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#1 Edited by Golden Superman (415 posts) - - Show Bio

 
 

                                                                                                       
                                                                              VS
 
 
Who would win in a fight?
#2 Posted by comicdude23 (11331 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder Woman. Overkill.

#3 Posted by venomoushatred1001 (12273 posts) - - Show Bio
@comicdude23 said:
Wonder Woman. Overkill.

Aye.
#4 Posted by Aqua11500 (2632 posts) - - Show Bio

LOL if WW blitz she wins,if she hesitates or goes for a regular approach she gets her emotions drained and  her soul is useless or gets some type of dark magic dropped on her ass.
 
Raven wins if this was a regular comic fight actually written by a good writer. Because of her powerset she has an instant win over Diana and the fact that she cloud BFR  Diana a number of ways.Blitzing is really a cheat move to me..but whatever. 
 
IMO Raven is the better character. :) 
 
Diana 8/10

#5 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio

Somebody doesn't understand how Raven's powers work. 
 
WW stomps

#6 Posted by Roddy010 (5429 posts) - - Show Bio

WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....

#7 Posted by comicdude23 (11331 posts) - - Show Bio
@Roddy010 said:
WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....
No. Wonder Woman has strength, skill, lightning etc.
#8 Posted by Roddy010 (5429 posts) - - Show Bio
@comicdude23 said:
@Roddy010 said:
WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....
No. Wonder Woman has strRavenength, skill, lightning etc.
Raven's the most powerful empath in the DCU, she  also has teleportation, intangability, magic and  other mental abilities to  take her down....WW has tfhe speed and strength advantage which is  why she wins this battle...
#9 Posted by comicdude23 (11331 posts) - - Show Bio
@Roddy010 said:
@comicdude23 said:
@Roddy010 said:
WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....
No. Wonder Woman has strRavenength, skill, lightning etc.
Raven's the most powerful empath in the DCU, she  also has teleportation, intangability, magic and  other mental abilities to  take her down....WW has tfhe speed and strength advantage which is  why she wins this battle...
1. Show her empathy feats. And mental ability feats.
2. Wonder Woman has strength, speed, durability, weapons, knowledge, skill, experience.  
3. Even if she didn't blitz, she could use her lasso, maybe Zeus's lightning, use her strength for KO, etc.
#10 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio

WW would win easilly by blitz. 
In an actual comic book fight, depending on the scenario ofc, i could see Raven winning by either teleporting Diana somewhere else or go through with the treat she once made of feeling her the pain and suffering the planet feels. Making it akin to what Jeanette pulled off with her banshee scream.

#11 Posted by Roddy010 (5429 posts) - - Show Bio
@comicdude23 said:
@Roddy010 said:
@comicdude23 said:
@Roddy010 said:
WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....
No. Wonder Woman has strRavenength, skill, lightning etc.
Raven's the most powerful empath in the DCU, she  also has teleportation, intangability, magic and  other mental abilities to  take her down....WW has tfhe speed and strength advantage which is  why she wins this battle...
1. Show her empathy feats. And mental ability feats.2. Wonder Woman has strength, speed, durability, weapons, knowledge, skill, experience.  3. Even if she didn't blitz, she could use her lasso, maybe Zeus's lightning, use her strength for KO, etc.
  1. She was able to manipulate the emotions of every Amazonian (including Wonder  Woman) and healed Darkseid, She mindraped The  Disruptor (Michael Beldon) into a comatose state, She once said that she could summon  the agony of all humanity when threatening some thugs she was mindraping....
  2. This is why I say she wins speed being the major factor...
  3. Raven can become intangiable that lasso will go staright through her....
#12 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio
@Roddy010 said:
@comicdude23 said:
@Roddy010 said:
WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....
No. Wonder Woman has strRavenength, skill, lightning etc.
Raven's the most powerful empath in the DCU, she  also has teleportation, intangability, magic and  other mental abilities to  take her down....WW has tfhe speed and strength advantage which is  why she wins this battle...
Raven's like the only empath in the DCU.  She doesn't use her teleportation in battle, she can't become intangible, she knows next to no magic and has no mental abilities.
#13 Posted by Buckshot (18678 posts) - - Show Bio

@Zoom said:

Somebody doesn't understand how Raven's powers work. WW stomps

I don't understand how Raven's powers work. Why doesn't she win? And why do people think she does?

