Mara Jade Skywalker vs Shaak Ti

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TheVivas

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#1  Edited By TheVivas
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New canon and Legends feats count. Latest versions of each character(basically each at the time of their deaths). Random encounter and both in character. Fight starts 25 feet away on board the Anakin Solo, specifically the bridge area. Who comes out on top? Win by death or incapacitation.

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nerdchore

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Im thinking mara wins majority here.

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ShootingNova

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#3  Edited By ShootingNova

Ah, bon.

Mara is more skilful. Shaak has almost no realistic, non-circumstantial feats, to be honest. She was wrecked by Grievous twice, but in both scenarios, she was not in peak physicality, though I doubt that if she was, she would be able to properly compete with him anyways. She was also driven off by Anakin who was already seemingly hindered to some degree. As for the often-cited feat of contending with the numerous Magnaguards, that was entirely circumstantial. To begin with, during the entire chase, Shaak never even defeated a single Magnaguard via raw skill. She had difficulty with a single one and she relied on it hitting passing trains with its electrostaff in order to expose itself, which was how she won. Granted, I do believe she probably could beat one in raw skill, it would certainly require significant effort on her part. She lost to the mass of Magnaguards (and they never attacked her all at once, only in small or large chunks), and then relied on having an electrostaff, a weapon of greater length, in order to give her greater reach and repel more staffs. Is her combination of electrostaff and lightsaber combat, which was sufficient to hold off the Magnaguards a noticeable combative feat? Yes, but it does not apply here. Shaak was also winning against Galen Marek in respects to raw skill, but given Marek at that stage had also been on the losing end against Kazdan Paratus and only fought roughly evenly with Kota, I don't consider it an overwhelming feat.

Mara performed well against Yuuzhan Vong, who, based on their displays against other Jedi, are just as good as the Magnaguards in a consequential sense, which in of itself almost automatically renders herself the superior duelist. She defeated Luuke (who was Luke's equal), IIRC, when Luke was aiding her. Corran Horn also conceded that she was the better duelist, and Corran himself has performed well against the Yuuzhan Vong, beaten Jensaari, and has beaten Gantoris and Shedao Shedai. If anything, he is already a better duelist than Shaak, so for Mara to be superior to him elevates her above Shaak by at least a tier. Mara has also beaten Alema Rar and fought about evenly with Lumiya, both feats to assure her elevation to a tier or two ahead of Shaak.

For physical attributes, I don't believe it would be overly consequential. Shaak has formed shields out of her blade, dodged blaster fire and moved invisibly fast and in blurs, but Mara has performed virtually all of those feats, and more, such as, IIRC, creating fans and I seem to recall her forming webs as well. Shaak has blitzed droids before, IIRC, but Mara has simply contended with faster beings like Caedus (although given the stupidity of that fight as a whole, it might not be worth bringing it up) and Lumiya. Mara managed to react to and avoid Force Lightning from the NR era alone, which was years before her prime. She should be faster.

For power, Shaak managed to effortlessly (or at least, almost effortlessly) lift and hurl a stream of debris whilst exhausted, which is a decent showing. She has also hurled groups of droids, used Saber Throw and utilized Deflection against lightsaber blades. Mara has utilized Barrier to repel explosions, utilized Heal on an unborn Ben, displayed fairly respectable showings of Sense and Telekinesis , and has telepathically probed thirty minds during the Rebellion era alone (so in her prime, she should be much more powerful). Mara was able to levitate across areas whilst producing bubbles of Force energy, manipulating the air around her, and minimizing her heat signature/emissions, all at once. She also learned a variety of other powers such as Concealment and Force Lightning. Shaak is fairly powerful, but Mara is still more powerful, and more versatile.

Really Mara, has virtually all of the edges here, whether slightly or significantly. She is faster, more skilful, more powerful and more versatile. I would give her 10/10 in a decent fight.

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TheVivas

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@shootingnova: I don't see how Shaak's feat of fighting all those Magnaguards is circumstantial. She defeated one by herself with her own skills, then force shoved the other into a train. When she was being chased, she was attacked by at least four or five almost at once a few times, which is why she lost her lightsaber. She killed 5 Magnaguards during the fight against the horde and incapacitated at least two. In a fight where it's ten vs one or double digit adversaries vs one opponent, the group of attackers/enemies almost never attack all at once. It would be too easy for someone to dodge an attack and have it hit your own teammate. That being said, Shaak held off attacks from four Magnaguards at once and blocked all of their attacks at once right before they retreated.

Other than that, there's not much to say lol. You pretty much covered everything. If they fought on Felucia, do you think it would be a different outcome?

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JKBart

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#5  Edited By JKBart

@thevivas said:
Other than that, there's not much to say lol. You pretty much covered everything. If they fought on Felucia, do you think it would be a different outcome?

You ask Nova or just the forums? If the second one, I believe it could be quite benefitial to Shaak, if you include nature manipulation utilized by Shaak. It is still hard to judge though - Mara's experience with Yuuzhan Vong and their creatures has much to do with solving problems with animals and plants. :P Still, it could allow for a lucky shot in a proper moment. It's always hard to include environment and its aid, as you can't calculate the chances of them being employed in good moment of the fight, and their success depends mostly on it.

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ShootingNova

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@thevivas: I already addressed that. She won by getting it to hit the trains with its electrostaff instead to expose itself, and then she defeated it. Even then, it was hardly an easy fight.

