Hulk Vs. X-Men

@adamtrmm: I never said that you were biased. I said that you are using the term PIS incorrectly. There is no PIS in Wolverine tanking hits from the Hulk and other class 100+ because his power set lets him do it, and he's done it consistently. It's within his ridiculous durability limits. He'll be a factor here due to his durability, damage out put, and speed to stay a step ahead of Hulk. He's always been a factor and given Hulk some trouble. I am saying that Wolverine should beat Savage Hulk 1-1? No, but saying that he can't be a big nuisance for Hulk and be a factor in this fight is just downplaying Wolverine.

@wolverine08:

For me, any street-leveler fighting a powerhouse and not getting manhandled is a bit of PIS, it's not just about Wolvie. What else makes him irrelevant for me is Hulk intense healing factor, so no matter how deep he can stab it doesn't really matter bc he'll heal, and then he can simply BFR him with just one powerful punch, that's how I see this without what I call PIS. And if we're talking about today's Hulk, Wolvie cannot really stay ahead with a speed, if you know what I mean.

Anyways, peace man I'm going to sleep it was a long day :)

@adamtrmm: You see, that is your problem dealing with this. You're going about it in that "Wolverine is a street leveler! Hulk is a powerhouse! Hulk should smash puny, hairy man!" You're not looking at power sets and what way they factor into a fight. Wolverine has avery good power set/enhancements for dealing with someone like Hulk. He can soak Hulk's main force of damage, blunt force, due to the healing factor and adamantium skeleton. His combat speed is good enough that he can avoid Hulk for a good deal, and he has the damage out put necessary to give Hulk trouble. Even with Hulk's healing factor, the damage from the adimantium claws has effected him before, and when Logan starts doing things like going for Hulk's eyes, his overall effectiveness is going decreased. Then you add in that while James is doing this to Hulk, you have Cyclops who will be letting loose more than usual due to the threat they are dealing with, and a class 100+ Colossus to give Hulk trouble, and you'll see why Wolverine is a factor here along with his experience dealing with Hulk.

Well, X-Men will probably lose unless they can find some krypton. Hulk can only die one way but the X-Men can just smashed like little marmallows.

@wolverine08:

You still don't have an answer for one-hit-BFR from Hulk, he could avoid, but what if he's not? Wolverine, Beast, and even Cyclops are all distractions right here in the way I see the battle happening, it all depends on what versions of Archangel and Gambit are here, bc if they're all regular versions they'll have to play smart, really, really smart to pull a win, then Wolverine can be a factor, not in a one on one battle. The main point.

@adamtrmm: Oh, I most definitely have an answer for the "one hit BFR" from Hulk. For one, he's never actually BFRed Wolverine through his punches. Never. Savage Hulk has gotten pissed at Wolverine on numerous occasions, and has tried to punch Wolverine's head off and Logan just flew back. A good distance indeed, but not out of the environment. Secondly, BFR isn't a part of Hulk's fighting style. He isn't Superman, it is not, and never will be his modus operandi. The only way Hulk will actually successfully achieve BFR against Wolverine is by picking him up and throwing him like a football. Again, something he has never even attempted against James since BFR is not his style.

Wolverine can hang with Hulk one on one. He'll most definitely lose the majority to Savage Hulk and any stronger incarnation of him, but he has the ability to give Hulk a problem. It is his power set that let's him put up that decent effort, and it will always let him do so. Saying that Wolverine can't give Hulk some trouble one on one is just simply ignoring the numerous, consistent comics in which he has.

Leaning towards hulk.

I don't see what beast, Arch Angel, and gambit can do to hulk. Cyclops can hurt hulk however he is a glass cannon. He has amazing power out put but his durability isn't goo enough to tank a thunder clap. I would say hulk can tank his optic blasts. I don't know if Storm has a defense against thunder claps either, so she would probably fall in the same category as cyclops (I am willing to be corrected on that though if she does have a defense let me know).

