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#1 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Who do you think would win if these two extraterrestrial powerhouses ever ended on opposing teams?

#2 Posted by Zenma (4970 posts) - - Show Bio
sighs......battle forums and what motivated you to make this tread?
#3 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

I've always had a lot of respect for the two titled characters, and I was wondering what other like minded people might think.

#4 Posted by Oluf_Von_Host_Museum (84682 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll go with Piccolo

Moderator
#5 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Reasons?

#6 Posted by Hedatary (3768 posts) - - Show Bio

Why make this thread when everyone knows who's gonna win.

Piccolo win.

#7 Posted by Oluf_Von_Host_Museum (84682 posts) - - Show Bio
Omega-level Supreme said:
"Reasons?"
Blast powers give him the advantage on ranged attacks and his hand to hand skillz are on another level. As far as minds go its debatable who has the upper hand there.
Moderator
#8 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Piccolo is a beast when it comes to fighting and hes powerful. However, why would it be such an obvious victory?

#9 Posted by Zenma (4970 posts) - - Show Bio

well if you're talking about piccolo beyond the namek saga then of course he wins, but if he's around dragonball (not dragonball z) then martian man hunter may win

#10 Posted by Hedatary (3768 posts) - - Show Bio

Because your putting a dbz character, a world shatter powerhouse against a martian who isn't even on the level of supes. This is a one sided fight.

#11 Posted by Zenma (4970 posts) - - Show Bio

mostly

#12 Edited by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio
#13 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Don't you think MM's mind reading abilities could even the playing field? He's able to phase through just about anything, he has strength and speed that rival Kryptonians, and shapeshifting and regenerative abilities that surpass Piccolo's own. I think he's at least a formidable adversary. Wouldn't you agree?

#14 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Don't you think MM's mind reading abilities could even the playing field? He's able to phase through just about anything, he has strength and speed that rival Kryptonians, and shapeshifting and regenerative abilities that surpass Piccolo's own. I think he's at least a formidable adversary. Wouldn't you agree?

"

Agreed.... However, it all depends on which Piccolo though. Martian hunter is probably in par with Nail Piccolo during the Frieza saga and Android saga.

But Kami Piccolo might be too powerful for Martian Hunter.


Here's some lesser known abilities Piccolo can do if you guys ever read the manga or watch the series. You know he can do these things.

Telekinesis abilities
Reality Warping Manipulation
Has the ability to see everything that happens on Earth in real-time
Has the ability to see in the future
Magic



Some more of the more known abilities:

Healing Factor & Regeneration
Extraordinary Superhuman Strength
Can control, create, and manipulate Chi (power within) & Kai (power channel from out source) or any other form of energy
His power level allows him to gather or generate and store that power without being killed by that power
He has virtually impenetrable skin
He can stretch his limbs pretty far
can split into multiples (magic)
or
can use speed to create multiples
He has super speed, able to move his limbs at lightspeed.



Now about his speed.... I don't know if you guys know this; but you know that white cape and turban Piccolo wears? The cape weights like 30 tons, while the hat weights like 10 tons.



I think Piccolo can grow really big; just like Lord Slug... But i'm not really sure. Lord Slug was an ancient Namek, but then again.... So is Piccolo.


Piccolo is pretty wise, and probably perhaps the smartest Z-Fighter of all. So he's not just going to  use all his finishing moves like Cherry Bomb,  Destruction Wave, Kisenko, and Special Beam Cannon. They take  awhile to charge; so he'll only use it after his opponents are at a weakened position.

I would say the best moves would be the scatter shots or homing blast. It's pretty cool to that Piccolo can create energy mind-fields and whatnot. He's pretty creative when it comes to manipulating his powers.


#15 Posted by Ripcord (1309 posts) - - Show Bio

Piccolo wins this for me.

#16 Posted by Lantern Prime (13044 posts) - - Show Bio

Picolo, he wiould either overpower him or slitz him. But it woul;d be a better match if this is the Picolo that fought Goku when he was teenager.

#17 Posted by T.J. Magnum (27685 posts) - - Show Bio
Hedatary said:
"Because your putting a dbz character, a world shatter powerhouse against a martian who isn't even on the level of supes. This is a one sided fight.
"

cough MM is on supes level,in fact he is above it cough

caption



#18 Posted by Lantern Prime (13044 posts) - - Show Bio

Actually he can beat Supes easily. But he still loses in this match though.

#19 Posted by Hedatary (3768 posts) - - Show Bio

Then why the hell are there so many goku vs supes threads?! If Piccolo could beat manhunter then shouldn't goku be able to beat Supes easily?! Whats up with this paradox!

