• 79 results
  • 1
  • 2
#1 Edited by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio

 





Kisuke Urahara was one of the most elite captains of the Soul Society until he was banished from the organization.  Urahara's laid back and upbeat demeanor often conceals that he is a genius level combatant, and has demonstrated he has both the ability to utilize large amounts of spirit pressure and a nuanced enough level of skill to utilize the most complex and demanding of techniques.  
VS




The mighty patriarch of the Uchiha Clan, Madara has gained such a mastery of the ninja arts that he has discovered the forbidden secret of immortality.  Now wielding the power of both the sharingan and rinnegan he is more of a menace than ever.  In the past the only ninja that had the power to defeat him was The 1st Hokage.
 
THE SITUATION:  Madara after going through a mass murdering rage through Tokyo, has finally found the shrine containing a scroll containing the knowledge of very powerful jutsu.  The only thing standing in his way is Urahara. Assuming spirit pressure and chakra function the same way who will win in this battle to the death?
#2 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio

If Madara's Sharingan can work on Urahara, then he wins

#3 Posted by D3athstroke (3911 posts) - - Show Bio

Urahara Stomp. Spite

#4 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@D3athstroke: You think Madara's sharingan will have no effect?
#5 Posted by D3athstroke (3911 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheGoldenOne:
Even if it will work on Kisuke it will Do no Harm to Him

I will Give 15 seconds to Madara
#6 Posted by All_StarSupes (74 posts) - - Show Bio

Looking at the set up, i favour Madara over Kisuke. Nothing Kisuke has done in the manga has been that impressive with the exception of sealing Aizen away, even then he needed Ichigos help. Also Madara has his Space/time teleport which can let him move where ever he wants, plus he now has the rinnegan and we all saw how powerful Nagato was.

#7 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@D3athstroke: If it works, then Urahara would be susceptible to genjutsu. Madara could win from that poin. But if his Sharingan doesn't work work on Urahara, then Urahara stomps hims.
#8 Edited by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio

Madara has not shown much feats. We haven't even seen Kisuke's Bankai. But, I know Kisuke will destroy Madara before he even lifts a finger.

#9 Posted by warlock360 (28050 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think either of them have been seen at their prime and therefore no one truly knows what they are capable of, i suggest a standstill on this for now.

#10 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious said:
"

Madara has not shown much feats. We haven't even seen Kisuke's Bankai. But, I know Kisuke will destroy Madara before he even lifts a finger.

"
With what attack?
#11 Posted by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheGoldenOne: 
 
Benihime's Nake technique.

#12 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: I think you are underestimating Madara. Don't get me wrong, Urahara is pretty powerful, but all that would be useless if he is affected by the sharingan.
#13 Posted by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheGoldenOne: 
 
We haven't seen Madara's eternal mangekyou sharingan do anything.
#14 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: True but we know what a normal sharingan and mangekyou sharingan can do. Plus he has a space/time jutsu
#15 Posted by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheGoldenOne: 
 
Could that space/time jutsu be linked to the sharingan? Because, when he absorbed Sasuke, he went into the dark hole of his orange  mysterious mask.
#16 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: I think it is, because Kakashi has used his sharingan to perform a similar feat.
#17 Posted by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheGoldenOne: 
 
 
 
True, since Kakashi used the technique on Deidara. It seemed to put strain on Kakashi. Also, Minato has a similar technique except that his is a speed feat.  
 
But, judging from Madara's technique, he seems to disappear slowly...Kisuke should be able to grab him before he vanishes.

#18 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: Maybe he was disappearing slowly for dramatic purposes? 
#19 Edited by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheGoldenOne: 
 
Or maybe that could be his limit? You do know Naruto characters don't stand a chance against Bleach characters, right?
#20 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: Yes, i'm aware Bleach characters are stronger than naruto characters. It's just that when it comes to the Uchiha clan, it's hard to beat them due to the sharingan. Madara without his sharingan would get slaughtered so bad.
#21 Posted by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio

The Uchiha Clan(As much as I like them) are overrated. Characters like Killer Bee can hold their own against the sharingan since he was able to snap out of the illusion that Sasuke cast on him.  
 
I mean, how do we know that the sharingan can work on characters that are outside of the Narutoverse? It can't be proven.

#22 Edited by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: Yes they can be overrated sometimes. Majority of the characters in Naruto are not on Killer Bee's level, so they would get owned by the sharingan. Since this is not a real battle and we don't know where they are fighting, i would assume it to be somewhere were both combatants powers are able to affect the other. If you say the sharingan can't work on characters outside the Narutoverse, then why should Kisuke's moves work on characters outside the Bleachverse? I know this is the second time i'm arguing for the Uchiha , but i'm not a fanboy. I don't really like them that much. Besides i don't know who would win here. Kisuke is very intelligent. If he is able to figure out the sharingan before it is used on him, he would probably form a new strategy and slaughter Madara! lol
#23 Posted by All_StarSupes (74 posts) - - Show Bio

Bleach is stronger than Naruto??? HA! People always say this but just look at the feats and you'll clearly see Naruto wins (and One piece as well). Bleach is nothing more than a hyperbole manga, where random characters beat each other and then lose to someone weaker. The only impressive thing I've seen in Bleach is Aizen destroying the Cleaner and thats about it.

