Leon VS Miles Morales

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44orhsaJ

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Leon S. Kennedy

VS
VS

Miles Morales

No Caption Provided

Rounds

  1. Morals are on
  2. Morals are off

Rules

  • No prep
  • Standard gear
  • Win by any means

Location

  • Begin visible
  • Begin 50 feet apart
  • Fight takes place here:
No Caption Provided

Who wins and why?

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44orhsaJ

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The_Caped_Crusader

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I think Batman would win.

Edit: I'm definite Batman would win.

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AdamAnouer

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I'm gonna give this one to Miles mostly because he seems to have a very good awareness of just how dangerous those around him can be and I think he wouldn't waste a second giving Leon a chance to cap him. Either that or the two team up to try and foil the Umbrella Corperation.

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DarthAznable

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Is Miles really that bad against street levelers?

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Miles is probably comparable to Krauser. Miles has been able to throw a cop car, and also punched out a giant right? In that case he'd be a bit superior to Krauser. Although Krauser is a highly trained and experienced spec ops soldier while Miles is just a kid, so that evens things out. Do I think Leon can beat Miles in CQC? Possibly, but maybe not, as Krauser did take the upperhand on him during their knife fight through a combination of his stats and skill, so Miles sheer stats might be able to compensate. However, Leon did prove that he can last against Krauser, so he can last against Miles as well, and if he supplements that CQC with some precision gunshots and tactical maneuvering AKA the same thing he did in his second fight with Krauser which he won, then he can win here too.

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sirfizzwhizz

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@nickzambuto: I agree, if this was just stats. However, Miles still has Spider Sense, Wall Crawling, Webs, Invisibility, and the one shot win Spider Sting. All that puts him over. I think Leon and Chris together would do better.

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Jacthripper

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Miles is probably comparable to Krauser. Miles has been able to throw a cop car, and also punched out a giant right? In that case he'd be a bit superior to Krauser. Although Krauser is a highly trained and experienced spec ops soldier while Miles is just a kid, so that evens things out. Do I think Leon can beat Miles in CQC? Possibly, but maybe not, as Krauser did take the upperhand on him during their knife fight through a combination of his stats and skill, so Miles sheer stats might be able to compensate. However, Leon did prove that he can last against Krauser, so he can last against Miles as well, and if he supplements that CQC with some precision gunshots and tactical maneuvering AKA the same thing he did in his second fight with Krauser which he won, then he can win here too.

The only thing I'd see giving Miles the win would be the Venom Sting, that hax piece of sh!t attack that always works...

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renamed040924

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@nickzambuto: I agree, if this was just stats. However, Miles still has Spider Sense, Wall Crawling, Webs, Invisibility, and the one shot win Spider Sting. All that puts him over. I think Leon and Chris together would do better.

The advantage of "skill" shouldn't be underestimated. Miles has many superpowers beyond simply stats, but given Leon's high training and expertise in numerous fields of combat, he can keep up. Miles' inexperience and relative lack of any real skill of any kind will be his downfall, Leon will overwhelm him with his tactical marksmanship, blade handling, environmental use, and simple overall survival skills. Even back in RE2 when Leon was just as inexperienced as Miles and had very little training to help him out, his natural instincts alone made him 10x the fighter Miles is, and he was able to fight numerous BOWs who can all rival Miles in sheer stats. Lickers are likely faster and more agile than Miles but Leon is capable of taking them on in groups, William Birkin is infinitely more powerful than Miles and nearly immortal yet Leon defeated him numerous times, and Mr. X is superior to Miles in every area besides sheer agility, but since Miles isn't as skilled as Peter Parker and can't use his agility to the same extent, that advantage alone wouldn't be enough to compensate. Yet through simple skill and his will to survive, Leon defeated all of these creatures and more. Than in RE4 after his training from the Government, he took on even more powerful and dangerous enemies like El Gigante, the Verdugo, Saddler, and Krauser. Krauser in particular has the stats to rival Miles, but additionally went through the same training as Leon and was more experienced, but Leon beat him. So I do firmly believe Leon can take Miles by himself, he's simply proven himself in more dangerous situations already, Miles isn't bringing anything special to the table whereas Leon is bringing a high level of skill and tactical awareness that Miles can not counter. I only think raw CQC is debatable. Leon + Chris simultaneously would be more of a match for Peter himself rather than Miles.

