Old King Thor vs DC Team

This thread should be closed. Old King Thor would one shot every member of team. The Flash infinite mass thing is a joke. He can't hit harder than Galan. Galactus hit Thor with about everything he had...Thor took it. He proceeded to get the Necro sword and gave Galactus a beating he's never received before. Give team Darkseid and Doomsday and it still wouldn't matter.

This battle only has one of two outcomes and either way it's over quickly

Flash speed steal or phases Thor before Thor can react causing Thor to pass out or:

Flash attempts to speed steal or phase Thor. Thor laughs at him. Then OKT one shots them all

30 min sundip for Kryptonians and Morals off for Wally...

I dont know this could be victory for the Team

lol. are you real? Force of just 1000 white dwarf stars is more than a punch from galactus? Did you even read the okt vs galactus fight?

Plus, speed force barely protected him from one imp.

By all means, show me wally doing a dozen imp on someone.

@princearagorn1: do you know how big a white dwarf star is actually? It's bigger than the earth, combine the size of a white dwarf star with 1000 and it sure as h*ll has more force than galactus's punch.

I don't have a scan of him doing dozen, but that doesn't really matter cause it was just a suggestion, I didn't even say that he'll win by doing that. Anyways, do you have any counter for speed stealing? If not, then I don't see no way the team loses.

@princearagorn1: "At light speed my fist hits like a white dwarf star" there is really no need for evidence for that when he can easily fight at lighspeed and beyond.

It is not, becuase he never stolen speed from anyone from this level.

And really, stop with this scans, because all of it are just Flash's thoughts and characters opinions aren't a prove. A specially when they're talking about themselves. He is no Watcher/Living Tribunal to claim things like that and he also didn't use any machine to measure anything there.

In other words: No, his punches aren't star level, unless he will destroy a star, some scientist will make research in DC universe and confirm he can or unless some all-knowing being will say some phrase like "My understanding of universe tells me, that Flash can destroy a star". He has neither of that.

He doesn't have to bust the galaxy, if he beaten galaxy-buster - Surtur. This is not ABC logic, this is feat-in-battle. It is also not like it is his only win.

He beat Perrikus, Bor, Gardener (with destroying and reforming moon), Desak-Destroyer, stunned Order:

Gallery

dented Cap's shield, imprisoned nuclear explosion in force field, striked Gorr light years away and stopped time after fight with Desak.

Fight-feats matters and they aren't ABC logic. ABC logic would come, if I would say that since character A won with B, he will win with C regardless of difference of power set of whole 3.

If all 3 would only used strength and durability in this way: Namor beats Colossus, Colossus beats Titania, then Namor > Titania is fair assumption, UNLESS we can show similar combination that would deny that, for example:

(assuming that all used only strength in their battles) Unknown Hyperion beats Blue Marvel, Blue Marvel beats Pagan, but also: Pagan beats Thor and Thor beats unknown Hyperion. Our only conclusion could be that all are in the same level of strength and durability.

When it comes to so many battles, there is no doubt about Thor's level, a specially based on two of them - with Surtur and Desak-Destroyer.

Besides, it is not like Thor needs any galaxy-level of power to win this battle anyway.

We shouldn't assume he can, he may have the same power(s), but use it in different way. Like Lanterns or Herlads. Yet, it is not contest called "Who will destroy dozen galaxies first?" - it is fight between two sides highly unevenlly matched, considering how what history both sides have against beings with level of opposite team. King Thor beat characters levels more powerfull than Team 2 and team 2, even with cooperation never beat someone like King Thor.

Not even to planet busters IIRC.

Really best thing he did in battles was teaming up with other speedsters to BFR SBP. And it didn't help much anyway. He didn't beat, but was beaten by Despero and Doomsday for example.

Best answer for all threads like that is: Did he ever solod anyone of this level?

No? Then he loses.

He did? How many times? Less than half battles? He loses anyway.

How many times he used power mentioned by his supporter in thread? Not even once against enemy on this level? Then he can't use it or it is uneffective on higher beings or he is afraid of doing. Either way - he won't use it here.

It stops all this nonsense that Iceman can beat Thanos, Ghost Rider winning with Soulfire Darkseid, Flash beating Odin or Darwin winning with Galactus.

When they will do something on that level, then we will have data to talk about it. It is as immposisble to talk with, as debate against Hulk with Red Ring and sword of He-Men.

1.I see that we're highly not understanding each other in this case. My point was that mentioned situation didn't happen at all in this story, not just in this comic. Yes, Odin BFRd/banished Surutr after the battles, but we can see Surtur lying on the ground clearly KOd. Odin many times BFRd/banished Surtur, but he didn't KO him.

3.Problem is, they are like ants to him. Have You seen what Odin did to Drax and Surfer?

4.And what proves that DC characters will use the speed? Bloodlust clearly doesnt', it only means they will rush in flying-speed with all strength they have. It surely doesn't mean that they will fight wisely. They also doesn't have proves to stay at super-speed for longer then one-two attacks. Even when Supergirl and Superman were using speed to vibrate (both were calmed down and using tactic, here there won't be any tactic, but blind rage) their body, they did it just for a second. Also nothing proves that they can combine their highest showings of speed and best punches together. Best thing they can actually do, is what Superman did against Dark Moon, but this would mean auto-KO without getting anything. It is not like we should assume that Superman can do both at the same time in the same way Silver Surfer isn't creating black holes in hearts of his enemies in nanosecond or Thor summoning planet-level storms and creating Infinity Vortex in microsecond.

Scenrio for this battle will be like that:

They all will rush, if they will use full flying-speed and as we have seen in the past - they will KO themselves creating over-moon level explosion that won't give them win.

Also, look at my respond to killemall above.

@captain_batman_ftw: lol. Are you sure you didn't miss anything in the okt-galactus fight? Like.. absolutely sure?

@czarny_samael666: "In other words: No, his punches aren't star level, unless he will destroy a star" *sigh* can you go to the last page or whatever, I even showed a scan where his punch was that hard. Didn't you see? He punched another being up to the orbit and he landed on the other side of the world.

So, speed stealing won't work on OKT even if he hasn't shown any resistance to this type of attack just because he is on a skyfather level? Wow, that makes so much sense. Just post a scan or whatever saying that OKT is immune to this type of attacks.

@princearagorn1: I have to ask you, wasn't that fight non-canon? Cause I've heard that it was non-canon.

Just post some feats indicating that galactus's punch has more force than 1000 white dwarf star.

According to that czarny dude, flash can't speed steal OKT even when he hasn't shown any resistance to these types of attacks because he is on a skyfather level.

@captain_batman_ftw: which one?

And the scan is posted on this very thread I think, galactus hit okt with the force of a billion supernova. Didn't even ko him.

@captain_batman_ftw: none of their attacks could phase OKT this is pure stomp OKT this isn't training practice OKT stomps

@princearagorn1: billion supernovas? Holy sh*t, I didn't know that, but I don't know which fight, I remember a fight between OKT and galactus that was non-canon, I think it was snowing in the envirement behind them, it was daylight and so on and on, but OKT lost that fight.

If he really has the force of billions of supernovas, then yes, lol.

1.You have shown Flash punching two other characters with some strength. Flash isn't reliable, since he can as much overraiting himself. What You actually proved, is that Flash can punch someone from one side of the planet to the other. Yet, if You want to say that he can do it to someone else, You have to prove that punched character is as durable as one against which You want to use that feat. In this case, it means that You would have to prove that this guy is as durable as OF Thor (Surtur/Odin level).

2.He doesn't have to show anything like that, as much as he Living Tribunal, Galacuts, Spectre, Lucifer Mornigstar and dozens of other beings doesn't. As much as they don't need to prove that Ghost Rider, Iceman, Darwin, Obsidian or any other dude that have very rare power will lose with them. These one-power types has to do it, not opposite.

That is why all these people before asked You about Flash vs Galactus - by Your logic, anyone and I mean ANYONE who never resisted that power WILL (not could be, not may be, but will be) defeated in this way, which is false.

@czarny_samael666: you still have not explained how speed stealing won't work on OKT, the only thing you have said is that he cannot be speed stolen because he is on a skyfather level. It's one of his powers, by your logic, superman won't be able to use his superstrenght (which is one of his main powers) against a skyfather level like allan scott or whatever.

@captain_batman_ftw: the scan is from current thor series, thor: God of thunder. Idk how you saw another okt vs galan fight, since okt was first introduced in the same series about just 20 issues ago. At least as far as I know.

@princearagorn1: I don't know which it was, but I saw a battle on youtube between those two where people were saying that it was non-canon.

But I just gotta know, is Thor: God of thunder a good series? I'm wondering because I ordered the first volume 5-6 days ago and it still hasn't come yet :(

No, Speed-steal is 0-1 type power, like flash-freeze, Penance Stare or evolving powers. They either work completly or doesn't work at all.

Besides strength isn't comparable to it, becuase it works on any solid being, yet it doesn't mean it would be a good attack. Superman's strength means nothing to LEGITIMATE skyfather. Many people uses the word skyfather as title, but on CV it is short name explainning higher being that has galax-galaxy+ level of power with some details.

There are not so many people in this. From Marvel it would be Odin, Ymir, Surtur, OF Thor, Dormammu, Infinity (evil Odin's half), one of versions of Seth (not Set!), maybe Zeus, Zelia, King Hercules, Serpent and Designate (maybe I forgot about few of them.. Last 4 aren't fully in this level yet, either because someone didn't make enough good case for them (Serpent, Designate, King Hercules) or that there are two ways of looking on some of their feats (Zeus, Zelia).

These characters who are skyfather-level are highly above even Thanos or Magus types who already shown greater durability and power than people against which powers shown by Flash were ever used succefully.

I have 3 questions for You:

A)Can Ghost Rider put down Lucifer Mornigstar by Penance Stare?

B)Can Iceman freeze Spectre?

C)Can Darwin evolve past Soulfire Darkseid powers and defeat him?

Think about it.

@captain_batman_ftw: I'll have to check. Killemall should know stuff like this. And thor: GOT is incredible. you'll see once your order reaches :)

The concept, plot, art, everything was done pretty well.

There is nothing non-canon in this battle, becuase Old King Thor himself is living in this future. Futures aren't universe-616, so this isn't part of this universe. Yet, we are talking exactly about THIS Thor, so his own life, has to be cannon for itself.

@czarny_samael666: Thor GOT is canon.

@princearagorn1: I've noticed like Thor looks much more detailed in GOT, I've also seen that the drawings are absoloutly amazing.

Think about this.
Supergirl is all powerful and all that, right? Anti-monitor is even much, much more powerful than her, but that doesn't stop her from almost killing him, does it? Well, he almost died in a match against her. while flash is even more powerful than supergirl, anti-monitor much more powerful than OKT, what stops flash from speed stealing or just phasing his organs out, not to mention that sundipped kryptonians are in this battle.
Think about that ;)

It's the best book out there right now IMO and I don't think I'm being a biased fan since Thor is my favorite character. Ribic's art blends in perfectly with the epic stories Aaron tells.

@fresh_prince: I was watching like a variant comic video once and he said that thor god of thunder is a great comic, at the end of the video he suggested which comics that should be collected and stuff and one of them was thor GOT. The art looks amazing, but overall my favorite artist is Jim lee.

@czarny_samael666: Yes I understand you when you say Thor was the one who KO'd Surtur while Odin was the one who banished him and I don't disagree and never really did. I acknowledge the feat and that it did happen but don't you think it is outlandish that Thor is able to wield the Odinforce much better than Odin can so quickly during his fight with Surtur? Odin could have easily imitated what Thor did in order to beat Surtur in the other future occasions they fought but why didn't he if he saw how effective it was? The fact that that fight took place during Thor 400 seems to speak a lot.

