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#1 Edited by WarBlade539 (4632 posts) - - Show Bio

After playing the hell out of Metal Gear Rising: Revengence, I had to make this topic.

Both are fully upgraded and Raiden has access to his 'Ripper Mode'.

Raiden

vs

Alex Mercer

Both are at full power

They start off a 200 meters away

Fight takes place in Manhattan, overrun with Infected.

Win by Death or K.O

NOTE: This is Mercer from Prototype 1. Nothing of Prototype 2 exists here.

#2 Posted by JonSmith (3996 posts) - - Show Bio

Raiden's outnumbered and outmatched. Haven't played Rising yet (though I intend to!), but I played the demo. I'd say Raiden is a decent amount faster than Mercer (at least in combat speed, definitely not in locomotion), but he's not putting down Mercer with a slashing weapon. ESPECIALLY in a city full of food and slaves for Mercer. All the Infected report to him. To take a quick report: Walkers, Runners, Hunters, Brawlers, Juggernauts, Harpies (think that's what they're called), and Goliaths. Not to mention all of Mercer's personal Infected. In addition to their being no electrolytes for Raiden to absorb to recharge his blade mode.

Raiden really has no chance here.

#3 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@JonSmith said:

Raiden's outnumbered and outmatched. Haven't played Rising yet (though I intend to!), but I played the demo. I'd say Raiden is a decent amount faster than Mercer (at least in combat speed, definitely not in locomotion), but he's not putting down Mercer with a slashing weapon. ESPECIALLY in a city full of food and slaves for Mercer. All the Infected report to him. To take a quick report: Walkers, Runners, Hunters, Brawlers, Juggernauts, Harpies (think that's what they're called), and Goliaths.

Honestly? Raiden could handle all of this without much issue if he had a steady supply of nanopaste.

@JonSmith said:

In addition to their being no electrolytes for Raiden to absorb to recharge his blade mode.

This is the problem.

#4 Posted by JonSmith (3996 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida said:

Raiden's outnumbered and outmatched. Haven't played Rising yet (though I intend to!), but I played the demo. I'd say Raiden is a decent amount faster than Mercer (at least in combat speed, definitely not in locomotion), but he's not putting down Mercer with a slashing weapon. ESPECIALLY in a city full of food and slaves for Mercer. All the Infected report to him. To take a quick report: Walkers, Runners, Hunters, Brawlers, Juggernauts, Harpies (think that's what they're called), and Goliaths.

Honestly? Raiden could handle all of this without much issue if he had a steady supply of nanopaste.

In addition to their being no electrolytes for Raiden to absorb to recharge his blade mode.

This is the problem.

Is he really that powerful in Rising? Please, no spoilers.

#5 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio

@JonSmith said:

@Ferro Vida said:

Raiden's outnumbered and outmatched. Haven't played Rising yet (though I intend to!), but I played the demo. I'd say Raiden is a decent amount faster than Mercer (at least in combat speed, definitely not in locomotion), but he's not putting down Mercer with a slashing weapon. ESPECIALLY in a city full of food and slaves for Mercer. All the Infected report to him. To take a quick report: Walkers, Runners, Hunters, Brawlers, Juggernauts, Harpies (think that's what they're called), and Goliaths.

Honestly? Raiden could handle all of this without much issue if he had a steady supply of nanopaste.

In addition to their being no electrolytes for Raiden to absorb to recharge his blade mode.

This is the problem.

Is he really that powerful in Rising? Please, no spoilers.

Avoiding as many spoilers as possible... One of the first things you fight is a Ray.

#6 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

Raiden has merc outgunned in the stats department

aly can only hide behind his regen

#7 Posted by WarBlade539 (4632 posts) - - Show Bio

@JonSmith: This is Mercer from Protoype 1. No element of Prototype 2 exists here.

#8 Posted by JonSmith (3996 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkazrael999 said:

This is Mercer from Protoype 1. No element of Prototype 2 exists here.

You said full upgrades. May not have been shown in game, but at the end, Mercer's the only infected leader left, and says as much himself. They follow him by default, so while his arsenal may be vastly more limited (Walkers, Runners, Hunters, Hydras) He's still got some serious firepower and an all you can eat buffet, while Raiden has a limited power supply that's going to run out quickly, at which point, he'll be overwhelmed.

