John 117 Vs. Steve Rogers (No Weapons or Armor)

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Doomnaut

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#1  Edited By Doomnaut

John 117

No Caption Provided

Ultimate Steve Rogers

No Caption Provided

Scenario

Win by death or knockout

No prep

Morals off

No weapons or armor

Hand to hand only

Setting

No Caption Provided

Who wins?

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Worlds_only_DC_fan

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John is bigger, has close to the same strength or more than Cap, can run as fast as Cap, and can jump really high. He also has Spartan hand to hand training and Cap has special forces training. I think MC wins 7/10.

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Cjdavis103

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#4  Edited By Cjdavis103
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OreoAssassin

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#5  Edited By OreoAssassin

John

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Doomnaut

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juiceboks

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#7 juiceboks  Moderator

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve. The guy is durable enough to tank hits from 100+tonners and hurt people MUCH more durable than Chief. I'd also bet that Ult Cap has greater h2h skills than John so he has that going for him. He wins quite handily IMO.

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SheenLantern

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#8  Edited By SheenLantern

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve.

I thought Chief was a 6 tonner without the armour?

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YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

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Captain America is arguably more skilled, but John isn't too shabby either. He dropped and killed numerous Orbital Drop Shock Troopers with ease while holding back at the age of 14. On top of that, John's augmentations are superior to Steve's super soldier serum, and grants John superior speed, strength, and reaction time in this battle. It's a good fight, but it's essentially an inferior copy versus the premium package. Master Chief wins.

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juiceboks

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#10  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@sheenlantern said:

@juiceboks said:

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve.

I thought Chief was a 6 tonner without the armour?

When was this shown? I don't remember any feats he has that would put him above Cap in terms of physicals. Everything he's done without his suit(which relatively isn't much) Steve has replicated to an equal or greater extent.

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YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

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@juiceboks: John's reaction speed is still above Cap's IIRC, even out of armor.

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Doomnaut

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bump.

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shroudofsorrow

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@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: Cap has greater H2H showings than beating featless ODSTs, though I am thinking of 616 Cap. Ultimate Cap is a different story, but even he was able to withstand hits from Ultimate Hulk (at least that's what I've been told).

Anyone have scans or recorded showings for the two's physical feats? Because it would be nice to have some more concrete information.

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texasdeathmatch

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#14  Edited By texasdeathmatch

Going with Ult Cap for this one. I just can't imagine an armorless John pulling off the same ridiculous feats that Cap has done.

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juiceboks

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#15 juiceboks  Moderator

@juiceboks: John's reaction speed is still above Cap's IIRC, even out of armor.

Is it really? Maybe on paper but feat by feat they seem pretty equal. Both have dodged bullets point blank and run through automatic gunfire.

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YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

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@shroudofsorrow said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek: Cap has greater H2H showings than beating featless ODSTs, though I am thinking of 616 Cap. Ultimate Cap is a different story, but even he was able to withstand hits from Ultimate Hulk (at least that's what I've been told).

Anyone have scans or recorded showings for the two's physical feats? Because it would be nice to have some more concrete information.

Ultimate Captain America is a lot more brutal, and all-around more powerful. He'd defeat 616 Captain America in a solid fight. My post two hours ago is incorrect though. I thought this was John without armor, but with augmentations, and Ultimate Cap without his shield or augmentations. I just realized this is a normal Ultimate Captain America, just unarmed. Cap should win this though, since he has a lot more feats and is all around more impressive than John without armor.

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek said:

@juiceboks: John's reaction speed is still above Cap's IIRC, even out of armor.

Is it really? Maybe on paper but feat by feat they seem pretty equal. Both have dodged bullets point blank and run through automatic gunfire.

Still, I don't think Cap is ten times faster than a human in terms of raw speed, traveling speed, or reaction speed. However, I do agree that Ultimate Cap should win here. I was misinformed in my first post and had thought this was John without armor, but with augmentations, versus Ultimate Cap without his shield and his super soldier serum taken away.

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juiceboks

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#17  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek John can run 300 mph without his suit? I mean, yea he's improved greatly over the years but that's pretty ridiculous.

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DKMfurlaff

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Cap is not more brutal than john

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YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

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@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek John can run 300 mph without his suit? I mean, yea he's improved greatly over the years but that's pretty ridiculous.

What are you referencing? I just want to know what feat to gauge with.

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MonsterStomp

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Not really sure. Could go either way.

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juiceboks

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#21  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@juiceboks said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek John can run 300 mph without his suit? I mean, yea he's improved greatly over the years but that's pretty ridiculous.

What are you referencing? I just want to know what feat to gauge with.

Nah, I'm asking you when did he showcase physicals 10x greater than a human's. Peak human speed is 30 mph so 10x that is 300.

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YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

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@juiceboks said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek said:

@juiceboks said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek John can run 300 mph without his suit? I mean, yea he's improved greatly over the years but that's pretty ridiculous.

What are you referencing? I just want to know what feat to gauge with.

Nah, I'm asking you when did he showcase physicals 10x greater than a human's. Peak human speed is 30 mph so 10x that is 300.

I don't think John can run that fast lol. The most he's run was at speeds that outraced 50mm bullets, which travel at an average of 2750 - 2850 feet per second. That was his first trial run with the MJOLNIR MARK V Armor with Cortana though.

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Jmarshmallow

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Ultimate Cap? He should win. If nothing else than it's just based on his superior feats.

Jmarshmallow

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juiceboks

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#24  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek said:

@juiceboks said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek said:

@juiceboks said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek John can run 300 mph without his suit? I mean, yea he's improved greatly over the years but that's pretty ridiculous.

