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#51 Posted by Soulstealer (825 posts) - - Show Bio

@Wonderbrezzy said:

@Silver2467:

I don't need to bow down to your wants and needs, and if you wish to see yet another person asked the same as you did, tonight I posted my pic and sign go to with his ockward reqest Im not doing this any more . this place is out of hand Scroll down On REAL Life pic Thread and see for your self SMH

http://www.comicvine.com/forums/off-topic/5/real-life-pic-thread/12499/?page=807

Him asking you to observe forum rules isn't exactly out of line. Also I don't believe he meant any maliciousness toward you. If you don't like the thread, let the moderators know and request to create another or even PM. No one is trying to be rude, however it's a battle thread in the battle forms and Silver is hardly in the wrong for saying what he did.

#52 Posted by texasdeathmatch (13171 posts) - - Show Bio
@Wonderbrezzy said:

@Silver2467:

I don't need to bow down to your wants and needs, and if you wish to see yet another person asked the same as you did, tonight I posted my pic and sign go to with his ockward reqest Im not doing this any more . this place is out of hand Scroll down On REAL Life pic Thread and see for your self SMH

http://www.comicvine.com/forums/off-topic/5/real-life-pic-thread/12499/?page=807

Stay on topic, no one here wants to see that.
 

Great debate though guys.
#53 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6560 posts) - - Show Bio

^^^

Agreed.

#54 Posted by Saren (26015 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467: That reply didn't reach my inbox for some reason. I don't really disagree with any of your points. Just one addition: earlier you questioned whether Gorgon's telepathy would work on Maul's mind because of his dark nature; I believe it would. It seemed to work on Norman Osborn, Shishido remarked that there were demons lurking inside Osborn's mind but he didn't seem to have any discomfort or difficulty.

Moderator
#55 Posted by Silver2467 (16527 posts) - - Show Bio
@CitizenBane said:

@Silver2467: That reply didn't reach my inbox for some reason. I don't really disagree with any of your points. Just one addition: earlier you questioned whether Gorgon's telepathy would work on Maul's mind because of his dark nature; I believe it would. It seemed to work on Norman Osborn, Shishido remarked that there were demons lurking inside Osborn's mind but he didn't seem to have any discomfort or difficulty.

Makes sense.
#56 Edited by Silver2467 (16527 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump. 
 
Late of course, but let's continue at any rate. Maul's speed feats are rather impressive. I have speed showings on his part that convey superhuman speed in all categories, movement, perception, reaction, and combat. You will have to forgive me for the protractedness of this post, Bane, but then again, you of all people should appreciate the value of being comprehensive.
 
For movement speed, Maul disappears in a blur. 

Desperate, she reached for her wrist launcher. Her only chance was to hit the horned one squarely and hope that the explosion would be contained enough by the other's body to allow Lihnn to survive. But as she triggered the launcher the tattooed man seemed to disappear in a blur.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter 
 
He sprints five times faster than a human being can run. 

Maul angled to the middle of the narrow avenue. His speeder bike was parked not far away; he could activate the slave circuit by remote control and have it here within a few minutes at most. But there was an even quicker way to overtake them. He called upon the Force, moving easily five times faster than a human could travel at a dead run. There was no way they could escape him now.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter

He travels by leaping distances so quickly that footage from recording devices would have to be slowed down to display him.

Maul waited until the moon was low in the sky before he went to Lommite Limited's headquarters at the base of the escarpment. The incidents of sabotage had caused the complex of buildings to be placed on high alert. Armed sentries, some accompanied by leashed beasts, patrolled, and powerful illuminators cast circles of brilliant light over the spacious grounds. A five-meter-high electrified stun fence encompassed everything.
Maul spent an hour studying the movements of the sentries, the periodic sweeps of the illuminators, the towering fence, and the motion detector lasers that gridded the broad lawn beyond. He was certain that infrared cams were scanning the grounds, but there was little he could do about those without leaving evidence of his infiltration. A probe droid would have been able to tell him all he needed to know, but there wasn't time and he wanted to do this personally. To test the possibility that pressure detectors had been installed in the ground, he used the Force to propel stones over the fence. As they struck specific places on the lawn, he waited for some response, but the guards stationed at the entry gates simply continued to go about their business.
When he was satisfied that he had committed the results of his reconnaissance to memory, he shrugged out of his cloak and leapt straight up over the fence, landing precisely where some of the rocks he had tossed rested. Then he sprang to a series of other sites that ultimately carried him to the wall of the principal building, moving with such speed the entire time that whatever holorecordings were being made wouldn't show him unless they were played in slow motion.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Saboteur

As a Togorian pirate slashes at Maul with an inward swing of twin axes, Maul leaps above and then behind the Togorian so quickly that he lands as the Togorians axes slice past each other.

The dark side alerts me that the captain is taking aim at my back. He will try to crush me with a swipe from each hand, hoping to cut me in two. I leap, again using the dark side to add velocity and distance. I sail high above his head and grab onto one of the cages with one hand. I use the momentum to swing past the captain. I let go, make a midair reversal, and land behind him. I have done this so fast that his two vibro-axes are now meeting where my body once stood.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

Another visually indiscernible showing, faster than a droid can see. (He also breaks durasteel binders cuffed around his wrists, but I think you and I would agree that the Gorgon is stronger than Maul.)

Behind his back, Maul flexed his wrists. The durasteel binders dug into his flesh, but the Sith Lord felt no pain. With a jerk, Maul pulled his arms apart. The binders shattered, scattering bits of durasteel all over the cell's filthy floor. The interrogator droid made an excited whirring sound. It had never seen a prisoner break free from a set of binders with such ease. The droid activated its laser scalpels and hurtled through the air toward Maul. Maul delivered a sharp kick to the droid's spherical underside. The droid soared toward the ceiling but regained control before impact and flew back toward the Sith. Maul leaped aside, moving faster than the droid's photoreceptor could follow. The droid raced past him and smashed hard against the cell wall.

--Taken from Episode 1 Adventures: The Fury of Darth Maul

For perception speed, Maul perceives his surroundings in slow motion during a training exercise wherein he fights combat automata that can throw blows nearly imperceptibly fast.

The Sith apprentice stood in the middle of the training chamber as the four droids circled him. His breathing was calm, his heartbeat even and slow. He was aware of his body's reactions to the danger—aware and in control.
Two of the droids—Rapier and Chain, he silently named them—were within his field of vision. The other two—Cudgel and Hachete—were not, being behind him. It did not matter; through his awareness of the Force he could sense their movements as plainly as if he had eyes in the back of his head.
Maul raised his own weapon, the double-bladed lightsaber, and triggered the power control. Twin lances of pure energy boiled forth, hissing and crackling in crimson loops that began and ended at the two flux apertures on either end of the device. Any Jedi Knight could wield a single-bladed lightsaber; only a master fighter could use the weapon first designed by the legendary Dark Lord Exar Kun millennia ago. Unless one was in perfect attunement with it, the weapon could be as deadly to the user as to the opponent.
Rapier lunged at full extension, its metal knee joint bent almost to the floor. The needle point flickered toward Maul's heart, almost too fast to see.
The dark side blossomed in Darth Maul, the power of it resonating in him like black lightning, augmenting his years of training, guiding his reactions. Time seemed to slow, to stretch.
It would have been easy to chop the blade itself in half, as few metals could resist the frictionless edge of a lightsaber. But there was no challenge to that. Maul spun toward the point, twisted around the outside, and snapped his hands horizontally at chest level. The left blade of the lightsaber sheared through Rapier's sword arm. Both arm and weapon clattered to the floor.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter

Another reference to his ability to perceive his surroundings in slow motion and thusly move quicker. 

