Me vs comichero75 (Batman vs Captain America)

Over the past few days (okay, months) now, I have been quarreling with a TROLL on YouTube. comichero75. He believes that Captain America is superior to Batman in most ways, and that he would DEFINITELY win in a fight. Do you agree? I don't. I'll tell you why soon but first, here is an argument I was in with him:

Him: You fan boys kill me LMAO. Caps sheild is not affected by magnetism. Bat is only smarter when it comes to solving a crime. Cap is a tactical genious.

Me: They are even in skill. But Cap has more stamina. Batman counters Cap's stamina because of his indomitable will which he will use to force himself beyond his physical limits. Cap has near indestructible shield. Batman has remote controlled and reverse batarangs to hit Cap from behind. Batman and Captain America are both conjoined no. 1 on my favourite comic book heroes of all time list. The fight could go either way in my opinion.

Him: Yea, nice fairytale. Caps will is equally stong. And not only that, Cap is tactically smarter than Batman. Cap will be moving too fast to any batarangs. And even Batman admitted to Cap that he will loose in a long fight against CA. All the gadets that Batman has wont equal the tactical genious, strenght,speed, and stamina of Cap.

Me: It's not a fairytale. Prove to me that Caps will is equally as strong. Prove to me that Cap is more of a tactical genius than Batman. Prove to me that he can a hear a remote batarang, which doesn't produce any sound, coming at him from behind. The thing is, if they got into a fight without prep, they would draw. With prep, they would draw. They are equals. If you can't prove to me otherwise, which you won't be able to do, I stand firm on my opinion.

Him:Cap is stronger due to the Super Soldier Serum, he can bench press close to 1 000 pounds. Cap lead miltary units in the second world war and he was the battle leader of the avengers for a heck of a long time. and his mental capabilites are also at the height of human perfection. The batarnag thing? it still has to move through the air, which it will disturb with its physical presents, which Cap will hear due to his senses. Batman fights like Batman, Cap fights like a Soldier.

Me: That did not prove to me anything. You did not prove to me any of the things I requested. Batman can bench press ABOVE 1000 pounds and so can Cap. But Cap CAN lift more than Batman. Batman has lead the Justice league for a while at one point. Batman's mental capabilites are above genius level intellect. What do you mean the batarang will disturb Cap with it's physical presence? Neither Cap or Batman have a sixth sense. Face it. Captain America and Batman ARE EQUALS. And the fight could go either way.

Him: Batman and Cap are not equals. Batman is nowhere close to Cap in strenght, agility, stamina, speed, and tactical skills. The only thing they are similar in is fighting skill. But Cap takes that due to his physical advantages. The only thing Batman has over Cap is crime solving. So Batman would win in a game of clue, Cap would win in Stratego.

Me: I said that Cap is physically superior to Batman. They are not similar in fighting skill. Batman will play dirty. He will cheat and break your arms if he has to. Even in a straight up fight he will. Being physically superior doesn't mean shit. For example Bruce Lee was taught by Yip Man. But Bruce Lee was not a great fighter at all. The only special thing about him was his speed. And in a straight up fight with Yip Man, Bruce couldn't even touch him because Yip Man was more skilled.

And from the last quote is where the argument is at now. Do you guys agree with me? Or HIM!?!

Tell him to grow a pair and join the site. 

@texasdeathmatch said:

Tell him to grow a pair and join the site.

TDM is calling him out.

I've always sided with Cap in the ongoing Cap vs. Bat debate.

I agree that Captain America is physically superior to Batman and that a fight can go either way (I scor it 6/10 in Cap's favor.) However, I disagree with you when you say that batman will "fight dirty" and Cap won't. Cap's a soldier not a Boyscout. Oh, and your opponent is a MORON.

Always took the Bat-side of the argument to be honest.

@progenitor said:

I've always sided with Cap in the ongoing Cap vs. Bat debate.

I've also always took the Cap side in this argument.

@SlimJ87D said:

@progenitor said:

I've always sided with Cap in the ongoing Cap vs. Bat debate.

I've also always took the Cap side in this argument.

This. Cap should theoretically be able to take Bats in a fight.

