Iroh vs Zaheer

When the Dragon of the West takes on the Master of Flight, who will win?

Zaheer has flight for this battle

Fight takes place in the Spirit World by the Tree of Time. Time is noon. Starting distance is 35 feet.

Both are bloodlusted. Victory by death.

Who will win?

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@justthatkid: sure, thanks for letting me know

Isn't bending nullified in the Spirit World?
(If I missed something that they can, it's probably because I didn't watch 2nd season of Korra)

I'm going to go with Iroh here. Zaheer has a huge advantage with the flight, but I think Iroh can pull this off.

@eclipsebat: ah, yeah, that was all S2 stuff. You can physically enter the spirit world and keep your bending

Iroh, I think.

Zaheer slaughters. At least give Iroh the comet-amp.

L. D.

Any reasons?

@arcus:

By feats, Zaheer. By being a badass, Iroh. XD

Lol :)

Zaheer

Agreed.

As much as I like Iroh, I gotta go with Zaheer, he could just choke him to death, whilst flying around dodging Iroh's attacks

Iroh overwhelms Zaheer with his powerful fire blast that Zaheer can't match. Flight will only help Zaheer evade and torture girls blinded by rage, if Zaheer decides to stray too far, Iroh will fire whip him back to earth or strike him with lightning.

Master>Rookie

Iroh is not bringing anything new to the table, while he will have to adapt to fighting an airbender. So, Zaheer takes it. Would be a good fight though.

@cpt_nice: No. Zaheer can't do anything to the Dragon of the West. Zaheer's air attacks are too weak to hurt Iroh, a physical beast who can throw boulders and tank them easily. The best Zaheer can do is fan Iroh because he sure as heck won't be rag dolling him. Iroh's raw power would counter anything Zaheer threw, and his reaction is top notch.

Zaheer takes the majority here. As usual, Iroh is lacks feats. Zaheer is faster and more agile and his mobility is augumented by flight. Iroh is not touching him.

@gxrevolution: Lol not trying to be rude or anything, but did you even listen to Zuko and Iroh? I know for sure Zuko has said atleast twice that Iroh taught him everything he knows, along with Iroh always correcting his stances. We both know that Iroh is better than his nephew and that Zuko would tear Zaheer apart lmao.

Zaheer won't be touching Iroh. The guy has excellent reaction speed and moves lightning speeds in combat, plus what will Zaheer do? Push him with a weak air blast, Iroh is heavy.

@oparu said:

@gxrevolution: Lol not trying to be rude or anything, but did you even listen to Zuko and Iroh? I know for sure Zuko has said atleast twice that Iroh taught him everything he knows, along with Iroh always correcting his stances. We both know that Iroh is better than his nephew and that Zuko would tear Zaheer apart lmao.

Zaheer won't be touching Iroh. The guy has excellent reaction speed and moves lightning speeds in combat, plus what will Zaheer do? Push him with a weak air blast, Iroh is heavy.

Thats nice and all but we need feats.

Taking out a bunch of fire nation fodder fire benders is not impressive. The fire nation soldiers are amongst the worse fodder in the series. Maybe if it were against EE soldiers, then it may be somewhat impressive

@gxrevolution: Just remember that Iroh did better than Zaheer struggling against Zaofu guards. I just told you that Zuko were his feats. Iroh's lightning travels instantly, Zaheer is dead.

Zaheer. He has the agility and speed to evade Iroh's blasts, whereas Iroh hasn't shown much in the way of avoidance or accuracy to suggest he could keep up with Zaheer.

@juiceboks: He does not need airbender quick speed to beat Zaheer. If this were true no one could beat an airbender yet we've seen Bumi beat Aang while he stood still the majority of the battle...

Zaheer is a weaker bender than Iroh. This is a battle between a rookie and a grandmaster, the only person Zaheer beat was Kya and handicapped Korra. Zaheer's only advantage is his ability to fly far away from Iroh, which isn't even an advantage anyways.

Iroh shoots the flying coward out of the sky with a fire blast stronger than this.

Iroh is capable of generating lightning in 2 seconds while running with the Dai Li and Azula hot on his trail. Zaheer doesn't stand a chance.

This one attack is larger than anything Zaheer ever dished out. Also let me know when Zaheer can even defeat Azula hold off 30+ Dai Li, Zuko, and Azula.

I recall Iroh being stated to be better than Ozai,who was pretty much a beast(even though he had the comet amping him app,but he skills were obvious there).Plus,if Azula and Ozai can fly,then surely Iroh can as well,both combatants can fly.But i think Iroh has greater inner peace than Zaheer and raw power which makes him stronger

Shameless bump.