The cantina had an air of benign neglect, a smell of liquid inebriants and greasy food. The lighting was deliberately low. Flying insects of various sizes circled the illuminators, and children of several species ran in and out. Males and females fraternized openly, with a sense of levity or abandon. Music was provided by a ragtag band of Bith and fat Ortolans. Along the length of the bar Weequays conversed with Ugnaughts, Twi'leks with Gands. Maul was the only Iridonian in the place, but he was not the only sole representative of a species.
If some of the residents he had passed on the street were the hunters, the manka cats, here were the nerfs the cats fed on—the ones who gave themselves over to intoxicants and games of chance and other vices. It was the sheer absence of discipline that sickened him. Discipline was the key to power. Unflinching discipline was what had forged him into a sword master and warrior. Discipline was what enabled him to defy gravity and slow the inrush of sensory input, so that he could move between the moments.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Saboteur

For reflexes and dexterity, Maul agilely twists around a spray of blaster bolts flying toward him.
As a teenager, Maul runs through a barrage of blaster fire without sustaining a hit. 

Without so much as a word from Talzin, the three Nightsisters drew their swords and enabled their energy bows. The dimly illuminated docking bay appeared to be deserted, but Maul could perceive the presence of armed beings lurking in the dark periphery. Regardless, Talzin continued to march into the open, as if without a care.
“Stay right where you are and lower your weapons,” a gruff voice barked in Basic over the cargo bay loudspeakers.
The beings Maul had sensed began to edge from the shadows, contingents of top-knotted Weequays and big-brained Siniteens armed with blaster rifles. At the center of the group stood a towering Vollick clad head to foot in garish battle armor.
“You won’t be returning to Dathomir, Mother Talzin,” the Vollick said. “The five of you are going to be my guests on Rattatak, where you will eventually become members of my elite army.” He drew an outsize blaster from its holster and triggered a shot toward the bay’s tall ceiling.
“Our weapons are set on stun, but we’ll shoot to kill if you decide to refuse my invitation.”
Talzin didn’t bother to reply. With a motion of her hands, the docking bay was suddenly filled with dozens of Nightsister warriors, though sporting robes and weapons that struck Maul as of ancient design. He understood that he was being treated to a dazzling Force illusion, but the Vollick’s soldiers were fully taken in. Just as the warlord had warned, the selector switches of a dozen blasters went from stun to full on, and a harried storm of bolts began to crisscross the bay, putting everyone in jeopardy.
The real Nightsisters were as fast on the draw as their opponents, and managed to drop several soldiers with energy quarrels before Talzin’s conjured illusion of ancient warriors began to evaporate into the same recycled air out of which they had appeared. Emboldened then—and ignoring the Vollick’s commands for cease-fire—the Weequays and Siniteens charged, dropping one of the Nightsisters and wounding Talzin in the thigh.
Maul thought about racing back into the drop ship, but doubted that it had sufficient power to overcome the bay’s tractor beam array. Instead he made a mad run for the fallen Nightsister, leaping, whirling, and tumbling across the deck until his hands seized on her energy bow. Retreating to the ship, he took cover behind one of the landing struts and began to return fire.
If this was a test, he thought, it was for keeps.
Several meters away, Talzin was flat on the deck with the two remaining Nightsisters unleashing a dark-side barrage of arrows, many of which were finding their marks. Maul scanned the cargo bay. Having passed through this station on several occasions—typically en route to extrasystem contests arranged by Trezza—he knew that its cargo and passenger hubs were linked at several points by airlock corridors. If he could make it to the passenger pod, he could commandeer a drop ship and be back on Orsis before anyone even discovered that he was missing. But it would be easier said than done if he had to continue playing by the rules his Master had laid out.
He was preparing to make a break for the nearest hatchway when Mother Talzin called to him.
“Don’t leave us, Maul!”
He turned to see that she was on her feet, supported by one of the Nightsisters while the other was covering them.
“Maul!” Talzin repeated.
Confliction paralyzed him. Would his Master expect him to show sympathy? Even if the test had gone awry, Talzin might still be one of Sidious’ agents, and thus deserving of his help. Did the dark side of the Force ever permit self-sacrifice? Cursing through his gritted teeth, he put his right arm through the bow and hooked it over his shoulder, then ran through a hail of blaster bolts to reach Talzin. Heaving her over his shoulder, he raced for the safety of the adjacent bay, the two Nightsisters steps behind.

Short sword in hand and evading bolts from Weequay and Siniteen blasters, Maul sprinted for the control room bulkhead. For a moment it appeared that he intended to run up the wall, but instead he launched himself straight up from the deck when he was a few meters short of the bulkhead. At the same time he raised the sword over his head in a two-handed grip and plunged it into the control room’s broad transparisteel window. A normal blade would simply have bounced off the transparency, but energized by the dark side of the Force the Nightsister’s sword not only penetrated the pane the way a lightsaber would, but opened a vertical tear in the window as gravity struggled to return Maul to the deck. Dangling from the weapon’s hilt, he rode with it for a short distance, then swung his body up and around the sword, bringing his feet in front of him and slamming them against the pane. That the gambit worked, however, owed less to the amount of momentum Maul was able to supply, and more to the concentrated blaster fire provided by the Vollick’s warriors.
Feet first, Maul flew through the smashed window into the control room, with dozens of blaster bolts following him through and ricocheting wildly. Several devices in the room were struck, and, as circuits fried, the small space began to fill with acrid smoke.

--Taken from Restraint

He sidesteps blaster bolts. 

Maul opened the door and stepped into the office. Trezza was seated behind his massive desk. Kilindi stood before him. And Meltch Krakko stood on the far side of the room, near an open fireplace.
Kilindi gasped at the sight o Maul's blood-soaked body. Maul fixed his gaze on Krakko and walked straight toward him. Even though Maul was not carrying any weapons, Krakko drew his blaster and fired at him. Maul jerked his body to the left, dodged the blaster bolt, and kept walking toward Krakko. Krakko fired two more shots. Maul dodged those too before he grabbed Krakko's gun arm with one hand, and his neck with the other.

--Taken from The Wrath of Darth Maul

Maul draws his lightsaber before a falling blaster hits the floor and moves his hands in a blur as he deflects over half a dozen blaster bolts. 

Before the weapon had bounced off the wall and landed on the floor, Maul had the lightsaber in his grasp. He thumbed on both blades as the next blaster bolt and half a dozen more came his way in rapid succession. The Sith apprentice's hands were a blur as he let the dark side take him over completely, giving in to its power and allowing it to control and manipulate him. Blaster bolts struck the lightsaber's spinning blades and were deflected into the walls, the ceiling, the floor.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter

He deflects blaster bolts. 

