MARVEL VS DC READ IT

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bigcimmerian

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- DC is consisted of:

1) Black Manta

2) Lex Luthor with warsuit

3) Deathstroke

- Marvel is consisted of:

1) Green Goblin Norman

2) Iron Man Bleeding Edge

3) Captan America

- No prep, battle till death or KO, pre Flashpoint DC, who wins and why?

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Fallschirmjager

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#2  Edited By Fallschirmjager

You're not the boss of me.

Also. Black Manta is not equal to GG. And you need to specify if human or actual black manta version. Cos it matters a lot.

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#3  Edited By bigcimmerian

You're not the boss of me.

Also. Black MAnta is not equal to GG. And Pre-52 Manta is freaking useless.

Really? What about current Manta and Norman Osborn? Sorry I don't know much about Pre Flashpoint Manta.

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#4  Edited By Fallschirmjager

@bigcimmerian said:

@fallschirmjager said:

You're not the boss of me.

Also. Black MAnta is not equal to GG. And Pre-52 Manta is freaking useless.

Really? What about current Manta and Norman Osborn? Sorry I don't know much about Pre Flashpoint Manta.

I edited my statement a little.

Manta spent a lot of Post-Crsis as an actual Black Manta. This thing:

No Caption Provided

The interesting thing is, that form technically makes him physically equal to Aquaman - however he literally has NO feats against anyone else and I'm pretty sure he has zero feats on land in that form. So its debatable if he's actually better off as it.

He didn't go back to being a human until a lot later. I think GJ might have changed him or it might have been before that. But he spent like the entire 90's like that which is when Aquaman's longest solo took place.

Either way. human black manta would get stomped by GG and while technically actual black manta manta should stomp GG, but he has no feats outside of water ....so....

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#5  Edited By Spidey_Jackson

Marvel Team.

Beata

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bigcimmerian

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@fallschirmjager: You're underestimating human Black Manta. Current Manta can give Aquaman good fight, and his optic beams can hurt Aquaman and kill Atlanteans with ease. He's also very good fighter.

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#7  Edited By Fallschirmjager

@bigcimmerian said:

@fallschirmjager: You're underestimating human Black Manta. Current Manta can give Aquaman good fight, and his optic beams can hurt Aquaman and kill Atlanteans with ease. He's also very good fighter.

You're overestimating Black Manta.

People bring that "he fights Aquaman" thing all the time. It doesn't really mean anything. Him being able to fight Aquaman is nothing but PIS. They're not equal and they've never been equal. Black Manta is a human with a suit that allows him to swim deep in the ocean, that's about it.

His Optic Beams? If by hurting Aquaman you mean 2 point blank shots = barely destroying Aquaman's armor and giving him minor burns = then yes he can hurt him.

His skill feats are decent at best compared to actual skilled people.

I've read every fight Aquaman and Black Manta have had, except the pre-crisis ones (one time Arthur almost killed him btw but stopped himself). They're not equal dude. One real punch and Black Manta is dead.

Its like the Joker vs Batman. They physically fight from time to time, but at no point is Joker ever in a position to win. He gives Batman problems in other ways through his schemes and plans. In a straight up confrontation Bruce dominates.

Go look at Black Manta's feats and accomplishments. Really, look at them. He's done almost nothing. Certainly nothing compared to the things Aquaman does on a monthly basis. Have you read the new Suicide Squad book? Black Manta is nothing but a member on their team of street levelers. The problems he and they have are not the same things that Aquaman deals with.

Him "fighting" Aquaman really doesn't mean anything. He's a great character and I think he's vastly underrated but he's way overrated in combat terms. Fighting Aquaman doesn't mean anything. Hercules also fought Aquaman too, do you consider Black Manta = to Hercules? How about The Dead King? The Dead King destroyed a continent in 1 shot. Is he equal to Black Manta? They both fought Aquaman.

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bigcimmerian

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@bigcimmerian said:

@fallschirmjager: You're underestimating human Black Manta. Current Manta can give Aquaman good fight, and his optic beams can hurt Aquaman and kill Atlanteans with ease. He's also very good fighter.

You're overestimating Black Manta.

