This topic is locked from further discussion.

#201 Edited by spiderbuck (2455 posts) - - Show Bio

@cgoodness: qft.

Imagine, if you will, replacing Chaos King with Superman. It does not end well for him.

#202 Posted by Cgoodness (6752 posts) - - Show Bio

@spiderbuck: that's why I'm usually on thors side when he's fighting Supes in these threads, he can one hit KO Supes while Supes has to hit Thor alot to just knock him back.

#203 Edited by Experio (17632 posts) - - Show Bio

The first scan showed Superman having enough

The second scan Showed him getting hurt by Magic but it just didnt kill him, but one thing is to get cleared out. Does Mjolnir from comparing to Desaads Magical weapon have the potential to kill Superman? Its the only way to determine how Mjolnir would effect him

#204 Posted by spiderbuck (2455 posts) - - Show Bio

@cgoodness: Yeah, I agree. Thor has good days and bad days, but on average he's a tough SOB with a buttload of versatility and power.

#205 Edited by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

@toptom said:

Not a good start.

I am sorry but that is simply ridicoulos. That feat is all but ambiguos. We have the numbers, we have the time,we have the motivation about why he was struggling a little. You want it to be ambiguous, 'cause we don't know how much weight he had on each arm or leg. It is funny though, this feat is ambiguous but the one in which Thor is somehow blowing a planet without even touching it is not. ;)

Of course its left to be ambiguous - which to better clarify its meant to be a showing that says 'Superman is this strong... but he could be stronger' that much is evident by the dialogue and a point brought up about his absence from the sun for five days. As for 'we have the numbers!' - actually we don't have the numbers, namely why:

The writer doesn't want to get into the details and that's why they're using the word essentially - as in 'pretty much.' As for struggling 'a little' - you don't take pauses after each... word... if... it... is... a minor struggle. Clark's out of breathe, he's tired and this process taxed him to his limits. And the very nature of the showing where we don't know how much weight is on each limb - how this machine really puts that weight on Superman is an unknown - albeit not the one I was immediately referrencing. We as the reader have to take a number of assumptions because that information is not immediately available.

Do you have an issue with this assessment? Am I not being fair in analysis of it or are you going to tell me how this is wrong and how Superman can totally punch out the weight of the world EZ?

@toptom said:

Firs of all it is meaningless talking about pre-52 Superman. I don't even know why you are mentioning him (and you do it even in the wrong way since he has exceeded the feat you are talking almost 3 times already....). This is new 52 Superman and lifting a planet = moving a planet.I am sorry. Somehow you are still pretending to find the flaw in that feat. If you lift something you are actually moving that objcet from the ground. If i am strong enough to lift a car then i am also strong enough to move it. Since a planet is in the vacuum lifting it equals moving it.Stop talking about oranges and lemons, try to use a bit of logic or common sense instead.

Try thinking for a moment. You keep making references to his Pre-52 counterpart everytime you mention 'planet moving' strength in this argument. I'm pointing out that wasn't case then and it hasn't been shown to be the case now. He moved what three times before the New 52? Show me Superman under his own power and un-enhanced moving the planet three times.

Lifting the weight of the world doesn't equate to him being capable of moving the Earth. You're pretending its the same feat but it isn't. There is a massive difference from picking an object up off the ground and pushing a planet. The first erroneous assumption you make is Clark has the flight power to push the planet, but he's done nothing to suggest he can in the New 52. His efforts would look a lot like this:

Another assumption you made was how the Earth's weight (or better termed - mass) relates to pushing the planet out of orbit around the Sun. It has a lot less to do with how much we weigh the Earth and more to do with the forces that keep the Earth in that constant orbit (we're falling into the sun as we speak, but narrowly avoid it at the end of the year!). The better question you should ask is how hard should Superman have to push to move the Earth, rather than make an assumption based off him lifting the mass of the Earth.

Being in space only makes the task a lot harder than you think it does. But thanks for playing and trying to educate me about how its the same feat with the amazing little thought you've put into this argument.

@toptom said:

Then regarding your "lifting strength ≠ striking power theory" you could be right if Superman hasn't already surpassed that feat using merely his fists.

Since when did 'Power Level' become "he's hitting with each fist harder than the weight of the planet!"?

There is a difference between 'theory' and simply thinking practical. Quite literally you are arguing as if Superman was a DBZ character at this point trying to push a statement about 'power levels' into something it isn't. Congradulations! Quite the achievment, it comes with a complete lack of me taking you remotely seriously in a debate with the S-Man.

How many times i have to talk about the H'el feat again? You have already told that i mention him too much...but looks like i haven't mentioned it enough. (of course i am the one who is trolling...)

So we have two examples of Thor and Superman hitting someone. The main difference is Thor's hits are destroying adjacent worlds and Superman's are being felt on the Watchtower. How is this feat comparable again - outside of course someone's dillusional mind? Thor's clearly hitting much harder, what's there to debate here?

You literally have no argument - outside 'he's passed his recorded power level' and 'he essentially lifted the weight of the Earth'. Awesome.

@toptom said:
..umm..not really. If "just" hitting something with such a force damages him severely, being HIT with a similar force repeatedly can ko him or even kill him.

A good question at this point would be to ask if you know how muscles work - especially when you're working out. Something tells me you don't, so it's best to leave it alone. His bone's vibrating and his fingers cracking are from the force - that however is not significant damage to Thor, given he's being stabbed / Gorr's weapon is chewing on him from the inside - that's damage - him tearing his muscles as he exerts them is not.

Thanks for playing.

You wanted to see Gorr using/creating a wormhole and i have shown it to you. He has opened it when he has summoned that snake.Deal with it.

Deal with what? His weapon pulled another power out of it's hat that I missed (or forgot) when the Thor's were about to pummel him. It's clear young Thor's the reason that wormhole was created given Gorr wasn't trying to go anywhere.

Debating a non point.

#206 Edited by toptom (1293 posts) - - Show Bio

Again with that feat? Just stop embarassing yourself. It was stated that he was lifting that weight, if you put the word "essentially" it doesn't change a bit. Plus it is clear to most that he could do more.... as he has already done.

There is a massive difference from picking an object up off the ground and pushing a planet.

Lol...yes there is a difference...until you can lift an object that is "essentially" as heavy as the earth when you aren't even at full power of course. (you know that posting a picture with pre-52 supergirl doesn't prove nothing...right?). ((Then if you want to push a planet out its orbit you don't even have to use a force that is equal to its mass but one who is much smaller...i bet you don't even know this.))

The first erroneous assumption you make is Clark has the flight power to push the planet, but he's done nothing to suggest he can in the New 52.

"Essentially" you don't know what you are talking about. He has shown to be able to fly about 300 times faster than light,apparently even without trying.Try harder,or don't try at all.

Then you say he hasn't done anything to suggest he can't (but that is only you mind me)...except lifting right the same weight you say he can't and surpassing that feat later,just using his fists (then we don't even have to count the times in which it was stated he could cick the moon out of orbit,of course..).

Lifting the weight of the world doesn't equate to him being capable of moving the Earth. You're pretending its the same feat but it isn't.

Maybe english is your language...but looks like you have some problem with it. Here you are , i am helping you a bit. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lift (if you lift an object you have to move it,son..)

Since when did 'Power Level' become "he's hitting with each fist harder than the weight of the planet!"?

More or less since Dr veritas has stated that he has surpassed the previous power level,which she has measured when he was bench pressing the planet.Lets go on.

"So we have two examples of Thor and Superman hitting someone. The main difference is Thor's hits are destroying adjacent worlds and Superman's are being felt on the Watchtower. How is this feat comparable again - outside of course someone's dillusional mind? Thor's clearly hitting much harder, what's there to debate here?"

Since Thor can't destroy things without touching them, i am going to believe that Gorr was somehow involved in this, since he was fighting back, and since physical blows doesn't travel in the vacuum. Then I haven't told that Superman can punch harder than that, what i have told is that he can shatter a planet as well with his fists since he can generate a pressure bigger than 6 sixtilion (or something like that), and many of them coming at super speed can bring thor down and i haven't seen anything to suggest the contrary.

Debating a non point.

..smh..

#207 Edited by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

The usage of 'essentially' makes a big difference in the written langauge. I'd rather not play English teacher, but hopefully an example will help clarify that point:

  • I save children.
  • I essentially save children.

The first is without doubt, a clear statement to an action. The latter implies there is more to the action itself than what is being said. And that is besides the point, I have no issue with accepting the feat for what it was - but pretending it's a completely defined showing is hogwash. There are a number of unwritten details and an emphasis on it being ambiguous to Superman's upper limits.

He didn't exceed anything outside his 'recorded power-level'. Explain to me what 'exceeding his recorded power levels' means - because right now you're arguing with nothing relevant outside a similar showing where Superman is hitting a lot less harder.

Just a pro-tip about power-levels:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsMSiVn6vpQ

Indeed they are.

Are you perhaps MKF30, because I doubt you're Spike given he loathes Superman for a passion. Maybe even the second coming of SupermanDefender? Eitherway you're trolling. Don't be afraid to reveal your identity - I'm just curious.

You glossed over the point. It doesn't matter how much you can lift - if you don't have the necassary flight-power / propulsion you won't go anywhere. Right now there is no evidence for Clark having that much power behind his flight, he could push on the Earth all day and it wouldn't move. Ignore that factoid all day in favor of pushing stupid points, but you will go about as far as Superman has everytime he's tried to push the Earth on his own. Spoilers, no where.

@toptom said:

Then you say he hasn't done anything to suggest he can't (but that is only you mind me)...except lifting right the same weight you say he can't and surpassing that feat later,just using his fists (then we don't even have to count the times in which it was stated he could cick the moon out of orbit,of course..).

The Flash has gone million times the speed of light - he can't push a planet. You're bringing up un-relevant data to justify a conclusion it has nothing to do with. Short of Superman actually pushing the Earth, you don't have argument.

He lifted 'essentially' the same weight as the Earth for days - he didn't do that with his flight power. So again you're ignoring the point. He didn't surpass anything outside his previously recorded level of power - which means a huge gleaming pile of nothing.

Maybe english is your language...but looks like you have some problem with it. Here you are , i am helping you a bit. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lift (if you lift an object you have to move it,son..)

I get you're trying to antagonize me - it's a cute effort and all but I couldn't care any less. The big flaw if your point here is he didn't lift the Earth, he supposedly just lifted (more like pushed on as an earlier post of mine pointed out) its equivalent in weight. So this entire link to the dictionary is entirely unecassary given the lack of him lifting any worlds at all.

Thanks for playing.

More or less since Dr veritas has stated that he has surpassed the previous power level,which she has measured when he was bench pressing the planet.Lets go on.

Apparently you know a lot more about Dr. Veritas' methods in determining that 'power level' then the rest of us. Regardless you forgot a few key details.

Superman had gone through more than a single test at this point, using the entirety of this research facility to test him. His power level - whatever that means - was determined through those tests. So again - you're argument doesn't exist.

Let's finish big shall we?

