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#1 Posted by SilverSurfa (256 posts) - - Show Bio

Iceman vs HumanTorch, Match, Pyro, Nova and Sunfire

#2 Posted by fesak (7073 posts) - - Show Bio

Really?

Moderator
#3 Posted by Ego (2324 posts) - - Show Bio

it depends... iceman needs to be distracted by match, nova and sunfire while... pyro controls all their flames and creates countless of giant fire monsters... while iceman is distracted, human torch is charging up for supernova blast. and you know what happens after that. suicide win... everyone dead.

other then that. iceman would take them all out by reducing oxigen levels in the atmophere. and just... turning all of their hearts to ice with mere thoughts.

#4 Posted by The Enigma (1882 posts) - - Show Bio

Iceman: omega level cryokinesis.

#5 Posted by Vrakmul (23849 posts) - - Show Bio

Ice man wins.

#6 Posted by SilverSurfa (256 posts) - - Show Bio

Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?

#7 Posted by fesak (7073 posts) - - Show Bio

The Enigma says:

"Iceman: omega level cryokinesis."

How is this an argument? When has he ever done something to live up to the ""Omega"" label?

People seems to think that anyone Omega wins by default.

Moderator
#8 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

HumanTorch, Match, Pyro, Nova and Sunfire

#9 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

fesak says:

"The Enigma says:
"Iceman: omega level cryokinesis."

How is this an argument? When has he ever done something to live up to the ""Omega"" label?

People seems to think that anyone Omega wins by default."

thats exactly why i hate them

#10 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

The Enigma says:

"SilverSurfa says:
"Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?"

Misconception: Iceman controls heat energy, that subsequently enables him to control ice."

yeah, ice.

#11 Posted by The Enigma (1882 posts) - - Show Bio

SilverSurfa says:

"Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?"

Misconception: Iceman controls heat energy, that subsequently enables him to control ice.

#12 Posted by SilverSurfa (256 posts) - - Show Bio

The Enigma says:

"SilverSurfa says:
"Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?"
Misconception: Iceman controls heat energy, that subsequently enables him to control ice."

haha i said something about that straight after u. wot i meant was that iceman used ice for his atks and defence therefore their fire based attacks wud be effective against his defence...and attacks as you cant freeze fire... espically johnny storm....

#13 Posted by SilverSurfa (256 posts) - - Show Bio

Ice man lives up to the omegalvl because he not only manupilates ice but he acutally manupliates ice through energy manupilation. He can freeze ppls blood veins meaning no blood flow meaning they die. he also can use any surrounding water or freeze it meaning he can freeze ppl up instantly because most of a human's body is water... He can go into uber mist form ( thats awesome)

#14 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"The Enigma says:
"SilverSurfa says:
"Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?"

Misconception: Iceman controls heat energy, that subsequently enables him to control ice."

yeah, ice."

He hasnt evolved his powers to anything greater, thats his failure, he should of concentrated on more variaties than only ice, if he would have done so i would see it, but with his powers as they are, No.

#15 Posted by SilverSurfa (256 posts) - - Show Bio

The Enigma says:

"SilverSurfa says:
"The Enigma says:
"SilverSurfa says:
"Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?"
Misconception: Iceman controls heat energy, that subsequently enables him to control ice."
haha i said something about that straight after u. wot i meant was that iceman used ice for his atks and defence therefore their fire based attacks wud be effective against his defence...and attacks as you cant freeze fire... espically johnny storm...."
No but theoretically he woudl be able to stop Johny Storm's fire."

WEll yes but theres 4 others...

#16 Posted by The Enigma (1882 posts) - - Show Bio

SilverSurfa says:

"The Enigma says:
"SilverSurfa says:
"Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?"
Misconception: Iceman controls heat energy, that subsequently enables him to control ice."
haha i said something about that straight after u. wot i meant was that iceman used ice for his atks and defence therefore their fire based attacks wud be effective against his defence...and attacks as you cant freeze fire... espically johnny storm...."

No but theoretically he woudl be able to stop Johny Storm's fire.