That leaves wolverine and colossus. Colossus is strong but hulk is stronger, has a healing factor which will make him almost impossible for Colossus to put him down from what I have seen. If I am not mistaken in the scans posted earlier wasn't hulk weakened?

Anyways that leaves wolverine vs hulk and we all know how that goes down.

@wolverine08:

So what you're saying is Wolverine never gets BFRed simply bc of a plot? You said it, Hulk never tries to accomplish that, the question is, why? So the fight will be interesting and fans will be glad :)

Why it never happened? Bc of plots, like I said already. You keep saying he is a factor I tell you how he isn't if there's no plot to make him relevant (the only thing keeps him this way). If you cannot admit that, why are even debating? I say he is only a factor when in a team, under hell of a tactic. Until I see how he can be relevant in a battle, without a plot device. I'm not saying Wolverine cannot achieve some damage, still don't see how it is a big factor.

And BFRing with just one hit could be easily accomplished, until there's an evidence it couldn't. This how I see it. If you disagree, it's ok.

I am sorry to all of my friends that are Hulk fans...I couldn't help myself, it was the perfect setup for that scan=P

@adamtrmm: No, it has never happened due to the fact that it's not Hulk's style to try go for BFR. He doesn't do it against most of his opponents, not to talk of Wolverine. He's never BFRed Logan, and he has no reason to all of a sudden start trying to now. None of his punches have ever BFRed Logan. Even when he's been pissed.

Like I told you already several times, Wolverine can give Hulk a decent amount of trouble one on one. He's already done so a plethora of times. The power set lets him do so. Consistency is on his side in this case. That's what we go with on here, CONSISTENCY. Not what we like. You do not have to like that Wolverine's power set lets him hang with Hulk, but screaming "Plot!" to try discredit his consistent showings against Hulk isn't going to cut it here.

@jashro44: Storms main defense for that would be flight. Not to mention that she already BFRed WW Hulk via wind and the pinpoint accuracy of her lightning (She KOed red hulk with it putting it through a needle sized hole.) Honestly vs savage hulk (Anything stronger is far beyond her) she can potentially solo this.

@wolverine08:

So there's no reason why Hulk couldn't BFR him in my scenario, simply bc he doesn't do it consistently, since Wolvie doesn't wheigh more than a mountain. I can see where your points are coming from, but you rufuse the idea of him being non relevant, even in the case I'm giving you. I do consider Wolverine one of the most powerful street-levelers, and in my win-scenario for the team him and Archangel are actually being the teams wild-cards in this win, since they are the only two who could cut him (maybe). All that could be achieved in an icredible tactic and a perfect team game of course. But if you still disagree, let's stay where we are, bc I don't consider them on the same level or even near that, and I am not trying to discredit him, that's just how itis supposed to be.

Damn I just deleted the previous post, I was forced to write it again :)

@jashro44: I believe he did try to thunderclap her when Storm and Cable fought him during the Onslaught story, and it didn't do anything to her. IIRC, the art wasn't the greatest with respect to following the sequencing on panel but he was leaping through the air and she forced him out of the sky with wind. Once he landed he turned around and TC'd her and it didn't have an effect.

Okay are you ready? This is what happens alright. Gambit touches Wolverines ear lobes right? Charges him up really good so the Canadian is glowing fuchsia all over and slightly cooking with a bacon like sizzle crisp going on. Okay so he is charged and ready to explode? Then Colossus right? Colossus picks him up and does a Super Kinetically Charged Fastball Special - right into Hulk and when Wolvie hist Hulk he explodes and his claws get stuck in Hulk's nose, because Beast is a scientist and he worked out the exact angle Colossus needs to throw Wolverine at, so when he explodes, his adamantium claws get lodged in Hulk's nose. Then Storm makes it RAIN! Cause that what she do!

