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#1 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

OK so we look at Speed Feats all the time to say on the forums who wins, bad habit in a way, but basically the way faster guy wins 9/10 times in most matches. Lately I seen mangas in general which have most of the time Zero stated speed feats get rated in the Mach 100+ categories by fans.

This is a site of feats and statements. We use this to reliably determine who is faster, not judge from artwork or anime style fight scenes.

So with that said. Are Naruto characters fastest byFEATS or STATEMENTS faster than say Comics best like Batman, Deathstroke, Spider Man, Wolverine, Luther Strode, and Iron Fist best Street Level feats? Does Naruto characters blow away the Combat Speed, Reflex Speed, Physical Speed of Comics Street Level? Remember this has nothing to do with Travel Speed.

VS

#2 Edited by xlab3000 (3130 posts) - - Show Bio
#3 Posted by otakuemperor (148 posts) - - Show Bio

i honestly agree that alot of these speed stats are unlikely but hey thats fiction for you but my policy is the best feat to go with is always the first. naruto in the very first episode was capable of painting the hokage monument and leading two highly trained ninja in a race across 1lthe fillage and was just a blur and even had the reaction time and manueverability to have already stopped and put up a camoflouge before anyone even saw him. now keep in mind that sasuke lee kakshi kiba and lee all showed speed that was capable of out pacing naruto so id say its not crazy to say there moving and high speeds but they're definetly movin beyond human speed

#4 Posted by DarkRaiden (6518 posts) - - Show Bio
#5 Posted by jashro44 (19562 posts) - - Show Bio

All though I am not an expert on naruto from what I do know they aren't that much faster then street level. For example Itatchi had to activate susanoo to avoid saukes kirin (an attack stated to move at 1/1000 of a second). Now sure your average street leveler probably couldn't dodge lightning after it has been fired but characters like iron fist have shown to react within microseconds. 1/1000 of a second is 1 milisecond.So I think they can match Itachis reaction speed (of course thats not really taking into account Itatchis sharingan).

Granted Itatchi isn't the fastest character in the series so the top tiers are probably beyond street level speed wise but not sure if characters around Itachis level or lower would be (ignoring his sharingan). And again my knowledge is limited so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

#6 Posted by DarkRaiden (6518 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

All though I am not an expert on naruto from what I do know they aren't that much faster then street level. For example Itatchi had to activate susanoo to avoid saukes kirin (an attack stated to move at 1/1000 of a second). Now sure your average street leveler probably couldn't dodge lightning after it has been fired but characters like iron fist have shown to react within microseconds. 1/1000 of a second is 1 milisecond.So I think they can match Itachis reaction speed (of course thats not really taking into account Itatchis sharingan).

Granted Itatchi isn't the fastest character in the series so the top tiers are probably beyond street level speed wise but not sure if characters around Itachis level or lower would be (ignoring his sharingan). And again my knowledge is limited so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

Eh...Itachi's damn close to top tier in speed. Last we saw him he was fast as Sage Mode Kabuto, fast as KCM Naruto and Killerbee, putting him near Raikage in speed. These people would all be the top tier in speed actually as no one else has been shown to be faster.

#7 Posted by jashro44 (19562 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

All though I am not an expert on naruto from what I do know they aren't that much faster then street level. For example Itatchi had to activate susanoo to avoid saukes kirin (an attack stated to move at 1/1000 of a second). Now sure your average street leveler probably couldn't dodge lightning after it has been fired but characters like iron fist have shown to react within microseconds. 1/1000 of a second is 1 milisecond.So I think they can match Itachis reaction speed (of course thats not really taking into account Itatchis sharingan).

Granted Itatchi isn't the fastest character in the series so the top tiers are probably beyond street level speed wise but not sure if characters around Itachis level or lower would be (ignoring his sharingan). And again my knowledge is limited so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

Eh...Itachi's damn close to top tier in speed. Last we saw him he was fast as Sage Mode Kabuto, fast as KCM Naruto and Killerbee, putting him near Raikage in speed. These people would all be the top tier in speed actually as no one else has been shown to be faster.

Honestly I have only really seen his fight with naruto and Killer bee. I assume the sharingan allows him to keep up with them.

#8 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (16001 posts) - - Show Bio
#9 Posted by NighThunder (2819 posts) - - Show Bio

I think it became obiviious that naruto chars were faster in reflex speed by chunin exams.

#10 Posted by Dratini1331 (6969 posts) - - Show Bio

Reflexes for naruto character should be higher, but raw speed for most characters I would put around mach 4-ish. There are some characters I rank higher though, obviously. Most Naruto characters would be high than your average street leveler, or around the same, for comic speeds.

