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#1 Edited by Cypher's Gambit (2109 posts) - - Show Bio

So, I was at a local book shop and stumbled upon a comic in the magazine section. It was X-Men Legacy, which seemed like a very promising line of the Marvel comic branches. It's rare to see Magneto fighting anything of worth these days, and I was quite pleased to see him rise once more when he defeated the reality warper and mind manipulating Proteus. Apparently, Proteus took over the minds of 4 or 5 of Magneto's X-Men. Save for Rogue who apperantly absorbed the powers of the majority of them to battle (i don't know her name) a pyrokinesis woman along with Pyslocke & Nightcrawler. To put a long story short, Rogue beat the both of them until the lady with the pyrokinesis was about to throw the money hit. That's when Psylocke came out of unconsciousness and attacked the lady from behind.
 
Meanwhile: Magneto was fighting Proteus (as Blind Fold) in space. Magneto was so powerful even at a weakened state, that he lifted a good chunk of Earth and took it up into space to battle Proteus (Blindfold). Now since Proteus is taking possession of Blindfold, it gives him the power of to use her premonitions to know that he will defeat Magneto. However; he can not warp Magneto, nor can he reach his mind to posses or to shut off. Nevertheless, he over powers Magneto with an explosion and throws him and the giant piece of Earth towards the planet. Magneto manages to survive and Proteus teleports down to finish him off. That's when Magneto finally understood Proteus. Proteus is a sentimental being that is constructed of faintly metabolized electrons and psionic energy. Magneto uses this as an advantage and disperses Proteus into nothing and scatters the energy throughout the globe. Psylocke asks, if it was permanent, and Magneto replied in a similar fashion, "we know he will come back."
 
So... Magneto demenstrated a feat of defeating a purely bred being of psionic energy with little and faintly dusted particles of electrons. This being was a vast reality manipulator and a very powerful mind controller. Also given the fact that he was powered up by mistress Selene to be one of her higher ups of her army for re-risen mutants. This was a plus for Magneto in my book. Any thoughts of this anyone?
 
 

 Magneto vs Proteus
#2 Posted by rbysjti (10690 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm gonna have to say Proteus will win

#3 Posted by Baldy (5021 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:

" Where will it stop? Can Magneto not manipulate magical/demonic or dark energy as well? How about telekinetic energy? "

Everytime I look at his ripped body he manipulates my libido energy, does that count?
#4 Posted by Edamame (28194 posts) - - Show Bio
@Baldy: LOL
#5 Posted by karrob (4280 posts) - - Show Bio

In an extended fight Proteus will win but Magneto is a cunning strategist.
#6 Posted by Lance Bastro (4744 posts) - - Show Bio
@karrob said:
" In an extended fight Proteus will win but Magneto is a cunning strategist. "
#7 Posted by Lance Bastro (4744 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Lance Bastro: Magneto can't counter reality warping though.  "
did you read the op? proteus is a reality warper and magneto beat him. "canon"
#8 Posted by Lance Bastro (4744 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Lance Bastro: LOL. Yes. I read all Necrosha issues. I recognize who won that fight.  However, I have an "issue" with Magneto not being affected by reality warping.  "
oh, well... i havne't really read the issue. i'm just going by the op. but magneto should be omega mutant these days. that means he should be somewhere in the lines of reality warping himself.... or at least a defense for it.
#9 Posted by Omg chris (1607 posts) - - Show Bio

  Yeah this is a great feat for Magneto basically this is what Magneto did to Proteus to get him in his pure energy form by manipulating the electons to make him unbalanced resulting him  to explode pretty good feat.





#10 Posted by Lance Bastro (4744 posts) - - Show Bio
@Omg chris said:
"   Yeah this is a great feat for Magneto basically this is what Magneto did to Proteus to get him in his pure energy form by manipulating the electons to make him unbalanced resulting him  to explode pretty good feat.