People bring that "he fights Aquaman" thing all the time. It doesn't really mean anything. Him being able to fight Aquaman is nothing but PIS. They're not equal and they've never been equal. Black Manta is a human with a suit that allows him to swim deep in the ocean, that's about it.

His Optic Beams? If by hurting Aquaman you mean 2 point blank shots = barely destroying Aquaman's armor and giving him minor burns = then yes he can hurt him.

His skill feats are decent at best compared to actual skilled people.

I've read every fight Aquaman and Black Manta have had, except the pre-crisis ones (one time Arthur almost killed him btw but stopped himself). They're not equal dude. One real punch and Black Manta is dead.

Its like the Joker vs Batman. They physically fight from time to time, but at no point is Joker ever in a position to win. He gives Batman problems in other ways through his schemes and plans. In a straight up confrontation Bruce dominates.

Go look at Black Manta's feats and accomplishments. Really, look at them. He's done almost nothing. Certainly nothing compared to the things Aquaman does on a monthly basis. Have you read the new Suicide Squad book? Black Manta is nothing but a member on their team of street levelers. The problems he and they have are not the same things that Aquaman deals with.

Him "fighting" Aquaman really doesn't mean anything. He's a great character and I think he's vastly underrated but he's way overrated in combat terms. Fighting Aquaman doesn't mean anything. Hercules also fought Aquaman too, do you consider Black Manta = to Hercules? How about The Dead King? The Dead King destroyed a continent in 1 shot. Is he equal to Black Manta? They both fought Aquaman.

But if he fights Aquaman and cause him minor burns, what will he do to Goblin who is infinitely less durable and much weaker than Arthur?

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Fallschirmjager

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#9  Edited By Fallschirmjager

@bigcimmerian: if he could hit him, it would probably kill him.

but he can't hit him. Manta doesn't have any exceptional marksmanship feats. Aquaman has had no problem dodging them, like I said during their fight Manta only got a shot in because it was at point blank range.

Gobby can just fly around and drop bombs.

edit. Also, his optics don't have very many uses before they burn out. He only can fire a few shots. During his fight with Arthur in The Others, he shot once at point blank range, did nothing. Shot again, burned away the armor and burned Aquaman a bit but his visor was cracking. A 3rd shot probably would have destroyed the helmet.

Its probably why he waited until he was face to face.

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Darkgenex

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Marvel team. I'd actually argue that Bleeding edge could almost solo.

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bigcimmerian

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#11  Edited By bigcimmerian

@bigcimmerian: if he could hit him, it would probably kill him.

but he can't hit him. Manta doesn't have any exceptional marksmanship feats. Aquaman has had no problem dodging them, like I said during their fight Manta only got a shot in because it was at point blank range.

Gobby can just fly around and drop bombs.

edit. Also, his optics don't have very many uses before they burn out. He only can fire a few shots. During his fight with Arthur in The Others, he shot once at point blank range, did nothing. Shot again, burned away the armor and burned Aquaman a bit but his visor was cracking. A 3rd shot probably would have destroyed the helmet.

Its probably why he waited until he was face to face.

I think those scans proved that Manta can at least hold his own against Green Goblin.

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@bigcimmerian: He went through a car, went through a wall and flipped Aquaman through some glass.

That's it. Nothing GG can't handle. And again, did you read those scans? Manta's visor was breaking after the 2nd shot. He can't use his blasts very much and he doesn't have any particular marksmenship feats.

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@bigcimmerian: He went through a car, went through a wall and flipped Aquaman through some glass.

That's it. Nothing GG can't handle. And again, did you read those scans? Manta's visor was breaking after the 2nd shot. He can't use his blasts very much and he doesn't have any particular marksmenship feats.

For someone that read Aquaman books you don't know much about Black Manta or hate him apparently,because you're lowballing him a lot....(sorry mate).

Black Manata doesn't have any problem to use heat blast at all and it didn't destroy the helmet (nothing on scans shows that),IRRC Aquaman break the helmet apart with the Trident (want scans?) Black Manta's diving suit enables to travel through the seas even in the deepest parts of the oceans as Atlantis,which indicates that suit enhances his durability (he withstood punches from Arthur) and probably strength too,because how he could deal with Aquaman? Apparently Arthur didn't holding back in any fight.

