This topic is locked from further discussion.

#201 Edited by TheLastSane1 (14 posts) - - Show Bio

Broly wins hands down.

Why: Vegeta is an idiot he wants to prove he is beyond his opponent in all ways so he would allow Broly to reach ultimate power. Instead of putting him down when he should.

#202 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

Broly wins hands down.

Why: Vegeta is an idiot he wants to prove he is beyond his opponent in all ways so he would allow Broly to reach ultimate power. Instead of putting him down when he should.

You are referring to the scene with Vegeta and Cell (#17 Absorved). OP stated the they are both BLOOD LUSTED.

#203 Posted by Rozalia (692 posts) - - Show Bio

@overlordarhas said:

One thing that interest me, anyone in Freeza's level and above are casual planet busters, it could also be debated that Vegeta at the start of the Saiyan Saga could destroy a Planet easily. The amount of Ki control, both Protagonist and Antagonist is amazing, even at the point of losing, they have control.

Something to note is that if the planet goes then Vegeta dies. Broly can survive in space with his Energy shield.

#204 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@rozalia:

Bardock and the rest of the saiyans confronting Freeza have no trouble in space.

Vegeta destroyed a Planet with his Space Pod in space wide open

Paragus is in space trying to hold down Broly.

Saiyan surviving in Space is highly debatable.

#205 Posted by TheLastSane1 (14 posts) - - Show Bio

@overlordarhas: Which even it says should not be stated. Vegeta always goes for the win especially if it means the kill. Broly does the same. But Bloodlusted does not mean it negates their normal behavior or fighting style. Vegeta feels cocky and strong he lets his opponent get stronger so he can prove he is superior.

Bloodlusted does not mean they are suddenly just reduced to movesets and pls.

#206 Posted by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Those aren't Saiyans behind Bardock. Those're Freeza's goons, and they're in far outer atmosphere and near Freeza's ship, which can be said to generate a field for his pawns to breathe with.

Brolly still steamrolls Vegeta with ease.

Online
#207 Edited by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio
#208 Posted by God_Spawn (37879 posts) - - Show Bio

@overlordarhas: Rage is well....rage. Bloodlust usually defined on comicvine is that a person is not afraid to kill but usually fights within their normal characteristics. So say for example if I said Namor is bloodlusted and tried to pass a speedblitz as an argument. It wouldn't fly because Namor doesn't normally speedblitz someone.

So Sane1 is pretty spot on.

Moderator
#209 Edited by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Brolly lives. So everything dies.

Online
#210 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio
#211 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

Those aren't Saiyans behind Bardock. Those're Freeza's goons, and they're in far outer atmosphere and near Freeza's ship, which can be said to generate a field for his pawns to breathe with.

Brolly still steamrolls Vegeta with ease.

Steam rolled vegetable, that's funny.

His Ship Generating a field is never implied.

#212 Edited by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Explain his goons surviving around the ship and then others of the same dying when King Cold breaks the viewport and ejects several of his men into space near the recently destroyed planet Namek.

Saiyans can survive in far outer atmosphere for a limited time, but not in a direct vacuum. Brolly is an exception to the rule because he is a mutant of some kind and he generated a shield that withstood the vacuum of space and kept both himself and his father alive long enough to reach a nearby habitable world. The same can't be said for Vegeta or any other Saiyan.

Online
#213 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

Explain his goons surviving around the ship and then others of the same dying when King Cold breaks the viewport and ejects several of his men into space near the recently destroyed planet Namek.

Saiyans can survive in far outer atmosphere for a limited time, but not in a direct vacuum. Brolly is an exception to the rule because he is a mutant of some kind and he generated a shield that withstood the vacuum of space and kept both himself and his father alive long enough to reach a nearby habitable world. The same can't be said for Vegeta or any other Saiyan.

Fair enough, but explain why Paragus is in space trying to stop Broly.

#214 Edited by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Fair enough, but explain why Paragus is in space trying to stop Broly.

It's a movie that falls outside canon. It doesn't have to make sense. Much like the Plot Devices that were used. And Brolly was still attacking things, which can very well mean the planet wasn't destroyed yet, only breaking to pieces.

When Brolly smacks Paragus away, there's a lighter glow in the corner which may indicate the planets atmosphere. So they could very well be in far outer atmosphere at the time as Brolly is wrecking stuff. Destroying asteroids doesn't seem like it'd get his rocks off, based on his track record.