@Om4zd:

1. Cap is not as skilled as Batman is, he's done nothing to suggest he is. Even Iron Fist commented that his form is basic but he has incredible speed and stamina

2. Cap is no where near Batman when it comes to tactics and combat smarts either. Bats is intellectually superior to Cap in all aspects by a large margin.

3. Cap is physically stronger and faster but not to the point where Bats couldn't contend with him.

IMO this fight could go either way

And your friend is indeed a moron

I tend to flop sides on this fight. It could go both ways.

@Dex_Starr said:

@Om4zd:

1. Cap is not as skilled as Batman is, he's done nothing to suggest he is. Even Iron Fist commented that his form is basic but he has incredible speed and stamina

2. Cap is no where near Batman when it comes to tactics and combat smarts either. Bats is intellectually superior to Cap in all aspects by a large margin.

3. Cap is physically stronger and faster but not to the point where Bats couldn't contend with him.

IMO this fight could go either way

And your friend is indeed a moron

I fail to see how someone like Iron Fist, who has probably only worked with Captain America a limited of times compared dozens of others, can define his form as basic. On top of that, we've seen Captain America perform tons of advanced martial arts moves that exceed the basic strikes etc.

He might not know as much martial arts as Bruce does. Sure there's nothing that suggest he is more skilled than Bruce, but there's nothing that suggest he isn't as skilled as Bruce is. It's not the quantity, it's the quality.

Captain America.

@SlimJ87D said:

@Dex_Starr said:

@Om4zd:

1. Cap is not as skilled as Batman is, he's done nothing to suggest he is. Even Iron Fist commented that his form is basic but he has incredible speed and stamina

2. Cap is no where near Batman when it comes to tactics and combat smarts either. Bats is intellectually superior to Cap in all aspects by a large margin.

3. Cap is physically stronger and faster but not to the point where Bats couldn't contend with him.

IMO this fight could go either way

And your friend is indeed a moron

I fail to see how someone like Iron Fist, who has probably only worked with Captain America a limited of times compared dozens of others, can define his form as basic. On top of that, we've seen Captain America perform tons of advanced martial arts moves that exceed the basic strikes etc.

He might not know as much martial arts as Bruce does. Sure there's nothing that suggest he is more skilled than Bruce, but there's nothing that suggest he isn't as skilled as Bruce is. It's not the quantity, it's the quality.

So how many times does Iron Fist have to fight Cap to determine where he stands on the martial arts spectrum? Weather you can see how Danny can define him or nor is irrelevant, the fact is he did.

But you're right partially, Cap has performed a bunch of advanced martial arts moves, but no one excuse him of being a poor fighter now did they? Just that he uses a basic form. Danny was indicating that Cap, even though he's highly skilled, is accustomed to fighting martial artist that he physically outclasses.

I'm not sure why you're telling me that quality beats quantity because I haven't even mentioned anything about Batman's mastery of every martial arts style. Batman is a more skilled combatant because he has better skill related feats, and he has a better track record against skilled martial arts...who he DOESN'T outclass physically

There's plenty to suggest Cap isn't as skilled, mainly the 2 reasons I listed above, he doesn't hasn't beaten an equal caliber of skilled opponents [most of the martial artist that Cap beats, he PHYSICALLY OUTCLASSES, where Bats doesn't outclass his opponents physically]

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Also...Cap stated that Black Panther is his EQUAL in skill..and Panther sure as hell isn't on par with Bats in skill...

@steelhound56 said:

@SlimJ87D said:

@progenitor said:

I've always sided with Cap in the ongoing Cap vs. Bat debate.

I've also always took the Cap side in this argument.

This. Cap should theoretically be able to take Bats in a fight.

4thed

I usually take the Cap side for my own reasons.....Batman doesn't really have anything that would ensure a win over Cap

50/50

@Dex_Starr said:

Batman is a more skilled combatant because he has better skill related feats, and he has a better track record against skilled martial arts...who he DOESN'T outclass physically

There's plenty to suggest Cap isn't as skilled, mainly the 2 reasons I listed above, he doesn't hasn't beaten an equal caliber of skilled opponents [most of the martial artist that Cap beats, he PHYSICALLY OUTCLASSES, where Bats doesn't outclass his opponents physically]

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Also...Cap stated that Black Panther is his EQUAL in skill..and Panther sure as hell isn't on par with Bats in skill...

