Naruto, Ichigo, Luffy and Natsu Vs Goku (Saiyan Saga)

Goku one-shots them all, he one-shots moon + guys with ease in saiyan saga, what are these guys going to do to him

Bump

This is going to be the best fight ever.

Let's see...

Luffy is the first to die. Sure, let that rubber band dude wrap around Goku nicely, and then get vaporized by his Kame-Hame-HAAAAA thing.

Ichigo, with all of his hybrid powers he gain from the Bleach series, would give Goku a very hard time.

Natsu, with the power of friendship, will also give Goku a hard time.

Naruto...oh geez...he's going to troll Goku big time!

Yet, in the end, Goku's the one who is the strongest of them all.

Though, either he wins or them, I can't decide.

But it's gonna get very ugly. And I bet only one survivor of the team can finish off Goku if he has no back up powers available.

Goku pretty easily. Naruto is the strongest on the team and he's only around Raditz level.

Kaioken x 4 Kamehameha GG

Goku ez

Goku

(':

Oh how time changes things.

The team takes this.

Goku.

Naruto solos.

Sooooo Goku vs Naruto then? Anyone who's not Naruto is fodder. Meh can go either way imo.

Seeing how narufans can't say "Genjutsu GG" going with Goku.

@justsomerandomkid: good thing Naruto doesn't have Genjutsu.

Lol. Team wreck. They could all solo

Edit: Joking Lol. Team still win tho.

Team easily. People overrate DBZ and underestimate literally everyone else.

LMFAO

Goku completely stomps

My same reaction XD.

going with team. think the major debate will be on Naruto vs Goku.

going with team. think the major debate will be on Naruto vs Goku. in my op naruto can hold his own... so many techniques to use. shadow clones, demon fox shadow clones, sage mode, rasengan and enormous amount of chakra from all tailed beasts

Luffy or Naruto can solo with Luffy's fourth gear and conquer's haki, and Naruto's new form, if you add Natsu and Ichigo into the mix, I really don't see how Goku can win.

I'm not sure they can do any significant damage to base Goku, let alone touch him once he gets revved up. But when he starts using Kaio-ken, just forget about it.

Goku.

Goku gets cut.

lol'd at this. Roshi also bust the moon, at he was ~100 power level. going off this goku is moon busting x50. he should theoretically at this point be able to bust half the solar system away.

that also means even at PL 450 piccolo was 4.5x moon busting easily. and goku would have been even more then that. that also means, when vegetates power rose to 35k. he was 350x moon busting. meaning by then he could wipe our solar system away from the sun --> jupiter at the very least. art 350x moon busting power, a single ki blast should instantly destroy the whole planet. hell, he should be able to destroy the planet just be punching it.

by that logic one Roshi kamehame wave should have been more then enough to finish raditz too.

this is why nobody uses power levels in DBZ lol.

@chair-sama: Roshi's power level wasn't around 100 when he destroyed the moon. Why do people keep saying this? It was made clear the Earthlings raised their ki when they attack. Skinny Roshi standing doing nothing was 138. Roshi when serious is most likely much higher. In one source he is stated to be 180. However that's when he isn't buff or firing a kamehameha. When Goku fired a kamehamhea it doubled his power level in his fight with Raditz. Even though it's not a fact, lets say buff Roshi has a lower power level than old King Piccolo. That would make buff Roshi have a power level probably at least of around 200. When Roshi used his kamehameha to destroy the moon he used so much energy he couldn't even fire another one. After Goku used his kamehameha that doubled his power level, he was still able to fight and could probably shoot plenty more kamehamehas so Roshi's power level could of easily of been more than doubled when he fired his kamehameha, but lets lowball and say it only doubled. That would make full power Roshi's kamehameha around 400, which would line up with Piccolo's moon busting.

However both moon buntings were outliers and I still think the team wins, lol. Naruto is arguably moon level now anyways.

All confirmed

all confirmed power levels have been 139 for base roshi- so yes i was a bit low.

highest stated was 180 when serious. so lets consider. goku went form a 416 to 924 using his kamehameha wave, so going off that same power jump. ~2x(ill even use x3 for good measure) that puts him at 540.

so going off that, vegeta in his great ape form was stated to have a power level of 180k (18k x10)

180k/540 = 333.3.

that makes vegeta in great ape form, x333 power the takes to bust a moon.

by that standard busting the planet should only take a single punch. in fact he would have to hold back immensely to be able to even fight goku without busting the planet to begin with.

but in the end i agree that team should take this confirmed power statements > power scaling off other feats.

what we do know about naruto is some confirmed feats.

this is one of his current fight feats.

