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#1 Posted by trebean (680 posts) - - Show Bio

Can they wing it?

#2 Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek (20387 posts) - - Show Bio

Pretty sure Zoom could solo almost all of Marvel Earth, and the Flash Family would eliminate anyone that Zoom couldn't handle himself (especially counting Zoom himself). If you're also going to bring in people like Jesse Quick and Max Mercury, I could see the Flash Family taking this handily.

#3 Edited by Cooldes (4133 posts) - - Show Bio

franklin richards

#4 Edited by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

Pretty sure Zoom could solo almost all of Marvel Earth, and the Flash Family would eliminate anyone that Zoom couldn't handle himself (especially counting Zoom himself). If you're also going to bring in people like Jesse Quick and Max Mercury, I could see the Flash Family taking this handily.

What?

Zoom only has time and speed. How's he getting past ultra durable Thor? Captain Universe? Hyperion? Sentry?

How's he taking down Hulk? Doom who has time stopping, auto forcefields, anti-matter guns, time displacement grenades, inhibitor rays, can drain powers, and magic to take on Morgan La Fey, Brother Voodoo and more?

Dr. Strange with his auto shields and extreme magic. Juggernaut who's invulnerable to physical attack, Ghost Rider who can't die by purely physical attacks, Darwin who adapts to everything, Franklin Richards reality warps, Legion reality warps and has equal if not better control of time than Zoom, telepaths can mind rape, Magneto has his forcefield, and more.

The Flash Family+Zoom can't beat the Avengers nonetheless Marvel Earth.

#5 Posted by WaveMotionCannon (5528 posts) - - Show Bio

#4 Edited by DarkRaiden (1479 posts) - 5 minutes, 2 seconds ago - Show Bio

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek said:

Pretty sure Zoom could solo almost all of Marvel Earth, and the Flash Family would eliminate anyone that Zoom couldn't handle himself (especially counting Zoom himself). If you're also going to bring in people like Jesse Quick and Max Mercury, I could see the Flash Family taking this handily.

What?

Zoom only has time and speed. How's he getting past ultra durable Thor? Captain Universe? Hyperion? Sentry?

How's he taking down Hulk? Doom who has time stopping, auto forcefields, anti-matter guns, time displacement grenades, inhibitor rays, can drain powers, and magic to take on Morgan La Fey, Brother Voodoo and more?

Dr. Strange with his auto shields and extreme magic. Juggernaut who's invulnerable to physical attack, Ghost Rider who can't die by purely physical attacks, Darwin who adapts to everything, Franklin Richards reality warps, Legion reality warps and has equal if not better control of time than Zoom, telepaths can mind rape, Magneto has his forcefield, and more.

The Flash Family+Zoom can't beat the Avengers nonetheless Marvel Earth.

THIS!!!!!

#6 Edited by SheenLantern (6787 posts) - - Show Bio

The Flash Family+Zoom can't beat the Avengers nonetheless Marvel Earth.

Aha

I'd like to hear your reasoning behind that.

#7 Edited by BOdinson (224 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden said:

The Flash Family+Zoom can't beat the Avengers nonetheless Marvel Earth.

Aha

I'd like to hear your reasoning behind that.

There's no speedforce in Marvel U...

#8 Posted by Odinsonnn (308 posts) - - Show Bio
#9 Edited by SheenLantern (6787 posts) - - Show Bio

@bodinson said:

@sheenlantern said:

@darkraiden said:

The Flash Family+Zoom can't beat the Avengers nonetheless Marvel Earth.

Aha

I'd like to hear your reasoning behind that.

There's no speedforce in Marvel U...

You must be pretty dense if you don't realise the OP intended the characters to actually have their powers.

#10 Posted by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden said:

The Flash Family+Zoom can't beat the Avengers nonetheless Marvel Earth.

Aha

I'd like to hear your reasoning behind that.

I mean the avengers with Thor, Captain Universe, Hyperion, Hulk, Iron Man (I think that's right). That line up alone should be self explanatory. I mean lets be honest, when has any Flash shown offensive capability to put down someone like Thor? Also IIRC Captain Universe is like Surfer powerful, and can time travel. Could be wrong though.

#11 Posted by SheenLantern (6787 posts) - - Show Bio

I mean lets be honest, when has any Flash shown offensive capability to put down someone like Thor?

