Planetary plus 202122 Vs Juiceboks

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#1  Edited By 202122
No Caption Provided

On the planet Kryton 20 hours before it was destroyed.

Your teams have 2 hours prep

full knowledge of the opposing team

and full knowledge of the terrain.

In the planets core there is a vast power source that will elevate you to the next level (transport you to the place in time, space and dimension that the next battle will take place). It also grants you a boon for that battle (to be discovered in round 2 - after I think of it).

Even with the powers of your team it will take 4 hours to access the power source and you have to start activating it two hours before Krypton's destruction ( it takes 1 hour and 50 minutes to build up power). Failure to do so will result in the destruction of one of your team members ( one team members down for second round).

You will have to provide not just a battle strategy and evidence for how you can defeat your enemy but a realistic time frame to do so that is less than 14 hours.

When voting commences ( agreed on by players or in 4 days if not done by then) those voting will have to vote on

a) who won based on the debate and only the debate. If you think a team should have won but the argument didn't get to prove that vote for the team how proved their case.

b) whether you think the time frame laid out was believable. To keep it fair those who would face the winner of a battle in the next round will not vote on time frames.

Rules

Temporary BFR is allowed but will not make a win. To win you have to actually deal with each and every character

Win is by Death, KO, Incapacitation or Immobilization ( this is not achieved by a BFR)

Any feats used that would be considered above Odin (Marvel level) are null and void ( this is for anyone who may have slipped a character through I was unsure of)

All characters are in character and will interact as such. If there would normally be animosity or friction between them it will exist here. If characters are all used to ruling the roost they will fight for control and players will have to address.

Team who finishes their debate first and calls for voting will get first pick of the four boons on offer for round 2, second will get second etc. This is to encourage everyone to participate at their best :)

202112

  • Wonder Woman
  • Power girl
  • Beta Ray Bill
  • Adam Warlock
  • Maxima

Vs

Juiceboks

  • Orion
  • Deadman
  • Super Buhan
  • Hyper Shadow w/ unlimited time
  • PC Mongul

This is the OP given by the tourney creator so just going of that

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#2  Edited By 202122

I'll let you start as long as you're ok with everything above

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#3  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

Alright will do.

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#4  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

PC Mongul recognizing atleast two of your team members and being the cocky overlord he is would try and solo them as he's done in the past. I dont believe any of them are his physical match so overpowering him is out of the question. Warlock might try and BFR him if he figures this out in time but I doubt he would without Mongul beating the tar out of WW and Power Girl first. Even if he were to try that Shadow could bring him right back with his Chaos Control. Orion can manhandle Supes so Maxima shouldnt be that difficult. Two of my team members can take control of two of your team members and I can only see Adam stopping Deadman using the abilities he got post Annihilation Wave. Shadow speedblitzing can distract him long enough for atleast one of the two beings to take control of a member(correct me if I'm wrong but no one other than Adam has any resistance to body possession). In truth all they would need is to down/weaken atleast one of your members which Mongul can certainly accomplish so that Buu can absorb that person to augment his abilities and skills. Then it turns into a 5v4 and they just overpower your team.

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#5  Edited By 202122

@Juiceboks said:

PC Mongul recognizing atleast two of your team members and being the cocky overlord he is would try and solo them as he's done in the past. I dont believe any of them are his physical match so overpowering him is out of the question. Warlock might try and BFR him if he figures this out in time but I doubt he would without Mongul beating the tar out of WW and Power Girl first. Even if he were to try that Shadow could bring him right back with his Chaos Control. Orion can manhandle Supes so Maxima shouldnt be that difficult. Two of my team members can take control of two of your team members and I can only see Adam stopping Deadman using the abilities he got post Annihilation Wave. Shadow speedblitzing can distract him long enough for atleast one of the two beings to take control of a member(correct me if I'm wrong but no one other than Adam has any resistance to body possession). In truth all they would need is to down/weaken atleast one of your members which Mongul can certainly accomplish so that Buu can absorb that person to augment his abilities and skills. Then it turns into a 5v4 and they just overpower your team.