If IRC Cap when didn't have his serum anymore, and he took out Two (three?) Super Soldiers.

@cattlebattle said:

I usually take the Cap side for my own reasons.....Batman doesn't really have anything that would ensure a win over Cap

Neither does Cap, if he did then the fights would always go 10/10 for Cap if he's ensured victory

@nickthedevil said:

@Dex_Starr said:

Batman is a more skilled combatant because he has better skill related feats, and he has a better track record against skilled martial arts...who he DOESN'T outclass physically

There's plenty to suggest Cap isn't as skilled, mainly the 2 reasons I listed above, he doesn't hasn't beaten an equal caliber of skilled opponents [most of the martial artist that Cap beats, he PHYSICALLY OUTCLASSES, where Bats doesn't outclass his opponents physically]

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Also...Cap stated that Black Panther is his EQUAL in skill..and Panther sure as hell isn't on par with Bats in skill...

If IRC Cap when didn't have his serum anymore, and he took out Two (three?) Super Soldiers.

And? I'm not sure why this feat keeps being brought up. Just because their 3 Super Soldiers doesn't mean they have fighting skills anywhere close to Cap's. The only thing that tells me is that Cap took down 3 strong brutes.

@Dex_Starr said:

@cattlebattle said:

I usually take the Cap side for my own reasons.....Batman doesn't really have anything that would ensure a win over Cap

Neither does Cap, if he did then the fights would always go 10/10 for Cap if he's ensured victory

@nickthedevil said:

@Dex_Starr said:

Batman is a more skilled combatant because he has better skill related feats, and he has a better track record against skilled martial arts...who he DOESN'T outclass physically

There's plenty to suggest Cap isn't as skilled, mainly the 2 reasons I listed above, he doesn't hasn't beaten an equal caliber of skilled opponents [most of the martial artist that Cap beats, he PHYSICALLY OUTCLASSES, where Bats doesn't outclass his opponents physically]

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Also...Cap stated that Black Panther is his EQUAL in skill..and Panther sure as hell isn't on par with Bats in skill...

If IRC Cap when didn't have his serum anymore, and he took out Two (three?) Super Soldiers.

And? I'm not sure why this feat keeps being brought up. Just because their 3 Super Soldiers doesn't mean they have fighting skills anywhere close to Cap's. The only thing that tells me is that Cap took down 3 strong brutes.

That physically outclassed him?

@ReVamp said:

Always took the Bat-side of the argument to be honest.

@nickthedevil said:

@Dex_Starr said:

@cattlebattle said:

I usually take the Cap side for my own reasons.....Batman doesn't really have anything that would ensure a win over Cap

Neither does Cap, if he did then the fights would always go 10/10 for Cap if he's ensured victory

@nickthedevil said:

@Dex_Starr said:

Batman is a more skilled combatant because he has better skill related feats, and he has a better track record against skilled martial arts...who he DOESN'T outclass physically

There's plenty to suggest Cap isn't as skilled, mainly the 2 reasons I listed above, he doesn't hasn't beaten an equal caliber of skilled opponents [most of the martial artist that Cap beats, he PHYSICALLY OUTCLASSES, where Bats doesn't outclass his opponents physically]

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Also...Cap stated that Black Panther is his EQUAL in skill..and Panther sure as hell isn't on par with Bats in skill...

If IRC Cap when didn't have his serum anymore, and he took out Two (three?) Super Soldiers.

And? I'm not sure why this feat keeps being brought up. Just because their 3 Super Soldiers doesn't mean they have fighting skills anywhere close to Cap's. The only thing that tells me is that Cap took down 3 strong brutes.

That physically outclassed him?

Grodd's cyborgs physically outclassed Batman and he wrecked them with his bare hands...

