#1 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Battlefield

Top Team Blue. Bottom Team Red.

Rules

Strength - Must start, keyword, start at 80 Tons Max, however Strength cannot exceed 200 tons.

Durability - Healing Factor is unlimited. You can be immune to harm!

Speed - Hyper Sonic (Mach 5) is fastest.

Powers - Falls in Line with Demolishing Large Mansion in one Hit.

Time Powers - Allowed but cannot be used as Time Freezing or Reversing Time. Cannot increase your own speed to past Hyper Sonic.

Reality Warping / Transmutation - Cannot be used on Enemy Team.

Telepathy - Wolrd Level, and no Illusions or Mind Raping.

Gear must fit the rules.

No BFR.

Morals will be on.

Teams

beatboks1 Negative man, Arani Caulder / Celcius, Amazing Man ( original will Everett), Post COIE Wally West

theorder14 Archer (FSN), Tohno Shiki (Tsukihime), Daemon Spade (Reborn), Killua (HxH)

#2 Posted by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

finally found this after a couple dozen reworded google searches. be back to start my debate after I find out who the hell my opponents are

#3 Posted by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Posted by dondave (36124 posts) - - Show Bio

This should be good

#5 Posted by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

@theorder14:

Negative man - founding member of the Doom Patrol. Negative energy soul self that can destroy anything of positive energy or matter on touch, and phase through things. His body could use the negative energy to have sonic speed.

Arani Caulder / Celcius- Trained in Martial arts and mystics by Tibetan monks. When Niles Caulder ( the Doom Patrol's "chief") gave her his immortality serum it kicked in her meta gene. She generates intense heat from one hand (molten lava hot) and freazing cold from the other. Doesn't age and has a healing factor

Amazing Man ( original will Everett) - retconned as DC's first Afro American hero in the 40's. Courtesy of being altered by Ultra Humanite he has the power to take on the properties of whatever he touched. By touching steel he becomes lik Colosus, Rubber like Plastic man. When he touched an electro magnet he had magnetic powers ( which stuck for a while)

Post COIE Wally West - this version of wally was only Sonic speed level ( from his page for this era "He was still consigned to relatively low speeds, only 700 miles per hour or so.") and had a LOT more limitations

Hope that helps

#6 Edited by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio

@beatboks1: Yea thank you.

Archer - A Anti-heroic spirit from the future. He can use projection to create countless of weapons and reinforcement to strengthen those weapons and himself. He's hypersonic in combat speed and his favorite weapons in close combat are Kanshou and Bakuya.

Tohno Shiki - From a demon-slaying clan and trained in the assassination arts since he was a child. One of the techniques he learned from childhood is called the Flash sheath,gives him the ability to perform insanely fast slashes. The other one is called the Flash run, allows him to fight in high speed. Excels at stealth and can detect the presence of inhuman. He can see the death of all things in the forms of dots and lines and can erase them from existence if he stab the dots or cut the lines.

Daemon Spade - lived on for ten generations by possessing other ppl. He's a master illusionist and have full control of his senses. Got a powerful healing factor and possess most of the gears and powers of the Vongola and Shimon family.

Killua - A hunter who's a expert at stealth and assassination. Hypersonic in combat speed and easily massively hypersonic if he use Raikou Sekka so i won't be using that technique. He have opened a 16 ton door without using nen and a 64 ton with nen. So he's at least at 64 - 128 ton with nen. Can transmute his aura into electricity and have lighting speed reaction.

so. you start?

#7 Posted by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

@theorder14: It will be about 18 hrs before I can kick things off. If you want to start before then feel free.

#8 Edited by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio

@beatboks1: okay then.

As soon as the fight begins, each and every one of them will go into stealth mode. Archer will turn into his spiritual body erasing his presence and becomes invisible so it's unlikely the enemies will detect him, however he cannot attack the enemies in that state. He will go to the highest vantage point and search for the opponents from there. Archer can reinforce his eyes and see everything within 4000 meters so i believe he's the one who will detect your team first.