#20 Posted by T.J. Magnum (27685 posts) - - Show Bio
Hedatary said:
"Then why the hell are there so many goku vs supes threads?! If Piccolo could beat manhunter then shouldn't goku be able to beat Supes easily?! Whats up with this paradox!
"

anime fanboys
#21 Posted by Lantern Prime (13044 posts) - - Show Bio
T.J. Magnum said:
"Hedatary said:
"Then why the hell are there so many goku vs supes threads?! If Piccolo could beat manhunter then shouldn't goku be able to beat Supes easily?! Whats up with this paradox!
"

anime fanboys"

Actually both DC and ANIME FANBOYS have been posting stuff like this for awhile.
#22 Posted by T.J. Magnum (27685 posts) - - Show Bio
Lantern Prime said:
"T.J. Magnum said:
"Hedatary said:
"Then why the hell are there so many goku vs supes threads?! If Piccolo could beat manhunter then shouldn't goku be able to beat Supes easily?! Whats up with this paradox!
"

anime fanboys"

Actually both DC and ANIME FANBOYS have been posting stuff like this for awhile."

well it's time to stop.
#23 Posted by Lantern Prime (13044 posts) - - Show Bio
T.J. Magnum said:
"Lantern Prime said:
"T.J. Magnum said:
"Hedatary said:
"Then why the hell are there so many goku vs supes threads?! If Piccolo could beat manhunter then shouldn't goku be able to beat Supes easily?! Whats up with this paradox!
"

anime fanboys"

Actually both DC and ANIME FANBOYS have been posting stuff like this for awhile."

well it's time to stop."

Yeah, neither side is gonna be move to the other side.
#24 Posted by T.J. Magnum (27685 posts) - - Show Bio
Lantern Prime said:
"T.J. Magnum said:
"Lantern Prime said:
"T.J. Magnum said:
"Hedatary said:
"Then why the hell are there so many goku vs supes threads?! If Piccolo could beat manhunter then shouldn't goku be able to beat Supes easily?! Whats up with this paradox!
"

anime fanboys"

Actually both DC and ANIME FANBOYS have been posting stuff like this for awhile."

well it's time to stop."

Yeah, neither side is gonna be move to the other side. "

true.
#25 Posted by Vrakmul (23642 posts) - - Show Bio

Whenever I see a DBZ thread storm clouds pop into my head.  

#26 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
Lantern Prime said:
"T.J. Magnum said:
"Lantern Prime said:
"T.J. Magnum said:
"Hedatary said:
"Then why the hell are there so many goku vs supes threads?! If Piccolo could beat manhunter then shouldn't goku be able to beat Supes easily?! Whats up with this paradox!
"

anime fanboys"

Actually both DC and ANIME FANBOYS have been posting stuff like this for awhile."

well it's time to stop."

Yeah, neither side is gonna be move to the other side. "


I think the victor only depends on which universe the battle takes place in, though. Wouldn't you guys agree on that?


#27 Posted by Hedatary (3768 posts) - - Show Bio

Thats a pretty stupid reason. Please don't start that universe theory again. Please

#28 Posted by King Saturn (224043 posts) - - Show Bio
Perfect Cell said:
"Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Don't you think MM's mind reading abilities could even the playing field? He's able to phase through just about anything, he has strength and speed that rival Kryptonians, and shapeshifting and regenerative abilities that surpass Piccolo's own. I think he's at least a formidable adversary. Wouldn't you agree?

"

Agreed.... However, it all depends on which Piccolo though. Martian hunter is probably in par with Nail Piccolo during the Frieza saga and Android saga.

But Kami Piccolo might be too powerful for Martian Hunter.


Here's some lesser known abilities Piccolo can do if you guys ever read the manga or watch the series. You know he can do these things.

Telekinesis abilities
Reality Warping Manipulation
Has the ability to see everything that happens on Earth in real-time
Has the ability to see in the future
Magic

.


"
What  ? Piccalo is a Reality Warper  ?
#29 Posted by brainiac 1.0 (4150 posts) - - Show Bio
King Saturn said:
"Perfect Cell said:
"Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Don't you think MM's mind reading abilities could even the playing field? He's able to phase through just about anything, he has strength and speed that rival Kryptonians, and shapeshifting and regenerative abilities that surpass Piccolo's own. I think he's at least a formidable adversary. Wouldn't you agree?

"

Agreed.... However, it all depends on which Piccolo though. Martian hunter is probably in par with Nail Piccolo during the Frieza saga and Android saga.