Zaheer wins.

Zaheer is a talentless buffoon compared to white lotus legends. Iroh has the strong stance and strength to stop Zaheer if he goes for the flying tackle thing he did against Korra. I also doubt Zaheers going to be stupid enough and stay within his range, that being said well timed charged lightning takes em out. Also notice how Iroh fires multiple forks of lightning compared to others, that AoE would be troublesome to evade.

lmao not debatable. Iroh burns an overrated rookie bender to a crisp wondering what he's doing with his life.

Iroh.

Oh god, both are vastly overrated(just as fighters, they're indeed great characters) but:

By hype: Iroh stomps.

By actual feats: Zaheer wins after a nit of a fight(Zaheer can easily avoid Iroh, but he isn't rly a great bender).

Bloodlusted Iroh though...

Maybe he could get Zaheer with Lightning.

Iroh stomps.

Zaheer is a master martial artist and a bending prodigy, one who fought someone about as skilled as Iroh but younger and faster (Tenzin) .... Flight already puts the odds in Zaheer's favor, Iroh stomping is impossible outside of blind bias.

@ancient_0f_days:

Zaheer is a master martial artist

Despite that he never showed any notable skill in martial arts.

and a bending prodigy

And Iroh is a bending master.

one who fought someone about as skilled as Iroh but younger and faster (Tenzin)

And got trashed.

Flight already puts the odds in Zaheer's favor,

Flight grants Zaheer the ability to run away or stall, not win.

Iroh stomping is impossible outside of blind bias.

Tenzin stomped him without making use of a single of his best options, there's nothing to suggest or argue for Zaheer in terms of fighting master benders and winning. He is not skilled or powerful enough, he is hardly fast enough to deal with many of them. Iroh is implied to be above EoS Azula level, and she would win against Zaheer with moderate difficulty at most, 10/10.

@anthp2000:

Tenzin stomped him without making use of a single of his best options

Tenzin didn't stomp Zaheer at all, he landed two hits that dealt little to no damage and fought him for a few minutes without any clear victor while Tenzin's family and the entire air nation desperately needed his help. This clearly shows they are on about the same tier with Tenzin having a significant skill advantage.

Despite that he never showed any notable skill in martial arts.

What? He showed notable skill in martial art from the first scene he was in and Zuko believed he could take down any bender.

@unlimited1: I'm not arguing with you, sorry.

Despite his fighting capability while humiliating Kya

So is Kya, not like Iroh hasn't been hit by prodigies before (Cough Cough Azula)

Na, he stayed on his feet for a while and kept pace with Tenzin's agility, if he was getting trashed, he wouldn't have been able to block and dodge a master with decades of bending on him when he'd only had it for a few weeks at best. He did better than most against someone who is arguably better than Iroh.

Flight gives Zaheer range and speed over an older slower opponent, that's enough to win.

Tenzin didn't stomp him, he landed 3 hits and completely missed 8 not counting their simultaneous attacks while fully capitalizing on his strengths, speed, agility and experience, to say Zaheer has never won against a master is laughable since he clearly beat Kya and several white lotus at the same time. Zuko already put Zaheer high up without bending and stated he could beat any bender (clearly wasn't thinking about Tenzin but there's that), Iroh's implication's are about as good as Zaheer's and Azula isn't wouldn't do much better since they're both evenly matched in potential bending prowess, agility and martial skill and she almost got wrecked by Katara in Ba Sing Se....

@anthp2000: I mean, it's not really great when you say that "Iroh is *implied* to be Azula level", and yet you criticize Zaheer because he never showeed his skill, despite the fact that he is a stated to be a martial artist master?

@ancient_0f_days:

Despite his fighting capability while humiliating Kya

His fighting capability? The fight is an outlier on its own, Kya fared respectfully against Ming Hua, who's a tier above Zaheer in every snigle category.

So is Kya, not like Iroh hasn't been hit by prodigies before (Cough Cough Azula)

Kya is not a master on Iroh's level at all, and Azula is also a master. Zaheer has not demonstrated the bending prowess of either Iroh or Azula; and neither has Kya for what it's worth, if she had, she would have a roughly even fight with Ming Hua, who is on Azula's level, and that's clearly not the case.

Na, he stayed on his feet for a while and kept pace with Tenzin's agility, if he was getting trashed, he wouldn't have been able to block and dodge a master with decades of bending on him when he'd only had it for a few weeks at best.

