Sage of Six Paths Madara vs Toneri

VS

Location: Valley Of The End

Intel: Both Sides have full intel of each other

Scenario 1

Infinite Tsukuyomi is restricted

Both are in Character

Scenario 2

Infinite Tsukuyomi is unrestricted

Both Characters are bloodlusted

Toneri doesn't have sage mode so he can't break the Gudoudama's.

Moon busting firepower isn't enough.

#logic.

GG.

By Power scaling it seems Madara is stronger.

Madara was going toe to toe with both Sage of Six Paths Naruto and Rinnegan Sasuke while Toneri lost to BSM Naruto. Then again Toneri did split the Moon in half.

@noone301994: That's no limit fallacy. It's like saying Frieza can't beat Madara. Madara hasn't shown he can regenerate from absolute molecular destruction. If he can't absorb Toneri's attack, he gets killed

I'd go to Madara with high difficulties

Reason is ^^

Toneri was said to be as strong as Madara in the movie. Feat wise, Toneri is stronger

@josephgomes619: This is immortal Madara the one who absorbed the shinju (which Kaguya was inside) therefore it will be like he is fighting someone on Kaguya's level. He regenerated from the night guy which turns you into nothing his whole left side was gone but thanks to his regeneration he recovered quickly. Plus Toneri lost to a less powerful Naruto.

Also Limbo nuff said.

Toneri was said to be as strong as the Madara you mentioned. Kaguya >>> Madara, not even close. Naruto still had sage powers as some people say, and Naruto obviously got stronger in the timeskip. Early Part 2 Naruto was hill level, Final VoTE Naruto was Large country/continent level

@josephgomes619: Toneri was said to be "as strong as" Madara.. correct but that doesn't mean he has the skill and techniques to go up against him. Many factors come into play

Sorry, by that logic Madara can also beat Kaguya because Kaguya is dumber than a 3 year old kid, even though Kaguya was stated to be stronger.

Toneri and Madara have equal hype, while Toneri has better DC and Madara has better haxx thanks to rinnegan. Madara hasn't shown he can tank moonbusting attacks, that's why Toneri wins. Madara got owned pretty bad by Black Zetsu, Toneri losing to Naruto is a better showing than losing to BZ

@josephgomes619: Was it stated which Form of Madara he was on par with?

Madara's Final form is on par with the Sage of Six Paths.

Yes, Naruto fought the final version of Madara. By saying on par with Madara it means the strongest version of Madara. Anyway, Toneri stomps Madara by feats alone

Who and what is Toneri? What episode?

Bot Kaguya cen distroy dimenshons and werlds. Tey are at celestial nd galactus lvl. Kishmodo steted tat notin bot sage mode cen brake them nd truth balls cent be broekn so wut he says goes. HERP DERP. Rite @randell1985?

Kishimoto said it doesn't matter what you throw at it. only natural energy can destroy truth seeking balls that is a fact. he has said it doesn't matter how powerful the attack is if there is no natural energy in the attack it will not break them you could shoot planet destroying beams at it and as long as there is no natural energy in them it will not harm the truth seeking balls

Truth seeking balls can be broken by Taijutsu easily. Kaguya gets one shotted by Toriko/Hulk

@josephgomes619: Naruto didn't even use his strongest form against Toneri and he beat him.

Naruto was using BSM powered up by Sage of Six Paths Chakra.

It's obvious Sage of Six Paths Mode>BSM.

Madara could keep Toneri busy with Chibaku Tensei, Limbo/Wood Clones while he goes and casts Infinite Tsukuyomi

@josephgomes619: Naruto has fought edo madara, alive madara, as well as rikudo madara. He could be talking about any one of them. Considering bijuu sage mode is nowhere near enough to beat sage mode madara, one of the first two seems more likely.

Also.. early part 1 naruto hill level? How?

@ironshinobi88: he's from the last naruto movie..

@darkslumber: I don't remember anyone except madara putting his final form on sage's level.. Sasuke's indra susano, however, was on that level..