I'm not saying Black Manta wins,but he can't be underestimated like that. Also Green Goblin doesn't have marksmaship feats either.

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#15  Edited By Fallschirmjager

@matchesmalone21: No one is underestimating anyone.

Just because two characters fight each other does not mean they're in the same league. That's the worst logic around these forums.

Seriously. Go read Suicide Squad where Manta and the rest of the squad is on the run from a bunch of guys with guns. You think Aquaman would ever run from a gang like that? He wouldn't. You think Black Manta can fight Hercules and Swamp Thing? He can't.

Seriously. I dare anyone to actually go find a feat of Black Manta's when he's not fighting Aquaman that justifies him fighting Aquaman. Because they don't exist. He fights him because they are enemies, no logic of character strength is taken into account.

That would be like me claiming Aquaman can hang with Superman because he punches him 1 time, despite hte fact that Aquaman and Superman's strength feats are on a clearly different level. That would be like me claiming Aquaman is as skilled a fighter as Diana because he broke out of her headlock, when every feat we've seen from them indicates otherwise.

Goblin's marksmenship is irrelevant. Manta has no super speed on land that we've seen. Goblin is on a glider that can fly. Manta is going to have a hard time hitting Goblin. Goblin not so much.

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Yeah, manta is a miss match against GG. Other than that, Luthor and Iron Man are a bit of a toss up, and Deathstroke beats Cap.

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Marvel Team

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@bigcimmerian said:

- DC is consisted of:

1) Black Manta

2) Lex Luthor with warsuit

3) Deathstroke

- Marvel is consisted of:

1) Green Goblin Norman

2) Iron Man Bleeding Edge

3) Captan America

- No prep, battle till death or KO, pre Flashpoint DC, who wins and why?

1. Goblin.

2. I don't know about this one to be honest, lex hasn't really shown any real great feats with this suit like he did in the pre-52, except for taking a hit from mazahs when mazahs had stolen most of the crime syndicate's powers.

3. To be honest, the only reason this battle still goes on is because of the fans of captain america and them both being supersoldiers. Deathstroke is too much for cap, plus his armor makes it hard for cap to even make him itch when deathstroke was giving lobo a hard time.

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@fallschirmjager said:

@matchesmalone21: No one is underestimating anyone.

Just because two characters fight each other does not mean they're in the same league. That's the worst logic around these forums.

Seriously. Go read Suicide Squad where Manta and the rest of the squad is on the run from a bunch of guys with guns. You think Aquaman would ever run from a gang like that? He wouldn't. You think Black Manta can fight Hercules and Swamp Thing? He can't.

Seriously. I dare anyone to actually go find a feat of Black Manta's when he's not fighting Aquaman that justifies him fighting Aquaman. Because they don't exist. He fights him because they are enemies, no logic of character strength is taken into account.

That would be like me claiming Aquaman can hang with Superman because he punches him 1 time, despite hte fact that Aquaman and Superman's strength feats are on a clearly different level. That would be like me claiming Aquaman is as skilled a fighter as Diana because he broke out of her headlock, when every feat we've seen from them indicates otherwise.

Goblin's marksmenship is irrelevant. Manta has no super speed on land that we've seen. Goblin is on a glider that can fly. Manta is going to have a hard time hitting Goblin. Goblin not so much.

Ok mate. Won't argue anymore,bu again you didn't mentioned the suit enhance his durability. Why should take into account anyway,right? As you take into account he couldn't fire more than 2 heat beams,beside being tottaly wrong

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bigcimmerian

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@matchesmalone21: You should probably censore these f words before Saren see you :D

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@bigcimmerian said:

- DC is consisted of:

1) Black Manta

2) Lex Luthor with warsuit

3) Deathstroke

- Marvel is consisted of:

1) Green Goblin Norman

2) Iron Man Bleeding Edge

3) Captan America

- No prep, battle till death or KO, pre Flashpoint DC, who wins and why?

