#1 Posted by RogueShadow (10764 posts) - - Show Bio

Round 1: Both armed with a machete and a shotgun. Fight takes place in I am Legend's New York. They have until nightfall to kill their opponent. Nightfall is 20:00 it is 19:00. Begin 200 feet apart in cover.

Round 2: Both unarmed in a bar. Win by death or KO.

Round 3: Jesus is tasked with taking Ellie to the Firefly lab. Do they make it? Does he save her? Same world as TLOU. Starts with the same gear. Tess is not present.

Round 4: Joel & Ellie vs Jesus & Rick. Fight takes place in Woodbury. Standard gear. To the death.

#3 Posted by AllStarSuperman (21878 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrterminator: Lol no. Its Jesus/Paul macer from the walking dead

#4 Posted by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not comfortable with saying Joel beats Jesus...

#5 Posted by texasdeathmatch (13171 posts) - - Show Bio

After just playing Last of Us and reading the latest Walking Dead TPB, gotta go with Jesus. Dude caught a spear and took on like 3 armed guys without a weapon.

#6 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

Round 1: Joel stomps

Round 2: Jesus stomps

Round 3: Joel wins

Round 4: Not enough information.

If there's anything involving stealth, Joel stomps. If there's anything involving hand-to-hand combat, Jesus stomps. If there's anything involving navigating difficult terrain, especially in TLOU world, Joel wins.

#7 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

After just playing Last of Us and reading the latest Walking Dead TPB, gotta go with Jesus. Dude caught a spear and took on like 3 armed guys without a weapon.

That's not very impressive. Joel killed hundreds of clickers and humans in the video game. Joel routinely took out groups of 30-40 mercenaries, groups of clickers, etc.

#8 Edited by texasdeathmatch (13171 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari: As impressive as those numbers are, I didn't see the level of H2H skill that Jesus has displayed. Joel has never purposely disarmed his opponents, just charges them with a few slugs to the face like a brawler, or chokes them out. These are feats I can see Jesus easily repeating, if not better. He's gracefully disarmed his opponents with ease, while Joel has a more brutal, in-your-face approach to his attacks, which won't work well against Jesus.

#9 Posted by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

After just playing Last of Us and reading the latest Walking Dead TPB, gotta go with Jesus. Dude caught a spear and took on like 3 armed guys without a weapon.

If 3 guys is Jesus's limit than Joel absolutely stomps him. Taking on multiple armed enemies with very limited supplies is the entire premise behind Last of Us.

#10 Posted by Elzio1 (120 posts) - - Show Bio

Round 1: Joel stomps

Round 2: Jesus stomps

Round 3: Joel wins

Round 4: Not enough information.

If there's anything involving stealth, Joel stomps. If there's anything involving hand-to-hand combat, Jesus stomps. If there's anything involving navigating difficult terrain, especially in TLOU world, Joel wins.

THIS

#11 Posted by texasdeathmatch (13171 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: Joel can take on multiple guys at the same time because he has a health bar. I don't like your style of debating with video game characters, so good day to you, sir.

#12 Posted by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: Joel can take on multiple guys at the same time because he has a health bar. I don't like your style of debating with video game characters, so good day to you, sir.

Joel doesn't have a health bar in canon, obviously. You're saying he didn't fight multiple guys in canon?

#13 Posted by texasdeathmatch (13171 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: I did say good day to you, but here:

He can, but not without taking a few licks from other opponents. From what I've seen, Jesus is much more capable of disarming and taking on groups of enemies without using stealth (not to mention completely unarmed). I just don't see Joel repeating what Jesus did without it turning into a whole confrontation that requires hiding behind boxes and random bottle throwing. Or just brawling with his opponents.

Several times during cinematics or quicktime evens, Joel is taken off guard in the game and almost choked out, drowned, or knocked off a railing. Jesus is way more agile and able to subdue his opponents with ease. And IIRC, Jesus was able to take out enemies with his hands tied behind his back.

I don't know, believe what you want, but I've played Last of Us and read Walking Dead (and love them both, so no bias here) and don't think Joel has a chance unless he's way better equipped than Jesus, and even then, Jesus has a chance of subduing him.

#14 Edited by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

@texasdeathmatch said:

@nickzambuto: I did say good day to you, but here:

He can, but not without taking a few licks from other opponents. From what I've seen, Jesus is much more capable of disarming and taking on groups of enemies without using stealth (not to mention completely unarmed). I just don't see Joel repeating what Jesus did without it turning into a whole confrontation that requires hiding behind boxes and random bottle throwing. Or just brawling with his opponents.

Several times during cinematics or quicktime evens, Joel is taken off guard in the game and almost choked out, drowned, or knocked off a railing. Jesus is way more agile and able to subdue his opponents with ease. And IIRC, Jesus was able to take out enemies with his hands tied behind his back.