@chair-sama: How old is this and why in Batgod's name am I being tagged in an ancient post?

Anyway I am of the mind both power levels and SSJ multipliers are nonsense...considering Toriyama said so himself. IIRC this was to help explain for those using power levels, arguing "lol gag moon buster isn't moon buster", or that it somehow "isn't consistent" that no matter how you try to rationalize it, there's nothing unbelievable about these characters busting celestial bodies BOS. I mean...it literally happened. GG, case closed.

What is kinda funny is that at no point was I trying to argue something I merely imagined "should" happen, as you just were lmao. I merely offered a description of something that actually did happen, without any nonsense declaration of what I imagined would have been the case otherwise. The point is that if you aren't Akira Toriyama, you don't get to suggest what he expects any punch would do, because what he says is all that matters. He can say night is bright and the sky is under us, and it'd be true because it's his story, not yours.

And by ANY logic, btw...no, Roshi would not be >Radditz. That's stupid lol. No matter what Roshi does, if we are told Radditz is stronger than him then he's stronger. It's pretty simple, really.

Please explain how two instances of moon busting are BOTH outliers. That is a ridiculous statement. It happened TWICE, it isn't an outlier it is consistent with the series, get over it.

Then you go on to say that Naruto is arguable moon level? That is not just reaching, its idiotic.

I am getting a tad tired of always seeing you do this in any DBZ thread, in fact it is literally my mission to log in and say something to you every time because it is that consistently absurd.

This version of Goku is stronger than two people who busted a moon. That is completely apparent and can't even be considered power scaling.

The only chance that the team has is hax because Goku completely outclasses them in raw damage output by a significant margin.

Goku

How so?

DBZ characters have extremely high damage output, but outside of that they are not nearly as strong as people give them credit for.

Even against Beerus, Goku was lower than Lightspeed. That can easily be shown by comparing Goku and Beerus' speed to the speed of the falling water droplets in the cave when they fought in BoG. It can also be calculated at several other points in the series. The two feats which people like to throw out to imply that DBZ characters are lightspeed are both massively misunderstood. One is the throwaway line from Piccolo when they were fighting against Raditz which 1) was just Piccolo talking in shock and has no bearing on anything and 2) is a mis-translation from the original Japanese anyways.

The other is when Kid Goku supposedly "outran the solar flare" against Tien...which is completely absurd. Kid Goku is never shown outrunning the solar flare. All that is shown is that the solar flare goes off and when the light goes away, Goku is wearing Roshi's sunglasses. Any human being could do the exact same thing if you knew what was coming. Just close your eyes as your opponent is yelling "SOLAR FLARE" and then, with your eyes still closed, run to where you already know Roshi is with his sunglasses, and put them on. Not hard at all.

DBZ characters are also not as durable as people give them credit for. Again, late in the series while training against Whis, it is shown that their regular bodies can be injured quite easily. And that makes sense as all throughout the series, DBZ characters have survived blasts that are supposedly planet-busting, but can be injured by punches that barely leave a small crater in the ground. The reason why, which was shown as early as the original Dragon Ball, is that while their bodies are weak, their own Ki can negate Ki attacks. But that is far less effective against non-ki attacks, which is why they can't just throw up their ki barrier and become invulnerable to all damage. Regular fire has hurt DBZ characters. Much weaker punches. Rocks (and I'm not talking about non-cannon Krillin throwing a Rock at Goku's head). They're still superhuman, but even pre-timeskip Luffy has shown that his regular punches can pack more punch than Goku's punches ever have.

To this same effect, DBZ strikes aren't that strong either. Most people assume that they are insanely strong because they can take down people who can survive massively destructive attacks. But this is not what is shown in the series. When Goku punches the ground, it only leaves a very small impact in the ground usually (small compared to what they should be if they can take out people who have planet-level durability). And that's not just Goku "holding back". That happens with people like Frieza as well. The reason is that their ki defense only blocks against ki. So their ki aura can nullify extremely powerful ki attacks, but they don't nullify physical attacks. Which means you have to calculate the physical strength of their blows separate to the destructive power of their ki. And when you do that, you realize that even much later in the series, Goku's punches aren't even mountain level, and during the Saiyan Saga? Far less than even that.

That being said, DBZ characters are still ridiculously powerful. They can still pull out planet-busting moves like there's no tomorrow.