1. Goblin.

2. I don't know about this one to be honest, lex hasn't really shown any real great feats with this suit like he did in the pre-52, except for taking a hit from mazahs when mazahs had stolen most of the crime syndicate's powers.

3. To be honest, the only reason this battle still goes on is because of the fans of captain america and them both being supersoldiers. Deathstroke is too much for cap, plus his armor makes it hard for cap to even make him itch when deathstroke was giving lobo a hard time.

This is pre-Flashpoint Deathstroke. His New 52 armour and fight with Lobo is irrelevant. Pre 52 Deathstroke vs Pre-Current Captain America is a really good match-up that could probably go either way.

As for Luthor vs Iron Man...Luthor's Suit was designed to fight Kryptonians...so a lot of it's weaponry will be a lot less effective here. Tony also has a clear advantage in terms of speed and mobility.

I'd go with Goblin Serum Norman over Black Manta. As for Goblin not having any marksmanship feats...well he has been able to tag one of the most agile characters in comics who also happens to be a bit of a pre-cog. I'd say that gives him a leg up over a guy whose main enemy is someone that is not exactly known for his agility.

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bigcimmerian

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@shawnbaby: I don't know man, this seems like good marksmanship feat to me.

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What's current Goblin like?

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#26  Edited By Shawnbaby

@bigcimmerian said:

@shawnbaby: I don't know man, this seems like good marksmanship feat to me.

What...hitting someone at Point Blank range with a wide-beam energy attack? That hardly screams marksmanship. The harpoon grab is pretty good....but it's a stationary target and once again the range was pretty close.

What does interest me though is Aquaman Stating that the batteries don't last long. That kinda makes it crucial that Manta is able to hit Norman right away. Evry miss is going to be a huge drain.

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What's current Goblin like?

In his last appearance as The Goblin King he was cured of the Goblin Serum.

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@shawnbaby:

The plus side being that he was also cured of the insanity the went along with the Goblin Serum...so we can expect to see a lot more of Norman using his brain.

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@shawnbaby: dude, some of the stuff you said was valid, but I do not agree about cap and DS going either way. Deathstroke has been made to take on multiple meta-humans at the same time, I belive he went up against the batfamily once, he has made a fool out of batman more than once.

Regardless of it being new 52 or pre-52, deathstroke wins so hard that it isnt even funny. That match is just a mis-match.

And I believ that lex's battlesuit is more powerful than tony's.

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Shawnbaby

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@shawnbaby: dude, some of the stuff you said was valid, but I do not agree about cap and DS going either way. Deathstroke has been made to take on multiple meta-humans at the same time, I belive he went up against the batfamily once, he has made a fool out of batman more than once.

Regardless of it being new 52 or pre-52, deathstroke wins so hard that it isnt even funny. That match is just a mis-match.

And I believ that lex's battlesuit is more powerful than tony's.

Cap has also battled multiple metahumans at the same time. He's fought Spider-Man, who is a good deal faster, stronger, and more agile than Deathstroke. Cap is physically on par with Deathstroke and at least as skilled. It won't be an easy fight for either of them to win.

The Bleeding Edge suit is one of Tony's most powerful. He tanks Nukes in that thing. Featwise, Tony has Lex beat.

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@shawnbaby: cap has also fought multiple meta-humans at the same time, that's impressive, I'lle give him that. Just mention those meta-humans cap has fought against, I believe you, but I want to see their skill set and powers. The feat when deathstroke went up against the bat-family, shows his "power" that he is ble to think 9 times faster than a normal human and use over 90% of his brain. That feat also showed how good his combat was. I'm not saying it would be beyond easy for him to defeat cap, but it wont be hard either, he can use so much of his mind and think so much faster, given that he is a master strategist (I know that cap can think 10x faster than a normal human, and that he is a master strategist), deathstroke has more expirience thar cap and more military expirience.

That's just my opinion, though.

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@shawnbaby: fratwise tony has *new 52* lex beaten, pre-52 would take him out so hard that it ain't even funny.

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@bigcimmerian said:

@shawnbaby: I don't know man, this seems like good marksmanship feat to me.

What...hitting someone at Point Blank range with a wide-beam energy attack? That hardly screams marksmanship. The harpoon grab is pretty good....but it's a stationary target and once again the range was pretty close.