Alternatively… alternatively right? 05 in the hizzle. Scott, Warren and Hank tell the other X-Men to go home cause they are dead weight right? Angel flies up high and throws stuff at Hulk, like feathers and apples and potatoes and stuff. Cyclops sneaks up behind Hulk and gets on his knees behind the Hulk. Then Beast just runs up and jumps in front of Hulk and does his scary face.

Its canon that Beast has jumped out of the shadows and actually stopped and scared the Juggernaut. True story, I think its one of the first issues after he mutates into gorilla beast a couple of decades ago. He actually jumped at Juggernaut and spooked him so bad he almost fell over backwards. That makes Beasts scary face as powerful as Thor's Godblast and Celestial empowered War Hulk. With Scott behind Hulk crouching, ain't no way he falls over and hits his head.

The only X-Man with the means of defeating Hulk is Wolverine, but all his partners (besides Colossus) would be KOed by one thunder clap. Can Colossus and Wolverine beat the Hulk? It's definitely possible. If we are going to restrict Hulk from powering up to WWH levels then I'm going to give it to Wolverine, I've changed my vote. He's already soloed characters that are stronger than a base Hulk with a few slashes and a lil "kick to the noggin".

@adamtrmm: Look at Hulk's consistent fights against opponents other than Wolverine. He does not make an active effort to try BFR. Battlefield removement IS NOT Hulk's memo. Then you also have to look at other factors that would make it hard for Hulk to BFR Wolverine. His height is probably a factor. Hulk is about 8'0-8'5 in his Savage form whereas James is a measly 5'3. When Hulk tries to punch Wolverine, his hand is coming down. If he wanted to BFR him, he'd have to punch in an upward fashion.

So there's no reason why Hulk couldn't BFR him in my scenario, simply bc he doesn't do it consistently, since Wolvie doesn't wheigh more than a mountain.

We go by what happens consistently in the comics. Not what you want to be portrayed. Hulk has consistently not BFRed Wolverine with his punches. There is no reason why he should gain the punching technique of a professional boxer, and BFR James with his punches now.

But if you still disagree, let's stay where we are, bc I don't consider them on the same level or even near that,

Oh boy, I think I see the problem. I am not saying that Wolverine is an equal to or a powerhouse like Hulk. OK? I am saying that due to his relatively unique powerset he can give Hulk some problems in a one on one fight. You seem to be completely puzzled by how Wolverine is supposed to give Hulk problems. It is pretty simple, he soaks his punches via the healing factor/adimantium skeleton, he uses superior speed to avoid some of his hits, and he uses the adimantium claws to go for weak points like the eyes, neck, brain, etc. That is how Wolverine gives Hulk problems.

and I am not trying to discredit him, that's just how itis supposed to be.

No, no, no. That is how you want it to be. Looking at how things have consistently gone down, Wolverine can give Hulk some problems one on one. Can he win the majority? Heck no, but Hulk is in for a challenge whenever he steps into the ring with Wolverine.

@sherlock: She didn't BFR'd him, she blocked her path with her winds to then double team him with Human Torch. Also, she's no soloing anything, realistically Hulk would kill her with minor trouble alone.

@ghostravage: if your talking about WWH then WAT he didn't block his path she blew him away so BFR

An what's driving her from soloing with everyone else distract info him she could easily overload his body with electrical attacks. Or even wats stopping beast from telling her where to zap him to shut him down like she's done before.

Storm can technically solo. Especially with Wolverine and Colossus to keep him busy. She can paralyze him, short out his synapses, etc.

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Her lightning's strong enough and precise enough to affect Hulk in big ways. X-men win 8/10.

This is quite a decent battle actually. When you consider that colosseus on his own isn't that many levels below savage hulk in strength and add in Cyclops' energy blasts and Wolverine's "annoyance factor" and experience in fighting the Hulk, plus storm with his lightning attacks, etc, I think the X Men have a fairly good chance. Need to take him out early however, as Hulk will be too strong if it goes onto long.