Tohno Shiki and Killua will go together. They can erase their presence and hide in the bushes, in the house or under the water. Daemon will support the team and hide himself by using the flame mist. It's most likely my team will get the first move and get a drop on the enemies with a surprise attack unless they have a way to detect my team.

Here's some scans of Killua, Tohno and Daemon using their stealth. Tohno Shiki here turned into his other alter ego and sneaked up on Arcueid (who's around high supersonic to low hypersonic speed) and cut her 17 times before she could react.

#9 Posted by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

The battlefield is an island and us starting off it on what looks like a reef for you and a jetty for me. So to begin Arani will freeze the water water from around the island ( only out as far s the circular reef). That's going to make progress pretty slow for you and stealth pretty hard. How exactly does one stealthily approach an island when your freezing. You won't be moving fast and you'll leave signs in the ice and the frost on the beach. Plus I have more cover on my side of the island than you. Wally and Larry ( Negative man) would search our side of the island at high speed. Knowing it was clear Arani would then go to the other extreme and user her heat powers to make the other half of the island extremely hot. This ( having used her power to make such extremes in such a short time) would leave her weakened but it would cause shock in the unprepared systems of your team. You would be disoriented and have trouble with your senses ( even those with heightened ones).

It's clearly some type of resort on the island, Wally will carry Will ( Amazingman) in close at speed where Will will do some laying of hands on a rubber ball. Presto chango and I have an instant plasticman a la

In his super stretchy and flexible state he will act as a catapult ( massive slingshot) to hurl large boulders at the area of your approach. Wally will use his much lower speed here to create a wind vortex with his arms to put your team on the back foot.

Once pushed back by Wally's winds Larry will blast a trench in front of your team to keep them contained.

By this stage Arani will have recovered and will create hot air pockets that Wally will then blow at you. These will quite literally take you wind away and leave you fighting for air.

#10 Edited by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio
@beatboks1 said:

The battlefield is an island and us starting off it on what looks like a reef for you and a jetty for me. So to begin Arani will freeze the water water from around the island ( only out as far s the circular reef). That's going to make progress pretty slow for you and stealth pretty hard. How exactly does one stealthily approach an island when your freezing. You won't be moving fast and you'll leave signs in the ice and the frost on the beach. Plus I have more cover on my side of the island than you. Wally and Larry ( Negative man) would search our side of the island at high speed. Knowing it was clear Arani would then go to the other extreme and user her heat powers to make the other half of the island extremely hot. This ( having used her power to make such extremes in such a short time) would leave her weakened but it would cause shock in the unprepared systems of your team. You would be disoriented and have trouble with your senses ( even those with heightened ones).

I highly doubt freezing the water is gonna affect their stealth. Like i said, Archer will turn into his spiritual body and fly up to search for the enemies, no attacks will hurt him when he's in this form until he turns back into his material body. Daemon Spade could create flame shields and a simple silent dash is enough for them to reach the island without having to leave any trails. I believe every single one in my team have the reaction and speed to avoid Arani's heat powers and even if it would some how reach the team, Daemon Spade could create several shield to protect Shiki. Killua wouldn't even need it thanks to his nen shield and if it's necessary Daemon could simply teleport them with the warp portal.

@beatboks1 said:

It's clearly some type of resort on the island, Wally will carry Will ( Amazingman) in close at speed where Will will do some laying of hands on a rubber ball. Presto chango and I have an instant plasticman a la

In his super stretchy and flexible state he will act as a catapult ( massive slingshot) to hurl large boulders at the area of your approach. Wally will use his much lower speed here to create a wind vortex with his arms to put your team on the back foot.

Once pushed back by Wally's winds Larry will blast a trench in front of your team to keep them contained.

By this stage Arani will have recovered and will create hot air pockets that Wally will then blow at you. These will quite literally take you wind away and leave you fighting for air.