Modern Goku would be able to instantly take out all 4 of these guys. However, Saiyan Saga Goku? Ichigo solos. He's faster and his piercing attacks can slice Goku in half. Luffy solos. He's faster and insanely more durable and has much stronger punches than anything Goku had fought up to this point. Naruto solos. Again, faster and has all sorts of neat hax abilities that can kill and incapacitate, plus like Luffy his phsyical blows are just too much at this point and far outclass Goku. Natsu can kill Goku but I'd have to see some speed calcs for him to decide if Goku wouldn't just speed blitz him first.

all of this exactly.

the other thing about this whole fight is.

1. morals on.

2. in character.

^means nobody is blitzing anybody.

its a fact that goku has not blitz his opponents when non bloodlusted and heavily enraged. it was even made into a joke in this recent DBS when trunks asked why goku isn't using his full power against Black goku, vegeta said he has kind of a bad habit of holding back at first.

this also effects characters like naruto and luffy too.

now ichigo does have a habit of *trying* to speed blitz his opponents that he knows pose a threat to him (many times with aizen, even faceaplming him mid sentence, with the espada's, yhwach, etc)

so, and especially with him being composite(dangai for feats, current for hype) he has the potential to sneak attack a powerful GT in conjunction with the others attacking goku(just like he did to kaizen after yamamoto's forbidden hado, came up and blitzed kaizen from behind)

i don't follow FT much so i can't speak for natsu, not sure how his in character actions are or how fast he really is so i will refrain from mentioning him here and let somebody with more knowledge chime in about him.

and heres the thing about Moonbusting in DBZ. nobody is saying it didnt happen. it did. But here are some main points related to that.

1. this is morals on in character goku. he is not going to just speed spam a moon busting attack.

2. naruto has survived a moon splitting attack. if we are going to credit roshi+piccolos moon busting in favor of goku, then we need to count naruto tanking a moon splitting attack with his hands.

3. the problem with a kamehameha wave is he has never(neither has roshi's moon busting wave) had an instant one with this version of goku( he didnt learn the Instant Transmission until Post-namek) even lowballing the teams speed, the and goku only taking 2-3 seconds to charge a kamahameha wave, is more then enough time(especially for naruto) to move/dodge and counter attack. in fact a kamehameha wave is the WORST move in this fight for goku, the main time goku uses it is as a finisher in a 1v1 or against an equally powerful blast(IE: galick gun, death ball, cell's kamehame, etc) and we have never seen him bust even mountains with normal Ki blasts. even Characters like Majin buu's normal ki blasts usually only leave building sized craters usually. especially when fired rapidly.

i know goku can launch a moon/planet busting kamehameha wave. is it smart to for this version of goku? even against vegeta, look at how long it took to charge that up? he'd have all 4 piled on him, and what happens when he does charge up and use it, and he finds out he just blasted a shadow clone+substitution jutsu? GG he just drained most of his ki and left himself wide open the whole time.

ALSO the fact that, going off cannon feats, that vegeta's tail while in his great ape oozuro form( let me remind you, he was at 180k power level, far dwarfing that of goku's) he was able to be cut by a mere human(yachirobe). what makes you think ichigo(who far far far dwarfs anything that yachirobe has ever done) or one of naruto's resenshurikens(something that has been confirmed to cut at a cellular level) couldn't do some insane damage?

even frieza was cut by krill's destructo disk, and their power difference was immense, krillin was literally fodder that he could kill with TK with ease, and his destruct disk literally cut a chunk of his tail off.

Freiza was cut to pieces by trunks sword.

DBZ canonically has shown to not have the biggest immunity to cutting power. and the only time goku has been immune was a version multiple times more powerful then this version and thats while SSJ.

in the end, if this was a bloodlusted, morals off goku, he would ROFL stomp team with ease.

But a morals on-in character(who's very character is to hold back and try to enjoy the fight) he wouldnt just speed blitz and blast them. This has never happened. ever. and being morals on and in character he has a much higher chance of being possibly beat.

@chair-sama: Ya I completely agree with you power levels shouldn't be used for scaling. I was just showing you that Roshi didn't blow up the moon with a power level of 100.

true that.

@man_of_miracles: Just because it happened more than once doesn't mean it isn't an outliar.

Piccolo destroyed the moon with one ki blast, yet this attack impressed him.

Moon busting is more impressive than cutting a trench across a planet but this attack impressed Goku.

Krillin should be a casual moon buster but this attack "terrifies" him.

I'm not saying these characters aren't moon busters, I'm saying the fact that they can bust moons but are scared of much weaker attacks doesn't make any sense, which is what makes the moon busting an outliar.

Naruto and Ichigo at best should be around Nappa or a bit stronger and Luffy should be mid Sayian Saga Z fighters and Natsu not much knowledge on this character .