@magnificentstorm: Does it look like BFR to you?

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It's quite visible she just stopped his tracks, not blew him away... -.-

How many times has she done such thing?

@ghostravage said:

@magnificentstorm: Does it look like BFR to you?

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It's quite visible she just stopped his tracks, not blew him away... -.-

How many times has she done such thing?

She did do it another time when she fought him.

@darkraiden: Im not talking about BFR, everybody can BFR Hulk... Im talking about shutting his brain off. I find that hilarious given the fact the amount of feats resisting pretty much everything in his brain.

That being said, that Hulk is laughable... Hulk complaining about temperature? When he's been 2 times near absolute zero with no problem whatsoever and taking temperatures as hot as the first layers of the sun without harm at all? Damn, that's some convenient degradation over there.

Has she shut Hulk's brain off since then? No. She was pretty horrified at accidentally killing him that time. Though I've seen Storm go on mean streaks like when she paralyzed that girl so...also her lightning's strong enough that a barrage should KO Hulk pretty good. Especially given that Thor's did in 1 strike and it didn't look like exceptionally powerful lightning either.

Storm can actually keep hulk suspended with her wind, allowing the x men to take pot shots at hulk. And colossus can match base savage hulk easily

@darkraiden: So... Lightning... I hope you know the strongest lightning ever recorded is around 6 billions of volts... While Hulk since classic days has resisted WAY WAY more than that... Even if Storm surpasses that record, she wont be remotely close to what Hulk resisted back then...

Do you know how many volts are in 1 megavolt? 1,000,000... 6000 megavolts are already up there with the strongest lightnings going by Nature's potential, you know... Storms potential... Now, if you look at Hulk, he's taking >BILLIONS< of >MEGAVOLTS< and that only gave him static hair. Nuff said.

As for Thor, i already delivered way too many times that annual... Anyway, Thor's lightnings may have magical features, so a logical explanation couldn't be applied. That instance is hardwanked anyways.

@ghostravage said:

@darkraiden: So... Lightning... I hope you know the strongest lightning ever recorded is around 6 billions of volts... While Hulk since classic days has resisted WAY WAY more than that... Even if Storm surpasses that record, she wont be remotely close to what Hulk resisted back then...

Do you know how many volts are in 1 megavolt? 1,000,000... 6 megavolts are already up there with the strongest lightnings going by Nature's potential, you know... Storms potential... Now, if you look at Hulk, he's taking >BILLIONS< of >MEGAVOLTS< and that only gave him static hair. Nuff said.

As for Thor, i already delivered way too many times that annual... Anyway, Thor's lightnings may have magical features, so a logical explanation couldn't be applied. That instance is hardwanked anyways.

I was talking about the force/power of the lightning, not the volts. She did pierce the ground down to the Earth's Core with it. It's essentially Nuke+++ level each bolt.

@darkraiden: Do you have the instance, with context?

of....?

@darkraiden: "She did pierce the ground down to the Earth's Core with it. It's essentially Nuke+++ level each bolt."

This...

Oh that....I have no idea. I just know she sent a lightning bolt down that to earth's core and overloaded Polaris with one bolt. I think it was to kill some monster from the looks of it.

@darkraiden: Dude... That's not storm, it was Polaris's Magnetic pulse that went down to the Earth's Core... Not only it doesn't mean that Polaris's pulse destroyed his way to the core, but the fact that's not even a feat for Storm...

That's clearly Storm.

What the hell man? The very first text box says it was Lorna's Magnetic Force! Clearly it wasn't Storm.

Yeah but it's from Storm. She .....caused it? No...was the catalyst? um....better phrase, she provided her the power to do so via overloading her with a lightning bolt.

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@darkraiden: You're twisting the feat to say it was Storm's powers. All Storm did was restoring Lorna's magnetic powers ending in an abrupt eruption of Lorna's powers. Good to know Storm is a good source of energy... That doesn't mean her lightnings are Nuke+++... That statement has no base whatsoever.