IMP ring a bell?

#12 Edited by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden said:

I mean lets be honest, when has any Flash shown offensive capability to put down someone like Thor?

IMP ring a bell?

Yeah, I know about it, not enough to put down Thor. At all. It'd take a whole lotta those to even phase him.

#13 Posted by The_Titan_Lord (6750 posts) - - Show Bio

Marvel earth maybe.

#14 Posted by kidman560 (7577 posts) - - Show Bio

@sheenlantern: ehmm Aurora and Northstar solo and then Captain Universe mops up afterwords

#15 Posted by Cable_Extreme (9599 posts) - - Show Bio

I see Silver Surfer being a problem, he has been known to have nanosecond reaction time, and he has a power advantage. I see hulk, and Thor irrelevant in this fight due to the fact that they simply cannot tag Flash or Zoom. Franklin Richards can end all of it if he isn't taken out first. And I am not sure they will take Frankin Richards as a threat due to the fact he is a kid. Strong reality warpers will be able to possibly stop the assault. And I don't see them killing people like Juggs, or Ghost Rider ect.... So they will eventually tire out punching away at people to allow the reality warpers to take their stand.

#16 Posted by SheenLantern (6787 posts) - - Show Bio

@sheenlantern said:

@darkraiden said:

I mean lets be honest, when has any Flash shown offensive capability to put down someone like Thor?

IMP ring a bell?

Yeah, I know about it, not enough to put down Thor. At all. It'd take a whole lotta those to even phase him.

What, the attack that one-shot someone with the durability of Superman wouldn't even phase Thor?

Stop being such a fanboy.

@sheenlantern: ehmm Aurora and Northstar solo and then Captain Universe mops up afterwords

Aurora and Northstar are snails compared to Wally West and Zoom.

I don't know enough about CU to reach an educated decision.

#17 Edited by RBT (4302 posts) - - Show Bio

@DarkRaiden: Dude, Flash's IMP broke Anti Monitor's armour. Thor is nothing.

#18 Posted by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden said:

@sheenlantern said:

@darkraiden said:

I mean lets be honest, when has any Flash shown offensive capability to put down someone like Thor?

IMP ring a bell?

Yeah, I know about it, not enough to put down Thor. At all. It'd take a whole lotta those to even phase him.

What, the attack that one-shot someone with the durability of Superman wouldn't even phase Thor?

Stop being such a fanboy.

@kidman560 said:

@sheenlantern: ehmm Aurora and Northstar solo and then Captain Universe mops up afterwords

Aurora and Northstar are snails compared to Wally West and Zoom.

I don't know enough about CU to reach an educated decision.

*repeats self from other threads*

Thor's taken a score of planets, blah blah blah gravity of neutron star, blah blah, celestial blast, core of a sun, blah blah blah, regularly defeats Surfer who's star+ in destructive capability, even his unconscious body survives super bomb, stalemated Zeus that one time, etc. Thor's insanely durable, moreso than even Supes. And Wally's attack only claimed to oneshot someone with Superman's durability. We have no idea what it'd actually do to someone like Supes. Actually we do, Zoom hit WW with a lightspeed punch, turns out it feels like a Supes punch, launched her across a continent, but she was able to get up just fine.

#19 Posted by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt said:

@DarkRaiden: Dude, Flash's IMP broke Anti Monitor's armour. Thor is nothing.

And Thor's taken down Galactus and busted a Celestial's armor, lifted an incalculably heavy sword, and his punches fix/rip holes in dimensions. High level feats are high level feats. Also Flash had help and many other people attacking Anti-Monitor IIRC

#20 Edited by kidman560 (7577 posts) - - Show Bio

@sheenlantern: Aurora and Northstar have both been shown to punch 1000 times a second, and Aurora and Northstar can turn into their light forms blind the flashes and then knock them out also Aurora pulls a flash here (btw ask me for any scans of what i have previously said and i will get them to you) also Aurora and Northstar perceive/react to speeds of up to Mach 28 so i think they will be just fine

they will be able to take down all of them but Wally and thats where Captain Universe comes in

@rbt: dude honestly thats PIS at its finest, IMP didnt kill Zoom but it broke the Anti Monitor's really?

