I think the people who have the character as their picture should be banned from commenting on their battles :P Just kidding I agree completely Jamie would get owned.
" @Korg: How many minds (Multiple Mans') can Stryfe control telepathically, simultaneously? %Pr "
He only needs to control Madrox Prime to effect all the others, so that question is irrelevant. Jamie has normal human strength and durability. He can't do anything to Stryfe. Stryfe, on the other hand, can just kill all of Jamie's dupes with a TK blast. He doesn't even need telepathy here.
" @Korg: How many minds (Multiple Mans') can Stryfe control telepathically, simultaneously? %Pr "
He only needs to control Madrox Prime to effect all the others, so that question is irrelevant. Jamie has normal human strength and durability. He can't do anything to Stryfe. Stryfe, on the other hand, can just kill all of Jamie's dupes with a TK blast. He doesn't even need telepathy here. "
@Korg: Agreed. I hope you don't mind me asking, but are you a Stryfe fan like I am? Stryfe is one of the most powerful telepaths in the X-Men universe, but unfortunately he lacks the skill and experience that say, Xavier has as a telepath. Stryfe is more skilled and experienced with his telekinesis. I speculate that Apocalypse tried to make Stryfe "telepathically" weak, so that Apocalypse could use Stryfe as a host body, just like what Apocalypse did to Stryfe in Messiah War. %Pr
" @Korg: How many minds (Multiple Mans') can Stryfe control telepathically, simultaneously? %Pr "
He only needs to control Madrox Prime to effect all the others, so that question is irrelevant. Jamie has normal human strength and durability. He can't do anything to Stryfe. Stryfe, on the other hand, can just kill all of Jamie's dupes with a TK blast. He doesn't even need telepathy here. "
Actually Madrox doesn't control his dupes. A side effect of when he sent dupes out for long periods of time to learn skils is that each dupe manifests as a different facet of his personality. Some are even evil and have killed people. So no, controling Madrox prime will not allow him to control the others.
@Korg: He is more skilled with his telekinesis than his telepathy. He is very intelligent. Psylocke was able to shield herself from Stryfe telepathically. I speculate that Apocalypse tried to make Stryfe "telepathically" weak when Stryfe was young, so that Apocalypse could use Stryfe as a host body. When Stryfe defeated Jean in X-Cutioner's Song, Jean barely had any of her telepathic powers. %Pr
So because he is more skilled with telekinesis, he is not skilled with telepathy? I'm afraid that doesn't make much sense. It's also completely irrelevant since Madrox doesn't have any telepathic ability whatsoever.
@Korg: Why does that not make any sense? I am obfuscated. Please explain. What i was trying to say is that he doesn't have Exodus' or Emma Frost's or Xavier's skill. %Pr
Why would Apocalypse try to make Stryfe telepathically weak? If he's going to use him as a host wouldn't he want him to be as powerful as possible, isn't that the whole point of trying to use him as a host?
@PrinceIMC: If Stryfe were telepathicall weak, then it would be easier for Apoc. to use him as a host. Less resistance.
@Korg said:
" @cracks said:
" @Korg: Why does that not make any sense?"
Jean Grey was a powerful telekinetic. Naturally this means she had very little telepathic ability. See why that doesn't make sense?
@cracks said:
" What i was trying to say is that he doesn't have Exodus' or Emma Frost's or Xavier's skill. %Pr "
What I'm saying is that such a claim is unsubstantiated, and I disagree with it. "
My claim is substantiated, but I guess we can agree to disagree if you want. Exodus has had at least two centuries worth of skill and experience using his powers and abilities. Stryfe is 65 right? About that age? Obviously two centuries is longer than 65 years of age. If Psylocke was able to hide herself from Stryfe telepathically, then that implies that Emma and Xavier are above Stryfe with regards to telepathy only in skill and experience. Stryfe has more raw power in telepathy though. Stryfe was intelligent enough to attack Jean telepathically when she barely had any of her telepathic powers in X-Cutioner's Song.
True, but Jean now has very skilled and experience telepathy. She is at #2 on the list thProxy-Connection: keep-alive Cache-Control: max-age=0 Exodus made of the most skilled and experienced telepathy in the X-Men Universe. Jean defeated Emma. Jean Grey is
@cracks: Exodus was imprisoned by Apocalypse for all those years. He was given powers then imprisoned until Magneto released him so he doesn't really have centuries of experience.
Psylocke did make herself invisible to Stryfe using her telepathy but she was focusing all of her power to do this and she was only able to do it for a short time. It probably isn't something that Xavier or Emma Frost could do because Psylocke is a different kind of telepath than them, she's a ninja not just in body but in mind and uses her powers much more subtly At the time Stryfe was also occupied with fighting the X-Men.
@PrinceIMC: I know. Exodus has at least two centuries worth of skill and experience. Exodus was born in 12th Century France. Exodus was not imprisoned forever, otherwise he would not be able to do things that he has done. Exodus is still above Stryfe in telepathic skill and experience.
Do you happen to have a scan for Psylocke and Stryfe? Psylocke was even able to read Stryfe's mind. Not just make herself invisible to Stryfe's telepathy.
Even Cable in Messiah War was able to prevent Stryfe from telepathically entering Cable's team members' minds. %Pr
" @Exodus has had at least two centuries worth of skill and experience using his powers and abilities."
We've been over this. Exodus does not have anywhere near that much experience. He was in a comatose state from a year after he was granted his powers until the end of the 20th century. The "list" Exodus gives of the most powerful telepaths is completely meaningless. It is simply his opinion on the matter.