#17 Posted by The Enigma (1882 posts) - - Show Bio

SilverSurfa says:

"The Enigma says:
"SilverSurfa says:
"The Enigma says:
"SilverSurfa says:
"Ice man is powerful but remember there r 5 fire based mutants here 1 of them galactus's herald. Also Fire> Ice. So it might be a closer match than u think?"
Misconception: Iceman controls heat energy, that subsequently enables him to control ice."
haha i said something about that straight after u. wot i meant was that iceman used ice for his atks and defence therefore their fire based attacks wud be effective against his defence...and attacks as you cant freeze fire... espically johnny storm...."
No but theoretically he woudl be able to stop Johny Storm's fire."
WEll yes but theres 4 others..."

Wouldn't make a difference.

#18 Posted by SilverSurfa (256 posts) - - Show Bio

well he cant freeze johnny storm or the other's becuz they wud just melt the ice with ease.... their body temperatures r crazy. so i doubt he can freeze them from the inside?

#19 Posted by The Enigma (1882 posts) - - Show Bio

SilverSurfa says:

"well he cant freeze johnny storm or the other's becuz they wud just melt the ice with ease.... their body temperatures r crazy. so i doubt he can freeze them from the inside?"

Look. fundamentally Iceman controls heat. He has been shown to be to stop heat based powers because of this (Sunfire in X-Men #200-204). There is no reason why, if he could stop more powerful artifical powers such as sunfire's, that he should not be able to stop others.

#20 Posted by Kravicia (50 posts) - - Show Bio

Iceman shouldn't have a problem performing moisture inversion on Torch. No matter how "hot" he is, he still must carry an affluent amount of moisture within himself

He could easily steal the moisture from Pyro & Sunfire to take them outta the fight or flash freeze would swiftly do the same.

Iceman could also go on the defensive and continue to replace whatever his foes melt, until they're encased with ice & consumed any/all oxygen needed to light up

Like Chamber and Rockslide, Iceman's reconstitution abilities make him more or less a psychic entity than a physical being.

Also, consider the fact that he can regenerate his form from steam, to water, to ice, and back to flesh is a clear indication that he is a sentient entity that can control all aspects of the thermal spectrum.

He's also gone close to Absolute Zero temperature & negative 200 degrees (temperature in some areas of space.) and could've gone further but held back because of his teammates

Not to mention his flash freezing & encasing a large fire and fusion core explosion (whose energy output of a would've been well beyond that of a nuke) within 20 seconds

Iceman could most like handle these guys
Post Edited:2008-05-28 09:47:19

#21 Posted by Kravicia (50 posts) - - Show Bio
#22 Posted by _Sojourn_ (19321 posts) - - Show Bio

Iceman has the ability to control other people fire power. At his full potential he has the ability to nullifiy any fire based attack from its origin.

#23 Posted by Ebony Bishop (767 posts) - - Show Bio

Actually, that image above showing him controlling Sunfire's powers was from just prior to Messiah Complex, in current continuity.

#24 Posted by fesak (7073 posts) - - Show Bio

Slight says:

"Iceman has the ability to control other people fire power."

When has he done this?

Moderator
#25 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Slight says:

"Iceman has the ability to control other people fire power. At his full potential he has the ability to nullifiy any fire based attack from its origin."

cough AoA cough

#26 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"Yeah, tough thing the Human Torch isn't really fire, its more Plasma and therefore it wouldnt effect him (look back into one of the older threads i think Creator made it)"

Sunfire's abilities work the same way.

#27 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Ebony Bishop says:

"Actually, that image above showing him controlling Sunfire's powers was from just prior to Messiah Complex, in current continuity."

Yeah, tough thing the Human Torch isn't really fire, its more Plasma and therefore it wouldnt effect him (look back into one of the older threads i think Creator made it)

#28 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Static Shock says:

"Vlad Tepes Dracula says:
"Yeah, tough thing the Human Torch isn't really fire, its more Plasma and therefore it wouldnt effect him (look back into one of the older threads i think Creator made it)"

Sunfire's abilities work the same way."

Well that being said, where is iceman in that moment?

#29 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"Well that being said, where is iceman in that moment?"