Moderator
#14 Posted by Roddy010 (5429 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom said:
@Roddy010 said:
@comicdude23 said:
@Roddy010 said:
WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....
No. Wonder Woman has strRavenength, skill, lightning etc.
Raven's the most powerful empath in the DCU, she  also has teleportation, intangability, magic and  other mRental abilities to  take her down....WW has tfhe speed and strength advantage which is  why she wins this battle...
Raven's like the only empath in the DCU.  She doesn't use her teleportation in battle, she can't become intangible, she knows next to no magic and has no mental abilities.
Raven has  used teleportation in battle before,  during the Teen Titan run in 80s she showed the ability to become intangiable...And she does have a few mental abilities...Empathy is a psi-based power...That's the only way she is able to mind rape people and or cast illusions....
#15 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom: She quite frequently pulls out magic when having gone demonic, but has used them as well when she was in her 'white' period. Finally during the recently concluded trip to demon land from 93-97, Raven does pull out some kind of magical attack, one that blasts everyone away from her the second annihilated an demon army of thousands.
#16 Edited by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio
@Buckshot said:

@Zoom said:

Somebody doesn't understand how Raven's powers work. WW stomps

I don't understand how Raven's powers work. Why doesn't she win? And why do people think she does?

Because Wonder Woman is a speedster with enough strength to kill Raven in one punch.  Raven doesn't have any super speed or enhanced durability.
 
Why do they think she does?  I don't know.  Because they like the cartoon? 
 
@Roddy010 said:

during the Teen Titan run in 80s she showed the ability to become intangiable...And she does have a few mental abilities...Empathy is a psi-based power...

Scans? 
 
@Outside_85 said:

@Zoom: She quite frequently pulls out magic when having gone demonic, but has used them as well when she was in her 'white' period. Finally during the recently concluded trip to demon land from 93-97, Raven does pull out some kind of magical attack, one that blasts everyone away from her the second annihilated an demon army of thousands.

Are we talking about evil Raven?
 
And what spells did white Raven ever use?  She teleported, she made people feel emotions, she healed people but she's always done these things. 
 
Modern comics occasionally have Raven be like "blah blah blah magic" but they also occasionally mention how Beast Boy is in love with Terra or how Arsenal totally thinks drugs are awesome but most modern Titans comics suck.  There's no explanation for her having magical abilities and no magical abilities during Wolfman, Grayson or Johns' Titans runs. 
 
Even on Raven's most out of character, writer watched the cartoon instead of reading the comics day, Raven doesn't have the power to beat Wonder Woman.
#17 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom: Yes it happens mostly when shes goes evil. As during her white period she fired balls of flames at an opponent from the folds of her cloak. Honestly i dont get the 'blah blah blah magic' argument, and it is completetely irrelevant that you think todays Titans sucks. If you want an explanation, try looking over DC list of demons, only Blue Devil should stick out from the crowd as being without inherent magical abilities besides his fists.
#18 Posted by PhoenixoftheTides (3623 posts) - - Show Bio
@comicdude23 said:
Wonder Woman. Overkill.
Agreed.
#19 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio
@Outside_85 said:
@Zoom: Yes it happens mostly when shes goes evil. As during her white period she fired balls of flames at an opponent from the folds of her cloak. Honestly i dont get the 'blah blah blah magic' argument, and it is completetely irrelevant that you think todays Titans sucks. If you want an explanation, try looking over DC list of demons, only Blue Devil should stick out from the crowd as being without inherent magical abilities besides his fists.
When Guggenheim writes a bad story with Zoom in it and changes his powers and personality, everyone ignores it because we know the next time Zoom shows up with a half competent writer, his powers and personality will be back to normal. 
 
Whoever writes T-Bolts tells some bad Juggernaut stories but nobody cares because they know Juggernaut will be back to normal sooner or later. 
 
