#51 Edited by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio

"well lets think batman was a martial artis punisher was a cammander war vet" 

Batman is a martial arts master and has mastered nearly all forms of martial arts. He even beat Karate Kid when he fought dirty. Punisher has standard military training plus a little training from Captain America. Hardly worth comparing the two.


"punisher took on spiderman"

With guns. Which was bullsh#t in itself because Spider-Man regularly dodges automatic gunfire, often at point blank yet gets nailed by a pistol shot a few dozen feet away.


"batman needs to use gadgets to win agaist alot of people" 

Batman fights most of his h2h opponents with h2h. Pick up a Batman comic at least once. Punisher almost never goes anywhere without his guns, grenades, and knives.


"and batman had his back broke by Bain who was just a guy on steroids basicly" 

This is just stupid. Batman lost to Bane after going weeks without sleep and constant fighting. There was nothing left in Batman. Punisher would not even had made it to the fight with Bane. He would have died after the first week of fighting for sure.


"punisher has broken skulls with his fist" 

Comic or movie? I have never read him do that in any Punisher comic I ever had picked up. Never once have I read him do that with one hit. I need a reference for that.


"punisher has alot more exsperiance than batman"

No. Punisher would get murdered by some of the villains Batman has fought. Deathstroke, Shiva, Ra's, etc. Punisher often kills his opponents so there is not much experience that could be had from people you fight only once.


"more cut throat"

No. Punisher kills and Batman does not. Batman still gets very brutal. He always does what he needs to do to win.


"and while batman lost his parents Frank lost his family so punisher has more to fight and live for"

This is one of the silliest reasons I have ever heard for Punisher winning anything.


"punisher has a much higher pain tolerance than batman he can get shot and just pull the bullet out like nothing"

Batman has been shot, had ribs and legs broken, and had been drugged and still kicked some @$$.


"batman gets punched by Havey Dent and gets knocked out"

So?


"as for who scarier punisher takes that hands down"

No he does not. Punisher is not even taken seriously in the entire Marvel U. It would be understandable if he was supposed to be a joke character like Deadpool.


"punisher has fought ninjas befor wher so stealth isnt batmans strong point."

I am assuming you are joking here. Why is stealth not Batman's strong point just because Punisher has fought ninjas in the past? He has never fought Batman before. Batman is on a whole other level than a standard ninja.


"So in the end punisher wins."

Wrong. Actually, it is surprising how everything you posted was wrong. What I find even more funny is that I do not even consider myself a Batman specialist here on the vine. If one of them do take an interest in this thread, there will be nothing left of Punisher's reputation here.

#52 Posted by AtPhantom (14434 posts) - - Show Bio

LOL, Good job murdering his post Erik. : )

#53 Posted by claws (5267 posts) - - Show Bio

i go with batman he is smarter and probaly an better fighter

#54 Posted by SUNMAN (7374 posts) - - Show Bio

so many fanboys in this thread i is ridiculous. This would be a decent fight.

#55 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio

well for one as i said not only was he a captain of a marine force to get their easly He completed Basic Training and then trained in Infantry, Reconnaissance, Force Reconnaissance and Sniper School. Castiglione was able to attain dockets to permit him to go through U.S. Army Airborne Training and U.S. Navy Underwater Demolition Team training to be qualified as a Navy SEAL. and about batman and the martial arts thing he constently gets beat up by two face scarcrow pinquen and others so even with that i think a marine commander/war vet can top that you know what traing they do in marines?

well yea punisher with gun and spider man with enhanced strength and webs btw fun fact spiderman's spider sense doesnt work every time theirs danger just like that it happens frequintly but not all the time their has been times wher he had problems with his spider sense either going off or not working pluss yes spider man has doged gunfire but either they werent aiming or were far away with machine guns punisher who was a war vet quickly sniped him spiderman is fast but not light speed or faster than a speeding bullet.

yea batman fights hand to hand agaist the joker sometimes and mabey some random rober and again batman sneaks attacks all those people im a batman fan of course if read his comics read a punisher book eh?

mabey you don't know punisher cuz this made you sound stupid yes batman went weeks without sleep but read a punisher comic he said ''i will never rest until every crimminal scum is dead''  in any punisher book have you seen him sleep at all? no he doesnt yet he can go into mansions,houses and other buildings batman needs to sneak attack and punisher even killed people that did that.

my bad nose with one punch or jaw you got that one i'll send you a scan

punisher fights bullseye the russian who cant be hurt by bullets he daredevil wolverine who btw happens to be a master in ''every'' master of martial arts batman beats most of his enimys prepared after a defete or retreat then comes back with stuff like armor special guns or or sometime of thing specificly for that enimy batman fights the same enemy over and over and still loses at times so of course batman can take on his enemys sometimes punisher constantly goes after differant mafia familys gang wars ect.

batman brutal yes mercaless no ounisher interrogates his enemys and still kill them on occasions he lets them go andd that was only twice punisher does anything to win weather it means taking hostages or using a nuke or human sheilds and hitting below the belt

one if the silliest reasons for punisher winning anything? when punisher either sees or hearss or remembers something about his family he goes into full masicure mode read the max series

k punisher has been shot thrown through wall,windows, had class shards go into him survived ambushes in war and other places and still killed some @$$

so if a weak bisneus man can knock him out im sure a soldier can

bunisher strikes fear into people just for mentioning his name armys and swat go after him also a reason for the skull on his shirt batman on the other hand people find a pain and only fbi or rokkie cops go after him and a joke character like deadpool dead pool is a funny character but still has important sroy line read x men sometimes find out more but punisher a joke rofl then if thats the case batmans the tooth fairy right?

your wrong what i find funny is you attempted to make me look bad my beeing a douch and i just counterd everything you said im not trying to be mean but damn you annoyed me anyway unless you can top that without being a trol in think i made my point the funny thing is batman isnt even on my top 10 favorate heroes yet i know more about him than you it seems.