For one thing - Thor's the God of Thunder and Lightning. He's more than capable of destroying a plethora of things either through his various weapons in his hammer or his own innate ability to call down magic bolts of lightning. He's leveled entire areas bro-fisting Hercules or Beta Ray Bill. He does not need to touch anything to destroy said anything.

The other I couldn't much care what you say you believe in - Gorr's big part in this feat was getting hit in the face by Mjolnir. That's his entire contribution, you having issues coming to that realization is not my problem. It's all you. And we can play with the vacuum concept all day - the energy from those hits are the only catalyst worth mentioning - you have nothing else to contribute here. Just like the Watchtower feeling Superman's hits, somehow the vacuum of space can transfer this energy and that's that.

Superman's fists don't hit anywhere close to that hard and he certainly can't hit that hard in rapid assaults. As for why you haven't seen anything to the contrary because you're intentionally playing dumb at this point just to cheer on to the rest of us that 'Superman wins.'

If you're going to respond - either post evidence what power levels means, reveal to us why his striking power feat is remotely as impressive as Thor's and how Gorr's contribution was more than being hit.

Thanks again,

Sincerely Someone You've debated against before in all likelihood.

#208 Posted by BigCimmerian (9127 posts) - - Show Bio
#209 Posted by BigCimmerian (9127 posts) - - Show Bio

@toptom said:

@sog7dc:

that planet shattering feat is higly ambiguous. And if I am going to be honest I am giving that to Gorr (mostly)and not to Thor. They were fighting each other but he was the strongest one...by far. So both of them have shattered that planet (somehow...),but since he was many times stronger than him that should be a Gorr's feat and not a thor's.

Then you say that the only advantage that you cleary see is the speed for supes, but I can't really see Thor being able to move the earth,let alone if he is not at his 100%. Let alone punching it out of orbit. This Superman, on the other hand, is so strong that Dr.Veritas wanted to open a black-hole to test his full strength,since lifting the whole planet for 5 days wasn't enough...even if he was weakened by the lack of sun's light.

Thor has had all this feats thanks to a nice space fight,and these are those kind of fights were we can get the craziest feats, but if we put Superman on a similar scenario ,against a powerful enemy,he has all the numbers and the feats to do even better.

You are probably wrong, Thor is physically more powerful than Gorr, but Gorr is superior because of his shadow powers and he defeated 3 Thors after all those gods were sacrificed in order to Gorr gain strength.

#211 Posted by jashro44 (26523 posts) - - Show Bio

Even if we assume gorr was doing most of the work that just means Thor is more durable the a planet...

#212 Edited by The_Titan_Lord (7216 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow. I'm enjoying your debates guys. I agree on one thing Lifting strength ≠ Striking Power. You obviously can lift or push some stuff but that doesn't mean you can break it with your bare hands by striking at it.

#213 Posted by SOG7dc (8563 posts) - - Show Bio

I think you guys are getting too contentious. nobody feels as strongly about superman as I do but please don't let this become a flame war.

#214 Edited by toptom (1293 posts) - - Show Bio

@isaac_clarke: so...you are really basing your arguments on somenthing like: "he has essentially done that...", "pre-52 supergirl couldn't move the earth.."..."the flash can not move the earth....", "he can lift the planet but he can not move it..." , "superman has done more than a tests"...wow. That resembles me some circus's show , with clowns,precarious funambolists and somersaults.

uff...

however. Lifting requires move an object from the ground. That is settled. We can argue about feat all days but sometimes things are purely objcetive. If you have some problem with objcetivity (and logic..) that's your problem. Here you are again this link. i am still trying to help you. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/lift

Then, you try to avoid the fact that he is physically strong enough to perform such a feat because "you have to fly faaast, D'oh!" I can give you evidence showing superman flying 300 times faster than light, but that would be useless......because the flash can not move a planet. That is a revelation.( of course it doesn't matter that he hasn't super strength, or that he isn't durable enough...or that he can fly...that are just small points)

Then regarding your: "Superman had gone through more than a single test at this point, using the entirety of this research facility to test him. His power level - whatever that means - was determined through those tests. So again - you're argument doesn't exist."

he has done those tests, and thanks to them she could measure his power levels. Then he has exceeded them all.With his fists alone.You are free to NOT see the connection. Again..that's just your problem, somehow.

"The other I couldn't much care what you say you believe in - Gorr's big part in this feat was getting hit in the face by Mjolnir. That's his entire contribution,"

Looks like he was fighting back.

"Superman's fists don't hit anywhere close to that hard and he certainly can't hit that hard in rapid assaults"

First of all we don't know if Thor was the only one to cause such a devastation (because, despite what you say he can not destroy things via telepathy), what we know for certain is that superman can generate MORE than 6 sextilion of pressure..and that he has super speed. To bad for thor he is not holding back in this fight.Since one punch from superman will hurt thor, hundreds of them will do the job.

Then looks like you enjoy wasting your time posting those images..but at least the last one could be funny for someone and wasn't utterly asinine as the supergirl's one . Seems like you are making progresses.

(then i don't even know who is mkf30...but seems that you are suffering from some kind of mental persecution...)

However this discussion has entered in a vicious cirlce. Unless you bring some valid or new arguments(because of course i haven't brought them..as you say), i am done. I still see superman winning most of the times thanks to his speed (he can litterally see thor in slow motion) and strength.

#215 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

@sog7dc: this i agree, definitely go with supes due to his potential which was even posted but gotta love how some folks downplay supes strength lol.

@toptom: hey dude im mkf/Vaeternus, as im sure can tell the guy clearly has an obsession with me for some reason, its one reason i hardly post. [now you see why lol]as lol take it from me dont kill yourself lol dude lol while youve proved the guy wrong he'll never admit it, you've made solid points and i agree like you said veritas even states she felt he could do so much more and supes wasnt even going all oit, thor would fail if he tried.lifting the earths weight much less for five days straight in a weakened state no less lol. Some folks just cant see past their own opinions ·shrugs· As I'm sure you've come to realize he thinks anyone who proves him wrong or disagrees with him is apparently "me" under a different name.

#216 Posted by houseshm (443 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow. I'm enjoying your debates guys. I agree on one thing Lifting strength ≠ Striking Power. You obviously can lift or push some stuff but that doesn't mean you can break it with your bare hands by striking at it.

agreed, I cant believe how many people try posting a scan of some guy lifting something equivalent to a planet or moon and say that means he can destroy a planet/moon. No that is completely wrong. Also, the same issue superman was bench pressing the earth, he couldnt get out of a the grip of a dragon that was killed by fire and he was smacked to ireland from new york even after he got a power boost by going to the sun. marvel now thor would win.

#218 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

@ houseshm, Err superman defeated the dragon...weak argument. Also if youre going to post a scan post the entire panel...noticed plan b is missing since it shows supes beating the dragon once he got serious(not to mention Superman was holding back and not even going all out, he even koed one of the head by punching it...) give me a break...

BTW, the end of that scan since it would just contradict your own point...Supes using his heat vision with precision and killing the dragon instantly...

#219 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

It's that guy that was banned four times four trolling, lets say "hi".

@sog7dc: this i agree, i still go with supes due to his potential which was even posted but gotta love how some folks downplay supes strength lol.

@toptom: hi man im mkf, as im sure can tell the guy clearly has an obsession with me for some reason, its one reason i hardly post. [now you see why lol]as lol take it from me dont kill yourself lol dude lol while youve proved the guy wrong he'll never admit it, youve made solid points and i agree like you said veritas even states she felt he could do so much more and supes wasnt even going all oit, thor would fail if he tried.lifting the earths weight much less for five days straight in a weakened state no less lol. Some folks just cant see past their own opinions ·shrugs·

I'm one of the reasons you hardly post? What was your excuse while I was in Italy for the last month and a half? I was hoping you finally became more productive in your life outside living it on these boards and got a decent job. Oh well.

What did me wrong with? What good points? Quite literally your post amounts to the usual lack of specifics or any basic reasoning.

#220 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

@ isaac, lol I was never banned 4 times, but apparently your obsession persists(that's not creepy). But moving on since you're going off topic yet a gain.. So tell me, are you that bored that you feel the need to quote every person in here who disagrees with you, typing novels of ridicule and your personal opinion? You must have a lot of time on your hands. haha, says the guy who trolls everyone not for his precious Thor...

Yes, since you have this bad habit of stalking me on here, seriously this topic is proof lol, you go into another rant about "MKF30 blah, blah" yet nobody cares guy and it's off topic and does nothing for your argument no less(so do tell and humor me what I have to do with you debating with other users exactly? I would have thought you've learned from the last guy who tried to do that but sadly not(can't say I'm surprised though) I do have one and I thought you'd by now do something which I'm sure @toptom can see(btw he's not me and I'm not him) I never saw him in my life until now, but given his responces I must say I like him already so you may want to get over your paranoid delusions by now of "everyone who godforbid disagrees with you automatically being me".

Right...so in other words, in reality others proving you wrong=(to you) "lack of specifics or any basic reasoning" uhh huh, whatever you say sparky.

#221 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

@toptom said:

@isaac_clarke: so...you are really basing your arguments on somenthing like: "he has essentially done that...", "pre-52 supergirl couldn't move the earth.."..."the flash can not move the earth....", "he can lift the planet but he can not move it..." , "superman has done more than a tests"...wow. That resembles me some circus's show , with clowns,precarious funambolists and somersaults.

You clearly haven't read arguments or your purposely misinterpreting them. Who are we kidding, of course it's the latter. The fact you can sit there and ignore the dialogue in the scans posted where the good Dr. says Superman had undergone multiple tests is evidence enough of that.

There is no ground in space; he can't lift something orbiting a star. He can't push it without the necassary flight power to do so.

No, I said he can't do it because there is no evidence he can. If he doesn't have a showing where he shows himself pushing a planet - that he has the necessary power in his propulsion to push it. His independent flight-speed is an inconsequential data point that doesn't reflect he can do what you claim he can.

Cleary it was a mention in regards to his performance in the fight - not just his fists. Without some sort of scale, some sort of data on what 'power level' means or what Superman's power level specifically even was - her dialogue doesn't tell us anything outside he's performing better than he did in his tests.

In other words - you have no debate.

"The other I couldn't much care what you say you believe in - Gorr's big part in this feat was getting hit in the face by Mjolnir. That's his entire contribution,"

http://www.comicvine.com/api/image/scale_medium/3295686-3291996-4180709447-qiyja+%281%29.jpg

Looks like he was fighting back.

Looks like he's getting smacked in the jaw by Mjolnir.

You're argument is Gorr's weapons penetrating Thor's skin are in part or the entire reason planets are exploding.

  • This is despite that not being the case in earlier fights Gorr's had with Thor that didn't consist of worlds exploding because he was stabbing Thor.
  • This also tries to argue that to even hurt Thor - Gorr is using an insane amount of force - concentrated in his blades to stab Thor.

So far you insist the evidence isn't clear because... well you haven't given a reason - just that Gorr is some how participating in this showing outside being a punching bag. Yet in a similar showing with Superman that is no where at the same scale of devastation - where Superman is just punching someone into the dirt while 'his recorded power levels are exceeded' and it's felt on the Watchtower. This is somehow a better feat because as you explained it... Superman's power level exceeded recorded levels from when he 'lifted' 'essentially' the weight of the world for five days.