@cattlebattle said:

I usually take the Cap side for my own reasons.....Batman doesn't really have anything that would ensure a win over Cap

Neither does Cap, if he did then the fights would always go 10/10 for Cap if he's ensured victory

@cattlebattle said:

@Dex_Starr said:

@cattlebattle said:

I usually take the Cap side for my own reasons.....Batman doesn't really have anything that would ensure a win over Cap

Neither does Cap, if he did then the fights would always go 10/10 for Cap if he's ensured victory

I never said Cap did.... -_-

If you're reasoning is Batman having nothing to ensure a win over Cap, but you agree that Cap doesn't either, why did you single out Batman? And not mention this for Cap?

@Dex_Starr said:

@nickthedevil said:

@Dex_Starr said:

@cattlebattle said:

I usually take the Cap side for my own reasons.....Batman doesn't really have anything that would ensure a win over Cap

Neither does Cap, if he did then the fights would always go 10/10 for Cap if he's ensured victory

@nickthedevil said:

@Dex_Starr said:

Batman is a more skilled combatant because he has better skill related feats, and he has a better track record against skilled martial arts...who he DOESN'T outclass physically

There's plenty to suggest Cap isn't as skilled, mainly the 2 reasons I listed above, he doesn't hasn't beaten an equal caliber of skilled opponents [most of the martial artist that Cap beats, he PHYSICALLY OUTCLASSES, where Bats doesn't outclass his opponents physically]

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Also...Cap stated that Black Panther is his EQUAL in skill..and Panther sure as hell isn't on par with Bats in skill...

If IRC Cap when didn't have his serum anymore, and he took out Two (three?) Super Soldiers.

And? I'm not sure why this feat keeps being brought up. Just because their 3 Super Soldiers doesn't mean they have fighting skills anywhere close to Cap's. The only thing that tells me is that Cap took down 3 strong brutes.

That physically outclassed him?

Grodd's cyborgs physically outclassed Batman and he wrecked them with his bare hands...

this is ture.

@cattlebattle said:

If you're reasoning is Batman having nothing to ensure a win over Cap, but you agree that Cap doesn't either, why did you single out Batman? And not mention this for Cap?

@cattlebattle said:

@Dex_Starr said:

@cattlebattle said:

If you're reasoning is Batman having nothing to ensure a win over Cap, but you agree that Cap doesn't either, why did you single out Batman? And not mention this for Cap?

Because its my own personal opinion, the fact is that no one can ever be right in this argument as the characters are fictional who fluctuate in skills and power level per story and round out to be pretty even anyways...

Ahhh personal opinion, the most cliche cop out on the forums, congratulations

He's right on some points but totally wrong on others.

Ahhh personal opinion, the most cliche cop out on the forums, congratulations

Batman beats Cap 6/10 due to utility belt.

Without his utility belt it's very close. Bruce is smarter and better fighter, but Cap is faster, stronger, and tougher. Batman's suit however helps him in taking damage, as we've seen him take hits from people like Darkseid. Even if Darkseid was holding back, that's still a nice feat of durability for him and the suit.

WITH the utility belt, there's enough options to give him an edge in the fight, especially since Cap wont see it coming. Bruce is a master of hiding what he's about to do til the last moment. A well placed exploding batarang, smoke grenade, flashbang, KO gas grenade, or something else like that can give him the time he'd need to get the advantage.

@cattlebattle said:

@Dex_Starr said:

Ahhh personal opinion, the most cliche cop out on the forums, congratulations

Okay, great an internet tough guy...love these types. I could offer a gigantic list of reasons for Cap, in which, you could offer similar ones for Batman, doesn't mean anyone's right or wrong If you really want to pursue this argument you should use the search engine as its been discussed a bazillion times without ever having a clear winner

I'm a legit tough guy, I roll through the hood puffin and passing and capping fools with my Nine

@Dex_Starr said:

@SlimJ87D said:

@Dex_Starr said:

@Om4zd:

1. Cap is not as skilled as Batman is, he's done nothing to suggest he is. Even Iron Fist commented that his form is basic but he has incredible speed and stamina

2. Cap is no where near Batman when it comes to tactics and combat smarts either. Bats is intellectually superior to Cap in all aspects by a large margin.