It is time to activate the assassin droids. Assassin droids are a necessary part of training. They are programmed to fight to the death. Blasters are built into their chests and hands. Their accuracy is perfect. A miscalculation on my part could be lethal. I activate three droids and power up my double-bladed lightsaber. I am outnumbered, but assassin droids can't move as quickly as I can. They cannot jump, and their flexibility isn't as finely tuned.
Their weaponry makes up for that.
They track me easily in the empty room, their sensor lights flashing. I meet the first barrage and deflect it with my lightsaber, spinning it in a blur of motion while I track the next blaster fire and meet it. I can feel the power of the dark side. Aggression fuels it. The darkness throbs furiously, beating in my muscles, making me merciless and effective.
This is what I love: the feel of the dark side of the Force pulsing, growing, until the air crackles with the charge. It is the charge of blood and pain and anger. I control it. I manipulate it. It only makes me stronger.
The assassin droids are programmed to use complicated fighting strategies. They try a flanking maneuver, but I leap over them, the dark side fueling every muscle, and come at them from behind. I destroy the first droid as the second and third turn and fire.
I am already a millimeter away, escaping the fire and twisting to deliver a cleaving blow to the second droid. It topples, its sensor lights still flashing. I bury the other end of my lightsaber in its control panel. It lets out a screech of protest that sounds almost human. Smoke rises and I breathe it in. It is the smell of the Jedi Temple burning. The pleasure of destruction builds, makes my blood pound.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

He catches four arrows fired at him and throws them back at their source.

Since the other cell doors remained sealed, it appeared C-3PX was still trapped. Darth Maul was about to free the droid when the other two Bartokk escorts appeared at the end of the corridor. Seeing Maul standing over their fallen comrades, one of the Bartokks struck a wall panel that controlled a series of trapdoors within the dungeon. Suddenly, the grated floor dropped away beneath Maul's feet. A second later, he plunged down through the trapdoor and into a dark cavern. Maul landed on top of a sandpile and rolled to the subterranean floor. Lifting himself up, he looked at the cavern ceiling. The trapdoor had sealed, but Maul could see the Bartokks through the grated floor.
The Bartokks scurried across the corridor and jammed twin-bolt crossbows down through the floor's open slots. They aimed their weapons at Maul and fired. Four poison-tipped, armor-piercing arrows sped toward the Sith Lord. Maul's hands moved like lightning as he plucked each arrow from the air and flung them back at the assassins. The arrows shot up through the grated floor and struck the two snipers. Their arms reflexively reached to remove the arrows, but the poison worked rapidly. Now there were four Bartokks lying on the corridor floor above Darth Maul.

--Taken from Episode 1 Adventures: The Fury of Darth Maul

He dodges blaster bolts from enemies shooting from behind him.

Maul decided that he had to show himself. He appeared briefly on a rise, east of the base, a two-legged stranger dressed in a long cloak, deep black against the snowfield. The assailants took him for one of the clan and immediately opened fire. Maul propelled himself over the rise with leaps and bounds, though scarcely of the sort of which he was capable. Bruit did the wise thing and split his team, figuring, as Maul predicted he would, that the lone enemy knew another way into the base.
Maul kept himself in plain sight, dodging the blaster bolts fired by his pursuers, without using his lightsaber. He couldn't have been a better guide if he had been one of them. Briefly hidden by a snowdrift, he called on the Force to twirl himself deeply into the white wave.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Saboteur

More blaster deflection. 

Maul had to finish what he had begun. He drew his lightsaber, ignited it at both ends, and leapt down to the floor of the prefab bunker.
Bruit, the Falleen, and the others spun around when they heard the resonant thrumming of his weapon, which Maul whirled over his head and around his shoulders. But no one fired. They stood staring at him, as if he were some hallucination born of bloodlust or snow blindness. Maul realized that he would have to goad them into doing what he needed them to do. He began to march forward, glowering at them with his yellow eyes and showing his teeth, and at last someone fired—the Rodian from the cantina. Maul deflected the bolt straight back at him with the lower of his blades and kept coming. "We have no fight with you, Jedi," the Falleen yelled.
The remark brought Maul up short.
"This is our business," the humanoid went on. "It doesn't concern Coruscant."
Maul growled and advanced.
Crouching suddenly, a Twi'lek fired, and Maul twirled, deflecting the bolts with his twin crimson blades. The Twi'lek and another security man dropped. Then the rest opened fire at once. Maul leapt and jinked, spun and rolled, an acrobatic wonder, impossible to target. He stopped once to raise his hand and pepper his opponents with a flurry of Force-hurled glassware and sharp instruments. He turned blasters against each other and wrenched one fighter down onto a table with enough force to snap the man's spine.
His hand weapon depleted, the Falleen rushed him. Maul spun through a fleet kick, breaking the Falleen's arm. Then, without lowering his leg, he broke the security chief's neck. Only Bruit remained. Gaping at Maul in disbelief, he let his blaster drop from his rigid hand.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Saboteur

An example of both reaction time and combat speed, Maul dismantles multiple squads of patrolling battle droids, each of which squad is comprised of eight droids, showing him deflecting fire from dozens of enemies and cutting them all down.

The deserted city of stately domes and elegant spires struck him as an artifact—or perhaps a quaint historical replica closed for routine maintenance. Squads of B1 battle droids armed with blaster rifles patrolled the narrow streets and stood sentry outside the Theed Palace and other major buildings. Evading them effortlessly, Maul timed the patrols, made note of their numbers, and used the Force to create sounds that tricked the droids into moving in one direction or another. The idea of using droids as combatants annoyed him, for droids were only as good as their programming, and the bipedal, slender-headed B1 had limited skills and no ability to perform autonomously. Only the fact that the droids, too, were integral to his Master’s more far-reaching plan kept Maul from revulsion. The deeper he ventured into the galaxy, the less honor he found.
But the Sith would redress that deficit once the Jedi were exterminated and the Republic brought down.
Maul stowed the speeder in an alley that ran alongside Theed’s space force hangar, which was perched on the edge of an escarpment. Inside the domed building he took stock of Naboo’s smart yellow-and-chromium Nubian fighters, neatly arranged in berths on several tiers, with an R2 astromech droid assigned to each ship. Despite the success of the occupation, the Neimoidians would have been wise to disable the fighters, but they were apparently incapable of tampering with anything of value. As with the control ship, Maul was tempted to show them the error of their ways, but again he did nothing.
Emerging from the hangar, he allowed himself to be detected and confronted by a patrol of droids. In a metallic voice, their officer unit ordered him to halt and raised its E-5 rifle. Reared by Darth Sidious’s custodial droids on Mustafar, Maul—for many years—had had a complex relationship with droids of any sort. Certainly his fascination with technology owed in part to the circumstances of his abnormal upbringing, but he had no compunction about destroying droids when the need arose, whether in training sessions or on missions. Still, he derived no enduring satisfaction from the contests, even when combating the most sophisticated among them.
Calling his long lightsaber to his hand, he made short work of the squad, decapitating them with his blade or exploding them by deflecting blaster bolts back at them. The brief altercation drew several more patrols, the members of which he similarly dismembered.

--Taken from End Game

Squad (8 battle droids): A squad consists of eight battle droids. While organic squads were led by a sergeant, droid squads didn't need an officer, as the squad members were directed remotely or programmed before an arrangement.

--Taken from The Essential Guide to Warfare

For combat speed, Maul kills the miniature army of guards under the employ of Black Sun vigos. 
Maul slashes a droid twice before an onlooker could see either stroke delivered.