And yes I have seen what Odin did to Drax and Surfer but those two weren't exactly fighting at the speeds the team here can. There are also more of them for Thor to worry about rather then seeing them one at a time. Hitting them won't be as easy as it was for Odin to hit those 2.

Because them flying at regular flight speed doesn't have as much force as it does if they were utilizing their speed. The force exerted would be much greater and that's what they're trying to do here. Superman himself has shown that he can fight at speeds and even utilize his other abilities as is the case in his fight with Mongul or with Doomsday. Don't get me wrong I'm not comparing those 2 to Thor in speed, I'm just pointing out that he can stay at super speeds for more than just 1 or 2 attacks. Using ABC logic like you did, if OKT is at Odin level, then they don't exactly need moon-level attacks in order to hurt or at least phase Thor. If Odin's felt attacks from people such as Thor then the attacks of this team should work on OKT. A combination of those smaller attacks, while not on the level Galactus hit Thor with, will still put it's toll on him.

Team

Thor should win, easily, if I am not mistaken.

Team

@supermanwithatan01: @ultragreenboy: how

@thanosii: Even Odin was not immune to physical damage. This team has the speed, blunt force and the overall abilities to damage him.

@czarny_samael666: @frozen: @princearagorn1: Marvel future being canon or otherwise is not an easy question to answer as 2 guys are making out to be, epscially the more far into the future it gets. Some example, orginal Guardians of the Galaxy team isnt from a different simply a future of current 616 reality and yet its deemed a whole completely different reality, the same is true for 2099 universes as well. There are literally 100s of example i can site about future reality not being exactly glass canon.

The longer in the future the more dubious things become, because marvel 616 future isnt predefined, it changes constantly. Better explained in Bendis's Avengers run, or Legion solo series etc. Future because uncertain, any future we see as just potential futures unless the writer completely decides to ignore so many years of canon publication.

@killemall: Yes, the GOT future could change, though keep in mind the series is a very recent depiction of the future for Thor - anyways, this is OKT being used with all OF feats.

Recent being one thing, what i was pointing was, as far away as you reach into the future, the canonity of it, despite writers intention can be questionable because future by its very nature is uncertain.

You dont have to official change the future, to the best of my knoweledge neither 2099 nor GOTG future has been change, it remains unaltered even today.

Thats why i find this thread dodgy, because its not like Thor with Odin Force has always had same power level. Example Thor # 400 looked powerful, but then we have King Thor who certainly wasnt anywhere close to as powerful as Odin given he literally got knocked out trying to remake a moon, Odin having repaired countless planets and stuffs with a wave of his hand. We also likewise was Odin Force Thor much later struggling to even bring back Asgard , all he managed to do was bring back a small city and had used so much energy that he had to go for Thor sleep, when Odin finally came back in Fear Itself he rebuilt the entire Asgard + an additional planet called Battleworld with the soul purpose of weaponizing it for fighting Serpent.

I am also really unsold at Old King Thor being more powerful than Odin or even as powerful as him, but thats for a different debate.

@killemall: Firstly, yes we will see, whether GOT changes, secondly, I do believe you made the point that writers often vary power levels {e.g. Jurgens attributed Odin at a very low level whereas other writers clearly uphold him higher} though yes, it's a different debate for another time.

I think you are missing the point. The very fact that its not in the current timeline means the canonity is dubious, it doesnt have to change.

I understand that, not saying i dont understand, but when we are left with nothing other than comparing feat what can we actually do, because you seem to have essentially compared a fed Galactus vs Odin and an Old Hungry Galactus vs Old King Thor to somehow surmise Old King Thor is more powerful.. i am just pointing counter arguments comparing feats.

Locked by request :)