What does interest me though is Aquaman Stating that the batteries don't last long. That kinda makes it crucial that Manta is able to hit Norman right away. Evry miss is going to be a huge drain.

I wasn't talking about his energy attack. Harpoon grab is very impressive if you ask me. Look at the size of the target, and you can't say anything about the distance between the target and Manta because it's not shown here.

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What's current Goblin like?

Currently depowere by Green Goblin atidote in superior spiderman 31

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#36  Edited By MAZAHS117

Team MARVEL should win. Stark with Bleeding Edge is the mvp.

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@shawnbaby said:

@bigcimmerian said:

@shawnbaby: I don't know man, this seems like good marksmanship feat to me.

What...hitting someone at Point Blank range with a wide-beam energy attack? That hardly screams marksmanship. The harpoon grab is pretty good....but it's a stationary target and once again the range was pretty close.

What does interest me though is Aquaman Stating that the batteries don't last long. That kinda makes it crucial that Manta is able to hit Norman right away. Evry miss is going to be a huge drain.

I wasn't talking about his energy attack. Harpoon grab is very impressive if you ask me. Look at the size of the target, and you can't say anything about the distance between the target and Manta because it's not shown here.

Actually you can tell a whole lot about the range. For one thing, It's a wrist-mounted harpoon gun...the range is very limited. For another it's quite easy to tell that they are all close enough to have a conversation. And Aquaman is able to pretty much instantly close the distance between them.

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bigcimmerian

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@bigcimmerian said:

@shawnbaby said:

@bigcimmerian said:

@shawnbaby: I don't know man, this seems like good marksmanship feat to me.

What...hitting someone at Point Blank range with a wide-beam energy attack? That hardly screams marksmanship. The harpoon grab is pretty good....but it's a stationary target and once again the range was pretty close.

What does interest me though is Aquaman Stating that the batteries don't last long. That kinda makes it crucial that Manta is able to hit Norman right away. Evry miss is going to be a huge drain.

I wasn't talking about his energy attack. Harpoon grab is very impressive if you ask me. Look at the size of the target, and you can't say anything about the distance between the target and Manta because it's not shown here.

Actually you can tell a whole lot about the range. For one thing, It's a wrist-mounted harpoon gun...the range is very limited. For another it's quite easy to tell that they are all close enough to have a conversation. And Aquaman is able to pretty much instantly close the distance between them.

Those are comic books, grappling hook used by Batman couldn't lift humans in real life, but it does in comics, so it must be some special harpoon :P Scan 2 pannel 2 it looks like they are not so close to him, and Aquaman can appear like blur if he rly pushes himself.

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#39  Edited By Shawnbaby

@shawnbaby said:

@bigcimmerian said:

@shawnbaby said:

@bigcimmerian said:

@shawnbaby: I don't know man, this seems like good marksmanship feat to me.

What...hitting someone at Point Blank range with a wide-beam energy attack? That hardly screams marksmanship. The harpoon grab is pretty good....but it's a stationary target and once again the range was pretty close.

What does interest me though is Aquaman Stating that the batteries don't last long. That kinda makes it crucial that Manta is able to hit Norman right away. Evry miss is going to be a huge drain.

I wasn't talking about his energy attack. Harpoon grab is very impressive if you ask me. Look at the size of the target, and you can't say anything about the distance between the target and Manta because it's not shown here.

Actually you can tell a whole lot about the range. For one thing, It's a wrist-mounted harpoon gun...the range is very limited. For another it's quite easy to tell that they are all close enough to have a conversation. And Aquaman is able to pretty much instantly close the distance between them.

Those are comic books, grappling hook used by Batman couldn't lift humans in real life, but it does in comics, so it must be some special harpoon :P Scan 2 pannel 2 it looks like they are not so close to him, and Aquaman can appear like blur if he rly pushes himself.

They are all talking to one another and Manta is close enough to hear and be heard. That means they are within a fairly close proximity to each other.
Magic Harpoon theory doesn't work. It's still connected to his Wrist Launcher...you can see the cord.

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Team MARVEL should win. Stark with Bleeding Edge is the mvp.