#21 Posted by Dratini1331 (7028 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor's taken a score of planets, blah blah blah gravity of neutron star, blah blah, celestial blast, core of a sun, blah blah blah, regularly defeats Surfer who's star+ in destructive capability, even his unconscious body survives super bomb, stalemated Zeus that one time, etc. Thor's insanely durable, moreso than even Supes. And Wally's attack only claimed to oneshot someone with Superman's durability. We have no idea what it'd actually do to someone like Supes. Actually we do, Zoom hit WW with a lightspeed punch, turns out it feels like a Supes punch, launched her across a continent, but she was able to get up just fine.

First off, if we're talking pre-flashpoint, supes has taken hits far above anything thor has AFAIK. Ignoring the core of a star, as that seems obvious for supes, he's taken supernovas to the face and planetary collisions. SS is basically marvel's whipping boy, and should beat thor a large majority of the time. SS has massive high's and lows, where he can destroy stars, and where he gets beat by black panther. Furthermore, being unconscious HELPS you survive things. You become relaxed, which makes you far, far more likely to survive large impacts. Thor is NOT more durable than pre-52 supes, or at least not by much.

Wally has shown that he could 1-shot a white martian IIRC, and he could always phase people's brains out. Furthermore, he can always speed steal most people. Zoom could cause damage to WW, and that alone should speak volumes.

That being said, I don't think Flashes win, but they could take a large majority of marvel earth until they run into all the auto-shields. Then it's a matter of comparing the shields to those of GLs and such.

#22 Edited by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden said:

Thor's taken a score of planets, blah blah blah gravity of neutron star, blah blah, celestial blast, core of a sun, blah blah blah, regularly defeats Surfer who's star+ in destructive capability, even his unconscious body survives super bomb, stalemated Zeus that one time, etc. Thor's insanely durable, moreso than even Supes. And Wally's attack only claimed to oneshot someone with Superman's durability. We have no idea what it'd actually do to someone like Supes. Actually we do, Zoom hit WW with a lightspeed punch, turns out it feels like a Supes punch, launched her across a continent, but she was able to get up just fine.

First off, if we're talking pre-flashpoint, supes has taken hits far above anything thor has AFAIK. Ignoring the core of a star, as that seems obvious for supes, he's taken supernovas to the face and planetary collisions. SS is basically marvel's whipping boy, and should beat thor a large majority of the time. SS has massive high's and lows, where he can destroy stars, and where he gets beat by black panther. Furthermore, being unconscious HELPS you survive things. You become relaxed, which makes you far, far more likely to survive large impacts. Thor is NOT more durable than pre-52 supes, or at least not by much.

Wally has shown that he could 1-shot a white martian IIRC, and he could always phase people's brains out. Furthermore, he can always speed steal most people. Zoom could cause damage to WW, and that alone should speak volumes.

That being said, I don't think Flashes win, but they could take a large majority of marvel earth until they run into all the auto-shields. Then it's a matter of comparing the shields to those of GLs and such.

No Supes hasn't. Celestials Galaxy bust at least, universe bust at best, and he survived multiple blasts from them. If we use all of their feats, Thor is insanely durable and won't be going down to mere Flashes. WW isn't close to as durable as Thor. And yeah Wally oneshotted a White Martian, but never Superman, and we don't know how durable said white martian really is.

#23 Posted by green_skaar (4415 posts) - - Show Bio
#24 Posted by Dratini1331 (7028 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: Dude, they get random ups and downs. Thor has also harmed galactus, something which Odin has trouble with at times. Also, there's no reason AFAIK that thor won't die from losing his brain. I recall someone at one point saying phasing was unusable on Asgardians, but couldn't back it up. Any reason why ripping his brain out wouldn't work on thor?

#25 Edited by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: Dude, they get random ups and downs. Thor has also harmed galactus, something which Odin has trouble with at times. Also, there's no reason AFAIK that thor won't die from losing his brain. I recall someone at one point saying phasing was unusable on Asgardians, but couldn't back it up. Any reason why ripping his brain out wouldn't work on thor?