Stellar argument.

It's not telepathy - it's the raw power of his swings of Mjolnir into Gorr's face. The energy from that strike is being transferred across space and tearing apart the adjacent world - that Thor rushes into to put back together - with his ability to manipulate 'earth' from mom. Superman thinks punches that can level a small -mountain top a big deal in the New 52 and the fact the Earth isn't destroyer kinda kills any argument that Superman is hitting anywhere close to that hard - much less as hard as Thor was kitting Gorr.

Superman could hit Thor all day and it wouldn't matter based off that pathetic display of his exceeding his limits.

@toptom said:

Then looks like you enjoy wasting your time posting those images..but at least the last one could be funny for someone and wasn't utterly asinine as the supergirl's one . Seems like you are making progresses.

(then i don't even know who is mkf30...but seems that you are suffering from some kind of mental persecution...)

However this discussion has entered in a vicious cirlce. Unless you bring some valid or new arguments(because of course i haven't brought them..as you say), i am done. I still see superman winning most of the times thanks to his speed (he can litterally see thor in slow motion) and strength.

I waste a lot more time responding to your lack of an argument - reclarify points you're just going to ignore in the next post as you intentional go about misinterpreting what I've written. Supergirl's was illustrating how strength matters little if you don't have the flight power to do something - but thanks for playing.

Also can you get me some of those scans of Superman moving the Earth pre-52 on his own?

#222 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

@ isaac, lol I was never banned 4 times, but apparently your obsession persists(that's not creepy). But moving on since you're going off topic yet a gain.. So tell me, are you that bored that you feel the need to quote every person in here who disagrees with you, typing novels of ridicule and your personal opinion? You must have a lot of time on your hands. haha, says the guy who trolls everyone not for his precious Thor...

Yes, since you have this bad habit of stalking me on here, seriously this topic is proof lol, you go into another rant about "MKF30 blah, blah" yet nobody cares guy and it's off topic and does nothing for your argument no less(so do tell and humor me what I have to do with you debating with other users exactly? I would have thought you've learned from the last guy who tried to do that but sadly not(can't say I'm surprised though) I do have one and I thought you'd by now do something which I'm sure @toptom can see(btw he's not me and I'm not him) I never saw him in my life until now, but given his responces I must say I like him already so you may want to get over your paranoid delusions by now of "everyone who godforbid disagrees with you automatically being me".

Right...so in other words, in reality others proving you wrong=(to you) "lack of specifics or any basic reasoning" uhh huh, whatever you say sparky.

I've personally been involved in three of those bans and you happily went to tell me on Zaterra how you were banned for the week after arguing in a Mortal Kombat thread. That's four bans in the time I've known you - how you keep coming back - is the most illusive question - because honestly you would think Mods would just call it a day and not give you another chance.

I understand math isn't your strong point and you know I already have that evidence to pull out - so this 'what I've been banned four times? Jeez where did you get that idea from' is pointless chatter. Static's banned two of your accounts, Divine Spawn another and the fourth - who knows? The only reason you're posting here is a site glitch that unbanned them.

Of course you like him - he's debating how Superman wins. It doesn't matter what he's saying as long as it ends with 'Superman wins.' That's all it takes for you to fall in love with anything really --- the glorious DC sticker.

Like I've said before I have my doubts you read comics regularly and you certainly haven't read a Thor comic you life (much-less anything from Marvel Now).

Now how about you tell me why Superman wins and why Thor's feat where he's pummeling Gorr hard enough to destroy the adjacent planet's isn't as good as Superman's hitting someone into the dirt or fighting a dragon.

#223 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

Isaac, Yeah, well since you don't have any mods wrapped around your finger anymore like a certain former mod(emphasis on the FORMER) who was involved in one of those nonsense bans, you have no aid anymore. But not that any of that matters, because you should have been banned that first time being involved in flaming. At any rate, no that's 2 times and technically only one of them being legit. Yeah, well considering how many people you go out of your way to argue with it's shocking you're not banned when you should be. You quote people make novelic, useless posts putting others down in a subtle fashion thinking you're slick doing it just because you've been proved wrong or don't agree. I already told you the Zaterra name was NOT me but created by me for a friend initially, but just made on my PC who logged in a few times on his PC then just lost interest. But I'm done repeating myself with that. You also should not speak of mulitple names having your Hellos name, so hypocrite much? Posting scans from me saying the same thing on my YT(since I'm sure you'll do that next to prove you're just still stalking me elsewhere) again perhaps you need to get a new hobby? Go outside or something? Since you obviously have to search through a LOT of vids being as how I have over 100 uploaded on my channel..sad and creepy at the same time.

Oh yeah because Superman totally hasn't pummeled or dealt with people stronger then himself on Gorr's or supassing his level like Darkseid, H'el, Helspont etc. But I'm sure you'll ignore that.

Clearly you're unaware of this topic, last time I checked had more feats then Marvel now Thor...Why Superman wins? Ok(not that you'll be convinced you'll just lowball the feats or make up some other lame excuse but sure) And keep in mind these aren't even ALL of his feats...just a few to prove my point.

http://www.comicvine.com/superman/4005-1807/forums/new-52-superman-respect-thread-670295/?page=18

Wait...did YOU of all people just pull out the "fanboy" card? LMAO...Oh the irony, because you totally haven't displayed ANY remote bias for Thor or MU over the years on here even WITH legit Superman feats that Thor can only dream of doing here...but to help you further, I shall educate you more concerning scans.

Supes surviving a CLEAN direct shot from Darkseid's omegga beams(because Thor would totally not be effected by that right?) and going toe to toe with DS(yet at this stage Superman wasn't even at full power or potential yet yet hurt Darkseid) Now I can sense it now, Isaac will come at me with "it still tagged Superman or something of that nature" because Thor has totally showed speed feats remotely close to Clarks lol. But if so proof?

Superman going toe to toe with Helspont(who is a Majestic Villian has greater durability then Superman yet Superman's durabilty is no joke as he was just K.O.ed by his blast) again something Thor would not just walk away from...

Shown ridiculous speed and blitzing, Supes would be moving Faster then Thor would THINK...

Oh and that Dragon point since that other fellow conveniently left out the conclusion to that once superman got serious, he destroyed it instantly via using his heat vision with precision...

Oh lastly, btw the last guy to question "me never reading or owning a comic book" I made look silly, so it'll be wise for you to retract that statement before I do the same to you (not that I haven't before) but seriously, I'd wager my comicbook collection is larger then yours, and you've clearly shown you read nothing but Marvel while lowballing everything else as usual. But first let's see your "huge" collection otherwise you're just all talk and no action like most people who try to come at me with the "you have no comics" card...as for your math comment, I've said I never liked Math class that doesn't translate to me being horrible at it as I still passed it last time I checked but good job on yet another false assumption! You're on a roll today!!

P.S. try not to post scans of you stalking my youtube or other sites since that proves nothing except that you're clearly a stalker.

#224 Posted by houseshm (443 posts) - - Show Bio

@ houseshm, Err superman defeated the dragon...weak argument. Also if youre going to post a scan post the entire panel...noticed plan b is missing since it shows supes beating the dragon once he got serious(not to mention Superman was holding back and not even going all out, he even koed one of the head by punching it...) give me a break...

BTW, the end of that scan since it would just contradict your own point...Supes using his heat vision with precision and killing the dragon instantly...

that was exactly the point lol, superman could not get out of the dragon grip even though the dragon was so weak it was killed by fire. Superman lifting strength does not equal striking strength. He was going all out when he punched the dragon and it even says that on panel. His punch is stated to be able to topple a small mountain. Even after lifting the the weight equivalent to earth and getting charged up by the sun he got beat up by a dragon and could not get out of its grip using his strength. This shows lifting strength has nothing to do with a fight. BTW, superman heat vision didnt kill the dragon so you just contradicted yourself right there. It even says on the scan you posted that he uses his heat vision to ignite oil and the fire engulfs the dragon.

#225 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@ houseshm, Err superman defeated the dragon...weak argument. Also if youre going to post a scan post the entire panel...noticed plan b is missing since it shows supes beating the dragon once he got serious(not to mention Superman was holding back and not even going all out, he even koed one of the head by punching it...) give me a break...

BTW, the end of that scan since it would just contradict your own point...Supes using his heat vision with precision and killing the dragon instantly...

that was exactly the point lol, superman could not get out of the dragon grip even though the dragon was so weak it was killed by fire. Superman lifting strength does not equal striking strength. He was going all out when he punched the dragon and it even says that on panel. His punch is stated to be able to topple a small mountain. Even after lifting the the weight equivalent to earth and getting charged up by the sun he got beat up by a dragon and could not get out of its grip using his strength. This shows lifting strength has nothing to do with a fight. BTW, superman heat vision didnt kill the dragon so you just contradicted yourself right there. It even says on the scan you posted that he uses his heat vision to ignite oil and the fire engulfs the dragon.

He wasn't even going all out he's thinking while he's fighting him, Superman wasn't pissed or anything and I like how you posted the scan but ignored the fact that he KOed one of the heads completely after punching it..., he was weighing his options since Clark doesn't even go all out half the time because he doesn't need to. I never said Superman lifting is striking but the same goes for Thor, and clearly in terms of power feats, Superman has displayed more impressive feats. He was lifting the Earth's weight 5 days STRAIGHT in a weakened state not exposed to the sun....where has thor proved to life the weight of a planet such as Earth for multiple days straight no less? I don't really consider that "beat up" being slapped a few times by a tail, Thor would have just as much trouble if not more and being as how he needs his little hammer to fight how would he summon a lightning strike when he's tied up? lol Yes, the heat vision was used via precision and ignited the oil engulfing and thus defeating the dragon. I didn't contradict anything. My point was you failed to post the scan for whatever reason because it proves superman defeated the dragon...

#226 Posted by houseshm (443 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@ houseshm, Err superman defeated the dragon...weak argument. Also if youre going to post a scan post the entire panel...noticed plan b is missing since it shows supes beating the dragon once he got serious(not to mention Superman was holding back and not even going all out, he even koed one of the head by punching it...) give me a break...

BTW, the end of that scan since it would just contradict your own point...Supes using his heat vision with precision and killing the dragon instantly...

that was exactly the point lol, superman could not get out of the dragon grip even though the dragon was so weak it was killed by fire. Superman lifting strength does not equal striking strength. He was going all out when he punched the dragon and it even says that on panel. His punch is stated to be able to topple a small mountain. Even after lifting the the weight equivalent to earth and getting charged up by the sun he got beat up by a dragon and could not get out of its grip using his strength. This shows lifting strength has nothing to do with a fight. BTW, superman heat vision didnt kill the dragon so you just contradicted yourself right there. It even says on the scan you posted that he uses his heat vision to ignite oil and the fire engulfs the dragon.

