Grimmjow Vs. Kenpachi

Obviously Kenpachi, he already beaten Noitra,

Kenpachi>Noitra>Grimjow

Kenpachi would own Grimmjow, didn't he beat #4 with ease? Grimmjow was #9 Now if he doesn't have access to his full captain powers, i'd say they would be about even with Kenpachi still winning due to his durability.

Kenpachi has a high level speeds as well. Also he is too powerful he defeated a guy at a level higher than grim..

@mavfan626: yeah, Grimmjow has the upper hand for agility, I give him that

but still, Kenpachi may be slow, but his hands are just fast,

Kenpachi's main focus is to evolve his fighting style based on his enemy,

Kenpachi maybe a brute but he is a battle genius, he can even beat Kaname with his eyes closed because he was smart to figure out a way

Kenpachi Zaraki

Grimm Shady is faster, but Kenpachi showed when in Tosen's bankai he can catch an opponent eventually, even if he can't see them. Nnoitra has harder skin than Grimm, hands down. Hits from Kenny will dwindle him down far faster than that bland orange haired disappointment.

This is ungodly stomp Zaraki could end Nnoitora any time he wanted and instead of it he was playing with him and when he got serious just one shotted him

Zaraki with eye patch on stomped and obliterated TWO captains (Komamura, Tousen)

Same Zaraki with eye patch on one shotted three Stern Ritters

This is not even fight Zaraki stomps Grimjow

@mavfan626 said:

@Blacharrt1: Grimmjow was #6 and Noitra was #5. Grimmjow feats were better then Noirtra though.. I think Grimmjow could of challenged Noirtra and beat him, thus taking the rank of #5

Ah i see i had the numbers confused, I think nel and yammy were why. Still each number seemed to have a drastic difference in power, even by one number. especially the top 5. But Nnoitra, didn't really seem to do much in my opinion Grimmjow definitely had a better fight. But the Nnoitra fight with Nel was awesome.

this is not anime vice.

Grimmjow might give him a run for his money in full release mode but in the end Kenpachi should win this.

kenpachi ... quite easily at that.

Kenpachi stomps...

Grimmjoww might be faster and more agile, but Kenny is ridiculously more durable, and has feats (one shotting Nnoitra, the various other ridiculous feats he performs) that Grimmjoww can't come close to performing.

@mavfan626 said:

@matmatxm8: If you look at the Grimmjow's feat's in power, strength, speed and sgility he was better then Noitra even though Noitra was a high rank. think about it, Neliel was rank 3 and was have trouble keeping up with Noitra, to beat him she had to tranform right? but if you went by ranks then she should of been able to easily defeat him but she couldn't.

That is because Nel "was" number 3, the implication is that Noitra surpassed her old rank while she was in her "child form" and that the espada, in general ,were stronger than when she was part of them. Basically, Nel would not be number 3 in that line-up.

@D3athstroke said:

This is ungodly stomp Zaraki could end Nnoitora any time he wanted and instead of it he was playing with him and when he got serious just one shotted him

Zaraki with eye patch on stomped and obliterated TWO captains (Komamura, Tousen)

Same Zaraki with eye patch on one shotted three Stern Ritters

This is not even fight Zaraki stomps Grimjow

Fail.

Kenpachi said that konamura ran off saying "Genryusai-dono", and it seemed to be a good battle.

Kenpachi was beaten by shikai ichigo. Grim was having upper hand against ban kai ichigo. If you go by ban kai= 5-10x shi kai, it is ungodly stomp, but I don't think it is. Grim is different type of opponent. He isn't going to tank ken's attacks idiotically like nnoitora. He seemed much too quick for that.. And he has his cero..

Knowing Kenpachi, I am not inclining fully against him, but, considering Grim fought vizard ichigo for quite a while, I would go with him.

Now, I don't think anyone would side with ken against vizard ichigo..

I always felt the Espada ranks were horribly off. Stark being higher rank than Barragan, anyone being higher than Ulquiorra, Halibel and Nnoitra being higher than Grimmjow. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense when you compare their actual fights. I think based on feats Grimmjow would stomp Kenpachi.

Grimmjow is strong but Kenpachi is stronger. After a good battle, Kenpachi would stand victorious.

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@PrinceAragorn1 said:

@D3athstroke said:

This is ungodly stomp Zaraki could end Nnoitora any time he wanted and instead of it he was playing with him and when he got serious just one shotted him

Zaraki with eye patch on stomped and obliterated TWO captains (Komamura, Tousen)

Same Zaraki with eye patch on one shotted three Stern Ritters

This is not even fight Zaraki stomps Grimjow

Fail.

Kenpachi said that konamura ran off saying "Genryusai-dono", and it seemed to be a good battle.

Kenpachi was beaten by shikai ichigo. Grim was having upper hand against ban kai ichigo. If you go by ban kai= 5-10x shi kai, it is ungodly stomp, but I don't think it is. Grim is different type of opponent. He isn't going to tank ken's attacks idiotically like nnoitora. He seemed much too quick for that.. And he has his cero..