1. Flash doesn't do that often if at all

2. They're not bloodlusted

3. Has Flash ever phased through anyone as dense/durable as Thor and done this?

4. I've heard stuff about Asgardian Physiology

5. Flash will be tagged if he tries. Yeah. Thor swings his hammer several times the speed of light, if Flash tries something so blatant, I see him getting KO'd.

#26 Edited by FlashGreaterSignEveryone (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

The flash family solos if you give them the speed force other than that its a stomp

#27 Posted by green_skaar (4415 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: Dude, they get random ups and downs. Thor has also harmed galactus, something which Odin has trouble with at times. Also, there's no reason AFAIK that thor won't die from losing his brain. I recall someone at one point saying phasing was unusable on Asgardians, but couldn't back it up. Any reason why ripping his brain out wouldn't work on thor?

Usually I see this scan with that general claim: http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/14/146504/2868968-2429946_thormjolnir93d_phasedisruptionaveng.jpg

#28 Posted by godzilla44 (3446 posts) - - Show Bio

I think the flashes can take out about 95 percent of the marvel earth and thats about it

#29 Posted by HumanNumber (1467 posts) - - Show Bio

These kind of threads have too many variables to take into account. But to think that Zoom won't slaughters the majority is a little naive. Wally too. These two have shown to move multitudes faster than light and can perceive and think at that speed. For them to get outside of a comic book they would have too see an attack and wait for what would be hours to them, all the while not moving away from it. They hit as hard as supes and speedsters are statues in comparison.

#30 Posted by RudeBomberBoy01 (1841 posts) - - Show Bio

Zeus wins!

@rbt said:

@DarkRaiden: Dude, Flash's IMP broke Anti Monitor's armour. Thor is nothing.

Lol no it didn't.

#31 Posted by thanosii (1303 posts) - - Show Bio

@rbt: that's totally untrue he phased AMs armour by contrast Thor is immune to phasing Hope solos, Franklin solos , Legion solos , MJJ, Jamie Braddock, Shaman Nate, etc.

#32 Edited by Dratini1331 (7028 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: Oops, thought they were bloodlusted *o.O* my bad. He did it to amazo when he was pissed, but not outside of bloodlust so nvm that then derp. Hammer should still go through him, but yeah, no BL makes this completely different.

#33 Edited by patrat18 (10138 posts) - - Show Bio

I really don't see whats stopping Zoom from visiting most of marvel's characters past and erasing them, or the Flash family phasing through everybody in sight.

#34 Posted by SheenLantern (6787 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidman560: Mach 28? You say that as if it's really impressive. That's only 28x the speed of sound. Flash moved many trillions of times faster than light when he saved a city from a nuke.

@rudebomberboy01

Lol no it didn't

Lol yeah it did.

@darkraiden

First of all, speaking as a huge Surfer fan. Thor doesn't 'regularly' defeat Surfer, he's done it about 3 times and every time was because Surfer is a massive pacifist. You couldn't argue that Surfer wouldn't stomp Thor if he really wanted to.

Dratini basically sums the rest up. The Celestial thing isn't remarkably impressive. Supes has taken hits from Anti-Monitor, Imperiex and the such.

#35 Edited by NoBody134 (298 posts) - - Show Bio

Marvel earth

#36 Posted by Cara_Hunter (3687 posts) - - Show Bio

Doctor Doom solo's

#37 Posted by SheenLantern (6787 posts) - - Show Bio

Doctor Doom solo's

How does he solo without prep?

#38 Edited by Cara_Hunter (3687 posts) - - Show Bio

@sheenlantern: Auto shields that can tank a shot from the IG and still keep him alive, Doom just uses that time to stop time via magic and snap their necks.

#39 Posted by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@sheenlantern: Celestials >>Imperiex and Anti-Monitor sorry. Especially since their blasts have one shotted Galactus and Odin respectively and Thor took multiple and still wasn't dead.

#40 Edited by RudeBomberBoy01 (1841 posts) - - Show Bio

@sheenlantern: I don't see Flash punching the armour, looks like he was going through it.. You know, like phasing through it..

.

.

Oh and Flash didn't destroy the armour on his own, all the Pre Crisis heroes had been amped up (including Pre Crisis Superman) and had been pounding on the armor for quite a while, cracking/damaging the armour, they even put a hole in the armour, Flash just added the finishing touch into finally destoying the armour.

Context matters.

