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#1 Posted by Greendevil (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

I cant belive this battle has never been made??

Rules :

  • WIN = death by any means necessary
  • NO PREP
  • NO BFR
  • Bloodlust ON!
  • They both spot each-other from 1000 meters and engage
  • Location: Just outside our galaxy

Nova Prime

Richard Ryder has FULL Nova Force and Worldmind

Nova Prime

Martian Manhunter

MM pre-52 Is at full strength. But he is Martian Manhunter not Fernus

Martian Manhunter

Who / why / how................ wins this fight?

Enjoy!

#2 Posted by crackerjack82 (2606 posts) - - Show Bio

Hmm, sadly Manhunter, Nova is powerful, but he could phase out and stop him

#3 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

Nova Prime

#4 Posted by _Black (2302 posts) - - Show Bio

Most likely J'onn. I don't think telepathy would work on Richard. Nova's shields are formidable, but so is J'onn's strength. If J'onn couldn't break through them, he could penetrate them with his intangibility. With bloodlust on, I could see J'onn going for the instant kill with his intangibility.

#5 Posted by sandiego008 (3283 posts) - - Show Bio

J'onn should win this ....

#6 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

@sandiego008 said:

J'onn should win this ....

Why??

#7 Posted by WaveMotionCannon (5183 posts) - - Show Bio

Nova Prime can win this with full Nova Force and Worldmind could pull this off. I don't he'd be that vulnerable to MMs TP and Worldminds tactical assistance might put him at a distinct advantage over MM.
He can't match MM physically but he has enough speed to stay away from a bloodlusted MM.

#8 Posted by CapitolPunishment (2303 posts) - - Show Bio

The Martian outclasses him in almost every way possible.

#9 Posted by Illuminatus (9497 posts) - - Show Bio
@CapitolPunishment said:
The Martian outclasses him in almost every way possible.
Not too mention I've never seen Rich ever display TP resistance that would suggest is he is capable of resisting that of Manhunter's.
#10 Posted by geraldthesloth (33313 posts) - - Show Bio
@CapitolPunishment said:
The Martian outclasses him in almost every way possible.
#11 Posted by CapitolPunishment (2303 posts) - - Show Bio

@Illuminatus: Exactly, we can't just presume he has TP resistance because he has force fields. I'm not sure exactly what type of attack it was LMV hit him with in the Thanos imperative arc being that it was not well defined but it seemed like it mind raped both Richard and world mind in one shot. LMV may have just somehow overloaded him/it but that also shows that his mind is vulnerable.

#12 Posted by terry2012 (4812 posts) - - Show Bio

Martain Manhunter

#13 Edited by Greendevil (1938 posts) - - Show Bio

@Illuminatus: @CapitolPunishment: He resisted the creature that lived in Galactus ship that was trying to posses him. The one Surfer snitched on and Galactus vaporised. Also IIRC he also had some success against Ultron/Phalanx. IMO Martians TP wont affect him. The intangibility though, combined with his other Superman powers could pose some problems.

Novas durability is sick and should not be underestimated. After all he did survive Galactus rage. Granted Annihilus did also, but he had Quantum bands and the Cosmic control rod. He also took hits from the Sfinx with 2 Kaa stones!

Im leaning towards MM but i deff agree with this

@WaveMotionCannon said:

Nova Prime can win this with full Nova Force and Worldmind could pull this off. I don't he'd be that vulnerable to MMs TP and Worldminds tactical assistance might put him at a distinct advantage over MM. He can't match MM physically but he has enough speed to stay away from a bloodlusted MM.

And this

@_Black said:

Most likely J'onn. I don't think telepathy would work on Richard. Nova's shields are formidable, but so is J'onn's strength. If J'onn couldn't break through them, he could penetrate them with his intangibility. With bloodlust on, I could see J'onn going for the instant kill with his intangibility.

#14 Posted by MFrenzy11 (467 posts) - - Show Bio

nova prime got it

#15 Posted by HumanNumber (1466 posts) - - Show Bio

Unless Nova has some amazing tp resistance, MM puts him in a coma.

#16 Posted by Sethlol (1296 posts) - - Show Bio

@CapitolPunishment said:

The Martian outclasses him in almost every way possible.
#17 Posted by Simon_the_digger (2853 posts) - - Show Bio

MM

#18 Posted by dondave (34588 posts) - - Show Bio

Martian Manhunter ftw

#19 Posted by jobbernos (1420 posts) - - Show Bio

@CapitolPunishment said:

The Martian outclasses him in almost every way possible.
#20 Edited by robertloucksjr (1671 posts) - - Show Bio

Nova has Psi-Shields and World Mind to tell him that the attempt is being made. If World-Mind can find a way around intangibility, Rider takes this.