@nickzambuto said:

Miles is probably comparable to Krauser. Miles has been able to throw a cop car, and also punched out a giant right? In that case he'd be a bit superior to Krauser. Although Krauser is a highly trained and experienced spec ops soldier while Miles is just a kid, so that evens things out. Do I think Leon can beat Miles in CQC? Possibly, but maybe not, as Krauser did take the upperhand on him during their knife fight through a combination of his stats and skill, so Miles sheer stats might be able to compensate. However, Leon did prove that he can last against Krauser, so he can last against Miles as well, and if he supplements that CQC with some precision gunshots and tactical maneuvering AKA the same thing he did in his second fight with Krauser which he won, then he can win here too.

The only thing I'd see giving Miles the win would be the Venom Sting, that hax piece of sh!t attack that always works...

Venom Sting is certainly the wild card in this match, in fact now that I think about it, that ability alone is making me re-evaluate my thoughts. Although pound-for-pound I do see Leon winning more often than not regardless.

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sirfizzwhizz

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@nickzambuto: Skill means little in most fights. Unless Leon is Daredevil or Batman in skill, he is not making up for the huge disadvantage in stats or powers.

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@nickzambuto: Skill means little in most fights. Unless Leon is Daredevil or Batman in skill, he is not making up for the huge disadvantage in stats or powers.

Skill means little in most fights? I just explained how Leon has been physically outmatched by opponents on par with Miles since RE2 and has won simply through skill, yet skill doesn't matter? We're not just talking about fist fighting here, Leon doesn't need to be on par with top tiers to beat Miles, he has a PLETHORA of skills INCLUDING martial arts, but also including firearms, explosives, blades, and tactical planning.

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sirfizzwhizz

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@nickzambuto: That came out wrong. Skill matters alot, but it matted little in most fights of overwhelming stats.

Daredevil is not beating say Spiderman. Batman is not beating say Heretic. Shang Chi is not beating Gorgon. What do these fights have in common? They were done and proven true.

The Stats are WAAAAY too much. Miles is a 6 (if not more) toner. He is bullet speed like Wesker. He has insane durability to blunt and kinetic force. Miles has in human agility.

All these stats are well above Leon, and add in webbing, invisibility, spider sense, venom sting, wall cralwing, ect powers... its overwhelming.

Finnaly Miles has some skill, skill enough to beat foes WELL above Miles weight class. People that a 100 Leon would not be able to beat honestly.

All this makes Leon medium level skill (he is no Daredevil or Batman in skill) is not remotely cutting it.

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renamed040924

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#14  Edited By renamed040924

@sirfizzwhizz said:

@nickzambuto: That came out wrong. Skill matters alot, but it matted little in most fights of overwhelming stats.

Daredevil is not beating say Spiderman. Batman is not beating say Heretic. Shang Chi is not beating Gorgon. What do these fights have in common? They were done and proven true.

The Stats are WAAAAY too much. Miles is a 6 (if not more) toner. He is bullet speed like Wesker. He has insane durability to blunt and kinetic force. Miles has in human agility.

All these stats are well above Leon, and add in webbing, invisibility, spider sense, venom sting, wall cralwing, ect powers... its overwhelming.

Finnaly Miles has some skill, skill enough to beat foes WELL above Miles weight class. People that a 100 Leon would not be able to beat honestly.

All this makes Leon medium level skill (he is no Daredevil or Batman in skill) is not remotely cutting it.

Those examples you listed are very different from the battle at hand. Not only are Heretic and Gorgon physically superior to Batman and Shang-Chi, but they also have their own respectable fighting skills on top to aid them even further. And about Peter Parker, the stat gap between him and Daredevil is huge whereas the gap between Leon and Miles might... not be that big, actually. Plus Peter is a far better fighter than Miles regardless which aids him.

I mean I can probably make a case for Leon being just as fast as Miles honestly. They're both pretty good bullet dodgers, but Leon is able to outmaneuver Tyrants and is almost untouchable to them, despite the fact that they are bullet timers themselves.

In a scenario like this, where the skill gap is FAR larger than the stat gap, the skilled fighter will win. If the stat gap was larger than the skill gap, as it is with Gorgon and Shang-Chi, then the stat fighter would win.

