#1 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
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#2 Posted by kinggamer97 (1013 posts) - - Show Bio

Midnighter

#3 Posted by Midnightist (10858 posts) - - Show Bio

Midnighter

#4 Posted by Wing Ultimate (223 posts) - - Show Bio
kinggamer97 said:
"Midnighter"

Midnightist said:
"Midnighter"
Midnighter
#5 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio

I say Huntsman.

He can be killed but he comes back each time as a better fighter, so you can't beat him the same way like Doomsday. He can mimic skills like Taskmaster.

#6 Posted by Midnightist (10858 posts) - - Show Bio

that may be true, but even if he comes back better ighter would just run new strategies to stop him again and again. He once described that he could run millions of battles in his head for thousands of foes. I think he would beat Huntsman each time he came back

#7 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
Midnightist said:
"that may be true, but even if he comes back better ighter would just run new strategies to stop him again and again. He once described that he could run millions of battles in his head for thousands of foes. I think he would beat Huntsman each time he came back"

Good Point. But each time he would be harder to beat. Logic dictates that eventually his skilled would be so great that he couldn't be.
#8 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio

He would be learning from Midnighter.

#9 Posted by Midnightist (10858 posts) - - Show Bio

however the limit to Midnighter's predictions are unknown. In teory there is always a way to beat someone and if anybody can find it it would be Midnighter

#10 Posted by The Scientist (630 posts) - - Show Bio

Oh please your all giving him too much credit, he couldnt even take out the joker by himself!

#11 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
Midnightist said:
"however the limit to Midnighter's predictions are unknown. In teory there is always a way to beat someone and if anybody can find it it would be Midnighter"

Even himself?
#12 Posted by Midnightist (10858 posts) - - Show Bio

he could have if he wanted to trust me he would have lol

#13 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
Midnightist said:
"he could have if he wanted to trust me he would have lol"

So based on mathmatical equation. Since there is a way to beat him, Huntsman would learn the skill eventually to do so.
#14 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
The Scientist said:
"Oh please your all giving him too much credit, he couldnt even take out the joker by himself!"

Joker wasn't real, so he couldn't read him.
#15 Posted by Midnightist (10858 posts) - - Show Bio

you know what I take back what I said given that their powers are so similar and would probably cancel each other out they would probably kill each other fighting.

#16 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
Midnightist said:
"you know what I take back what I said given that their powers are so similar and would probably cancel each other out they would probably kill each other fighting."

And I just remembered (because of the Scientist) that I don't think the Huntsman is real. he is connected to the child he protects. I think he is manifested by her. I know One of the Wildcats couldn't read him. Midnighter may have the same problem he did with the Joker.
#17 Posted by The Scientist (630 posts) - - Show Bio
Alpha said:
"The Scientist said:
"Oh please your all giving him too much credit, he couldnt even take out the joker by himself!"

Joker wasn't real, so he couldn't read him."
Joker is insane, which is another reason why he couldn't
#18 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
The Scientist said:
"Alpha said:
"The Scientist said:
"Oh please your all giving him too much credit, he couldnt even take out the joker by himself!"

Joker wasn't real, so he couldn't read him."
Joker is insane, which is another reason why he couldn't"

couldn't you still predict what a insane person would do if you can predict any possibility?
#19 Posted by The Scientist (630 posts) - - Show Bio

Any possibility is a hell of a range, plus if you are insane your next moves are unpredictable.

#20 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
The Scientist said:
"Any possibility is a hell of a range, plus if you are insane your next moves are unpredictable."

But there still is a limit to what you can do. So if I can cover any possible reaction (as most feel Midnighter can do)  would cover any thing the joker could possibly d.
#21 Posted by Buckshot (18925 posts) - - Show Bio

Depends on what you count as a win. Huntsman could win because as long as Miranda isn't in the fight Midnighter can't permanently kill him. Or Midnighter could because I think one kill should win it and he should still be able to kill him each subsequent time (even if he gets better having learned some new moves before he died, he's still physically outclassed by Midnighter). He could also win by breaking every bone in Huntsman's body or restrain him some other way without killing him.

