#1 Edited by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio
Nemesis
Peter witnesses a man running from an oddly dressed woman on one of his patrols. Being the
Spidey
 nosy super-hero that he is, Spidey decides to intervene as he swings in between Charis and the Brotherhood member with one of his quips. Charis decides that it is best to simply deal with Spider-Man now then deal with further interventions in the future and the fight begins on the rooftops of New York.
Note: I believe WS chracters are under-used in battle forums (besides the obvious like Midnighter, Hawksmoor, and Majestros). I'm using Spidey here to see what Nemesis is capable of before I put her in a better-matched battle. So please, don't hold back with your explanations.
#2 Posted by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay, I take it back, you don't have to explain. Just someone, please post!

#3 Posted by Vance Astro (90726 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going to go with Spider-man.I think he has the speed,agility,and long range advantage with the webbing.

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#4 Posted by TheDrifter (26555 posts) - - Show Bio

Nemesis

#5 Posted by Vance Astro (90726 posts) - - Show Bio
TheDrifter said:
"Nemesis"
Why?
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#6 Edited by One-Above-All (485 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"I'm going to go with Spider-man.I think he has the speed,agility,and long range advantage with the webbing."
Don't know how strong Nemesis' forcefields are, but they could probably stop his webbing, and her swords can cut through anything.
#7 Posted by TheDrifter (26555 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"TheDrifter said:
"Nemesis"
Why?"
Force Field, Swords that cut through anything, etc etc
#8 Posted by Vance Astro (90726 posts) - - Show Bio
TheDrifter said:
"Vance Astro said:
"TheDrifter said:
"Nemesis"
Why?"
Force Field, Swords that cut through anything, etc etc"
With Spider-man's speed and agility..what are swords going to do?
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#9 Posted by One-Above-All (485 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
"TheDrifter said:
"Vance Astro said:
"TheDrifter said:
"Nemesis"
Why?"
Force Field, Swords that cut through anything, etc etc"
With Spider-man's speed and agility..what are swords going to do?"
Not sure how much, but she also has superhuman strength, speed, and durability, and psychic powers.
#10 Posted by Vance Astro (90726 posts) - - Show Bio
One-Above-All said:
"Vance Astro said:
"TheDrifter said:
"Vance Astro said:
"TheDrifter said:
"Nemesis"
Why?"
Force Field, Swords that cut through anything, etc etc"
With Spider-man's speed and agility..what are swords going to do?"
Not sure how much, but she also has superhuman strength, speed, and durability, and psychic powers."
Her psychic power I believe is empathy....which isn't going to do anything.
Spider-man has faced people with superhuman strength and durability greater than his own.
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#11 Posted by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm mostly going to be asking asking questions because I'm unfamiliar with Nemesis except for her CV page. How would they match-up in terms of speed and agility?, what about durability? I read that she took on the entire Wildcats squad (including Mr. Majestic who is loosely around Superman's level) is that right? What was the deal with that battle, is she actually that good? When she activates her forcefield, can she still attack or move? How big is it, how strong is it, and how fast can she get it up? I also read that she does stuff with the mind like read into someone's past (which she could probably use for psychological warfare here), what else can she do with her mind that would help her in this fight?

#12 Posted by Vance Astro (90726 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't know much about Nemesis,but I haven't been given a good explanation of how or why she can win...so naturally I would take Spider-Man as the victor.This is the problem when you use WS characters,not to many people read their comics to make a case.

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#13 Posted by Buckshot (18865 posts) - - Show Bio

Was waiting to see if anyone else would post. Good thread SB and I agree that more WS characters could be used besides the 3 you mentioned. I almost made this thread (a fight with Spider-Man as a gauge) with Backlash a while back. I didn't  do it but then like a week later several Backlash threads popped up so it was ok.

Anyway, I'm thinking Spider-Man. Nemesis has some things going for her (strength, speed, swords that can cut through anything, forcefields, special weapons) but I'm not sure on her physical attributes. I know she has superhuman strength and speed, but I don't think it's that great. She's a Kheran, but she's not as fast or strong as Maj. She's fast enough to avoid Spider-Man (peak human Cap can do it and so can others), but hitting him would be hard because I don't think she's that fast (she has to get past his spider sense). I'll have to come back to this cuz I have class in like 15 minutes, but I think it's a good fight. For now at least.

