Thor solos this easily and then kills Strom for being useless.
Invisible Woman and Jean Grey vs. Thor and Storm
Not at all - Jean and Sue have multiple ways of taking Storm down; their powers are just as versatile in different ways from Storm's. Storm would have trouble with either Jean or Susan. Seems to me like you are lowballing two characters that are at least equal to Storm in power output. Also, and this has been repeated ad nauseum: resistance does not equal immunity. So while it may take a focused psychic attack to take Storm out, she's usually shown as writhing on the ground in agony when it happens and not in a condition to fight (see below). So, yes, she causes weaker telepaths trouble, but more powerful psychics like Jean can incapacitate Storm; and with TK, Jean can kill her while she's neutralized. And the theory that TK takes concentration and peace of mind is erroneous - especially since we see TK and TP employed in fights where two combatants are slugging it out. Those may help, but they aren't necessary, in the same way that while concentration and peace of mind certainly helps Storm to maintain control of her powers, she can still pull off special effects in the middle of a heated battle. And Storm isn't getting through Sue's forcefield. No offense to Ororo, but Sue has more experience and has battled far more powerful adversaries. Lightning or weather manipulation from Storm isn't getting through her field or causing Sue much stress.@TheMightyAvenger said:
@PhoenixoftheTides said:@Aqua11500: Hey chill out, I was making a joke, although I don't think Storm could solo this team, mainly bacause of Sue.
@TheMightyAvenger said:
@Aqua11500: Hey chill out, I was making a joke, although I don't think Storm could solo this team, mainly bacause of Sue.Storm can't solo that team. Jean and Sue have high defensive capabilities, and Storm would be hard pressed to match either of them one on one in a serious battle.
Yes because this is regular Jean without Phoenix,and Sue..well she's Sue.
Both are known for having physical backlash from their powers.The harder the hits are and the more energy Sue has to contain or block. The powerful the backlash and the more intense .Same with Jean and her physic powers,she can be strained.The key principle to Telekinesis is concentration and peace within the mind,with Storm dropping down burst and lightning,Thunderclaps etc all around the area...one of them are sure to get off focus and zapped.
Jean is powerful,and when she isn't Phoenix her power levels are more stable and reachable for others to match. Only way Sue would win is Bubble in the head. If jean tries to shut down Storm's mind it isn't going to be instant do to Storm's powers and Resistance
Im not saying Storm might be able to solo them both at the same time,but maybe one by one if she plays her cards right.Lets not forget she more cunning and tactically better then the other two ladies and has a more versatile power set.Regardless with Thor on her side they win either way,Thor might feel generous and Let Storm have her pick while he takes on the other opponent that's left.
The Goddess of Lightning and The God of Thunder for the ultimate win! lol j/p
Anyway, this is all rather moot - it really comes down to Thor being powerful enough to take Sue and Jean out with or without Storm's help, so we agree on that at least.
@PhoenixoftheTides
:Not at all - Jean and Sue have multiple ways of taking Storm down; their powers are just as versatile in different ways from Storm's. Storm would have trouble with either Jean or Susan. Seems to me like you are lowballing two characters that are at least equal to Storm in power output. Also, and this has been repeated ad nauseum: resistance does not equal immunity. So while it may take a focused psychic attack to take Storm out, she's usually shown as writhing on the ground in agony when it happens and not in a condition to fight (see below). So, yes, she causes weaker telepaths trouble, but more powerful psychics like Jean can incapacitate Storm; and with TK, Jean can kill her while she's neutralized. And the theory that TK takes concentration and peace of mind is erroneous - especially since we see TK and TP employed in fights where two combatants are slugging it out. Those may help, but they aren't necessary, in the same way that while concentration and peace of mind certainly helps Storm to maintain control of her powers, she can still pull off special effects in the middle of a heated battle. And Storm isn't getting through Sue's forcefield. No offense to Ororo, but Sue has more experience and has battled far more powerful adversaries. Lightning or weather manipulation from Storm isn't getting through her field or causing Sue much stress.
Anyway, this is all rather moot - it really comes down to Thor being powerful enough to take Sue and Jean out with or without Storm's help, so we agree on that at least.
Not not at all at what? Storm is more versatile then both of them,her powers are simply much broader. Sue powers is the ability bend light and distorted hyperspace to create cnstructs,thats basically it.With in her energy manipulation she can create any construct that comes ot mind. Jean without PF is a gifted telekinetic and very powerful telepath. Storm who controls the weather just doesn't wield the weather alone,but the pure essence of the elements.She an energy manipulator,so much range within that category of power. Also i am not lowballing anyone,they could take Storm out jst as well as she could them,but to your comment about Susan being more experienced? i don't see how.Storm is a warrior,a true fighter and a superb tactician.She's also very good with multi tasking on great scales.