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#22 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
Buckshot said:
"Depends on what you count as a win. Huntsman could win because as long as Miranda isn't in the fight Midnighter can't permanently kill him. Or Midnighter could because I think one kill should win it and he should still be able to kill him each subsequent time (even if he gets better having learned some new moves before he died, he's still physically outclassed by Midnighter). He could also win by breaking every bone in Huntsman's body or restrain him some other way without killing him."
Al that was tried before and he still one. He beat Velocity's speed attack and seem to know the weak point of the robot for the Triad. He stood up to Ripclaw who had him in speed and strength. He seems to learn how to win, when shouldn't be able to.
#23 Posted by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio

How does he revive himself? Does he just regenerate like someone with a healing factor? If so then Midnighter could just stand over him with something sharp and kill him every-time he revives which won't give him a chance to use any new skill he learned. If Doors are allowed, Midnighter could BFR him and be done with it. There are other ways but with out knowing the mechanism of Hunstman's revival it's hard to say how Midnighter would keep him dead. Maybe he could just find and kill Miranda.

#24 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio

He wouldn't know about the link to her. I think he is manifested by Miranda. Once he was completely covered by lava and suddenly reappeared. Midnighter wouldn't be able to kil him the same way twice. He is like Taskmaster but better. He doesn't just learn the new skill but become better at it than who he learned it from.

#25 Posted by Super-Buster (2358 posts) - - Show Bio

Midnighter's senses allow him to know what power/s his opponent has so if we assume Midnighter can figure out that Huntsman can't die forever because of Miranda then his senses would somehow discover that aspect of his power, In any case, if Hunstman revives next to Miranda then isn't that kind of a BFR? They would have to find each other again and eventually Midnighter will trace Huntsman's revivals back to Miranda.

#26 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
Super-Buster said:
"Midnighter's senses allow him to know what power/s his opponent has so if we assume Midnighter can figure out that Huntsman can't die forever because of Miranda then his senses would somehow discover that aspect of his power, In any case, if Hunstman revives next to Miranda then isn't that kind of a BFR? They would have to find each other again and eventually Midnighter will trace Huntsman's revivals back to Miranda."

He would have the same problem he did with the Joker in Dreamwar. Since Huntsman is just a manifestation of Miranda.

Just my theory.
#27 Posted by Lunacyde (19458 posts) - - Show Bio

The problem with Midnighter is that the reach and scope of his powers is never really clearly stated. I think if it was more clearly defined exactly what he can and can't do with his powers then it would be easier because as it is now I think you guys are giving him an awful lotta power.

#28 Posted by Alpha (7331 posts) - - Show Bio
Lunacyde said:
"The problem with Midnighter is that the reach and scope of his powers is never really clearly stated. I think if it was more clearly defined exactly what he can and can't do with his powers then it would be easier because as it is now I think you guys are giving him an awful lotta power."
I kinda agree with you. The way he is described he would be unbeatable but he has been beaten. He's tough and would beat most street level characters but he isn't the level that his fans put him at.

But neither is Batman. : )
#29 Posted by Lunacyde (19458 posts) - - Show Bio

Haha true...gotta love old Bats anyway tho lol

#30 Edited by The Man of Yesteryear (5502 posts) - - Show Bio
Alpha said:
"Lunacyde said:
"The problem with Midnighter is that the reach and scope of his powers is never really clearly stated. I think if it was more clearly defined exactly what he can and can't do with his powers then it would be easier because as it is now I think you guys are giving him an awful lotta power."
I kinda agree with you. The way he is described he would be unbeatable but he has been beaten. He's tough and would beat most street level characters but he isn't the level that his fans put him at.

But neither is Batman. : )"
Wrong!!! Batman is unbeatable!!!

Bat-factor > God!!!!
#31 Posted by Lunacyde (19458 posts) - - Show Bio

hahah ohhh here we goo....