#56 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
AtPhantom said:
"LOL, Good job murdering his post Erik. : )
"

by murder you mean attempt at being a douch and ambarrass me and make me look stupid than yea if you didnt see i just counterd everything he said most of wich was just fanboy talk hate to say it but iv had more aruable debaters on youtube wich isnt even about comics not beeing mean just trash talk for him doing it to me -.-
#57 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Tradog said:
"well for one as i said not only was he a captain of a marine force to get their easly He completed Basic Training and then trained in Infantry, Reconnaissance, Force Reconnaissance and Sniper School. Castiglione was able to attain dockets to permit him to go through U.S. Army Airborne Training and U.S. Navy Underwater Demolition Team training to be qualified as a Navy SEAL. and about batman and the martial arts thing he constently gets beat up by two face scarcrow pinquen and others so even with that i think a marine commander/war vet can top that you know what traing they do in marines?

well yea punisher with gun and spider man with enhanced strength and webs btw fun fact spiderman's spider sense doesnt work every time theirs danger just like that it happens frequintly but not all the time their has been times wher he had problems with his spider sense either going off or not working pluss yes spider man has doged gunfire but either they werent aiming or were far away with machine guns punisher who was a war vet quickly sniped him spiderman is fast but not light speed or faster than a speeding bullet.

yea batman fights hand to hand agaist the joker sometimes and mabey some random rober and again batman sneaks attacks all those people im a batman fan of course if read his comics read a punisher book eh?

mabey you don't know punisher cuz this made you sound stupid yes batman went weeks without sleep but read a punisher comic he said ''i will never rest until every crimminal scum is dead''  in any punisher book have you seen him sleep at all? no he doesnt yet he can go into mansions,houses and other buildings batman needs to sneak attack and punisher even killed people that did that.

my bad nose with one punch or jaw you got that one i'll send you a scan

punisher fights bullseye the russian who cant be hurt by bullets he daredevil wolverine who btw happens to be a master in ''every'' master of martial arts batman beats most of his enimys prepared after a defete or retreat then comes back with stuff like armor special guns or or sometime of thing specificly for that enimy batman fights the same enemy over and over and still loses at times so of course batman can take on his enemys sometimes punisher constantly goes after differant mafia familys gang wars ect.

batman brutal yes mercaless no ounisher interrogates his enemys and still kill them on occasions he lets them go andd that was only twice punisher does anything to win weather it means taking hostages or using a nuke or human sheilds and hitting below the belt

one if the silliest reasons for punisher winning anything? when punisher either sees or hearss or remembers something about his family he goes into full masicure mode read the max series

k punisher has been shot thrown through wall,windows, had class shards go into him survived ambushes in war and other places and still killed some @$$

so if a weak bisneus man can knock him out im sure a soldier can

bunisher strikes fear into people just for mentioning his name armys and swat go after him also a reason for the skull on his shirt batman on the other hand people find a pain and only fbi or rokkie cops go after him and a joke character like deadpool dead pool is a funny character but still has important sroy line read x men sometimes find out more but punisher a joke rofl then if thats the case batmans the tooth fairy right?

your wrong what i find funny is you attempted to make me look bad my beeing a douch and i just counterd everything you said im not trying to be mean but damn you annoyed me anyway unless you can top that without being a trol in think i made my point the funny thing is batman isnt even on my top 10 favorate heroes yet i know more about him than you it seems.


"
  • I said standard military training. No matter what position he had gotten to, he still only had exactly what the military gives to everyone plus what Captain America gave him. Whoopee!
  • You know nothing of Spider-Man if you are willing to put out that garbage. Spider-Man's spider sense always works unless special circumstances occur such as drained powers or characters that are able to shield themselves from his spider sense. The rest of that paragraph was pointless.
  • You just proved that you have never read a Batman book in your life.
  • Lol Do you really think that the Punisher never sleeps? Are you kidding me? The human body cannot function without sleep. Maybe you should read a book other than Punisher as well.
  • It is not hard to break a nose. A little more effort to break a jaw but hardly a feat worth mentioning unless it is against someone with durability.
  • That is my point. Punisher kills thugs by the dozens. Who cares? A thug has no more training than the average joe has received. Also, most of the time he just lights them up with his guns anyway. Where did you ever hear that Bullseye is immune to bullets?
  • So because Punisher is more skilled in torture through interrogation he wins? This is almost as bad as you saying he wins because his whole family was killed while Batman only lost his parents.
  • You fail to realize losing your family does not win anything against an opponent. Just because he goes bloodlust does not mean much. Batman wrecks psychos that do not use their heads. When Punisher lost his head in a Daredevil fight, Daredevil won the fight.
  • And?
  • Who said Harvey Dent is weak? Do you read Batman at all?
  • Lol that is just a poorly thought out post, much like the rest of it.
  • I may not be right but you sure as hell are wrong. I do not care if you think I am a douche, you countered nothing at all and made yourself look even more silly. You can say what you want about your knowledge of Batman, you have yet to prove that you have even a rudimentary knowledge of the character. Batman wins and if it comes down to h2h combat, Batman destroys Punisher. 
#58 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio

k im rofl right now you contradicted yourself
ok

.you know nothing of the military mabey go to a training session or join or read up they train for incounters with martial arts and how to use them

no read the book he had to ask madam web for helo with his spider sense and when spiderman was running from a helicopter it shot at his and didnt even move spiderman still got shot you know nothing of spiderman if it works everytime he should always dodge every punch thrown at him huh and if he cant avoid a punch he can avoid a bullet.