#24 Edited by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheGoldenOne:  True, some are close to his level, though in some ways. But, I agree, this battle is as unreal as the characters, themselves. As for the battlefield, that needs clarification like the rest of the battle information does.If they are fighting, where their powers/abilities can have a damaging effect on each other, then both have some chances of challenging each other.  
 
 
Also, that is true about Kisuke's abilities affecting characters that are outside of the Bleachverse, these are two questions that beg for an answer. You make a good argument for the Uchiha group. I'm not trying to underestimate the Uchiha members, I am just trying to challenge your argument. 
 
Kisuke is more intelligent than Madara and if he does have prep, then he will win. But, if Madara does, too then he might have a chance but not an easy one. But, I agree again, Kisuke's strategy would slaughter Madara to death. lmao. :P 
#25 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio
@All_StarSupes: Bleach characters are stronger than Naruto character imo. 
 
@Nefarious: So we agree? :)
#26 Posted by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheGoldenOne: Yep. :)
#27 Posted by cascadeking09 (6752 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious said:
"

Madara has not shown much feats. We haven't even seen Kisuke's Bankai. But, I know Kisuke will destroy Madara before he even lifts a finger.

"
This
#28 Edited by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@cascadeking09: It seems it is always a spite when it comes to fighting Uchiha members.
#29 Posted by cascadeking09 (6752 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: True, but the only thing I see saving Madara in this one would be Izanagi.
#30 Edited by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@cascadeking09: Hmmm, I agree. Izanagi would be very helpful for Madara..he will have to time it right, though.
#31 Edited by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio

I stated in the OP that we are assuming that spirit pressure and chakra function the same way, so both opponents techniques would effect each other.  I also posted a picture of the shrine that they are fighting in front of in the OP.  I would say generally speaking that Bleach characters are more powerful than Naruto characters, but not universally.  Madara when compared to the rest of Naruto's characters he is much more powerful than the general cast of characters.  Madara is also by leaps and bounds the most powerful member of the Uchiha clan that ever lived.  So far in this thread it seems we have neglected the more basic powers of the sharingan.  The sharingan make its wielder hyper perceptive of any type of visual information which means he can read and predict movements and attacks with super human accuracy, as well as mimic combative movements and even entire fighting styles that his eye sees.  The sharingan and rinnegan both allow there user to directly perceive  chakra/spirit pressure, which means that if Madara sees the chakra/spirit pressure in Urahara's body suddenly behave differently he will know that Urahara is about to use a kido/jutsu.  Madara also can use jutsu from any of the elemental styles.  I'm not saying Madara would necessarily win, but this battle will be a rigorous struggle for both opponents.  Also to help inform this discussion since both characters are among the most powerful people in their story lines we will say that both opponents have a workable knowledge of each others abilities by way of reputation. 

#32 Posted by brvermee (31 posts) - - Show Bio
@All_StarSupes: indeed
#33 Posted by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
How much of a problem do you think that Madara's new rinnegan gravity manipulating abilities will be to Urahara?
#34 Posted by The Stegman (24045 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nefarious: but isn't Madara like Intagible? so kisuke CAN'T grab him, he'll go right through like Kakashi did when he attacked from behind
#35 Posted by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@kadeem: Hmm, it is possible that they would be difficult for Kisuke. I want to see those abilities, again.
#36 Posted by The Stegman (24045 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Stegman: *intangible,i meant to say
#37 Posted by TheAlmightyFrag (27 posts) - - Show Bio
@kadeem:  I'll have to go back and read it again, but I'm fairly certain that what Pain did to Konoha was on par with anything that's been done in Bleach (destruction-wise). I doubt Kisuke could have tanked that blast, though he could easily have escaped the AOE.
#38 Edited by Nefarious (19840 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Stegman: Yes, he is. But, that is true, Kisuke's attacks will just phase through Madara. I still  don't understand how/why that happens.
#39 Edited by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Stegman said:

" @Nefarious: but isn't Madara like Intagible? so kisuke CAN'T grab him, he'll go right through like Kakashi did when he attacked from behind "

@Nefarious said:
" @The Stegman: Yes, he is. But, that is true, Kisuke's attacks will just phase through Madara. I still  don't understand how/why that happens. "