#9 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

Raiden has merc outgunned in the stats department

aly can only hide behind his regen

Agreed.

#10 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2: I played prototype

electricity is no-no for alec and he didn't fully tank the nuke

#11 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man: So Electricity harms him you say? I know the Nuke Comment of him is BS to the extreme. He kinda died and had to reform from whatever life was around him.

#12 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@CadenceV2: The fight with specialist cross, its not the grenade gun that's dangerous but the stun baton

#13 Posted by saiyan_earthling (5456 posts) - - Show Bio

Raiden should be able to win, due to his superior physical stats.

#14 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@saiyan_earthling said:

Raiden should be able to win, due to his superior physical stats.

#15 Posted by saiyan_earthling (5456 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@saiyan_earthling said:

Raiden should be able to win, due to his superior physical stats.

hahahahaha, good one

#16 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@saiyan_earthling:

#17 Posted by saiyan_earthling (5456 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@saiyan_earthling:

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

#18 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

You guys are underestimating Mercer here I mean really. His healing factor & biology prevents instant death from anything Raiden can throw at him. I've never seen mercer Knocked Out. As a plus for mercer as mentioned in Manhattan he has plenty of bio mass to consume. I've played Revengence so I know all Raiden's feats I've also played Prototype and know all Alex's. I see Alex winning in the end

#19 Posted by GhostRider2 (3380 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird: I agree, also Mercer has so many powers at his disposal starting from blade, hammers, claws,etc and his armor mode and i dont see still standing after Mercer release the barrage devastator.

#20 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't see mercer tagging Raiden anytime soon

#21 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

I don't see mercer tagging Raiden anytime soon

First of all Mercer is faster than Raiden. Mercer has a couple AOE attacks at his disposal, not to mention attacks that can come beneath Raidens feet.

#22 Posted by Saren (25899 posts) - - Show Bio

So if nothing from Prototype 2 exists here, does that mean the showing where nuke-tanking Alex Mercer gets beaten silly by Heller and then eaten alive doesn't count?

Moderator
#23 Edited by GhostRider2 (3380 posts) - - Show Bio

@CitizenBane: Prototype 2 ending was shit, they replaced Alex with Heller this was bad.And no the fight doesnt count.

#24 Posted by ChaosMarvel (997 posts) - - Show Bio

Mercer

#25 Posted by Dextersinister (6351 posts) - - Show Bio

@CitizenBane said:

So if nothing from Prototype 2 exists here, does that mean the showing where nuke-tanking Alex Mercer gets beaten silly by Heller and then eaten alive doesn't count?

Tanking means you can continue to fight, Mercer was taken down by being caught in the outskirts of a nuke which at best shows he can recover from being very heavily wounded as his frame was still intact, decapitating his head would more than likely kill him.

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#26 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird:

First of all Mercer is faster than Raiden

I might need feet or at least calcs on this statement, electricity is not good for mercer (as pointed out by Cross' stun baton)

#27 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Dextersinister said:

@CitizenBane said:

So if nothing from Prototype 2 exists here, does that mean the showing where nuke-tanking Alex Mercer gets beaten silly by Heller and then eaten alive doesn't count?

Tanking means you can continue to fight, Mercer was taken down by being caught in the outskirts of a nuke which at best shows he can recover from being very heavily wounded as his frame was still intact, decapitating his head would more than likely kill him.

I doubt it

#28 Posted by GhostofOnyx (656 posts) - - Show Bio

I think mercer just to powerful for raiden.

#29 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird:

First of all Mercer is faster than Raiden

I might need feet or at least calcs on this statement, electricity is not good for mercer (as pointed out by Cross' stun baton)

Have you played both games? Mercer is faster.

#30 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird: not in protoype 1 he isn't

#31 Posted by saiyan_earthling (5456 posts) - - Show Bio

Raiden s^%ts on Mercer.

#32 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@saiyan_earthling said:

Raiden s^%ts on Mercer.

Raiden is a linear fighter with a single way of killing his enemies slicing them with his sword. During the fight with armstrong he got owned when he lost his sword and all Steven did during that fight was throw haymakers. The fact that he can block anything with his sword is a game play mechanic. Alex has a plethora of attacks that will not only take Raiden by surprise ie devestadors and ground spikes, but will deal serious damage if they hit Raiden. I just dont understand how you think Raiden will win?

#33 Posted by monarch_prime (398 posts) - - Show Bio

Mercer.

#34 Posted by saiyan_earthling (5456 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird said:

@saiyan_earthling said:

Raiden s^%ts on Mercer.

Raiden is a linear fighter with a single way of killing his enemies slicing them with his sword. During the fight with armstrong he got owned when he lost his sword and all Steven did during that fight was throw haymakers. The fact that he can block anything with his sword is a game play mechanic. Alex has a plethora of attacks that will not only take Raiden by surprise ie devestadors and ground spikes, but will deal serious damage if they hit Raiden. I just dont understand how you think Raiden will win?

Raiden is physically stronger, fast enough to react, dodge or outrun Mercer's tentacles, and durable than Mercer. Also Mercer never tanked the nuke. Yes he survived it, but he was in no condition to fight after. Raiden may take a long time to kill Mercer, but don't forget that he's fought continuously for days.

Also, Mercer has to keep absorbing things to regenerate, which Raiden won't let it happen as he keeps slicing him (Mercer) up.

Unless Mercer's tentacles can get a grip on Raiden, they won't do s^%t on an outrunning cyborg.

#35 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird said:

@Dextersinister said:

@CitizenBane said:

So if nothing from Prototype 2 exists here, does that mean the showing where nuke-tanking Alex Mercer gets beaten silly by Heller and then eaten alive doesn't count?

Tanking means you can continue to fight, Mercer was taken down by being caught in the outskirts of a nuke which at best shows he can recover from being very heavily wounded as his frame was still intact, decapitating his head would more than likely kill him.

I doubt it

Nope, stay in the boat and he dies he didn't tank the explosion, just the blast wave on the outside

#36 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@saiyan_earthling said:

@Enemybird said:

@saiyan_earthling said:

Raiden s^%ts on Mercer.

Raiden is a linear fighter with a single way of killing his enemies slicing them with his sword. During the fight with armstrong he got owned when he lost his sword and all Steven did during that fight was throw haymakers. The fact that he can block anything with his sword is a game play mechanic. Alex has a plethora of attacks that will not only take Raiden by surprise ie devestadors and ground spikes, but will deal serious damage if they hit Raiden. I just dont understand how you think Raiden will win?

Raiden is physically stronger, fast enough to react, dodge or outrun Mercer's tentacles, and durable than Mercer. Also Mercer never tanked the nuke. Yes he survived it, but he was in no condition to fight after. Raiden may take a long time to kill Mercer, but don't forget that he's fought continuously for days.

Also, Mercer has to keep absorbing things to regenerate, which Raiden won't let it happen as he keeps slicing him (Mercer) up.

Unless Mercer's tentacles can get a grip on Raiden, they won't do s^%t on an outrunning cyborg.

Alex survived a nuke... could Raiden?...No! Whats your point? Raiden fighting for days means nothing to Mercer he has perpetual stamina. Raiden may have bigger feats of strength but that doesn't mean he is stronger than Mercer, we never saw his limits. What makes you so sure Raiden could even slice through an armor plated Mercer? Because he can slice through all the fodder in his own game like tanks, choppers & Cyborgs? He couldn't slice through Armstrong's armor plated nanomachines... He couldn't dodge his haymakers either but unlike armstrong mercer will have more than punches at his disposal.

#37 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird said:

@Dextersinister said:

@CitizenBane said:

So if nothing from Prototype 2 exists here, does that mean the showing where nuke-tanking Alex Mercer gets beaten silly by Heller and then eaten alive doesn't count?

Tanking means you can continue to fight, Mercer was taken down by being caught in the outskirts of a nuke which at best shows he can recover from being very heavily wounded as his frame was still intact, decapitating his head would more than likely kill him.