Raven is the same way.  We just haven't gotten back to competent writers yet on Titans. 
 
Scans of Raven shooting fireballs?  Or at least an issue number so I can verify?  I don't remember that ever happening.
#20 Posted by super_psycho (2789 posts) - - Show Bio

Princess

#21 Posted by Jodema (477 posts) - - Show Bio

WW. She just LOOKS like she could win.
#22 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom: It's unlikely the Johns-era Raven will dissapear as long as the man has the power in DC, and Krul is competent. I cant remember the number, but they were fighting a man called Muse that was invading their dreams, this was also where Raven shot fire, but the important thing was that no one else did anything they couldnt do, might have been an annual but Chase was apart of the team.
#23 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio

Johns era Raven didn't use magic.  She got a tramp stamp and basically devolved as a character but she didn't use magic.
 
Krul is competent but his Green Arrow is FAR better than his Teen Titans.  His Teen Titans is just better than anyone else's Teen Titans since Johns but that's not saying much since Henderson, Winick, Wallace and McKeever are all garbage at writing the Titans.
 
And you're sure Raven has magic because she set a guy on fire in a dream?  Even in that issue, she was like "the power comes from my cape" not "hokus pokus." 
 
Also Danny Chase sucks, not that anyone was saying otherwise.

#24 Posted by Charmix (11838 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom said:
@Roddy010 said:
@comicdude23 said:
@Roddy010 said:
WW wins with a blitz...Other than that Raven would win this....
No. Wonder Woman has strRavenength, skill, lightning etc.
Raven's the most powerful empath in the DCU, she  also has teleportation, intangability, magic and  other mental abilities to  take her down....WW has tfhe speed and strength advantage which is  why she wins this battle...
Raven's like the only empath in the DCU.  She doesn't use her teleportation in battle, she can't become intangible, she knows next to no magic and has no mental abilities.
Thank you for mentioning this!! thank you, =] 
It explains alot to me on WHY Black Alice said she was the best healer or something! Because she's the only one to have shown the skill consistently!!! 
Thank you Zoom! (;
#25 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio

Lol.

#26 Posted by Aqua11500 (2632 posts) - - Show Bio

The only reason Diana wins is because of blitz, that's her only card right now. 
 
It's so obvious though,and over used move of speedsters. 
 
 
Outside of that i would say Raven wins.

#27 Posted by Baltoro (1116 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder Woman shouldnt be disrespected and put against a kid.  Please close this thread as it is a spite thread.

#28 Posted by Baltoro (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@Aqua11500 said:
The only reason Diana wins is because of blitz, that's her only card right now.  It's so obvious though,and over used move of speedsters.   Outside of that i would say Raven wins.
It's overused because it makes her win the fight.  If you went to a duel and had  a choice between a sword and a butterknife, and you know millions have been killed by swords, but none by a butterknife...would you bring the butterknife to a fight?
#29 Posted by mfundo (1623 posts) - - Show Bio

Raven
#30 Posted by Baltoro (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@mfundo said:
Raven
The 800 pound gorilla in the room is how?
#31 Posted by mfundo (1623 posts) - - Show Bio
@Baltoro
Can't Raven speed blitz , doesn't she have powers of super speed as well? Anyway she could just go all Dark Raven on her butt that's if she is allowed of course. Or simply slowed time down,  she has done it before within a milisecond and obliterate her. Why so much hate over Ray-Ray anyway? 
#32 Posted by comicdude23 (11331 posts) - - Show Bio
@mfundo: No....first off, she ONLY slowed time down in the show, and she had NO idea how she did it. It's no canon. Second, she doesn't have speed, Wonder Woman beats Raven easily....
#33 Posted by mfundo (1623 posts) - - Show Bio
@comicdude23
Okay, okay there is no need to get huffy, I thought it would be canon and also she would be able to slow time with ease . There is no need to be so mean, I'm going to cry now to my mum now who is currently watching Law And Order: Los Angeles.
#34 Posted by Baltoro (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@mfundo said:
@Baltoro: Can't Raven speed blitz , doesn't she have powers of super speed as well? Anyway she could just go all Dark Raven on her butt that's if she is allowed of course. Or simply slowed time down,  she has done it before within a milisecond and obliterate her. Why so much hate over Ray-Ray anyway? 
Wonder Woman has light speed feats though, that means Raven's super speed will look like slow motion to her unless she has light speed or FTL speed as well.
#35 Posted by comicdude23 (11331 posts) - - Show Bio
@mfundo: Well, the Raven in the OP is the one that slowed time down/stopped it I think, but she didn't know how she did it. It's an even easier win for WW if this is Animated Raven....
#36 Posted by mfundo (1623 posts) - - Show Bio
@Baltoro
Okay fine, WW rocks and stomps Ray-Ray woohoo! Let's party now.
#37 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio
@Aqua11500 said:
The only reason Diana wins is because of blitz, that's her only card right now.  It's so obvious though,and over used move of speedsters.   Outside of that i would say Raven wins.
Raven wouldn't win even if Wonder Woman wasn't way the hell faster than her.
#38 Edited by Baltoro (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@mfundo said:

@Baltoro: Okay fine, WW rocks and stomps Ray-Ray woohoo! Let's party now.

Well, the thread was a little disrespectful, I can admit Wonder Woman loses when she faces someone respectable like Batman with prep, but this fight is way too one sided.  Now that we agree that Raven is nowhere near the level of WW we should have it locked.  Agreed?  I dont want to see this Raven girl humiliated by the superior Amazon....it is not right.
#39 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio

The problem with many fights on CV is that it too often comes down to who has superspeed and who doesnt, which decides who speed blitzes who. The problem speed blitzing is that its only on forums, like CV, that the fights are decided this way, comics hardly ever do it. True sometimes comics make character(s) look bad for the benefit of others, but most of those are pointed out and discounted from most debates. And its really a pity that debates are shut down like this.
 
@Zoom: Why not?

#40 Posted by comicdude23 (11331 posts) - - Show Bio
@Outside_85 said:
The problem with many fights on CV is that it too often comes down to who has superspeed and who doesnt, which decides who speed blitzes who. The problem speed blitzing is that its only on forums, like CV, that the fights are decided this way, comics hardly ever do it. True sometimes comics make character(s) look bad for the benefit of others, but most of those are pointed out and discounted from most debates. And its really a pity that debates are shut down like this.
 
@Zoom: Why not?
I know some characters hardly do it.....but WW has done it I believe....she's used her speed before. 
#41 Edited by Baltoro (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@Outside_85 said:

The problem with many fights on CV is that it too often comes down to who has superspeed and who doesnt, which decides who speed blitzes who. The problem speed blitzing is that its only on forums, like CV, that the fights are decided this way, comics hardly ever do it. True sometimes comics make character(s) look bad for the benefit of others, but most of those are pointed out and discounted from most debates. And its really a pity that debates are shut down like this.
 
@Zoom: Why not?

Okay, I'll give you that some characters don't blitz and people on here overuse the speed blitz argument over and over again.  However, Raven was crapping her pants when she was put against a character around Wonder Woman's level and she even had a team helping her.
 

Wonder Woman can punch through Terra and rip off Young Frankstein's arms, that seems to be enough to scare Raven away...I'll bet she runs away from Wonder Woman if we want to be realistic with what would happen if she fought her.  I just don't like when a girl way too weak to fight Wonder Woman is made into a vs thread.  What does Raven bring to the table that Wonder Woman would have trouble with?  WW is a better fighter than Adam, probably faster, not as strong but still can scare this girl away.
#42 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio
@Baltoro: Whats happening in those scans is Raven 'feeling in' on what Terra and Frankenstein Jr. is feeling, an emotional feedback of their pain, it has nothing to do with Adam. And Raven has faced far greater powers than Adam; like Superboy Prime, Darkseid and Trigon.
 
