Master Roshi vs Wolverine

Hand to Hand combat with equalized stats, no claws, no ki, and no healing factor. Takes place at the World Tournament with standard Budokai rules.

So this is about who has better fighting skills?

My bet would be on master Roshi

Roshi has the better showings of h2h skill, so Roshi takes this

And it starts again...

Master Roshi is far superior in martial arts. hes much older than wolverine and much more experienced

@darkelf35 said:

Master Roshi is far superior in martial arts. hes much older than wolverine and much more experienced

Wolverine is pretty old to

yeah..they are both pretty old Wolverine is 110-150 Roshi is 430+

@darkelf35 said:

yeah..they are both pretty old Wolverine is 110-150 Roshi is 430+

Where do you know how old Roshi is?

Roshi

They said it a few times within the series that he was more than 400 years old

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7GtE0BZXJA

This is dumb. You might as well have called this WWII infantry vet VS. Shaolin monk.

@jashro44 said:

@SlimJ87D:Yes but the op says no ki. martial arts in DBZ is about training your KI from what I recall. Without KI you are sort of taking away the DBZ characters skill (for the most part anyways).

Not really. Characters increase their ki to increase their stats, but h2h combat techniques are an entirely different focus. Roshi is a renowned fighter even without his stats, he's mastered numerous different martial art styles most of which he created himself. Ki techniques are handy, but they're only about 10% of your average DBZ fight, most of it is high speed punches and kicks.

Not to mention the fact that Roshi only knows two ki attacks either way (kamehameha and Bangoku Lightning Thingy)

Mutaito sealed King Piccolo a few hundred years before the series began. And Turtle has stated Roshi isn't dying from age anytime soon.

However Roshi spent most of his years watching porn and living in seclusion rather than fighting.

I change my mind. Wolverine.

@nickzambuto said:

Hand to Hand combat with equalized stats, no claws, no ki, and no healing factor. Takes place at the World Tournament with standard Budokai rules.

with no healing factor, Roshi stomps without moving,

why?......beause Wolverine will be dead old.

oh well just trolling, Roshi stomps he has versatile martial arts and also strength and speed even with equalized stats. he can knock him with one acupressure move.

Age/experience doesn't mean anything. Why people continuously use this as a valid point is useless. Why people think this is a straight up stomp is ridiculous.

@jashro44 said:

@nickzambuto:Akira Toryamma confirmed everything in DBZ is done through the use of KI. Its how they win battle according to him...

http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/88/t1330641-new-interview-with-akira-toriyama/

What's the trick to winning battles [in the DB world]?

A. Toriyama says it all comes down to 'ki', the size of it and the ability to control it. He says it includes several forms: genki, yuuki & shouki (energy, bravery & true character). You can only train your muscles to a certain point, it's 'ki' that carries you beyond that and what helped Goku come closer to being the strongest warrior in the universe.

We all know this, this is why dbz accused "false abc logic" but when it's between ~equal strong fighters, then they have to rely on skill and techniques. You can see it on the budokai tenkaichi fights. Being a ki user not close this case out. Also the stats are equal here, so they would use skills. Even in that interview AT says he watched a lot of Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan. It doesn't look me he wanted to make unskilled powerhouses.

Roshi is better in H2H, he should win after an interesting and good fight with Logan.

@god_spawn said:

Age/experience doesn't mean anything. Why people continuously use this as a valid point is useless. Why people think this is a straight up stomp is ridiculous.

if you mean me, i said i was trolling, but Roshi still stomp because he's a martial art master with amped speed and reflex, he can KO Wolverine with one acupressure hit.

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: I'm talking in general. Stats are equaled as per OP. Neither is faster than the other. And I could easily say the same for Logan. He's used pressure points at the very beginning of his fight with Thing in Enemy of the State (used his claw to do it) and he used one on Kid Gladiator at the start of their brief scuffle. Roshi hasn't shown anything to say he is the superior fighter here.

@Fuchsia_Nightingale said:

Wolvie, pulls up Psylocke's shirt up and Roshi loses

@god_spawn said:

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: I'm talking in general. Stats are equaled as per OP. Neither is faster than the other. And I could easily say the same for Logan. He's used pressure points at the very beginning of his fight with Thing in Enemy of the State (used his claw to do it) and he used one on Kid Gladiator at the start of their brief scuffle. Roshi hasn't shown anything to say he is the superior fighter here.

if this was Batman vs Roshi or Karate Kid vs Roshi it would be diffuclt to judge, but vs Wolverine it's not that difficult, with equalized stats it comes to martial arts, and Roshi was for hundreds of years the strongest martial arts master in the globe, Wolverine is not. most of his fights he rely on his healing factor and smelling factor while Roshi use hand to hand fight and don't rely on his Ki or special Ki technics until the oppenent shows superabilities.