@Korg: That list is not about most powerful telepaths. It addresses the most skilled and experience telepaths.
Then tell me why Exodus was able to accomplish all of those impressive feats with such little time to fine tune his skill and experience? I am positive that Exodus has at least one century worth of experience and skill. That is above 65 years of age.
I agree that the list should now be updated because things have changed. %Pr
The list means nothing. It is an evaluation by Exodus, and nothing more. It is not a definitive measure of anything, and you should really stop acting like it is.
@cracks said:
" Then tell me why Exodus was able to accomplish all of those impressive feats with such little time to fine tune his skill and experience?"
Ok, see if you can follow this logic: The writers wanted a powerful villain who was not already well-known. He was written to be a badass. This is how writing works.
@Korg: The irrefutable fact remains that the people on that list are one of the most skill and experienced telepaths in the X-Men universe. I understand what you mean by saying that it is not definitive, but it still has some truth, but not the complete truth.
I can follow that logic. So tell me then how many years has Exodus had for fine tuning his skill and experience with his powers and abilities? Do the writers think that comic book readers are stupid and uneducated? Because if they wanted to do that then that means they don't think highly of their readers. If this is the case then why have the writers not done the same thing to other villains or other characters? Why only Exodus? If this is the case then I abhor writers. %Pr
"With enough Multiples (even if the are only average human strengths) will eventually become to much fro stryfe to deal with. "
Nope.
@Green Skin said:
"controling Madrox prime will not allow him to control the others. "
Yeah, forcing Jamie to reabsorb his dupes would have no effect on said dupes. That makes total sense. "
Well yeah he could reabsorb them, not control them. You made it sound like he could control them all by controlling prime. He can't. He can force prime to reabsorb the others, but your still only controlling prime. So next time say it right.
" @Korg: The irrefutable fact remains that the people on that list are one of the most skill and experienced telepaths in the X-Men universe."
Irrefutable? Don't make me laugh. Rachel Grey isn't even on the list he gives. Neither is Cassandra Nova. Neither is Cable, neither is X-Man, Stryfe, The Shadow King, Selene, or Apocalypse, etc. It is a faaaaaar cry from being an accurate list when it comes to measuring telepaths of skill, experience, or power in the X-Men's universe.
@Green Skin said:
" Well yeah he could reabsorb them, not control them. You made it sound like he could control them all by controlling prime. He can't. He can force prime to reabsorb the others, but your still only controlling prime. So next time say it right. "
I said it 100% correct the first time. I said effect, not control. Next time, read it right.
" Well yeah he could reabsorb them, not control them. You made it sound like he could control them all by controlling prime. He can't. He can force prime to reabsorb the others, but your still only controlling prime. So next time say it right. "
I said it 100% correct the first time. I said effect, not control. Next time, read it right. "
Whoops. My bad.
@Phoenix of the Black Throne said:
Prime is still psychically linked to the dupes and although Jamie can't control them, a telepath can use this link to do it. "
Can you show that on panel? Scott and Jean were linked for years, does that mean if a telepath controlled Jean they could control Scott too? Why would a telepath even try that? Much better to make Prime reabsorb the others, or just attack the dupes directly.
I assumed that the list only included human mutant telepaths in the X-Men Universe. Cassandra Nova and the Shadow King are not human mutant telepaths. I agree that Rachel, Cable, X-Man and Stryfe should obviously be on there. Apocalypse is not a natural telepath; I believe he got it through unnatural means. I don't think that we have ever seen Apocalypse ever use his telepathy, except for when Apocalypse telepathically defeated Jean Grey, but that was not fair since Jean Grey was in a state of shock. Can someone act properly when they aren't even thinking straight? No.
X-Man is really not that skilled and experienced. Even Apocalypse defeated him in The Twelve storyline. I believe that even Jean Grey defeated X-Man once, due to skill and experience.
Again, the list was not made regarding power, but only skill and experience. And yes you are correct in stating that it not completely accurate.
Selene should definitely be on the list of most skilled and experienced telepaths since she has a millenia worth of skill and experience practicing her telepathic powers and abilities, in addition to her other abilities. %Pr
"I assumed that the list only included human mutant telepaths in the X-Men Universe."
Why would you assume that? Exodus says "In all the world". That's a pretty big hole, and leaves room for other telepaths that aren't normally part of the X-Men's universe.
@cracks said:
" X-Man is really not that skilled and experienced. Even Apocalypse defeated him in The Twelve storyline. I believe that even Jean Grey defeated X-Man once, due to skill and experience."
You are overlooking a huge part of X-Man's history in his merging with his other self. He became more powerful and more skilled than any other mutant telepath we have seen.
@Korg: With the Shadow King it varies. He once held his own against both Jean Grey and Xavier in the Muir Island Saga, but then he lost to Psylocke, and then Rogue and then Mystique and Damask in the Age of Apocalypse storyline, so I think it depends what host body the Shadow King has.
X-Man at full power is not more skilled and experienced than Jean Grey is at full power. I am not saying that X-Man has no skill and experience though, so don't think that. More powerful? Definitely. Cable (at full power without the TO virus), Jean, Selene, Rachel Grey, possibly a blood lusted Xavier, all have more skill and experience than X-Man does in regards to telepathy. %Pr
Jean has been alive longer than X-Man. As a matter of fact, I remember Jean trying to teach X-Man, her "son," to properly use his powers. Jean performed the same "teaching" with Cable.
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