#11 Edited by russellmania77 (14543 posts) - - Show Bio

BATMAN... you forgot to bold it so i did

#12 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio
#13 Edited by jashro44 (19562 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: Very good blog! I do agree with your thoughts on Haku. I don't think she is faster then light mainly because Sauske could follow his movements. Its not totally impossible but it seems unlikely.

On the Lee VS Dosu fight personally I would say he is talking about his gauntlets. Because it looks like his fist isn't really connecting with Lee (to me) and everything on the page is drawn all weird. The next page Dosu states his attacks can't simply be dodged because if you do dodge his attacks the sound will hit you.

Sasuke did seem to dodge the sonic attack after its fired I agree with that one. And as you said this is a low tier sauske so the characters likely get a lot faster.

I think naruto stating he is moving at mach 5 is an exaggeration. It would seem unnecessary to run at mach 5.

As for Kakashi cutting lightning in half I tend to think those are exaggerated claims because of the whole itatchi thing I mentioned above (we know Itachi is faster kakashi).

As for the water bullets I kind of think its the same as Haku. I do doubt they move light speed (I think if water moved that fast it would evaporate [granted I know naruto is fictional universe but still I think water being flung that fast is an exaggeration])

Again though very good blog! Can't wait to see some updates.

#14 Posted by ThatGuyWithHeadPhones (10251 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44: I love how you called Haku a she..lol

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#15 Posted by jashro44 (19562 posts) - - Show Bio
#16 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

Didn't sasuke have trouble dodging danzos air bullets(which I don't think was intended to be any faster than actual bullets since guns don't exist)?

#17 Posted by Jgames (1616 posts) - - Show Bio

Mach 4 is usually the range of top tier in naruto, and the fastest reflex recorded was Itachi being able to activate susanoo. So high tier are faster than your street level your posted, but average ninja like shikamaru is probaly not as fast as Spiderman

#18 Posted by Pierpat (2669 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2:

Well i think it's, for reactions:

Spider man(he starts reacting before anyone else, spider sense......)>>Naruto top tiers(Itachi,madara, gai)>Deathstroke>Average Mid tier ninja(Lee,Naruto,sasuke,kages)>Peak human(comics bullet timers/catchers)>Low ninjas(Ino,shikamaru)

And for speed:

Naruto top tiers(Minato,Gai,Madara)>>>>>>Naruto high mid tiers(SM naruto&Jiraya,Lee,bee,sasuke)>>>>Spider Man and deathstroke>>Naruto low tier(Ino,Shikamaru)>comic bullet timers

Explanation:

The naruto verse has often speed that runs in relation with their reflexes,the top tiers in speed are surely supersonic with solid feats and statements to prove it, while comic high level street levelers often have incredibly good reaction times while staying subsonic(Deathstroke and Spiderman can see and catch multiple bullets but are subsonic).

#19 Posted by oceanmaster21 (7737 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: naruto charchaters should win out of speed and reflexes

#20 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm really having trouble digesting this. Why would we instantly put them at quicksilver level when they have shown actually showing effort to dodge shurikens? Its almost as hard to believe similar vague feats put luffy at light speed.

#21 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (16001 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm really having trouble digesting this. Why would we instantly put them at quicksilver level when they have shown actually showing effort to dodge shurikens? Its almost as hard to believe similar vague feats put luffy at light speed.

because the shurikern are thrown by someone as fast as them.. If flash throws shurikern, could batman dodge them? (well, it's too large of a gap, but you get the idea)

#22 Posted by ThatGuyWithHeadPhones (10251 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm really having trouble digesting this. Why would we instantly put them at quicksilver level when they have shown actually showing effort to dodge shurikens? Its almost as hard to believe similar vague feats put luffy at light speed.

Luffy, light speed...lolno

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#23 Edited by Strider92 (16080 posts) - - Show Bio

Calcs are unreliable at best and downright wrong most of the time. If you applied the same logic to comic characters then we'd see characters doing things far beyond their normal capabilities. Manga and comic artists go for aesthetic and not realism (hence the reason we see some crazy feats being done by characters who aren't capable of said feat) so if you think you can calculate a stat based on an artists interpretation then you're severely misguided.

#24 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@thatguywithheadphones: I'm not saying he is. Just that other people think so. Its kind of rediculous in my opinion.

#25 Edited by dccomicsrule2011 (23171 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92 said:

Calcs are unreliable at best and downright wrong most of the time. If you applied the same logic to comic characters then we'd see characters doing things far beyond their normal capabilities. Manga and comic artists go for aesthetic and not realism (hence the reason we see some crazy feats being down by characters who aren't capable of said feat) so if you think you can calculate a stat based on an artists interpretation then you're severely misguided.

You my friend, just won the thread with this post.

