Iroh & Zuko vs. Ozai & Azula (Sozin's comet)

Duel Agni Kai

Iroh & Zuko vs Ozai & Azula

The events of Sozin's comet diverge and everything unfolds differently. Ozai stays in the capitol with Azula, anticipating Zuko and Iroh’s arrival, while his fleet still burn down the earth kingdom. Both Iroh and Zuko confront Ozai and Azula at the palace. How will events differ. Who would win this royal rumble?

Note: The conditions of the fight are the same, but Ozai and Iroh are added.

Location: Royal Palace

Starting Distance: 100 metres

• fight to the death
• Both sides have prep and knowledge
• Both sides are determined to kill the other

Round 2: Sane Azula

Iroh solos while drinking tea and playing pai sho

Lot of Avatar threads been popping up lately.

Zuko is better than crazy azula as proven. Ozai's feats as a firebender looked far better than iroh's imo, but he gets killed by redirected lightening, which is ic for him to spam. So team 1 more often than not.

@experio: Avatar's an awesome show

Iroh and Zuko could probably win. Zuko was beating Azula, if he could finish her off he could help Iroh against Ozai (if he needs help) Lightning redirection would come in handy, assuming there's no Katara around

Iroh could supposedly match Ozai, but never had the feats to prove it.

So Ozai solos.

Iroh probably solo's.

I mean, neither of team two can lightning redirect...

If it were reduced to JUST fire bending then team 2 should take it.

Ozai vs Iroh would be an even fight, neither of them is soloing

Zuko could match Ozai for a temporary amount of time. He clearly had the upper hand during the agni kai during Azula. Iroh, has impressive feats like breaking the walls of Ba sing Se with one blow andescaping his prison during the invasion with ease.

@jbourne_32: None of that is proof that they can beat a forest buster who can freaking fly.

Ozai wins it for the team. Feats speak louder than vague assumptions. Ozai has much better feats than Iroh, from what I've SEEN, he wins.

As for Azula vs Zuko, it was the single most disappointing fight of the series. Azula has clearly shown to be better than him every time they fought, but he beats her cause she's suddenly crazy? Okay, whatever. But, it is a feat...so yeah, Zuko beats crazy Azula. But still loses to Ozai.

@jonez120: Iroh knows how to use lightning and can redirect it... Why wouldn't Iroh just use lightning on the two of them? It IS a battle to the death.

@boringperson: And Ozai knows that Iroh can redirect lightning so he could just chuck 50 feet wide fireballs at him.

It is a battle to the death.

@the_stegman: She was never shown to be clearly better than Zuko after the dragons.

Huh? More like arguably best fight of the series. She was not "suddenly crazy" they had been setting up her descent into insanity the last six episodes of the season starting with Mai and Ty Lee's betrayal. Then there is the fact that Zuko was fresh off of learning from the original firebending masters, and the fact that she had been static in her abilities while Zuko had been continuously growing in his ability throughout all 3 seasons. Your Azula love misleads you this time hotman.

I agree about Iroh and Ozai. iroh's only chance at defeating his brother from feats shown in the series is to hit him with lightning/redirect his lightning back at him.

@jonez120:

"a forest buster who can freaking fly."

that description. Lol.

He won because he learned from the dragons dude, not cause she was crazy. The whole point was Zuko hit rock bottom until he joined team avatar and learned from the dragons to regain his firebending. With his change of luck he also had his powers amped.

Team one wins.

I would say it was definitely a combination of both, as it was specifically mentioned in dialogue that she was slipping and that was the reason he believed he could beat her.

@jbourne_32: He won both because of the dragons and because she was going insane. There was no "change of luck" amping his powers

thats not actually what I meant. I said while his life was taking a positive turn he also became more powerful. Also, I dont get how azula was going insane. Everything she did in that fight seemed really in character for her.

I think Zuko had overcome Azula skill wise by the end of the series.