Well Madara isn't intangible exactly, but I could see why you would think that.  The power he is mostly known for is his ability to directly manipulate physical space.  He can use this jutsu for a variety of feats such as teleporting himself and others.  He can also use this jutsu to blend any given point "A" in physical space into any point "B", which he often uses in combat both evasively and defensively in a manner that could be perceived as intangibility to someone who doesn't know he is just manipulating the physical space either around his body or around the object he wants to pass through.  You are right to say that he could use this jutsu to counter an up close attack though.
#40 Posted by The Stegman (24045 posts) - - Show Bio
@kadeem: right gotcha, so that being said, i dont see how kisuke can really hurt him unless he raises his spiritual pressure and physically overpowers him or gets him by surprise (however with the sharingan it'll be hard to surprise him) that being said, bleach characters are tough REALLY tough, some go through building and pillars and get right back up, so i dunno how many of of Madara's attacks will work on kisuke, im still going to give it to Madara for two reasons 
 
1. If he can trap Kisuke in that pocket dimension that he travels to, i dont see how Kisuke can escape unless he has the power to open portals (which he might, im a bit fuzzy on his powers 
 
or 2. if Madara traps him in a genjutsu 
#41 Posted by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Stegman: I think you made a pretty good account of one possible way the battle may play out.  I would of imagined though that while Madara was on the rampage, Urahara was observing Madara to learn about him.  While Madara has the ability to see chakra/spirit pressure with his eyes, Urahara has more of a sixth sense that allows him to sense chakra/spirit pressure with his mind,  In the past Urahara has used this ability to notice when and how the spirit pressure in opponents bodies behaves when they use any given kido/jutsu to evade or counter it, or at times even improvise a new kido specifically designed to counter his opponent's kido/jutsu.  It would be interesting if he was able to use this talent against Madara,  Its also worth pointing out that while Madara often does use his time/space jutsu defensively it is not automatic, he must be aware of attacks in order to use it effectively, and i can't see Urahara not noticing that being the tactical genius he is.  Since we said that they are aware of each other by way of reputation i think it would be safe to say that Urahara would no better than to make eye contact with him.
#42 Posted by The Stegman (24045 posts) - - Show Bio
@kadeem: yeah i do recall him having abilities like that and it's kinda vexing me (this battle i mean) because we know so little about their full power Kisuke's bankai, Madara's full power with the sharingan and Rinnegan. however i think Madara would be just a good a strategist as Kisuke, he did single handedly start a war as well as fight the 4th hokage on equal grounds, and im speculating here, but Itachi Uchiha didn't need eye contact to trap someone in genjutsu, he just had to merely point at him, i ASSUME since Madara is better trained in the sharingan abilities he could do the same
#43 Posted by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Stegman: You are right to say that Madara is better at sharingan based jutsu, but the jutsu Itachi used by pointing was not a sharingan based genjutsu.
#44 Posted by ssejllenrad (12847 posts) - - Show Bio

Madara.

#45 Posted by IIDEADxPOOLII (1414 posts) - - Show Bio

Seriously going with Urahara unless Madara can somehow pull off Izanagi on him not seeing him make it out alive.
#46 Posted by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
@IIDEADxPOOLII: How do you think Urahara will be able to deal with Madara using his gravity manipulation and time/space jutsu to counter his attacks?
#47 Posted by TheAlmightyFrag (27 posts) - - Show Bio
@kadeem said:

" @The Stegman: I think you made a pretty good account of one possible way the battle may play out.  I would of imagined though that while Madara was on the rampage, Urahara was observing Madara to learn about him.  While Madara has the ability to see chakra/spirit pressure with his eyes, Urahara has more of a sixth sense that allows him to sense chakra/spirit pressure with his mind,  In the past Urahara has used this ability to notice when and how the spirit pressure in opponents bodies behaves when they use any given kido/jutsu to evade or counter it, or at times even improvise a new kido specifically designed to counter his opponent's kido/jutsu.  It would be interesting if he was able to use this talent against Madara,  Its also worth pointing out that while Madara often does use his time/space jutsu defensively it is not automatic, he must be aware of attacks in order to use it effectively, and i can't see Urahara not noticing that being the tactical genius he is.  Since we said that they are aware of each other by way of reputation i think it would be safe to say that Urahara would no better than to make eye contact with him. "

 Not sure who would win, but in regards to the bold, Kisuke's got a cloak that hides his reiatsu. IIRC it worked well enough so that Aizen didn't feel him coming. If he knows that Madara can see spirit pressure, he could bring it to counter that ability.
#48 Posted by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheAlmightyFrag: Usually during these threads I have an opinion going in on who would win but this is one of those few threads where i can still see the fight going either way.  It is also a battle I would love to see for real although it is unlikely.  I didn't list the cloak in the OP because we are assuming that both opponents only have their usually artillery. Even if Urahara had the cloak, Madara still has and advantage in that as soon as his sharingan sees and energy blast eminating from Urahara's attacks it will be able to analyze and predict the power, speed, and direction of the blast, allowing him to evade or counter it.
#49 Posted by TheGoldenOne (38849 posts) - - Show Bio

To be honest, i see this going either way. I have to think about this more. i will be back.

#50 Posted by kadeem (2870 posts) - - Show Bio

 Anyone here who doesn't see the fight as going either way?