#1 Edited by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
    

 

VERSUS 

 

  
 
 

LOCATION 

 
Unpopulated.  Vehicles are stationary and abandoned.   Everything is on limits.
   
 

RULES

 
 -Begin 30 feet apart. Both near vehicles and the buildings for cover. 
-Random encounter. 
-Morals apply. 
-Ollie has a bow with regular arrows, 1 explosive arrow, 1 net arrow, and an adamantium katana. 
-Silver Samurai has a katana, daggers, and shurikens.
-In character. 
-Standard elimination rules apply. 
-For the sake of balance, assume an arrow is capable of breaching Harada's armor.  
#2 Posted by Saren (25112 posts) - - Show Bio

Have I not read enough Harada or is maneuverability a bit of a problem for him? As in, his armor cuts down on his speed somewhat? I didn't get the impression that he could swing around without any problem during his fight with Elektra, but I could be horribly mistaken. I have seen one fight where he KO'd Logan, in Wolverine #2, but I think that was close combat so I'm not sure how much speed was involved.

If Ollie's arrows can breach Harada's armor, he could take him down before he covers the distance. If he does cover the distance, I think Harada would take a decisive win in a sword fight. Ollie's only swordsmanship feats that I'm aware of are beating Deathstroke with prep in a fight that Slade wanted to lose, and later beating Jason Todd, who's not exactly renowned for his skill with a katana.

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#3 Posted by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Posted by Saren (25112 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n: Cool, that answers my issue over his speed. If he can deflect bullets arrows shouldn't be a problem. I will side with Harada for the time being, I think he's stronger, fast enough, and more skilled with a sword.

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#5 Posted by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
@CitizenBane: I was considering giving Ollie or trick arrow or two, but I thought it would be unfair.  I'll wait and see how this plays out.
#6 Posted by Scarbearer (745 posts) - - Show Bio

Hrm, this is a tough one. I think a lot of people vastly underestimate Ollie in close combat, but even so, Harada's got the tools to beat him in close quarters. If he can keep him at range though I think Ollie can take this though. Harada does have some great bullet blocking feats, but Ollie has crazy savant ability with a bow and arrow. He can vary the speed at which his arrows are traveling depending on how much draw and arc he uses in his shots and throw off Harada's timing. If we're talking pre-52 Ollie (and I assume we are since he's not using trick arrows) he'll be willing to take some pretty brutal shots to put him Harada down.

I think Ollie is capable of winning but by a very slim majority because it's only gonna take one mistake for Silver Samurai to close in and put him where he's out matched. I'll say Green Arrow 6/10

#7 Posted by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
@Scarbearer:  

If we're talking pre-52 Ollie  

Yes, it's pre-52.
#8 Posted by Morpheus_ (29696 posts) - - Show Bio
I believe some tricks arrows will be required. I don't see Ollie winning otherwise. He mastered the katana, but as the Citizen said, his feats are not really enough to compare him to someone like Silver Samurai.
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#9 Posted by TDK_1997 (15089 posts) - - Show Bio

Green Arrow isn't that well trained with a katana to stop somebody at the level of Harada with the katana.

#10 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

If Silver Samurai has his teleportation ring, then it should be a short fight. Even without, his bullet-blocking feats and sword skill should get him the victory.

#11 Posted by TDK_1997 (15089 posts) - - Show Bio

@Doombot_666 said:

If Silver Samurai has his teleportation ring, then it should be a short fight. Even without, his bullet-blocking feats and sword skill should get him the victory.

He doesn't need his teleportation ring.He can dodge bullets,arrows won't be a problem.And that means that Ollie doesn't have that big chances.

#12 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@TDK_1997 said:

@Doombot_666 said:

If Silver Samurai has his teleportation ring, then it should be a short fight. Even without, his bullet-blocking feats and sword skill should get him the victory.

He doesn't need his teleportation ring.He can dodge bullets,arrows won't be a problem.And that means that Ollie doesn't have that big chances.

Yes. Thank you for paraphrasing my second sentence.

#13 Posted by Illuminatus (9489 posts) - - Show Bio
@Doombot_666 said:

If Silver Samurai has his teleportation ring, then it should be a short fight. Even without, his bullet-blocking feats and sword skill should get him the victory.

According to k4tz, Silver Samurai has never used his teleportation ring in a combat situation.
#14 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Illuminatus: It doesn't really matter, I guess. Silver Samurai should still win this.

#15 Posted by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
@Morpheus_ said:
I believe some tricks arrows will be required. I don't see Ollie winning otherwise. He mastered the katana, but as the Citizen said, his feats are not really enough to compare him to someone like Silver Samurai.
 When creating this I was considering one explosive and one glue.  Giving him too much seemed unfair to me.  Perhaps a net arrow as well.  Thoughts?
#16 Edited by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
@Illuminatus said:

@Doombot_666 said:

If Silver Samurai has his teleportation ring, then it should be a short fight. Even without, his bullet-blocking feats and sword skill should get him the victory.