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#14 Posted by cpt_linger (2902 posts) - - Show Bio

the only way for her to win would be to immobalize spidey and then dice him up..... don't see that happening, too fast and agile for her. spider wins.

#15 Posted by Vance Astro (90726 posts) - - Show Bio
Buckshot said:
"Was waiting to see if anyone else would post. Good thread SB and I agree that more WS characters could be used besides the 3 you mentioned. I almost made this thread (a fight with Spider-Man as a gauge) with Backlash a while back. I didn't  do it but then like a week later several Backlash threads popped up so it was ok.

Anyway, I'm thinking Spider-Man. Nemesis has some things going for her (strength, speed, swords that can cut through anything, forcefields, special weapons) but I'm not sure on her physical attributes. I know she has superhuman strength and speed, but I don't think it's that great. She's a Kheran, but she's not as fast or strong as Maj. She's fast enough to avoid Spider-Man (peak human Cap can do it and so can others), but hitting him would be hard because I don't think she's that fast (she has to get past his spider sense). I'll have to come back to this cuz I have class in like 15 minutes, but I think it's a good fight. For now at least."
I noticed you mentioned Cap dodging Spider-Man's hits..Do you think Marvel allows it because of who Cap is or do you think Cap is actually fast enough to dodge Spider-man's punches.I mean he does dodge bullets which I would assume come faster than a punch from Spider-Man but I have seen Spidey all over some peak or superhuman characters not being able to dodge his punches.
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#16 Posted by Buckshot (18865 posts) - - Show Bio
Super-Buster said:
"I'm mostly going to be asking asking questions because I'm unfamiliar with Nemesis except for her CV page. How would they match-up in terms of speed and agility?, what about durability? I read that she took on the entire Wildcats squad (including Mr. Majestic who is loosely around Superman's level) is that right? What was the deal with that battle, is she actually that good? When she activates her forcefield, can she still attack or move? How big is it, how strong is it, and how fast can she get it up? I also read that she does stuff with the mind like read into someone's past (which she could probably use for psychological warfare here), what else can she do with her mind that would help her in this fight?"
 Quick before I go: I have the same problems with her speed and strength. She's been able to hit Maj a few times, but they have a personal relationship that may have played a factor (former lovers and all that). The most recent time she hit him, she needed him to be distracted. I'll have to look at it more later. Her forcefields can be like shields (attached to her forearms like real shields might be) and or skintight. She can move and fight with them on. They're pretty tough if I recall correctly. She's had them up though explosions, daemonites swarming her, and Maj exploding parts of her building. It comes up really fast. Possibly thought controlled. Her mind probably isn't her best weapon and I don't think she can work like Mr. X or anything. Some psychological stuff might be possible.
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#17 Posted by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio

Well if Nemesis can attack and move with her force field on, what incentive does she have to bring it down? Could she go the whole fight in a skintight force field? If so, how could Spidey harm her? If he wrapped her up with his webs (so that her swords are not in a position to slice anything) would she be able to expand the force field to unwrap herself?

One way we might gauge her speed and durability is to see what showings other Kherans (I think Zealot is one) have. I know Nemesis might have higher or lower stats than the Kheran we compare her against but they should be in the ballpark and a good place to start.

As for her ability to read pasts, I think it would be kind of interesting to see what she dug up. Would she see his life like everyone else in the MU remembers it or would she what really happened (With Mephisto and all that). I think she might see what everyone else sees since I think Mephisto actually re-wrote reality. I don't think she can do too much damage with this technique but she could distract him with disturbing recalls of his past (like Gwen's death) and apparently a distraction was enough for her to hit Maj. Also, maybe better understanding her opponent and what moves he has made in the past could be an advantage to her.

Am I missing something?
#18 Posted by Mr. Wilson (6322 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going with Spidey.