Anger rises in me, which is good. The darkness crests and roars. I twist in the air, my lightsaber twirling, revolving. Its balance is perfect in my hand. I strike one hard blow to the left flank of the droid. I feel the power of the move reverberate all the way to my shoulder. It gratifies me. The other blow to the right follows a fraction of an instant later, so close that an observer would not be able to tell which blow came first. They would only see the armless droid wobble, its internal balance mechanism destroyed.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

Now, this feat requires some elaboration. Maul engages in daily practices with his bladework in which he performs ten thousand maneuvers. He repeats this exercise one hundred times a day and still finds time to conduct other exercises (such as the aforementioned fights with assassin droids), sleep, meditate, and receive teachings or missions from Sidious (which do not come to Maul every day, I should point out, and on days in which he has missions, his exercises will be suspended until the mission is finished). The latter activities would significantly reduce his time in the day to conduct these practices. How long precisely it takes Maul to complete one of these regimens is unclear, but to perform ten thousand moves one hundred times per day on top of his other tasks is impressive. It would necessitate him to strike several times each second.

When I complete my basic exercises, I power up my double-bladed lightsaber and practice maneuvers. My body is as strong as durasteel and as fluid as water. I shift from one position of attack to another. I fall on one knee and slash my lightsaber as I imagine cleaving my victim cleanly. I roll away and grip my lightsaber with both hands for a vertical sweep. I leap and twist and come down, leading with my left shoulder. I deliver a death blow and leap away, somersaulting in the air. I perform ten thousand slashes, lunges, attacks.
My lightsaber is no longer a separate weapon, but part of my arm. I move in the time it would take my opponent to blink. I move in the time he would take to raise his weapon. He would only see the space where I had been. He would feel the sudden shock of the blow that would knock him to the floor. I do these maneuvers a hundred times a day. I do them even though my body knows them intimately, even though I have not made a mistake or a misstep in years. I do them until the memory of the movement is part of the muscle itself. The goal of the Sith is to fight without thought.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

He rushes and kills a Togorian before others are aware of his presence.

"Shut your flapping mouth. What's the difference? We have the ship." The Togorian captain turns away, unconcerned.
That's my cue. Everything on the bridge fades to gray—the screens, consoles, cages, open containers, discarded food. They are only obstacles or objects to be used, background to my targets. Even while the pirates have been speaking, my mind has been strategizing. I will move without thought, kill without mercy. And I will do it faster than those lumbering Togorians can take a breath.
I am in the room and have dispatched the first target before the others are even aware of my presence. He goes down without a cry, the victim of a ceiling-to-floor sweep from my lightsaber that cuts him in two. The thud of his massive body hitting the floor alerts the others. The captain turns and sees me. Roaring, he bares his fangs.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

This showing also needs context. Maul has rewired a frigate;s controls so that the engine controls and the weapons controls are crossed so that when a Togorian activates the engines, he will destroy the ship. Maul runs to his own ship to escape the frigate but is interrupted by a Togorian whom he fights. He slashes the Togorian a thousand times in a short but undefined span of time. We can surmise, however, that he did this in a brief period because Maul had to leave before a Togorian ignited their ship's engines to leave. All that would need to precede that is for a Togorian to enter the frigate's bridge and activate the controls. How long it was before one did that is, again, unspecified but still not long considering the Togorians were starting their controls by the time Maul entered his ship. 

My rage is a torrent, a burning river. I leap, twist, keeping my weight on my good leg. My lightsaber is part of my body now, merciless, hard, cruel. I dance around him, slicing his arms, chest, shoulders. I want a thousand cuts to kill him. He falls facedown without a cry.
I leap over his body and up the ramp. My leg wound screams in protest but I do not limp. I steel myself against the pain, disciplining my mind against it. I won't attend to it until I am safely away from this ship and have landed on Tatooine.
Then I hear the warm-up of the preliminary ignition of the freighter. I start my engines and activate departure procedures. A warning light tells me that the hatch will not close.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

Maul records that he could unleash four to five blows in the flicker of an eye and then steps behind and kicks an approaching Tusken Raider faster than the Raider can see it happen.

The Sand People advance on me angrily. In their breath masks and goggles they are protected from the sand that now stings my eyes and clogs my mouth. The howling intensifies. The Raiders shake their gaderffii and begin to surround me. There are just too many of them. I can take out four or five in the flicker of an eyelash, but that will just infuriate the rest. Frustration boils inside me. These interruptions deflect me from my mission.
I never run away from a battle. But this one will tax me, and my strength is needed for the Jedi. If my Master hears I have been wounded, he will be furious.
All of these calculations race through my mind, faster than the Tusken Raiders are moving. One fierce Raider is the first to come at me, racing forward with his stick held high. It is easy for me to fake a dodge to the left, then make a half turn and kick him from behind as he staggers, surprised that there is now empty air where I had been standing.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

He duels Anoon Bondara, swinging his lightsaber with sufficient speed to form "webs" out of his blurring motions. 

The Sith and the Jedi leapt from the speeder bike onto the platform to continue their battle. The docking ledge was only about ten meters by fifteen, barely enough room to maneuver in. Maul knew he had to dispatch the Jedi quickly, before Pavan once again vanished into the labyrinth of Coruscant's downlevels. He pressed the attack viciously, blocking and thrusting, the twin radiant blades spinning a web of light about him. 

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter
 
He duels Darsha Assant fast enough to weave a "shield" out of his blade motions.

His eyes were hypnotic, their golden hue an eerie counterpart to the bloodred and black tattoos covering his face. But they did not prevent her from deflecting his strikes as he again moved within range, his twin blades spinning so fast they seemed to merge into a crimson shield.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter

He kills a person with general invisible speed, nothing out of the ordinary, after which Maul also dodges blaster bolts (and interestingly, another speed feat interlaced with a strength feat, where Maul kicks a person with enough force to embed his foot in their torso.)

Maul heard Magneta’s bodyguard move, and Magneta, too—going for a hold-out blaster concealed beneath her apron. Maul was also aware that several field workers were gathered just outside the door, waiting to spring an ambush. Snarling, he whirled, moving faster than human eyes could follow, breaking Magneta’s neck with the edge of his hand, then spinning again to send his stiffened right foot into the chest of the bodyguard as he rushed into the room.
A hail of blaster bolts came through the front door. Dodging them, Maul ran across the room and dived headfirst through a window, somersaulting in midair so that he hit the ground on his feet, now centered among his astonished opponents. Growling, he clenched his bare hands and set on them, killing one after another.

--Taken from End Game

Maul evades and deflects spears and plasmic spheres launched at him and then clears through a twenty meter line's worth of Gungan warriors.