"
oh so that's what happened... great!.. what comic is this?
#11 Posted by Edamame (28194 posts) - - Show Bio
@Lance Bastro: Necrosha: X-Men Legacy.
#12 Posted by Lance Bastro (4744 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Lance Bastro: Necrosha: X-Men Legacy. "
alright i'll check it out. is juggernaut in necrosha x-men legacy?
#13 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio
@karrob said:
" In an extended fight Proteus will win but Magneto is a cunning strategist. "
#14 Edited by Edamame (28194 posts) - - Show Bio
@Lance Bastro: Juggernaut is not involved. It would be cool to see him battle Proteus or Selene, though.  LOL. 
#15 Posted by Omg chris (1607 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame:  I think you just answered your own question energy contains proton and electrons psionic  energy is still a form of energy is it not? 
#16 Edited by MisterShin (228 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:

" @Omg chris: I know, but it just doesn't make complete sense to me.  I'm just expressing how I feel about the situation. * shrugs *   I thought that the psionic energy would have properties that Magneto would still not be able to manipulate?    I mean, where is it going to stop? Can Magneto manipulate demonic/magical energy as well and therefore defeat Blackheart? "

Well Magneto controls/manipulates nearly everything relating to electro-magnetism (electro-magnetism relates to a hell of alot of stuff). 
Manipulating electrons is within his Electro-magnetic power so its not so bad.
 
Demonic / Magical energy is not made of atoms (electrons, protons, neutrons) so he should have no power over it what so ever. 
Demonic / Magical energy defy logic aka you wont find it on a periodic table.
#17 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame: 
 
What MisterShin said:
 
 
@MisterShin said:
" @Edamame said:

" @Omg chris: I know, but it just doesn't make complete sense to me.  I'm just expressing how I feel about the situation. * shrugs *   I thought that the psionic energy would have properties that Magneto would still not be able to manipulate?    I mean, where is it going to stop? Can Magneto manipulate demonic/magical energy as well and therefore defeat Blackheart? "

Well Magneto controls/manipulates nearly everything relating to electro-magnetism (electro-magnetism relates to a hell of alot of stuff).  Manipulating electrons is within his Electro-magnetic power so its not so bad.  Demonic / Magical energy is not made of atoms (electrons, protons, neutrons) so he should have no power over it what so ever.  Demonic / Magical energy defy logic aka you wont find it on a periodic table. "

 
 
Also I want to add that "Psionic" energy is a form of teleplasm energy. Teleplasm = Ectoplasm are both related to Psionic which is in turn, related to the EM spectrum.
#18 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @MisterShin: But demonic/magical energy is still energy and since energy is composed of electrons and such, demonic/magical energy should, I hope not, also be made out of electrons and such.  No?  If not, then what is the exact composition of demonic/magical energy?   Doesn't psionic energy also defy logic?  I remember Beast mentioning that magical energy is the same thing. I may have misinterpreted it, but ... "
No, because magic is the absence of logic. Magic is basically anti-logic so there should be no such form of any type of EM fields constructing magic.
#19 Edited by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:

" Is it related because there are electrical functions in the brain, hinting at anything psionic? "

It has nothing to do with the electric pulse of the brain. The fact of the matter is that the Universe (the whole universe) is constructed by Electro-Magnetism. It is one of the 4 (four) fundamental building block of what makes a reality a reality. Psionic powers or the astral or hyper space planes are also bonded together thus related to the EM spectrum.
 
The only thing the EM Spectrum is not related to is magic.
#20 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Perfect Cell said:
" @Edamame said:
" @MisterShin: But demonic/magical energy is still energy and since energy is composed of electrons and such, demonic/magical energy should, I hope not, also be made out of electrons and such.  No?  If not, then what is the exact composition of demonic/magical energy?   Doesn't psionic energy also defy logic?  I remember Beast mentioning that magical energy is the same thing. I may have misinterpreted it, but ... "
No, because magic is the absence of logic. Magic is basically anti-logic so there should be no such form of any type of EM fields constructing magic. "
So, psionics is the lack of the absence of logic? Also, should magical energy not really  be considered "realistic" energy? "
Psionics are real. It can be explained in science. Magic is not real, science can not explain it.
#21 Edited by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:

" @Perfect Cell: Well, yes, I know that the electromagnetic force binds all matter together. "

What you need to know is that it binds all energy too. (not related to magic)
 
 
 
@Edamame said:

" @Perfect Cell: Well, yes, I know that the electromagnetic force binds all matter together.    So, Magneto can manipulate hyperspatial energies as well? Well, he won't have a problem with Hyperstorm or Invisible Woman then. LOL.    But why is magic not related to the EM spectrum? Just because it defies logic?  Isn't magical/demonic energy also bonded together like psionic/astral/hyperspatial and thus related to the EM spectrum? "


 
Magneto defeated Hyperstorm already. And yes, Hyperspace/hypermatter/subspace/astral space are all connected to the EM-Spectrum.
 