According to k4tz, Silver Samurai has never used his teleportation ring in a combat situation.
And I stand by that until someone can prove otherwise from the comics.  People have only listed the cartoon and video games as source for implying he tele-attacks, where-as I've read a majority of Harada's earlier showings.  He uses it from transportation- to enter and exit a match.
#17 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n said:

@Morpheus_ said:
I believe some tricks arrows will be required. I don't see Ollie winning otherwise. He mastered the katana, but as the Citizen said, his feats are not really enough to compare him to someone like Silver Samurai.
When creating this I was considering one explosive and one glue. Giving him too much seemed unfair to me. Perhaps a net arrow as well. Thoughts?

If Silver Samurai were to block a net arrow and the net still deployed, it could tangle him up for a few seconds, giving Green Arrow the chance to finish him... Or Silver Samurai's blade would just cut through the net like butter. I don't know how much distance he would need to cut the net with his sword-charging power.

#18 Posted by Scarbearer (745 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n said:

@Morpheus_ said:
I believe some tricks arrows will be required. I don't see Ollie winning otherwise. He mastered the katana, but as the Citizen said, his feats are not really enough to compare him to someone like Silver Samurai.
When creating this I was considering one explosive and one glue. Giving him too much seemed unfair to me. Perhaps a net arrow as well. Thoughts?

I think an explosive arrow and a glue arrow can give Ollie some options, without completely tipping the match in his favor because Harada should be hard to lock down.

Just don't give him the boxing glove arrow. We don't want this thread to become spite after all. :P

#19 Posted by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
UPDATED OP! 
-Ollie has a bow with regular arrows, 1 explosive arrow, 1 net arrow, and an adamantium katana.  
 
@Scarbearer: :D
#20 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@k4tzm4n: This is one of your few threads where I see a clear victor :P
#21 Posted by k4tzm4n (34940 posts) - - Show Bio
@Ferro Vida: :O 
Who do you think is taking the majority?
#22 Posted by TDK_1997 (15089 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n said:

UPDATED OP!
-Ollie has a bow with regular arrows, 1 explosive arrow, 1 net arrow, and an adamantium katana.

@Scarbearer: :D

That clears it up.Now Ollie is the winner.

#23 Posted by Vance Astro (91414 posts) - - Show Bio

Silver Samurai.

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#24 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@k4tzm4n said:
@Ferro Vida: :O Who do you think is taking the majority?
Silver Samurai should take a solid majority here. The net arrow will slow him down at best, and I don't see Ollie opening with the exploding arrow.
#25 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida said:

@k4tzm4n said:
@Ferro Vida: :O Who do you think is taking the majority?
Silver Samurai should take a solid majority here. The net arrow will slow him down at best, and I don't see Ollie opening with the exploding arrow.

The trick arrows are a game changer. The net arrow would slow Silver Samurai down for a few seconds (and more importantly occupy or pin down his arms), but that's all Green Arrow needs, really. Green Arrow wouldn't open with an exploding arrow. He'd probably wait until Silver Samurai has already blocked a few regular arrows then send an explosive arrow his way so that he can block it thinking it's like all of the others. If Silver Samurai were to block an explosive arrow with his sword, then his blocking skills wouldn't matter that much because he'll still be within the kill-radius of the arrow's warhead. He'll either be incapacitated by the explosion or stunned and left defenseless for at least a few seconds.

#26 Posted by progenitor (7533 posts) - - Show Bio

I've actually been impressed with Ollie's skill progress as a character, especially now his skill with a blade, but it still doesn't hold up to the skill of Harada, who should take a solid majority, IMO.

#27 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@Doombot_666 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@k4tzm4n said:
@Ferro Vida: :O Who do you think is taking the majority?
Silver Samurai should take a solid majority here. The net arrow will slow him down at best, and I don't see Ollie opening with the exploding arrow.

The trick arrows are a game changer. The net arrow would slow Silver Samurai down for a few seconds (and more importantly occupy or pin down his arms), but that's all Green Arrow needs, really. Green Arrow wouldn't open with an exploding arrow. He'd probably wait until Silver Samurai has already blocked a few regular arrows then send an explosive arrow his way so that he can block it thinking it's like all of the others. If Silver Samurai were to block an explosive arrow with his sword, then his blocking skills wouldn't matter that much because he'll still be within the kill-radius of the arrow's warhead. He'll either be incapacitated by the explosion or stunned and left defenseless for at least a few seconds.

SS is fast enough to cut through the net when the arrow opens up, or to knock the arrow aside with his blade before it does, and that is, again, presuming Ollie would open with that. GA would have the chance to fire maybe two arrows before SS closes the distance between them; he's smart enough to know to get in close when fighting an archer, he won't just stand there and deflect arrows at a distance.
#28 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida said:

@Doombot_666 said:

@Ferro Vida said:

@k4tzm4n said:
@Ferro Vida: :O Who do you think is taking the majority?
Silver Samurai should take a solid majority here. The net arrow will slow him down at best, and I don't see Ollie opening with the exploding arrow.