But Kami Piccolo might be too powerful for Martian Hunter.


Here's some lesser known abilities Piccolo can do if you guys ever read the manga or watch the series. You know he can do these things.

Telekinesis abilities
Reality Warping Manipulation
Has the ability to see everything that happens on Earth in real-time
Has the ability to see in the future
Magic

.


"
What  ? Piccalo is a Reality Warper  ?
"

Dont mind him he is smoking I dont think anyone was a reality warper in dbz.  Probably janemba but no one else.
#30 Edited by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
brainiac 1.0 said:
"King Saturn said:
"Perfect Cell said:
"Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Don't you think MM's mind reading abilities could even the playing field? He's able to phase through just about anything, he has strength and speed that rival Kryptonians, and shapeshifting and regenerative abilities that surpass Piccolo's own. I think he's at least a formidable adversary. Wouldn't you agree?

"

Agreed.... However, it all depends on which Piccolo though. Martian hunter is probably in par with Nail Piccolo during the Frieza saga and Android saga.

But Kami Piccolo might be too powerful for Martian Hunter.


Here's some lesser known abilities Piccolo can do if you guys ever read the manga or watch the series. You know he can do these things.

Telekinesis abilities
Reality Warping Manipulation
Has the ability to see everything that happens on Earth in real-time
Has the ability to see in the future
Magic

.


"
What  ? Piccalo is a Reality Warper  ?
"

Dont mind him he is smoking I dont think anyone was a reality warper in dbz.  Probably janemba but no one else."


No, Piccalo is a low level reality warper. He can create cars and clothes out of thin air. Janamba was the true reality warper of the series though were he warped all time and space with it's other dimensions into one clunk.




#31 Posted by Zenma (4970 posts) - - Show Bio

well piccolo wins lets end it there

#32 Posted by Wisppeons (3726 posts) - - Show Bio

mmhm Pic warped gohans clothes remember

#33 Posted by Akira Overdrive (10077 posts) - - Show Bio

I've always liked the namekean.

#34 Edited by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio
Perfect Cell said:
"Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Don't you think MM's mind reading abilities could even the playing field? He's able to phase through just about anything, he has strength and speed that rival Kryptonians, and shapeshifting and regenerative abilities that surpass Piccolo's own. I think he's at least a formidable adversary. Wouldn't you agree?

"

Agreed.... However, it all depends on which Piccolo though. Martian hunter is probably in par with Nail Piccolo during the Frieza saga and Android saga.

But Kami Piccolo might be too powerful for Martian Hunter.


Here's some lesser known abilities Piccolo can do if you guys ever read the manga or watch the series. You know he can do these things.

Telekinesis abilities
Reality Warping Manipulation
Has the ability to see everything that happens on Earth in real-time
Has the ability to see in the future
Magic



Some more of the more known abilities:

Healing Factor & Regeneration
Extraordinary Superhuman Strength
Can control, create, and manipulate Chi (power within) & Kai (power channel from out source) or any other form of energy
His power level allows him to gather or generate and store that power without being killed by that power
He has virtually impenetrable skin
He can stretch his limbs pretty far
can split into multiples (magic)
or
can use speed to create multiples
He has super speed, able to move his limbs at lightspeed.



Now about his speed.... I don't know if you guys know this; but you know that white cape and turban Piccolo wears? The cape weights like 30 tons, while the hat weights like 10 tons.



I think Piccolo can grow really big; just like Lord Slug... But i'm not really sure. Lord Slug was an ancient Namek, but then again.... So is Piccolo.


Piccolo is pretty wise, and probably perhaps the smartest Z-Fighter of all. So he's not just going to  use all his finishing moves like Cherry Bomb,  Destruction Wave, Kisenko, and Special Beam Cannon. They take  awhile to charge; so he'll only use it after his opponents are at a weakened position.

I would say the best moves would be the scatter shots or homing blast. It's pretty cool to that Piccolo can create energy mind-fields and whatnot. He's pretty creative when it comes to manipulating his powers.


Yes, piccolo has TK abilities on a very large scale. He was able to lift (I think) 2-3 pyramids simultaneously. I do not recall a time when he demonstrated TK in a fight, however.