Online
#215 Edited by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai:

Ok, but stop calling Broly a mutant or that he is like a junkie, you might hurt his feelings. LOLZ

#216 Edited by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Well Brolly is kind of a mutant. 10k PL at birth, different transformation from every other Saiyan, and endlessly increasing power. Ginyu called himself and his squad mutants. So they do kinda exist.

Online
#217 Edited by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

Well Brolly is kind of a mutant. 10k PL at birth, different transformation from every other Saiyan, and endlessly increasing power. Ginyu called himself and his squad mutants. So they do kinda exist.

Off topic, Speaking of GINEW, do you think Gohan should join them (Ginew Forces) as the GREAT SAIYAMAN.

They could tech him a thing or two.

#218 Edited by ssejllenrad (12847 posts) - - Show Bio

DBZ ban is lifted again?

#219 Edited by ssejllenrad (12847 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

Well Brolly is kind of a mutant. 10k PL at birth, different transformation from every other Saiyan, and endlessly increasing power. Ginyu called himself and his squad mutants. So they do kinda exist.

Off topic, Speaking of GINEW, do you think Gohan should join them (Ginew Forces) as the GREAT SAIYAMAN.

Ahahahaha! Good idea. Like any Power Ranger team, there should be someone outside the five that happens to be much stronger than the original team!

#220 Posted by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Ginyu could teach Gohan how to do it right. Heck the Ginyu force could do it so hard, sakura petals were drifting down around them.

Online
#221 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@ssejllenrad:

DBZ VS DBZ is OK

Like the Idea, the Green Ranger is said to be the strongest Ranger that ever existed.

#222 Edited by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

And then he became the White Ranger and bossed around all the other color rangers. Then everyone hated him.

Online
#223 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

And then he became the White Ranger and bossed around all the other color rangers. Then everyone hated him.

True but I think that the White Ranger is weaker than Green, besides, Green Ranger is said that he could do missions solo.

#224 Posted by TheLastSane1 (14 posts) - - Show Bio

Here is why I believe Broly would win.
1. One the style of combat that both sides. Vegeta and Broly normally fight in what a comic would consider Bloodlusted. Vegeta if he is sure he is superior to his foe will toy with his foe, inflicting pain not death. He wants his foe to die knowing that no matter what he did he could never surpass Vegeta in power. This was why when Vegeta defeated Semi-Perfect Cell he was sure that Perfect Cell would be nothing compared to him as he had easily defeated Semi-Perfect Cell so surely he could beat Perfect Cell.

Broly defeated 2 ascended or Grade 2 Super Saiyans as well as a Grade 4 Full-Power Super Saiyan with casual attacks as well as a Super Namek. He did not waste his time fighting them down he simply put them down with casual ease and then went to torture Goku in combat. Even in the second movie he didn't kill the two young saiyans he beat then h*ll out of them for the sheer joy it gave him.

Neither of these fighters would go for a quick kill, they could go for the hurt and degrading first.

2. A Super Saiyan Two (Majin Vegeta) is considered to be Twice as strong as a Full-Power Super Saiyan. However, A FPSSJ1 Goku's Kamehameha at point blank range did absolutely nothing to Broly. Now while this does not 'prove' Broly is twice as strong its a good indicator of his power. He effortlessly beat a FPSSJ1 Goku near senseless something Cell was unable to do, or at least did not do when he sparred with Goku in the games. Cell would want to crush Goku with a fast attack to instill fear in the others, he would beat down Goku to show his power but instead he fought him in a straight up Spar and neither side appeared stronger. So this leans toward Broly being possibly 2 or 3 times stronger due to Nothing the fighters could do damaged him in the least (I will not be talking about the Plot Device at the end) Even in the Return a SSJ2 Goku (This was just prior to the Buu Saga so he did have it) a SSJ2 Gohan (He would not have gone SSJ1, he knew he would die in a fight like that he fought Broly before.) and SSJ1 Goten's combined power was not enough to stop him. He was holding their combined Kamehameha with one hand feeding his energy blast. (Again I will not be talking about the Plot Device)

3. Majin Vegeta is a SSJ2, maybe a little bit above SSJ2 levels. We see a Goku SSJ2 fight him to a pretty good stand still (Goku was burning his time on earth so he timed out.) Yet we saw Goku SSJ 2 not be able to over power Broly even with Gohan and Goten's combined strength added.