How would u know the location of my team now again? Even if the enemies could detect them, I don't think any boulders or wind vortex would tag any1 in my team. Most of them r low hypersonic and have even greater reaction speed and they could use severals shields if they have to.Daemon Spade have two shields he can use to support the team. Hibari's cloud flame roll(could also be used offensive) and the Sistema C.I.A Shields that easily blocked Tsuna's high speed X-cannon.

Daemon also have lots of techniques he could use to distract and hurt the enemies at a distance. He possess almost every powers and gears of the Vongola and Shimon family.For example, he can create countless of blizzardroids and each and every one of them have the same fighting power as Suzuki Adelheid but are less skilled. Able to use the Swamp flames element to make the ground muddy . Can make waves of sword slashes. Use the leaf cutter for distractions etc. Yea, i don't see any of ur team catching a break, especially against the blizzardroids. Every single one of them have sharp blades that could deal fatal damage. How durable r ur team btw? I read about them but there's no mention on durability.

Archer have hawk like eyes and can see everything within 4km like i mentioned. The moment Archer find his enemies, he will materialise and attack from their blind spot with his bow. Archer is proficient with projectiles and is capable of tagging enemies with hypersonic + speed thanks to his low level clairvoyance. I think none of ur team have the reaction or the speed to avoid his attacks especially when it comes from their blind spot. Archer will project one of his fastest arrows and start shooting at Arani while she's busy using her heat powers but she doesn't have to be the only target. Archer can change the course of his arrows so it could hit several foes. The arrow is called Hrunting and if it's used as a broken phantasm it can travel at hypersonic + speed.

Archer can shoot Hrunting 5 times in a row with 20 sec intervals depending on how much mana he puts into it. He will then have to wait for a moment to recharge his mana but is still able to project weapons from the Unlimited Blade Works.

Here in this vid, Archer snipes and kills the protagonist at 1:00

In this vid below, it shows Archer facing against Saber and the protagonist. Each time the protagonist dies, he travels back to time so he have experienced getting killed by Archer several times b4 . At 0.00 to 5:40 shows the final showdown between them. You can read the whole thing if you want the details. Otherwise, u can skip to 2:25 . Note that everything that occurs during 2:25 to 5:40 happens under one second in real time

#11 Edited by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

really wont affect stealth? hiw do you cross ice without leaving a sign of doing so. coming from ice to sand with cold wet feat ( ice will ment under body heat at least a little) how do you not leave tracks in sand. even if you try to cover them there will be signs of covering them. intense cold like that will also cause frost that you will have to leave visible. not to mention the very simple thing that in cold like that your very breath is visible. seriously the sprirt one is the only one who wont be easy to see the path of.

I never said she was using her heat powers against them. she's using them on the battle field turning it from its starting tropical area to an arctic type zone and then an area of intense desert/volcanic area. unless your planning on leaving the battlefield ( giving me the win) there's no way to avoid my planned attack as its not on your team but the entire area.

I never said I know where your team is i just know where their not ( having searched my side of the island at super speed). Since my plan is then to close off your avenues of approach with a blast from Negative man. the same blast can be used to ionize the air so any portal created to come into our area would result in an explosion taking down your team.

the vortexes and the debri that will be blown by them( from AM catapult breaking rocks and dust from impact) and the heated air are all a wide field attack not targeted.

Shields arent going to be any good. Negative man's energy self is negative energy contact with any positive energy or matter if he wants to will destroy it

#12 Edited by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio
@beatboks1 said:

really wont affect stealth? hiw do you cross ice without leaving a sign of doing so. coming from ice to sand with cold wet feat ( ice will ment under body heat at least a little) how do you not leave tracks in sand. even if you try to cover them there will be signs of covering them. intense cold like that will also cause frost that you will have to leave visible. not to mention the very simple thing that in cold like that your very breath is visible. seriously the sprirt one is the only one who wont be easy to see the path of.