Their is nothing I hate more then fan made calculations, mainly because you come up with a whole bunch of sh!t that goes against canon for the character.

Easy manga feat to calculate that requires little speculation:

Tsuna dodges missiles shot from a state of the art Mech suit with top of the line weapons. Basically all you have to do is find out how fast some of the world's best missiles travel and you have a decent rough estimate. Sure it may not be absolute, but no calculation is unless it is directly stated by the author.

One that too hard to qualify:

How fast does one need to go to leave an after image that looks like a mirage when they move in one huge burst of speed? Do you now the answer? I certainly don't. This is one feat I would say that far surpasses Batman, but that about all I can say. I can't claim mach 10 with this feat like some do. (looking at you OBD)

#26 Posted by Funsiized (3585 posts) - - Show Bio

Mangas in general are to inconsistent to judge anything off of. Most characters are glass cannons. The Mangaka will throw things around just to add Dramatic effect. Then we end up with attacks that have lightning in the name...but are far from that speed. Added to things such as the famous "Kizaru-Lightspeed or not?" Debates that will range to the end of time. Added to the fact that Mangas throw in a random variables. Such as The fourth being referred to as a "Yellow flash" indicating speed, when really he is Teleporting. Using direct feats is near impossible, as Mangakas typically use vague statements to make their characters seem as Powerful as the Readers imagination. I can't even tell you how many times I have heard "Steel hard body" in a manga...The twisty way of the Japanese Language doesn't help either. Every sentence they throw out is like a hidden message.

Just my opinion.

#27 Posted by Strider92 (16080 posts) - - Show Bio

@dccomicsrule2011: Exactly. For example here:

Here both Spider-man and Wolverine are leaving mirage images as they move but does this mean they are speedster level of speed? Of course not. This is the artists way of showing that the character is moving really fast.

If I applied Calc logic to scans such as these i'd probably come out with a hypersonic movement Spider-man but I don't because we have canon statements of how fast he actually is so things like this can be dismissed as artists aesthetic. Whereas i've seen manga characters credited as hypersonic from calcs and yet their actual consistent feats put them below that. This is because the artist did not draw the image thinking "Oh i'll draw this down to the last minute detail so we can see exactly without a shadow of a doubt how strong/fast this character really is by calculating it using advanced maths." It was drawn simply to be attractive and interesting nothing more.

#28 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@funsiized: @strider92: @dccomicsrule2011: I made this thread long time ago, and only now is it catching on lol. The reasoning and logic being used here is more than I could have wished for.

#29 Posted by DeathHero61 (5244 posts) - - Show Bio

oh here we go again.....

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#30 Posted by Funsiized (3585 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: The only time I ever state speed is really either for Bleach characters, as Shunpo Directly presents for form of high speed Or for freezing characters, Cause Cassie dodged a Mach 3 sonic wave and i can use that as a building block.

#31 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

Interesting. I like striders answers.

#32 Posted by Sovereign91001 (3982 posts) - - Show Bio

Calcs are unreliable at best and downright wrong most of the time. If you applied the same logic to comic characters then we'd see characters doing things far beyond their normal capabilities. Manga and comic artists go for aesthetic and not realism (hence the reason we see some crazy feats being done by characters who aren't capable of said feat) so if you think you can calculate a stat based on an artists interpretation then you're severely misguided.

Thank goodness for logic.

#33 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: Sorry if my question is a little off topic(well not to far off) but when I saw this... At first I thought it was simply a reflex feat but then as I took a closer look it seemed more like a speed feat than a reaction one. Even MJ says so. So does this mean the webhead has 40x normal human reaction and movement speed(which would at the very least make him subsonic for short bursts)?

#34 Posted by Strider92 (16080 posts) - - Show Bio

@segamarvel: For brief periods yes he can move exceedingly fast as we've seen here in the past:

However he cannot consistently move at this pace given his in-character showings. These are more brief bursts of speed when he's put in a potentially fatal position rather than consistent movement speed like say the characters in Bleach demonstrate with Shunpo.

#35 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: Really? You would think from the way he is describing it, it sounds like he can move that fast whenever he "cuts loose". I'm starting to think his Speed/reflexes are 15x at base while his spider-sense increases it with an aadrenaline rush against dangerous opponents like the Hulk.

#36 Posted by Strider92 (16080 posts) - - Show Bio

@segamarvel: He says "My reflexes work at 40x faster than a normal person." Thats not the same as physical speed. What he states is that he's reaction speed is 40x faster than a normal person which based on his showings is correct. He cannot however run 40x faster than a human his physical speed is not that fast just his reactions/reflexes.

#37 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: That still doesn't make much sense. It is a little obvious that the writer is trying to show the reflexes are used as part of his spider speed when speed blitzing. I hope you please have the patience to read my theory.