Alright firstly i'm going to point out some holes in your team:

Orion is a hero

Deadman is a hero well known for his good deeds

Super Buu is a villain

Hyper Shadow is a hero

PC Mongul villain

So firstly you're team doesn't work and according to the OP your team has to work and there is no way a team with 2 major villains and 3 heroes can work together. So you either have a team of 3 or a team of 2 i'll let you decide.

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#6  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

Shadow is often portrayed as an anti hero rather than a full on hero actually. The concept of heroes and villians working together for a common goal isnt new or that uncommon anyway. Thanos is a major villain and he worked with the Avengers to defeat Rot.

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#7  Edited By 202122

@Juiceboks said:

Shadow is often portrayed as an anti hero rather than a full on hero actually. The concept of heroes and villians working together for a common goal isnt new or that uncommon anyway. Thanos is a major villain and he worked with the Avengers to defeat Rot.

oh sorry my mistake...doesn't change the fact that he still wouldn't work with PC Mongul who is the definition of pure evil, also super buu isn't very bright he doesn't do teams and he would most likely end up turning on your team anyway. Same with Mongul he's not going to work with Orion and vice versa it's not happening. Yes the concept isn't new but this whole tournament is based on teamwork and whether your team would actually work together and in this case no they would not.

Also please tag me so that i know you've commented/replied

am i wrong in saying that this team wouldn't work

Avatar image for diredrill
DireDrill

2483

Forum Posts

26

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#8  Edited By DireDrill

It isn't up to Beatboks1 to decide that, 202122. If Juiceboks feels he has explained how his team will work together and feels it is enough to win then by all means allow him to continue. Remember, this tourney ultimately comes down to votes. How effective each of you are presenting your case is what nets you the victory. You just need to present your case, refute his where you can and hope that the Votes come down on your side.

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#9  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

I will admit it's rather unlikely that Mongul would work with Orion but remember Mongul may be evil but he's certainly not stupid. Me bringing up Thanos was just an example of what can happen when a dire situation calls for unlikely allies. They all have knowledge of your team as stated. If its going to increase his chances of taking down someone like Warlock, I dont see why he wouldnt for the time being work with others. Shadow has been known to join forces on several occasions with heroes and villians for the same reason. I will say that Buu is the most unlikely to not work with the others but he's not entirely unintelligent. He does have some patience and understands that a good fight is more fun when an enemy is at his/her most powerful even in his base form. ex: Letting Goten and Trunks fuse as requested by Piccolo. If they all promise him a good fight with your team I'm sure he would oblige for the duration of the fight. Let it also be known that this is Buuhan who has the combined skills and attributes of Piccolo(a rather smart individual), the power of Gotenks and the tactical mind of Gohan.

Avatar image for beatboks1
beatboks1

10837

Forum Posts

12952

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 6

#10  Edited By beatboks1

@202122 said:

@Juiceboks said:

Shadow is often portrayed as an anti hero rather than a full on hero actually. The concept of heroes and villians working together for a common goal isnt new or that uncommon anyway. Thanos is a major villain and he worked with the Avengers to defeat Rot.

oh sorry my mistake...doesn't change the fact that he still wouldn't work with PC Mongul who is the definition of pure evil, also super buu isn't very bright he doesn't do teams and he would most likely end up turning on your team anyway. Same with Mongul he's not going to work with Orion and vice versa it's not happening. Yes the concept isn't new but this whole tournament is based on teamwork and whether your team would actually work together and in this case no they would not.

Also please tag me so that i know you've commented/replied

am i wrong in saying that this team wouldn't work

You've got to make the case for how you would play the character faults against them. You can have a team of all evil or all good and still do that if you look at character motivations and play them. For example there is a certain team in the tourney that is very strong and versatile and all stand on the same side of good and evil but ahve a very distinct character interplay weakness. Not saying any more.

@DireDrill said:

It isn't up to Beatboks1 to decide that, 202122. If Juiceboks feels he has explained how his team will work together and feels it is enough to win then by all means allow him to continue. Remember, this tourney ultimately comes down to votes. How effective each of you are presenting your case is what nets you the victory. You just need to present your case, refute his where you can and hope that the Votes come down on your side.

Yep basically this. When I made the rule in the set up thread and mentioned to one player who dropped out that he might have a problem I was just keying people up for that idea.If you want to play that angle you have to sell it as in how your going to take advantage of that.