Knowing Kenpachi, I am not inclining fully against him, but, considering Grim fought vizard ichigo for quite a while, I would go with him.

Now, I don't think anyone would side with ken against vizard ichigo..

Kenpachi losing to Ichigo did not mean much. Besides I'm pretty sure Kenpachi K.O.ed Ichigo but Hichigo helped him out with a power boost. Afterwards, Kenpachi didn't even acknowledge the existence of anyone below captain level. Plus the injury that put Grimmjow down would not have harmed Kenpachi so his endurance is also a major factor.

@mavfan626 said:

She would still be a high ranking then Noitra..

IMO she would take #5, everybody behind gets pushed back and Yammy ceases to be an espada.

Yammy is, by rank, the strongest Espada. The ranks are 0-9, not 1-10, and he's 0.

@mavfan626 said:

@drgnx said:

@mavfan626 said:

@matmatxm8: If you look at the Grimmjow's feat's in power, strength, speed and sgility he was better then Noitra even though Noitra was a high rank. think about it, Neliel was rank 3 and was have trouble keeping up with Noitra, to beat him she had to tranform right? but if you went by ranks then she should of been able to easily defeat him but she couldn't.

That is because Nel "was" number 3, the implication is that Noitra surpassed her old rank while she was in her "child form" and that the espada, in general ,were stronger than when she was part of them. Basically, Nel would not be number 3 in that line-up.

She would still be a high ranking then Noitra..

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@mavfan626 said:

She would still be a high ranking then Noitra..

IMO she would take #5, everybody behind gets pushed back and Yammy ceases to be an espada.

She should take a lower number than Nnoitra if she got back in, she would not be higher. For that she would need to be able to beat Nnoitra if he is fighting at full strength, her showings were against Nnoitra in his sealed form, I think if she healed properly and stayed as an adult she would surpass him eventually. She was doing okay in her sealed form though. The point I was trying to make goes back to mavfan626's comment, about her being a number 3 and having issues with Nnoitra. I'm pointing out her "3" was no longer valid as Nnoitra himself pointed out that the Espada were stronger than when she had left. It is like the ex-espada, they are "ex" for a reason.

Luppi replacing Grimmjow, didn't make sense, if he was so strong he should have been number 7, unless Aizen was doing it to toy with Grimmjow.

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@Laurcus: lol no. He is not stronger than anyone past 7. Byakuya and Kenpachi one shotted him without even paying attention. He has nothing to him besides getting big and angry and pales in comparison to a real espada like Barragan or Ulquiorra. His rank might be 0 but it apparently does not mean much.

That's why I said earlier that I think the ranks are BS. Ulquiorra is not weaker than Stark or Halibel, Grimmjow is not weaker than Nnoitra or Halibel. The ranks are supposed to indicate power, but they don't. And technically, by the ranking system, the first to go would be the lowest rank, which is #9.

It doesn't make any sense to me either. Well, actually, it does. Tite Kubo is horrible when it comes to continuity.

@UltimateHero0406 said:

@PrinceAragorn1 said:

@D3athstroke said:

This is ungodly stomp Zaraki could end Nnoitora any time he wanted and instead of it he was playing with him and when he got serious just one shotted him

Zaraki with eye patch on stomped and obliterated TWO captains (Komamura, Tousen)

Same Zaraki with eye patch on one shotted three Stern Ritters

This is not even fight Zaraki stomps Grimjow

Fail.

Kenpachi said that konamura ran off saying "Genryusai-dono", and it seemed to be a good battle.

Kenpachi was beaten by shikai ichigo. Grim was having upper hand against ban kai ichigo. If you go by ban kai= 5-10x shi kai, it is ungodly stomp, but I don't think it is. Grim is different type of opponent. He isn't going to tank ken's attacks idiotically like nnoitora. He seemed much too quick for that.. And he has his cero..

Knowing Kenpachi, I am not inclining fully against him, but, considering Grim fought vizard ichigo for quite a while, I would go with him.

Now, I don't think anyone would side with ken against vizard ichigo..

Kenpachi losing to Ichigo did not mean much. Besides I'm pretty sure Kenpachi K.O.ed Ichigo but Hichigo helped him out with a power boost. Afterwards, Kenpachi didn't even acknowledge the existence of anyone below captain level. Plus the injury that put Grimmjow down would not have harmed Kenpachi so his endurance is also a major factor.

@mavfan626 said:

She would still be a high ranking then Noitra..

IMO she would take #5, everybody behind gets pushed back and Yammy ceases to be an espada.

How come it didn't mean much? He lost to a non-getsuga ichigo. Grimmjow took a GT from ban kai ichigo and all that happened was a scar. Other than that, he was fighting near-equally with a hollow mask ichigo in his released form. That many hits from vizard ichigo would have killed ken easily, if he was taked down with so much less before..

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

@Laurcus: @UltimateHero0406: @drgnx: The espada are ranked by their reiastu levels..

It was stated in Bleach databook 2 page 133

Hmm. That explains quite a lot. I nearly stopped reading bleach when I saw his rank was zero.

