#1 Edited by BladeStorke (38 posts) - - Show Bio

Neo (The Matrix) VS Darth Vader (Star Wars)

FIGHT TO THE DEATH- WHO WOULD WIN?

#2 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio
#3 Posted by KnightOfZero (1527 posts) - - Show Bio

does neo have the power when he is in the matrix?

#4 Posted by Bossmonster (2194 posts) - - Show Bio

@knightofzero: Yes. Some he has displayed, others that he hasn't.

However, on this board, they would be fighting in a neutral universe where they both have their abilities.

Also, I think Neo should take this more times than not.

#5 Posted by NeonGameWave (7712 posts) - - Show Bio

Neo.

#6 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

@bladestorke:

Neo before or after the end of the first movie?

#7 Edited by LordOfAllHumans (3978 posts) - - Show Bio
#8 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio
#9 Posted by tparks (4772 posts) - - Show Bio

Been a while since I've seen the Matrix movies, but can Neo actually die as long as Agent Smith is still alive as well? I thought Neo was the positive balance to Agent Smith's negative. The Matrix was trying to rationalize an equation with Neo being the one or something ridiculous like that. This doesn't mean Vader can't win, he could still get a KO. Matrix experts, HELP!

#10 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@bossmonster: @neongamewave: @betatesthighlander1:

Darth Vader clearly stomps. @bladestorke never specifies which version of Darth Vader this is, i.e., movie version or EU version. And since he doesn't specify we generally go by the pictures in the OP. The picture in the OP looks like EU Darth Vader (is this right?), and if this is EU Darth Vader vs Neo, then unless I'm forgetting some major aspects of The Matrix movies, Darth Vader should stomp.

Am I missing something?

#11 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

@bossmonster: @neongamewave: @betatesthighlander1:

Darth Vader clearly stomps. @bladestorke never specifies which version of Darth Vader this is, i.e., movie version or EU version. And since he doesn't specify we generally go by the pictures in the OP. The picture in the OP looks like EU Darth Vader (is this right?), and if this is EU Darth Vader vs Neo, then unless I'm forgetting some major aspects of The Matrix movies, Darth Vader should stomp.

Am I missing something?

what kind of feats does EU Vader have to put him on par with Neo?

#12 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (1991 posts) - - Show Bio
#13 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

@bossmonster: @neongamewave: @betatesthighlander1:

Darth Vader clearly stomps. @bladestorke never specifies which version of Darth Vader this is, i.e., movie version or EU version. And since he doesn't specify we generally go by the pictures in the OP. The picture in the OP looks like EU Darth Vader (is this right?), and if this is EU Darth Vader vs Neo, then unless I'm forgetting some major aspects of The Matrix movies, Darth Vader should stomp.

Am I missing something?

what kind of feats does EU Vader have to put him on par with Neo?

I could easily ask the reverse question: What kind of feats does Neo have to put him on par with EU Vader?

Darth Vader with the Force has precog + relativistic--light speed attack + reaction speed. Can Neo survive light speed light saber combat?

#14 Posted by Juiceboks (8394 posts) - - Show Bio

Vader should take it.

#15 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

@betatesthighlander1 said:
@uberhikari said:

@bossmonster: @neongamewave: @betatesthighlander1:

Darth Vader clearly stomps. @bladestorke never specifies which version of Darth Vader this is, i.e., movie version or EU version. And since he doesn't specify we generally go by the pictures in the OP. The picture in the OP looks like EU Darth Vader (is this right?), and if this is EU Darth Vader vs Neo, then unless I'm forgetting some major aspects of The Matrix movies, Darth Vader should stomp.

Am I missing something?

what kind of feats does EU Vader have to put him on par with Neo?

I could easily ask the reverse question: What kind of feats does Neo have to put him on par with EU Vader?

Darth Vader with the Force has precog + relativistic--light speed attack + reaction speed. Can Neo survive light speed light saber combat?

when did Vader ever lightsaber fight at light speed?