With the S-DST approaching the straits, Maul saw that stone fortifications had been erected on both fingers of land, and that from behind those bulwarks, spheres of faintly blue energy were being lobbed into the sky, decimating the STAP patrols. As the destroyer drew closer to the sandy shore, hundreds of orange-and purple-skinned Otolla Gungans appeared at the top of the walls, armed with energy lances and so-called plasmic boomers that could be hurled from baskets worn over one hand. Surfacing from the suddenly turbulent waters came a fleet of organically grown submersibles, whose weapons began to target the destroyer with orbs of destructive power.
The S-DST beached itself so that the droid troopers and droidekas could disembark. Rushing in to meet the hovercraft came a cavalry force made up of Gungans seated on two-legged wingless reptavians adorned with war feathers. Leading the charge were two green-skinned Ankura whom Maul assumed were Boss Ganne and his general. From the rear flew energy orbs launched from catapults strapped to the backs of beasts, whose sonorous calls reverberated across the lake. Battle droids marched out to face them, firing their E-5s continuously, and bolstered by the droidekas that wheeled toward the yelping riders, stopping only to fire from behind their individual deflector shields.
Maul leapt ashore. The horizontal hail of fire from the battle droids and the droidekas heated the air and conjured a breeze. STAPs fell from the sky like stones, and the energy spheres fountained water and dirt high into the air.
In planning his attack on the Orsis training camp, he had initially decided that his first kill should be Trezza. The Falleen had to be taken out while Maul was at the peak of his strength. Then the rest of the trainers and trainees could be seen to. But Maul hadn’t stood by his decision, undermined by reluctance to kill the being who had in many ways been his only flesh-and-blood caregiver. As a consequence, he had come close to losing to Trezza when they had finally joined in hand-to-hand combat. Maul had promised himself that he wouldn’t make the same mistake twice. Mistakes were part of the past—mere lessons like those he had learned on Tatooine—and he knew what had to be done now.
Maul gazed into the sky, where only a few STAPs remained. The aerial platforms answered solely to their droid pilots, but he thought of a way to make use of them. Summoning one, Maul launched himself into the air with a Force jump as the STAP soared overhead. Dangling from the platform’s starboard footrest with one hand, he called his lightsaber to the other, and ignited its blades.
Some of the Gungan riders saw him coming and took aim. Maul twisted his body, either evading flights of energy lances and spheres or fending them off with the lightsaber. Letting go of the STAP when he was still twenty meters from Ganne and the general, he called on the Force to send himself tearing through a score of mounted Gungans. It was clear that they had never seen anything like him. But then, who had? What Sith in the past thousand years had been allowed to wield a lightsaber in open battle? Was that in itself not enough to qualify him as a true Sith?
The rubbery Gungans all but disintegrated at the touch of the twin blades Maul had hoped to reserve for the Jedi. Their billed heads flew in all directions. His slashes halved them down the middle or through the midsection, and they squawked as they died. Their nostrils flared and their eyes bulged from their heads, and the white sand beach grew puddled with their blood. Maul maneuvered closer to Ganne, cutting the legs out from under the Gungans’ mounts or impaling them on his lightsaber. He launched himself into the air when he was still five meters from the Boss and the general. The latter lost his head to one of the blades, and Ganne was knocked from his mount by Maul’s extended left hand.

--Taken from End Game

Qui-Gon muses that Maul is quicker than he is, and Qui-Gon himself is fast enough to deflect a curtain of fire while brandishing his lightsaber fast enough to construct a shield out of his blade motions. 

Even without knowing anything else, Qui-Gon knew this man was trained in the fighting arts of a Jedi, a skilled and dangerous adversary. Worse, he was younger, quicker, and stronger than Qui-Gon, and he was gaining ground rapidly.

--Taken from The Phantom Menace

Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, Tiin, and Ki-Adi-Mundi surged from the pyramid entrance, engaging the terrorists that had driven them back. A quarter of the way across the immense plaza, the Jedi spread out in a wedge formation, their constantly moving blades fending off blaster bolts loosed from ahead and to either side. Behind the energy barrier fashioned by the lightsabers, Yaddle, Depa, Vergere, and two of the judicials raced out to divert fire from the rear.

--Taken from Cloak of Deception
 
Your thoughts on how these compare with the Gorgon?
#57 Posted by Saren (26015 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467: I'll get back to this in a day or so, if that's alright.

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#58 Posted by Silver2467 (16527 posts) - - Show Bio
@CitizenBane: Sure.
#59 Posted by Saren (26015 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silver2467: Apologies for the delay.

Gorgon's dearth of appearances makes it hard to provide more examples of his speed or to establish whether he could replicate/best Maul's own agility displays, but I'd like to think he could (although there is some ABC logic involved) because Wolverine's enhanced reflexes have allowed him to perform several of the feats that you listed for Maul. On the occasions that Logan dodges things instead of soaking damage just because he can, he has dodged bullets after they were fired, weaved his way through hails of bullets multiple times, moved faster than Vindicator could perceive, moved faster than the eye could follow, outraced a speeding baseball, kept pace with a low-level speedster for a while, left afterimages, and once fought Sabertooth so fast that Psylocke's mind struggled to keep track of them. More importantly, Logan has demonstrated excellent combat speed, which is the main reason why he consistently tags Spider-Man in their encounters despite the latter holding an advantage in terms of raw speed. He knows how to couple speed with precision, while Parker simply overwhelms opponents with superior reflexes. I've also heard it said that Logan has a recorded reaction time of 0.032 seconds, though I cannot personally verify that.

Gorgon has thus far been portrayed as significantly faster than Logan ----- not so fast that Logan cannot tag him, of course, but still fast enough for his speed to be a major factor in how he defeats Wolverine. Since the battles between Gorgon and Wolverine haven't been posted here, I'll post them below (not sure if you've seen them before, if so, skip ahead):

Fight 1:

Fight 2:

Several arcs after Enemy of the State, Logan fights Shogun and struggles to keep up with him; one of the reasons he gives for this is Shogun's speed, which he compares to Shishido's.

As for Gorgon's own speed showings, I think it is safe to say that he does perceive his environment faster than normal (the feat where he turns around and moves his sword through the air to slice a couple of bullets apart after they've already traveled most of the distance between barrel and target, since most human characters would be hard-pressed to catch even a glimpse of a bullet in flight). For Maul's feats of constructing a shield out of his blade motions, Gorgon has done the same thing to block bullets during his fight with Elektra and the fight with several S.H.I.E.L.D agents at Fury's hospital (scans above).

The best feat I can find for Gorgon's ability to leap distances is him leaping over a roundtable to strike someone sitting opposite. It's comparable to Maul leaping over a five-metre-high fence, although I can't think of a feat that's comparable to Maul moving so fast holorecordings would need to be slowed down to view him. Regarding Maul's speed feats against blaster fire, I'm not really sure how fast blaster bolts move. Perhaps you could clarify that for me. Gorgon has weaved around bullets before while simultaneously killing four men, and has run up to a gunman who was firing two guns at once, beheading him without getting touched by a bullet once.

For combat speed, there's Gorgon vs five Leviathan soldiers. One of them manages to tag him, but loses the offending arm and his life immediately afterwards.

In one of his earliest appearances, he fought dozens of Hand ninjas blindfolded and made short work of them.

I have no feats that are comparable to Maul's ability to strike several times in the blink of an eye, although Gorgon has demonstrated that once he starts hitting Logan, he hits him again and again while Logan struggles to hit back or regain his place in the fight. But Maul striking someone a thousand times in a short span of time is pretty hard to beat. I think it puts him ahead of Shishido in terms of combat speed.

Regarding whether Gorgon could block Maul's telepathic probing, he has two showings of psi-resistance: one where he no-sells Phobos' gaze that causes its victim to see their worst nightmares (although he says he can do so because there is nothing that he fears, and on another occasion Nick Fury resisted Phobos' gaze as well and the stated reason was that he's seen too much in his life to be cowed by the god of fear's powers), and another where a group of HYDRA psychics who were searching for a traitor in the organizations scan Gorgon's mind and one of them says attempting to read his thoughts is like looking into an abyss for a hint of light.