He wasn't even trying to, he was weighing his options since Clark doesn't even go all out half the time because he doesn't need to. I never said Superman lifting is striking but the same goes for Thor, and clearly in terms of power feats, Superman has displayed more impressive feats. He was lifting the Earth's weight 5 days STRAIGHT in a weakened state not exposed to the sun....where has thor proved to life the weight of a planet such as Earth for multiple days straight no less? I don't really consider that "beat up" being slapped a few times by a tail, Thor would have just as much trouble if not more and being as how he needs his little hammer to fight how would he summon a lightning strike when he's tied up? lol Yes, the heat vision was used via precision and ignited the oil engulfing and thus defeating the dragon. I didn't contradict anything. My point was you failed to post the scan for whatever reason because it proves superman defeated the dragon...

Clark did go all out this time, its says he took NO CHANCES which pretty much means he went all out. Clark going all out with his PUNCH is strong enough to topple a SMALL MOUNTAIN. You are giving lifting feats again and they mean anything here. Thor doesnt have to lift a planet to win a fight. Lifting strength has nothing do with a fight so you failed to prove why superman is superior.

#227 Edited by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, well since you don't have any mods wrapped around your finger anymore like a certain former mod who was involved in one of those nonsense bans, you have no aid anymore. But not that any of that matters, because you should have been banned that first time being involved in flaming. At any rate, no that's 2 times and technically only one of them being legit. Yeah, well considering how many people you go out of your way to argue with it's shocking you're not banned when you should be. You quote people make novelic, useless posts putting others down but think you're slick doing it just because you've been proved wrong or don't agree. I already told you the Zaterra name was NOT me, but just made on my PC by my friend who logged in a few times on his PC then just lost interest. But I'm done repeating myself with that. You also should not speak of mulitple names having your Hellos name, so hypocrite much?

Well, at least you've admitted you've been banned four times(oh never mind - two of those BANS don't count). But honestly if I had mod's wrapped around my fingers at any point in my tenure on Vine I wouldn't have waited to get you banned when you stormed into select threads to troll. I would have opted for a banhammer abortion.

Should have, could have, would have - it makes little difference when the majority of the time your bans are completely justified.

I'm sorry... what were you lying about? The of the matter is Zaterra was the account you immediately hopped onto to post when you where banned on MKF30... twice. The day Static banned you - I saw you posting on that same account. C'mon.

Clearly you're unaware of this topic, last time I checked had more feats then Marvel now Thor...Why Superman wins? Ok(not that you'll be convinced you'll just lowball the feats or make up some other lame excuse but sure) And keep in mind these aren't even ALL of his feats...just a few to prove my point.

http://www.comicvine.com/superman/4005-1807/forums/new-52-superman-respect-thread-670295/?page=18

Quality over quantity. However 'Marvel Now! Thor' - is the Thor from before 'Marvel Now!' - quite literally he has a boatload more showings to pull from. I've read the thread - honestly Superman has neat feats - even on his pre-New 52 counterpart; the issue is none of them display any showings close to the levels depicted by Thor in his own book alone - let alone others.

Wait...did YOU of all people just pull out the "fanboy" card? LMAO...Oh the irony, because you totally haven't displayed ANY remote bias for Thor or MU over the years on here even WITH legit Superman feats that Thor can only dream of doing here...but to help you further, I shall educate you more concerning scans.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/107179/3296305-2369857-omegabeams.png

Out of countext scans #1. For one Superman and the Flash were running away from the blasts - Superman was tagged as shown and KOed:

Hey look, he got KOed - even in the scans you posted.

And Darkseid wanted Superman for the big plan of getting his daughter so vaporizing him wouldn't have been the best idea - that is assuming he can given his Omega Beams did a lot of nothing and Superman's always had plot protection from them.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/107179/3296324-2371437-superman_vs_darkseid.jpg

Supes surviving a CLEAN direct shot from Darkseid's omegga beams(because Thor would totally not be effected by that right?) and going toe to toe with DS(yet at this stage Superman wasn't even at full power or potential yet yet hurt Darkseid)

Uh... you realize at that point both Wonder Woman and Aquaman had stabbed Darkseid in the eyes and Superman at this point was bullrushing him into a portal to BFR Darkseid...right? Otherwise Darkseid was trashing Superman and planning to use him for his big plan to get his daughter.

He didn't tank anything. It KOed him and allowed Darkseid to have his goons grab him to take him away. Tanking something generally doesn't consist of being knocked out cold by it.

Take for example Thor's fight with Galactus in Avengers #10 (?):

Read from right to left.

Sure Galactus was reaching down to finish him, but Thor at the very least remained conscious when he was blasted by Galactus.

Another excellent example is when Glory is hitting him with a blast that is sending Thor through time and space (Chaos War: Thor #1):

Thor's tanking Glory's best - and able to react / counter it with Mjolnir.

His fight with the Silver Surfer in Mighty Thor consisted of Thor (weakened) face-tanking cosmic blasts from the Silver Surfer:

Read from right to left

That's again, tanking something.

Even better - his showing in God of Thunder #11 - against the Godbomb designed (successfully mind you) to kill every god in creation - throughout time:

Not only tanking it - but absorbing the bomb into himself.

I know MKF30 not as cool as the Omega Beams, because it's DC and this Marvel - but I think we can make a case Thor might be able to tank those beams. Given he's tanking attacks that are tearing apart reality or bombs designed to kill him - and all over gods.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/107179/3296317-supes+vs+helspont.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/107179/3296307-2369960-hellspont.jpg

Superman going toe to toe with Helspont(who is a Majestic Villian has greater durability then Superman yet Superman's durabilty is no joke as he was just K.O.ed by his blast) again something Thor would not just walk away from...

Your point? Thor regularly fights individuals beyond his paygrade - from skyfathers, to abstracts at this point - dozens upon dozens of times. Plus that character as far as I know has New 52 feel that negates who he used to be the rogue of anyways.

Shown ridiculous speed and blitzing, Supes would be moving Faster then Thor would THINK...

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/107179/3296327-supes+speed+blitzing.jpg

Uh... that's not a speed blitz - that's a bullrush. Thor does them all the time. The main difference is - Superman is using it on an inexperience Hal Jordan (who Batman stole of the ring of just before without him noticing) and Thor does it to characters like Galactus:

Not once:

But twice:

Read from right to left

What he does later to try and hit the Flash was more akin to Superman actually utilizing his combat speed. But let's get on with the heatray vision feat.

Oh and that Dragon point since that other fellow conveniently left out the conclusion to that once superman got serious, he destroyed it instantly via using his heat vision with precision...

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/107179/3296292-2758271-superman_zone_017.jpg

You realize the explosion from the oil Superman heatrayed is what did that explosion right? Because it wasn't at all under Superman's own power he did that but that oil-field. That wouldn't hurt Thor, especially given his fight with Gorr consisted of Thor pushing Gorr into the adjacent star to fight him there.

But you know those are just details, vital details... but details. Right?

Oh lastly, btw the last guy to question "me never reading or owning a comic book" I made look silly, so it'll be wise for you to retract that statement before I do the same to you (not that I haven't before) but seriously, I'd wager my comicbook collection is larger then yours, and you've clearly shown you read nothing but Marvel while lowballing everything else as usual. But first let's see your "huge" collection otherwise you're just all talk and no action like most people who try to come at me with the "you have no comics" card...as for your math comment, I've said I never liked Math class that doesn't translate to me being horrible at it as I still passed it last time I checked but good job on yet another false assumption! You're on a roll today!!

Given you don't even know what is happening in the scans you posted yourself - it's tough for me not to say 'are you sure you read comic books?' So far you've been completely wrong.

Huge collection? That's what the Salvation Army is for. Although I am due for to turn in some stuff - its never more than a drawer's full. Of course keeping the stuff I really like. I'm pulling my scans right off of my Marvel digital account for the most part anyway.

Just to point: You okay? This has been one of the more thorough beatdowns I've given you in debating.

#228 Edited by BOdinson (224 posts) - - Show Bio
@vaeternus said:

He wasn't even going all out he's thinking while he's fighting him, Superman wasn't pissed or anything and I like how you posted the scan but ignored the fact that he KOed one of the heads completely after punching it..., he was weighing his options since Clark doesn't even go all out half the time because he doesn't need to. I never said Superman lifting is striking but the same goes for Thor, and clearly in terms of power feats, Superman has displayed more impressive feats. He was lifting the Earth's weight 5 days STRAIGHT in a weakened state not exposed to the sun....where has thor proved to life the weight of a planet such as Earth for multiple days straight no less? I don't really consider that "beat up" being slapped a few times by a tail, Thor would have just as much trouble if not more and being as how he needs his little hammer to fight how would he summon a lightning strike when he's tied up? lol Yes, the heat vision was used via precision and ignited the oil engulfing and thus defeating the dragon. I didn't contradict anything. My point was you failed to post the scan for whatever reason because it proves superman defeated the dragon...

You do realise that Thor doesn't need the hammer to summon elements, right? as he has done so at least twice in the very arc that's being discussed here.

Where have you been for the entirety of the God of Thunder run that you don't even know that?

#229 Posted by SPM1M (916 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@ houseshm, Err superman defeated the dragon...weak argument. Also if youre going to post a scan post the entire panel...noticed plan b is missing since it shows supes beating the dragon once he got serious(not to mention Superman was holding back and not even going all out, he even koed one of the head by punching it...) give me a break...

BTW, the end of that scan since it would just contradict your own point...Supes using his heat vision with precision and killing the dragon instantly...

that was exactly the point lol, superman could not get out of the dragon grip even though the dragon was so weak it was killed by fire. Superman lifting strength does not equal striking strength. He was going all out when he punched the dragon and it even says that on panel. His punch is stated to be able to topple a small mountain. Even after lifting the the weight equivalent to earth and getting charged up by the sun he got beat up by a dragon and could not get out of its grip using his strength. This shows lifting strength has nothing to do with a fight. BTW, superman heat vision didnt kill the dragon so you just contradicted yourself right there. It even says on the scan you posted that he uses his heat vision to ignite oil and the fire engulfs the dragon.

He wasn't even trying to, he was weighing his options since Clark doesn't even go all out half the time because he doesn't need to. I never said Superman lifting is striking but the same goes for Thor, and clearly in terms of power feats, Superman has displayed more impressive feats. He was lifting the Earth's weight 5 days STRAIGHT in a weakened state not exposed to the sun....where has thor proved to life the weight of a planet such as Earth for multiple days straight no less? I don't really consider that "beat up" being slapped a few times by a tail, Thor would have just as much trouble if not more and being as how he needs his little hammer to fight how would he summon a lightning strike when he's tied up? lol Yes, the heat vision was used via precision and ignited the oil engulfing and thus defeating the dragon. I didn't contradict anything. My point was you failed to post the scan for whatever reason because it proves superman defeated the dragon...

Clark did go all out this time, its says he took NO CHANCES which pretty much means he went all out. Clark going all out with his PUNCH is strong enough to topple a SMALL MOUNTAIN. You are giving lifting feats again and they mean anything here. Thor doesnt have to lift a planet to win a fight. Lifting strength has nothing do with a fight so you failed to prove why superman is superior.

umm you guys do realize that dragon was a creature of krypton right? a KRYPTONIAN dragon its not a surprise that superman had trouble breaking its grip plz do the research before posting misleading posts imagine a human trying to over power a dragon the size of sky scrapers, its actually a HUGE feat imo that superman defeated the dragon

#230 Edited by houseshm (443 posts) - - Show Bio

@spm1m said:

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@ houseshm, Err superman defeated the dragon...weak argument. Also if youre going to post a scan post the entire panel...noticed plan b is missing since it shows supes beating the dragon once he got serious(not to mention Superman was holding back and not even going all out, he even koed one of the head by punching it...) give me a break...