In "Spider-Man Vol 1 #41" he fights iron fist and says that he has the advantage because he has spider-sense and the Proportionate speed of a spider to close the skill gap between them(He mentions his Proportionate speed in a combat situation instead of his reflexes). In "The Spectacular Spider-Man Vol 1 #182" He says that his Reflexes are a little off and slowing him down because he was drugged and needed to make it in time to stop vermin(he mentions reflexes instead of speed in a travel situation). This leads me to believe Peter's Speed/reflexes are one n the same. So he can move AND react at 15x(sometimes 40x faster if he pushes himself) faster than average human in both combat and travel speed by default.

#38 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: I'm also confused with you last reply since it technically contradicts your answer before that?

#39 Posted by Strider92 (16080 posts) - - Show Bio

@segamarvel: How does it contradict what I said? I said he cannot consistently move at the same speed he uses to avoid that bullet. He can use it to avoid yes but he can't actually run at that speed. For example you can move your hand at a much faster speed than you can run. I'm not saying he can't react in that space of time i'm saying he can't physically run at that speed.

Yes he can move super-humanly fast but not to the same extent he can make quick reflexive reactions.

#40 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: Sorry I worded my statement wrong. I don't mean he can run that fast, I just mean he can move that fast in h2h combat speed. All i'm saying.

#41 Posted by Strider92 (16080 posts) - - Show Bio

@segamarvel: Oh then yes. He can move that fast in hand to hand.

#42 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: So that makes him at least subsonic when he's fighting. Cool.

#43 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: So ya All I really meant is his movement speed is that high in combat. I didn't mean to say he could travel across NY at that pace since he would just tire himself out. I guess that's why he has webs. That would also explain why he was to fast for Quicksilver to dodge despite his reflexes as a speedster. His combat speed was closer to his than he thought. Travel speed is a different story since for some weird reasons speedsters can keep that pace long enough to travel to far away places.

#44 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (16001 posts) - - Show Bio

@segamarvel: I personally think spiderman's combat speed is quite close to sonic levels, reflexes reaching about mach 4 when taking things seriously/ angry/ written well.

#45 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: From the way he has saved people like Vermin by moving faster than bullets at a short burst for a short distance, I think you might be right. After all he did once move this fast for a short burst

#46 Posted by Floopay (8598 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92 said:

Calcs are unreliable at best and downright wrong most of the time. If you applied the same logic to comic characters then we'd see characters doing things far beyond their normal capabilities. Manga and comic artists go for aesthetic and not realism (hence the reason we see some crazy feats being down by characters who aren't capable of said feat) so if you think you can calculate a stat based on an artists interpretation then you're severely misguided.

You my friend, just won the thread with this post.

Their is nothing I hate more then fan made calculations, mainly because you come up with a whole bunch of sh!t that goes against canon for the character.

Easy manga feat to calculate that requires little speculation:

Tsuna dodges missiles shot from a state of the art Mech suit with top of the line weapons. Basically all you have to do is find out how fast some of the world's best missiles travel and you have a decent rough estimate. Sure it may not be absolute, but no calculation is unless it is directly stated by the author.

One that too hard to qualify:

How fast does one need to go to leave an after image that looks like a mirage when they move in one huge burst of speed? Do you now the answer? I certainly don't. This is one feat I would say that far surpasses Batman, but that about all I can say. I can't claim mach 10 with this feat like some do. (looking at you OBD)

After images don't require speed AT ALL. It's a common misconception based on some statements a bunch of people made awhile back that creating an afterimage requires at least Mach 10. All she needs to do is move fast enough or create enough light to produce a blurred afterimage on the eyeball. Sounds impressive? It's not. Someone can wiggle a pencil at less than 1 mile per hour and create the same illusion, making it appear as if the pencil is made of rubber, or even that it is in two places at once.

Thanks for reading,

Floopay

#47 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (16001 posts) - - Show Bio

@segamarvel: yep, that's roughly mach 2. Fairly good with our range, His movement and combat speed should be pretty close.

#48 Edited by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio
#49 Posted by thelocust619 (2188 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow. When did Itachi EVER keep up with full speed KCM Naruto, why did that one guy say Itachi, Guy, and Madara are higher tier than Naruto and the Kages? Cuz they're not....at all.

That's the misconception right there: itachi wanking and misjudged tiers. These speed issues are due to people not knowing their stuff honestly, that's it. I can't even believe some of the bull I just read in this thread alone

#50 Posted by segamarvel (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@segamarvel: Oh then yes. He can move that fast in hand to hand.

one more question. Is combat speed basically travel speed in a shorter distance? It seems to look that way in the naruto show or DBZ.