Reality manipulation? No, Franklin Richards has RM abilities. Piccolo can transubstantiate materials, and materialize some objects. That's the power to transmute and matterialization, not reality manipulation. Don't see it being very effective in this fight. Especially not on the level he has displayed.
I wasn't aware he has 'tele-vision'... excuss me clairvoyance. I knew he could hear at superhuman distances though. Please provide an example to prove this feat. Thank you.
Magic is abundant in the Z Universe. It is also abundant in the DC Universe, an often delt with by high tier League members like Jon.
His healing factor and regeneration,  are very impressive. I would say it's a draw.
He does exhibit varying degrees of superhuman strength. MM consistantly exhibits Kryptonian level super strength.
Although he's manifest awesome feats with his Chi/Kai, it (chj/kai) is to obscure to categorize. Is it magical in nature? Is it something like the Power Cosmic? Or is it like teleplasm, the medium in which psionic powers are transmitted? Please try to answer this.
I do not think Piccolo skin is even semi-virtually impenetrable (if that makes sense). MM is practically invulnerable himself, however.
As I note before his shapeshifting pales in comparison to that of MM.
Clone and after image generation. These, as you know, can be a bonus or a detriment.
I concur he does possess the skill at super speeds. How fast he is, is arguable. MM also possesses super speed.
The weight of his attire is impressive. Apparently weighted clothes can increase ones agility and speed in the Z Universe. Not really anywhere else, but hey I'm not picky.
Piccolo Daimao was able to grow to colossal heights, there is no reason Piccolo Jr., virtually the formers reincarnate, can't do the same. MM can size-shift aswell. There is no advantages here.
Ma Jr. (Piccolo) may be the most wise and smartest of the Z fighter.  However,  power wise he is shadowed later in DBZ storyline. Which shows brains can't guarantee anyone victory. MM is NO SLOUCH when it comes to acumen neither. Bruce Wayne once compared MM to himself saying, "in many ways, Martian Manhunter is like an amalgam of Superman and himself." Source Wikipedia.org
Ma Jr. does have an advantage in the area of blast power.  While MM is only able to fend agaisn't ranged attacks with Martian Vision optic blast. They are powerful and precise I must add.
Ma has the upper hand in the field of Martial Arts mastery.
MM has several overlooked advantages, invisibility, intangibility and as I said before TELEPATHY. Which gives him the ability to predict what Ma is going to do (in theory) before Ma has decided to do anything.
Does anyone want to reconsider there position now?

*Note: capitalized words used to emphasize.
#35 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
Omega-level Supreme said:
"Perfect Cell said:
"Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Don't you think MM's mind reading abilities could even the playing field? He's able to phase through just about anything, he has strength and speed that rival Kryptonians, and shapeshifting and regenerative abilities that surpass Piccolo's own. I think he's at least a formidable adversary. Wouldn't you agree?

"

Agreed.... However, it all depends on which Piccolo though. Martian hunter is probably in par with Nail Piccolo during the Frieza saga and Android saga.

But Kami Piccolo might be too powerful for Martian Hunter.


Here's some lesser known abilities Piccolo can do if you guys ever read the manga or watch the series. You know he can do these things.

Telekinesis abilities
Reality Warping Manipulation
Has the ability to see everything that happens on Earth in real-time
Has the ability to see in the future
Magic



Some more of the more known abilities:

Healing Factor & Regeneration
Extraordinary Superhuman Strength
Can control, create, and manipulate Chi (power within) & Kai (power channel from out source) or any other form of energy
His power level allows him to gather or generate and store that power without being killed by that power
He has virtually impenetrable skin
He can stretch his limbs pretty far
can split into multiples (magic)
or
can use speed to create multiples
He has super speed, able to move his limbs at lightspeed.

Yes, piccolo has TK abilities on a very large scale. He was able to lift (I think) 2-3 pyramids simultaneously. I do not recall a time when he demonstrated TK in a fight, however.