What are you referencing? I just want to know what feat to gauge with.

Nah, I'm asking you when did he showcase physicals 10x greater than a human's. Peak human speed is 30 mph so 10x that is 300.

I don't think John can run that fast lol. The most he's run was at speeds that outraced 50mm bullets, which travel at an average of 2750 - 2850 feet per second. That was his first trial run with the MJOLNIR MARK V Armor with Cortana though.

Any notable feats he has without the armor? I can't think of any sides the ODST beatdown and being a blur to highly trained soldiers.

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Shot

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#25  Edited By Shot

John works on efficiency. John is faster, stronger and more durable. Probably the same skills and adaption. He Accidently killed 14 highly trained ODST soldiers unarmed without his armor during training when he was like 14 years old. John is very brutal and one of the best Spartans. In the end, it could go either way since they both don't have their weapons.

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PaperCut1969

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#26  Edited By PaperCut1969

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek You say Masterchief out ran 50mm bullets? He would have to go 1875 mph...... That's the speed of an F-15. Maybe I'm reading your comment wrong, but I don't think Masterchief can run that fast with his suit. Or maybe I just did my "math" horribly wrong.

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YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

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@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek You say Masterchief out ran 50mm bullets? He would have to go 1875 mph...... That's the speed of an F-15. Maybe I'm reading your comment wrong, but I don't think Masterchief can run that fast with his suit. Or maybe I just did my "math" horribly wrong.

Keep in mind the SkyHawk Jet caught Chief off guard and practically came out of nowhere.

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Veshark

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What exactly has MC accomplished without his armor? Also, what are his physical stats?

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Edude117

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#29  Edited By Edude117

@juiceboks said:

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve. The guy is durable enough to tank hits from 100+tonners and hurt people MUCH more durable than Chief. I'd also bet that Ult Cap has greater h2h skills than John so he has that going for him. He wins quite handily IMO.

A little above peak human? No. No, he's quite above peak human. I mean... a lot above peak human. And of course Ult Steve has more feats. Chief rarely fights without his suit on. Actually, never fights without it on. Only when he was still back in training. Their H2H skills are about even, in my opinion. I wouldn't go as far as to say that Chief is better, but he's most definitely not worse.

@veshark said:

What exactly has MC accomplished without his armor? Also, what are his physical stats?

At the age of fourteen, killed three ODST's with his bare hands. They're the best of the best. Like... best... of the freakin' best. An ODST can take on an Elite. He's got microsecond reaction time and Chief, when he runs, can accelerate to 60 miles an hour instantly.

@sheenlantern said:

@juiceboks said:

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve.

I thought Chief was a 6 tonner without the armour?

Nope. Without the suit on, he weighs about 300 pounds.

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SheenLantern

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#30  Edited By SheenLantern

@edude117 said:

@sheenlantern said:

@juiceboks said:

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve.

I thought Chief was a 6 tonner without the armour?

Nope. Without the suit on, he weighs about 300 pounds.

I didn't mean he weighed 6 tons I meant he could lift 6 tons.

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Edude117

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@edude117 said:

@sheenlantern said:

@juiceboks said:

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve.

I thought Chief was a 6 tonner without the armour?

Nope. Without the suit on, he weighs about 300 pounds.

I didn't mean he weighed 6 tons I meant he could lift 6 tons.

Oh, haha. Yeah, for a second there, I was like... really?

Armorless, he can lift a maximum of about 2 tons, I believe.

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godzilla44

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I'm not sure about this one, no one really posting any feats that puts anybody over anybody. People keep saying that cap was hit by a 100+ hulk, did ultimate hulk do anything that put him above 100+ tons?

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Veshark

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I'm not sure about this one, no one really posting any feats that puts anybody over anybody. People keep saying that cap was hit by a 100+ hulk, did ultimate hulk do anything that put him above 100+ tons?

Here:

No Caption Provided

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Stupid_People

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@edude117 said:

@sheenlantern said:

@juiceboks said:

John's a little above peak human without the suit and doesn't have any feats to match up against Ult Steve.

I thought Chief was a 6 tonner without the armour?

Nope. Without the suit on, he weighs about 300 pounds.

I didn't mean he weighed 6 tons I meant he could lift 6 tons.

IIRC not even close. From reading Fall of Reach I believe they can lift 3x their body weight out of suit.

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eagerbuttermilk

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#35  Edited By eagerbuttermilk
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#37  Edited By godzilla44

@veshark: thanks I haven't read the ultimate series yet, I've only seen the animated movies that's it.

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@eagerbuttermilk: Chief inside the MJOLNIR MARK V Armor would stomp Cap even with his shield. John in armor is too much.

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adhd_assassin

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i ran this thread a while back. cap won due to better feats

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Doomnaut

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Dark Cloud™

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Ultimate Cap for the win!

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ChildoftheAtom

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Ultimate captain would win

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SheenLantern

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IIRC not even close. From reading Fall of Reach I believe they can lift 3x their body weight out of suit.

@comicstooge You got some 'splaining to do.

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ComicStooge

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SheenLantern

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@comicstooge:

MC is a 6 tonner, with reflexes above peak human and durability that Ozy can't possibly match.

Ozy gets crushed.

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ComicStooge

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@sheenlantern: I'm on my phone, so I can't post scans and such, so I won't be able to properly respond to you for a long while.

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SheenLantern

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ComicStooge

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@sheenlantern: That's code for 'I'm holidaying overseas and don't have the time or energy to engage in a serious debate'. ;)

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ChildoftheAtom

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@stupid_people:

The ultimate captain America can lift up to 3 tons. If master chief is out of suit captain has this in strength. Plus Steve can't get fatigued