I doubt it

Nope, stay in the boat and he dies he didn't tank the explosion, just the blast wave on the outside

Cutting his head off will achieve nothing... He has received wounds on his head that were big enough to see though. Cutting it off wont do anything

#38 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird: wounds big enough to see through =/= decapitation

#39 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: wounds big enough to see through =/= decapitation

The guy regenerated from a puddle of biomasss beheading him will NOT kill him

#40 Edited by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird: said guy can get game overed if hit long enough, there is a reason why boss fights are dangerous

puddle needs a crow (asspull) to latch one an take over

#41 Posted by beautifulrevery (1508 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird said:

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: wounds big enough to see through =/= decapitation

The guy regenerated from a puddle of biomasss beheading him will NOT kill him

Truth. Mercer is NOT a human. He's virus colony impersonating a human. He doesn't have a brain or skeletal system really. It's just the biomass acting as a human.

#42 Edited by Dextersinister (6351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird said:

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: wounds big enough to see through =/= decapitation

The guy regenerated from a puddle of biomasss beheading him will NOT kill him

He has still never shown to be able to survive decapitation, he regenerated with his head still attached to his body and his brain intact. They have already established memory loss though cranial damage within the series so even if he was capable of regenerating his head he would be a vegetable.

He was greatly weakened after Heller took off his limbs a few times, Mercer regenerating his head would have looked silly.

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#43 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@beautifulrevery: @Dextersinister:

remember, only things from prototype 1 folks

and KO is a very viable option

he can get knocked by the hunters

#44 Posted by Dextersinister (6351 posts) - - Show Bio

@beautifulrevery said:

@Enemybird said:

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: wounds big enough to see through =/= decapitation

The guy regenerated from a puddle of biomasss beheading him will NOT kill him

Truth. Mercer is NOT a human. He's virus colony impersonating a human. He doesn't have a brain or skeletal system really. It's just the biomass acting as a human.

Mercer is based on and is made up almost entirely using the remains of the the original, humans are biomass as well. A base virus colony would be incapable of moving as viruses have no function they are simply carried, he is a virus colony in the same way that a large portion of are own dna comes from viruses.

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#45 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: said guy can get game overed if hit long enough, there is a reason why boss fights are dangerous

puddle needs a crow (asspull) to latch one an take over

Dont confuse gameplay mechanics with actual abilities. An analogous statement to what you just said would be that Solid Snake is invincible so long as he has rations equipped. Now we both know that is not the case even though its technically true while playing the game. But, its just how the game has to be for the experience.

#46 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird: There is the fluff and there is the crunch

#47 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Dextersinister said:

@beautifulrevery said:

@Enemybird said:

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: wounds big enough to see through =/= decapitation

The guy regenerated from a puddle of biomasss beheading him will NOT kill him

Truth. Mercer is NOT a human. He's virus colony impersonating a human. He doesn't have a brain or skeletal system really. It's just the biomass acting as a human.

Mercer is based on and is made up almost entirely using the remains of the the original, humans are biomass as well. A base virus colony would be incapable of moving as viruses have no function they are simply carried, he is a virus colony in the same way that a large portion of are own dna comes from viruses.

Says who? I dont remember that explanation from the game. Mercer isn't the remains of the original he IS the virus. As mentioned he is acting as human

#48 Posted by Enemybird (3266 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: There is the fluff and there is the crunch

#49 Posted by Rumble Man (11118 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird:

Story and gameplay

#50 Posted by Dextersinister (6351 posts) - - Show Bio

@Enemybird said:

@Dextersinister said:

@beautifulrevery said:

@Enemybird said:

@Rumble Man said:

@Enemybird: wounds big enough to see through =/= decapitation

The guy regenerated from a puddle of biomasss beheading him will NOT kill him

Truth. Mercer is NOT a human. He's virus colony impersonating a human. He doesn't have a brain or skeletal system really. It's just the biomass acting as a human.

Mercer is based on and is made up almost entirely using the remains of the the original, humans are biomass as well. A base virus colony would be incapable of moving as viruses have no function they are simply carried, he is a virus colony in the same way that a large portion of are own dna comes from viruses.

Says who? I dont remember that explanation from the game. Mercer isn't the remains of the original he IS the virus. As mentioned he is acting as human

The virus was from a small vial and you can't summon a body from thin air it has to come from somewhere, it infected his remains. The entire Mercer but not Mercer was a bit of a stretch in the story inserted purely to remove responsibility for unleashing the virus in the first place.

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