yea ok coming from a guy who never read punisher huh?

rofl you contradicted yourself you said batman went weeks without sleep yet you say punisher cant well news flash its a comic book nothing makes sense you just enjoy it and go with it! read a punisher book not one did he ever sleep that or he goes years without it.

yea but its something batman cant do easly

yea batman who fights bankrobers and rich guys is better than mafia familys and military huh and batman still cant do that also i said he took on bulsseye and the russian is ammune to bullets you know who that is right?

no you were saying batman is more brutal i was proving he wasnt their you go again with the dumbness read the books look how he kills his enemys i wasnt saying he wins only because of it but because it helps batman became batman after his parents died right? so if his motive for doing something catches back up with him he does better when you are motivated to do something and the motivation is great you can do it in comic standerds anyway daredevil hurt punisher never one tho punisher killed daredevil

wow stupid

yes i read batman thats why im saying this harvey cant pibk up a bazooka with one hand he cant do anything amazing him knocking out batman shows batman is weak what has two face done to show hes strong

poor come back man really im dissapointed man you should be a better debater than this youtube would crush you in their sorry debates -.-

yea so again i proved you wrong and ok you dont care that your a douch well i guess you dont care that your an idiot as well i have good reasons for saying that you can't even back it up douches are douches not debaters just like you  you say i made myself look silly yet you constently contradicted yourself your S.M.A.R.T.! arent ya ^^  yea fanboys never were good at debating  well no your not a fanboy just an idiot my knolage of batman comming from the non exspert everything iv said has happend and batman has done
punisher wins he took on wolverine in hand to hand combat and stood up to the hulk in world war hulk killed dare devil befor so now what?



#59 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Sigh. I guess I should not be surprised you mixed everything up and had gotten yourself confused. Here goes.
  1. I do not need to join the military to know that they give every private the same training as another private, the same training is given to a captain as another captain, etc etc etc.
  2. Like I said, circumstances or things that can cloak against his spider sense.
  3. No matter what I say here you will just prove your own adolescence anyway.
  4. No, I am surprised you missed that. You must be over eager to attack me that you jumped the gun. I said Batman went weeks without sleep. You said Punisher never sleeps. Read more carefully. It should not be hard because unlike you, I take the time to make my arguments look nice and not the youtube comments posts that you are giving here.
  5. Wrong.
  6. I am not surprised I misunderstood your pathetically juvenile posts. My 6 year old nephew types better than you.
  7. No. I was saying that Batman is brutal when he needs to be. He is a very calculating man and never wastes more energy than needed to bring someone down.
  8. "anyway daredevil hurt punisher never one tho punisher killed daredevil" Are you seriously trying to imply that Punisher has never been hurt by Daredevil and on top of that Punisher has killed Daredevil? You are just saying any old thing now.
  9. "wow stupid" I do not think you are even aware of what you are talking about.
  10. Lol. I cannot believe you are saying Batman is weak. You must not comprehend the things you are saying. 
  11. Youtube users simply flame everyone with racist and bias remarks. I am surprised you hold that type of debating in such high regard.
  12. You say I am the idiot yet all one has to do is compare our posts. You must not be older than 14 years old. The things you have stated as facts have shown that you are a Punisher fanboy. You are prepared to say anything you can. Trying to bait me with you feeble name calling does nothing but humor me. Have you read the rules? You understand that you can be banned from the site for your behavior right?
  13. Punisher taking on Wolverine does not count for much. Whenever a character needs a boost in sales who do you think they throw him up against to look good? The correct answer is Wolverine. Are you talking about Punisher with the Venom suit? As if that was not the most bullsh!t story I have ever read. Also in case you have not noticed, Daredevil is alive.
#60 Posted by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio

I love the Punisher...well sometimes anyways lol...but honestly if you look at it Batman is better than him in nearly every category that matters.

#61 Edited by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio

okay hear i go

1.yea same training as i said that training can use and counter martial arts

2.what i ment was it doesnt work everytime thats what madam web exsplained dude read more of his comics.

3.no your the one who said i never read batman comic because what you think i dont know what im talking about.

4.ok my bad on that part but still as i said he doesnt look at any comic of his he doesnt batman does and if he doesnt he gets beat as you sated with bain

5.about what?

6.good for him your insults are worse than mine nice job trying to sound smart their but you were able to make out what i said so your no idiot but im trying to make a point not right a paper to my boss, or to get into a collage but to prove that one character can beat another i do take time in what i post yes i make mistake but they are one that i can correct  you insult me i insult you but ok i wont anymore then and i'll still prove my point its just hard when you constiently try to insult me and like you you can say its my manner of speaking or in this case typing

7.punisher is brutal when he needs to be as well wich is everyday what has batman done that is so brutal? and punisher doesnt even break a sweat when he is done with his job so he doesnt use up more energy than he has to agaist his villians

8.what i meant to say was daredevil hurt punisher but punisher killed daredevil im not making it up here

9.ok you said ''so'' after i proved twice what im talking about.

10.k man let me put it this way in a debate people say things when heated up just i guess the way in the comics he fights makes him look weak i mean i havent seen him fight to many people head on and won like punisher does

11.compare post yes but you also say some things that are just stupid or only insulting or dont make sense or are incorrect but my bad your far from an idiot still when i get in a heated argument i tend to d that.