#16 Posted by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari said:

@betatesthighlander1 said:
@uberhikari said:

@bossmonster: @neongamewave: @betatesthighlander1:

Darth Vader clearly stomps. @bladestorke never specifies which version of Darth Vader this is, i.e., movie version or EU version. And since he doesn't specify we generally go by the pictures in the OP. The picture in the OP looks like EU Darth Vader (is this right?), and if this is EU Darth Vader vs Neo, then unless I'm forgetting some major aspects of The Matrix movies, Darth Vader should stomp.

Am I missing something?

what kind of feats does EU Vader have to put him on par with Neo?

I could easily ask the reverse question: What kind of feats does Neo have to put him on par with EU Vader?

Darth Vader with the Force has precog + relativistic--light speed attack + reaction speed. Can Neo survive light speed light saber combat?

when did Vader ever lightsaber fight at light speed?

The beam weapons in Star Wars are actual light speed beams, Jedi and Sith Lords casually react to and deflect them all the time. And even if we nerf Darth Vader and say he's massively hypersonic, with precog + mind control/domination what will Neo do? He's simply outclassed here.

#17 Posted by dccomicsrule2011 (23843 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going with Vader.

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#18 Edited by cfrehse (1004 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari: doesnt mean he moves at the speed of light. If you know something is aimed at you you can dodge or block it. The movies and games really dont look like the weapons are moving at the speed of light.

#19 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

The beam weapons in Star Wars are actual light speed beams, Jedi and Sith Lords casually react to and deflect them all the time. And even if we nerf Darth Vader and say he's massively hypersonic, with precog + mind control/domination what will Neo do? He's simply outclassed here.

okay then, lasers in STar Wars clearly don't move at light speed. by the way the move on screen they seem to be going at about 44 MPH, and the EU usually has blasters portrayed as they were in the movies

#20 Posted by JediXMan (30206 posts) - - Show Bio

The beam weapons in Star Wars are actual light speed beams, Jedi and Sith Lords casually react to and deflect them all the time. And even if we nerf Darth Vader and say he's massively hypersonic, with precog + mind control/domination what will Neo do? He's simply outclassed here.

Blaster bolts are not lasers. Both exist in the Star Wars universe, however. But there is a different.

I vote Vader, though.

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#21 Posted by Simon_the_digger (2897 posts) - - Show Bio

Vader.

#22 Edited by dccomicsrule2011 (23843 posts) - - Show Bio

@betatesthighlander1:

okay then, lasers in STar Wars clearly don't move at light speed.

Yes they do and it has been stated.

by the way the move on screen they seem to be going at about 44 MPH,and the EU usually has blasters portrayed as they were in the movies

Blaster are way faster then 44 MPH what we see are not actually the blast,the real bolt that does the damage moves much faster then what we see.

@uberhikari:

The beam weapons in Star Wars are actual light speed beams

Certain beams?Yes. Blaster bolts? No. They are not lasers, but plasma.

And even if we nerf Darth Vader and say he's massively hypersonic,

I would put Vader in the hyper-sonic range but he is sure not massively hyper-sonic

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#23 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

@betatesthighlander1:

okay then, lasers in STar Wars clearly don't move at light speed.

Yes they do and it has been stated.

where?

by the way the move on screen they seem to be going at about 44 MPH,and the EU usually has blasters portrayed as they were in the movies

Blaster are way faster then 44 MPH what we see are not actually the blast,the real bolt that does the damage moves much faster then what we see.

then why do lightsabers reflect the bit we see?

#24 Posted by JediXMan (30206 posts) - - Show Bio
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#25 Edited by dccomicsrule2011 (23843 posts) - - Show Bio

@betatesthighlander1:

It was stated in the Complete Cross-Sections Sorce book:

Laser cannons and turbolasers fire invisible energy beams that travel at lightspeed. A glowing pulse traveling along the beam at less than lightspeed marks the energy bolt's path.