Madara can't keep anybody busy. Madara's speed feats aren't too impressive. Madara got blitzed and slashed by Sasuke in half

By hype Toneri = Madara as stated in the movie. By feats, Toneri >> Madara. However rinnegan has decent amount of haxx that would allow Madara to live for a while

Naruto got a lot stronger in 2 year timeskip. Early part 2 Naruto was a hillbuster, EoS VoTE Naruto is a large country/continent buster. Training helps a lot

@josephgomes619: Madara didn't get blitzed by Sasuke he just let it happen because he was trying to get to the other Dimension and he would've gotten there faster with half a body.

Toneri can't even really Kill Madara because Madara can only be defeated two ways extract the tailed beats out of him or Seal him away and he can only be sealed by the Moon and Sun Seals.

He can easily keep him busy, The Chibaku Tensei Madara used he did those casually without any effort plus he called them raindrops and they were country level but they were only meant to serve as a distraction which implies that his full powered Chibaku Tensei is off the charts.

The Rinnegan's also got some Major Hax. If Madara manages to get a hand on him then he gets Soul Ripped.

@loki_d: I think that was debunked recently by somebody that saw the Movie but don't quote me on that.

@darkslumber: Sasuke blitzed Madara and there's no sugar coating it...lol

@vintage_spiderman: With his teleportation he was blitzing him left and right when he got cut in half that was not a blitz. Madara saw him coming and could've reacted in so many different ways.

I just watched the Movie

Here's what each Dojutsu gives you

Rinnegan

Deva Path (Chibaku Tensei, Shinra Tensei & Banshō Ten'in)

Preta Path

Asura Path

Naraka Path

Human Path

Animal Path

Outer Path (Control Gedo Mazo, Rinne Tensei, Can use Bodies as Puppets)

Limbo Border Jail

Tenseigan

Tenseigan Chakra Mode (Silver Wheel Rebirth Explosion and Other)

Truth Seeking Balls

Telekinesis (Similar to Shinra Tensei & Banshō Ten'in)

Can Control People like Puppets

Golden Wheel Reincarnation Explosion

Toneri would give Rinnegan Madara without the Juubi or One Eyed Sage o Six Paths Madara a Good fight but Toneri would get stomped by Final Form Madara

Double Rinnegan? Madara stomps.

Naruto: The Last takes place two years after the end of the manga. Naruto has gotten a lot stronger, so powerscaling from the great ninja war won't work.

@mastermustard: Obviously Naruto got stronger but the Naruto we saw in the last was BSM Naruto. In this case powerscaling does work due to the fact BSM Naruto in the Last isn't stronger than Six Paths Mode Naruto in the War-Arc.

Madara..

Not only he was in Bijuu mode against toneri, kurama was fighting the stone statue at the moment. Toneri was practically punched out by naruto...

Madara would stomp him. Naruto fodderized Toneri, with a punch.

Madara's Truth-Seeking Balls don't exactly stop Toneri's attacks since he uses Truth-Seeking Balls a lot, like Golden and Silver Wheel Reincarnation Explosions. He can also apparently read minds, I'm not sure how well he can use it in the middle of a fight however.

But the game changer here is what Toneri did to Naruto. Toneri was able to strip Naruto of his Six Paths Sage Mode in the movie via chakra absorption, I'm sure he can do the same to Madara to take his Six Paths Ten-Tails Coffin Seal form, as it stems from the Six Paths Sage Technique just like Naruto's Six Paths Sage Mode. Toneri can take Madara's Six Path Powers by absorbing his chakra.

Doing this would make Madara substantially weaker, at best he retains a limited control over Truth-Seeking Balls, his own Truth-Seeking Balls disappear themselves. He also should lose senjutsu chakra, seeing as he wouldn't have any senjutsu chakra prior to using the Six Paths chakra, therefore he loses any ability to combat Toneri's Truth-Seeking Balls.

I don't see Madara's Susanoo surviving a moon-cutting Truth-Seeking Ball sword, maybe since Naruto and Sasuke were in a similar situation with Obito and the Sword of Nunoboko.