Whether Maul can block Gorgon's mind-reading is debatable. Wolverine has class-9 telepathic barriers in his head courtesy of Xavier, meaning no telepath below Emma Frost's level should be able to do anything with his mind. Gorgon managed to read Logan's mind and taunt him with his most unpleasant memories. However, Logan's telepathic resistance isn't always a constant. I have serious doubts that Gorgon's telepathy is even remotely comparable to Emma Frost's, and other characters like Mister X have also read Logan's mind. Most recently, a novice Jean Grey from the past (the earliest days of the X-Men) with literally no prior experience with telepathic powers reduced Logan to a drooling mess on her first attempt. Writers haven't really approached the matter of his psychic resistance with any kind of consistency.

Gorgon likely heals a lot faster than Maul does, to the best of my knowledge. I remember that Maul was tagged thrice in the final issue of his 4-part mini, first by two Black Sun soldiers and then by a Nightsister's Force Lightning, and finally by Master Lex. At the end of the story, he still retained at least one of those wounds (Palpatine asks him "What of the wound you suffered?" when inquiring as to whether Maul was ready for another task). Gorgon's been caught in an explosion and then stabbed all over by Wolverine and Elektra, but he still healed in mere moments. Of course, the best of my knowledge might not portray the most accurate representation of Maul's healing. Maul's lightsaber would obliterate the flesh it comes into contact with, but Gorgon would likely grow it back. I doubt Maul can say the same for injuries inflicted by Grasscutter. But while I think Tomi can handle slashes and stabs to the torso and similar damage, if Maul manages to slice off a limb, it could end the fight right then and there, since I doubt Gorgon can regrow entire limbs as quickly as he can regenerate smaller chunks of flesh being torn from his body. Of course, the same could be said for Maul if gets a limb chopped off.

The OP stipulates that no blade can cut through the other, buuuuuut what if Gorgon cuts the saber's hilt? Or am I just scrambling for a silly loophole here? Assuming Maul doesn't simply pick up the two pieces and use them as two separate sabers, a tactic like that could be an alternate route to a win for Tomi. As to whether Maul's saber could do the same to Grasscutter's hilt, I'm not sure ------- the sword's structure is apparently highly durable since it can slice through the hide of gods like Ares with ease, and according to the mini it first appeared in, it was forged in the fires of a thousand hells or some other flowery description along those lines. If a statement like that is meant to be taken literally (although I doubt it, myth-based stories are rife with hyperbole), Grasscutter's hilt might hold up to the saber.

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#60 Edited by Silver2467 (16527 posts) - - Show Bio
@CitizenBane said:

@Silver2467: Apologies for the delay.

I was the one with the eight month late reply. I think this is my line. 
 

Gorgon's dearth of appearances makes it hard to provide more examples of his speed or to establish whether he could replicate/best Maul's own agility displays, but I'd like to think he could (although there is some ABC logic involved) because Wolverine's enhanced reflexes have allowed him to perform several of the feats that you listed for Maul. On the occasions that Logan dodges things instead of soaking damage just because he can, he has dodged bullets after they were fired, weaved his way through hails of bullets multiple times, moved faster than Vindicator could perceive, moved faster than the eye could follow, outraced a speeding baseball, kept pace with a low-level speedster for a while, left afterimages, and once fought Sabertooth so fast that Psylocke's mind struggled to keep track of them. More importantly, Logan has demonstrated excellent combat speed, which is the main reason why he consistently tags Spider-Man in their encounters despite the latter holding an advantage in terms of raw speed. He knows how to couple speed with precision, while Parker simply overwhelms opponents with superior reflexes. I've also heard it said that Logan has a recorded reaction time of 0.032 seconds, though I cannot personally verify that.

Gorgon has thus far been portrayed as significantly faster than Logan ----- not so fast that Logan cannot tag him, of course, but still fast enough for his speed to be a major factor in how he defeats Wolverine. Since the battles between Gorgon and Wolverine haven't been posted here, I'll post them below (not sure if you've seen them before, if so, skip ahead):

Fight 1:

Fight 2:

Several arcs after Enemy of the State, Logan fights Shogun and struggles to keep up with him; one of the reasons he gives for this is Shogun's speed, which he compares to Shishido's.


All of this is agreeable. Logan could rival Maul's more mid-tier speed feats, those which entail basic imperceptible and blurring speed and reacting to projectiles, et hoc genus omne; it would be Maul's more high end combat and reaction feats that, in my opinion, should supersede Wolverine's. I am familiar with the Gorgon's very evident superiority over Wolverine in the speed department, but I am also confident in Maul laying claim to being distinctively faster than Wolverine as well.
 

As for Gorgon's own speed showings, I think it is safe to say that he does perceive his environment faster than normal (the feat where he turns around and moves his sword through the air to slice a couple of bullets apart after they've already traveled most of the distance between barrel and target, since most human characters would be hard-pressed to catch even a glimpse of a bullet in flight). For Maul's feats of constructing a shield out of his blade motions, Gorgon has done the same thing to block bullets during his fight with Elektra and the fight with several S.H.I.E.L.D agents at Fury's hospital (scans above).

Agreed on the former point, but were I to raise issue with Maul and Gorgon's respective bladework displaying the illusion of a "shield" from their blade sweeps, my issue with it would be that Maul achieved this during combat with another swordsman, while the Gorgon was reflecting bullets with his sword when he achieved it. I don't mention this in an attempt to invalidate the Gorgon's showing but rather to illustrate a disparity in its mode of accomplishment. The Gorgon gyrated, so to speak, his blade to intercept oncoming bullets. Maul did more than simply spin his blade in a linear manner; he navigated skillful strokes and parries with his blade aimed at an armed opponent. The blurring movements of their blades that coalesced into "shields" were different. While this would not necessarily render the Gorgon's feat of that type inferior (because really, measuring precisely how fast "moving a blade into a shield" is would be practically impossible), just dissimilar. I would hardly count it implausible for the Gorgon to duplicate Maul's showing in exactly the same fashion that Maul did; I am just isolating how the two differ.
 

The best feat I can find for Gorgon's ability to leap distances is him leaping over a roundtable to strike someone sitting opposite. It's comparable to Maul leaping over a five-metre-high fence, although I can't think of a feat that's comparable to Maul moving so fast holorecordings would need to be slowed down to view him.

Fair enough, although Maul also leaped to the top of a building later in that break-in, but how tall this building is was never defined. 

He tested the building's flat roof for motion and pressure detectors as he had the lawn. Vaulting to the top, he was confronted with an expanse of solar arrays, skylights, and cooling ducts.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Saboteur
 
For a more definite example, Maul leapt ten meters vertically to reach a speeder. 

The human, who had been staring at Darsha and her mentor with a strange expression—mingled relief and revulsion—seemed to wisely decide that they were by far the lesser of two evils. He vaulted into the skycar's backseat, followed by the droid. Darsha cast another glance behind her and saw the dark one leaping toward them. This close, she could see his face, and a more fearsome visage she could not recall ever having encountered. Then her neck was jerked painfully as Master Bondara hit the ascent control and the skycar rocketed upward.
But not swiftly enough. The vehicle shuddered from a blow delivered to the stern undercarriage, and then lurched to one side. As Master Bondara fought the controls, Darsha saw a black-gloved hand catch the cockpit's rear gunwale. He must have used the Force to help him jump, she thought, as the skycar was already a good ten meters off the ground.