Like i said, they only need to dash once to reach the island whiteout having to touch the ice or they could just simply use the shields as foothold. Daemon could easily use the desert flame element to instantly cover their tracks so no, there won't be any signs of them covering the sands at all. Killua have his Ken shield so i highly doubt some cold will do anything to him.The only one i can see being affected by the cold is Tohno Shiki but Daemon Spade will cover him with the flame shield like i mentioned.

@beatboks1 said:

I never said she was using her heat powers against them. she's using them on the battle field turning it from its starting tropical area to an arctic type zone and then an area of intense desert/volcanic area. unless your planning on leaving the battlefield ( giving me the win) there's no way to avoid my planned attack as its not on your team but the entire area.

The thing is that she isn't using her powers on ur side of the island, right? With the help of Daemon Spade, they will escape up to the air with the help of Hibari's roll (they can use it as foothold) and by now, Archer should have already fired his Hrunting, causing some serious damage on your team.

@beatboks1 said:

I never said I know where your team is i just know where their not ( having searched my side of the island at super speed). Since my plan is then to close off your avenues of approach with a blast from Negative man. the same blast can be used to ionize the air so any portal created to come into our area would result in an explosion taking down your team.the vortexes and the debri that will be blown by them( from AM catapult breaking rocks and dust from impact) and the heated air are all a wide field attack not targeted.

I think the opposite would happen, the flames of the night would explode on ur side of the Island first and it's only then they're going through the warp portal.+ What's the Negative man's reaction speed? I believe every single one in my team are too fast for him to react. They could also just simply speed blitz at high supersonic to low hypersonic speed.

@beatboks1 said:

Shields arent going to be any good. Negative man's energy self is negative energy contact with any positive energy or matter if he wants to will destroy it

Except they're not ordinary shields. He won't be able to affect Killua nen shield becuse it's his aura and Negative man won't be able to see it. Hibari's hedgehog Roll could be used defensive and offensive. The Sistema C.A.I shield are using the storm and rain flame as energy. And last and not least, we have Archer's magical shield, the Rho Aius. It's powerful enough to block the Gae bolg, one of the most hax weapon in the fate series. Gae bolgs bends causality so let's say it hits Superman, it would most definitely kill him. Now the Rho Aius shield eats up more mana than usual so Archer won't be using it frequently and will only summon it when it's a emergency.

So how exactly will Negative Man destroy every shields here?

#13 Edited by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

your first poiny makes no sense whatsoever. using flame ( any type) to cover tracks on ice makes more of a sign of them. a "quick dash" on ive will have you slippinh over and "quck" isnt stealthy, so are you being quick or stealthy.

no actually I intend for arani to use her cold and heat powers from our starting point as soon as battle starts. so she will be from where we are

Negative man is a sonic level speedster. the only powers he has besides his negative energy self are that the energy allos him to run super fast and slightly enhances his strength. think Quicksilver from marvel Level speed and reactions. frankly he's probably a bit above the version of Wally I have who IIRC was only Mach 2 or 3 speed level back then

it doesn't matter what type of shield it is or energy if it's positive ( as in coming from a mositive mass and matter universe) then contact with negative energy ( coming from negative mass or an anti matter universe) it's destroyed. unless your saying that your characters are anti matter characters then they definitely will br worse for wear if they make any sort of contact with Negative man when he allows himself to phase into reality. the only thing that makes him able to interact in a matter universe is the specially treated bandage that is wrapped around his body. That's also the only thing that allows his energy form to carry his body.

his energy only has to touch anything of positive matter or energy and he allow himself to come into phase with it to destrroy it.

#14 Edited by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio

@beatboks1: Ah okay, thought u read the links i posted, anyways

your first poiny makes no sense whatsoever. using flame ( any type) to cover tracks on ice makes more of a sign of them. a "quick dash" on ive will have you slippinh over and "quck" isnt stealthy, so are you being quick or stealthy.