Avatar image for beatboks1
beatboks1

10837

Forum Posts

12952

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 6

#11  Edited By beatboks1

@202122: @Juiceboks: Another day and a half to go before I call for Voting guys

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#12  Edited By 202122

@Juiceboks said:

I will admit it's rather unlikely that Mongul would work with Orion but remember Mongul may be evil but he's certainly not stupid. Me bringing up Thanos was just an example of what can happen when a dire situation calls for unlikely allies. They all have knowledge of your team as stated. If its going to increase his chances of taking down someone like Warlock, I dont see why he wouldnt for the time being work with others. Shadow has been known to join forces on several occasions with heroes and villians for the same reason. I will say that Buu is the most unlikely to not work with the others but he's not entirely unintelligent. He does have some patience and understands that a good fight is more fun when an enemy is at his/her most powerful even in his base form. ex: Letting Goten and Trunks fuse as requested by Piccolo. If they all promise him a good fight with your team I'm sure he would oblige for the duration of the fight. Let it also be known that this is Buuhan who has the combined skills and attributes of Piccolo(a rather smart individual), the power of Gotenks and the tactical mind of Gohan.

You're team is still flawed in the fact that in the battle your team wont be able to work together but let's move on to the actual battle

@Juiceboks said:

PC Mongul recognizing atleast two of your team members and being the cocky overlord he is would try and solo them as he's done in the past. I dont believe any of them are his physical match so overpowering him is out of the question.

Alright lets say Mongul does run in and tries to solo my team (like you stated yourself) I don't need to overpower him or BFR:

Adam Warlock soul sucks him with the soul gem and he's out of the fight

@Juiceboks said:

Orion can manhandle Supes so Maxima shouldnt be that difficult.

Well Maxima has taken on Superman before and won, also Orion is on the same level as Darkseid in strength where Darkseid has been beatem by Supes so whose to say Maxima couldn't match Orion in strength. Once again she does't need to though using TP she takes control of Buhan's mind and turns him on Orion leaving you with 4 members and since Orion will have to kill Buhan to stop him from absorbing him your team is down to three. Below are scans of her overloading an advance alien telepaths mind and taking control of Supes (both whom have strong resistance against TP)

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

@Juiceboks said:

Two of my team members can take control of two of your team members and I can only see Adam stopping Deadman using the abilities he got post Annihilation Wave. Shadow speedblitzing can distract him long enough for atleast one of the two beings to take control of a member(correct me if I'm wrong but no one other than Adam has any resistance to body possession). In truth all they would need is to down/weaken atleast one of your members which Mongul can certainly accomplish so that Buu can absorb that person to augment his abilities and skills. Then it turns into a 5v4 and they just overpower your team.

Well considering Orion just killed Super Buu then it's not likely, and as you state yourself Adam Warlock sucks another soul this one belonging to dead man using his infinity gauntlets. With the power to turn giant demons into gnats there isn't much your team can do to him (Haha unintentional pun).

Shadow in gold mode or whatever they call it these days can travel just under light speed where as Wonder Woman and Powergirl can travel faster then so speed blitzing isn't going to work when Wonder Woman or Powergirl are faster and stronger. Sonics chaos beams aren't going to do much when he can't see them coming, either could take down Shadow with a few punches.

That turns the fight into 5vs1 where Orion is already tired from his fight against Buu, Beta Ray cosmic hammers into the ground and Power girl or Wonder Woman (depending on who fought Shadow) assists.

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#13  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@202122 said:

No Caption Provided

Supes beating DS a few times versus all the times that the latter has gotten the better of the former is hardly the grounds to say Maxima could handle Orion.

Also you said that Maxima can take control of Buu. How is she gonna do that with Orion either blasting her with the Astro Force or beating her in fisticuffs? I doubt she could concentrate while a being more powerful than her is trying to fight her. Does she need to touch a being to take control of it? From the scan it just looks like she projected an illusion in Supermans mind which is certainly different from mind control.