There is nothing to suggest that. Zuko himself requests that Katara come along because he can't beat Azula alone. Only once he sensed that her sanity had started slipping did he think he could defeat her one on one.

@jbourne_32: It started after Mai and Ty Lee betrayed Azula. You can see before the fight how she was losing it, seeing visions of her mom and stuff

Umm, minus the fact that she had no composure, was clearly off her game, and fought completely differently than we had ever seen her fight before. Usually she was completely calm, cool, tactical. In this fight she was out of control.

@jbourne_32: @lunacyde: Exactly how does learning one firebending combo suddenly make him better than Azula? He learned the Dragon Dance and it reestablished his confidence, but it still shouldn't put him at a level higher than her. Zuko won because Azula was off her game and crazy.

@lunacyde: There is so much to suggest it. He asked Katara along to help, being humble and cautious doesn't mean that he isn't better. For example, watch the fight below Ba Sing Se, where he betrays Aang. He performs significantly better against Katara then Azula does, and shows impressive fire bending overall.

Secondly, he got trained by dragons. It completely changed his technique, and further increased his skill. By the end of the series he could redirect lighting, which cancels out Azula's lightning, which was the only thing she had over him by that point. I am very confident in saying so. He is probably ten times better at the end of the series than he was at the beginning, if not more.

@the_stegman: Compare their fights with each other before and after the dragons. Before, she could destroy him with ease (like at the abandoned city). Afterwards they were fairly even (as seen at the Boiling Rock and the airships). He was using a new technique, and had a new source for firebending, and clearly it made a difference

He didn't just learn the Dancing Dragon, he was granted visions about the origin and true meaning of firebending. He had a different source for his firebending, the true (and it was inferred stronger) source. Because he drew his firebending from life, not rage or hate, his firebending was shown more efficient.

Also, I already explained it was a combination of the two factors.

I already have commented multiple times how the dragons granted him the visions of the true origin of firebending and gave him a new source for his firebending. At the Boiling Rock after he learned from the dragons, but before she started going crazy they stalemated. When she arrived at the Western Air Temple on Airships immediately after being betrayed they stalemated again. Only once she had gone full-blown nuts was it ever shown that he was clearly superior. I also already commented on how much he improved from season 1 to the season 3 finale so you aren't telling me anything I haven't already said myself.

@jonez120: Lightning won't be stopped by any sized fireball...

Neither of team 2 has any answer to Iroh's lightning.

@lunacyde: How does her being crazy hurt her firebending anyways? Zuko is obviously better by the finale.

@thebourneposter: it hurts her fighting style so she's not as focused or efficient as she was before. He's obviously better than her in the finale because of this. He didn't learn anything between their stalemates and the Agni Kai, so the only reason for him to have an advantage would be because she was going crazy

I don't know how he is "obviously better" when the previous two times they fought it was a stalemate.

How does her being crazy not effect her ability to fight? You seriously think someone in the middle of a full-blown mental breakdown is going to fight as well as someone who is methodical, tactical, and thinking clearly? She was seeing things and displaying paranoid schizophrenic tendencies for goodness sake. That fight was the first time in the entire series where we really see her struggle, where she is out of breath, where she isn't completely cool and collected plotting out every move she makes.

Iroh really didn't get to fight during the comet though, but from what was shown, he was easily on Ozai's level after shown being capable of blowing a giant hole in the impenetrable Bai Sing Se wall and blocking several comet amped up fire blast. We don't know how powerful Ozai was without comet, but Iroh was one of the most powerful firebender in the series.

Dancing Dragon>>>> Prodigious skill.

In fairness it was the betrayal of Mai and Ty Lee that finally tipped her over the edge.

@lunacyde: I will concede that you have more evidence backing your point of view. I disagree, I think that Zuko just progressed past her, but I can't prove it. So, for the purposes of this debate, I lost.