He was getting legit trashed. He didn't land a snigle hit, Tenzin landed several and did not ultise his best moves at all, the air spout, the AoE sphere he used to one shot the 3 Red Lotus etc. are all moves he could've used to end the fight quickly, yet he kept on trashing a staling Zaheer.

He did better than most against someone who is arguably better than Iroh.

Tenzin has only ever faught Zaheer and some chi blockers 1 on 1. He did not do 'better than most' against him. Tenzin's best feats are all before and after his fight with Zaheer, and he still stomped him while he was running away and couldn't touch him.

Flight gives Zaheer range and speed over an older slower opponent, that's enough to win.

He grants him travel speed and evasive capacity. Which is good for stalling, not winning. When Zaheer does something equivalent to stopping Azula's lighning after it's been fired at point blank range, you can say h has reaction speed on par with Iroh.

Tenzin didn't stomped him while fully capitalizing on his strengths, speed, agility and experience,

Please show me where Tenzin used the air spout he used against the equalists, the blast that KOed Zaheer before they faught, the blasts that send mecha tanks flying, the speed he used afterwards, once the Red Lotus had him surrounded, easily dodgign Zaheer's attack and hitting him before he could react... Tenzin was throwing around his most basic attacks with his most basic speed and still trashed him.

to say Zaheer has never won against a master is laughable since he clearly beat Kya and several white lotus at the same time.

1. Kya is not on Iroh's level, not even close, and even this victory is an outlier.
2. White Lotus guards are fodder, and not even Elite Fodder at that (equalists were manhandling them)

Zuko already put Zaheer high up without bending and stated he could beat any bender

Zuko had just been informed Zaheer had aquired airbending.

(clearly wasn't thinking about Tenzin but there's that),

Or about the several other benders in the world who are on an entirely different level than Zaheer, and I can list plenty right now. This statement about the Red Lotus' capabilities basically made no sense, Tenzin proved he can take any or most of them, Korra, the Avatar with full control over the Avatar State, was still alive, and various other benders' showings put them on a level way above Zaheer, and they were alive atm.

Iroh's implication's are about as good as Zaheer's

Iroh was stated to be the only one on the 'good' side to be able to take on Ozai 1 on 1 under Sozin's Comet, this puts him at least on Ozai's league. A league far above anything Zaheer could hope to achieve with his showings and implied standing in-universe.

and Azula isn't wouldn't do much better since they're both evenly matched in potential bending prowess, agility and martial skill

.......

• Azula is far more skilled and pwoerful than Zaheer as a bender. She has demonstrated bending on the level of Katara, Toph and Aang.
• Azula was dancing around Aang's single-target airbending in the eclipse, there's nothing to suggest Zaheer is on her level of speed and agility.
• Azula's unarmed feats put her on an entirely different skill level as far as martial arts, or anything, is concerned.

and she almost got wrecked by Katara in Ba Sing Se....

You're good with outliers. And before you attempt to disrespect me as biased against Zaheer or towards Iroh, call my aguments 'laughable' make your search and think about how biased your arguments for Zaheer are.

Having a statement that puts you high up on a certain category and not having any showings to back it up is not enough to put you on par with people who are also high up on that category, yet have that feats to back it up. Iroh and Azula are also master martial artists, and have the feats to back it up. I didn't criticise Zaheer, he simply doesn't have the showings to suggest he is on their level, a statement on its own is not enough here.

Na, Ming was pushing Kya around and still didn't do to her what Zaheer did, KO her outright.

That's interesting considering Azula is not a master on Irohs level either, Ming Hua did worse against Kya than Zaheer and Zaheer was at least able keep up with Tenzin and dodge the majority of his standard attacks.

landing 3 hits and missing 8 isn't getting trashing your opponent, he won based on skill and didn't have time to preform those heavier attacks, after all he's dealing with someone almost as fast as he is. It would leave him wide open since Zaheer was able to easily recover from 2 out of those 3 hits without pausing for more than a second and continue dodging and blocking Tenzin. And Tenzin didn't do his moves for the same reason Zaheer didn't pull the air out of all of his foes to begin with, it takes time.

Iroh has only ever fought nameless fodder, considering how Zaheer actually has a win and a loss on decent benders, that makes Tenzin look way better overall having fought someone good enough to wreck his sister.

First of all Azula hadn't even fired her lightning when Iroh grabber her hand...stop lying, Zaheer is faster based on having consistent combat dodging feats against faster fighters than Iroh. Especially counting his fight with Avatar State Korra.