Youre underestimating Hyper Shadow. He his durable enough to tank hits from high level enemies such as Black Doom. He survived atmospheric re entry in a weakened base form with no major injuries save for amnesia at the end of Sonic Adventure 2. If he cant speedblitz via his natural speed, then he can accomplish it by manipulating time with Chaos Control. Slowing down WW and Supergirl and either hurl Chaos Spears or hit them with a Super Sonic Boost. Both are capable of harming Multiversal level beings such as Solaris so I dont see WW or Power Girl tanking either of them. He could also slow them down enough for either Buu or Deadman to take over one of them as they wouldnt be able to react fast enough to resist. As a matter of fact, Shadow could just stop time completely for everyone save for himself and take out several of your team members right off the bat while Mongul rushes ahead and Warlock turns to deal with him. He has used this tactic many times before for example when he fought Silver in Sonic 06.

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#14  Edited By 202122

@Juiceboks said:

@202122 said:

Supes beating DS a few times versus all the times that the latter has gotten the better of the former is hardly the grounds to say Maxima could handle Orion.

Supes is a different opponent then Maxima, she is a skilled fighter with TP and telekinesis to back her up, and yes Darkseid has beaten Supes more then he'd like to admit but he's still won many encounters.

@Juiceboks said:

@202122 said: Also you said that Maxima can take control of Buu. How is she gonna do that with Orion either blasting her with the Astro Force or beating her in fisticuffs? I doubt she could concentrate while a being more powerful than her is trying to fight her. Does she need to touch a being to take control of it? From the scan it just looks like she projected an illusion in Supermans mind which is certainly different from mind control.

In the first scan i provided i showed her being able to overload a powerful telepaths mind with out any physical contact so no she doesn't need touch. She doesn't just plant an illusion she takes control of his mind. Below she takes control of a quantum boosted Booster Gold and some aliens also i almost forgot about the time Maxima beat Orion.

You can't argue with an actual comic battle of Orion losing to Maxima so that takes down Orion and she takes control of Super Buu after she's done mind crushing Orion.

So it's 6 Vs 4 and i have a mind controlled Buu on my side as well.

@Juiceboks said:

@202122 said: Youre underestimating Hyper Shadow. He his durable enough to tank hits from high level enemies such as Black Doom. He survived atmospheric re entry in a weakened base form with no major injuries save for amnesia at the end of Sonic Adventure 2. If he cant speedblitz via his natural speed, then he can accomplish it by manipulating time with Chaos Control. Slowing down WW and Supergirl and either hurl Chaos Spears or hit them with a Super Sonic Boost. Both are capable of harming Multiversal level beings such as Solaris so I dont see WW or Power Girl tanking either of them. He could also slow them down enough for either Buu or Deadman to take over one of them as they wouldnt be able to react fast enough to resist. As a matter of fact, Shadow could just stop time completely for everyone save for himself and take out several of your team members right off the bat while Mongul rushes ahead and Warlock turns to deal with him. He has used this tactic many times before for example when he fought Silver in Sonic 06.

Black Doom is nothing compared to Wonder Woman she is so much stronger, she is on a completely different level here, he doesn't have the speed/reactions to even say Chaos Control before he's battered into the earth. Also lets not forget that even if he did have the time to use the stone Warlock counters it with the space gem also used to control time. It's abilities are made completely useless so neither team will be able to alter time with those abilities balanced out. Plus I know he's durable but 10 hits from a morals of WW is all she needs to put him down. As for Deadman his powers make it even easier to deal with him since his soul his already ripped from his body.

This is how the fight goes:

1) Orion falls to Maxima's TP

2) Buu becomes controlled by Maxima

3) Hyper Shadow is blitzed by Power Girl and WW

4) Deadman falls to Warlock's Soul gem

5) Mongul falls to the combined might of my team

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#15  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@202122 said:

@Juiceboks said:

@202122 said:

Supes beating DS a few times versus all the times that the latter has gotten the better of the former is hardly the grounds to say Maxima could handle Orion.

Supes is a different opponent then Maxima, she is a skilled fighter with TP and telekinesis to back her up, and yes Darkseid has beaten Supes more then he'd like to admit but he's still won many encounters.

@Juiceboks said:

@202122 said: Also you said that Maxima can take control of Buu. How is she gonna do that with Orion either blasting her with the Astro Force or beating her in fisticuffs? I doubt she could concentrate while a being more powerful than her is trying to fight her. Does she need to touch a being to take control of it? From the scan it just looks like she projected an illusion in Supermans mind which is certainly different from mind control.