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@nickzambuto:

In a scenario like this, where the skill gap is FAR larger than the stat gap, the skilled fighter will win. If the stat gap was larger than the skill gap, as it is with Gorgon and Shang-Chi, then the stat fighter would win.

This is not true though. Miles is not a martial artist but still a smart fighter who taken down beings and characters well above the High street weight class. He does this through his own combat experience and power set. Why should someone way less then Electro, Venom, Green Goblin, Warmachine, Giant Woman, ect be a factor at all?

Your argument amounts to Captain America beating up someone like Luke Cage in a fight because he is more skilled. You show me what happens to a guy like leon, who is less than a ton in strength fights another with 6 ton strength. It would be like Mike Tyson vs a 5 year old kid who is a master fighter. The stats are still too much.

Your still not accounting for other powers. Miles uses invisibility to hide and surprise attack.What counters does Leon have in a random fight vs a person who can just go invisible? How about Webbing? What counter Leon have to being webbed up? Venom Sting? Need i say more? One touch win. Spider Sense? not a huge advatage, still helps to react to any attack Miles is not aware of.

Your not even counting on any of this is your posts. Leon loses. Both in stats and HAX powers. powers that Leon has no experience against.

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AllStarSuperman

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Venom sting FTW

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renamed040924

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@nickzambuto:

In a scenario like this, where the skill gap is FAR larger than the stat gap, the skilled fighter will win. If the stat gap was larger than the skill gap, as it is with Gorgon and Shang-Chi, then the stat fighter would win.

This is not true though. Miles is not a martial artist but still a smart fighter who taken down beings and characters well above the High street weight class. He does this through his own combat experience and power set. Why should someone way less then Electro, Venom, Green Goblin, Warmachine, Giant Woman, ect be a factor at all?

Your argument amounts to Captain America beating up someone like Luke Cage in a fight because he is more skilled. You show me what happens to a guy like leon, who is less than a ton in strength fights another with 6 ton strength. It would be like Mike Tyson vs a 5 year old kid who is a master fighter. The stats are still too much.

Your still not accounting for other powers. Miles uses invisibility to hide and surprise attack.What counters does Leon have in a random fight vs a person who can just go invisible? How about Webbing? What counter Leon have to being webbed up? Venom Sting? Need i say more? One touch win. Spider Sense? not a huge advatage, still helps to react to any attack Miles is not aware of.

Your not even counting on any of this is your posts. Leon loses. Both in stats and HAX powers. powers that Leon has no experience against.

Think of it this way. Neither of them are incompetent fighters, but whereas Miles is good at thinking on his feet, Leon is also good at thinking on his feet PLUS he has the more refined training and experience to aid him even further. Both Giant Woman and Venom were oneshotted by Miles' Venom Sting so those fights aren't examples of Miles using skill to overcome someone superior, and this might be a low showing, but since Ultimate Cap tore War Machine apart, I have to assume that he isn't very powerful either. Green Goblin is physically inferior to any generic Tyrant, although he does have his firepowers so that's something, and Elektro isn't the most competent guy either. Miles has his superpowers to help him defeat these opponents, Leon however needs to rely on pure skill. When Miles faces Elektro all he has to do is use his spider agility to dodge the blasts and then sock Elektro in the face, but Leon is just a human, he needs to constantly rely on more tactical awareness in order to overcome. I really don't see how you can argue that Miles is in any way comparable to Leon in regards to skill.

The physical difference between Captain America and Luke Cage is ginormous, Luke Cage is dozens and dozens of times stronger, but Miles is only maybe two or three times stronger than Leon, and not much faster at all. This stat gap is small enough that skill can overcome.

Leon has highly keen instincts and senses, on several occasions he has been able to anticipate danger and future ambushes despite no warning at all, and he has faced whole hordes of invisible opponents before who were just as agile as Miles, although unlike Miles, the Novistadors had razor sharp claws and were out for blood. They also spit acid, which is similar in danger to the Venom Sting. The fact that Leon defeated these creatures proves that his "skill" can overcome superpowers. The webbing isn't impossible to dodge nor is it impossible for Leon to shoot it down in midair or cut through it with his knife, and Ultimate spider sense isn't as advanced as maninstream Spider-Man's, nor is Miles as skilled with it as Peter Parker is. Granted, the Spider Sting is a huge advantage, but whereas you say one touch win, I counter with one bullet win.