Reality manipulation? No, Franklin Richards has RM abilities. Piccolo can transubstantiate materials, and materialize some objects. That's the power to transmute and matterialization, not reality manipulation. Don't see it being very effective in this fight. Especially not on the level he has displayed.
I wasn't aware he has 'tele-vision'... excuss me clairvoyance. I knew he could hear at superhuman distances though. Please provide an example to prove this feat. Thank you.
Magic is abundant in the Z Universe. It is also abundant in the DC Universe, an often delt with by high tier League members like Jon.
His healing factor and regeneration,  are very impressive. I would say it's a draw.
He does exhibit varying degrees of superhuman strength. MM consistantly exhibits Kryptonian level super strength.
Although he's manifest awesome feats with his Chi/Kai, it (chj/kai) is to obscure to categorize. Is it magical in nature? Is it something like the Power Cosmic? Or is it like teleplasm, the medium in which psionic powers are transmitted? Please try to answer this.
I do not think Piccolo skin is even semi-virtually impenetrable (if that makes sense). MM is practically invulnerable himself, however.
As I note before his shapeshifting pales in comparison to that of MM.
Clone and after image generation. These, as you know, can be a bonus or a detriment.
I concur he does possess the skill at super speeds. How fast he is, is arguable. MM also possesses super speed.
The weight of his attire is impressive. Apparently weighted clothes can increase ones agility and speed in the Z Universe. Not really anywhere else, but hey I'm not picky.
Piccolo Daimao was able to grow to colossal heights, there is no reason Piccolo Jr., virtually the formers reincarnate, can't do the same. MM can size-shift aswell. There is no advantages here.
Ma Jr. (Piccolo) may be the most wise and smartest of the Z fighter.  However,  power wise he is shadowed later in DBZ storyline. Which shows brains can't guarantee anyone victory. MM is NO SLOUCH when it comes to acumen neither. Bruce Wayne once compared MM to himself saying, "in many ways, Martian Manhunter is like an amalgam of Superman and himself." Source Wikipedia.org
Ma Jr. does have an advantage in the area of blast power.  While MM is only able to fend agaisn't ranged attacks with Martian Vision optic blast. They are powerful and precise I must add.
Ma has the upper hand in the field of Martial Arts mastery.
MM has several overlooked advantages, invisibility, intangibility and as I said before TELEPATHY. Which gives him the ability to predict what Ma is going to do (in theory) before Ma has decided to do anything.
Does anyone want to reconsider there position now?

*Note: capitalized words used to emphasize."



"I wasn't aware he has 'tele-vision'... excuss me clairvoyance. I knew he could hear at superhuman distances though. Please provide an example to prove this feat. Thank you."


Piccolo already has superhuman senses; and already can hear long distances. When he merged with Nail; This practically boosted of course. But he could not see things in real-time like King Kai only until he and Kami merged.

During the Android through mid-Cell Saga; Piccolo came to Kami demanding Kami merge with him to make Piccolo whole again. As the Guardian of the Earth, Kami has a much higher degree of magic manipulation and probably something like... "Holy Power"; which the current Piccolo didn't have.

While the Androids where doing their thing (which was driving around in a van having "fun") Piccolo was going crazy because he could not see the events Kami can see in real-time. (so much more Piccolo could not feel or sense the power levels of the androids -Which makes him more clueless about what's going on) In fact- kami wasn't even paying any attention to the androids at all. He was focusing the sights upon Cell's awakening (reading the future) and actually seeing Cell in action before any of the Z-Fighters knew it existed. (Tele-Vision).

Once Kami agreed to Piccolo... He took in those extra powers with the merge.







"Although he's manifest awesome feats with his Chi/Kai, it (chj/kai) is to obscure to categorize. Is it magical in nature? Is it something like the Power Cosmic? Or is it like teleplasm, the medium in which psionic powers are transmitted? Please try to answer this."


The power of Chi and Kai are of natural inner and outter power. I believe the term "POWER LEVEL" relates to the control & storage your inner chi which can hold, compress, decompress, manipulate from within you're own body and then release that energy without the worry of being consumed by that energy.

For instance: Frieza's "Death Ball" can consume and destroy planets. That power is eminating from his own body. Being generated by just his finger. But how is he able to stay alive holding that kind of energy inside him? His power level is what keeps him able to retain that kind of energy.

Kai power is the manipulation of gathering or borrowing or even absorbing energy from out side of your power source. Frieza can't do this, but Goku does it every time. "Spirit Bomb" for example.

Piccolo as of any or most DBZ character, mostly control natural power. Cosmic or Teleplasm are a part of this power. The only powers that doesn't really relate to it is Dark and Holy power... I ithink they are outside of the natural order power.







"I do not think Piccolo skin is even semi-virtually impenetrable (if that makes sense). MM is practically invulnerable himself,"


Piccolo's skin is pretty resilient and pretty much bulletproof, which is why i say.. Virtually Impenetrable. You can tell when any of the DBZ characters are bashed through buildings and mountains. The Movie below will pretty much show what Piccolo is impenetrable of. The only things that can pierce him are people whom are stronger than him.

Imagine an iron fist hitting an iron face at light speeds. Both would be damage of course, but the one whom receives the hit gets damage more. Now imagine a beam that can blow up an entire island coming at you at light speeds... The force would be much greater. Therefore of course whoever is at the weaker end of the beam will get hurt. Or... Penetrated.




  



#36 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio

You might want to skip from 34 sec to the 4th minute... That is; unless you want to see the whole thing.

#37 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio
#38 Posted by Conspiralcy (149 posts) - - Show Bio
Omega-level Supreme said:
"Nice rebut, but I have to ask...

"Cosmic or Teleplasm are a part of this power."

What do you mean by a part? Why isn't magic 'a part of this power'? What are the full applications of Chi, Kai, or POWER LEVEL? How does it effect , in your opinion, the outcome of this match?

Here is a definition of chi from Wikipedia.org:

In traditional , qi (; qi, ch'i hei; ki; gi; pronounced :  in ) is an active principle forming part of any living thing.

It is *requently translated as "energy flow", and is often compared to Western notions of or (). The literal translation is "air", "breath", or "gas" (compare the original meaning of Latin "breathing").

Frequently does not mean accurately.


"The only things that can pierce him are people whom are stronger than him."

I'll have to disagree with this stament. Based on the fact that he was penetrated by an imperfect Cell when the two first met. It has been established in anime and canon alike that Piccolo was more powerful/stronger than Cell on this event.

From http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Piccolo

Piccolo Jr. rushes to Ginger Town, the location of this murderous new enemy. The bug-like creature claims that he is Piccolo Jr.'s "brother", and the two engage in battle. Piccolo Jr. seems to have the upper hand, but is taken off guard when the creature launches a ; as he's dodging the blast the creature latches onto Piccolo Jr.'s back and stings his arm, draining the life from it and rendering the limb useless and withered. Piccolo Jr. headbutts the creature and breaks free but claims that with his injury he has been defeated, luring the creature into explaining his actions. The creature reveals his name as , and that he is a combination of Earth's greatest warriors put together by Dr. Gero. His purpose is to locate Androids 17 and 18 and take their energy so that he may achieve his "". Now knowing the creatures origin and intentions Piccolo Jr. exposes his ruse, tearing the withered arm free and growing a healthy one in its place, now prepared to resume battle with Cell.

From http://www.dbz.freeuk.com/info/theoreticalpowerlevels.html

Cell: 9,000,000
Kamicolo (Piccolo and Kami combined): 10,000,000
Cell (after absorbing Android 17): 16,000,000

Finally from http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChQWrWX-sGY and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCH1ajxt1XY&feature=related.  I'd post the videos here (Mr. Cool) if I knew how.

There may be more where that comes from (can't think of any at the moment), but I think Piccolo displays a high level of durability and recovery agains't injury that increses with his power level, but not virtually impenetrable skin. Back on point, Martian Manhunter is (or as near as a comic character can be, inconsistant writing) INVULNERABLE.

"
Can't he mind wipe Piccolo?
#39 Posted by Hedatary (3768 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay, first of all, the creatory stopped using the powerlevels after freeza saga and the powerlevels displaying here are all calculated guess. So you can`t use that since we don`t really know how strong the two are compared to each other. And if you say that Piccolo doesn`t have INVULNERABLE skin, then what does that make him


#40 Edited by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Can't he mind wipe Piccolo?

In theory, yes.

Ok, omit the power levels conjecture if you want. I posted two other sources to support my point. Refute those and we have a conversation.

I don't recall writing 'Piccolo doesn`t have INVULNERABLE skin'. I wrote he doesn't have virtually impenetrable skin. I already address what I think he has, 'a high level of durability and recovery agains't injury that increses with his power level. I capitalized the word invulnerable for emphasis, and placed it as an attribute of Martian Manhunter.

Your last sentence ask 'what does that make him'. I think he's/it's (that another subject altogether) a Namekian.

#41 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
Omega-level Supreme said:
"Nice rebut, but I have to ask...

"Cosmic or Teleplasm are a part of this power."

What do you mean by a part? Why isn't magic 'a part of this power'? What are the full applications of Chi, Kai, or POWER LEVEL? How does it effect , in your opinion, the outcome of this match?

Here is a definition of chi from Wikipedia.org:

In traditional , qi (; qi, ch'i hei; ki; gi; pronounced :  in ) is an active principle forming part of any living thing.

It is *requently translated as "energy flow", and is often compared to Western notions of or (). The literal translation is "air", "breath", or "gas" (compare the original meaning of Latin "breathing").

Frequently does not mean accurately.


"The only things that can pierce him are people whom are stronger than him."

I'll have to disagree with this stament. Based on the fact that he was penetrated by an imperfect Cell when the two first met. It has been established in anime and canon alike that Piccolo was more powerful/stronger than Cell on this event.