In the first scan i provided i showed her being able to overload a powerful telepaths mind with out any physical contact so no she doesn't need touch. She doesn't just plant an illusion she takes control of his mind. Below she takes control of a quantum boosted Booster Gold and some aliens also i almost forgot about the time Maxima beat Orion.

You can't argue with an actual comic battle of Orion losing to Maxima so that takes down Orion and she takes control of Super Buu after she's done mind crushing Orion.

So it's 6 Vs 4 and i have a mind controlled Buu on my side as well.

For some reason I couldnt enlarge the scan so I couldnt tell how exactly it went down. Regardless that one instance was a sucker shot by Maxima and New Gods are shown to have great telepathic resistance. For example the parademons resisting MM telepathic attacks in the Martian Manhunter 2 series. Orion is no exception having resisted Darkseids manipulation in the past.

@Juiceboks said:

@202122 said: Youre underestimating Hyper Shadow. He his durable enough to tank hits from high level enemies such as Black Doom. He survived atmospheric re entry in a weakened base form with no major injuries save for amnesia at the end of Sonic Adventure 2. If he cant speedblitz via his natural speed, then he can accomplish it by manipulating time with Chaos Control. Slowing down WW and Supergirl and either hurl Chaos Spears or hit them with a Super Sonic Boost. Both are capable of harming Multiversal level beings such as Solaris so I dont see WW or Power Girl tanking either of them. He could also slow them down enough for either Buu or Deadman to take over one of them as they wouldnt be able to react fast enough to resist. As a matter of fact, Shadow could just stop time completely for everyone save for himself and take out several of your team members right off the bat while Mongul rushes ahead and Warlock turns to deal with him. He has used this tactic many times before for example when he fought Silver in Sonic 06.

Black Doom is nothing compared to Wonder Woman she is so much stronger, she is on a completely different level here, he doesn't have the speed/reactions to even say Chaos Control before he's battered into the earth. Also lets not forget that even if he did have the time to use the stone Warlock counters it with the space gem also used to control time. It's abilities are made completely useless so neither team will be able to alter time with those abilities balanced out. Plus I know he's durable but 10 hits from a morals of WW is all she needs to put him down. As for Deadman his powers make it even easier to deal with him since his soul his already ripped from his body.

Black Doom assaults him with space manipulating attacks as base form Shadow and with more potent attacks when he transforms to Devil Doom. Devil Doom has control over the Chaos force sufficient enough to rival Shadow so in alot of ways he is more powerful than Diana. Shadow doesnt need to say Chaos Control to use Chaos Control and he doesnt need a Chaos Emerald. He wouldnt get blitzed by someone who's not light speeds faster than him like WW. She may be more skilled in combat than him and certainly stronger but I believe he has her in speed and raw power. When was the space gem used to stop time? The closest thing I can recall is speeding someone up which isnt the same as time manipulation as time and space are not one in the same. Also are you implying that Warlock has access to the whole Infinity Gauntlet? The soul gem is a piece of his usual equipment not the gauntlet.

This is how the fight goes:

1) Orion falls to Maxima's TP

2) Buu becomes controlled by Maxima

3) Hyper Shadow is blitzed by Power Girl and WW

4) Deadman falls to Warlock's Soul gem

5) Mongul falls to the combined might of my team

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#16  Edited By 202122

"For some reason I couldnt enlarge the scan so I couldnt tell how exactly it went down. Regardless that one instance was a sucker shot by Maxima and New Gods are shown to have great telepathic resistance. For example the parademons resisting MM telepathic attacks in the Martian Manhunter 2 series. Orion is no exception having resisted Darkseids manipulation in the past."