3. Cap is physically stronger and faster but not to the point where Bats couldn't contend with him.

IMO this fight could go either way

And your friend is indeed a moron

I fail to see how someone like Iron Fist, who has probably only worked with Captain America a limited of times compared dozens of others, can define his form as basic. On top of that, we've seen Captain America perform tons of advanced martial arts moves that exceed the basic strikes etc.

He might not know as much martial arts as Bruce does. Sure there's nothing that suggest he is more skilled than Bruce, but there's nothing that suggest he isn't as skilled as Bruce is. It's not the quantity, it's the quality.

So how many times does Iron Fist have to fight Cap to determine where he stands on the martial arts spectrum? Weather you can see how Danny can define him or nor is irrelevant, the fact is he did.

But you're right partially, Cap has performed a bunch of advanced martial arts moves, but no one excuse him of being a poor fighter now did they? Just that he uses a basic form. Danny was indicating that Cap, even though he's highly skilled, is accustomed to fighting martial artist that he physically outclasses.

I'm not sure why you're telling me that quality beats quantity because I haven't even mentioned anything about Batman's mastery of every martial arts style. Batman is a more skilled combatant because he has better skill related feats, and he has a better track record against skilled martial arts...who he DOESN'T outclass physically

There's plenty to suggest Cap isn't as skilled, mainly the 2 reasons I listed above, he doesn't hasn't beaten an equal caliber of skilled opponents [most of the martial artist that Cap beats, he PHYSICALLY OUTCLASSES, where Bats doesn't outclass his opponents physically]

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Also...Cap stated that Black Panther is his EQUAL in skill..and Panther sure as hell isn't on par with Bats in skill...

How does Iron Fist making an analysis become a direct comparison with Batman? That's what's irrelevant. I'd like to see this scan also. Just because someone has" basic form" doesn't retract from there their skill. It proves nothing at all.

I get what you're trying to say, that without him outclassing his opponents physically he wouldn't perform the same. Probably not, but he wouldn't under perform as much as you think. And it's true that Batman has more feats at his peak human level. But there still is no evidence that shows he is more skilled. You're main point that Steve isn't as skilled is because of his SSS so I will address that.

Something that you disregard, many of us see as a good feat when Steve was able to defeat 3 super soldiers who far outclassed him in strength, speed and durability. Bucky being as strong and durable as he is comments that Steve with the SSS was 3 times all his stats. Steve reverted bacl to his frail asthma body that hardly had any muscle mass. There's a good chance those Super Soldiers were up to 6 or more times stronger than Steve. Any strikes with his frail body that weighed about 90 pounds wouldn't be capable of knocking these guys out, and he had to use pure skill to defeat them. Go ahead, deny it took any skill to perform the feat. It doesn't get to my main point.

We hardly ever get to see Steve depowered, but when lost the formula he still defeated Crossbones without the SSS. And Crossbones beat the hell out of Bullseye making him have to retreat.

Now compare all his other fights with Crossbones and prove to me that his SSS made that marginal of a difference. You can't. The whole point of the story arc was to establish that it wasn't the SSS that made Steve a hero it was his will.

Don't try and downplay Crossbones and Bullseye either, every skilled martial artist in the marvel universe has some sort of power as well. Iron Fist with his Chi, DD with his senses, Gorgon with his TP, Mister X with his TP, Wolverine Daken Deadpool all have healing factors, etc. Maybe we should downplay all of their skills as well.

I already know you Dex, you're just going to deny it took any skill to defeat the Super Soldiers and just downplay Crossbones and all of his feats. So lets not bother. You have no proof that any of them are anymore skilled than the other.

I'd also like to see you debate on Black Panther and Batman's skills with Static or Morpheus.

Finally, take this for what it's worth for what ever time period this was Captain AMerica says he studied all the martial arts known to man.

@SlimJ87D:First, if you please put your future scans either into links or into thumb nail size, that would be appreciated, thanks

Now..

@SlimJ87D said:

.How does Iron Fist making an analysis become a direct comparison with Batman? That's what's irrelevant. I'd like to see this scan also. Just because someone has" basic form" doesn't retract from there their skill. It proves nothing at all.