I don't know, believe what you want, but I've played Last of Us and read Walking Dead (and love them both, so no bias here) and don't think Joel has a chance unless he's way better equipped than Jesus, and even then, Jesus has a chance of subduing him.

You're acting as if stealth isn't an option here. Jesus can be as good at H2H as he wants, if he never sees Joel then he won't be able to utilize it. Joel has highly conditioned senses so stealth won't work against him, and I believe he's the better shot, so he can take Jesus out at a range without even being spotted.

#15 Edited by texasdeathmatch (13171 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: I actually mentioned stealth a couple times. And I also mentioned Joel has a chance if he has better gear...This is exactly why I didn't want to debate with you, haha.

Yes, under the specific circumstances like Joel having a rifle and having quite the distance between himself and Jesus, he will snipe Jesus. But if they are closer, Jesus has shown the ability to sense enemies close by, like recently when someone tried to throw a spear at him while hidden in the woods, which Jesus was able to easily catch without warning and while trying to talk to the hidden guy.

You're using in-game feats with his "highly conditioned senses", so really, now, I'm done debating with you. Sorry.

#16 Edited by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

@texasdeathmatch said:

@nickzambuto: I actually mentioned stealth a couple times. And I also mentioned Joel has a chance if he has better gear...This is exactly why I didn't want to debate with you, haha.

Yes, under the specific circumstances like Joel having a rifle and having quite the distance between himself and Jesus, he will snipe Jesus. But if they are closer, Jesus has shown the ability to sense enemies close by, like recently when someone tried to throw a spear at him while hidden in the woods, which Jesus was able to easily catch without warning and while trying to talk to the hidden guy.

You're using in-game feats with his "highly conditioned senses", so really, now, I'm done debating with you. Sorry.

You're honestly not being professional enough for me to bother.

#17 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

Are you referring to "Listen Mode"? That's not actually heightened senses, that's a gameplay feature implemented to revamp a genre's style of stealth gameplay. Humans cannot see through walls dude.

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#19 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

@saren said:

@deranged_midget said:

Are you referring to "Listen Mode"? That's not actually heightened senses, that's a gameplay feature implemented to revamp a genre's style of stealth gameplay. Humans cannot see through walls dude.

Stuff and nonsense. Are you telling me Shepard doesn't slow down time when you pull up the powers bar?

As a matter of fact, no! You see, Shepard and his "enemies" are all actually just playing a futuristic reimagining of what we now refer to as "paintballing". In this case though, the players involved seek out as much realism as they can and work through hiring special effects artists for makeup and sets, military advisors for the next best thing to actually weaponry and gear and hire the best pilots to take over for the Normandy (which is actually the only thing which is real).

Oh and since we've concocted ways to respawn in the future, no one's actually too afraid of someone going off the rails and occasionally bringing mechs, invincible ninja's for hire or even an M-920 Cain, which packs enough power as a tactical nuke!

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#20 Posted by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

Are you referring to "Listen Mode"? That's not actually heightened senses, that's a gameplay feature implemented to revamp a genre's style of stealth gameplay. Humans cannot see through walls dude.

It's reflective of his naturally advanced senses of hearing and sight dude, which has allowed him to hear footsteps coming from several floors below which Ellie didn't even notice, listen in on Sam and Henry's conversation from a distance away while they were actively trying to not let him hear (on the shore after Joel and Ellie jumped off the bridge), and pinpoint the snipers position in town while being shot at.

#21 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

It's reflective of his naturally advanced senses of hearing and sight dude, which has allowed him to hear footsteps coming from several floors below which Ellie didn't even notice, listen in on Sam and Henry's conversation from a distance away while they were actively trying to not let him hear (on the shore after Joel and Ellie jumped off the bridge), and pinpoint the snipers position in town while being shot at.

Hearing someone walking down a hallway is completely different from what you're referencing. Outside of pure combat encounters, Joel has been taken down in the most ridiculous of circumstances and consistently so during cutscenes by regular humans where in gameplay, where the player is given mechanics to aid them. Joel is capable of expanding on Listening Mode through upgrades which allow the player to see through walls. It's not exactly reflective of natural "advanced" senses mate because there is nothing to state or prove that he's in possession of anything special in that regard.

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#22 Posted by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto said:

It's reflective of his naturally advanced senses of hearing and sight dude, which has allowed him to hear footsteps coming from several floors below which Ellie didn't even notice, listen in on Sam and Henry's conversation from a distance away while they were actively trying to not let him hear (on the shore after Joel and Ellie jumped off the bridge), and pinpoint the snipers position in town while being shot at.

Hearing someone walking down a hallway is completely different from what you're referencing. Outside of pure combat encounters, Joel has been taken down in the most ridiculous of circumstances and consistently so during cutscenes by regular humans where in gameplay, where the player is given mechanics to aid them. Joel is capable of expanding on Listening Mode through upgrades which allow the player to see through walls. It's not exactly reflective of natural "advanced" senses mate because there is nothing to state or prove that he's in possession of anything special in that regard.