 
Magical/Divine/Demonic energies are not related to logic so therefore isn't tied or has anything to do with any of the four fundamentals of the universe.
#22 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

As far as Magneto not being effected by reality warping, Proteus used it to transmute the iron in his blood to lead in that battle, IIRC.

#23 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" In what way are psionics real? What instances do you have in mind? I can't think of any.
"
You're missing the point. Psionic, Magnetism, Hyperspace, Subspace, fire, ice, wind and water can not substitute or copy Magic.
 
Magic on the other hand can. So if you like... Yes magic can be related to the what you've mentioned. Magic can turn into the EM-Field. Magic can turn into a reality warper. Magic can make a universe disappear.
 
 

#24 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" In what way are psionics real? What instances do you have in mind? I can't think of any.
"
I already told you. Teleplasm  / Ectoplasm / Psionic are the same thing. 
#25 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Perfect Cell said:
Magical/Divine/Demonic energies are not related to logic so therefore isn't tied or has anything to do with any of the four fundamentals of the universe. "
Sure about that?
 



#26 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Perfect Cell: Okay. So, Magneto can also manipulate telekinetic energy.
I doubt it.
#27 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame: The link states that the 'emanation' is hypothetical, anyway.
#28 Edited by Edamame (28194 posts) - - Show Bio

@Static Shock: Exactly. That is why I am still curious about the matter. LOL

#29 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio

Magneto using the power of Magnetism to create an astral form of himself.
 
 

 
#30 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Perfect Cell: Magneto has latent telepathic abilities. I doubt he's using magnetism to achieve that.
#31 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Static Shock: Yeah. Well, Magneto can only engage in astral projection.  That's about it.  "
Mental blocks and resistances, too.
#32 Edited by Edamame (28194 posts) - - Show Bio

Yes, Magneto managed to defeat the Shadow King. That was very impressive.

#33 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Static Shock: Exactly. Which is why I am still curious about the matter. LOL.   "
Anyway, Magneto can affect teleplasm and etcoplasm. Meaning... He can actually fight Blackheart (you've mentioned Blackheart earlier). Mephisto's realm is held together by magic, but the realm itself is constructed of many souls. AKA teleplasm energies. Though Magneto can not directly get rid of Blackheart or Mephisto, he can still certainly defend himself with all the ectoplasm laying around inside the magical realm.
 
But keep in mind there are levels of magic and how much one ca "defy" things.
#34 Posted by Stormcell (1077 posts) - - Show Bio

As usual, people leaving out the important details in fights where Magneto is concerned. Proteus wins this fight with ridiculous ease. To begin with, Proteus only had a portion of his power when Magneto beat him and eventhen, Magneto nearly lost his life in that fight. Proteus was able to transmute the iron in Magneto's blood into lead and Magneto was powerless to stop him. If Proteus had been written better, he could have just turned Magneto into a glass statue and shatter it or simply erased Magneto's mutant gene. Magneto is a joke compared to Proteus.
#35 Posted by Stormcell (1077 posts) - - Show Bio
@MisterShin said:
"@Edamame said:

" @Omg chris: I know, but it just doesn't make complete sense to me.  I'm just expressing how I feel about the situation. * shrugs *   I thought that the psionic energy would have properties that Magneto would still not be able to manipulate?    I mean, where is it going to stop? Can Magneto manipulate demonic/magical energy as well and therefore defeat Blackheart? "

Well Magneto controls/manipulates nearly everything relating to electro-magnetism (electro-magnetism relates to a hell of alot of stuff).  Manipulating electrons is within his Electro-magnetic power so its not so bad.  Demonic / Magical energy is not made of atoms (electrons, protons, neutrons) so he should have no power over it what so ever.  Demonic / Magical energy defy logic aka you wont find it on a periodic table. "

Fact is, though, eventhough Proteus was composed of an energy close enough to EM energy, Magneto does not have the level of control over matter and energy Proteus does. Eventhough this was a weakened Proteus (Proteus' power was divided between multiple host bodies, therefore, he was nowhere near full power when he fought Magneto), his control over matter and energy far outdoes Magneto in many ways. Protues can do things like transmute glass into swarms of living bees. This is well beyond the scope of Magneto's control over subatomic particles. Its just another instance of Magneto being pitted against a character well beyond his powerclass and the more powerful character being greatly devalued for Magneto to look good.
#36 Posted by Lance Uppercut (23245 posts) - - Show Bio
@Stormcell said:
" As usual, people leaving out the important details in fights where Magneto is concerned. Proteus wins this fight with ridiculous ease. To begin with, Proteus only had a portion of his power when Magneto beat him and eventhen, Magneto nearly lost his life in that fight. Proteus was able to transmute the iron in Magneto's blood into lead and Magneto was powerless to stop him. If Proteus had been written better, he could have just turned Magneto into a glass statue and shatter it or simply erased Magneto's mutant gene. Magneto is a joke compared to Proteus. "
As always, your dislike of Magneto is noted. Now go away.