#21 Posted by Iragexcudder (4299 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not sure if Nova is immune to telepathy because of Worldmind or because of the helmet but Nova outclasses martian in speed and durability. If MM can use telepathy then he wins 10/10 but if he can still use his intangibility to phase in and out of novas blasts. I see J'onn comes out on top 6/10

#22 Posted by theDCkid (874 posts) - - Show Bio

Martian Manhunter wins, nova blasts would be innefective on J'onn.

#23 Edited by Killemall (18283 posts) - - Show Bio
@sethlol said:

@CapitolPunishment said:

The Martian outclasses him in almost every way possible.

#24 Posted by Doomnaut (1992 posts) - - Show Bio

Martian Manhunter wins in a good fight.

#25 Posted by New_World_Order (12570 posts) - - Show Bio

Martian Manhunter wins, but if Nova Prime gets the chance he can lobotomize him like he did Ego.

#26 Edited by ArrowRain (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Nova Prime for the win.

#27 Posted by CalebHara (2329 posts) - - Show Bio

Martian Manhunter outclasses him.

#28 Posted by King Saturn (223829 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't know if Martian Manhunter wins here...

#29 Edited by 18hunt (2891 posts) - - Show Bio

MMH

#30 Posted by Batman242 (4860 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll go with MMH.

#31 Posted by age_of_ultron_Prime2000 (1217 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Nova has a chance

#32 Posted by Ancient_0f_Days (11828 posts) - - Show Bio

Bloodlusted Martian Manhunter=Fernus

I'm pretty sure this is a mismatch

#33 Posted by izbighulk (598 posts) - - Show Bio

MMH ftw

#34 Posted by silverJuggernaut (132 posts) - - Show Bio

im going with nova prime because he has world minde with him.

#35 Posted by martianfrommars (15 posts) - - Show Bio

Martian Manhunter wins He is more durable,physically strong,faster,can turn intangable,has no weakness,can shapeshift,is one of the most powerful telepaths in DCU,can regenarate,never tires,is extremely intelligent and if he is bloodlusted he can just put his intangable hand through Nova's skull and turn super-dense until that happen though Nova won't go down easy

#36 Posted by SirNickTheEpic (589 posts) - - Show Bio

Nova prime has got this, in a good fight nova will over power him. Nova prime has proven he is more than a match for any power house (even silver surfer and superman) and putting him on a blood lust is just even more of a reason for Richard to win

#37 Edited by dondave (34588 posts) - - Show Bio

@sirnicktheepic said:

Nova prime has got this, in a good fight nova will over power him. Nova prime has proven he is more than a match for any power house (even silver surfer and superman) and putting him on a blood lust is just even more of a reason for Richard to win

He was beaten up by Silver Surfer

#38 Posted by SirNickTheEpic (589 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave: yes he was but they fought right in front of galactus the surfers main source of power

#39 Edited by dondave (34588 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave: yes he was but they fought right in front of galactus the surfers main source of power

Being in front of Galactus does not increase Surfer's power. Where did you get that from?

#40 Posted by SirNickTheEpic (589 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave: actually the surfer will drain from the cosmic pool and also nova was already damaged to start

#41 Edited by Iragexcudder (4299 posts) - - Show Bio

@martianfrommars: Nova is WAYYYY more durable than Martian Manhunter. Nova went through a series supermassive black holes and recovered fairly easily from it. He also crashed THROUGH a Neutron Star and continued to fight. Do you know how dense a Neutron Star is?

A neutron star is a sphere about the size of Brooklyn weighing as much as Earth.

Or

A grain of sand weighing as much as a Boeing Jet.

Nova is ridiculously more durable than J'onn.

Also, he's a lot faster than J'onn too. He traveled from Earth to Hel in under three minutes, which is roughly 3 times the speed of light.

His combat speed is also a lot faster than J'onns. While fighting Drax, he constantly evaded all of his attacks at FTL speeds. He was also able to tag Gladiator and Silver Surfer, of whom have microsecond reaction times (even though they beat him, but both were holding back)

Strength, J'onn has him beat on that.

Nova is immune to Telepathy.

Nova can channel blackholes that can destroy solar systems and gravimetric energy that can literally put J'onn in some serious trouble.

