Sharingan.

In other words, it's quality, not quantity.

Speaking of pulling the Bijuu out of him, Naruto actually gained sealing techniques from Shukaku, which means yes, he could remove the seal entirely should Madara be weakened enough.

And you bring up Limbo clones, Naruto had no trouble restraining those with his chakra.

Plus, it was said that Naruto gained many abilities of the sage, including the Tensei techniques, as he displayed when bringing Gai back to life, with absolutely no practice of the techniques.

Yes, but you still need to be in the perfect position, you need it all to be in place, and the Infinite Tsukuyomi, as I pointed out, would not be a viable option in a fight between these two parties.

And otherwise, it's just normal Genjutsu, which Naruto has broken before. If he can use the Tsukuyomi like any other Genjutsu, why not just use it all the time? Clearly he can't.

Bump

@etheral_dreams: @conner_wolf: @frisky4: @josephgomes619: @darkslumber: Madara doesn't need the moon or any prep to do Infinite Tsukuyomi.

Madara's Limbo clones defeated Naruto's shadow clones. Madara's limbo can also kill them apparently.

@loki_d: I said Goku....

But I can see that that is wrong.

Raiden wins.

Yes you are learning but I'd prefer batgod or solo king itachi

@loki_d:

Nah, Raiden is at least 10x the speed of light, he can easily win here.

Here's an example of how the fight would go:

Okay im seeing alot of madara would be able to tell tge difference in naruto's clones here but everyone is forgetting something kaguya possessed not only the tensai(might be spelled incorrect)byukugan but also the the rinne-sharingan as a third eye. If neji could see through naruto's clones in part one with his byukugan, why couldnt kaguya tell the difference then,she also possessed the rinne-sharigan so seeing past his clones shouldve been easy but she couldnt.( reason why idk), but if kaguya who had the exact same eyes as madara couldnt see through the clones then neither would madara. Also to tackle the clone theory and infinite tsukyomi attack madara would need the moon too be full in order to use I.T. without that neccessary requiremet its a complete loss on his part. Madara didnt even show half the abilities that kaguya did(reason for that would be kaguya had byukugan and madara had rinnegan as bases for their eyes and as we can easily point out simply through the battle of sasuke and naruto vs kaguya, and the battle of sasuke and naruto vs madara, madara was easier for them to deal with also the fact that madara's limbo clones were weak against sage jutsu puts madara at an even greater disadvantage against naruto. Now if naruto were to simply create a chakra beast form based off the power of all nine tailed beast (we see he can utilize all nine tailed beasts powers at will) he would thrash madara's incomplete ten tail six paths sage mode easily. It seems alot of people forget that the ten tails madara used was still an incomplete version seeing as it did not possess the other half of the nine tails chakra(which was in minato then given to naruto). This one very important detail gives naruto the upper hand in terms of tailed beast power since naruto has complete power of each tailed beast in him, madara's rinnegan would allow him to probably predict all of naruto's moves but as we saw in naruto and sasuke's final fight, not even sasuke could predict naruto's movement as he did in their first fight at the valley of the end. now going straight up naruto+sage mode+complete tailed beast power+six paths sage mode vs madara+rinnegan+rinne-sharingan+incomplete tailed beast+six paths sage mode=Naruto's win.oh and for those saying limbo clones can stop naruto, ease remember sasuke classified limbo clones as a ninjutsu and naruto possesses truth seeking balls which do what again, destroys,negates,dissolves,dispell(whichever you wanna use)all ninjutsu used against it except sage jutsu and as far as sage jutsu goes seeing as madaras own six sage power is not originally his, its only through hashirama's cells and his own that he even awakened the rinnegan, his sage power unlike naruto's is not complete

Naruto in fact not just hold off against Kaguya but he fought on spar with her actually. He broke her arm and make her lost control over the power. If Kaguya wasnt immortal then perhaps Naruto could have won at that point. Also, during the battle with Sasuke, Sasuke absorbed the tailed beasts chakra in which he is now possessed both rinnegan and tailed beasts' power like Madara. Kurama also said that Sasuke is as strong as the Sage of six paths at that point. But Naruto in a weakened state still defeated Sasuke. Thus, The hokage Naruto late who improved his abilites + 100% nine tails chakra in him now is probably the second strongest after Kaguya due to the fact that he cant seal Kaguya on his own.

Madara.

For people who have been talking about the infinite tsukuyomi as the battle key. The technique can only at night time because thats when Madara has the moon light to reflect. So technically, if the battle was day time then Naruto would win.

Due to Gen jutsu. I say Mads had the upper hand.

Madara = Toneri < Naruto. Its already confirmed in the movie so there shouldnt be any argument LOL.

@monkey1992: How many times do I have to say this.

Madara isn't equal to Toneri. Madara was never even mentioned in the Movie or any of the Databooks for the Movie. Somebody wrote that on Wiki a while back based off fake spoilers of the Movie. Madara isn't equal to Toneri.

The Sage wins

@darkslumber: Page 18-21 of the guide book has that. Go look for it. Until then, no comment.

Backing Naruto at the end of the day, both rounds.

Madara isn't equal to Toneri, he's stronger.

@monkey1992: I have read it and the only thing it says is that Madara stole the Gedo Mazo from the Moon.

Madara logically wins he had the body + the eyes of the sage along with the 9 bijju while naruto only had the body of the sage with a PORTION of the 9 bijju

Madara has 3 rinnegan? Madara stomps. Not even Kaguya can beat this Madara (Madara aint a retard like Kaguya)

@josephgomes619: No Kaguya stomps this Madara he got taken out by a black zetsu if we're gonna talk about being an idiot.. She dimension dumps him... Kaguya > Madara > S06P Naruto >= So6P Sasuke

Madara. He's a better character and I like him more. Yes I'm being biased

Kaguya got taken out by Sakura

3 rinnegan Madara >>> retard Kaguya. Madara can do everything Kaguya can + he has a brain

@thevivas: Why do you think so? Not disagreeing I'm just wondering.

@highaccuser: I just think he would win. Lol. He was doing pretty good against him before the IT was activated.

@thevivas: Well Madara only had one eye then.

Naruto takes this, Madara's was artificial and hindered because of it.