--Taken from Complete Cross-Sections

They seem to show it for visual effects but it has been stated that the "laser" we see is just the tracer and not the blast itself.And just as a side note blaster bolts are not laser but plasma.

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#26 Edited by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

@jedixman said:

@betatesthighlander1 said:

@dccomicsrule2011 said:

@betatesthighlander1:

okay then, lasers in STar Wars clearly don't move at light speed.

Yes they do and it has been stated.

where?

Lasers are not the same thing as blasters. That Stormtrooper fired a blaster bolt, not a laser.

sorry, blaster

@betatesthighlander1:

It was stated in the Complete Cross-Sections Sorce book:

Laser cannons and turbolasers fire invisible energy beams that travel at lightspeed. A glowing pulse traveling along the beam at less than lightspeed marks the energy bolt's path.

--Taken from Complete Cross-Sections

They seem to show it for visual effects but it has been stated that the "laser" we see is just the tracer and not the blast itself.And just as a side note blaster bolts are not laser but plasma.

eh, Star Wars giudes tend to say things that make essentially no sense in comparison to the movies

#27 Posted by momo111191 (246 posts) - - Show Bio

Neo in a stomp. Vader deflects bullets neo just stops them. Neo also has a much higher combat speed look at the time he punched the agents. He can fly and hits and dodges with such force it bends reality.

#28 Posted by HereComesTheBoom_Headshot (321 posts) - - Show Bio

Neo claims victory here -- I'll try to explain later when I return home from work.

#29 Posted by JediXMan (30206 posts) - - Show Bio

@jedixman said:

@betatesthighlander1 said:

@dccomicsrule2011 said:

@betatesthighlander1:

okay then, lasers in STar Wars clearly don't move at light speed.

Yes they do and it has been stated.

where?

Lasers are not the same thing as blasters. That Stormtrooper fired a blaster bolt, not a laser.

sorry, blaster

@dccomicsrule2011 said:

@betatesthighlander1:

It was stated in the Complete Cross-Sections Sorce book:

Laser cannons and turbolasers fire invisible energy beams that travel at lightspeed. A glowing pulse traveling along the beam at less than lightspeed marks the energy bolt's path.

--Taken from Complete Cross-Sections

They seem to show it for visual effects but it has been stated that the "laser" we see is just the tracer and not the blast itself.And just as a side note blaster bolts are not laser but plasma.

eh, Star Wars giudes tend to say things that make essentially no sense in comparison to the movies

You misunderstand: blasters do not move at lightspeed; lasers do. The guide is correct.

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#30 Edited by JediXMan (30206 posts) - - Show Bio

Neo in a stomp. Vader deflects bullets neo just stops them. Neo also has a much higher combat speed look at the time he punched the agents. He can fly and hits and dodges with such force it bends reality.

It does not bend reality. It bends the Matrix, which is nothing more than a computer program. He can't touch reality.

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#31 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

@jedixman said:


You misunderstand: blasters do not move at lightspeed; lasers do. The guide is correct.

when do we see Vader block a Laser?

@jedixman said:

@momo111191 said:

Neo in a stomp. Vader deflects bullets neo just stops them. Neo also has a much higher combat speed look at the time he punched the agents. He can fly and hits and dodges with such force it bends reality.

It does not bend reality. It bends the Matrix, which is nothing more than a computer program. He can't touch reality.

OP says the fight takes place in a neutral dimension where both have powers

#32 Edited by MonsterStomp (16719 posts) - - Show Bio

Neo jumps into Vadar rearranges his genetic coding and blows him into smitherines.

#33 Posted by Darth_Lampe (7 posts) - - Show Bio

It really depends on a lot of things. Vader is more likely to kill right off the bat, for starters.