Daemon Spade is a illusionist so he can use illusions to cover their tracks(From what i've heard from @cadencev2, Illusions is not allowed to be used to change the enemies perceptions and mind which Daemon isn't doing here). Killua and Shiki can move at high speed and still remain stealthy. guess i'll have to show you some examples then.(btw, i did mention they could use shields as foothold, right?)

Here's early series Killua using the rhythm echo.It's explained here.

Here it shows Killua dashing, and again like i said he could use the shields as foothold at the beginning of the fight.

In this vid. Killua speedblitz a serial killer *quietly* before he could react >.>.

(If u want, i can also show some feats of Tohno Shiki but it might take a while since i don't have them right now)

Killua have been trained ever since he was 3. Experiencing immense pain and torture and it was a everyday activity for him. He's been trained in the assassination arts and stealth ever since.

here's some more examples from another person named Knov from the same HxH universe and i believe Killua is more skilled at stealth than him.

If your not convinced, i still have some more stealth feats of Killua.

it doesn't matter what type of shield it is or energy if it's positive ( as in coming from a mositive mass and matter universe) then contact with negative energy ( coming from negative mass or an anti matter universe) it's destroyed. unless your saying that your characters are anti matter characters then they definitely will br worse for wear if they make any sort of contact with Negative man when he allows himself to phase into reality. the only thing that makes him able to interact in a matter universe is the specially treated bandage that is wrapped around his body. That's also the only thing that allows his energy form to carry his body.

his energy only has to touch anything of positive matter or energy and he allow himself to come into phase with it to destrroy it.

Can you show some scans of him destroying shields then? Even if he could destroy them, how many can he destroy at once? Daemon spade could just recreate the shields. Also, Archer will only use his Rho Aius when someone attacks so it's not like he's going to have it activated. For example, let's say someone shoot a projectile against Shiki, Archer have the reaction and his low level clairvoyance to use Rho Aius in time to protect him and then deactivate it. Negative Man wouldn't even get to do anything unless he's the one attacking.

what's Negative Man's durability and reaction speed? Because most of my team will be moving at hypersonic speed and the shield is also capable of moving at high speed, it could even be used offensive.(Already posted some of the scans but i'll just post it again anyway.)

#15 Posted by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

@theorder14:

Sorry dude I'm going to have to drop out. I got home from work an hour or so ago and have been thumbing through some old Doom Patrol issues to get scans.

It seems I've well untruly broken the rules of the tourney picking negative man. Yeah his running speed is sonic ( for his physical body) but the speed of his energy form is light speed

Clearly well over the tourney's speed limit. I honestly didn't remember him being anywhere near that fast when I picked him

Combine that with the fact that in issue 98 of the original Doom Patrol he was carrying a Nuclear bomb when it went off and he survived he's also well over Durability limits too.

@cadencev2 Sorry man I F%^& up and picked someone WAYYYYY over tourney limits in a few ways

#16 Edited by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio

@beatboks1: meh , maybe u can swap Negative man for another character if @cadencev2: allows it? If not then gg i guess :/

#17 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Voting is Open till Sunday

#18 Posted by Pop123 (90 posts) - - Show Bio
#19 Edited by Theorder14 (1437 posts) - - Show Bio

@pop123: Next time, make sure you read all our posts before u reply because it's pretty obvious u didn't read beatboks last comment there >.>

i haven't even gotten a chance to go all out with any of my characters lol :D

#20 Posted by beatboks1 (7100 posts) - - Show Bio

Voting is Open till Sunday

No need to vote here man.

I inadvertently picked a character who was past several limits of the tourney because it's been years since I read his stories.

I don't think it's fair if I continue with negative man, after reviewing several of his issues he's way OP on speed and destructive power.

#21 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2 said:

Voting is Open till Sunday

No need to vote here man.

I inadvertently picked a character who was past several limits of the tourney because it's been years since I read his stories.

I don't think it's fair if I continue with negative man, after reviewing several of his issues he's way OP on speed and destructive power.

Cool, Next time you will think twice (da da daaaa)