Yet he didn't and couldn't...and how can TP be a sucker shot when she can use it from miles away to good effect. This is a comic battle that shows Maxima's TP being stronger then Orion's resistance you can't argue against that. Once Maxima is done she takes control of Buu and it becomes a battle of:

6 Vs 4

"Black Doom assaults him with space manipulating attacks as base form Shadow and with more potent attacks when he transforms to Devil Doom. Devil Doom has control over the Chaos force sufficient enough to rival Shadow so in alot of ways he is more powerful than Diana. Shadow doesnt need to say Chaos Control to use Chaos Control and he doesnt need a Chaos Emerald. He wouldnt get blitzed by someone who's not light speeds faster than him like WW. She may be more skilled in combat than him and certainly stronger but I believe he has her in speed and raw power. When was the space gem used to stop time? The closest thing I can recall is speeding someone up which isnt the same as time manipulation as time and space are not one in the same. Also are you implying that Warlock has access to the whole Infinity Gauntlet? The soul gem is a piece of his usual equipment not the gauntlet."

Devil Doom is a lot more powerful in some ways...just not ones that effect the outcome of this fight. He has better matter manipulation and energy attack but Diana has better speed, strength and skill. How can Hyper Shadow have WW in speed when he can't travel faster then the speed of light and she can travel faster then it. Here you can see matching some of the fastest people in comics including Flash and Amazo (who had absorbed the entire league's powers. Also I think you forget about Power Girl is a female Superman capable of going just as fast as the big man himself, even faster then WW Shadow doesn't have the reaction/speed feats to beat WW (Faster then the speed of light) and Powergirl (As fast as Supes).

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Sorry meant to type Time gem and yes Warlock has access to the entire gauntlet they're part of his standard gear

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#17  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@202122:

"Devil Doom is a lot more powerful in some ways...just not ones that effect the outcome of this fight. He has better matter manipulation and energy attack but Diana has better speed, strength and skill. How can Hyper Shadow have WW in speed when he can't travel faster then the speed of light and she can travel faster then it. Here you can see matching some of the fastest people in comics including Flash and Amazo (who had absorbed the entire league's powers. Also I think you forget about Power Girl is a female Superman capable of going just as fast as the big man himself, even faster then WW Shadow doesn't have the reaction/speed feats to beat WW (Faster then the speed of light) and Powergirl (As fast as Supes)."

I didnt forget, Shadow has them in speed via time manipulation. Slowing them down or speeding himself up to the point where he can effortlessly dispatch both. Both are fast but arent fast enough to blitz him before he can think to use Chaos Control because he can operate at light speed. Flash holds back..alot. He states she can keep up with him to a certain point same as Supes so that doesnt show her moving at speeds capable of blitzing him faster than he can think.

"Yet he didn't and couldn't...and how can TP be a sucker shot when she can use it from miles away to good effect. This is a comic battle that shows Maxima's TP being stronger then Orion's resistance you can't argue against that. Once Maxima is done she takes control of Buu and it becomes a battle of"

No Caption Provided

It was a sucker shot because he had barely noticed she grabbed him. They werent fighting it was a surprise assault. I'm not doubting her telepathic abilities which are formidable, however he does have a high resistance and when seriously pushed to the edge(both physically and mentally) he enters a berserk state which only a handful of people could contain and Maxima isnt one of them. I dont have the scans of him resisting DS telepathic assaults but I believe it was in one of the New Gods 3 issues when he does this. Anyone with access to the issue can confirm.

Also, the IG is not part of his standard gear. He gained it in Infinity Watch and thats it. He usually has the Soul Gem not the whole gauntlet. And besides, that would certainly put him way above Skyfather level which is against the OP rules.

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#18  Edited By 202122

@Juiceboks said:

@202122:I didnt forget, Shadow has them in speed via time manipulation. Slowing them down or speeding himself up to the point where he can effortlessly dispatch both. Both are fast but arent fast enough to blitz him before he can think to use Chaos Control because he can operate at light speed. Flash holds back..alot. He states she can keep up with him to a certain point same as Supes so that doesnt show her moving at speeds capable of blitzing him faster than he can think.

Shadow doesn't have time to use chaos control he isn't going to be able to see and therefore even think to use Chaos Control, and as for operating at light speed he can't go that fast, his travel speed is impressive but reaction is a whole different thing where as WW has the reactions to match her travel speed. Shadow isn't beating Power girl with her speed same as Wonder Woman.@Juiceboks said:

@202122:

It was a sucker shot because he had barely noticed she grabbed him. They werent fighting it was a surprise assault. I'm not doubting her telepathic abilities which are formidable, however he does have a high resistance and when seriously pushed to the edge(both physically and mentally) he enters a berserk state which only a handful of people could contain and Maxima isnt one of them. I dont have the scans of him resisting DS telepathic assaults but I believe it was in one of the New Gods 3 issues when he does this. Anyone with access to the issue can confirm.