Don't know where Iceman is.

#30 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Then how does he block Sunfires powers?

#31 Posted by Ebony Bishop (767 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, but it doesn't matter if he gets puddled. He can reform out of the moisture in any one of their bodies, killing them in the process.

#32 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"Then how does he block Sunfires powers?"

Or let me put it this way, what does it take for Bobby to nullify someones Thermical powers and can he fight with his while doing so (which i strongly doubt) and even if he did, he'd get puddled by 4 people without powers, same for him.

#33 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"Or let me put it this way, what does it take for Bobby to nullify someones Thermical powers and can he fight with his while doing so (which i strongly doubt) and even if he did, he'd get puddled by 4 people without powers, same for him."

I don't see why he wouldn't be able to nullify someone's fire powers while using his own. Why do you find that difficult for him to do? Iceman has the power to absorb heat. And also...

Iceman now has the ability to control chemical reactions involving heat exchange and can prevent people with fire based abilities from using their powers.

The scan on the last page proves this claim....

And, besides, what if Iceman goes absolute zero in the surrounding area? His opponents would instantly die.

#34 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

Ebony Bishop says:

"Yeah, but it doesn't matter if he gets puddled. He can reform out of the moisture in any one of their bodies, killing them in the process."

Or he could instantly freeze their blood vessels and vital organs, causing them to explode.... Either way you look at it, Iceman can't really die...

#35 Posted by fesak (7073 posts) - - Show Bio

Static Shock says:

"Vlad Tepes Dracula says:
"Or let me put it this way, what does it take for Bobby to nullify someones Thermical powers and can he fight with his while doing so (which i strongly doubt) and even if he did, he'd get puddled by 4 people without powers, same for him."

I don't see why he wouldn't be able to nullify someone's fire powers while using his own. Why do you find that difficult for him to do? Iceman has the power to absorb heat. And also...

Iceman now has the ability to control chemical reactions involving heat exchange and can prevent people with fire based abilities from using their powers.

The scan on the last page proves this claim....

"

How does it prove anything? It could as well be Cannonball big-mouthing and trying to scare Sunfire.

I really doubt that Cannonball understands how Icemans powers really work, and i think he just made that up.

Moderator
#36 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Static Shock says:

"Vlad Tepes Dracula says:
"Or let me put it this way, what does it take for Bobby to nullify someones Thermical powers and can he fight with his while doing so (which i strongly doubt) and even if he did, he'd get puddled by 4 people without powers, same for him."

I don't see why he wouldn't be able to nullify someone's fire powers while using his own. Why do you find that difficult for him to do? "

because apparently its a new terretory for him and not really mastered it yet

#37 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

fesak says:

"How does it prove anything? It could as well be Cannonball big-mouthing and trying to scare Sunfire.I really doubt that Cannonball understands how Icemans powers really work, and i think he just made that up."

Oh. I thought that dude was Iceman on that scan, just powered down. My bad. I take it all back....

Anyway, I'm gonna find some evidence on Iceman right quick....

#38 Posted by mantoid (2305 posts) - - Show Bio

Iceman wins.

M

#39 Posted by Ebony Bishop (767 posts) - - Show Bio

But apparently, the results speak for themselves in that scan. It doesn't matter if Cannonball doesn't understand it -- Iceman told him that he could stop Sunfire's powers, and clearly, as you see Shiro get clocked by Cannonball, of all people, he isn't accessing his powers. I doubt very much he just took Sam's word for it.

#40 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Static Shock says:

"Ebony Bishop says:
"Yeah, but it doesn't matter if he gets puddled. He can reform out of the moisture in any one of their bodies, killing them in the process."

Or he could instantly freeze their blood vessels and vital organs, causing them to explode.... Either way you look at it, Iceman can't really die..."

well happened in an alternate reality, frozen to death while he experimented with Absolute Zero I think it was X-Men: what if 12 or something

#41 Posted by Ebony Bishop (767 posts) - - Show Bio

Yes, but in this reality, he doesn't die by being vaporized. The story arc where Nightcrawler met his father (I don't have scans, sorry), Iceman is reduced to a head, and doesn't die. Then he melts, and recorporates through the villain, killing her.