From http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Piccolo

Piccolo Jr. rushes to Ginger Town, the location of this murderous new enemy. The bug-like creature claims that he is Piccolo Jr.'s "brother", and the two engage in battle. Piccolo Jr. seems to have the upper hand, but is taken off guard when the creature launches a ; as he's dodging the blast the creature latches onto Piccolo Jr.'s back and stings his arm, draining the life from it and rendering the limb useless and withered. Piccolo Jr. headbutts the creature and breaks free but claims that with his injury he has been defeated, luring the creature into explaining his actions. The creature reveals his name as , and that he is a combination of Earth's greatest warriors put together by Dr. Gero. His purpose is to locate Androids 17 and 18 and take their energy so that he may achieve his "". Now knowing the creatures origin and intentions Piccolo Jr. exposes his ruse, tearing the withered arm free and growing a healthy one in its place, now prepared to resume battle with Cell.

From http://www.dbz.freeuk.com/info/theoreticalpowerlevels.html

Cell: 9,000,000
Kamicolo (Piccolo and Kami combined): 10,000,000
Cell (after absorbing Android 17): 16,000,000

Finally from http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChQWrWX-sGY and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCH1ajxt1XY&feature=related.  I'd post the videos here (Mr. Cool) if I knew how.

There may be more where that comes from (can't think of any at the moment), but I think Piccolo displays a high level of durability and recovery agains't injury that increses with his power level, but not virtually impenetrable skin. Back on point, Martian Manhunter is (or as near as a comic character can be, inconsistant writing) INVULNERABLE.

"



"Cosmic or Teleplasm are a part of this power."

What do you mean by a part? Why isn't magic 'a part of this power'? What are the full applications of Chi, Kai, or POWER LEVEL? How does it effect , in your opinion, the outcome of this match?




Cosmic, Teleplasm or any power which physics can define are natural 3rd dimensional energies, which exist on our reality. Neutron and Photonic energies are natural. The energies of the Magnetic Spectrum (Radio, Micro, Infrared, Visible Light, Ultra Violet, X-rays, Gamma Rays) are natual. Tachyon energies, Electricity, and Kinetic energies are all natural. The combination of all these natural energies is cosmic power. Teleplasm in a form of telekinese to the form of telepathic are of natural powers because anything that has to do with the thoughts of the mind relate to electricity, radio and their frequencies.

All of these powers most notably, the Magnetic Spectrum are also related to the cause and effect of:

TIME
SPACE
REALITY
MIND


Holy Power or Dark power is beyond that spectrum; however... They can effect the power of 4th or 5th dimentions.


SOUL
 -being the very basic of these two powers.




And this is were the "magic" of Magic Powers define from. Magic is the defiance of anything in Physical Science. Magic defies Natural order. For instance: Dr. Strange and Genisis (Sis-Neg) are very powerful Magic Users. They have power to even go head to head with Cosmic Being like Galactus, Shuma Gorath and Living Tribunal. And Live to tell about it.


Both Piccolo and Martian Hunter pretty much has all of these abilities. The only thing we have to know; is which one of them has a greater "storage" of mind and body to keep all this information and power within their own physical and spirital self (Power Level)







"The only things that can pierce him are people whom are stronger than him."

I'll have to disagree with this stament. Based on the fact that he was penetrated by an imperfect Cell when the two first met. It has been established in anime and canon alike that Piccolo was more powerful/stronger than Cell on this event.





I meant to say =In Par= or stronger... Piccolo is not by any mean invulnerable to beings like Cell, Buu, Broly, or anyone else who exceeds a power level greater than he is.

Remember how Piccolo was torn to shreds by 3rd form Frieza? I can guarantee you, the Piccolo who fought Imperfect Cell wouldn't even be phased by even 4th form Frieza at 100% power. If 4th form Freiza shot a full powered "DEATHBEAM" at Kami Piccolo, it would just blow him back, but not pierce through him.

Once again; That is the effect of POWER LEVEL. Frieza can destroy entire Planets, but why is he weaker than the Andriods? The Andriods were created with a much greater (but CONDENSED) energy and they don't get tired.

And that being stated proves that the more Power Level you gain, the more Invulnerable you get. Being bullet proof makes you invulnerable. Being smashed into buildings and mountains at 10,000 Miles Per Hour and your skin still in tact; pretty much.. makes you invulnerable...

Am i correct? Please let me know.






#42 Edited by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Concerning magic, I think the DCU would disagree with you.

Taken from:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Mxyzptlk#Powers_and_abilities
&
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Ching_%28comics%29

Mr. Mxyzptlk has access to fifth-dimensional technology that to third-dimensional beings may as well be magic...

I Ching is the last surviving member of an ancient sect. Their monastery was hidden high in the mountains and their task was to maintain ageless knowledge lost centuries past - a time when men foolishly concluded that magic and science are different. Only the sect knew that they are sides of the same coin.