BTW, the end of that scan since it would just contradict your own point...Supes using his heat vision with precision and killing the dragon instantly...

that was exactly the point lol, superman could not get out of the dragon grip even though the dragon was so weak it was killed by fire. Superman lifting strength does not equal striking strength. He was going all out when he punched the dragon and it even says that on panel. His punch is stated to be able to topple a small mountain. Even after lifting the the weight equivalent to earth and getting charged up by the sun he got beat up by a dragon and could not get out of its grip using his strength. This shows lifting strength has nothing to do with a fight. BTW, superman heat vision didnt kill the dragon so you just contradicted yourself right there. It even says on the scan you posted that he uses his heat vision to ignite oil and the fire engulfs the dragon.

He wasn't even trying to, he was weighing his options since Clark doesn't even go all out half the time because he doesn't need to. I never said Superman lifting is striking but the same goes for Thor, and clearly in terms of power feats, Superman has displayed more impressive feats. He was lifting the Earth's weight 5 days STRAIGHT in a weakened state not exposed to the sun....where has thor proved to life the weight of a planet such as Earth for multiple days straight no less? I don't really consider that "beat up" being slapped a few times by a tail, Thor would have just as much trouble if not more and being as how he needs his little hammer to fight how would he summon a lightning strike when he's tied up? lol Yes, the heat vision was used via precision and ignited the oil engulfing and thus defeating the dragon. I didn't contradict anything. My point was you failed to post the scan for whatever reason because it proves superman defeated the dragon...

Clark did go all out this time, its says he took NO CHANCES which pretty much means he went all out. Clark going all out with his PUNCH is strong enough to topple a SMALL MOUNTAIN. You are giving lifting feats again and they mean anything here. Thor doesnt have to lift a planet to win a fight. Lifting strength has nothing do with a fight so you failed to prove why superman is superior.

umm you guys do realize that dragon was a creature of krypton right? a KRYPTONIAN dragon its not a surprise that superman had trouble breaking its grip plz do the research before posting misleading posts imagine a human trying to over power a dragon the size of sky scrapers, its actually a HUGE feat imo that superman defeated the dragon

Who says the krptonian dragon is as strong as superman or even supergirl? The dragon was KILLED by FIRE something superman or supergirl would not even FEEL. Please do your research and dont try to overpower characters by making assumptions. It not a huge feat at all.

#231 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

@isaac_clarke: Reading what you want to read again I see? And I said try NOT to post scans of me on other sites(this does nothing to support your argument other then make you look like a creepy stalker) which apparently you are....and where there did I say " I was banned 4 times" sorry but that's not admitting anything because that never happened. You really do have selective reading don't you? Superman SURVIVED the beams, that's the point. It was never that he didnt' get tagged....you missed the point clearly. Proof of Thor being able to survive DS beam? oh wait...there is none.

Cosmic blasts, Darkseid's OB and Helspont's cosmic attacks>>>>>>>>SS's blasts yet Clark took both like a champ and proves how durable he is. The only one worthy there is Galactus and that's not even that recent....besides, Galactus gets beat by people less powerful then he is daily or gets his powers stolen, let's see here. Dr. Doom? Check. SS? Check. Thor? Check...need I go on? So that's not really that impressive.

Right, because Pre-Ret Beyonder getting duped by a mortal wasn't plot device...when he's supposedly "omnipotent" right? lol right...at any rate, the fact that Helspont WANTED superman as well as DS(two characters more powerful then Superman and Thor) just proves how powerful and the potential Superman has...

No, that's a speedblitz...there you go again trying to lowball a legit feat lol, charging someone REALLY fast is a blitz, no matter how much you wish to deny it...still point is Thor doesn't and can't move NEARLY as fast as Superman has and can, period.

As I told house, the heat vision was as the panel confirmed done with PRECISION which ignited the oil rig to explode and thus take out the Dragon....as in Clark hit a certain direct spot that would react the way he wanted...technically it was under Supes power being as how it was his heat vision...I do know, but you as usual make assumptions what I do and don't understand, clearly you're the one who doesn't understand the panel. Read it again, his HEAT vision ignites the oil rig...you're assuming that wouldn't hurt thor yet hard to say Thor's power is stronger then Supes when historically speaking Supes has shown otherwise(including the crossover) I mean come on, the guy needs his little hammer just to fly or do anything for that matter. Is there any feat Thor has that doesn't require his little hammer? lol Just curious

Nope, you've yet to prove me wrong outside of your own world as usual. There are many people in here who feel Superman would win, not just me for similar reasons listed but as usual you feel the need to target me, give it up guy. You can't quote every single person in here who feels Superman would win and rightfully so just agree to disagree because you've nothing to prove nor convince me of feeling otherwise. Oh, so in otherwords you have no comic collection, sounds to me I was right. Haha, beatdown? right in your own mind maybe, you don't even know jack about anything outside of Marvel so please...

@houseshm: Clark wasn't going all out, he was just trying to get out of the grip of the dragon but he still defeated it so I really don't see how this holds any water. If that's the best you can do, it is you sir who has failed to prove Thor winning here over Superman, especially when Superman can do SO much you're completely ignoring..Besides, you are aware that wasn't a normal dragon right? It was from krypton...you guys act as if it was a "typical Dragon" that's funny.

@ bodinson: That's lovely but clearly you missed my point...lol, Thor fanboys always amusing. Pretty sure for a strike hard enough to KO much less kill a dragon of that much power, he'd need the hammer as most panels suggest. I didn't say he NEEDS it to summon an element. Read more carefully next time please.

Yes, I can do that too.

#232 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

@bodinson: Wait he's honestly debating Thor can't summon lightning without Mjolnir? Dear Thor...

@vaeternus:

He's done it twice in God of Thunder - the one featuring a Thor without Mjolnir.

Once in his initial encounter against Gorr right before he passed out:

What are you the God of?

Then again on Gorr's world that was barren of anything to even make a storm from, namely why the Goddesses of Lightning couldn't do it.

Hell I posted the scan where Thor flies into the planet thats about to be destroyed because of how hard he was hitting Gorr and repaired it with his innate power from Gaea. With his own lightning theme to it.

#233 Edited by RudeBomberBoy01 (2139 posts) - - Show Bio

isaac_clarke vs Vaeternus round 2000000

C'mon guys, just quench this and bro fist each other.

#234 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

Isaac, I said summoning attacks that could put the Dragon down of that calibur WITHOUT using the hammer itself...I never said anything about power source or Mjolnir? Ok, so your scans prove my theory. Notice the first scan he's using the hammer to strike, the second panel he's tossing it with two hands...

@rudebomberboy01 said:

isaac_clarke vs Vaeternus round 2000000

C'mon guys, just quench this and bro fist each other.

Dude, lol I'm all for that I must have said to the guy a million times "clearly we don't agree so let's agree to disagree" but he won't let it go lol. Notice, my post last page man. I said "Superman" because imo I feel Superman would win, he goes into this rant about me that nobody cares about lol out of no where while debating with the @toptom guy, because it sounded like he was getting pissed at toptom's counterpoint. I personally don't hate anyone on here enough to invest THAT much time into it lol which is why i'd rather have a block post option or user. That would prove so much more beneficial.

But hey you seem cool ;)

#235 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

@isaac_clarke: Reading what you want to read again I see? And I said try NOT to post scans of me on other sites(this does nothing to support your argument other then make you look like a creepy stalker) which apparently you are....and where there did I say " I was banned 4 times" sorry but that's not admitting anything because that never happened. You really do have selective reading don't you? Superman SURVIVED the beams, that's the point. It was never that he didnt' get tagged....you missed the point clearly. Proof of Thor being able to survive DS beam? oh wait...there is none.

Apparently bans don't count when you say they don't. Which is such an air-tight argument I don't think anyone can debate it. As for 'creepy stalker' six months after you wrote that comment I googled MKF30 banned and got that. Total amount of my life spent 'stalking' 30 seconds. Damn that's pretty intense, it's like if you post something on the internet on a public forum you have no privacy... Oh wait, you don't and everyone knows that. Well almost everyone.

You said Zaterra was one of the two accounts you made. No debate, it doesn't matter who you made it for - when it became your 'to go account' whenever MKF30 was banned. Whether that was a week or permanently.

Proof of Thor being able to survive DS beam? oh wait...there is none. Cosmic blasts, Darkseid's OB and Helspont's cosmic attacks>>>>>>>>SS's blasts yet Clark took both like a champ and proves how durable he is. The only one worthy there is Galactus and that's not even that recent....besides,

Circular arguments at their finest. You can't even prove that Darkseid's Omega Beams in the new 52 are on par with the Silver Surfer's casual blasts - let alone Galactus, Glory or really anyone that shoots lazer beams. Hell there isn't any evidence Superman can survive them given one KOed him and Darkseid didn't even want to kill him.

Galactus gets beat by people less powerful then he is daily or gets his powers stolen, let's see here. Dr. Doom? Check. SS? Check. Thor? Check...need I go on? So that's not really that impressive.

Few things:

  1. That has nothing to do with the argument.
  2. Galactus does not get beaten daily and has had a number of very impressive high-end fights as of late.
  3. Neither the Silver Surfer or Thor have never stolen Galactus' powers and Galactus has beaten them both consistently in every fight short of a Godblast decades ago that sent him running.
  4. Doom's either surprised Galactus using a number of plot devices to steal his powers (cosmic cube, watcher's knowledge, cosmic control rod, etc) and when the Beyonder KOed Galactus with Galactus' own technology.

Like I said without there being a DC logo I don't expect you to find it impressive. Nor do I expect you to know what you're talking about.

Right, because Pre-Ret Beyonder getting duped by a mortal wasn't plot device...when he's supposedly "omnipotent" right? lol right...at any rate, the fact that Helspont WANTED superman as well as DS(two characters more powerful then Superman and Thor) just proves how powerful and the potential Superman has...

Uh... Doctor Doom had Galactus' powers, was calling himself omnipotent and then 'stole' the Beyonder's powers - who later comes back and takes them away. And no it really doesn't prove anything we don't already know - they aren't looking at potential - they're looking at what is.

No, that's a speedblitz...there you go again trying to lowball a legit feat lol, charging someone REALLY fast is a blitz, no matter how much you wish to deny it...still point is Thor doesn't and can't move NEARLY as fast as Superman has and can, period.