Novas energy output is INCALCULABLE. Especially with 100% of the Nova Force AND Worldmind, there's no easy way of J'onn winning this.

Intangibility isn't a factor here. Nova would win 8/10, especially when Worldmind can access Martians weaknesses.

#42 Posted by Saren (25314 posts) - - Show Bio

J'onn phases his brain out.

Moderator Online
#43 Edited by dondave (34588 posts) - - Show Bio

@martianfrommars: Nova is WAYYYY more durable than Martian Manhunter. Nova went through a series supermassive black holes and recovered fairly easily from it. He also crashed THROUGH a Neutron Star and continued to fight. Do you know how dense a Neutron Star is?

A neutron star is a sphere about the size of Brooklyn weighing as much as Earth.

Or

A grain of sand weighing as much as a Boeing Jet.

Nova is ridiculously more durable than J'onn.

Also, he's a lot faster than J'onn too. He traveled from Earth to Hel in under three minutes, which is roughly 3 times the speed of light.

His combat speed is also a lot faster than J'onns. While fighting Drax, he constantly evaded all of his attacks at FTL speeds. He was also able to tag Gladiator and Silver Surfer, of whom have microsecond reaction times (even though they beat him, but both were holding back)

Strength, J'onn has him beat on that.

Nova is immune to Telepathy.

Nova can channel blackholes that can destroy solar systems and gravimetric energy that can literally put J'onn in some serious trouble.

Novas energy output is INCALCULABLE. Especially with 100% of the Nova Force AND Worldmind, there's no easy way of J'onn winning this.

Intangibility isn't a factor here. Nova would win 8/10, especially when Worldmind can access Martians weaknesses.

Nova didn't avoid his attacks at FTL speed, all he did was show that he has super-speed there was no indication that he used FTL Reactions to do so.

Thor has been able to fight evenly with Silver Surfer and Gladiator even though his reaction speed is pitiful. Fighting someone who has high reaction speed doesn't mean anything if they don't use said speed against you. I could fight Wally West if he decided not to use his speed against me, it doesn't mean I'm as fast as him. Also, he could barely see Silver Surfer, he originally thought he was an energy blast from Galactus.

How would Worldmind know Martian Manhunter's weakness, he not part of MU therefore, Worldmind wouldn't have any data on races native to the DCU.

Why won't intangibility be a factor?

Travel Speed doesn't actually mean much unless they want to chase each other or one decides to run away

#44 Posted by homicidalmaniac (6824 posts) - - Show Bio
#45 Posted by Iragexcudder (4299 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

@iragexcudder said:

@martianfrommars: Nova is WAYYYY more durable than Martian Manhunter. Nova went through a series supermassive black holes and recovered fairly easily from it. He also crashed THROUGH a Neutron Star and continued to fight. Do you know how dense a Neutron Star is?

A neutron star is a sphere about the size of Brooklyn weighing as much as Earth.

Or

A grain of sand weighing as much as a Boeing Jet.

Nova is ridiculously more durable than J'onn.

Also, he's a lot faster than J'onn too. He traveled from Earth to Hel in under three minutes, which is roughly 3 times the speed of light.

His combat speed is also a lot faster than J'onns. While fighting Drax, he constantly evaded all of his attacks at FTL speeds. He was also able to tag Gladiator and Silver Surfer, of whom have microsecond reaction times (even though they beat him, but both were holding back)

Strength, J'onn has him beat on that.

Nova is immune to Telepathy.

Nova can channel blackholes that can destroy solar systems and gravimetric energy that can literally put J'onn in some serious trouble.

Novas energy output is INCALCULABLE. Especially with 100% of the Nova Force AND Worldmind, there's no easy way of J'onn winning this.

Intangibility isn't a factor here. Nova would win 8/10, especially when Worldmind can access Martians weaknesses.

Nova didn't avoid his attacks at FTL speed, all he did was show that he has super-speed there was no indication that he used FTL Reactions to do so.

Thor has been able to fight evenly with Silver Surfer and Gladiator even though his reaction speed is pitiful. Fighting someone who has high reaction speed doesn't mean anything if they don't use said speed against you. I could fight Wally West if he decided not to use his speed against me, it doesn't mean I'm as fast as him. Also, he could barely see Silver Surfer, he originally thought he was an energy blast from Galactus.

How would Worldmind know Martian Manhunter's weakness, he not part of MU therefore, Worldmind wouldn't have any data on races native to the DCU.

Why won't intangibility be a factor?

Travel Speed doesn't actually mean much unless they want to chase each other or one decides to run away

Define how fast super speed is?

Reaction times are everything, thats what makes Wally West so powerful, because he can hit you and react faster than you can process thought. That about you fighting Wally West is absurd. I could fight Superman if he decided not to use his strength too, do you think thatll happen??

  1. How would Worldmind know Martian Manhunter's weakness, he not part of MU therefore, Worldmind wouldn't have any data on races native to the DCU.

Okay, first off, you have a lack of imagination for even saything this. Worldmind senses everything, every detail about someone. Every possible calculation, energy output, weakness, thought, power and speed of the character Nova is fighting. Worldmind is also a supercomputer, whose data is entirely comprised of the experiences, histories, and personalities of deceased members of the Nova Corps. Worldmind would have to see J'onn for a second to know what to do to him.

Nova has a FORCE OF THE UNIVERSE at his disposal. Opening Stargates and blackhole would definitely do some damage to J'onn.

Martian Manhunter wins He is more durable,physically strong,faster,can turn intangable,has no weakness,can shapeshift,is one of the most powerful telepaths in DCU,can regenarate,never tires,is extremely intelligent and if he is bloodlusted he can just put his intangable hand through Nova's skull and turn super-dense until that happen though Nova won't go down easy

Nowhere near more durable.

Stronger, yes.

Faster, no. I havent seen any Manhunter speed feats.

Nova is immune to telepathy.

Nova has one of the fastest regeneration of any character in marvel. After going through a series of black holes, he was completely healed in a matter of hours.

Worldmind has been around for thousands of thousands of years. He is also, very intelligent.

So him being bloodlusted, Nova would just allow him to walk on up to him and phase through his head? I didnt know that a bloodlust Nova Prime would allow that.

@floopay id like to hear your take on this also

#46 Edited by Saren (25314 posts) - - Show Bio

Also, he's a lot faster than J'onn too. He traveled from Earth to Hel in under three minutes, which is roughly 3 times the speed of light.

His combat speed is also a lot faster than J'onns. While fighting Drax, he constantly evaded all of his attacks at FTL speeds. He was also able to tag Gladiator and Silver Surfer, of whom have microsecond reaction times (even though they beat him, but both were holding back)

Pretty sure you meant "Hala", not "Hel", and J'onn has covered light-years with his flight. 3 times the speed of light is hardly anything in comparison, and your calculations are wrong anyway. The Drax statement is false as far as claiming that Nova was dodging at "FTL speeds" goes, and if fighting fast people is supposed to proof of reaction time, Martian Manhunter has matched combat speeds with Barry Allen twice. Barry has attosecond reaction time. He reacts literally millions of times faster than Gladiator and Surfer.

Okay, first off, you have a lack of imagination for even saything this. Worldmind senses everything, every detail about someone. Every possible calculation, energy output, weakness, thought, power and speed of the character Nova is fighting. Worldmind is also a supercomputer, whose data is entirely comprised of the experiences, histories, and personalities of deceased members of the Nova Corps. Worldmind would have to see J'onn for a second to know what to do to him.

Lack of imagination? LOL. Your empty speculation isn't imagination, it's just empty speculation. Worldmind has never met a Martian in its existence. It's not going to just automatically know the weaknesses of aliens from another multiverse. Don't make stuff up and accuse people of lacking imagination.

So him being bloodlusted, Nova would just allow him to walk on up to him and phase through his head? I didnt know that a bloodlust Nova Prime would allow that.

It's not so much a matter of permission as it is of capability. What exactly is he going to do when J'onn goes intangible, phases a hand into Rider's skull and removes his brain? Be bloodlusted?

Moderator Online
#47 Edited by dondave (34588 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

@iragexcudder said:

@martianfrommars: Nova is WAYYYY more durable than Martian Manhunter. Nova went through a series supermassive black holes and recovered fairly easily from it. He also crashed THROUGH a Neutron Star and continued to fight. Do you know how dense a Neutron Star is?

A neutron star is a sphere about the size of Brooklyn weighing as much as Earth.

Or

A grain of sand weighing as much as a Boeing Jet.

Nova is ridiculously more durable than J'onn.

Also, he's a lot faster than J'onn too. He traveled from Earth to Hel in under three minutes, which is roughly 3 times the speed of light.

His combat speed is also a lot faster than J'onns. While fighting Drax, he constantly evaded all of his attacks at FTL speeds. He was also able to tag Gladiator and Silver Surfer, of whom have microsecond reaction times (even though they beat him, but both were holding back)

Strength, J'onn has him beat on that.

Nova is immune to Telepathy.

Nova can channel blackholes that can destroy solar systems and gravimetric energy that can literally put J'onn in some serious trouble.

Novas energy output is INCALCULABLE. Especially with 100% of the Nova Force AND Worldmind, there's no easy way of J'onn winning this.

Intangibility isn't a factor here. Nova would win 8/10, especially when Worldmind can access Martians weaknesses.

Nova didn't avoid his attacks at FTL speed, all he did was show that he has super-speed there was no indication that he used FTL Reactions to do so.

Thor has been able to fight evenly with Silver Surfer and Gladiator even though his reaction speed is pitiful. Fighting someone who has high reaction speed doesn't mean anything if they don't use said speed against you. I could fight Wally West if he decided not to use his speed against me, it doesn't mean I'm as fast as him. Also, he could barely see Silver Surfer, he originally thought he was an energy blast from Galactus.

How would Worldmind know Martian Manhunter's weakness, he not part of MU therefore, Worldmind wouldn't have any data on races native to the DCU.

Why won't intangibility be a factor?

Travel Speed doesn't actually mean much unless they want to chase each other or one decides to run away

Define how fast super speed is?

Reaction times are everything, thats what makes Wally West so powerful, because he can hit you and react faster than you can process thought. That about you fighting Wally West is absurd. I could fight Superman if he decided not to use his strength too, do you think thatll happen??

  1. How would Worldmind know Martian Manhunter's weakness, he not part of MU therefore, Worldmind wouldn't have any data on races native to the DCU.

Okay, first off, you have a lack of imagination for even saything this. Worldmind senses everything, every detail about someone. Every possible calculation, energy output, weakness, thought, power and speed of the character Nova is fighting. Worldmind is also a supercomputer, whose data is entirely comprised of the experiences, histories, and personalities of deceased members of the Nova Corps. Worldmind would have to see J'onn for a second to know what to do to him.

Nova has a FORCE OF THE UNIVERSE at his disposal. Opening Stargates and blackhole would definitely do some damage to J'onn.

I don't think your understanding what I'm saying. You based that Richard has fast reaction times because he fought people who have high reaction times. However, that doesn't mean anything if they don't their speed against you. Hence, why I used the Flash example. I obviously have no chance of touching or reacting to the Flash if he was using his speed, but if he slowed himself down to human levels I would be able to react to him. That is the same with slower characters fighting faster opponents, Thor does the same but nobody would suggest he's as fast as Silver Surfer or Gladiator.

As you've said Worldmind has a vast amount of knowledge because he's come in contact with it before or has databases on it. Martians from the DC Universe haven't been in MU in any canon story, there would therefore be no database's for him to gain such knowledge of Martian abilities and weaknesses.

How is Nova's healing factor better than Martian Manhunter's, he's healed his entire body from an arm, reformed his body from a smear while inside a Volcano and he's also healed form being cut up into pieces by Wonder Woman's Lasso.

#48 Posted by dondave (34588 posts) - - Show Bio

@martianfrommars: Nova is WAYYYY more durable than Martian Manhunter. Nova went through a series supermassive black holes and recovered fairly easily from it. He also crashed THROUGH a Neutron Star and continued to fight. Do you know how dense a Neutron Star is?

A neutron star is a sphere about the size of Brooklyn weighing as much as Earth.

Or

A grain of sand weighing as much as a Boeing Jet.

Nova is ridiculously more durable than J'onn.

Also, he's a lot faster than J'onn too. He traveled from Earth to Hel in under three minutes, which is roughly 3 times the speed of light.

His combat speed is also a lot faster than J'onns. While fighting Drax, he constantly evaded all of his attacks at FTL speeds. He was also able to tag Gladiator and Silver Surfer, of whom have microsecond reaction times (even though they beat him, but both were holding back)

Strength, J'onn has him beat on that.

Nova is immune to Telepathy.

Nova can channel blackholes that can destroy solar systems and gravimetric energy that can literally put J'onn in some serious trouble.

Novas energy output is INCALCULABLE. Especially with 100% of the Nova Force AND Worldmind, there's no easy way of J'onn winning this.

Intangibility isn't a factor here. Nova would win 8/10, especially when Worldmind can access Martians weaknesses.

That was through a Stargate

#49 Posted by patrat18 (8919 posts) - - Show Bio

MM has this he has plenty of ways to take out nova

#50 Posted by Megatronus_Prime (57 posts) - - Show Bio

nova prime