I believe team take this if Goku doesn't take the fight fully serious with skills and ninja tactics for 6 out of 10

Most likely the team.

QFT

@alextheboss: ever heard about concentrating and focusing on enemy while reducing area? Now before you says that it is a fan made, look at Dark Schneider fights, DxD fights and Saint Seiya fights. They don't bust planets and galaxies in every fights.

@alextheboss said:

@man_of_miracles: Just because it happened more than once doesn't mean it isn't an outliar.

Piccolo destroyed the moon with one ki blast, yet this attack impressed him.

Moon busting is more impressive than cutting a trench across a planet but this attack impressed Goku.

Krillin should be a casual moon buster but this attack "terrifies" him.

I'm not saying these characters aren't moon busters, I'm saying the fact that they can bust moons but are scared of much weaker attacks doesn't make any sense, which is what makes the moon busting an outliar.

1) The moon busting isn't an outlier. It is consistent with the series including the fact that it was performed twice and that planet busting was performed casually later on in the series not to mention all of the casual city busting and continent busting along the way. If someone had moon busted once, and the highest feat besides that was destroying a house, that would be an outlier, You are trying to argue for these being outliers when you don't even understand what an outlier is.

2) Them being scared of these attacks is easily explainable, they simply concentrated the Ki of the attack into a smaller area, it is show and explained through the series that this can be done, which you would know if you paid any attention.

I mean seriously stop making the same tired arguments that dozens of people (not just me) have proven you wrong on over and over. It's sad.

lmao. that is your logic? that is correct in say, frieze's death beam or piccolo's special beam cannon. condenses power into a more singular point, its actually also the same logic behind an mundane sword. thinner, pointy object that doesn't more concentrated power over say, a massive club or hammer.

kind of similar to toneri splitting the moon. he doesn't blast it into pieces, he focuses his TSB into a sword and uses it to split the moon.

BUT

that logic does not help.

the second thing that does not help your logic, NONE of these characters have any reason to holdback/condense anything.

Lets look at racoome. what does condensing his blast into such a small crater do for him? he is trying to kill them all. why would he even bother, and not just blast that whole half of the continent they are on away?

Same with nappa. why would he condense his blast into a small area? what feelings does he have for the planet(by his own admission he doesn't care for it) why would he not just blast away the entire surface of the planet? or atleast the whole square mile they are in?

and now finally. frieza. the only one with a true reason to not planet bust(wants the dragon balls) why would he condense his blast SOOOO much? he doesn't need to condense anything for attack potency, why wouldnt he blast the whole area and kill like 5 birds with one stone. kill goku, gohan, etc/

so the blast, with enough condensed power was able to split a hill in half, narutos resenshurikens have similar output.

and this attack scared goku.

Team. Goku holds the DC advantage, but that's really it.

@chair-sama: Nappa was just showing off.

As for Recomme, he was basically toying with them. Even if he was angry, he wasn't stupid enough to blast up planet where DB were.

All for the sake of plot. Aizen could have killed in SS arc but why he didn't? Yhwach could have killed Ichigo with SS but didn't, why?

@akshsarpanch: The problem isn't the size of the blasts, it's the fact that the z fighters are impressed by the damage of the blast. Krillin clearly said blowing away the ground and warping the planet is impressive. Piccolo clearly said creating a trench that big was impressive. It's not like they said, wow the power of that blast was amazing. Then you would be right, they could be talking about the concentration. But they weren't talking about the ki blasts, they were talking about the destruction they caused.

King Piccolo was said to be stronger than Roshi. King Piccolo's strongest attack was only city level and the Daizenshuu says King Piccolo has the power of a small nuclear bomb... That's not even close to moon level.

Piccolo Jr.'s strongest attack was only large island level. The Daizenshuu said the island was a big as a small continent, even though it clearly isn't even close to the size of Australia (the smallest continent on our planet), but I will high ball and say it is actually small continent level. It's still nowhere near moon level.

They z fighters weren't scared by the concentration of those ki attacks. They were clearly impressed by the damage they caused.

Krillin was impressed by blowing away the ground and warping the planet. Piccolo was impressed by a crater so deep he couldn't see down it. Anyone with moon level DC would laugh at the little damage.

You just can't seem to accept the blatant inconsistencies in dragon ball. Toriyama isn't a consistent writer, and dragon ball used to be somewhat of a gag manga.

I agree saiyan saga characters are moon busters that can control their ki, but not facing the fact that those moon busting feats are outliars in the series is just you being in denial.

Here's to wishing dragon ball was a consistent manga.