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

Hmm. That explains quite a lot. I nearly stopped reading bleach when I saw his rank was zero.

It was also stated that each of the Espada are Vasto Lorde level

So?

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

@PrinceAragorn1 said:

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

Hmm. That explains quite a lot. I nearly stopped reading bleach when I saw his rank was zero.

It was also stated that each of the Espada are Vasto Lorde level

So?

The form Ichigo used to beat Ulquiorra is his Vasto Lorde hollow form. If Ichido beat Ulquiorra you can say that he's at least higher than or equal to te 4th espada but that doesn't put him anywhere near close to the other 3

Hell no. Vasto Lorde hollow form, if that's what it is called, stopped cifer's strongest attack with his bare hands, and two shotted him with ease. This is quite beyond what we have seen from any of the four espada ranked above him, which is already doubtful as cifer didn't show his second release to Aizen, and as you said, just based on reiatsu level, so doesn;t mean they could beat him.

Hollow ichigo's speed and power are much greater than what we saw in the entire battle, second only to the captain commander, and aizen.

@redbird3rdboywonder: @PrinceAragorn1:

I think it was mentioned the no one knew of ulquiorra's second release. So it is possible he was above the others in that form.

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

@PrinceAragorn1 said:

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

@Laurcus: @UltimateHero0406: @drgnx: The espada are ranked by their reiastu levels..

It was stated in Bleach databook 2 page 133

Hmm. That explains quite a lot. I nearly stopped reading bleach when I saw his rank was zero.

It was also stated that each of the Espada are Vasto Lorde level

But some were Adjuchas and Menos before their transformations. 9 Was a Menos who managed to hang around be consuming others to get stronger.Below 5-8 should have been Adjuchas.

Nnoitra looked like he was on the right track.

I would assume 1-4 were V.L.

0/10 I have no clue.

@drgnx said:

@redbird3rdboywonder: @PrinceAragorn1:

I think it was mentioned the no one knew of ulquiorra's second release. So it is possible he was above the others in that form.

Agreed. And he seems to be on par with them, at least.

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

@drgnx: I'm just saying what Kubo stated in the daabook

@PrinceAragorn1: @drgnx: Yes it could be possible but if that was the case you'd have to put Vasto Lorde Ichigo above Stark who took on 2 vizards(who could have been on par with Ichigo) and 2 captains who are far above the other captains which is waaaaaay to high for him to be IMO

I won't lie.. I do think that Vasto Lorde ichigo is stronger than stark. But that's just an opinion..

About the vizard thing though. I doubt any of them were > shinji. Grimjow did (barely) fight against Masked Shinji unreleased.His Released form lost to vizard ichigo, though.. And cifer beat hollow with ease, I doubt he couldn't have taken out two hollow forms in state 2.. in turn, he got owned by vasto lorde ichigo.. So possibly vasto lorde > 2 hollow forms.. which should be enough to take down love and whoever the other one was, and so above stark.

It's just logical opinion, and I am using abc logic because none of them have too-special abilities, being physical fighters in General..

I know ichigo,whether vizard of ban kai is nowhere near shunsui & ukitake, (hope I spelt right) but hollow form should take any one of them down. (NOT when they are teamed up and serious)

Stark, on the other hand didn't take both of them on for long, and lost easily when they Shunsui took him seriously.. really disappointing..

Don't go attacking me about assuming things, please.. Just tell me if I am flawed somewhere in the logic..

@redbird3rdboywonder said:

No I would never attack someone for being openly honest about how much they know

Alright now first regarding the Vizards, it's hard to know how they compare to Shinji but Kensei, Love, and Rose are all former captains just like Shinji was(he's a captain again in the current manga), so they could be comparable in terms of strength, but there's no doubt that Shinji is stronger than Lisa, Mashiro, and Hacchi as the two former were ex luitenants and Hacchi was just a Kido expert.

Now regarding the Shinji vs hollow ichigo, remember that Shinji never released his Shikai or Bankai during that fight so he was holding back against Ichigo and as for Love and Rose I doubt Vasto Lorde Ichigo could beat both of them if they release their shikai and bankais or that Vasto Lorde Ichigo> two vizards, because while it may seem that way remember we only saw a fraction of what they were truely capable of. Actually all of the Vizards have a special ability(with the possible exeption of Hiyori because I don't remember what her Shikai is.)

The fact that Sark was able to hold his own against the 4 of them for that long should be a testament to his strength because Ulquiorra would have died instantly

Though, hollow ichigo hit grimmjow much worse than shinji.. and cifer was throwing him around like he was nothing.. That's why I thought he should be on par with stark, not stronger but 4/10 to 6/10 level.. His lance attack was much larger compared to explosion of stark's ceros, and still, the ceros got the masks of the two vizards.. I don't think either love, or his friend could have survived the lance thing.. ichigo stopped it with his bare hands..

Again, it's quite possible that I am being done in by Vasto Lorde ichigo's awesomeness factor.. but I'd still give him 6-7/10 against stark..