Two things:

  1. You don't know what a speed blitz is.
  2. Under your definition of what it is, Thor blitzes people all the time.

As I told house, the heat vision was as the panel confirmed done with PRECISION which ignited the oil rig to explode and thus take out the Dragon....as in Clark hit a certain direct spot that would react the way he wanted...technically it was under Supes power being as how it was his heat vision...I do know, but you as usual make assumptions what I do and don't understand, clearly you're the one who doesn't understand the panel. Read it again, his HEAT vision ignites the oil rig...you're assuming that wouldn't hurt thor yet hard to say Thor's power is stronger then Supes when historically speaking Supes has shown otherwise(including the crossover) I mean come on, the guy needs his little hammer just to fly or do anything for that matter. Is there any feat Thor has that doesn't require his little hammer? lol Just curious

He had to direct his heatray vision really hard to make an oil rig explode? I would assume just hitting the oil with a match would have done effectively the same trick. Buit eitherway great - how does that help him against Thor? Oh now you're talking about crossovers and history - so you're not going to give anything concrete as to why it matters?

Seems like MKF30's best argument is Darkseid and lighting an Oil Rig on fire. The usual nothing. Right now there's nothing to prove Darkseid is particular that powerful - especially his Omega Beams. Same case for _______ Majestic Rogue. While Gorr's smacking away Thors with solar sized weapons - Darkseid is KOing the league with lightning, just like Ocean Master.

#236 Posted by BOdinson (224 posts) - - Show Bio

Isaac, 1) I said summoning attacks that could put the Dragon down of that calibur WITHOUT using the hammer itself...I never said anything about power source or Mjolnir? 2) Ok, so your scans prove my theory. Notice the first scan he's using the hammer to strike, the second panel he's tossing it with two hands...

1) I don't really consider that "beat up" being slapped a few times by a tail, Thor would have just as much trouble if not more and being as how he needs his little hammer to fight how would he summon a lightning strike when he's tied up? lol Yes, the heat vision was used via precision


It seems that perhaps you're suffering from some form of dementia or alzheimers as you clearly forget your own arguments and then still go and argue to back up your previously faulty arguments, insane...

2) What are you talking about?

#237 Posted by dondave (38987 posts) - - Show Bio

isaac_clarke vs Vaeternus round 2000000

C'mon guys, just quench this and bro fist each other.

Online
#238 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

Isaac, I said summoning attacks that could put the Dragon down of that calibur WITHOUT using the hammer itself...I never said anything about power source or Mjolnir? Ok, so your scans prove my theory. Notice the first scan he's using the hammer to strike, the second panel he's tossing it with two hands...

@rudebomberboy01 said:

isaac_clarke vs Vaeternus round 2000000

C'mon guys, just quench this and bro fist each other.

Dude, lol I'm all for that I must have said to the guy a million times "clearly we don't agree so let's agree to disagree" but he won't let it go lol. Notice, my post last page man. I said "Superman" because imo I feel Superman would win, he goes into this rant about me that nobody cares about lol out of no where while debating with the @toptom guy, because it sounded like he was getting pissed at toptom's counterpoint. I personally don't hate anyone on here enough to invest THAT much time into it lol which is why i'd rather have a block post option or user. That would prove so much more beneficial.

But hey you seem cool ;)

Except the Dragon was killed by the fires of an oil rig explosion and fire. This opinion where Thor's lightning wouldn't have brought it down based off it's ability to send Gorr away before he could kill him or damage his army (the one's that individually gave Thor trouble for several hours) is laughable.

Uh. Rant - You mean this post?

Superman

Hey man have you read God of Thunder 9? The one where Thor's hitting people hard enough to create wormholes and hitting people hard enough to destroy adjacent planets? Pretty cool stuff. I'm sure 52 Superman's all over that though.

I have the most boring rants I've ever seen.

isaac_clarke vs Vaeternus round 2000000

C'mon guys, just quench this and bro fist each other.

Lol. No thank you. I played nice with MKF30 early on, before he just came onto these forums to either lie or troll. The guy's been banned multiple times for a good reason.

Without a major adjustment in his attitude, like not being a obvious DC fanboy / troll hybrid - I just can't take him seriously.

#239 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

@ Isaac,

Yes, my old name were banned and then unbanned(your point?) My point is nobody here cares dude, much less knows what the hell you're talking about when those topics were filled with trolls and people just adding fuel to the fire for the sake of flaming, and as I said I was apart of that convo the IM and remember you vividly getting warned and this close to banned if not for your buddy at the time being a "mod" that was rather short lived I see. Oh yes, my MKF30 name being banned let's see here. Week ones I don't even count being as how they're "for both users" on MK sites and that hasn't happened in over 2 years now. Secondly, there are 2 MK sites now gone who were run by a psycho who banned everyone who disagreed with the guy now has made a hate site hating several MKC users(because that's not sad...lol) I'm on here, IGN, Giantbomb, TYM, MKO, Classic, MKU and several others I just don't go to anymore or simply forgot about. And never been banned on them, warned? Maybe but not banned flat out. But again, this is all irrelevant and pointless, has nothing to do with Thor vs. Superman. You just need to get over it seriously or it really makes you obsessive looking. Yes I used the Zat account a total of oh 10 posts maybe(talking me myself)? woahhh...I'm sure you have many more posts on your Hellos name...You know it's funny if I google MKF30 I see more positive things pop up or just what sites I registered on way more then the "I hate MKF" nonsense. 30 seconds? wow you must have superman level reading because I'm quite sure when you found that post, which I made and just already said already was within the past 6 months since I remember that convo vividly with another user from here.

Ha, right...apparently you didn't read the SS vs. DS topic, majority if memory serves me right felt Darkseid would win that due to the Omegga Effect. Moving on.

1. Oh really? Because I was making a mere analogy, if you really want something that has nothing to do with the topic your little "ban" rants are 100% irrelevant.

2. Of late perhaps....but in general, yes he has.

3. I never said Thor or SS stole G.'s power, I said Dr. Doom did...so you admit that was poor writing having Doom stealing characters powers such as Pre ret beyonder, Galactus etc then being scared of squirrel girl? So you admit this?

As I said I can easily say the same about you and Marvel topics, given how far out you defend them.

I was referring to Beyonder being supposedly omnipotent only for him to be duped by Dr. Doom. So again, you admit this is hogwash nonsense and just a poor example of bad writing? Don't get me wrong, all comics at times and games have poor writing, I just want to see if you actually will admit it or not.

Two things:

1. Yes I do, and you apparently don't.

2. I have never said such and don't know what on earth you're talking about, making stuff up again I see..

Perhaps I should post the definition of what blitzing someone is for you.

I see you're going off topic again since you apparently don't understand what I said concerning Clark's heat vision...lol. Doesn't change my view, I feel Superman wins here for reasons already listed. Feel free to agree or disagree all you want. I really do not care to be quite frank.

Actually, if you read the latest Darkseid one shot you'd know that he's pretty powerful and how he got his powers. Clear proof you don't read DC as I figured.

That's quite alright, because I wouldn't want to be friends with someone that's clearly delusional half the time.

@toptom said:

Again with that feat? Just stop embarassing yourself. It was stated that he was lifting that weight, if you put the word "essentially" it doesn't change a bit. Plus it is clear to most that he could do more.... as he has already done.

There is a massive difference from picking an object up off the ground and pushing a planet.

Lol...yes there is a difference...until you can lift an object that is "essentially" as heavy as the earth when you aren't even at full power of course. (you know that posting a picture with pre-52 supergirl doesn't prove nothing...right?). ((Then if you want to push a planet out its orbit you don't even have to use a force that is equal to its mass but one who is much smaller...i bet you don't even know this.))

The first erroneous assumption you make is Clark has the flight power to push the planet, but he's done nothing to suggest he can in the New 52.

"Essentially" you don't know what you are talking about. He has shown to be able to fly about 300 times faster than light,apparently even without trying.Try harder,or don't try at all.

Then you say he hasn't done anything to suggest he can't (but that is only you mind me)...except lifting right the same weight you say he can't and surpassing that feat later,just using his fists (then we don't even have to count the times in which it was stated he could cick the moon out of orbit,of course..).

Lifting the weight of the world doesn't equate to him being capable of moving the Earth. You're pretending its the same feat but it isn't.

Maybe english is your language...but looks like you have some problem with it. Here you are , i am helping you a bit. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/lift (if you lift an object you have to move it,son..)

Since when did 'Power Level' become "he's hitting with each fist harder than the weight of the planet!"?

More or less since Dr veritas has stated that he has surpassed the previous power level,which she has measured when he was bench pressing the planet.Lets go on.

"So we have two examples of Thor and Superman hitting someone. The main difference is Thor's hits are destroying adjacent worlds and Superman's are being felt on the Watchtower. How is this feat comparable again - outside of course someone's dillusional mind? Thor's clearly hitting much harder, what's there to debate here?"

Since Thor can't destroy things without touching them, i am going to believe that Gorr was somehow involved in this, since he was fighting back, and since physical blows doesn't travel in the vacuum. Then I haven't told that Superman can punch harder than that, what i have told is that he can shatter a planet as well with his fists since he can generate a pressure bigger than 6 sixtilion (or something like that), and many of them coming at super speed can bring thor down and i haven't seen anything to suggest the contrary.

Debating a non point.

..smh..

Well said. Gotta love the "essentially" lol as I said, the guy loves to lowball legit feats he don't agree with lol. The guy's obviously a troll who loves to add fuel to the fire of people he dislikes and apparently stalks them on various other sites(as if that proves anything on a comicvine topic) Sometimes you just have to realize, you can only beat a deadhorse so many times before realizing it's pointless. The first statement alone should prove why nobody should take what he says seriously. Ha the him playing nice, right. I can't remember him ever trying to pay me any respect.

Bodison, Yeah....it seems you have difficulty comprehending what I said perhaps? Wow quite an assumption to assume such a serious medical condition for someone you don't even know, sounds like delusional paranoia to me. You made an assumption of something I never said, I was asking when has Thor NOT used his hammer in a serious feat...racing a bunch of grunts while summoning raining fire is not what I consider a "massive feat"

Except Isaac, that err it was SUPERMAN'S HEAT VISION THAT IGNITED THE OIL RIG TO EXPLODE! But feel free to ignore that and all logic. ;) Not sure what Gorr has to do with Superman.

Ha, you telling me I need an attitude adjustment? Too funny, what can I say I can't tolerate trolls, baiters or people who generally serve no purpose in life. I'm sorry you fall into that category.

#240 Edited by RudeBomberBoy01 (2139 posts) - - Show Bio

You guys need to tone down the aggression levels and debate in a more friendly manner.

While both users are bringing valid points to the debate, I can't help but feel like this is a battlefield, instead of a fun and exciting debate.

I know the history behind both users and I've got mad respect for both users (especially Helios), but damn, you guys need to calm down lol.

A man can dream right?

#241 Posted by houseshm (443 posts) - - Show Bio

@vaeternus: Clark wasn't going all out, he was just trying to get out of the grip of the dragon but he still defeated it so I really don't see how this holds any water.

What part of taking no chances did you not understand? Clark was going all out when he punched the dragon and it was a small mountain busting punch as stated on panel. The point is clark was not strong enough to get out of the dragon grip and his lifting strength holds no weight in a fight.

If that's the best you can do, it is you sir who has failed to prove Thor winning here over Superman, especially when Superman can do SO much you're completely ignoring..Besides, you are aware that wasn't a normal dragon right? It was from krypton...you guys act as if it was a "typical Dragon" that's funny.