The reason bullets aren't used in Star Wars is because blaster bolts are far more effective and deadly, and travel much faster than bullets. So it's a bit difficult to really tell who has better reaction time and agility. Vader has precognition, which I don't think Neo has. Vader's been shown to pick men up with one hand like it was nothing, and destroy steel like it was aluminum (The former being physical strength, the latter being his force abilities). He has a weapon that can cut through just about anything, if you're using movie canon, and is arguably the most powerful Jedi or Sith to have ever existed.

It also depends on if we're using EU Vader, which makes movie Vader's feats far less impressive. This version can absorb energy blasts and manipulate it at his will(an extension of him deflecting them in the film), move faster than other Jedi/Sith can see, and has much more power overall.

Neo in the matrix is probably a better fight, because outside of it he isn't nearly as powerful, and Vader wins easily. With Neo's full arsenal, it can be a bit murky. He has flight, which Vader doesn't. He can warp reality or I guess more accurately the coding in the matrix. That's the one that would be most troublesome.

If Neo is able to just will Vader out of existence, or something of that nature it isn't much contest. I'm pretty sure EU Vader is faster in terms of combat speed, has better telekinesis, a better weapon, and probably more power. I don't think Neo can just stop objects from existing without doing that dive thing, so potentially Vader just needs to be on his toes and react to it. Since he has precog, he'd be able to see it coming.

Probably be a great fight, but over quick. I'd go Vader 6/10.

#34 Posted by JediXMan (30206 posts) - - Show Bio

@jedixman said:

You misunderstand: blasters do not move at lightspeed; lasers do. The guide is correct.

when do we see Vader block a Laser?

@jedixman said:

@momo111191 said:

Neo in a stomp. Vader deflects bullets neo just stops them. Neo also has a much higher combat speed look at the time he punched the agents. He can fly and hits and dodges with such force it bends reality.

It does not bend reality. It bends the Matrix, which is nothing more than a computer program. He can't touch reality.

OP says the fight takes place in a neutral dimension where both have powers

1. I don't recall. I'm not arguing that; I'm arguing that lasers travel at light speed. That's it.

2. I know.

I'm not arguing either side right now. Just correcting fallacies where I see them, that's all.

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#35 Posted by Herald417 (117 posts) - - Show Bio

Its been while since I've the matrix but what does Neo have to stop Vader from just starting the fight off force choking Neo or using the force to mind rape him. If it came to a physical confrontation its definitely close. But I dont think its it would come to that since its firmly in vaders character to just use the force to choke him out rather than fighting some he would assume is inferior to him

#36 Posted by Bossmonster (2194 posts) - - Show Bio

@herald417: @uberhikari:

Neo has many of the same powers that Vader has. He has Pre-cog as stated in Matrix 2. He's Certainly Hyper sonic and extremely so. Most all the feats vader can create with the force, Neo can create with TK. So in regards to force choke, there is nothing to say Neo can't Force choke vader given that we have seen Neo use is powers on several different occasion to alter the body of another person and move object.

I can see Vader winning this, however being a stomp is crazy. If neo targers his saber hilt and breaks it with TK, then that massviely reduces Vader's offensive powers. Also, Vader cannot survive a strike from Neo. He hit's way to hard. Physically, Neo will destroy him in h2h. Also, Neo is so much more mobile than vader and has Flight. Given what it did to smith, Neo could one shot Vader with a punch or TK is life support.

There are several ways Neo can win this and several Vader can win. I just personally see Neo winning more as he is the faster of the two.

#37 Posted by Darth_Lampe (7 posts) - - Show Bio

@herald417: @uberhikari:

Neo has many of the same powers that Vader has. He has Pre-cog as stated in Matrix 2. He's Certainly Hyper sonic and extremely so. Most all the feats vader can create with the force, Neo can create with TK. So in regards to force choke, there is nothing to say Neo can't Force choke vader given that we have seen Neo use is powers on several different occasion to alter the body of another person and move object.