@comicdude23: But its not her standard pattern of attack, like say the Flash's is. Even an maddened (Titan-influenced) Donna Troy didnt slaughter the Titans and Outsiders fighting her. Also, people have to consider that speedblitzing is actually quite dangerous, Diana's fists are like steel and if they hit you with just 100mph your bones are pretty much dust.Space shuttels and satelites have shown that small pieces of rubber can make craters in steel plates when the two collide with enough force.
 
Finally however, it would be nice to have more data and rules regarding this engagement.
#43 Posted by Aqua11500 (2632 posts) - - Show Bio
@Baltoro said:
@Aqua11500 said:
The only reason Diana wins is because of blitz, that's her only card right now.  It's so obvious though,and over used move of speedsters.   Outside of that i would say Raven wins.
It's overused because it makes her win the fight.  If you went to a duel and had  a choice between a sword and a butterknife, and you know millions have been killed by swords, but none by a butterknife...would you bring the butterknife to a fight?
No don't go using this as an example. 
 
By overused i mean it's almost a cheat way to me, because what type of fight is it when that person can end it at the beginning,that fast at that speed? especially if that's all people can say every damn battle. 
I mean if WW is suppose to be all powerful warrior and posses more attributes and skill more, or abilities,then why not use those instead. 
 
'WW blitz FTW"  
^^^^
 Not much of a debate if you think about it.Diana has a larger display of abilities,but all i see being posted is speed blitz.Give me ways WW can take down Raven without it.BTW Raven isn't a kid anymore.. 
 
 
 
@Zoom:  Okay i'll take you up on that. Explain please?
#44 Edited by Aqua11500 (2632 posts) - - Show Bio

Diana may be a brick and is nigh invulnerable with incredible Strength,but there is nothing saying she can resist emotion tampering or just being sucked of all her feelings.Raven can even shield herself with dark energy FF, teleport, she can open portals to other dimensions,fly and she has a bit of dark magic up her sleeves, and limited TK. Furthermore the OP was never specific enough, because if we can  combine both versions of raven,then it would make this match more even, considering how the WW fans are claiming one sided fight. 
 
 
Hell outside of blitzing skit, half these people know that's how it wouldn't even go down in the comics. Characters with incredible speed just dont go around blitzing and overusing the move all the time unless it's a Flash or someone of that a family.That says a lot considering these are the ohh so overpowerd DC characters. 
 
Raven could BFR WW into hell or another dimension , Emotionally rape the shit out of her,mind frak Diana.BTW if provoked or put in certain situation Raven can loose her morals and go Evil Trigon-Raven and whoop on Diana.

#45 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio

WW fans?  She's a boring character. 
 
She just happens to be more powerful than Raven.

#46 Posted by Erik (33327 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom said:
WW fans?  She's a boring character.  
You wound me Zoom!
#47 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom: Physically, but thats not Raven's field of power.
#48 Posted by PhoenixoftheTides (3623 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll stick with Wonder Woman for the win. Raven can be competent, but her power displays are too inconsistent, and I don't see her taking down one of DC's premier powerhouse superheroes based upon her usual range of feats. Frankly speaking, Wonder Woman has dealt with far more powerful divine and magial adversaries than Raven. Wonder Woman would beat her, and then spank her for being naughty.

#49 Posted by Baltoro (1116 posts) - - Show Bio
@Outside_85 said:
@Baltoro: Whats happening in those scans is Raven 'feeling in' on what Terra and Frankenstein Jr. is feeling, an emotional feedback of their pain, it has nothing to do with Adam. And Raven has faced far greater powers than Adam; like Superboy Prime, Darkseid and Trigon.
 
Can we stop making excuses for this girl?  She was obviously afraid of Black Adam cutting loose on her next.
#50 Posted by Outside_85 (10227 posts) - - Show Bio
@Baltoro said:
@Outside_85 said:
@Baltoro: Whats happening in those scans is Raven 'feeling in' on what Terra and Frankenstein Jr. is feeling, an emotional feedback of their pain, it has nothing to do with Adam. And Raven has faced far greater powers than Adam; like Superboy Prime, Darkseid and Trigon.
 
Can we stop making excuses for this girl?  She was obviously afraid of Black Adam cutting loose on her next.
I'm not, you apparently just dont know how her powers work.