Showing superman punch after being charged up by the sun is small mountain busting helps thor out alot actually. The krptonian dragon was killed by fire something superman or supergirl would not even FEEL. The dragon was very weak so its funny that you think the dragon is at superman's level.

#242 Edited by BOdinson (224 posts) - - Show Bio

You guys need to tone down the aggression levels and debate in a more friendly manner.

#243 Posted by RudeBomberBoy01 (2139 posts) - - Show Bio
#244 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

Yes, my old names were banned and then unbanned(your point?) my point is nobody here cares dude, much less knows what the hell you're talking about when those topics were filled with gaming hating trolls and people just adding fuel to the fire, and as I said I was apart of that convo and remember you vividly getting warned and this close to banned if not for your buddy at the time being a "mod". Oh yes, my MKF30 name being banned let's see here. Week ones I don't even count being as how they're "for both users" on MK sites and that hasn't happened in over 2 years now. Secondly, there are 2 MK sites now gone who were run by a psycho who banned everyone who disagreed with the guy now has made a hate site hating several MKC users(because that's not sad...lol) I'm on here, IGN, Giantbomb, TYM, MKO, Classic, MKU and several others I just don't go to anymore or simply forgot about. And never been banned on them, warned? Maybe but not banned flat out. But again, this is all irrelevant and pointless, has nothing to do with Thor vs. Superman. You just need to get over it seriously or it really makes you obsessive looking. Yes I used the Zat account a total of oh 10 posts maybe(talking me myself)? woahhh...I'm sure you have many more posts on your Hellos name...

Everyone's account was unbanned when the site was upgraded. They were originally banned because of trolling - the point? I just like reminding people where you came from. =)

Vividly? Did Static_Shock write it in rainbows? And who was concluded to be the main cause of 'flamming' in that thread regardless and banned? It was Isaac_Clarke... who was it? I think the user's name started with an M - some sort of Mortal Kombat theme to it... MKF30, then Zaterra the day after... then some months later Vaeternus. By the luck of god and questionable kindness from Mods, you're back (despite probably never having left).

Why should anyone take you seriously is why I keep posting it - over and over. I have absolutely no doubt you have been warned, you don't need to tell me twice with what you casually write here trying to antagonize users. Hellos used to have over 9000, but I have to start posting on it again with the Site update.

Ha, right...apparently you didn't read the SS vs. DS topic, majority if memory serves me right felt Darkseid would win that due to the Omegga Effect. Moving on.

Then the majority haven't:

  • Haven't read Silver Surfer: Communion or realistically any of the Silver Surfer's better showings. It's just there he resists / fights a universal reality warper's abilities.
  • Read Justice League #5-6 where even Aquaman is stabbing Darkseid in the eyes or Darkseid's beams are easily deflected by running through someone.
  • Are assuming Darkseid is at his pre-52 levels. Just like people assumed he was at his Pre-Crisis levels.

Quite frankly his best showings consist of replicating Ocean Master dropping the league with lightning or beating up an inexperience Superman and Hal Jordan. Stellar stuff. Then this happens:

Just before the League BFR's him, he turned into a punching bag that Wonder Woman and Aquaman got to stab in the eyes. The best he's getting out of this showing is that supposedly the League was out of their league fighting him.

1. Oh really? Because I was making a mere analogy, if you really want something that has nothing to do with the topic your little "ban" rants are 100% irrelevant.

2. Of late perhaps....but in general, yes he has.

An analogy where you show you have no idea what you're talking about? Every debate we have - some how Galactus gets brought up as someone that anyone can rob of his power and you completely ignore any context and in some cases completely lie through your teeth.

Ban 'rants' are just me saying how you've been banned four times and that your a liar. Nothing new.

3. I never said Thor or SS stole G.'s power, I said Dr. Doom did...so you admit that was poor writing having Doom stealing characters powers such as Pre ret beyonder, Galactus etc then being scared of squirrel girl? So you admit this?

Uh. Then why would you mention either Thor or the Silver Surfer in the same list of names with Doom when talking about Galactus' powers being stolen? Everyone is scarred of Squirrel Girl.

There is additional context to each time Doom has nabbed omnipotence that you completely ignore to push stupid falsehoods. Is every other time a super villian gains omnipotence poor writing or just Doctor Doom? Because Darkseid, Lex Luthor and even the Joker has. Yet everytime there is a Mxy debate you don't go around talking about the Joker jacking nearly all of his power.

As I said I can easily say the same about you and Marvel topics, given how far out you defend them.

No you really can't. I have no issues giving credit where credit is due - namely why I rebuffed points about Superman having nothing on Thor outside speed. Just because I argue with you - doesn't make me your polar opposite. Namely the lack of bans and the incredibly amount more credibility I have compared to you.

I was referring to Beyonder being supposedly omnipotent only for him to be duped by Dr. Doom. So again, you admit this is hogwash nonsense and just a poor example of bad writing? Don't get me wrong, all comics at times and games have poor writing, I just want to see if you actually will admit it or not.

You could argue whatever you'd like in regards to the Beyonder's omnipotence. It has nothing to do with this thread and my opinion on the writing quality of Secret Wars has ZIP to do with this debate. Go start a poll and ask if Secret Wars was written well.

Two things:

1. Yes I do, and you apparently don't.

2. I have never said such and don't know what on earth you're talking about, making stuff up again I see..

You showed me a scan of Superman bullrushing Hal Jordan. I showed you a scan of Thor doing the same thing twice to Galactus. Yet you insist one is a speedblitz, the other isn't.

Nonsense. Complete utter nonsense.

Perhaps I should post the definition of what blitzing someone is for you.

I see you're going off topic again since you apparently don't understand what I said concerning Clark's heat vision...lol. Doesn't change my view, I feel Superman wins here for reasons already listed. Feel free to agree or disagree all you want. I really do not care to be quite frank.

I'd rather vomit rainbows. Vividly.

You're entire argument is off-topic nonsense. You're posts are filled with scans that you argue prove something they don't. This is a poor debate and its at the quality I've come to expect from you after a month of being away. How lovely.

#245 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm: what part of not going all out as in bloodlusted or flying it to orbit did you not get? First of all no the dragon was not weak, lol second it was kryptonian since you decided to leave out both of those little facts. Secondly, just cause his punch koed a dragon head and shattered a mountain hardly means 'superman was going all out' consideri ng he has better strength feats...

There's also no proof thor wouldnt have trouble with that dragon and actually superman wore.it down prior to that. Id love to see thor take out a dragon on that scale without the use of his hammer directly, i mean when the guy has trouble with the hulk...rare chance hes putting down a dragon so easily that gave supes a hard time. The rest is merely your opinion.

#246 Posted by jashro44 (26523 posts) - - Show Bio

@isaac_clarke: to be fair darkseid was destroying planets in his villains month issue.

#247 Posted by isaac_clarke (5544 posts) - - Show Bio

@vaeternus said:

@houseshm: what part of not going all out as in bloodlusted or flying it to orbit did you not get? First of all no the dragon was not weak, lol second it was kryptonian since you decided to leave out both of those little facts. Secondly, just cause his punch koed a dragon head and shattered a mountain hardly means 'superman was going all out' consideri ng he has better strength feats...

You also have no.proof thor wouldnt have trouble with that dragon and actually superman wore.it down prior to that. Id love to see thor take out a dragon on that scale without the use of his hammer directly, i mean when the guy has trouble with the hulk...rare chance hes putting down a dragon so easily that gave supes a hard time. The rest is merely your opinion.

An oil rig explosion of fire defeated it. That is an incredibly low tolerance to fire. I'm glad you want to see Thor kill dragons without Mjolnir. Something he's never done before. At all.

Yeah's Thor's beaten dragons down with his bare hands. No oil-rigs either - no idea how he survived. He's fought dragons on panel a number of times - the only time I can remember one giving him a fight was Fing Fang Foom - when Thor was sporting his cursed bones. And the Hulk would have demolished that dragon - it's giving Superman a hard time because Superman isn't very powerful in that fight.

You keep muttering on about Thor this and that without Mjolnir. Do you do the same in Green Lantern threads? Or do you just hate Mjolnir?

@jashro44 said:

@isaac_clarke: to be fair darkseid was destroying planets in his villains month issue.

It gets hard to be fair after hearing how awesome X character is based off nearly nothing. But I haven't had the opportunity to read it so I should hold off in proclaiming how weak Darkseid was at moments in that book that just scream 'he's not the same Darkseid you're lumping him in with.'

No, it was the glitch. Otherwise all your accounts would have stayed banned and Divine_Spawn wouldn't have had to give you a little chat. Uh. Static_Shock was a biased and corrupt (?) mod? Pull strings? Is this some kind of joke? Yeah it is and it's called MKF30's perception of the world. What a poor little critter you are, born of the dirt beneath my feet. I'll explain the 9001 bit:

The Hellos post count at 9001 was intended to be a reference to DBZ's / DBZ Abridged 'its over 9000' gag. It has nothing to do with other posters - just me wanting to keep it at 9001. The moment you implied I was banned - I posted on it. Mainly because I love proving you wrong. Cry conspiracy all you want - its all hot air. Back to the debate - but not before mentioning you were banned four times for trolling. =)

So I'm creepy one - when apparently you've been watching each of those posters read comic books - specifically Justice League #5-#6 and Silver Surfer:Communion? Because right now you're making a factless claim on how aware of the characters the posters where in that thread. You yourself are living breathing proof of how posters walk into threads knowing nothing about the characters and pretend their opinion means something. In here - you haven't read a single Thor: God of Thunder book since Marvel Now! and for Superman you're relying on completely out-of-context scans straight out of his respect thread - clearly never reading the books because you think it's impressive he bullrushed a blinded Darkseid into a portal. You know the one Aquaman was stabbing in the eyes.

Aquaman / Wonder Woman would stab the Surfer in the eyes - while Cyborg opens a portal to BFR him as Superman pushes him through? HA HA - no that's not how it works. Either way it's a non-point. Darkseid in those issues was weaker than the Silver Surfer and he rolled the League over. Martian Manhunter? Hilarious.

I was referring to Darkseid's power in general, not really pre or currently but just so you know since current is what most of us go by unless specified otherwise it's obvious you haven't read Darkseid in Villians month as it explains how he got his powers, and that he becomes VERY powerful by slaying the old gods and thus taking their power, destroying worlds on his own(and not just a herald like SS having Galactus do it for him) and seemingly gave the JL a harder time then pre-new 52 by what we've seen so far. I also can't see SS dodging Darkseid's omega beams, if Superman had trouble lol...Flash was the only one able to actually dodge them. WW deflected them. Let's be real here, if Arthur fought DS one on one he'd be toast literally...and as I said clearly you haven't read worth a lick of the new strip that came out concerning Darkseid destroying other worlds...talk to me when SS does this daily like nothing.

Uh. The Silver Surfer doesn't destroy the planets for Galactus - he finds them so Galactus can eat them. Galactus as a byproduct of his fights is a universe buster. But I'm sure in the same situation Aquaman and Wonder Woman would leap into his eyes stabbing him long enough to BFR Galactus. Seems legit.