I can see Vader winning this, however being a stomp is crazy. If neo targers his saber hilt and breaks it with TK, then that massviely reduces Vader's offensive powers. Also, Vader cannot survive a strike from Neo. He hit's way to hard. Physically, Neo will destroy him in h2h. Also, Neo is so much more mobile than vader and has Flight. Given what it did to smith, Neo could one shot Vader with a punch or TK is life support.

There are several ways Neo can win this and several Vader can win. I just personally see Neo winning more as he is the faster of the two.

I don't think it'd be a given either way in this fight, and one character is going to edge the other one out, but is Neo's precog that prominent? Force users are able to utilize it constantly in battle, and is the main reason they can not be hit by blaster fire(For those strong enough in the force anyway). The Oracle is closer to a Jedi/Sith than Neo with it, but it's been a while since I've seen the films, so I don't recall a lot.

Personally, it seems to me that a lot of the things Neo has shown, Vader has done better. I don't really agree with speed, but I can at least understand where you're coming from on that front. I don't think you're giving Vader credit though in how durable he is. He survived a grenade in his armor, and is made of machine anyway. Punching a hole in him wouldn't do too much, well, small hole anyway. He's been stabbed through his chest multiple times with no ill effects (Lightsaber and viroblade). Why couldn't he survive a strike from Neo or be able to keep up in h2h?

#38 Edited by xlab3000 (3186 posts) - - Show Bio

Darth Vader

#39 Posted by Bossmonster (2194 posts) - - Show Bio


I don't think it'd be a given either way in this fight, and one character is going to edge the other one out, but is Neo's precog that prominent? Force users are able to utilize it constantly in battle, and is the main reason they can not be hit by blaster fire(For those strong enough in the force anyway). The Oracle is closer to a Jedi/Sith than Neo with it, but it's been a while since I've seen the films, so I don't recall a lot.

Personally, it seems to me that a lot of the things Neo has shown, Vader has done better. I don't really agree with speed, but I can at least understand where you're coming from on that front. I don't think you're giving Vader credit though in how durable he is. He survived a grenade in his armor, and is made of machine anyway. Punching a hole in him wouldn't do too much, well, small hole anyway. He's been stabbed through his chest multiple times with no ill effects (Lightsaber and viroblade). Why couldn't he survive a strike from Neo or be able to keep up in h2h?

I'll admit that the pre-cog thing on neo isn't that prominent, but I don't know that it's that way for Vader either. I know about him, but I don't remember him having great gifts for seeing the future. If I'm wrong in this, I can accept that. I not that "Jedi/Sith" are known to do it often as in many members of their orders are talented here, but I personally don't recall vader being on of them.

I won't deny that either, but I think that's only because Vader has EU and Neo doesn't. And to be honest, I'm cool with that. Really, all I wanted to make clear was that it shouldn't be a stomp. If it goes Vader 6/10, ok. That is totally fair. But 9/10, seriously lowballing Neo. On h2h, think of Neo's fight with Smith where it was really able to let loose in Matrix 2. Or especially the final battle in Matrix three. There is no way Vader would tank being Spiked the way Neo did. Neo and Smith can deal very high blunt damage. Like Neo punching Smith deep into the ground like he did.

I can't see Vader taking that. I believe it will one shot him. Now, I also think that the lightsaber will One shot Neo (unless he figures out there is not lightsaber and can catch it or something broken like that, then I don't really know.) and Lastly what I should have really stressed was not speed but mobility. being greater. I think that their fighting speeds might actually be pretty close, but Neo is clearly the more mobile of the two and has a wider range with flight. That's why I don't think he would be able to keep up with Neo h2h wise. Think about Neo pulling that pipe from the ground in Matrix 2. No effort, just rips it up and often sends Smith flying with a signal blow.

Now, I'm open to anything that would show that vader can do those things better and take them. I just don't know about them yet.

#40 Edited by Chibi_cute (4509 posts) - - Show Bio

When the battlefield is in the matrix.Then neo godstomps neo can basically control and manipulate everything in the matrix.

#41 Posted by Carter_esque (6447 posts) - - Show Bio

Neo wins