Sure, Madara still has his two Rinnegan and therefore can use Limbo: Border Jail, but Toneri, who has full knowledge of Madara would use his thousands of puppet to distract the Limbo Madaras, which especially works due to their ability to operate on their own. Toneri can also summon the Statue of the Otsutsuki Clan, which could withstand a Tailed Beast Ball, regenerate and create meteors to rain down. Unlike Naruto, Madara doesn't have a Nine-Tails Chakra Mode to fall back upon once his six paths powers are taken away.

Madara lolstomps. All Toneri did was split the moon in half big deal. Madara is more haxed and smarter.

This

I'm going with Madara.

I'm going with Madara, but neither of them would be able to use the Gudou Damas probably.

Why?

Gudou Damas are shown to block other Gudou Damas, and Naruto even physically kicked one, meaning that the users of that technique are rendered immune to its effects.

Naruto's physical immunity to the Truth-Seeking Balls is attributed to his Six Paths Sage Mode I believe, at least according to the wikia(no one bring up the "wikis are unreliable" card), I'm sure it applies for Madara's Coffin Seal as well. Truth-Seeking Balls obviously will be able to block one another, they're made of the same material and are generally spherical in most cases so more or less equal then. Doesn't really matter though, Toneri is likely able to take Madara's Six Path powers, making Madara lose Truth-Seeking Balls.

@hadeswubsu: Anybody who can use Truth Seeking balls are Immune to the effects of them. Madara's Limbo Clone was able to block Naruto's Truth Seeking Balls Stick without his Arm being erased.

'immune' is a strong word, though. He was hurt from the attack:

@princearagorn1: If it was any other clone or Person the Truth Seeking would've erased the Arm used to block that.

It was an attack none the less so he still got harmed by it.

true, just saying he isn't 'immune' to them, highly resistant.

Madara by scaling.

Madara.

@darkslumber: In chapter 640, half of Obito's body is destroyed by his Truth-Seeking Ball. Obito is notably not in complete control but he is a user of Truth-Seeking Balls and half of his body was destroyed by one, Madara's Limbo Clone obviously has advantages over Madara himself, such as when one Limbo Clone could hit all nine tailed beasts while he was alive and before he got the Coffin Seal and I previously attributed Naruto's resistance against Truth-Seeking Balls to his Six Paths Sage Mode.

@hadeswubsu: Obito didn't even have control back then. His Truth Seeking balls weren't I would say functioning at full capacity. For example when he blew off Half of Hiruzen's body he was still able to regenerate and come back but when Minato got his Arm cut off after Obito gained control he couldn't regenerate his arm back.

When Madara got smashed into his own truth seeking ball shield by Guy the only damage he took was from Guy's Punch the Truth Seeking Balls didn't harm him in anyway.

@darkslumber: Madara wasn't quite using his Truth-Seeking Ball as an offense, hence the fact he used it as a shield. The only thing that appears to be wrong with Obito's Truth-Seeking Balls prior to gaining control is a use Yin-Yang Release. Obito is still in his Coffin Seal, he gained nothing from getting control other than the ability to properly use Yin-Yang Release, he doesn't automatically gain immunity to Truth-Seeking Balls. Though, as a piece of speculation, Truth-Seeking Balls are ninjutsu(as stated in the Fourth Databook), likely the way Naruto and possibly Madara's Limbo Clone used Yin-Yang Release to nullify the Truth-Seeking Balls' ability to turn things to mere dust. In which case this immunity would definitely apply to Toneri. Thus the Truth-Seeking Balls in this battle would merely just be regular weapons in essence.(Except I keep saying Toneri can take away Six Path powers anyway so Madara would lose the Truth-Seeking Balls he got from the Coffin Seal, though as Obito demonstrated he can still somewhat use Truth-Seeking Balls.)

Toneri. As said, he is a moonbuster.

? madara has the juubi in him. Juubi>>tenseigan.

Naruto beat toneri without too much trouble, without Ashura cloak, without kyubi. Madara was fighting both ashura naruto/indra sasuke..

Whats a juubi?