She doesn't need contact to use TP this is just an example where she did, Orion isn't going to be able to defend against this kind of attack. This berserker mode isn't going to work in this instance because there's no way he can respond to a mind crushing from Maxima. Even if she doesn't deem it necessary to mind crush him Orion has been shown to be susceptible to psionic manipulation like Mother Box or when Raven used her empathy powers on him. Placing an illusion in his mind or manipulating his feelings would work just as well.@Juiceboks said:

@202122: Also, the IG is not part of his standard gear. He gained it in Infinity Watch and thats it. He usually has the Soul Gem not the whole gauntlet. And besides, that would certainly put him way above Skyfather level which is against the OP rules.

True the IG is a bit over the top but he still has access to the soul gem which is all he needs to win this battle

Avatar image for juiceboks
juiceboks

26044

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#19  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@202122: His reflexes are matched by his speed in base form as well as hyper shadow form. The same goes for Sonic as they are able to react to each other and other similar powered beings when they fight. Absorbing the Chaos Emeralds augments ALL of their abilities not just speed. So yes he does actually have lightspeed reaction and thats more than enough to be able to use Chaos control to slow or just stop time completely long enough to take out or absorb atleast one of your teammates. At the same time Adam is dealing with Mongul, Deadman could turn invisible and fly towards any of the other 4 and take control of them. Maxima would be an optimum choice preventing any potential mind control. If Warlock is taking care of Mongul then he wont notice an invisible Brand fly towards any of the others. No one save for Warlock can stop him or sense him while he's attempting to accomplish this.

The Mother Box just helps keep his anger in check. It doesnt control him. Ravens powers are empathatic not psionic and she is extremely formidable in the field. Since you brought it up, he could use it to BFR Maxima to Apokolips while she tries to take over Buu. Sure she can fly back but it would take awhile and that frees up time for Orion and Buu to double team Warlock or BRB.

Avatar image for 202122
202122

1260

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#20  Edited By 202122

@Juiceboks said:

@202122: His reflexes are matched by his speed in base form as well as hyper shadow form. The same goes for Sonic as they are able to react to each other and other similar powered beings when they fight. Absorbing the Chaos Emeralds augments ALL of their abilities not just speed. So yes he does actually have lightspeed reaction and thats more than enough to be able to use Chaos control to slow or just stop time completely long enough to take out or absorb atleast one of your teammates.

Feats? Scans? Shadow has never dealt with someone as fast as Powergirl or Wonder Woman he doesn't have the speed, strength, skill or feats to match either of these two.

@Juiceboks said:

@202122: At the same time Adam is dealing with Mongul, Deadman could turn invisible and fly towards any of the other 4 and take control of them. Maxima would be an optimum choice preventing any potential mind control. If Warlock is taking care of Mongul then he wont notice an invisible Brand fly towards any of the others. No one save for Warlock can stop him or sense him while he's attempting to accomplish this.

Adam with the soul gem Vs Mongul is not going to last longer then a few seconds. Adam Warlock absorbed the souls of Magus' entire death squad a feat which Thanos admitted he could't replicate. Deadman is next to go and within a minute you've already lost two powerful players not to mention Shadow (who falls in less then a second) and Orion and Buu who are under Maxima's control.

@Juiceboks said:

@202122: The Mother Box just helps keep his anger in check. It doesnt control him. Ravens powers are empathatic not psionic and she is extremely formidable in the field. Since you brought it up, he could use it to BFR Maxima to Apokolips while she tries to take over Buu. Sure she can fly back but it would take awhile and that frees up time for Orion and Buu to double team Warlock or BRB.

Well considering Raven empathy powers are PSIONIC Maxima could do the exact same thing and extremely formidable? Maxima's psionic skills are on a whole new level compared to Raven as i've already shown. He's not going to think to use the mother box to BFR and even if he thought of the idea Maxima will already have him under her control and seconds away from a mind crush.