4. Majin Vegeta is cocky as hell, he wants the world to know he is the best, he would not go for a killing attack even if he was close to Broly's level he would want to hurt the LSSJ and show to all he was Better then Goku. This would be his downfall as if Goku is inspired by Superman Broly is inspired by Hulk and like Hulk he seems to only get stronger as he continues to fight.

#225 Posted by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Super Sentai predates all of that and PR's were ripped from that and Voltron. Voltron kicks the crap out of Megazords.

Online
#226 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

Here is why I believe Broly would win.

1. One the style of combat that both sides. Vegeta and Broly normally fight in what a comic would consider Bloodlusted. Vegeta if he is sure he is superior to his foe will toy with his foe, inflicting pain not death. He wants his foe to die knowing that no matter what he did he could never surpass Vegeta in power. This was why when Vegeta defeated Semi-Perfect Cell he was sure that Perfect Cell would be nothing compared to him as he had easily defeated Semi-Perfect Cell so surely he could beat Perfect Cell.

Broly defeated 2 ascended or Grade 2 Super Saiyans as well as a Grade 4 Full-Power Super Saiyan with casual attacks as well as a Super Namek. He did not waste his time fighting them down he simply put them down with casual ease and then went to torture Goku in combat. Even in the second movie he didn't kill the two young saiyans he beat then h*ll out of them for the sheer joy it gave him.

Neither of these fighters would go for a quick kill, they could go for the hurt and degrading first.

2. A Super Saiyan Two (Majin Vegeta) is considered to be Twice as strong as a Full-Power Super Saiyan. However, A FPSSJ1 Goku's Kamehameha at point blank range did absolutely nothing to Broly. Now while this does not 'prove' Broly is twice as strong its a good indicator of his power. He effortlessly beat a FPSSJ1 Goku near senseless something Cell was unable to do, or at least did not do when he sparred with Goku in the games. Cell would want to crush Goku with a fast attack to instill fear in the others, he would beat down Goku to show his power but instead he fought him in a straight up Spar and neither side appeared stronger. So this leans toward Broly being possibly 2 or 3 times stronger due to Nothing the fighters could do damaged him in the least (I will not be talking about the Plot Device at the end) Even in the Return a SSJ2 Goku (This was just prior to the Buu Saga so he did have it) a SSJ2 Gohan (He would not have gone SSJ1, he knew he would die in a fight like that he fought Broly before.) and SSJ1 Goten's combined power was not enough to stop him. He was holding their combined Kamehameha with one hand feeding his energy blast. (Again I will not be talking about the Plot Device)

3. Majin Vegeta is a SSJ2, maybe a little bit above SSJ2 levels. We see a Goku SSJ2 fight him to a pretty good stand still (Goku was burning his time on earth so he timed out.) Yet we saw Goku SSJ 2 not be able to over power Broly even with Gohan and Goten's combined strength added.

4. Majin Vegeta is cocky as hell, he wants the world to know he is the best, he would not go for a killing attack even if he was close to Broly's level he would want to hurt the LSSJ and show to all he was Better then Goku. This would be his downfall as if Goku is inspired by Superman Broly is inspired by Hulk and like Hulk he seems to only get stronger as he continues to fight.

Nice analogy.

#227 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

Super Sentai predates all of that and PR's were ripped from that and Voltron. Voltron kicks the crap out of Megazords.

Voltron's sword is like a giant can opener

#228 Posted by Cardle_grave (458 posts) - - Show Bio

Gohan said in Movie 10 that his has gotten stronger since last time not weaker meaning

Movie 10 SSj2 adult gohan>SSj2 kid gohan Cell games>SSj2 adult gohan budokai

Broly 3 shot him, he would do the same to vegeta

#229 Posted by HereComesTheBoom_Headshot (321 posts) - - Show Bio

Vegeta wins. Broly is overrated.

#230 Edited by Abocado (666 posts) - - Show Bio

@overlordarhas said:

@reikai:

Ok, but stop calling Broly a mutant or that he is like a junkie, you might hurt his feelings. LOLZ

Calling Broly names will cause you a serious amount of BUTTHURT!

I will say this once, HIS POWER IS MAXIMUM!

#231 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@abocado said:

@overlordarhas said:

@reikai:

Ok, but stop calling Broly a mutant or that he is like a junkie, you might hurt his feelings. LOLZ

Calling Broly names will cause you a serious amount of BUTTHURT!

I will say this once, HIS POWER IS MAXIMUM!

Stop with the Power maximum joke and let us get back on topic.

#232 Edited by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Voltron's sword is like a giant can opener

Made to rip open the candya$$ mechs of those Pansy Rangers.

Gohan said in Movie 10 that his has gotten stronger since last time not weaker meaning

Which, for what we know, only means that he is stronger due to achieving SS2 status, not that he'd been training.

Online
#233 Edited by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

@overlordarhas said:

Voltron's sword is like a giant can opener

Made to rip open the candya$$ mechs of those Pansy Rangers.

@cardle_grave said:

Gohan said in Movie 10 that his has gotten stronger since last time not weaker meaning

Which, for what we know, only means that he is stronger due to achieving SS2 status, not that he'd been training.

Movie 10?

Voltron even the weaker Version (Vehicle) will destroy any PR's Megazord

#234 Edited by Rozalia (692 posts) - - Show Bio

@overlordarhas said:

@abocado said:

@overlordarhas said:

@reikai:

Ok, but stop calling Broly a mutant or that he is like a junkie, you might hurt his feelings. LOLZ

Calling Broly names will cause you a serious amount of BUTTHURT!

I will say this once, HIS POWER IS MAXIMUM!

Stop with the Power maximum joke and let us get back on topic.

What is there to discuss? Broly has an unbreakable shield, he could simply fly into space and blow up the planet with a standard energy blast (doesn't even need the Omega Blaster). Thats how casually Broly could defeat not just Majin Vegeta but 100 Majin Vegeta's at the same time.

Another funfact: Baby Broly never tanked anything.

Seems to me he did.

#235 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@rozalia:

Unbreakable Shield that:

  • Goku Punched Out
  • BFR'ed in to the sun via Father and Sons Kamehameha

If he is a Galaxy Buster then he could survived a simple sun dip by Shielding himself.

But we can't be certain that he perished.

Rule of ANIME # 1

If there are no bodies found, there is a chance of a villain returning at an indefinite date.

#236 Posted by SirMethos (1330 posts) - - Show Bio

@rozalia said:
What is there to discuss? Broly has an unbreakable shield, he could simply fly into space and blow up the planet with a standard energy blast (doesn't even need the Omega Blaster). Thats how casually Broly could defeat not just Majin Vegeta but 100 Majin Vegeta's at the same time.

When, exactly, did Broly get an "unbreakable" shield?

Also, Broly has considerably less raw power, than Majin Vegeta. Not to mention the fact that Vegeta is more skilled, and has more effective Ki techniques.

#237 Edited by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Actually Goku didn't punch out Brolly's shield. He hit it and got flung away by it, then Brolly came down atop him, expanded and exploded it to send Goku flying. That last "One Hit" at the end of movie 8, Brolly wasn't using his barrier.

And again, they only beat him in Movie 10 with Plot Device. It doesn't have to make sense.

Online
#238 Posted by Rozalia (692 posts) - - Show Bio

Goku Punched Out

There is a difference between punching out Broly and punching out his shield. The shield didn't break at any point I can remember with even the Family Kamehameha not being enough. The BFR was due to Broly being taken surprise, were he prepared he would have withstood it and if Trunks hadn't done his stuff Broly would have won the power struggle with ease.

Also, Broly has considerably less raw power, than Majin Vegeta. Not to mention the fact that Vegeta is more skilled, and has more effective Ki techniques.

Broly was with ease winning a power struggle against 2 SSJ2s with an Energy Ball type attack (which never do well in power struggles) and on that evidence you still think Majin Vegeta has more raw power?

#239 Posted by TheLastSane1 (14 posts) - - Show Bio

@rozalia: The problem with the Broly movies where it is actually Broly is they boost him up throughout the movie as this Uber Threat and then are forced to use a Dues Ex Machina to beat him.

The Friendship Punch is stupid. He casually slammed down everyone in that group, Goku included. He knocked three Super Saiyans out of their SSJ1 forms which means he damn near depleted their energy doing so. If a combined power of 4 severely beaten fighters on top of Goku who could do jack squat to Broly can suddenly equal higher power that is stupid and makes no sense even in DBZ.

In Return Trunk's attack is suggested to have either broken Broly's focus (Which makes no sense as it did nothing too him) or interrupted Broly's power flow except he was using a energy sphere attack which didn't require a direct energy flow.

Both times Broly got beat via a last minute 'How do we make the good guys win' plot device.

Broly combated a SSJ2 Gohan who was roughly on par with his former power at Cell (Vegeta called him weaker because by this point Vegeta in SSJ1 was nearly as strong), Goku SSJ2 (Who again fought Majin Vegeta to a stand still before he ran out of time), and Goten SSJ1 in a power struggle and was holding at most in a stalemate. This is 2 SSJ2s here Majin Vegeta is a SSJ2. How is this a difficult thing to grasp.

Hell, please watch when Broly no sells Vegeta in the first movie. The Prince of All Saiyans about soils his pants.

#240 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@rozalia: T


In Return Trunk's attack is suggested to have either broken Broly's focus (Which makes no sense as it did nothing too him) or interrupted Broly's power flow except he was using a energy sphere attack which didn't require a direct energy flow.

I think Broly panicked there. Opt to fire lower pl blast than investing on a massive 1 shot blast

#241 Posted by xlab3000 (3277 posts) - - Show Bio

@rozalia:

Unbreakable Shield that:

  • Goku Punched Out
  • BFR'ed in to the sun via Father and Sons Kamehameha

If he is a Galaxy Buster then he could survived a simple sun dip by Shielding himself.

But we can't be certain that he perished.

Rule of ANIME # 1

If there are no bodies found, there is a chance of a villain returning at an indefinite date.

Vegeta wins. Broly is overrated.

people who know what they are talking about

#242 Posted by OverLordArhas (7789 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai:

May I know if there are any official statement from Toriyama if Broly is Truly DEAD?

#244 Posted by Cardle_grave (458 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai: No it doesn't because his not using SSj2 nor SSj, he is using his base, And why would he comment on his SSj2 if his not using it. it is obviously talking about how Gohan Powered up form the training he done in 7 years.

He was confident in his base in beating broly when his SSj in movie 8 got shit stomped.

#245 Posted by AnyWhichWayButUp (760 posts) - - Show Bio

@overlordarhas: They're probably going to pull some LegendaryssjGod BS because thats just what Anime loves to do

#246 Posted by Perpetr8rMike (590 posts) - - Show Bio
#247 Posted by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

End of Movie 11 (Bio-Brolly, which was the biggest load of crap since GT), has a scene where King Kai tells Goku Brolly is tearing things up in Hell and that he needs to meet up with Pikkon and calm him down. We don't see what happens. It just ends.

Movie 12 is "Fusion Reborn" and even with the barriers between Earth and Hell broken down, the only villains who don't appear are Brolly and Cooler. Cooler only appears again in "Plan to Eradicate the Super Saiyans" With Hatchyect and as a cameo in GT when Meta-#17 escapes from Hell with Dr. Gero and Dr. Muu.

This leads me to believe Brolly only exists within his own universe in the movies. There's always a possibility we will see him again to settle things up and figure what happened in the end with him, or they'll leave it in limbo and just do "What If" scenes in the DBZ games.

Online
#248 Edited by WarlordEternal (2399 posts) - - Show Bio

My vote goes to Broly for reasons already stated.

#249 Edited by Rozalia (692 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai said:

End of Movie 11 (Bio-Brolly, which was the biggest load of crap since GT), has a scene where King Kai tells Goku Brolly is tearing things up in Hell and that he needs to meet up with Pikkon and calm him down. We don't see what happens. It just ends.

Movie 12 is "Fusion Reborn" and even with the barriers between Earth and Hell broken down, the only villains who don't appear are Brolly and Cooler. Cooler only appears again in "Plan to Eradicate the Super Saiyans" With Hatchyect and as a cameo in GT when Meta-#17 escapes from Hell with Dr. Gero and Dr. Muu.

This leads me to believe Brolly only exists within his own universe in the movies. There's always a possibility we will see him again to settle things up and figure what happened in the end with him, or they'll leave it in limbo and just do "What If" scenes in the DBZ games.

Its so obvious I'm so surprised you don't see it. Broly is extremely popular and famous as being unstoppable in combat and having him be dispatched in one punch like Frieza is something they don't dare do.
So they have the choice of either having him in the movie as a main villain or not at all. They chose not at all.

Lets put it this way, if the next movie has Broly returning to life/escaping hell then he'll be manhandling even Super Saiyan God Goku because that is what he does. Does such a thing make sense due to the difference in power at this point? No. Would it happen? Yes it would as Broly's power is maximum and all that jazz.

#250 Posted by reikai (4233 posts) - - Show Bio

Brolly would ascend to an equivalent level + his Legendary status which = SSJ God Gogeta level.

Online