Since you articulately described the Power Cosmic and Teleplasm with science, I hope we can agree that technology and science are both natural systems.
If you do concur, than the DCU includes magic as a "natural 3rd-dimensional energyies."

As for invulnerable. Words may be interpreted differently by individual to individual, with an acceptible level of plausibility.

I Google search Invulnerable, this is what I got.


Definitions of invulnerable on the Web:

  • immune to attack; impregnable; "gunners raked the beach from invulnerable positions on the cliffs"


I take 'immune to attack' as being able to withstand any assualt (regardless to the strength of the force) without sustaining any injury, whatsoever. Even to the point where One can take more than One can dish out. Since this is rarely the case in comics or anime, I'll say One has superhuman levels of physical tolerance, durability, or simply resistance to injury and maybe pain. By my definition invulnerability is limitless. By your definition unvulnerability can increase. By my definition invulnerability can not exist. By your definition Invulnerability can be measured.

I like your definition more. :)

#43 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Did you guys give up or what?

#44 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Did you guys give up or what?

"

Not really... Still here.

#45 Posted by Omega-level Supreme (1159 posts) - - Show Bio

Well this is old now so I give up...  how about that?

#46 Posted by Vance Astro (91196 posts) - - Show Bio

Martian Manhunter.Close thread.

Moderator
#47 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio

Whoa, I totally forgot about this... Give me until tomorrow; I'm about ready to sleep now.

#48 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
Omega-level Supreme said:
"

Concerning magic, I think the DCU would disagree with you.

Taken from:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mr._Mxyzptlk#Powers_and_abilities
&
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Ching_%28comics%29

Mr. Mxyzptlk has access to fifth-dimensional technology that to third-dimensional beings may as well be magic...

I Ching is the last surviving member of an ancient sect. Their monastery was hidden high in the mountains and their task was to maintain ageless knowledge lost centuries past - a time when men foolishly concluded that magic and science are different. Only the sect knew that they are sides of the same coin.

Since you articulately described the Power Cosmic and Teleplasm with science, I hope we can agree that technology and science are both natural systems.
If you do concur, than the DCU includes magic as a "natural 3rd-dimensional energyies."

As for invulnerable. Words may be interpreted differently by individual to individual, with an acceptible level of plausibility.

I Google search Invulnerable, this is what I got.


Definitions of invulnerable on the Web:


I take 'immune to attack' as being able to withstand any assualt (regardless to the strength of the force) without sustaining any injury, whatsoever. Even to the point where One can take more than One can dish out. Since this is rarely the case in comics or anime, I'll say One has superhuman levels of physical tolerance, durability, or simply resistance to injury and maybe pain. By my definition invulnerability is limitless. By your definition unvulnerability can increase. By my definition invulnerability can not exist. By your definition Invulnerability can be measured.

I like your definition more. :)

"

Abstract fifth dimensional space is just an imagination that humans can just dream of. We are 3rd dimensional being therefore we have a basic thought process of of ordinary 3rd dimensional beings. Time and anything Spiritual is roughly considered 4th dimensional. But 5th dimension in a very basic point of view is only a place a God would be able to exist and interact.

There are other theories of hypothetical extra dimensions beyond the 5th dimension all the way up to 11 to 24 different dimensions; but again, those are just hypothetical theories. We can't even understand the 5th dimension so who are we to acknowledge anything beyond 5th dimensional?

Even if Magic and Science are related to some degree. It still wouldn't change the fact, that 3rd dimensional beings with these powers and knoweldge would comprehend the 5th dimension and over. ComicBooks and Manga has the right to allow their characters to understand it, but in reality...It is just an Imagination by the writer.




As for the 2nd paragraph. There are so many types of invulnerability. Piccolo is invulnerable to bullets, getting his body tossed at light speeds and smashing into buildings and mountains and also entire Mountain Ranges. He is invulnerable to some degree to city/county/or state busting explosions. And he is just as invulnerable as they come. He is not by any means; as invulnerable as let's say.... The Juggernaut.

The Juggernaut is by Marvel definition: Totally Indestructible, unbendable, unbreakable, unwarpable invulnerability.


Piccolo is NOT as invulnerable as the Juggernaut.

#49 Posted by Lantern Prime (13044 posts) - - Show Bio

And charcters have been able to break Clasic Juggernaut.

#50 Posted by oldmagic (5295 posts) - - Show Bio

Just so you guys know, dbz characters can produce heat with there energy blasts. Piccolo could just burn MM with his energy attacks. There goes the battle.