Roshi

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: Just because Wolverine always relies on his HF doesn't take anything away from his skill feats. His feats are already close to Batman in terms of skill and without his HF he is more inclined to use his skill. It's been shown that way in the comics when he lost his ady and his HF became burnt out. He's already beaten characters like Iron Fist, Captain America, and Shang-Chi with skill alone and he didn't even have much of a healing factor during his fight with Cap. He's got knowledge on all human pressure points and even alien ones. He's used them relatively early in some of the fights he has so that is an option he has.

And being the strongest martial artist for years in a show where a lot of the martial arts constitutes as few pressure points and punching and kicking really fast and overpowering your opponents, I'm not convinced in the slightest it is enough to take Logan. I don't think Roshi would even beat Daredevil or Cap in h2h.

Master Roshi would break his hand trying to hurt Wolverine.

Wolverine easily.

@god_spawn said:

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: Just because Wolverine always relies on his HF doesn't take anything away from his skill feats. His feats are already close to Batman in terms of skill and without his HF he is more inclined to use his skill. It's been shown that way in the comics when he lost his ady and his HF became burnt out. He's already beaten characters like Iron Fist, Captain America, and Shang-Chi with skill alone and he didn't even have much of a healing factor during his fight with Cap. He's got knowledge on all human pressure points and even alien ones. He's used them relatively early in some of the fights he has so that is an option he has

as i said, Master Roshi was recognized as the greatest Martial-arts Master for hundreds of years, Wolverine has no martial arts state. Roshi's technics were the greatest H2H and martial arts techniques in all earth, he displayed high level martial arts in his fights : Jan Ken techniques, Bound Technique, Kame style Kong Fu, Drunken style Kong Fu, acupressure techniques, High Speed Rush, Hypnonis...

what established martial arts Wolverine has ?

@jashro44 said:

@nickzambuto:Akira Toryamma confirmed everything in DBZ is done through the use of KI. Its how they win battle according to him...

http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/88/t1330641-new-interview-with-akira-toriyama/

What's the trick to winning battles [in the DB world]?

A. Toriyama says it all comes down to 'ki', the size of it and the ability to control it. He says it includes several forms: genki, yuuki & shouki (energy, bravery & true character). You can only train your muscles to a certain point, it's 'ki' that carries you beyond that and what helped Goku come closer to being the strongest warrior in the universe.

Well yeah, but powering up your muscles isn't going to make you instantly know combat techniques.

Like I said, Roshi doesn't use ki either way.

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: Virtually all of them.

@Ferro Vida said:

@nickzambuto said:

Hand to Hand combat with equalized stats, no claws, no ki, and no healing factor. Takes place at the World Tournament with standard Budokai rules.

Master Roshi's fighting style enhances his physical stats. If you are going to take away everything that makes them who they are... I don't see the point of the fight.

Ki has no bearing on technique.

@god_spawn said:

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: Virtually all of them.

what do you mean Virtually all of them??? no place to imaginary assumptions please, we're talking by feats here.

Master Roshi stomps, he has greater, more versatile, more efficient martial arts.

@Vance Astro: I`m pretty sure he is, due to experience, skill, technique, and formula through the use of a stance in which there is a formation as well as confirmation of technique but Logan comes very close. If he isn`t better than Logan, he still however has the overall raw strength advantage but it would be a really good fight.

@Ferro Vida said:

@nickzambuto said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@nickzambuto said:

Hand to Hand combat with equalized stats, no claws, no ki, and no healing factor. Takes place at the World Tournament with standard Budokai rules.

Master Roshi's fighting style enhances his physical stats. If you are going to take away everything that makes them who they are... I don't see the point of the fight.

Ki has no bearing on technique.

Then why not pit Wolverine against someone who actually has feats free of Ki manipulation? If Roshi doesn't have the physical advantage that he would have had then he literally has no advantage, whereas Logan has showings of his hand to hand abilities even when he didn't have/use his powers.

All of Roshi's feats are free of ki. Roshi doesn't even use ki besides two attacks. I've stated this several times now.

@NeonGameWave said:

@Vance Astro: I`m pretty sure he is, due to experience, skill, technique, and formula through the use of a stance in which there is a formation as well as confirmation of technique but Logan comes very close. If he isn`t better than Logan, he still however has the overall raw strength advantage but it would be a really good fight.

you guys are hurshly lowballing Roshi, -_-

read OP : equal stat, means same strength too.

with equalized stats, it comes to martial arts to decide, and everybody knows who's the greatest martial art master here.

@All_Mighty_Beyonder: I'm not making imaginary assumptions. Marvel has him listed as being a master of virtually all forms of martial arts.

@Ferro Vida: Ki is not allowed within this scenario but through technique and prowess of physical progression, I believe him to be more stronger if not equal to Wolverine.