#19 Posted by Buckshot (18865 posts) - - Show Bio
Vance Astro said:
I noticed you mentioned Cap dodging Spider-Man's hits..Do you think Marvel allows it because of who Cap is or do you think Cap is actually fast enough to dodge Spider-man's punches.I mean he does dodge bullets which I would assume come faster than a punch from Spider-Man but I have seen Spidey all over some peak or superhuman characters not being able to dodge his punches."
I think he's fast enough to dodge him (for a while), but not fast enough to hit him. Avoiding him is easier than hitting him because actually landing a hit means being faster than him and also faster than the spider sense while avoiding him means he just has to be faster than him (or have a little lead time).

Super-Buster said:
"Well if Nemesis can attack and move with her force field on, what incentive does she have to bring it down? Could she go the whole fight in a skintight force field? If so, how could Spidey harm her? If he wrapped her up with his webs (so that her swords are not in a position to slice anything) would she be able to expand the force field to unwrap herself?
One way we might gauge her speed and durability is to see what showings other Kherans (I think Zealot is one) have. I know Nemesis might have higher or lower stats than the Kheran we compare her against but they should be in the ballpark and a good place to start.

As for her ability to read pasts, I think it would be kind of interesting to see what she dug up. Would she see his life like everyone else in the MU remembers it or would she what really happened (With Mephisto and all that). I think she might see what everyone else sees since I think Mephisto actually re-wrote reality. I don't think she can do too much damage with this technique but she could distract him with disturbing recalls of his past (like Gwen's death) and apparently a distraction was enough for her to hit Maj. Also, maybe better understanding her opponent and what moves he has made in the past could be an advantage to her.

Am I missing something?
"
Nemesis' incentive for bringing the force field down is that she's Coda and she loves to fight and though she fights smart, she's not worried about getting hurt. The Coda don't shy away from blood. They practice naked with real blades and their rituals involve cutting each other up. She probably wouldn't put up her forcefield until she saw something that could actually kill her. So if she underestimates Spider-Man, his first few blows could be a problem, but if she's acting in character, he would be too and wouldn't go for full power attacks straight away. (Even if he did though, she's trained to fight against Kherans of Maul and Majestic's types so I think she could take a hit from a ten tonner.) Her forcefields are mobile enough to be used to get out of webbing. She can put one up all around her (the skintight one or a larger sphere) and she can also do shield ones "locked" to her forearms which can change size and move if she needs them to. The sphere form was able to take fire from Kheran weaponry that temporarily dropped Majestic, but she wasn't shown moving while it was up. Don't if she can't move, or if the other shields aren't as strong, just wanted to give all the info I saw. She also has forcefields she can wrap around her fists to make her punches even harder, so they can modified a lot.

She has a few good showings of her own. For strength, she's ripped open a car. For speed, she's a bullet blocker (she's fast enough to turn on her force field and put it up between herself and bullets coming at her, even in the middle of a fight with several others) and can move faster than someone capable of teleporting (not over distance, but she could catch and beat a teleporter coming at her while she was engaging Zealot in combat). She's beaten Midnighter and Hawksmoor at once (though they weren't at their best). The speed ones may benefit from her psionic abilities, but she's fought robots and beaten them easily as well. Her durability and damage soak is pretty good. She's taken shots (punches and laser vision) from The High (Majestic level or thereabouts) and been fine. (Continuous blows to the head eventually knocked her out, but she beat him first by cutting off his head.) Comparing her with Zealot doesn't give us too much because Zealot doesn't have many feats (that I can think of anyway) for strength or speed. She often comes off as just a little superhuman.

Her empathic abilities can be used almost like a radar. She's not like DD or anything, but she can pinpoint any enemy with emotions (pretty much anything but robots and corpses). She's been able to shoot (she also uses guns) enemies cloaked in the best Kheran technology based on where their emotions are coming from. I might have to take back my statement that she's not like Mr. X. I'm looking over some comics again and Maj says she can react to attacks before they've even begun thanks to her psionic abilities. The psychological attack method could be useful and I think she'd see what he knows, not the real/previous reality. Distractions can be very useful. On the Maj thing though, the distraction she used to hit him wasn't from psychic knowledge, it was Zealot. The first time, I don't think he knew what kind of sword she was carrying.