Resistance does not equal immunity,you are absolutely right,but given Storm's strong wield and her powers she has VERY HIGH Resistance. The fact that you put those two scans up means nothing.Storm has more showings of her resisting telepathy than being subdued by it. Emma in the first scan had ambushed Storm,and then on top of that tortured her and had her bound.She was already drained,so that scan is very irrelevant. Storm just doesn't give weak telepaths trobule,but also very powerful ones..like *cough* *cough* Emma. Storm resisted the efforts of Charles,Oracle,Jean and Psylocke before.Jean TP isn't going to get through to Storm,if it does it will be a struggle, and by then she'd be fried like Emma when she tried to mind rape Ororo in 3rd scan. and yes,it does not always require that TK needs cocentration,but for the most part those are one of the key elements to using that type of power.Storm has fought alongside Jean for years,she knows how to work Jean.
while concentration and peace of mind certainly helps Storm to maintain control of her powers
That's to maintain her emotions,to keep from loosing control over her powers;since her emotions are tied to her abilities.The only time Storm has to use concentration on such a level is when she is doing something like global feats are something that requires alot of precise control.Fighting the everyday good fight isn't going to off balance Ororo.
Storm powers have penetrated Sue's Force Fields before,maybe you were unaware,but they have.BTW when Sue has some of things that Ororo has achieved under her belt let me know.Sue isn't as strong of a leader as Ororo is,Sue isn't as head strong and Independent,shes not the warrior Storm is. and when you said Sue has taken more powerful adversaries,do you mean with the help of F4,or when she was Invisible Girl and couldn't do anything but get rescued?
I mean Honestly that's a backhanded comment to the character of Storm as to say Sue is better in battle and overall more experienced. Also Sue has to concentrate to hold her shields,If Storm is hammering down on her field bolt after bolt,then Susan is going to buckle sooner or later.Lets not forget Storm can pop off a plethora abilities at the same time with multi-tasking.She controls their environments
Also this isn't moot,this was meant to be a team battle,im aware that Thor could solo with ease if he wanted,but in the stipulations are that they both face Jean and Sue.So i'm just letting people know that Storm could do her part just as well
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here it shows Storm's powers working through Sue's shields,and her winds are very powerful,capable of blowing Sue's Force field upward from solid ground.
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Inside Sue's dome and shooting wind and lightning
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Crystal manipulating the air in Sue's bubble forcing Susan to come out.If Crystal can do this,we have Ororo whose a much powerful elemental and more experienced..then
Sue is in trouble.
SUE Blocking a Bolt from Chlor(Clone Thor).This wasn't even the real thing and her nose started bleeding.Anytime Sues nose bleeds it means shes under stress or the backlash was powerful
Now imagine Storm using huge bolts after bolt on her.
@Phoenixofthe Tides
It is possible for Sue to create a forcefield that would allow Storm to use her powers outside of it in one instance
So then you are saying Sue can control other peoples powers now? If so that is new ability that i am not aware of. Sue can't just shut off other peoples power,she isn't leech.Sue's shields are stated to be able to block Psionics,yet this description is inconsistent,or maybe is that the nature of Storm's powers are special.I don't know,all i know is that she and can and will fall.If Storm can use her powers in the inside of her shield while in there with Sue,then whats stopping her from using it on the outside? If Sue's shields block psionics period then even if Storm was inside the shields with Sue how were her powers still working and active? Point is Sue has never been shown to shut off others powers unless it is a type of power that cant get through them.but Storm mastery of the elements have.Crystal also got in it,and Sue had no choice but to come out because she could not breath.
Clone Thor was a lot more powerful than Storm ever will be. If you are saying that it takes that type of attack to cause a nose bleed, then Storm can throw all the huge bolts she wants, and all she is doing is making herself a target for Sue to hit her with an invisible force battering ram while tiring herself out. And also wanted to point out that Sue was still standing after blocking that blast.