And also during the battle with the Children of the Vault, he is vaporized two or three times, and comes back from moisture in the air.

#42 Posted by Ego (2324 posts) - - Show Bio

it depends... iceman needs to be distracted by match, nova and sunfire while... pyro controls all their flames and creates countless of giant fire monsters... while iceman is distracted, human torch is charging up for supernova blast. and you know what happens after that. suicide win... everyone dead.

other then that. iceman would take them all out by reducing oxigen levels in the atmophere. and just... turning all of their hearts to ice with mere thoughts.

#43 Posted by mantoid (2305 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"Static Shock says:
"Vlad Tepes Dracula says:
" well happened in an alternate reality, **frozen** to death while he experimented with Absolute Zero I think it was X-Men: what if 12 or something"
What If's don't count because they aren't canon. Anyway, here, he's able to freeze a wall near absolute zero....
Post Edited:2008-05-28 14:44:43"
And that would effect Johnny's Supernova flame as how?"

Ice puts out fire.

M

#44 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"well happened in an alternate reality, **frozen** to death while he experimented with Absolute Zero I think it was X-Men: what if 12 or something"

What If's don't count because they aren't canon. Anyway, here, he's able to freeze a wall near absolute zero....


Post Edited:2008-05-28 14:44:43

#45 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Ebony Bishop says:

"Yes, but in this reality, he doesn't die by being vaporized. The story arc where Nightcrawler met his father (I don't have scans, sorry), Iceman is reduced to a head, and doesn't die. Then he melts, and recorporates through the villain, killing her.And also during the battle with the Children of the Vault, he is vaporized two or three times, and comes back from moisture in the air."

I believe you, ive seen Iceman decimated to liquid form, but i never seen him in mist... but i could imagine it... possibly. anyways

@Static Shock: Granted he is given those powers that he can nullify ALL thermical mutational powers... Wouldn't that effect him aswell? huh? huh!? xP

@Mantoid: Might aswell write "I like bunnies", because it makes the same point clear.

#46 Posted by Static Shock (47329 posts) - - Show Bio

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

"
Post Edited:2008-05-28 14:44:43"

And that would effect Johnny's Supernova flame as how?"

It all depends on who does their trump card first. Iceman is capable of it. He was able to freeze the Louvre and some flame guy in a few seconds.

I'm sure Iceman would freeze Human Torch before he would even try that....

Vlad Tepes Dracula says:

Granted he is given those powers that he can nullify ALL thermical mutational powers... Wouldn't that effect him aswell? huh? huh!? xP

Do you have anything to prove that it would effect him?

#47 Posted by Vlad Tepes Dracula (2208 posts) - - Show Bio

Static Shock says:

"Vlad Tepes Dracula says:
"well happened in an alternate reality, **frozen** to death while he experimented with Absolute Zero I think it was X-Men: what if 12 or something"

What If's don't count because they aren't canon. Anyway, here, he's able to freeze a wall near absolute zero....


Post Edited:2008-05-28 14:44:43"

And that would effect Johnny's Supernova flame as how?

#48 Posted by Ego (2324 posts) - - Show Bio

fesak says:

"Slight says:
"Iceman has the ability to control other people fire power."

When has he done this?

"

Not really controlling their fire directly.. Iceman's real power is to control atmophere. he can manipulate oxygen levels which fire needs.

#49 Posted by fesak (7073 posts) - - Show Bio

mantoid says:

"Vlad Tepes Dracula says:
"Static Shock says:
"Vlad Tepes Dracula says:
" well happened in an alternate reality, **frozen** to death while he experimented with Absolute Zero I think it was X-Men: what if 12 or something"
What If's don't count because they aren't canon. Anyway, here, he's able to freeze a wall near absolute zero....
Post Edited:2008-05-28 14:44:43"
And that would effect Johnny's Supernova flame as how?"

Ice puts out fire.

M"

Supernova is not fire.

Moderator
#50 Posted by Ebony Bishop (767 posts) - - Show Bio

I also like bunnies.