--Taken from Darth Maul: Shadow Hunter

He also jumped to higher catwalks in the Naboo plasma refinery while preparing for his duel with Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan, but I have no exact figures for how far apart those are. You will have to rely on what was portrayed in the film.

Instantly, and without a word, droids began to gather in the plaza, where they fell into formation and marched off in the direction of the Palace. Maul watched them go, then hurried into the cavernous building. There he spent a short time imagining Amidala’s arrival, the ensuing firefight, the starfighter pilots racing for their astromech-outfitted ships and launching out over the escarpment, the Queen and Panaka setting out for the Palace...
Maul’s gaze swept the hangar’s broad entrance. A tunnel linked the hangar to the Palace, but Amidala would certainly assume that it had been booby-trapped, and would likely lead the Jedi and her infiltration team across the eastern fork of the Solleu River and through the narrow paths and across the skybridges of the Vis district. But a lightsaber duel fought along that route or in the woods that surrounded the Palace would be difficult to control. Somehow he had to waylay the Jedi before they exited the building. Again he scanned the dim interior, and his gaze fell on the tall blast doors that separated the hanger from the contiguous power generator building. On his earlier visit to the hangar he had done little more than peer into the plasma power station, but now, eager to know what lay beyond the blast doors, he hurried through them.
A short walk took him to the edge of a curved inspection platform flanked by circular engineering consoles. A catwalk extended from the platform across a deep and wide circular extraction shaft studded with towering acceleration columns, within which plasma energy was intensified before refinement and storage. The flashing columns were linked at various levels by service catwalks no wider than the central walkway, which terminated at a narrow door on the far side of the shaft. Maul paced halfway to the door, then returned to the inspection platform and paced it a second time, marking the length and calculating the distances between it and the catwalks above and below. Several times he leapt to higher or lower catwalks. Once he had committed the arrangement to both mental and muscle memory, he walked all the way to the far door and through it.

--Taken from End Game
 
On another occasion, Maul leaped over a group of at least thirty Tusken Raiders by first running vertically up a wall and then bounding off it; so this was done from a position of initial elevation, not from ground level, I should point out. (Running up and then backflipping off a wall is actually one of Maul's most frequent exercises.)

I turn my back to them, but only for an instant. I run straight for the canyon wall. I don't have much distance to cover, so I have to run fast. I feel the tearing wound in my left thigh, but I push it aside. Pain is another annoyance. It will not slow me down. I run up the sheer wall, calling up the dark side to escape my enemies. My contempt and my anger at the Tusken Raiders help me. I am able to scale the wall despite the pain. With a final burst of strength that sends red agony through my leg, I flip over backward, fly over the surprised upturned faces of the Raiders, and land behind them.

--Taken from Episode 1 Journal: Darth Maul

To be honest though, leaping distance should be irrelevant to the outcome of this match. I only posted that quote from Saboteur to convey Maul's speed.

Regarding Maul's speed feats against blaster fire, I'm not really sure how fast blaster bolts move. Perhaps you could clarify that for me.

Sure. To expound on how fast blaster bolts are, I need to first present information on what a "blaster bolt" is. The visible "bolt" of the actual particle beam fired from a blaster is nothing more than a tracer which travels slower than the blast particles themselves.

When a blaster is fired, a small amount of high-energy blaster gas moves from the gas chamber to the gas conversion enabler (commonly called an XCiter). There the gas is excited by energy from the weapon's power source, which is a small power pack for hand weapons and a reactor or a power generator for a larger weapon. The excited gas passes into the actuating blaster module, where it is processed into a beam comprised of intense energy particles coupled with light. The prismatic crystal housing focuses the beam, which is further focused, or "galvenned," as it passes down the blaster's barrel. The final particle beam, or "bolt," contains high-energy particles that cause tremendous damage to anything they hit; the bolt's visible beam is a harmless by-product of this reaction.

--Taken from The Essential Guide to Weapons and Technology
 
Other sources have reiterated this. (Note: The quote below is describing blaster bolts fired from starship laser cannons. Lasers and turbolasers fired from space-faring vessels travel at light speed, but blaster bolts fired from hand held weapons do not. However, the composition of the technology is more or less identical, just enhanced on starship weaponry to accommodate the necessity for more destructive projectiles in that combative setting.)

Energy weapons fire invisible energy beams at lightspeed. The visible "bolt" is a glowing pulse that travels along the beam at less than lightspeed. Therefore, targets can explode instants before the "bolt" actually arrives.

--Taken from Attack of the Clones Incredible Cross-Sections: The Definitive Guide to the Craft from  Star Wars: Episode II

With that said, surmising how fast specifically a blaster bolt is needs to be done apart from how fast the tracer moves. However, there has never been an explicit distance-per-time measurement given in any sources for how fast blaster bolts move, like there is for how fast bullets move in RL; similar to firearms though, various blasters impact with various amounts of damage and fire their projectiles with various amounts of speed. There have been hints at how fast blaster bolts are in some sources. For instance, in the MedStar duology, blaster bolts and slugs were regarded as both being too fast for human reflexes to respond to, which advertises a degree of comparison between the two as both are listed in a similar category and are compared with one another casually. 

Of course, the fastest moves in the galaxy couldn’t block a blaster’s particle beam or a projectile from a slugthrower.

--Taken from MedStar 1: Battle Surgeons

Generally speaking, I consider blaster bolts and bullets to be of near equal speed, especially since slugthrowers (firearms) are classified as more antiquated technology to the majority of the Star Wars galaxy (with the exception of primitive cultures); they are still manufactured and used but with far less popularity than blaster weapons. However, Star Wars' firearms may not be entirely comparable to RL weapons, because even their firearms are more scientifically advanced.

Tatooine's moisture farmers endure a subsistence existence, hovering on the edge of poverty. In addition to the harsh atmospheric conditions, the farmers must brave violent Tusken Raiders, voracious krayt dragons, and brutal thugs. Unable to obtain traditional blasters because the Hutts control the gun running, these moisture farmers must often resort to outdated and "primitive" projectile weapons to defend themselves.

--Taken from The New Essential Guide to Weapons and Technology
 
If you need any further clarification, let me know. 

Gorgon has weaved around bullets before while simultaneously killing four men, and has run up to a gunman who was firing two guns at once, beheading him without getting touched by a bullet once.


For combat speed, there's Gorgon vs five Leviathan soldiers. One of them manages to tag him, but loses the offending arm and his life immediately afterwards.

In one of his earliest appearances, he fought dozens of Hand ninjas blindfolded and made short work of them.


These are all helpful, but if I were to nitpick (which I am), Maul has engaged more numerable enemies in similar circumstances. Particularly, I would more highly esteem Maul's performance in End Game where he carved up dozens of armed droids than the Gorgon's performance against gunmen.
 

I have no feats that are comparable to Maul's ability to strike several times in the blink of an eye, although Gorgon has demonstrated that once he starts hitting Logan, he hits him again and again while Logan struggles to hit back or regain his place in the fight.