Second, KOed? Are you blind? He was getting up as soon as he landed, they show him moving to rise as soon as he hit the ground. Zaheer was clearly outmatched but without an opening like he had earlier, Tenzin had no room to try and use heavier techniques nor the space to use the sphere while chasing Zaheer vertically. 3 hits and 8 misses isn't trashing.

1. Kya is still a master of her bending and still lost. Call it what you want, she lost.
2. Good thing Zaheer has more than just fodder feats and hype unlike Iroh.

Zuko was wary of Zaheer before he had any bending and was clearly given trouble in the past either he wouldn't have imprisoned him on a mountain

Go ahead and list em, doesn't change what Zuko said and I take his word with a grain of salt just like how I take Iroh's hype

• Azula isn't more skilled but is more powerful. Zaheer based his non bending fighting style on one of the most skilled air benders known to man and perfected his martial arts, just not his bending capability.
• Zaheer was dancing around everyone but Tenzin who has more years of air bending than Aang anyway and Korra who was in Avatar state.
• Azula barely has unarmed feats but the fact that Tenzin's martial art is air bending, every move he makes counts

You're good with lowballing, before I even attempt to mock you further, take a look at how you simply hype scale your way through this thread.....I'll give you all the time you need

@anthp2000: Not to mention he wrecked Tonraq and held his own against Avatar State Korra long enough for the mercury to take effect

@ancient_0f_days:

Na, Ming was pushing Kya around and still didn't do to her what Zaheer did, KO her outright.

Litteraly why their fight was an outlier.

That's interesting considering Azula is not a master on Irohs level either,

She is tho.

Ming Hua did worse against Kya than Zaheer

Litteral definition of Outlier/PIS/CIS.

and Zaheer was at least able keep up with Tenzin and dodge the majority of his standard attacks.

He still got trashed. Avoiding all the context you are.

landing 3 hits and missing 8 isn't getting trashing your opponent,

When your opponent is running away, sure it is.

he won based on skill and didn't have time to preform those heavier attacks,

He had all the time in the world to do this.

after all he's dealing with someone almost as fast as he is.

Who couldn't properly react to him after their fight.

It would leave him wide open since Zaheer was able to easily recover from 2 out of those 3 hits without pausing for more than a second and continue dodging and blocking Tenzin.

Basic airblasts. Not imperssive.

And Tenzin didn't do his moves for the same reason Zaheer didn't pull the air out of all of his foes to begin with, it takes time.

Tenzin's air spout or heavy hitting AoE don't take anywhere near the time Zaheer's suffocation technique takes. He has actually used them in combat unlike the suffocation technique which is litteraly used only twice, against a helpless old lady and a semi-dead Korra.

Iroh has only ever fought nameless fodder, considering how Zaheer actually has a win and a loss on decent benders, that makes Tenzin look way better overall having fought someone good enough to wreck his sister.

If we completely ignore statements yes, Iroh is semi-fodder, and really that's the only argument you can make for Zaheer winning this (which is a falwed argument, obviously). I have Tenzin above Iroh overall anyway, but there's no reason why he wouldn't be able to stomp Zaheer in a head on 1 on 1 too.

First of all Azula hadn't even fired her lightning when Iroh grabber her hand...stop lying,

Seems pretty fired to me.

Zaheer is faster based on having consistent combat dodging feats against faster fighters than Iroh.

Like who? Tenzin? Who tagged him several times while running away and wasn't touched a single time? And hit him before he could react while usrrounded 3 on 1 afetrwards? Tonraq is much slower than your average high tier and his fight with Kya is the definition of an outlier. Only possible explanation I have for that is not knowing how to propeerly fight airbenders, but even then, that means Kya would have beaten him through knowledge a second time via being better in everything except sheer mobility.

Especially counting his fight with Avatar State Korra.

His "fight" with Korra was him running away while she was dying. Plenty of good benders can replicate that.

Second, KOed? Are you blind? He was getting up as soon as he landed, they show him moving to rise as soon as he hit the ground.

He got up 10 seconds afterwards alongside Ghazan and Ming Hua. Nothing except for your headcanon defines being put down for 10 seconds as a non-KO.

Zaheer was clearly outmatched but without an opening like he had earlier, Tenzin had no room to try and use heavier techniques nor the space to use the sphere while chasing Zaheer vertically.

Tenzin had all the time in the world to use his best moves. You're in denial right now.

3 hits and 8 misses isn't trashing.