#32 Posted by Buckshot (18925 posts) - - Show Bio
 The Scientist said:
Joker is insane, which is another reason why he couldn't"
 The only reason Midnighter couldn't beat him was because of plot. Think about it, precog or not, Midnighter still physically outclasses him by a lot. He could have blitzed him and knocked off his head with a single punch.

The Scientist said:
"Any possibility is a hell of a range, plus if you are insane your next moves are unpredictable."

Not really since Midnighter can see the electrical activity in someone’s brain. Even if you’re crazy, the signal that tells your arm to move would still be there and Midnighter could pick it up, so even if Joker being crazy played a factor, Midnighter would still know what he was doing.


Alpha
said:
Al that was tried before and he still one. He beat Velocity's speed attack and seem to know the weak point of the robot for the Triad. He stood up to Ripclaw who had him in speed and strength. He seems to learn how to win, when shouldn't be able to."

He “beat Velocity’s speed attack” by tripping her as she ran past some bushes. She wasn’t even going all that fast since she was carrying a normal human that wouldn't be able to handle the strain of her real speed. Tripping a speedster that couldn’t see him and wasn’t even going that fast doesn’t mean Huntsman is fast enough to fight with Midnighter (who dodges bullets and has out maneuvered and beaten a speedster that was actually prepared for him). Knowing things about robots (especially when he comes from a place with above-human tech) doesn’t mean he automatically knows weaknesses of everything. (Zealot later exposed another weakness just by fighting him and she doesn’t have any special ability.) He “stood up to Ripclaw” but he didn’t win the fight. You say he figures out how to win but he doesn’t always win. He didn’t beat Ripclaw, he didn’t beat Slag(he died and Zealot was the one who beat him), he didn’t beat Spartan(someone else saved him), and he ran away from Impact. There might have been more but I don’t remember. He hasn’t shown superhuman stats (maybe agility with how he got away from Impact) so even if Midnighter can’t read him (proof?) he’s still outclassed.

I don’t recall anything saying he learned the skill better either in Cyberforce or Wildcats, just that he can learn an action by seeing it once. And despite that, he still almost got killed by Spartan (old version). He would have been blasted away if Kenesha didn’t teleport him elsewhere at the same second. He was barely hurting Spartan at all since he’s more durable than a normal human. The same would be true for Midnighter. Assuming Huntsman survived long enough to attack, he’d be hitting someone more durable than bricks and covered in body armor (Jukko, from SW:TA who is more accustomed to pain than anyone, complained about having to hit a weakened Midnighter) that also doesn’t feel pain unless he wants to and can heal from fatal injuries. How is Huntsman going to hurt him at all? And how will he survive a punch that can take heads off?


Alpha said:
"

He wouldn't know about the link to her. I think he is manifested by Miranda. Once he was completely covered by lava and suddenly reappeared. Midnighter wouldn't be able to kil him the same way twice. He is like Taskmaster but better. He doesn't just learn the new skill but become better at it than who he learned it from.

"

His reappeared next to Miranda, so he’d be out of the fight anyway. 


Lunacyde
said:
"The problem with Midnighter is that the reach and scope of his powers is never really clearly stated. I think if it was more clearly defined exactly what he can and can't do with his powers then it would be easier because as it is now I think you guys are giving him an awful lotta power."

He has all-around superhuman stats (more specifics can be given if needed) and he knows all an opponents powers and moves (possible moves and what they actually plan to do) and the way a fight will play out before it starts. What powers is he being given that aren’t already there in comics time after time?

He’s better defined that Huntsman, who has appeared in less than 10 comics. There’s so little known about him that we don’t even know what he is. Alpha thinks he’s a construct based off him being covered in lava and still being alive a few pages later and is using that to support his case. (Side question, even if he is a construct, do you have any evidence to make a judgement on his level of complexity, alpha? You assume him being a construct means Midnighter wouldn’t be able to predict him, but if he still has a brain then Midnighter can definitely still read him, and even if he doesn’t that doesn’t necessarily mean anything since Midnighter trains against holograms and has beaten various non-living enemies, so he can still predict moves either with his brain reading or other ways.) 

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