Who said it's a direct comparison? It's a comment on Cap relying on speed and power over skill. No one is saying Cap doesn't have skill, the point is that Cap is accustom to overpowering opponents rather than outskilling them [other human fighters]

@SlimJ87D said:

I get what you're trying to say, that without him outclassing his opponents physically he wouldn't perform the same. Probably not, but he wouldn't under perform as much as you think. And it's true that Batman has more feats at his peak human level. But there still is no evidence that shows he is more skilled. You're main point that Steve isn't as skilled is because of his SSS so I will address that.

Something that you disregard, many of us see as a good feat when Steve was able to defeat 3 super soldiers who far outclassed him in strength, speed and durability. Bucky being as strong and durable as he is comments that Steve with the SSS was 3 times all his stats. Steve reverted bacl to his frail asthma body that hardly had any muscle mass. There's a good chance those Super Soldiers were up to 6 or more times stronger than Steve. Any strikes with his frail body that weighed about 90 pounds wouldn't be capable of knocking these guys out, and he had to use pure skill to defeat them. Go ahead, deny it took any skill to perform the feat. It doesn't get to my main point.

We hardly ever get to see Steve depowered, but when lost the formula he still defeated Crossbones without the SSS. And Crossbones beat the hell out of Bullseye making him have to retreat.

He wouldn't under perform as well as I think? Well I haven't actually stated how well I think Cap would perform against other fighters if he didn't overpower them so how would you know that? Do I think he would lose? Depends on the fighter...Iron Fist? Absolutely...again it depends.

People desperate to show off Cap's skill find that impressive, because I can tell you right now that Cap taking down those soldiers is NOT IMPRESSIVE. You're assumimg that because those guys were on the SSS that they had godly fighting skills, for all we know they could of have easily been 3 super soldiers with little to no fighting skills. There isn't anyway to gauge it. Batman has taken down Cyborgs with pressure points, that feat is more impressive than Cap taking down those soldiers.

Crossbones never beat the hell out of Bullseye either, he starting choking him until he got stabbed in the arm, then Bullseye left. Weather he could beat Bullseye or not is irrelevant anyway.

Am I suppose to be impressed with Cap beating Crossbones? I know he was depowered because he had a blood transfusion, I have that comic for the record. Cap is a more skilled fighter than Crossbones so naturally he should win.

I think that you're assuming that I'm claiming Cap has no skill, which I'm not even saying, so I'm not sure why you're showing me these scans.

@SlimJ87D said:

I already know you Dex, you're just going to deny it took any skill to defeat the Super Soldiers and just downplay Crossbones and all of his feats. So lets not bother. You have no proof that any of them are anymore skilled than the other.

I'd also like to see you debate on Black Panther and Batman's skills with Static or Morpheus.

Finally, take this for what it's worth for what ever time period this was Captain AMerica says he studied all the martial arts known to man.

Apparently you don't know me very well, because I haven't downplayed anyone, I've only spoken facts. It took skill to defeat the super soldiers, with an unknown level of skill, this feat is no more impressive than Bats wrecking Grodd's Cyborgs with his bare hands.

And unfortunately I know you, and know that you're notorious for putting words in people's mouths and twisting what they say.

I don't have to debate Black Panther's skill comparison to Batman's, Static's already admitted that Batman is a better martial arts.

Cap hasn't MASTERED every fighting form. But again, I have no idea why you're bringing this up, have I once said anything about Batman's mastery of every martial arts style? No, I haven't...

Now.....

1. You haven't shown anything to compare Cap's skill to Batman's. I've stated several of Batman's skill related feats.

Here, just in case you didn't see it the first time around.

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

Now..you haven't shown any Cap skill showings that match these feats that Batman's performed.

What you showed was Captain America beating Crossbones without the SSS even though Bats would manhandle Crossbones.

You know what's funny? Crossbones has almost beaten Cap while he was on the Super Soldier Serum. When Cap had to rescue Diamondback from the Red Skull they fought, and Crossbones ended up disabling one of of Cap's arms with a knife, the only reason he it didn't go all the way through was because Cap was wearing Chain mail.

2. So the best you could up with was Cap fighting Crossbones while depowered? Let's take a look at Batman's track record shall we?