1. Storm didn't strike the Earth's Core, it was Lorna.
2. Storm lightnings are not Nuke+++.

She EXCEEDED her limits and power in 1 strike. if you can power something that's nuke++ level with 1 lightning bolt, what does that make your lightning? Nuke++ level.

Also she's still blocked mountain busters with her lightning bolts (just one), made Surfer feel it, overloaded Sebastian Shaw and more with her lightning so...still Nuke++ level.

Of course! She's a human ffs... It wasn't her power's limit, but his body, it was the punishment, didn't you read the dialogue of Havok and Cyclops?

Nah it was her powers' limits. That's what her physical limits mean...how much electricity her body can take....and part of her powerset is absorbing electricity.

@darkraiden: -.-' Nah. Let's just agree to disagree. You're reaching by twisting feats right now.

I don't see how flight defends against a thunder clap. Its a long range attack so she would have to fly pretty high in the air. I haven't read ww hulk however I imagine if she can BFR him he could just leap back so that seems like temporary solution (also from the scans posted it looks like hulk was in the air at the time so I don't think she can BFR him if he is resisting her winds). And I wouldn't compare red hulk to savage hulk as red hulk doesn't seem to have as impressive feats over all. Example is how bleeding edge nearly took down red hulk where as tony's current black and gold couldn't do much damage to current hulk. Savage hulk seems to have a much better healing factor then red hulk does.

Was there a reason it didn't work? Like did she block it some how? Also from the scans posted it looks like its grey hulk but I can't really tell, so which hulk was it?

No seriously, blocking Cyclop's blast and overloading Polaris aren't nuke++ feats? Not to mention overloading Sebastian Shaw and actually making Surfer reel with her lightning.

@darkraiden: Since when is Cyclops vision Nuke+++? Dude... Do you even know what a Nuke is? Ah, forget it... Im done.

His eyebeams have busted mountains, stated to bust small planets and destroyed giant icebergs.

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And storm blocked it with one bolt. I'd say blocking a mountain busting beam is nuke++ level. Especially as leisurely as she did it and with just one lightning bolt (also did it with her wind).

@darkraiden: How did you come to the conclusion those beams are Nuke+++ By making explode an iceberg? By making a hole in a mountain whose size isn't specified? Hell, there are mountain busting blunt shells that are not Nuke tier... Just to let you know... Nukes can decimate islands... Islands with mountains... Big mountains...

Hell, lets call the Cyclops expert to explain that blocking instance...

@god_spawn Hey mate? Could you spare some time and explain me this instance please?

?? Nukes don't even fully destroy cities.......at least Nukes we've seen go off.

@darkraiden: No...

Look at what these nukes can do...

Mk28 1.4 Megatons.

Ivy Mike: 12 Megatons.

Tsar Bomba: 50 Megatons...

All of them were detonated... The fact that nukes nowadays only decimate small cities and just create minor destruction in comparison to the real ones is because...

1. They're probably Thermonuclear nukes.
2. They're probably tactical nukes. Which are very small sized.

So yeah, nukes can decimate islands. And i think saying Storm lightnings are nuke+++ is WAY too much... and it's overwanking IMO.

@ghostravage said:

@darkraiden: No...

Look at what these nukes can do...

Mk28 1.4 Megatons.

Ivy Mike: 12 Megatons.

Tsar Bomba: 50 Megatons...

All of them were detonated... The fact that nukes nowadays only decimate small cities and just create minor destruction in comparison to the real ones is because...

1. They're probably Thermonuclear nukes.
2. They're probably tactical nukes. Which are very small sized.

So yeah, nukes can decimate islands. And i think saying Storm lightnings are nuke+++ is WAY too much... and it's overwanking IMO.

Well...ok. Tsar Bomba's not exactly your normal nuke but I get what you mean...