12.punisher taking on wolverine does count for alot punisher was tenth for best heroes like i said was dont know if he is now but also mabey because they thought it be a good idea i mean they were both war vets who lost their family well sorta wolverine won once so did punisher no not venom suit never read it care to fill me in? and as i said befor he killed him in an alternate universe and no im younger than that im 13 still i got what you meant by that i hear it alot when i see other arguments tho its mainly an insult that isnt true
yea im a fanboy coming from the guy who said batman win by accident and ok im can get baned but you said''my 6 cousen can type better'' so you have the same chance as me of being baned pluss other comments youv posed


#62 Posted by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow too many points to look at lol

#63 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"Wow too many points to look at lol
"
yea no kidding the guy im arguing with is good tho
#64 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
  • Batman has had training in more than just your run of the mill karate. He is versed in every known form of h2h combat including your revered military training and he is a master of most forms of h2h combat. Even an expert marine would get handled by Batman though Punisher is a step above an expert marine because of a little bit of Captain America training. 
  • I was stating that I do not believe Punisher could handle the abuse and depravation that Batman took before he was mauled by Bane, much less survived the Bane attack. 
  • You can make a point and still make it legible.
  • Punisher is not a calculating man. His moves are not thought out at all. He would use a bazooka to kill a fly. Hardly a paced and conservative use of energy.
  • Alternate universes count for sh#t here. Do you want to know why? Because they did not happen according to the normal continuity. They matter as much as when you are making up a story from scratch at home. They are basically fan fiction but with paid writers. 
  • I said "so" and you have yet to prove anything. Show me a reference where Harvey is clearly portrayed as weak.
  • Just because Batman does not get his a## kicked every time he fights someone, does not mean Batman has a low pain threshold. It just means he is smart enough to dodge.
  • My saying that Batman kills Punisher by accident is clearly an overblown, over exaggerated statement. I said it to get some people in here. Batman still takes this in every possible way. 
#65 Posted by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio

Erik has some good points....a lot of what IU would have typed if he hadnt already said it

#66 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio

1.punisher has beet wolverine befor who again masters every style of combat batman hardly uses thos skills iv seen him use like judo and karate not much els

2.punisher was thrown through a window on his back but yes punisher couldnt take that much why was it that bad again i thought he just needed therapy to get better?.

3.very true my bad man

4.well they use the same moves and princibles the characters has and punisher beat daedevil befor

5. well what mkes him strong i mean the guy was a auterney then got the accident then got a gun not much with training has to use two hands for 1 shot gun while punisher can use two shotgun at a time.

6.iv seen batman give up after getting hit by scarcrow with a stick  iv seen times wher raobin had to save batman from things like death or toture speaking of that frank was totured alot and still was fine thats ounisher main traight he can endure extreme amounts of pain more than normal humans punisher dodges takes human sheilds and cover he does breifings befor each mission surveys the area then makes his attack interrogates people to tell info about the place so he is prepared but he can also think on the spot when not prepared

7.and yes in some ways batman wins but not in alot mabey a few

#67 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"

Erik has some good points....a lot of what IU would have typed if he hadnt already said it

"
pardon who were you talking to?
#68 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
  1. Wolverine is a master of every known martial arts style. He chooses not to use it most of the time because he has a healing factor and he likes to punish himself.
  2. If you are asking how bad is Batman's injury he still must wear a back brace when he goes out to fight crime. It was a permanent injury.
  3. Ok moving on.
  4. It does not matter. It is fan fiction. I could write a complete BS story featuring the two where Punisher does not lay a finger on Daredevil. Does that make it true or worth using in a debate?
  5. Just because you are an attorney, does not mean you are weak. After he was hurt, he brutalized many people. It would not be outlandish if he became very good at it. Just because you do not have military training does not mean you are weak. I have never had military training in my life but I know I am not weak. I am probably among the best in shape men here on the vine.
  6. There is a thing on the vine we use here to explain some of what you are describing. It is called PIS. Batman has been fine after every single one of his torture sessions except the Emperor Joker story arc. Which if you read it, you would know why. Your interrogation crap is completely pointless so I am just going to skip over it. You say Punisher can really think on the spot yet at the hands of Daredevil he lost because Daredevil outthought him. He even admitted to himself that Daredevil is smarter than him.
  7. There is no way Punisher wins unless it is a contest to see who carries the bigger gun (in case you did not know, Batman does not carry a gun).
#69 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Tradog said:
"Lunacyde said:
"

Erik has some good points....a lot of what IU would have typed if he hadnt already said it

"
pardon who were you talking to?
"
He was just making a statement based on his opinions. He is entitled to do it and it does not have to be directed at anyone. 
#70 Posted by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio
Tradog said:
"Lunacyde said:
"

Erik has some good points....a lot of what IU would have typed if he hadnt already said it

"
pardon who were you talking to?
"

Everyone
#71 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio

1. i see but has batman ever used his moves or at least more than wolverine?

2.i see so lets say punisher knees him or shoots him in the back what then?

4.well what i was talking about is showing what could hav happend punisher couldnt get pwnd by daredevil the what ifs im talking about or have seen have great stories and can accualy happen like marvel zombies.

5.yea i can brutalize people too anybody can and out of like a couple thousand you say you one of the most in shape? i saw your pics you look in shape like average in shape for your age you dont look bowflex in shape and your right on the other parts i think you might have got what i meant wrong

6.my interogation ''crap'' isnt pointless if you knew what the message was as for batman and hist toture well while that is amazing punisher has gone through worse what kinds of things has batman gone throug?