Bane, David Cain, Prometheus, Deahtstroke, Wrath, Zeiss, Master Haim, Tsunetomo, Ra's al Ghul, Shiva, Bronze Tiger, Azrael, Owlman, Nightwing, Sensei

These are martial artist that Batman has either beaten or stalemated, and Batman doesn't physically outclass any of them except David Cain [who's old as hell] Nightwing [although Dick has him beat in agility] and Ra's depending on the incarnation.

So compare this entire list..to the one fight you have of Cap beating Crossbones without the SSS, and it's not even close.....

So if you want people to think Cap is on Bat's level of skill...show his track record..or show his skill related feats...that's all there is to it.

Ah yes, the "Captain America vs Batman" debate, up there with "Superman vs Thor' in the "longest running and most disputed nerdy comic debates of all time" list 
 
I've always sided with Batman, better martial artist, more disciplined warrior, and most importantly, he has better gear. But it is indeed a battle for the ages.

I'm too tired to go through the text above, but beating someone with Cap's stats is not really impressive unless they have the skill to go along with it. Crimson Commando has Cap-level stats and freaking Storm has beaten him. Killer Croc is stronger and more durable than Cap and Batman has beaten him with his gadgets, which I'm assuming he has here....

@Dex_Starr: The funny thing is that in the same story where Cap beat Crossbones without the SSS, he also lost to Black Widow and Diamondback while on the SSS. Up and down the showings go.

@CitizenBane said:

I'm too tired to go through the text above, but beating someone with Cap's stats is not really impressive unless they have the skill to go along with it. Crimson Commando has Cap-level stats and freaking Storm has beaten him. Killer Croc is stronger and more durable than Cap and Batman has beaten him with his gadgets, which I'm assuming he has here....

@Dex_Starr: The funny thing is that in the same story where Cap beat Crossbones without the SSS, he also lost to Black Widow and Diamondback while on the SSS. Up and down the showings go.

Well to be fair Cap was high on Ice and they even commented that his reflexes were dulled...

@Dex_Starr: Whatever dude, your main complaint was that Cap can't be considered skilled as Batman because of the SSS. There I showed that he obviously has skill without it and can perform well and has plenty of skill. It's going to be impossible for me to show more things with Steve depowered because he hasn't appeared that way as much as Bruce has as Batman and that's what you're riding on as a triumph card. But what he has performed depowered and even with asthma is pretty high showings making it impossible for you to claim if it truly is skill or just outclassing others in stats that either proves he's as skilled or isn't as skilled as Batman. We'll honestly never know.

Agree to disagree.

@CitizenBane: When he went to fight Crossbones he was serious and determined to prove himself. And he did.

This is pointless, a match up like is pure opinion, nothing else. So shall we compare cap to deathstroke? Sarcasm. Seriously, this is really opinion.

@Dex_Starr said:

@CitizenBane said:

I'm too tired to go through the text above, but beating someone with Cap's stats is not really impressive unless they have the skill to go along with it. Crimson Commando has Cap-level stats and freaking Storm has beaten him. Killer Croc is stronger and more durable than Cap and Batman has beaten him with his gadgets, which I'm assuming he has here....

@Dex_Starr: The funny thing is that in the same story where Cap beat Crossbones without the SSS, he also lost to Black Widow and Diamondback while on the SSS. Up and down the showings go.

Well to be fair Cap was high on Ice and they even commented that his reflexes were dulled...

He did fight and beat Daredevil in that condition, though.

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

@DrRenekton said:

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

How does Cap's shield deflect gas?

@SlimJ87D said:

@Dex_Starr: Whatever dude, your main complaint was that Cap can't be considered skilled as Batman because of the SSS. There I showed that he obviously has skill without it and can perform well and has plenty of skill. It's going to be impossible for me to show more things with Steve depowered because he hasn't appeared that way as much as Bruce has as Batman and that's what you're riding on as a triumph card. But what he has performed depowered and even with asthma is pretty high showings making it impossible for you to claim if it truly is skill or just outclassing others in stats that either proves he's as skilled or isn't as skilled as Batman. We'll honestly never know.

Agree to disagree.

@CitizenBane: When he went to fight Crossbones he was serious and determined to prove himself. And he did.