Again, explain to me what makes Miles that much better than Jack Krauser. Because Krauser was strong enough to crush a thick steel beam in his grip, rip it up from the ground, and throw it like a spear at superhuman speeds hard enough to make the concrete explode. He was also fast enough to dodge bullets, leave after images, and disappear in flashes of light. Not to mention his mutated arm, just as dangerous as the Venom Sting since they both have the potential to oneshot Leon. Basically I'm not seeing a major stat gap between Krauser and Miles, and whereas Miles has his other superpowers, Krauser had an armament of weaponry including guns, explosives, and flash bangs, and super soldier skill and experience. Krauser is very comparable to Miles, and since he's obviously a much better fighter, I would say that Krauser can definitely defeat Miles. So if Leon was quick, skilled, and tactical enough to defeat Krauser, why can't he defeat Miles?

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sirfizzwhizz

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@nickzambuto: Krause did not have Spider Sense, Webbing, Wall Crawling, Invisibility, Venom Sting, or 6 ton strength.

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@nickzambuto: Krause did not have Spider Sense, Webbing, Wall Crawling, Invisibility, Venom Sting, or 6 ton strength.

No but he had the same training as Leon and much more experience, so his skill is likely superior to spider sense. Bullets are a far more dangerous projectile than webbing, wall crawling isn't really a combat ability, Krauser used flash bangs to vanish on Leon and then ambush him using stealth, and his mutated arm is even more dangerous than the venom sting. Krauser also had prep time and outfitted the entire area with traps, explosives, and robots to try and wear Leon down. This was a LOT going against Leon, and Krauser isn't much weaker than Miles.

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Miles nearly fodderizies him.

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#21 Sy8000  Online

Miles for once.

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Miles one shots

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@lukehero said:

Miles nearly fodderizies him.

Miles for once.

Miles one shots

Please explain why you feel this way despite the fact that Leon has already taken on and defeated multiple opponents who outclass Miles in strength, speed, durability, skill, regeneration, versatility, and almost every other category.

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#24  Edited By The_GodOfAnime

Don't know much about either of them but great argument.based off of what I read I say Leon wins and uses miles head as a soup bowl.XD the only way I see miles winning this fight is if he lands the venom sting,or is overall just plain lucky,but seven times out of ten I see leon coming out on top.

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#25 Sy8000  Online

@nickzambuto: Because I doubt those people had more than on-paper stats going for them.

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#26  Edited By renamed040924

@nickzambuto: Because I doubt those people had more than on-paper stats going for them.

What does that mean?

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#27 Sy8000  Online

@nickzambuto: It means powers don't always translate into combat. Miles is a pretty good testiment to that.

Also, invisibility.

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#28  Edited By renamed040924

@highaccuser said:

@nickzambuto: It means powers don't always translate into combat. Miles is a pretty good testiment to that.

Also, invisibility.

Why are you automatically assuming that the enemies Leon has faced were incompetent without any indication that they were? Are you just searching for a reason for Miles to win?

Also, Leon has countered invisible enemies.

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#29 Sy8000  Online

@highaccuser said:

@nickzambuto: It means powers don't always translate into combat. Miles is a pretty good testiment to that.

Also, invisibility.

Why are you automatically assuming that the enemies Leon has faced were incompetent without any indication that they were? Are you just searching for a reason for Miles to win?

Also, Leon has countered invisible enemies.

Why would I do that? I don't even particularly favor Miles. I specifically used Miles as an example of characters needing combat showings to match their abilities. If the people Leon faced did, good for them.

I didn't know. Although honestly Miles might just be able to move too fast for him to see. He was moving faster than Warmachines targeting computers could match. I don't think Leon has that kind of speed.

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@highaccuser: What makes you think moving too fast for a targeting computer to track is too fast for the human eye to see? Leon himself regularly defeats characters who appear as nothing more than big blurs when they move. The strength gap between Miles and Leon isn't terribly large, and the speed gap is even smaller.