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Mara

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#9  Edited By TheVivas

@jkbart: Eh it was more of an open invitation but seeing as how he was basically the only one to comment on it(tear runs down my face lol) it was in a way addressed to him. But thanks for answering! Haha. And yeah same thought process here. If I thought the battle would've been 10/10 in favor of Mara every time, I would've set it up on Felucia or somewhere else lol

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#10  Edited By TheVivas
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deactivated-5dace575ce059

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Im thinking mara wins majority here.

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WollfMyth209

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Mara Jade should win 8/10.

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deactivated-5e8a1f5fafc4e

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Ti was actually pretty powerful at this point. When she was on Felucia, which was a focal point for the Force whose balance was tilted towards the Dark Side, she managed to directly TK Starkiller several times. At this point he was powerful enough to skid the best part of a TIE fighter across the ground as a weapon. And while Ti was a "beacon of light in the Darkness" (paraphrasing) on Felucia, Galen was primarily a Dark Sider, so he would actually benefit more from the focal point than her.

Whether or not that amount of Force power helps her here or not I'm not sure, but I thought it was worth pointing out.

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Comicdude360

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Honestly I think both could win. Mara is definitely more skillful but skaak is one of the fastest/most agile Jedi ever.

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ShootingNova

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#16  Edited By ShootingNova

Odd bump. Mara should win almost every time, and I still stand by my previous assessment.

@comicdude360 said:

Honestly I think both could win. Mara is definitely more skillful but skaak is one of the fastest/most agile Jedi ever.

She has dodged and deflected blaster fire, ran in blurs, and IIRC she has formed shields out of her blade and fought imperceptibly fast. Not that overwhelming given the scores of notable Jedi, most of whom have replicated those feats.

Why would speed even matter, anyway? Mara is faster than Shaak is to begin with, let alone Shaak being able to win because of speed.

@i_like_swords said:

Ti was actually pretty powerful at this point. When she was on Felucia, which was a focal point for the Force whose balance was tilted towards the Dark Side, she managed to directly TK Starkiller several times. At this point he was powerful enough to skid the best part of a TIE fighter across the ground as a weapon. And while Ti was a "beacon of light in the Darkness" (paraphrasing) on Felucia, Galen was primarily a Dark Sider, so he would actually benefit more from the focal point than her.

Whether or not that amount of Force power helps her here or not I'm not sure, but I thought it was worth pointing out.

That's a decent showing. Not sure about how consistent it is with her other showings. It's not necessarily inconsistent, though if it is, I could bring up Mara competing with Caedus in TK.

That said, I don't find it inconsistent. Shaak effortlessly lifted a decent stream of debris on Hypori whilst she was exhausted, and she deflected Grievous's lightsaber blow whilst exhausted as well, though it required maximum effort and the impact of the blow hurled her backward. It's still a good showing.

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deactivated-5e8a1f5fafc4e

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@shootingnova: Well, it was her latest showing of power so all we can say is she improved, I guess.

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#18  Edited By ShootingNova

@i_like_swords: Not a very plausible notion but I see no reason for it to be inconsistent anyway.

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GeorgeWBush

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When did Mara probe 30 minds?

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ShootingNova

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#20  Edited By ShootingNova

@burnface: Sometime in the Rebellion era according to Silver. Probably in Choices of One, which I don't own, so I can't confirm it. Been searching for it for a while.

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serrure

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forgive me if im wrong but doesnt Mara stomp

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@serrure: That is the general concession, yes.

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Ti was actually pretty powerful at this point. When she was on Felucia, which was a focal point for the Force whose balance was tilted towards the Dark Side, she managed to directly TK Starkiller several times. At this point he was powerful enough to skid the best part of a TIE fighter across the ground as a weapon. And while Ti was a "beacon of light in the Darkness" (paraphrasing) on Felucia, Galen was primarily a Dark Sider, so he would actually benefit more from the focal point than her.

Whether or not that amount of Force power helps her here or not I'm not sure, but I thought it was worth pointing out.

I can't believe how wrong this is looking back. Felucia was light-sided and Galen was weakened, not the other way around, and Galen wasn't even that powerful when Ti was TKing him. Lol.

Mara wrecks, badly.

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deactivated-5dace575ce059

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ShootingNova

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Yeah, Mara stomps. Heads and shoulders above Shaak.

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@shootingnova: wait how do we know she stomps? Just because mara is a better force user doesn't mean she tops Shaak! they both are jedi! all jedi = jedi! XD

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#28  Edited By MasterKungFu

mara

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This was bumped? Huh, yeah Mara stomps.

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Slash03

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Sabers: Mara with mid difficulty

Force: Shaak Ti with mid difficulty

All Out: Either way

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thebluedragon20

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MAra is a better dualist and Shaak is a little more skilled and powerful with the force. Mara is also better when it comes to physicality, but it's a pretty small gap. It could go either way, but I am leaning towards Mara for her unorthodox fighting style.

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the_wspanialy

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#32  Edited By the_wspanialy

Mara during her time as an Emperor's Hand has already a good chance of beating Shaak, considering her scalling above members of the Shadow Guard, who were able to give a decent fight to a more powerful version of Galen Marek than the one Shaak fought. LotF Mara would kill Shaak with a glance.

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El_mago

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Mara stomps with ease

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SamHerkel

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Probably Mara, but Shaak-Ti is no joke.