Oh and Anti Monitor still killed everyone at the end of that fight and sent Flash running away.

EDIT: I'm not saying what Flash did was unimpressive, (because it is an impressive feat) but people overblow it and make it seem like Flash is so powerful, he single-handedly took on Anti Monitor and defeted him, which is not the case.

#41 Posted by RudeBomberBoy01 (1841 posts) - - Show Bio

And I swear battles like these are not allowed?

#42 Posted by SheenLantern (6787 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: I....I-I'm sorry, did you just say a Celestial is more powerful than COIE Anti-Monitor? The one that overpowered the Spectre who was backed by the power of 5th Dimensional Imps? A single Celestial?

Also, you've basically denounced your own argument as PiS by bringing up the fact that Odin has been one-shotted by Celestials.

#43 Posted by GLforHIRE (455 posts) - - Show Bio

ppl always say flash can IMP someone like superman to beat him BUT flash does tire...and I assume IMP takes alot out of flash so its not like he'd be doing it to everyone over and over and over. He might take out thor with it but he'd have enough endurance to do it to thor, sentry, hulk, etc...heck even come and go guys like blue marvel. I think the numbers game would eventually be too much. Its not like no ones ever tagged flash before. People have shot/tripped/or slashed him while hes running. Eventually he would get caught by someone.

#44 Posted by DarkRaiden (7677 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: I....I-I'm sorry, did you just say a Celestial is more powerful than COIE Anti-Monitor? The one that overpowered the Spectre who was backed by the power of 5th Dimensional Imps? A single Celestial?

Also, you've basically denounced your own argument as PiS by bringing up the fact that Odin has been one-shotted by Celestials.

Not really when he also took on Odin's father Bor, took on Glory composed of many gods, has hurt Galactus and even driven him off, has stalemated Zeus, has busted a hole in a Celestial's armor, and more. He has a lot of these feats. And yeah Celestials beams have better feats than Anti-Monitor. Celestials destroy universes. And there were multiple of them.

#45 Edited by unBREAKable_Fs4 (1889 posts) - - Show Bio

@glforhire: The IMP is just a regular puch from Flash while he's running. It doesn't take much effort for him to do it. He's already massively faster than light, so him hitting you while running at light speed will hit with infinite mass.

#46 Posted by Cara_Hunter (3687 posts) - - Show Bio

@glforhire: The IMP is just a regular puch from Flash while he's running. It doesn't take much effort for him to do it. He's already massively faster than light, so him hitting you while running at light speed will hit with infinite mass.

no such thing as infinite mass if there was everything in the universe would explode or the punches would be insta kills, at best his punches are star busters no matter how fast he's going.

#47 Posted by Cgoodness (5133 posts) - - Show Bio

GR solos them

Juggernaut solos them

Dr.Doom solos them

Franklin Richards turns them into his heralds

#48 Edited by unBREAKable_Fs4 (1889 posts) - - Show Bio

@unbreakable_fs4 said:

@glforhire: The IMP is just a regular puch from Flash while he's running. It doesn't take much effort for him to do it. He's already massively faster than light, so him hitting you while running at light speed will hit with infinite mass.

no such thing as infinite mass if there was everything in the universe would explode or the punches would be insta kills, at best his punches are star busters no matter how fast he's going.

I'm just going by what is stated. It is fiction after all... but going by what you said, getting hit by a star busting punch millions-billions of times before you could react could without a doubt hurt the likes of Thor and Hulk

#49 Posted by Cara_Hunter (3687 posts) - - Show Bio

@cara_hunter said:

@unbreakable_fs4 said:

@glforhire: The IMP is just a regular puch from Flash while he's running. It doesn't take much effort for him to do it. He's already massively faster than light, so him hitting you while running at light speed will hit with infinite mass.

no such thing as infinite mass if there was everything in the universe would explode or the punches would be insta kills, at best his punches are star busters no matter how fast he's going.

I'm just going by what is stated. It is fiction after all... but going by what you said, getting hit by a star busting punch millions-billions of times before you could react could without a doubt hurt the likes of Thor and Hulk

TBH high end durability feats for Thor shows it would barely faze him due to that celestial blast.

Flash would probs get owned by an AOE attack if Thor gets the chance (AOE attacks are kinda Flash weaknesses)