You may be right about that,but Storm's lightning is very powerful,and that Clors lightning was nothing compared to the real thing ,be it that it was a clone. Storm may not be able to enhance her lightning to that of magic lightning,but she can produce powerful than usual bolts that you wouldn't find naturally.I'm completely sure Storm hammering away at Sue's shield would put ware on Susan. Then there is high winds and hurricane like Gail forces blowing, powerful lightning,thunderclaps etc..Sue's bound to buckle under the backlash and loose concentration with all the elemental energies whirling around her. Also Storm doing all of that isn't going to make her tired, like said multi tasking isn't a strain on Storm,its usually the larger feats that drain her.Sue could hit her with battering ram while blocking.Very true,but Storm would feel and see it coming.Storm can feel objects and other energy cut through the atmosphere,she can also perceive energy and see different forms of it around her.She would see any invisible projectile Sue would throw at her and being invisible wouldn't really help either
Don't be biased. all of the ladies have capabilities of beating each other in a one on on match,though the favor leans more toward Storm because of her power set and versatility.Storm's more powerful Sue,Jean's more powerful then Storm,but power doesn't always equal to a win.I would say when it just comes to pure war and fighting Storm has more skill,though both ladies have mastered their abilities over the years.
So, yeah, Storm isn't going to solo Sue anytime soon.
"lowballing" is ignoring the fact that clearly, Emma was able to seriously hurt Storm during their fight - she knocked her out of the sky. The only reason Storm was able to get the upper hand was because Emma switched to her diamond form to survive the fall, which made her unable to use TP. I provided two other scans showing that despite her TP resistance, she can be hurt by the attacks and can't easily retaliate while it is happening.
I'm not ignoring any facts,and what has Emma have to do with any of this.I never did say she didn't hurt Storm,regardless Emma knocked Storm outta of the sky.. Big whoop! Fact Still remains Storm beat her ass,and this wasn't the first time.So keep making up your excuses for Emma, I've been through this fight a million times with Emma fans and others. There is no " The only reason ".Storm got the upper hand ,because even while she may have been hurt she still resisted Emma's Telepathy,then she fried Emma and sent her flying.Emma had no choice but to stay in diamond form, and Storm was still going kick Emma's butt.Emma put that on herself,that was a completely dumb move on her part,she rushed Storm thinking she would have the advantage and Storm flipped the script on her.
The other scan you put yes she did get hurt by the telepathic assault,but along with Storm's powers her wield and resisting became stronger too.She resits the Shadow King all the time,and he a pretty powerful psychic,your point? Like i said Emma had tortured her and Storm was tired and beat down,but if this was a clear fight where she was ready Storm would scramble Emma telepathic assaults forcing her into diamond
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Storm scrambling Rachel PSI attack,and this Rachel with some PF power
So the essence of the matter, IMHO, is that the three women would give each other a good fight, but it is Thor's presence on the team that is overwhelming. Storm's presence is not really necessary. He has the superior power, durability, speed, strength, stamina, weaponry, armor and etc so he could solo whether or not she is able to help,
and what part of I understand that Thor could solo.Still this is a team battle,regardless of what he could do.Thor's presence on the team would be overwhelming , yes.With storm there it's more of a stomp.
I mean if Storm and Thor were working together in a actual team up on panel,do you think the writers would just let Thor have all the fun? No Storm would probably get some action too. In reality he can solo,but if this was an actual team battle then both would fight TOGETHER regardless of what one another can do.
I'm too tired to read through this tonight and reply, but I did spot these three scans that really have no baring in this thread.@Aqua11500 said:
First scan: Before Storm's resistance to telepathy was established. In a later issue Emma switches bodies with Storm and attempts a psy attack her and fails. In another instance, Jean with PF is unable to read Storm's mind due to the established increase static in her mind that can block probes. That scan has been debunked.
Second scan is a combined telepathic power assault. Xavier, Oracle, and Psylocke's telepathy were combine with Warskull to form that attack, and it was stated right there on panel that Storm would eventually break free of it. In either case, Jean does not have the combined telepathic power of those three telepaths for that feat to be relevant to this debate.
Third scan was a surprise psibolt Emma produced on an unsuspecting Storm. We have already seen what happens when Emma tries to attack a prepared Storm with a psi assault. In either case, Storm recovered a few seconds after that fall and defeated Emma.
@YoungJustice said:
This comes down to Thor vs Jean. In which Jean easily. I believe she was WPOTC when this came out.
WPOTC was in Endsong I thing, and that was well before this was created. Thor already triumphed over Hope Summers as Green Phoenix, and pretty handily at that.
Invisible Woman, I just don't see why Mjonlir couldn't break her shields. It was able to disabled Juggernaut's mystical barrier, it has dented Captain America's shield (or did it crack it, one of the two), it's shattered astroids and planetoids, and driven back the phoenix force itself. I just don't think it'll stand it's ground.
Thor alone would be a good match for these two, adding Storm is almost spite...
Thor has also beaten Storm with little to no effort in the Contest of Champions, to address a lot of what has been said in earlier posts.
Thanks for reading,
Floopay
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