7.yes i said he can think on the spot not that he was an super genius matt murdock was a lawyer and with his hitend senses can dodge alot of franks punches but batman has a broken back no senses and not very fast reflexes so i say with prep batman wins without prep punisher wins and batman i guess also wins by hand to hand mabey cuz i know punisher has had his gun knock out of his hand befor and had one in his pants or a knife or something. very good arhument tho i beleave batman might accualy win

#72 Posted by SUNMAN (7374 posts) - - Show Bio
erik said:
"
  • Batman has had training in more than just your run of the mill karate. He is versed in every known form of h2h combat including your revered military training and he is a master of most forms of h2h combat. Even an expert marine would get handled by Batman though Punisher is a step above an expert marine because of a little bit of Captain America training. 
  • I was stating that I do not believe Punisher could handle the abuse and depravation that Batman took before he was mauled by Bane, much less survived the Bane attack. 
  • You can make a point and still make it legible.
  • Punisher is not a calculating man. His moves are not thought out at all. He would use a bazooka to kill a fly. Hardly a paced and conservative use of energy.
  • Alternate universes count for sh#t here. Do you want to know why? Because they did not happen according to the normal continuity. They matter as much as when you are making up a story from scratch at home. They are basically fan fiction but with paid writers. 
  • I said "so" and you have yet to prove anything. Show me a reference where Harvey is clearly portrayed as weak.
  • Just because Batman does not get his a## kicked every time he fights someone, does not mean Batman has a low pain threshold. It just means he is smart enough to dodge.
  • My saying that Batman kills Punisher by accident is clearly an overblown, over exaggerated statement. I said it to get some people in here. Batman still takes this in every possible way. 
"
1. no idea about h2h but I would probably say Bats is superior
2. I disagree Punisher has endured a lot his damage soak is intense maybe even higher than Batmans. From getting shot, stabbed, thrown out of buildings, broken bones etc. He has endured a lot.
4. Disagree. This is true sometimes but it depends what you read. Look at what he did when he encountered Sentry. He has planned some pretty impressive feats you are not giving him enough credit. I know he got handled by Bullseye not to long ago but still. Obviously, Bats is more calculating and better with prep but Punisher has his moments.
#73 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
erik said:
"Tradog said:
"Lunacyde said:
"

Erik has some good points....a lot of what IU would have typed if he hadnt already said it

"
pardon who were you talking to?
"
He was just making a statement based on his opinions. He is entitled to do it and it does not have to be directed at anyone. 
"

well of course wasnt saying he didnt have the right or wasnt entitled to just woundering what he meant a at who he said everyone and with all do respect i wasnt talking to you about this i was talking to him and plus he said ''a lot of what U would have typed if he hadnt said it'' so im just assuming he was talking to someone.
#74 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio

also punisher has had his rib shot out by a shotgun and the guy who did it grabed at his lings trying to get to his heart and when punisher threw him out the window the guy was stabbing him in his back with a glass shard if you don't beleave me here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPpuISBP_Bs high quility to make out the words.

#75 Posted by Phones (894 posts) - - Show Bio

punisher

#76 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Tradog said:
"1. i see but has batman ever used his moves or at least more than wolverine?

2.i see so lets say punisher knees him or shoots him in the back what then?

4.well what i was talking about is showing what could hav happend punisher couldnt get pwnd by daredevil the what ifs im talking about or have seen have great stories and can accualy happen like marvel zombies.

5.yea i can brutalize people too anybody can and out of like a couple thousand you say you one of the most in shape? i saw your pics you look in shape like average in shape for your age you dont look bowflex in shape and your right on the other parts i think you might have got what i meant wrong

6.my interogation ''crap'' isnt pointless if you knew what the message was as for batman and hist toture well while that is amazing punisher has gone through worse what kinds of things has batman gone throug?

7.yes i said he can think on the spot not that he was an super genius matt murdock was a lawyer and with his hitend senses can dodge alot of franks punches but batman has a broken back no senses and not very fast reflexes so i say with prep batman wins without prep punisher wins and batman i guess also wins by hand to hand mabey cuz i know punisher has had his gun knock out of his hand befor and had one in his pants or a knife or something. very good arhument tho i beleave batman might accualy win"
  1. He always uses his martial arts training.
  2. Batman has a protective back brace.
  3. I am sorry but no.
  4. ........
  5. Batman was tortured to death countless times during the Emperor Joker story arc. 
  6. You talk about Batman's back as if it is a variable in any fight. He has a back brace that absorbs the damage his back would normally endure. Batman is fast. He dodges gunfire on a nightly basis. Not everyone likes to take the bullet to show how tough they are like Punisher. The best showings for Punisher were when he fought Daredevil as far as h2h is concerned and when Punisher won, he did barely whereas when Daredevil won, he did definitively. 
#77 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
SUNMAN said:
1. no idea about h2h but I would probably say Bats is superior
2. I disagree Punisher has endured a lot his damage soak is intense maybe even higher than Batmans. From getting shot, stabbed, thrown out of buildings, broken bones etc. He has endured a lot.
4. Disagree. This is true sometimes but it depends what you read. Look at what he did when he encountered Sentry. He has planned some pretty impressive feats you are not giving him enough credit. I know he got handled by Bullseye not to long ago but still. Obviously, Bats is more calculating and better with prep but Punisher has his moments."
  1. Sounds good to me.
  2. Nothing Punisher has endured is better than what Batman has.
  3. I may not be giving him enough credit but I am going off of what is more consistent, not his proudest moments which are few and far between. 
#78 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
#79 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio

Uh-huh. I never said that he does not have a high pain threshold. Never once did I even imply that. I am saying that he still loses. 

#80 Posted by Xehanort (48 posts) - - Show Bio

Punisher shoots Bats in the head. There fight is over

#81 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Xehanort said:
"Punisher shoots Bats in the head. There fight is over
"
Not so much.
#82 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
erik said:
"Uh-huh. I never said that he does not have a high pain threshold. Never once did I even imply that. I am saying that he still loses. "

in the video it showed scan when punisher was fighting the guy shot out his rib like it was gone then dug in their grabbing his lung trying to get his heart and as punisher was throwing him out the window the guy was stabbing him in the back or spine whi a big glass shard so i dont think batman can do that or anything to hurt the punisher too bad and considering punisher threw that guy on his back im sure punisher can do the same to batman.
#83 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Tradog said:
"erik said:
"Uh-huh. I never said that he does not have a high pain threshold. Never once did I even imply that. I am saying that he still loses. "

in the video it showed scan when punisher was fighting the guy shot out his rib like it was gone then dug in their grabbing his lung trying to get his heart and as punisher was throwing him out the window the guy was stabbing him in the back or spine whi a big glass shard so i dont think batman can do that or anything to hurt the punisher too bad and considering punisher threw that guy on his back im sure punisher can do the same to batman."
Yet Daredevil beat him so bad he just sat there waiting for a death that Daredevil would not deliver. 
#84 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
erik said:
"Tradog said:
"erik said:
"Uh-huh. I never said that he does not have a high pain threshold. Never once did I even imply that. I am saying that he still loses. "

in the video it showed scan when punisher was fighting the guy shot out his rib like it was gone then dug in their grabbing his lung trying to get his heart and as punisher was throwing him out the window the guy was stabbing him in the back or spine whi a big glass shard so i dont think batman can do that or anything to hurt the punisher too bad and considering punisher threw that guy on his back im sure punisher can do the same to batman."
Yet Daredevil beat him so bad he just sat there waiting for a death that Daredevil would not deliver. 
"
well batman was beaten by nightwing with like one punch. While batman is a better hand to hand combat fighter....he would likely end up dead by the end of this one. He can't kill....that can be a problem. So in a fight to the death...batman dies. Now let me be clear, I love the Punisher. He is my favorite comic character ever. If he approched Batman in a war-like frame of mind, he would indeed have the advantage. Like if they were in the jungle for instance, Frank would murder Batsy pretty quick. I mean Bruce has no experience with war  lets see a bazooka vs a boomerang unless batman can dofge bullets he cant win however i will say this in hand to hand batman wins because
This has already been done in a comic cross over. The first one by marvel. Punisher meets Azrael and forces azrael to run. The second comic is by DC and this time Frank Castle meets The bruce wayne Batman. Heres how it went down. Batman stops punisher from killing Joker. Batman give some line about not killing. Punisher gives some line about all the people that have died. They argue. Punisher punches Batman. Batman says "I'm going to let you have that one because you think I deserve it" Punisher goes for a second punch. Batman beats the crap out of the punisher. H breaks some ribs and one of the punisher's arms, forcing him to run away. so with prep and weapons punisher wins without prep or weapons batman wins or without prep and weapons batman wins without prep and with weapons punisher wins
#85 Edited by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio

If ther eis prep time you have to take in account that Batman is getting the same amount of prep time that the Punisher is getting, and we all know that there are VERY few people who can out-prep Batman. For goodness sakes it's called the Bat-Factor for a reason. Punisher may have guns, grenades, bombs, knives, etc. but that is not something Batman can't work around with prep time. All those weapons become inconsequential with a few well placed gasbombs, flash-bangs, or any other number of gadgets Batman will be packing.

Batman may be at a disadvantage because he doesnt have guns, but he has fought characters before who are better than/ just as good Marksmen as Punisher. ( Ex. Deadshot, Hush) Like I have already said there are plenty of counters to a gun based enemy.

Lastly it NEVER said this was a fight to the death. Punisher's durability and pain tolerance don't come into play as much if Batman just immobilizes him, which he very well could do, especially with some of his gadgets.

#86 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"

If ther eis prep time you have to take in account that Batman is getting the same amount of prep time that the Punisher is getting, and we all know that there are VERY few people who can out-prep Batman. For goodness sakes it's called the Bat-Factor for a reason. Punisher may have guns, grenades, bombs, knives, etc. but that is not something Batman can't work around with prep time. All those weapons become inconsequential with a few well placed gasbombs, flash-bangs, or any other number of gadgets Batman will be packing.

Batman may be at a disadvantage because he doesnt have guns, but he has fought characters before who are better than/ just as good Marksmen as Punisher. ( Ex. Deadshot, Hush) Like I have already said there are plenty of counters to a gun based enemy.

Lastly it NEVER said this was a fight to the death. Punisher's durability and pain tolerance don't come into play as much if Batman just immobilizes him, which he very well could do, especially with some of his gadgets.

"
Very nice Lunacyde. Logic prevails, Batman wins.
#87 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"

If ther eis prep time you have to take in account that Batman is getting the same amount of prep time that the Punisher is getting, and we all know that there are VERY few people who can out-prep Batman. For goodness sakes it's called the Bat-Factor for a reason. Punisher may have guns, grenades, bombs, knives, etc. but that is not something Batman can't work around with prep time. All those weapons become inconsequential with a few well placed gasbombs, flash-bangs, or any other number of gadgets Batman will be packing.

Batman may be at a disadvantage because he doesnt have guns, but he has fought characters before who are better than/ just as good Marksmen as Punisher. ( Ex. Deadshot, Hush) Like I have already said there are plenty of counters to a gun based enemy.

Lastly it NEVER said this was a fight to the death. Punisher's durability and pain tolerance don't come into play as much if Batman just immobilizes him, which he very well could do, especially with some of his gadgets.

"
well punisher with prep was able to take on hulk batman even with prep has to lose first then come back and kick butt and yes batman has his batcave but unless batman decides to come out with a robot or some kinda armor like with superman wich i doubt seeing as how batman wouldnt do that for ''just a  basic trained marine''  batman would probely come with a bullet proof vest and a few flash bangs but think about it yes batman has the batcave but punisher has the battle van in it he has info on just about everybody every type of weapon and exsposive and bellets that go through kevlare or steel  punisher's marksminship was good enough to hit spiderman punisher can pack gernades rockets hanguns rifals at once batman can only carrie a few exsplosives and mabey a last resort but punisher can just shoot batmans utility belt not that hard.

yes he has fought those people but deadshot uses lasers batman was probly in like some room and used the invierment but i read on here that when he attempted to replace batman he was arrested later by batman and gorden still punisher went head to head with deadpool who could beat deadshot and hush and punisher fought jigsaw with ironman tech or someone with it.

yea it never did but when has punisher ever just let anyone go? batman would try to stop him but punisher would just kill him in the end also how would batman imobolize him punisher has taken bullets and tazers and batman only ties up the people in his fights punisher when he turned himself in needed chains and a lock to contain him the joker has escaped batman's captures the only people batman accualy mobolizes are random criminals or someone with powers that need a certain something clayface mr freeze all them

like i said tho i dont think punisher wins in everyway just a few
#88 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
erik said:
"Lunacyde said:
"

If ther eis prep time you have to take in account that Batman is getting the same amount of prep time that the Punisher is getting, and we all know that there are VERY few people who can out-prep Batman. For goodness sakes it's called the Bat-Factor for a reason. Punisher may have guns, grenades, bombs, knives, etc. but that is not something Batman can't work around with prep time. All those weapons become inconsequential with a few well placed gasbombs, flash-bangs, or any other number of gadgets Batman will be packing.

Batman may be at a disadvantage because he doesnt have guns, but he has fought characters before who are better than/ just as good Marksmen as Punisher. ( Ex. Deadshot, Hush) Like I have already said there are plenty of counters to a gun based enemy.

Lastly it NEVER said this was a fight to the death. Punisher's durability and pain tolerance don't come into play as much if Batman just immobilizes him, which he very well could do, especially with some of his gadgets.

"
Very nice Lunacyde. Logic prevails, Batman wins."
yea it was good but he only wins at some parts the debate isnt over.
#89 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
  1. Punisher does not have the means to take on the Hulk anymore even with prep. He no longer has the venom suit. The only other time he went up against the Hulk, he did not even fight him. Spider-Man was and Punisher just blew them up.
  2. We already went over the whole Spider-Man thing. Do not try to sneak it back in.
  3. Punisher is not breaking out of Batman's restraints. 
  4. Even with prep there is not much information he could gather on Batman. Most people in Gotham do not know jack about him other than he likes to hurt bad guys.
  5. Punisher is not beating Hush and Deadshot together. Punisher did not even beat Deadpool. Deadpool is a clown and after Punisher smashed a television on Deadpool's head, he left. No winner in that fight at all. Punisher was fighting his guts out and Deadpool was just clowning around.
#90 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
erik said:
"
  1. Punisher does not have the means to take on the Hulk anymore even with prep. He no longer has the venom suit. The only other time he went up against the Hulk, he did not even fight him. Spider-Man was and Punisher just blew them up.
  2. We already went over the whole Spider-Man thing. Do not try to sneak it back in.
  3. Punisher is not breaking out of Batman's restraints. 
  4. Even with prep there is not much information he could gather on Batman. Most people in Gotham do not know jack about him other than he likes to hurt bad guys.
  5. Punisher is not beating Hush and Deadshot together. Punisher did not even beat Deadpool. Deadpool is a clown and after Punisher smashed a television on Deadpool's head, he left. No winner in that fight at all. Punisher was fighting his guts out and Deadpool was just clowning around.
"
1.accualy hulk and punisher have had quite a few confrontation in almost all of them he managed to hold his own and even more important not get smashed.also in wwh

2.we didnt really go over it you just said it was bs because you couldnt beleave spiderman coultnt dodge it

3.all batman has are ropes punisher broke out of wire rope hand cuff shackles and after he was done getting question he got out of his chains batman cant even hold joker when hes watching him joker eaither get away or batman takes his eyes off him so he will likely do the same with punisher
 4.punisher was able to get info on well hidden people in russia so im sure he can interrogate or find out about batman

5.i said deadpool can beat hush and deadshot and even tho punisher didnt beat deadpool he was able not to get killed deadpool kills his enemys if when he isnt serious deadpool may be funny but he is a highly skilled assassin/merc  he is no joke when it comes to fighting of course deadpool was playing around he wasnt even serous when he had to kill some zombies and punisher at least was able to pin him down long enough to get away that counts for something
#91 Posted by Secret Turchin Man (1789 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman in a terrible beating for Frank.

#92 Posted by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio

1. Whether Punisher can take Hulk or not with prep is irrelevent. How much do Batman and Hulk have in common? NEXT TO NOTHING.

2.Many people consider Punisher tagging Spider-man PIS. Maybe it is...maybe it isnt. It's not a very important point to this debate though.

3. Batman doesnt use ropes. He uses cables, typical metal handcuffs, etc. It doesnt matter though. It's not like when Batman gets him tied up or cuffed he is just going to not pay attention to him. If he tries escaping it takes time and Bats isnt going to let that happen. Besides the fight is basically over if he is wrapped up/immobilized.

4. What is he going to find out? Only a select number of people know ANYTHING about Batman. I am talking like you can count them on one hand.Besides as hard as it is going to be for Punisher to get info on Batman it is pretty easy for Batman to get info on Castle and know exactly what to expect. If Punisher gets info on batman , chances are Batman will know about it.

5. Who kills who is not necesarily relevent to this fight. Deadpool is "skilled" but is also A.) Mentally retarded B.) Rarely serious C.) Relies heavily on his healing factor.

#93 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio

@ Tradog:


  1. I agree with Lunacyde.
  2. It is PIS and there is no getting around it.
  3. Lies. Batman does not use standard rope or shackles.
  4. Wrong. He is going to interrogate the average run of the mill thug and get nothing other than Batman is a monster who eats babies.
  5. He did not pin Deadpool at all. He busted a television over Deadpool's head and walked away while Deadpool was cracking a joke.
#94 Posted by The Maniac (19 posts) - - Show Bio

Punisher plans his missions to the last detail, if things don't go as planned he can more than hold his own in h2h if needed, otherwise he just blows things up quicker. 
Batman gets informed before a battle and does think faster in a fight and has more fighting styles than the Punisher.  He just has to avoid the firepower.
That being said: it depends on the writer, if it's a DC writer, Batman wins, a Marvel writer Batman wins, just takes longer.

#95 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"1. Whether Punisher can take Hulk or not with prep is irrelevent. How much do Batman and Hulk have in common? NEXT TO NOTHING.

2.Many people consider Punisher tagging Spider-man PIS. Maybe it is...maybe it isnt. It's not a very important point to this debate though.

3. Batman doesnt use ropes. He uses cables, typical metal handcuffs, etc. It doesnt matter though. It's not like when Batman gets him tied up or cuffed he is just going to not pay attention to him. If he tries escaping it takes time and Bats isnt going to let that happen. Besides the fight is basically over if he is wrapped up/immobilized.

4. What is he going to find out? Only a select number of people know ANYTHING about Batman. I am talking like you can count them on one hand.Besides as hard as it is going to be for Punisher to get info on Batman it is pretty easy for Batman to get info on Castle and know exactly what to expect. If Punisher gets info on batman , chances are Batman will know about it.

5. Who kills who is not necesarily relevent to this fight. Deadpool is "skilled" but is also A.) Mentally retarded B.) Rarely serious C.) Relies heavily on his healing factor.
"
1.punisher i one of the few people that  can prepare for the hulk without an army or team and not get smashed no they have nothing in common but still i dont think batman would be able to stand up to hulk without some type of armor.

2.if it isnt PIS its important because as eric said spiderman dodged gunfire befor but at the same time they were just thugs but their were many of them and spiderman got shot in the arm but it was a helicopter punisher comes up and gets him easy so if he can get someone like spiderman who is much faster than batman he can much easly get batman

3.batman let the joker escape and thats like the worst villan you can let escape so im sure punisher can too he can escape almost anything and your right i would count as a win if he did that but two things one that would mean batman would eather rush punisher wich wouldnt be smart  and two he knocks punisher's weapons out of his hands then it would be h2h and as i said befor batman would win in h2h and punisher carries tazers so if he tazed batman and batman fell would that count as a win?

4.well how does punisher find out about a lot of people? he goes to the big guys like gordon  or whoever els knows and no one knows punisher who isnt dead so all batman's got is he i a vigilante so likely he will only bring a baterang and a rope while punisher will bring bazzokas tazers and other arsonals punisher has fough enough costumed people to know to pack heavy.

5.its not relivent? well in anycase its just hard to imagin punisher not killing anyone but A.)he is supposed to be but i think more goofy not retarded B.)yea i mean he fights good either way C.)he doesnt just lets himself get shot everytime think of it this way batman relies heavily on  his belt but doesnt only just that.
#96 Posted by Tradog (1916 posts) - - Show Bio
erik said:
"@ Tradog:

  1. I agree with Lunacyde.
  2. It is PIS and there is no getting around it.
  3. Lies. Batman does not use standard rope or shackles.
  4. Wrong. He is going to interrogate the average run of the mill thug and get nothing other than Batman is a monster who eats babies.
  5. He did not pin Deadpool at all. He busted a television over Deadpool's head and walked away while Deadpool was cracking a joke.
"
1. thats understandable
2.how so?
3.ok wire or cable punisher has broken out of wire dont knoe bout cable
4.not necessarily if frank cant get info from the small fries he goes for the big ones like jim gordon and everyone knows him or he might run into joker or harvey
5.ok he staled him long enough to get away and he probly lost interest or deadpool just being deadpool
#97 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Tradog said:
1. thats understandable
2.how so?
3.ok wire or cable punisher has broken out of wire dont knoe bout cable
4.not necessarily if frank cant get info from the small fries he goes for the big ones like jim gordon and everyone knows him or he might run into joker or harvey
5.ok he staled him long enough to get away and he probly lost interest or deadpool just being deadpool"
  1. Moving on.
  2. It is PIS because Spider-Man never gets shot by gunfire. You do know what PIS is do you not? I suppose that it makes sense to you that Spider-Man does things like the picture featured below nearly every issue, but Punisher fires one pistol shot and nails Spider-Man. By the way, that villain is stating his lasers go the speed of light which makes sense because they are lasers. That is much faster than a bullet.
  3. It does not matter. Batman does not carry standard restraints. He carries stuff that holds Killer Croc who is much more powerful than Punisher can even hope to become.
  4. Yeah, He is going to beat an innocent man senseless. Does that sound like Punisher to you? I believe Punisher's vow included not hurting the innocent. 
  5. He did not stall anything. He was frustrated that he could not beat Deadpool who was not even taking the fight seriously. If he had been, Deadpool would have killed Punisher. Deadpool is cursed with life on top of his healing factor. There is no reason for him to take any fight seriously.
#98 Posted by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio

In all fairness him dodging lasers that move the speed of light is also PIS...

#99 Posted by Erik (32505 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"In all fairness him dodging lasers that move the speed of light is also PIS..."
Not really. His spider sense puts him where he needs to be to avoid them. It does not really have much to do with his own speed. His spider sense is a form of precognition. 
#100 Posted by Lunacyde (20284 posts) - - Show Bio

Yea...but are you aware how fast light moves? He has been tagged by much slower before.