The New 52 League is inexperiened and a lot weaker than Pre-52. No ifs and buts about it - that's really the only reason Darkseid had an 'easier' time. When the Silver Surfer does what daily? Destroy planets? Why would I bother - he's got much better feats than that to pull from.

How did the guy that got KOed by Darkseid in a single shot hold his own? And are we forgetting the Justice League was there? That they're the ones that beat Darkside by stabbing him in the eyes and BFRing him?

You making things up about a character is a little different than me poking at the fact you've been banned four times. MKF30, MKF30 again, Zaterra the day after and then Vaeternus. That's four. Yay for site upgrades?

So Galactus having his powers stolen has what to do with why Superman would beat Thor? Or frankly the Beyonder's powers being jacked by Dr. Doom? The answer is nil. You're leading this argument on in idiotic directions. Probably a little spiteful over that Galactus vs Spectre thread that got you banned.

And you're getting this from where? Me not answering an idiotic question about the quality of writing in Secret Wars? That is one amazing 'astute' - it's like I'm one of those guys that goes thread to thread talking about how Marvel's doing something wrong every time someone makes a negative comment about something at DC. You know - like you.

Ah but you see for one Lex's was temporary as was Jokers, and Mxy allowed him a certain amount of power anyway. He didn't even gain ALL of Mxy's power unlike stupid Beyonder who got all his of his taken from Dr. Doom. or Dr. Doomed writing I should say, then fears Squirrel girl lol. No matter how you sugarcoat it, you can't deny that's horrible writing. Darkseid once he got his power was more or less omnipotent as a new god, or at the very least immortal.

Uh. Did you forget that all of Doctor Doom's moments of godhood were temporary?

If the Beyonder lost all of his powers - how did he get it all back from Doom on his own? Uh. Mxy intended to give the Joker a fraction of his powers - yet lost nearly all of it...

How's life from under your bridge?

Its like you write this stuff and have no idea how stupid it sounds.

Ha, yeah you're so credible that's why you're arguing with half the people in here who proved you wrong like @toptom did, so yes I can and will say you're biased for Marvel until you show anything different, you're not altering my view on that and you love to downplay, lowball whatever you want to call it DC characters and gaming characters because you know nothing about them. I see your patterns, all you do is post in A. Marvel related topics concerning Galactus, Thor, Hulk, SS, DBZ/anime, occassionally political and Dead Space topics. Yeah, I can do my spying homework too ;) But at least unlike you I won't take it outside of this site, I have far more important things in life to worry about.

What comes to mind is Killer debating you and crossing out all the parts that had nothing to do with the debate or wasn't canon to the debate. Your posts got so much smaller.

Where is this half? I've debated with Toptom and the legendary MKF30. At this point you aren't even making sense. If 'proving' me wrong consists of telling me Superman making a crater in the ground is more impressive than Thor destroying the adjacent worlds hitting Gorr in the face - then I happily accept being wrong. The same with your opinions where Thor can't tank the mighty Omega Beams (the ones that KOed Superman) - despite sitting dead center of a universal / transdimensional / transtemporal bomb that was killing every god in the Marvel Universe and absorbing it into himself.

Lowball gamming characters? Are you joking? Just because Raiden can't beat Thor or Elder Gods don't have the power to take on Odin isn't my fault. Asura would still roll over Superman and Thor together.

Uh. Wouldn't I also be posting in DC related topics given most of the Marvel ones I do post in are against DC characters? Dead Space? What all three or so threads on these boards of it? What about Doctor Who? Star Trek? Stargate? Dr. Manhattan? Mortal Kombat? Seems like I post in a lot of threads. Yay me?

I have no issue saying X Marvel character loses to X DC - the issue here Superman doesn't stand a chance based off the argument people are pushing here. Thor's got better durability and much better strking power feats - that's all that matters in this fight given Superman's striking power is struggling to prove itself at the Hulk's level.

Oh really, nothing to do with the thread? You're correct....that being said, neither does you ranting about who's been banned and who hasn't.

Thor can't beat Galactus without PIS, get real...and Superman didn't "ball rush" this isn't basketball, it's a fight he flew past him so fast you just saw a damn BLUR. Anyone with decent eyesight can see such knocking GL on his butt rather swiftly and discreetly. Assuming he even left the ground which you can't really tell but it's irrelevant, the point is he zipped by him so fast GL didn't know what the hell hit him...BTW, you can speed blitz someone via running fast at them OR flying...

The shame is very little of what you write has to do with the thread.

Uh. Can you please point out where I said Thor can beat Galactus? Bullrush - not ballrush.

Uh... Superman didn't spend that fight a blur. He spent it hitting Hal's shields or breaking out of his constructs and scarring the tar out of Batman.

So... what your saying is:

Charging at someone at high speed is not blitzing them. Thor did the exact same thing on both scans - that Superman and the Hulk did. No one is being Blitzed. They are all depicted in a BLURRED motion. No one sees it coming. There is NOTHING seperating these outside one of them being Superman and the others not. You insisting this is not the case is stupid.

Trying to use Hal Jordan - someone at the time who couldn't see Batman steal his ring off his fingers - JUST BEFORE this as a measurement of speed is bonkers. The fact Superman does this once and Hal was expecting him to come again is made very apparent - Superman just bulldozed through his defenses. I've already uploaded the entire fight. It consists of Superman smashing Hal's bubble.

#248 Edited by SPM1M (916 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm said:

@spm1m said:

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@houseshm said:

@vaeternus said:

@ houseshm, Err superman defeated the dragon...weak argument. Also if youre going to post a scan post the entire panel...noticed plan b is missing since it shows supes beating the dragon once he got serious(not to mention Superman was holding back and not even going all out, he even koed one of the head by punching it...) give me a break...

BTW, the end of that scan since it would just contradict your own point...Supes using his heat vision with precision and killing the dragon instantly...

that was exactly the point lol, superman could not get out of the dragon grip even though the dragon was so weak it was killed by fire. Superman lifting strength does not equal striking strength. He was going all out when he punched the dragon and it even says that on panel. His punch is stated to be able to topple a small mountain. Even after lifting the the weight equivalent to earth and getting charged up by the sun he got beat up by a dragon and could not get out of its grip using his strength. This shows lifting strength has nothing to do with a fight. BTW, superman heat vision didnt kill the dragon so you just contradicted yourself right there. It even says on the scan you posted that he uses his heat vision to ignite oil and the fire engulfs the dragon.

He wasn't even trying to, he was weighing his options since Clark doesn't even go all out half the time because he doesn't need to. I never said Superman lifting is striking but the same goes for Thor, and clearly in terms of power feats, Superman has displayed more impressive feats. He was lifting the Earth's weight 5 days STRAIGHT in a weakened state not exposed to the sun....where has thor proved to life the weight of a planet such as Earth for multiple days straight no less? I don't really consider that "beat up" being slapped a few times by a tail, Thor would have just as much trouble if not more and being as how he needs his little hammer to fight how would he summon a lightning strike when he's tied up? lol Yes, the heat vision was used via precision and ignited the oil engulfing and thus defeating the dragon. I didn't contradict anything. My point was you failed to post the scan for whatever reason because it proves superman defeated the dragon...

Clark did go all out this time, its says he took NO CHANCES which pretty much means he went all out. Clark going all out with his PUNCH is strong enough to topple a SMALL MOUNTAIN. You are giving lifting feats again and they mean anything here. Thor doesnt have to lift a planet to win a fight. Lifting strength has nothing do with a fight so you failed to prove why superman is superior.

umm you guys do realize that dragon was a creature of krypton right? a KRYPTONIAN dragon its not a surprise that superman had trouble breaking its grip plz do the research before posting misleading posts imagine a human trying to over power a dragon the size of sky scrapers, its actually a HUGE feat imo that superman defeated the dragon

Who says the krptonian dragon is as strong as superman or even supergirl? The dragon was KILLED by FIRE something superman or supergirl would not even FEEL. Please do your research and dont try to overpower characters by making assumptions. It not a huge feat at all.

"who says the kryptonian dragon is as strong as superman or even supergirl?" says the guy arguing superman couldnt break the dragons grip? so the dragon is no where as strong as superman even though he completely overpowered him physically? way to contradict yourself. the dragon obviously had the strength to hold superman although evidently lack the invulnerability thus fire killed it. not all kryptonian creatures carry the same power set as shown that supergirl has some extra powers that superman doesnt. not to mention the dragon wasnt exposed to sunlight as long as superman. to use this dragon to show supermans "weakness" is short attempt at low balling superman's strength. call it wat you want i personally dislike lobdell for crap like this now that i think about it thats why he is a horrible writer

#249 Posted by The_Titan_Lord (7216 posts) - - Show Bio
#250 Edited by Vaeternus (9410 posts) - - Show Bio

lmao @ isaac, wow so most of that post is just so many words yet so little said. Can you spare me the 100 paragraphs of you repeating yourself, putting others down etc and just perhaps record yourself then post the link? lol that would be better this way at least i wont fall asleep half way through your "points" otherwise what i got from all that is A.MKF30 and toptom bashing. check, you denying the fact that supes set off the oil rig via his heat vision, for the love of god look at the damn scan...geez man, you should go into politics cause you're a hell of a liar, exaggerater and seem to deny everything...no wonder you are the way you are.

Uhh, no i dont invest time stalking you, i just checked out your profile for curiousity since that is allowed and noticed you post in majority marvel topics and anime, dbz topics. woah....who would have thought?! I unlike you don't go out of my way to "find" you on other sites, where you go what you say. Like i care, you however clearly went through tons of youtube vids on my channel just to find me talking about a thread with another cv user months ago....as i said yes that's beyond creepy behavior.

wow you are do take everything literal huh? I used the hal jordan fight as an example, i posted the darkseid speed blitz too, the him tagging flash required speed, or what about him flying to mars and back in within just a few minutes, the moon and back even less....I've yet to see thor do this. in fact he seems to rely on his little hammer to fly lol. Kind of funny but yeah...moving on. Otherwise yes, speed blitz can be done in air or on the ground if youre fast enough....but all it what you will.

Bulrush? ok...that's a new one, whatever either way youre yet again lowballing a legit feat/feats. Really? because i beg to differ, there's tons of dc hate, gaming hate, lotr, marvel, etc etc on here daily you see me in all those topics? Not really...oh and im talking recently before you spend 10 hours looking for posts i made 3 years ago...

To save serious time, i'm just going to say believe what you will. I've already proved my point, next time try to stay on topic and keep my name out of your mouth. i know you have this "MKF fetish" for me but dude, seriously getting old and not interested. Just admit, you got mad cause toptom dismantled your argument with a better one.

Lastly, lol, case and point. Your post to josh is exactly what i'm talking about, you're trying to lowball a legit, canon feat of ds trying to say "it's not the same darkseid" right...just the one that currently matters and is canon but hey, just ignore that. it's all good. Clearly you haven't read the issue. So you think ss and thor if they took on darkseid one on one can beat him? right? Oh, oh maybe spiderman and daredevil can too!! :)