Iroh most definitely does not solo. his firebending feats under the comet might be on Ozai's level, but Iroh has NO feats of speed or agility that even come close to Ozai. Ozai could fly well enough to temporarily outmaneuver Aang in the Avatar State using a giant wind ball of doom. Even during the comet Iroh never flew, and in all his fights he consistently uses a slow, steady fighting style. I'll also point out it took Iroh quite a bit of focus and charging up to destroy the walls of Ba Sing Se. Ozai was searing away a massive swath of land with much less effort.

The most compelling evidence though, is that when asked if he would defeat Ozai his response was:

"Even if I did defeat Ozai, and I don't know if I could..."

You can tell by his expression and his tone that he doesn't think he's capable enough to do it. This isn't just sage humility either. Iroh is a humble man, but he's also very confident. He KNEW he could casually destroy Zhao and his soldiers when he made his threat concerning the Moon Spirit. He wasn't even slightly worried about the prospect of fighting the earthbenders after they captured him. In fact he didn't even see fit to use his firebending in that fight! He also showed zero concern with facing the Rough Rhinos or even the Dai Li agents when he was massively outnumbered. This however is the sole moment where we see Iroh doubt his ability to survive an encounter.

Ozai was just as powerful a bender as his older brother and in way better physical condition. He might not beat Iroh easily, but he'd definitely take the majority.

I can only go upon what is shown to me in the show, otherwise it's merely opinion and wishful thinking. I enjoyed our little debate though. I agree that he progressed greatly and that he may have even equaled her, but he did not surpass her by any quantifiable way.

@lunacyde: Yeah, going by the facts, which we have to go by, you're right. I just have my conjecture. :)

Its hard to debate a fight between Iroh and Ozai because one has little to no feats with the comet while the other has only feats with the comet.

Precisely.

I'm still in the school of thought that overall Ozai is more powerful, and that Iroh really truly did not think that he could beat him 1 v. 1. I think Iroh is much wiser, and perhaps more varied and skilled in all facets, but I do not think he was as powerful of a firebender.

@lunacyde: I've always taught that Azula was a crazy and sadistic freaky chic to be honest. And honestly speaking trying to electrocute katara seemed to be the usual path she would have taken. She seemed pretty in character to me, mocking "Zu-Zu" before the fight cheating to beat Zuko, that's my take on it. She only was insane after Katara chained her

Iroh showed exceptional agility throughout the series, and all before he got in much better shape in the prison(which he broke out of single handed without firebending) before the finale. I don't think Ozai has more agility or power, considering Iroh blasting the hole in Bai Sing Se was more powerful than anything Ozai performed on his fight with Aang. I also interpreted what Iroh said differently than how some others took it. I took it to mean that he may not have been willing to kill his brother in a fight and would probably be too hesitant if he ever did fight him.

I'm going with Iroh and Zuko for the win, due to Azula being crazy. If she wasn't I'd probably give it to her and Ozai.

Did you not see her before the fight when she was freaking out at everyone and having visions of her mom?

@experio: yeah not as much as kickass threads their on here everyday!

@metaljimmor@arcus

The fight at the boling rock was in fact more balanced, and Zuko is far more controlled and focus than he normally is, in contrast to their previous encounters. However, d]you will notice that Azula's mobility is hindered, due to being confined to the edge of the gondola. She is literally standing at the edge. Azula is all about mobility and making use of the space around her, which she couldnt dp as she was confined to the edge of the gunderla. However, she is able to make use of the limited space that she haste maneuver, and as always, she is calm, calculating and her attacks are precise. Her attacks just looked wild at WAT. In addition, Zuko was just simply unable to push her back.

Sane Azula>Zuko(Post dragon-training) >Crazy Azula

Azula also gave Zuko a lot of trouble in ’The search trilogy’, and she was still mentally unstable. In fact, she gave the entire Gang problems. On top of that, she was the only one who could defeat the wasp spirits

This is hard but I would go with iroh and zuko only because they are more knowledgeable benders