#37 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Stormcell said:
Eventhough this was a weakened Proteus (Proteus' power was divided between multiple host bodies, therefore, he was nowhere near full power when he fought Magneto), his control over matter and energy far outdoes Magneto in many ways.
This wasn't even stated on panel, so I'm not sure why you keep saying this. Even if he was divided, nothing in the book stated that he was actually weakened.
#38 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Stormcell said:
" As usual, people leaving out the important details in fights where Magneto is concerned. Proteus wins this fight with ridiculous ease. To begin with, Proteus only had a portion of his power when Magneto beat him and eventhen, Magneto nearly lost his life in that fight. Proteus was able to transmute the iron in Magneto's blood into lead and Magneto was powerless to stop him. If Proteus had been written better, he could have just turned Magneto into a glass statue and shatter it or simply erased Magneto's mutant gene. Magneto is a joke compared to Proteus. "
Magneto is still evolving though. He can manipulate space now... In a matter of time, he will be able to manipulate time. Since space & time continuum is related to the EM Spectrum.
#39 Posted by Lance Uppercut (23245 posts) - - Show Bio
@Static Shock said:
" @Stormcell said:
Eventhough this was a weakened Proteus (Proteus' power was divided between multiple host bodies, therefore, he was nowhere near full power when he fought Magneto), his control over matter and energy far outdoes Magneto in many ways.
This wasn't even stated on panel, so I'm not sure why you keep saying this. Even if he was divided, nothing in the book stated that he was actually weakened. "
It was actually stated on panel that Proteus divided himself amongst multiple hosts. It didn't say that he was dramatically weaekned however.
#40 Edited by Edamame (28194 posts) - - Show Bio

@Lance Uppercut said:

" @Stormcell said:

" As usual, people leaving out the important details in fights where Magneto is concerned. Proteus wins this fight with ridiculous ease. To begin with, Proteus only had a portion of his power when Magneto beat him and eventhen, Magneto nearly lost his life in that fight. Proteus was able to transmute the iron in Magneto's blood into lead and Magneto was powerless to stop him. If Proteus had been written better, he could have just turned Magneto into a glass statue and shatter it or simply erased Magneto's mutant gene. Magneto is a joke compared to Proteus. "
As always, your dislike of Magneto is noted. Now go away. "

LOL

#41 Posted by Stormcell (1077 posts) - - Show Bio
@Static Shock said:
" @Stormcell said:
Eventhough this was a weakened Proteus (Proteus' power was divided between multiple host bodies, therefore, he was nowhere near full power when he fought Magneto), his control over matter and energy far outdoes Magneto in many ways.  
 

This wasn't even stated on panel, so I'm not sure why you keep saying this. Even if he was divided, nothing in the book stated that he was actually weakened."
 
Read the enlarged panel below. Magneto clearly states that Proteus' power levels were diminished because he split himself into many different hosts. This is why I keep making the comments I make. 
 
Omg chris
said:
"  Yeah this is a great feat for Magneto basically this is what Magneto did to Proteus to get him in his pure energy form by manipulating the electons to make him unbalanced resulting him  to explode pretty good feat.
 


 
"
#42 Posted by Perfect Cell (3470 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame said:
" @Stormcell: That is true. Proteus spread his consciousness into what, five host bodies? "
And all back into one right before he was about to kill Magneto. He had no other host but Blindfold.
 
 
 
 
@Edamame said:
"@Perfect Cell said:
Okay. So, he can manipulate telekinetic energy then? On the "Teleplasm" link it mentions telekinesis.  Are souls composed of psionic energy? Really?   In other words, depending on the power levels of the magic wielder, Magneto might be able to control it?  "

Control his power, but not theirs.
#43 Posted by Stormcell (1077 posts) - - Show Bio
@Lance Uppercut said:
" @Stormcell said:
" As usual, people leaving out the important details in fights where Magneto is concerned. Proteus wins this fight with ridiculous ease. To begin with, Proteus only had a portion of his power when Magneto beat him and eventhen, Magneto nearly lost his life in that fight. Proteus was able to transmute the iron in Magneto's blood into lead and Magneto was powerless to stop him. If Proteus had been written better, he could have just turned Magneto into a glass statue and shatter it or simply erased Magneto's mutant gene. Magneto is a joke compared to Proteus. "
As always, your dislike of Magneto is noted. Now go away."

You must just hate how I point out the holes in Magneto's victories over people he has no chance against. Powerful characters suffer from PIS to weaken in Magneto storyarcs on a perpetual basis. I don't hate Magneto, but I believe in being fair. If Magneto gets a victory by the other character being devalued, I will point that out. This has become too much of a trend with this character thus I don't take him seriously anymore,
#44 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Stormcell: That's not what he's saying, though. He said that he broke himself like bread (as in split himself up) but nothing about he's power being diminished. It's a play on words, and Magneto doesn't even state what you're saying there. Even before he defeated Magneto, Proteus' consciousness was rolled back into one (in the body of Blindfold) after Rogue and Psylocke exorcised him from the others.
 

#45 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Edamame: It would be believable if that was actually stated, word for word.
#46 Posted by Lance Uppercut (23245 posts) - - Show Bio
@Stormcell said:
" @Lance Uppercut said:
" @Stormcell said:
" As usual, people leaving out the important details in fights where Magneto is concerned. Proteus wins this fight with ridiculous ease. To begin with, Proteus only had a portion of his power when Magneto beat him and eventhen, Magneto nearly lost his life in that fight. Proteus was able to transmute the iron in Magneto's blood into lead and Magneto was powerless to stop him. If Proteus had been written better, he could have just turned Magneto into a glass statue and shatter it or simply erased Magneto's mutant gene. Magneto is a joke compared to Proteus. "
As always, your dislike of Magneto is noted. Now go away."
You must just hate how I point out the holes in Magneto's victories over people he has no chance against. Powerful characters suffer from PIS to weaken in Magneto storyarcs on a perpetual basis. I don't hate Magneto, but I believe in being fair. If Magneto gets a victory by the other character being devalued, I will point that out. This has become too much of a trend with this character thus I don't take him seriously anymore, "
You mean point out facts I admit to? Wow, that really makes me angry. We've already heard your opinions on Magneto's wins. Numerous people have already destroyed you on these points. Why you continue to try boggles my mind. Now seriously, go away. I can't take a thread seriously when  you're in it.
#47 Posted by Stormcell (1077 posts) - - Show Bio
@Perfect Cell said:
" @Edamame said:
" @Stormcell: That is true. Proteus spread his consciousness into what, five host bodies? "
And all back into one right before he was about to kill Magneto. He had no other host but Blindfold. 
 


Okay, this is just no true. Nowhere was this established in the issue. On top of that, Magneto pointed out how Proteus fractioned his power by dividing himself into all of those host bodies right before he took Proteus out. Look, it doesn't matter how you cut it, Magneto has no shot against Proteus. Protues can control matter and energy on a level Magneto can't even begin to touch and has plenty of feats to back it up. Heck, Magneto could not even stop a Proteus with just a portion of his (Proteus') power from transmuting the iron in his blood into lead. This shows a much higher degree of control over matter and energy on Proteus' part over Magneto's. To boot, Proteus has even more impressive showings than this with his power. Magneto has no chance here without a serious PIS weakening Proteus to give Magneto the advantage.
#48 Posted by Omg chris (1607 posts) - - Show Bio

I suggest you re-read Static post and that comic @Static Shock said:

" @Stormcell: That's not what he's saying, though. He said that he broke himself like bread (as in split himself up) but nothing about he's power being diminished. It's a play on words, and Magneto doesn't even state what you're saying there. Even before he defeated Magneto, Proteus' consciousness was rolled back into one (in the body of Blindfold) after Rogue and Psylocke exorcised him from the others.   "

#49 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio
@Stormcell said:
"Okay, this is just no true. Nowhere was this established in the issue. On top of that, Magneto pointed out how Proteus fractioned his power by dividing himself into all of those host bodies right before he took Proteus out. Look, it doesn't matter how you cut it, Magneto has no shot against Proteus.
It wasn't established that Proteus was actually weakened before Magneto destroyed him, either. It goes both ways. All we get from it is Magneto stating that his broke himself like bread, or split himself up. Nothing about being weakened.
#50 Posted by Omg chris (1607 posts) - - Show Bio

Funny part is magneto was the one that was weakened since his blood became lead as you yourself pointed out.