I'm starting to think Nemesis now. One hit wins it for her and with her numerous explosives, guns, insight into his attacks, and millenia of combat experience, I think she could hit him. Her speed, ability to know his moves, and her force fields would make it hard for him to hit her though. She can also take a lot more punishment that he can. She's won fights after being gutted and smacked nearly unconscious by someone stronger than Spider-Man. He'd be lucky to survive any kind of contact with her blades.
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#20 Posted by T.J. Magnum (27685 posts) - - Show Bio

Nemesis

#21 Posted by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio
Buckshot said:
Nemesis' incentive for bringing the force field down is that she's Coda and she loves to fight and though she fights smart, she's not worried about getting hurt. The Coda don't shy away from blood. They practice naked with real blades and their rituals involve cutting each other up. She probably wouldn't put up her forcefield until she saw something that could actually kill her. So if she underestimates Spider-Man, his first few blows could be a problem, but if she's acting in character, he would be too and wouldn't go for full power attacks straight away. (Even if he did though, she's trained to fight against Kherans of Maul and Majestic's types so I think she could take a hit from a ten tonner.) Her forcefields are mobile enough to be used to get out of webbing. She can put one up all around her (the skintight one or a larger sphere) and she can also do shield ones "locked" to her forearms which can change size and move if she needs them to. The sphere form was able to take fire from Kheran weaponry that temporarily dropped Majestic, but she wasn't shown moving while it was up. Don't if she can't move, or if the other shields aren't as strong, just wanted to give all the info I saw. She also has forcefields she can wrap around her fists to make her punches even harder, so they can modified a lot.

She has a few good showings of her own. For strength, she's ripped open a car. For speed, she's a bullet blocker (she's fast enough to turn on her force field and put it up between herself and bullets coming at her, even in the middle of a fight with several others) and can move faster than someone capable of teleporting (not over distance, but she could catch and beat a teleporter coming at her while she was engaging Zealot in combat). She's beaten Midnighter and Hawksmoor at once (though they weren't at their best). The speed ones may benefit from her psionic abilities, but she's fought robots and beaten them easily as well. Her durability and damage soak is pretty good. She's taken shots (punches and laser vision) from The High (Majestic level or thereabouts) and been fine. (Continuous blows to the head eventually knocked her out, but she beat him first by cutting off his head.) Comparing her with Zealot doesn't give us too much because Zealot doesn't have many feats (that I can think of anyway) for strength or speed. She often comes off as just a little superhuman.

Her empathic abilities can be used almost like a radar. She's not like DD or anything, but she can pinpoint any enemy with emotions (pretty much anything but robots and corpses). She's been able to shoot (she also uses guns) enemies cloaked in the best Kheran technology based on where their emotions are coming from. I might have to take back my statement that she's not like Mr. X. I'm looking over some comics again and Maj says she can react to attacks before they've even begun thanks to her psionic abilities. The psychological attack method could be useful and I think she'd see what he knows, not the real/previous reality. Distractions can be very useful. On the Maj thing though, the distraction she used to hit him wasn't from psychic knowledge, it was Zealot. The first time, I don't think he knew what kind of sword she was carrying.

I'm starting to think Nemesis now. One hit wins it for her and with her numerous explosives, guns, insight into his attacks, and millenia of combat experience, I think she could hit him. Her speed, ability to know his moves, and her force fields would make it hard for him to hit her though. She can also take a lot more punishment that he can. She's won fights after being gutted and smacked nearly unconscious by someone stronger than Spider-Man. He'd be lucky to survive any kind of contact with her blades."
Thanks for the info, now let's see what fights I can come up with.
#22 Posted by oldmagic (5296 posts) - - Show Bio

Siperman wins simply because Cap taught him martial arts and how not to use instincts before using your own head....or something like that. 

#23 Posted by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio
oldmagic said:
"Siperman wins simply because Cap taught him martial arts and how not to use instincts before using your own head....or something like that. "
Is that all you got?
#24 Posted by oldmagic (5296 posts) - - Show Bio
Super-Buster said:
"oldmagic said:
"Siperman wins simply because Cap taught him martial arts and how not to use instincts before using your own head....or something like that. "
Is that all you got?"
yea, don't really feel like going on a lengthly explanation like buckshot did....besides, i'm eating dinner and watching tv at the same time.
#25 Posted by lionheart (1261 posts) - - Show Bio

nemesis. i dont really have a good reason
i just hate spiderman