The trick arrows are a game changer. The net arrow would slow Silver Samurai down for a few seconds (and more importantly occupy or pin down his arms), but that's all Green Arrow needs, really. Green Arrow wouldn't open with an exploding arrow. He'd probably wait until Silver Samurai has already blocked a few regular arrows then send an explosive arrow his way so that he can block it thinking it's like all of the others. If Silver Samurai were to block an explosive arrow with his sword, then his blocking skills wouldn't matter that much because he'll still be within the kill-radius of the arrow's warhead. He'll either be incapacitated by the explosion or stunned and left defenseless for at least a few seconds.

SS is fast enough to cut through the net when the arrow opens up, or to knock the arrow aside with his blade before it does, and that is, again, presuming Ollie would open with that. GA would have the chance to fire maybe two arrows before SS closes the distance between them; he's smart enough to know to get in close when fighting an archer, he won't just stand there and deflect arrows at a distance.

Of course he is, but Green Arrow's smart enough to know that he needs to prevent Silver Samurai from closing the distance. He'd run away, put objects between himself and the samurai, and seek high ground, which he'd probably be much better at doing seeing as he's not encumbered by samurai armor.

#29 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@Doombot_666: I'm under the impression you haven't seen SS do much. His armour hardly encumbers him. He's quick and agile enough to fight Wolverine, and were it not for Wolverine's healing factor he would have won those.
#30 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida: I'm not saying Silver Samurai isn't quick, just not as quick as Green Arrow.

#31 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@Doombot_666: And I'm saying you are incorrect. Can you show me GA speed feats?
#32 Edited by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida: No, and it wouldn't matter anyway. We're talking about peak-human speeds here, not super-human speeds. Common sense would tell you that, all other things being equal, a person who is not wearing a lot of armor or gear can move faster and jump higher than someone who is. You'd have to convince me that Silver Samurai is vastly faster than Green Arrow to convince me that his armor is not a factor, and it still wouldn't change the fact that while Silver Samurai is trying to close the distance, Green arrow will be trying to stay away from him. It's not even just an issue of speed. Silver Samurai's armor could make it harder for him to squeeze into tight spaces that Green arrow might use to put distance between the samurai and himself.

#33 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@Doombot_666: Alright, let's ignore his fights with Wolverine for a moment. Let me ask you this: how is Green Arrow going to consistently, accurately fire arrows at SS while he is running away?
#34 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida: Run into an alley way, ambush Silver Samurai from an unlikely position as he turns the corner; jump/climb up through a second-story window, hit him form above as he pursues; crawl under a high fence, fire arrows through it; sprint into a dark building, hide there, fire arrows; rinse and repeat. Without the trick arrows, it would only be a matter of time before Silver Samurai catches up to Green Arrow and takes him out. With the trick arrows, an explosive arrow could come at any time, and Silver Samurai wouldn't have much of a defense against it. All Green Arrow would need is a little time.

#35 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@Doombot_666 said:

@Ferro Vida: Run into an alley way, ambush Silver Samurai from an unlikely position as he turns the corner; jump/climb up through a second-story window, hit him form above as he pursues; crawl under a high fence, fire arrows through it; sprint into a dark building, hide there, fire arrows; rinse and repeat. Without the trick arrows, it would only be a matter of time before Silver Samurai catches up to Green Arrow and takes him out. With the trick arrows, an explosive arrow could come at any time, and Silver Samurai wouldn't have much of a defense against it. All Green Arrow would need is a little time.

Or, as he turns to do this, SS hits him in the back with a shuriken, since he has shown to have excellent accuracy with them. And this is a guy who has been stabbed and cut numerous times and continued fighting. Even if GA does hit him he will be able to keep up for a while regardless of his injuries. And, again, he can deflect arrows and has excellent reaction time.
#36 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida: And again, one explosive arrow and its over for silver samurai. All it would take is a few seconds for Green Arrow to capitalize on about any reaction Silver Samurai would have to an explosive arrow, whether it's being temporarily stunned, permanently blinded, knocked down, dead, or in any other way rendered defenseless. The samurai isn't going to continue fighting with an arrow in his head. I actually agree with most of what you're saying, except you seem to want to ignore the trick arrows.

#37 Posted by Ferro Vida (34678 posts) - - Show Bio
@Doombot_666 said:

@Ferro Vida: And again, one explosive arrow and its over for silver samurai. All it would take is a few seconds for Green Arrow to capitalize on about any reaction Silver Samurai would have to an explosive arrow, whether it's being temporarily stunned, permanently blinded, knocked down, dead, or in any other way rendered defenseless. The samurai isn't going to continue fighting with an arrow in his head. I actually agree with most of what you're saying, except you seem to want to ignore the trick arrows.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but GA doesn't usually kill. I don't see it likely that he will open by aiming a exploding arrow directly at Harada. There is too much risk of collateral damage for him to do that. If he did hit SS with an exploding arrow then he could win it, yes. I don't see it likely that he will do that before it is too late.
#38 Posted by Doombot_666 (213 posts) - - Show Bio

@Ferro Vida: You got a point there. Green Arrow might not have any problems lobotomizing a rapist, but he would probably draw the line at killing Silver Samurai unless we're both wrong about Green Arrow. I guess I was thinking more in tactical terms again. I'll change my pick back to Silver Samurai. Arrows and explosives don't do much good against an opponent like him unless you're willing to kill.