It is when (a) you're not hit yourself once, (b) when your opponent is running away and (c) when you haven't used remotely your best techniques.

Kya is still a master of her bending and still lost. Call it what you want, she lost.

There's a difference between a master like Kya and a master like Unalaq, if that helps. Both are masters, do you think she'd stand a chance against him?

I call it plot and completely disregard the verdict, good for you?

Good thing Zaheer has more than just fodder feats and hype unlike Iroh.

If that's your argument, you have zero reasons to tag me int he first place. Zaheer is not implied to be anywhere near grandmaster level, he is implied to be far below based on his fight with Tenzin.

Zuko was wary of Zaheer before he had any bending and was clearly given trouble in the past either he wouldn't have imprisoned him on a mountain

I have talked about it before. Zaheer's tactical ability, and decent combat abilities, make him a dangerous person. Running around with 3 master benders loyal to you with the wisdom, knowledge and tactical ability of Zaheer's makes you incredibly dangerous.

Tonraq had already beaten him in the past, when he didn't have airbending. Which makes him pretty unimpressive.

Azula isn't more skilled but is more powerful. Zaheer based his non bending fighting style on one of the most skilled air benders known to man and perfected his martial arts, just not his bending capability.

There's absolutely nothing Zaheer has done with airbending that suggests he is on Azula's skill level. She is Tenzin and Aang level as far as airbenders go in comparison. And power is not even close either. If you disagree go ahead and show me what moves Zaheer has that make him more skilled than someone who can use fire to propel at the air, breath it, shape it into frkn disks and fire whips, solidify it, make it deal piercing output and so, so on. Azula's control voer the element is insane, Zaheer is decent and extremely good for the time he had to train in actual practical bending, but he is nowhere near her skill level.

Zaheer was dancing around everyone but Tenzin who has more years of air bending than Aang anyway and Korra who was in Avatar state.

Oh please compare Aang's speed to Tonraq's now. One is the fastest character in the verse and the other was moving in slow mo to Unalaq's eyes.
Tenzin is one of the few people on Azula's speed calliber and he tagged a fleeing Zaheer numerous times, did not get tagged once and completely humiliated him afterwards (a 3 on 1, surroudned, dodged his attack and hit him before he could react).

Furthermore, Zaheer mever danced around anyone named fighter's attacks for what it's worth. Azula was litteraly having fun in the eclipse. Zaheer's best evasion showings are from his fights with Tonraq, and they're not anywhere near that level.

Tenzin is not on Aang's level of airbending, or speed, anyway.

Azula barely has unarmed feats but the fact that Tenzin's martial art is air bending, every move he makes counts

Outskilling Suki and humiliating Zuko unarmed? That is far above Zaheer's non existent unarmed showings. Also no, Tenzin's airbending does not translate to h2h at all.

You're good with lowballing, before I even attempt to mock you further, take a look at how you simply hype scale your way through this thread.....I'll give you all the time you need

Dude, you tagged me and started mocking both me and my arguments while wanking your favourite airbending pridigy. Grow up and have a proper discussion. I was being civil a post ago but people like you are not worth being that civil with.

Tonraq is unimpressive compared to people on Iroh's level.

Running away until Korra dies from poison is not enough to win an actual fight against master benders.

@anthp2000: I could go back and forth but all things considered, I proved Iroh doesn't stomp at all which was why I tagged you in the first place, also everyone knows Azula visibly charges lightning around her body before shooting it off and Iroh grabbed her fingers before the shot was fired....your image looked so busted it didn't even makes sense to post it. Dodging anyone in Avatar state is relatively challenging for anyone to and seemingly only possible through flight, sounds like you're lowballing the avatar state. You talk about wank while admitting Iroh has fodder feats exclusively....that's not even worth calling irony.

Bump

I doubt Zaheer could even hurt him. His airbending blasts are too weak to do anything more than stagger Iroh, who has shown to be able to stonewall direct hits from earth bent rocks without moving an inch. Zaheer also doesn't fight like a normal airbender would, thus taking away any advantage he might have by Iroh's unfamiliarity with fighting airbenders.

Zaheer has more speed and mobility (obviously) but he can only run and fly circles around Iroh so much before getting toasted either with fire or lightning. I honestly don't see how Zaheers airbending will affect him. If he had power feats in the level of Aang or Tenzin I could see him winning, but he doesn't.

I say Iroh

I agree iroh wins due to his superior reaction speed like the time he deflected lightning and he also has better physical feats like the time he destroyed ba sing za