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#31  Edited By Sy8000  Online

@nickzambuto said:

@highaccuser: What makes you think moving too fast for a targeting computer to track is too fast for the human eye to see? Leon himself regularly defeats characters who appear as nothing more than big blurs when they move. The strength gap between Miles and Leon isn't terribly large, and the speed gap is even smaller.

Computers can track things that move faster than humans can see right?

Moving as blurs is nothing special. Real life humans can do it under the right conditions.

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Really? :D

One powerfull web shoot and Leon has a hole :D

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Leo is dead

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44orhsaJ

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Considering nickzambutos argument I would like the Miles side to explain why Miles "nearly fodderizes Leon". I can see a win but I think nearly fodderizing him is an exaggeration....

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#36  Edited By Jestersmiles

@44orhsaj: Morals off Miles will just use the invisibility + Venom sting combo and finish him off. Morals he can just web him up if the fight not going his way, which I doubt it won't be.

The only reason this MIGHT be a fight is because Miles in character does not trust his spider sense as much peter but he still has other advantages. There no way of Leon winning here.

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44orhsaJ

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@44orhsaj: Morals off Miles will just use the invisibility + Venom sting combo and finish him off. Morals he can just web him up if the fight not going his way, which I doubt it won't be.

The only reason this MIGHT be a fight is because Miles in character does not trust his spider sense as much peter but he still has other advantages. There no way of Leon winning here.

Nick mentioned Leon fought invisible enemies before. As for webbing I don't see why its impossible to dodge it.

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#38  Edited By Jestersmiles

@44orhsaj: When has leon faced hordes of invisible enemies? and even if he did I bet none of them where the caliber of miles. Morals off Miles stomps Leon . As for webbing yeah Leon can dodge but for how long? Leon not even a Aim/bullet dodger, so I fail to see how miles won' t tag him with his webbing.

Miles 10/10

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44orhsaJ

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@44orhsaj: When has leon faced hordes of invisible enemies? and even if he did I bet none of them where the caliber of miles.

Not sure. I wasn't the one who brought the point up.

Morals off Miles stomps Leon . As for webbing yeah Leon can dodge but for how long? Leon not even a Aim/bullet dodger, so I fail to see how miles won' t tag him with his webbing.

Miles 10/10

How long can Miles dodge bullets from someone who knows how to shoot?

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#40  Edited By Jestersmiles

@44orhsaj: long enough to tag someone who not even a bullet dodger.

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#41  Edited By Jestersmiles
No Caption Provided

Miles moving to fast to be hit by multiple trained Hydra, Hydra who are professionally train by Nick Fury himself.

No Caption Provided

Miles dodges the very highly train SHIELD, and you can see moves as fast as the bullets are traveling.

I think he can dodge Leon just fine.

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@nickzambuto: miels definitely wins because eof the stat gap and miles feats

on a side note miles is atleast as skilled as peter if not more

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#43  Edited By renamed040924

@44orhsaj: I wouldn't listen to JesterSmiles. He hates me because I said Leon would beat Harley Quinn and follows me into half my threads to call me a "wanker". He also calls Batman "the Batgod" in a serious manner.

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#44  Edited By Jestersmiles

@nickzambuto: LOL I use the term batgod in a serious manner? lol proof? oh wait you don't have any. I don't care that you don't listen to me , hell makes my life easier but stuff making up stuff just to puff your self up, Oh wait I just told a wanker to stop wanking lol. nvm. If you going to say something about me have to guts to tag me .

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renamed040924

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#45  Edited By renamed040924

@nickzambuto: LOL I use the term batgod in a serious manner? lol proof? oh wait you don't any. I don't care that you don't listen to me , hell makes my life easier but stuff making up stuff just to puff your self up, Oh wait I just told a wanker to stop wanking lol. nvm. If you going to say something about me have to guts to tag me .

It takes guts to tag someone on an internet forum? I figured tagging you would have just been douchy.

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#46  Edited By Jestersmiles

@nickzambuto: no what seems douchy is making stuff up to make some one look bad but not surprised you did it. Again you got a problem with me I am right here.

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#47  Edited By Jestersmiles

@nickzambuto: again I am giving my honest opinion on a subject, stop thinking I am doing this out of spite for you. I COULD CARELESS ABOUT YOU, got it?

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