LMAO....ok....again.....My argument is that Cap isn't as skilled as Batman is because he doesn't have a similar caliber of feats.

You showed that he could beat Crossbones without it, sure...but how does Crossbones compare to the list of fighters I named? He doesn't, because most of them are as or more skilled than he is.

You're right about the fact that because Cap is usually on the SSS serum, it's hard to find feats to gauge his skill without it. But you don't even have to look at those, Why is it that Cap, even though he physically outclasses him and you claim that he has skill on par with Batman's, has never legitimately beaten Daredevil even though they've had 4 fights?

Ok, let's totally disregard the track records then because you think it's an unfair comparison...and use my other comparison....

Bats has disabled limbs, disabled breathing, erased memories with pressure points, and can even detect weak points in structures to the point where he can destroy cyborgs with pressure points. Other advanced techniques, Taoism, spirtual healing, vibrating palm technique, he modified Shiva's Leopard Blow so it's non lethal,

These are martial art showings that having peak-enhance level physical stats should have no bearings on. You show me Cap performing a similar caliber of skill related feats,

[he doesn't even have to beat anyone] and I'll gladly concede.

@DrRenekton said:

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

How does Cap's shield deflect gas? 

@CitizenBane said:

@Dex_Starr said:

@CitizenBane said:

I'm too tired to go through the text above, but beating someone with Cap's stats is not really impressive unless they have the skill to go along with it. Crimson Commando has Cap-level stats and freaking Storm has beaten him. Killer Croc is stronger and more durable than Cap and Batman has beaten him with his gadgets, which I'm assuming he has here....

@Dex_Starr: The funny thing is that in the same story where Cap beat Crossbones without the SSS, he also lost to Black Widow and Diamondback while on the SSS. Up and down the showings go.

Well to be fair Cap was high on Ice and they even commented that his reflexes were dulled...

He did fight and beat Daredevil in that condition, though.

Yeah but I don't think Daredevil was trying though...@KalTheHokage_2007 said:

This is pointless, a match up like is pure opinion, nothing else. So shall we compare cap to deathstroke? Sarcasm. Seriously, this is really opinion.

All fights are opinion, except for obvious mismatches like Spiderman vs Superman or Galactus vs Batman

@CitizenBane said:

@DrRenekton said:

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

How does Cap's shield deflect gas?

I said almost all.

Anyway I'm still 50 50 on this because there 2 of my top five characters.

@The Stegman said:

@CitizenBane:

@DrRenekton said:

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

How does Cap's shield deflect gas?

Or flash bang grenades, or regular grenades, or explosives, or sonics

I said almost all.

@DrRenekton said:

@The Stegman said:

@CitizenBane:

@DrRenekton said:

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

How does Cap's shield deflect gas?

Or flash bang grenades, or regular grenades, or explosives, or sonics

I said almost all.

We just named 5 things that Cap's shield cannot block. Name 5 things other than batarangs that it can.

@CitizenBane said:

@DrRenekton said:

@The Stegman said:

@CitizenBane:

@DrRenekton said:

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

How does Cap's shield deflect gas?

Or flash bang grenades, or regular grenades, or explosives, or sonics

I said almost all.

We just named 5 things that Cap's shield cannot block. Name 5 things other than batarangs that it can.

Challenge accepted

Bat-lasso, Bat-darts, Bat tazer, collapsible bat sword and the Bat goo gun.

Come at me

@DrRenekton: Don't forget Bat Captain America Repellent

@DrRenekton said:

@CitizenBane said:

@DrRenekton said:

@The Stegman said:

@CitizenBane:

@DrRenekton said:

I say Captain America because I mean caps shield deflects almost all of Batmans gadgets which means he has to H2H and with his shield he has a major advantage.

I give this 6/10 to CA

How does Cap's shield deflect gas?

Or flash bang grenades, or regular grenades, or explosives, or sonics

I said almost all.

We just named 5 things that Cap's shield cannot block. Name 5 things other than batarangs that it can.

Challenge accepted

Bat-lasso, Bat-darts, Bat tazer, collapsible bat sword and the Bat goo gun.

Come at me

None of those things exist apart from the taser.