That would be fine as a counterexample. 
 

But Maul striking someone a thousand times in a short span of time is pretty hard to beat. I think it puts him ahead of Shishido in terms of combat speed.

It might depending on how you interpret it. To be clear, I don't submit that Maul can release a thousand blows in the span of a second; I doubt he could even manage a hundred in a second. Based on consistent speed displays and comparisons with other characters in his weight class, I would estimate that Maul can deliver probably a matter of dozens of strokes per second. To further highlight the context of the incident where Maul struck a Togorian a thousand times, that event was retold in The Wrath of Darth Maul, and the novel explained that Maul intended to finish his fight with the Togorian quickly because he realized that other crew members could ignite the freighter's engines at any point and as a result destroy the ship. In spite of this, he was comfortable cutting the Togorian a thousand or so times. From this context, we can extrapolate that he did this in a very brief period of time, but how brief lacks specificity. With my impression of how many blows he can throw per second, it was probably about a fourth to three fourths of a minute or so (as a very rough evaluation). If you think the Gorgon could manage that, the two should be at around an even level.

Maul was irritated by the Togorians' tendency to taunt before striking. He was also eager to leave the freighter, as he expected the other pirates would start the engines at any moment.

He glared at his opponent, then leaped and twisted in midair, spinning his lightsaber at the pirate. Maul's blade took off the pirate's arm before landing. The pirate collapsed, and Maul struck him again, but it was not a killing blow because he did not wish for the pirate to die immediately. He wanted the pirate to die in agony.

--Taken from The Wrath of Darth Maul

Regarding whether Gorgon could block Maul's telepathic probing, he has two showings of psi-resistance: one where he no-sells Phobos' gaze that causes its victim to see their worst nightmares (although he says he can do so because there is nothing that he fears, and on another occasion Nick Fury resisted Phobos' gaze as well and the stated reason was that he's seen too much in his life to be cowed by the god of fear's powers), and another where a group of HYDRA psychics who were searching for a traitor in the organizations scan Gorgon's mind and one of them says attempting to read his thoughts is like looking into an abyss for a hint of light.


He might be able to resist Maul's probing then. Maul has never demonstrated a propensity or special talent for TP; his feats with TP are basic, from Mind Tricks to thought reading, nothing extraordinary.
 

Whether Maul can block Gorgon's mind-reading is debatable. Wolverine has class-9 telepathic barriers in his head courtesy of Xavier, meaning no telepath below Emma Frost's level should be able to do anything with his mind. Gorgon managed to read Logan's mind and taunt him with his most unpleasant memories. However, Logan's telepathic resistance isn't always a constant. I have serious doubts that Gorgon's telepathy is even remotely comparable to Emma Frost's, and other characters like Mister X have also read Logan's mind. Most recently, a novice Jean Grey from the past (the earliest days of the X-Men) with literally no prior experience with telepathic powers reduced Logan to a drooling mess on her first attempt. Writers haven't really approached the matter of his psychic resistance with any kind of consistency.

That being the case, he could probably manage to infiltrate Maul's mind. 
 

Gorgon likely heals a lot faster than Maul does, to the best of my knowledge. I remember that Maul was tagged thrice in the final issue of his 4-part mini, first by two Black Sun soldiers and then by a Nightsister's Force Lightning, and finally by Master Lex. At the end of the story, he still retained at least one of those wounds (Palpatine asks him "What of the wound you suffered?" when inquiring as to whether Maul was ready for another task). Gorgon's been caught in an explosion and then stabbed all over by Wolverine and Elektra, but he still healed in mere moments. Of course, the best of my knowledge might not portray the most accurate representation of Maul's healing. Maul's lightsaber would obliterate the flesh it comes into contact with, but Gorgon would likely grow it back. I doubt Maul can say the same for injuries inflicted by Grasscutter. But while I think Tomi can handle slashes and stabs to the torso and similar damage, if Maul manages to slice off a limb, it could end the fight right then and there, since I doubt Gorgon can regrow entire limbs as quickly as he can regenerate smaller chunks of flesh being torn from his body. Of course, the same could be said for Maul if gets a limb chopped off.

The subject of the Gorgon's healing and pain tolerance contrasted with Maul's does lean heavily in Gorgon's favor; Maul, being both a Zabrak and physically-bolstered by the Force, does heal quicker and does possess solid pain tolerance and durability, just not quite as much as the Gorgon. So the majority of your paragraph on it sounds reasonable. But my disagreement with it is how the Gorgon would respond to a lightsaber wound. While I think he could probably heal from it, a lightsaber-inflicted wound is quite a bit different than a standard blade's. A lightsaber will incinerate the tissue it connects with and cauterize the periphery of its point of contact. I would imagine that would be more strenuous to recover from than a stab wound from Wolverine's claws, but I could be wrong, I suppose. Pertaining to the two of them being incapacitated by having a limb severed, your assessment on that makes sense. With that said, superficial wounds from both could be rather inconsequential. The Gorgon has proven he can fight with his torso ripped open and handled an explosion just fine; so nothing more needs to be said on his part. For durability, Maul has withstood with stun blasts, fallen thirty meters unharmed, resisted a Nightsister's Force Lightning, withstood a speeder's repulsorlifts hurling him back, withstood extreme temperatures etc. For pain tolerance, Maul underwent training under the tutelage of Sidious, who has pushed him through tests wherein Maul has ran through mazes with spike-surfaced walls while sensory-deprived; survived for days to weeks on end against enemies and predators; entered flight simulators with correctional functions that electrocuted him; practice sparred with Sidious during which Maul sustained numerous lightsaber cuts, etc., and he has fought with blaster wounds; fought with a relatively deep axe wound in his leg; fought with only a partially and improperly healed fractured arm; etc. I think both of them could endure less severe injuries.
 

The OP stipulates that no blade can cut through the other, buuuuuut what if Gorgon cuts the saber's hilt? Or am I just scrambling for a silly loophole here? Assuming Maul doesn't simply pick up the two pieces and use them as two separate sabers, a tactic like that could be an alternate route to a win for Tomi. As to whether Maul's saber could do the same to Grasscutter's hilt, I'm not sure ------- the sword's structure is apparently highly durable since it can slice through the hide of gods like Ares with ease, and according to the mini it first appeared in, it was forged in the fires of a thousand hells or some other flowery description along those lines. If a statement like that is meant to be taken literally (although I doubt it, myth-based stories are rife with hyperbole), Grasscutter's hilt might hold up to the saber.

Could work, but then this just becomes an issue of whether or not it will actually happen. Maul is at least as fast as the Gorgon in combat, has a precog to amplify his reflexes, can read body language on an opponent, and is very skilled as a swordsman. Would Gorgon be able to cut his lightsaber in two for a majority? We could discuss the feasibility of that. On that note, who would you consider the more adept swordmaster: Gorgon or Maul?
#61 Edited by i_like_swords (16547 posts) - - Show Bio

Bump.

Has Gorgon finally met his match?:D

#62 Posted by MFrenzy11 (497 posts) - - Show Bio

Freak....... this is a good fight. Imam give it to Gorton though he's killed some heavy hitters.

#63 Edited by Whirlwind_33 (1590 posts) - - Show Bio

Gorgon 5.5-6/10

EDIT: I'll give Gorgon the slight edge in physical strength and healing ability.