I wouldn't say he consistently gets taken down, the only instance I can think of is when he got ambushed inside the truck, but that was after he crashed it into a wall at high speeds and probably almost broke his own neck. And even then, he was able to recover almost immediately and overpower both attackers. Joel was able to kill the Firefly soldier Ethan extremely casually at the end of the game despite being held at gunpoint, and he also overpowered two of David's men simultaneously and captured them while still suffering from being impaled by a lead pipe a few weeks earlier, so I would say Joel is capable of taking at least a few goons on at once. The only time he was ever truly defeated was when a Hunter surprised him out of nowhere, and kicked Joel in the face down a ladder. Joel wasn't able to overpower him, but to be fair he just fell 10 feet and had the wind knocked out of him to say the least, and the Hunter had him at a severe leverage disadvantage under the water (I never said Joel was Batman, but two or three guys in a fair fight, he can take)

Like I said, Joel has other instances of showing impressive hearing/sight abilities without listen mode, I listed three (in one of the game's first trailers, he heard a group of infected running around the instant they entered the floor below him, whereas Ellie was completely oblivious. That's what I was referencing)

#23 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

I wouldn't say he consistently gets taken down, the only instance I can think of is when he got ambushed inside the truck, but that was after he crashed it into a wall at high speeds and probably almost broke his own neck. And even then, he was able to recover almost immediately and overpower both attackers. Joel was able to kill the Firefly soldier Ethan extremely casually at the end of the game despite being held at gunpoint, and he also overpowered two of David's men simultaneously and captured them while still suffering from being impaled by a lead pipe a few weeks earlier, so I would say Joel is capable of taking at least a few goons on at once. The only time he was ever truly defeated was when a Hunter surprised him out of nowhere, and kicked Joel in the face down a ladder. Joel wasn't able to overpower him, but to be fair he just fell 10 feet and had the wind knocked out of him to say the least, and the Hunter had him at a severe leverage disadvantage under the water (I never said Joel was Batman, but two or three guys in a fair fight, he can take)

Like I said, Joel has other instances of showing impressive hearing/sight abilities without listen mode, I listed three (in one of the game's first trailers, he heard a group of infected running around the instant they entered the floor below him, whereas Ellie was completely oblivious. That's what I was referencing)

I can't pinpoint too many instances of the top of my head nor do I really feel like spoiling any of the ones that are listed from crucial points in the story. I'm not here to argue Jesus vs Joel, I'm merely concerning my efforts towards what you stated in regards to Joel's "senses' which I believe to be... a little skewed. On everything else, I can agree with or will take your word on. Although, comparing a fully grown adults senses, one has lived in this post apocalyptic world for nearly(?) two decades to that of a child's isn't exactly a fair comparison, especially when Ellie herself remarked how she almost never spent any real time in the world outside of what she was protected from.

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#24 Posted by nickzambuto (13698 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto said:

I wouldn't say he consistently gets taken down, the only instance I can think of is when he got ambushed inside the truck, but that was after he crashed it into a wall at high speeds and probably almost broke his own neck. And even then, he was able to recover almost immediately and overpower both attackers. Joel was able to kill the Firefly soldier Ethan extremely casually at the end of the game despite being held at gunpoint, and he also overpowered two of David's men simultaneously and captured them while still suffering from being impaled by a lead pipe a few weeks earlier, so I would say Joel is capable of taking at least a few goons on at once. The only time he was ever truly defeated was when a Hunter surprised him out of nowhere, and kicked Joel in the face down a ladder. Joel wasn't able to overpower him, but to be fair he just fell 10 feet and had the wind knocked out of him to say the least, and the Hunter had him at a severe leverage disadvantage under the water (I never said Joel was Batman, but two or three guys in a fair fight, he can take)

Like I said, Joel has other instances of showing impressive hearing/sight abilities without listen mode, I listed three (in one of the game's first trailers, he heard a group of infected running around the instant they entered the floor below him, whereas Ellie was completely oblivious. That's what I was referencing)

I can't pinpoint too many instances of the top of my head nor do I really feel like spoiling any of the ones that are listed from crucial points in the story. I'm not here to argue Jesus vs Joel, I'm merely concerning my efforts towards what you stated in regards to Joel's "senses' which I believe to be... a little skewed. On everything else, I can agree with or will take your word on. Although, comparing a fully grown adults senses, one has lived in this post apocalyptic world for nearly(?) two decades to that of a child's isn't exactly a fair comparison, especially when Ellie herself remarked how she almost never spent any real time in the world outside of what she was protected from.

She might be a child, but Ellie more than proved herself during the Winter Chapter where she was stealthing Clickers and beat David at hide n' seek.

#25 Posted by RogueShadow (10764 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump.