Goku VS Vegeta, Who would really win?

If equal power level, then Vegeta.

His arrogance comes only to opponent he underestimate, by the time mentioned in OP, he already knows what Goku is capable of.

Second, he will go for the kill immediately while Goku will job around first.

@thc:

Considering in their last encounter, Vegeta was completely blood lusted and amped by Babidi, to what degree is uncertain but taking into consideration both Spopovich and Yamu where amped quite a bit, one can come to the conclusion that Vegeta was as well, finishing a fight with a cheap shot to a opponent who has his back turned can hardly be considered a good showing or taken as a victory given he was obviously going for the kill but was unable to do so with a opponent who unlike himself wasn't blood lusted or amped by outside sources, and didn't want to fight in the first place. Given the fact that the fight was pretty evenly matched, even though Vegeta was blood lusted and amped by babidi, he also makes mention of how before the amp he realized Goku in his SS2 state was stronger then he was, 13.20 into the vid. Taking all of that into consideration, it would seem as if Goku had the better showing and would be shown superior, overall and given the OP circumstances.

@danm said:

Yes, Vegeta was amped but so too was Goku. To what degree for either, we are uncertain, what we are certain of is that they were equals.

He didn't finish the fight with a cheap shot, they agreed to finish their fight to fight Majin Buu together. Vegeta tricked Goku, then used a sneak attack to KO him so he could finish Buu alone. It is a good showing because it showed his attacks surpass Goku's atmospheric sense.

They were both fighting at their full, but yes obviously Vegeta wanted the win more, considering the fact that he was winning the fight. If Goku wanted to win more, he might have been winning instead, who knows, but it wouldn't have been by much unless he resorted to SSJ3.

13:20 is just another hint at Goku's hidden power that Vegeta's always been baffled over. And again, all it has to do is Goku having ascended beyond SSJ2, which is irrelevant to this fight.

@thc:

I would say in a even match, if one of the two individuals was amped and had more motivation to win the fight than that individual would be considered to have been on the losing end of the fight, Not exactly sure how Goku was amped, I certainly wouldn't consider being dead a amp, I don't believe it increases your power any, but we can both agree that Vegeta was and if Spopovich and Yamu are any indication, it was quite the amp. I'm sure you would agree SS2 Vegeta without the Majin amp fighting SS2 Goku, both given the same moral standard, either on or off, would end in yet another beat down for Akira Toriyama's favorite whipping boy, it may seem like I don't like Vegeta much which isn't the case, I actually find him to be more interesting and and overall more badass than Goku but you have to call it like it is.

Kid vegeta can already handle five saibamens with no difficulty. And handling offworld planetary missions that frieza's elite force had difficulty. Vegeta should be miles stronger than goku in their first fight and on par with zarbon and dodoria.

It would be nice if they showed more of vegeta when he was a kid,

@pope052: Goku is very unreliable aswell as he keeps getting injured, dies or has to travel extremely long distances to help his friends. Vegeta may not do as well in battle but that's because he wouldn't go to a trainer such as King Kai that to earn the right to train you must make him "laugh".

While I would agree with you on this point, I feel the need to point out that the trainer Vegeta "wouldn't go to" taught Goku a technique that allowed Goku to overpower and defeat him with: namely the Kaioken. As mentioned before by others on this thread, by the time Vegeta and Nappa arrived on Earth, they had been in numerous battles all throughout the stars picking up valuable combat experience. They were well beyond the Z Fighters of Earth upon their arrival, but Goku, who had ben training with King Kai at the time (not to mention the increased gravity of King Kai's world as a constant during his training) was able to soundly defeat Vegeta by overpowering him (against King Kai's warnings, but still..). Vegeta's a great fighter and strategist, but as shown during his battles with Recoome (I think that's how he spelled it) of the Ginyu Force, Android 18, and Perfect Cell, if he sustains too much damage in the course of a battle, he WILL adopt a "No mas, no mas" type of stance and sit on the sidelines nursing his wounds. Goku on the other hand, is ALWAYS willing to go all out, up to and including the point of death to defeat whoever is standing in front of him. Especially if his friends, family, or his adopted planet of Earth is in danger.

Could go either way

<------ Wins!

- Vegeta never had the special mentors like Goku did over the years of his fighting career besides his dad. It's already been established early about Goku. But the point I am trying to make is , Vegeta was always pretty much self-taught when it came to combat, he is very limited on developing new technique which is why he never attained SSJ3.

On the other hand, Goku has already developed 3 Super Saiyan transformations, the Kamehameha, the Kaio-Ken, Destructo disc, solar flare.... The list goes on.

Goku just has too many ways to deal with Vegeta. ( 9/10 for Goku)

Goku win, he learned many techniques from various people from Earth, to other planet and through out heaven.

While vegeta always rely on his raw talent until goku came, where he push his body to the limit. But he only had experience from ruling other planet. But never was taught various of techniques, or fought various of talented people like goku did in heaven or trained by other people.

Goku even defeated people stronger than him, while vegeta always losed if they have more power level. Although Vegeta can get a ass kicking.

Vegeta is the better fighter but in terms of power Goku wins I don't think Vegeta would last long against SSJ3 but since morals are on Goku might fight on even terms which might give Vegeta the edge.

Equal power levels, no 'funny' business...

good day

Vegeta. I'm biased.

@cybrilious4: Vegeta definitely outmatches Goku in terms of Ki versatility.

Though honestly I'm kinda split on this fight. We've basically NEVER seen Goku fight an opponent he's on equal terms with; he's basically always underpowered, and then uses his spirit to become stronger and more skilled and overpower them.

I always figured it was a toss up, either or depending on who is having the better day.

@thc: DBZ is totally inconsistent =P

http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_Inconsistencies

If only I actually knew how to do links here :(

I always thought the Goku vs Vegeta debate was kinda pointless. I understand some people like Vegeta more, but this fight isn't really arguable. Vegeta's sole reason for existence is to lose to Goku. If they were to have an equal fight, on equal ground, the writers would never let Vegeta win. We can argue feats all we want (which Goku has far better of FTR) but in-universe, Vegeta would never be superior.

Vegeta is a lot older than Goku. So has had more time to train. And he had been training since he was born, destroying planets and working for freeza. Goku has managed to achieve everything vegeta wanted in life before he did. Therefor I think goku would beat vegeta in a fair fight. Goku's weakness is his compassion. But if this was turned off he would be the greatest sayian warrior.

The fight would have went either way if Goku didn't have instant transmission.

But because Goku does have instant transmission, he has the ability to dodge attacks easier than Vegeta does and can surprise attack Vegeta.

Vegeta doesn't have a technique Goku can't similarly perform. Goku is the only one with the unique ability between the two.

Personally, I would say Goku wins the majority.

We've actually seen far more training and fighting from Goku from the time he was a small child. Until are able to see more from Vegeta... a lot more... I have to assume Goku has had more combat training and experience, even if only a little.

@thc said: "Goku also has a taskmaster-like fighting ability that allows him to hang with literally any fighter he's ever encountered, at least in terms of skill."

I totally agree with this statement. He's already more skilled than Vegeta, in my opinion, but he'll also be reading Vegeta like a book and countering his every move midway through the battle. Vegeta is a fighting genius, but Goku is even more so. Were it not for Vegeta's greater power level and his Great Ape transformation (impossible to emulate) in the Saiyan Saga, I have to believe Goku would've beaten him in their first encounter.

In the end, Vegeta admits that Goku better than him.

Goku. Equal power or not.

Equal or not, Goku 8-9/10.

Vegeta is more furious and fights more on instinct and they're both equal on skill. However Goku is a genius in fighting and will observe and adapt during the entire Fight. Goku is really tenacious and Vegeta is too stubborn and proud to give up so it would be a really long and bloody fight.

I'd say Goku will be barley alive after the fight but takes the majority

Goku 7-8/10

Lol

if they are equal in power, only determination and techniques will decide the winner,

this is a fight to death, with both sides bloodlusted right? if Goku is fueled by courage and stong will to win, Vegeta is also fueled with arrongance and warrior's pride, he won't give up easily. so determination can't give us a clue of who could win.

about techniques, i wouldn't say that Goku knows more techniques than Vegeta, because what i hate about DBZ is that the fights changed from tachniques and strategies to pure power and energy levels. there is a big difference between fights in Dragonball and Dragonball Z. in Dragonball we couldn't tell who would win, the fight was always full of suprises, new techniques, and strategies, i really enjoyed watching those fights. in Dragonball Z, fights lost their technicity, they become more a race of power, strength and speed, the element of surprise and new techniques was lost and no more used.

coming back to techniques, i think the only advantage that could make Goku win is Instant transmission, other than that i think it can go either way

Vegeta should win as he is more skilled but only in the short run.If the match goes on longer than Goku due to Goku's ability to adapt well the longer he stays in combat

Kakarot takes this.

Goku. For multiple reasons.

1). Ever since King Kai, Goku has had superior training.

2). Even if power levels are equalized, Goku has still shown to be faster than Vegeta.

3). Goku's will is stronger than Vegeta's. While neither would ever even think about giving up, Goku's will has allowed him to keep on pushing even when every odd is against him. Not the biggest factor playing a role here, but still a significant one.

4). Vegeta may have superior battle tactics, but Goku goes off pure instinct. I would definitely say that Goku's battle instinct has shown superior results than Vegeta's battle tactics.

Jmarshmallow

Couldn't be said better.

FTR: Goku wins. I'll consider actually posting later explaining why.

Equal power Goku has better technique and Vegeta is more tactical. Take that as you will.

Piccolo and Tien are the best fighters though:D Too bad they got sh*t on in power as it progressed.

People do know equal power level mean equal every stat except the mind and techniques. If I had to choose, I choose goku, just better showing overall, since most of his fight does not involved him getting his ass kicked

They are equal skilled, talented, most elite saiyajin warriors. Both trained at their best, and they are around equal in SSJ2. I think the only difference between them is their attitude. Actually they are like the opposite side of a coin, imo. Vegeta admitting Goku is the number one, was a filler, but I think it sum it up well. Goku is indeed not very smart, he was still a child inside. If we really love doing what we do, that sometimes gives better cope with new situations than straight, cold blooded problem solving analyze.

Goku adapting with instinct, Vegeta adapting with intelligence.

Goku's weakness is compassion, Vegeta's weakness is arrogance.

Goku is better at 1 vs 1 fights, based on his fight history. Vegeta (must be) better at fighting multiple opponents, based on his prince past(and even at the last movie, he did a multi tasking train).

Goku at Freeza saga was still could fight better on ground than in air. It never told about which one is preferred by Vegeta, but with his higher initial PL, he probably learned how to fly very soon, so fighting only on ground would be a little restriction to him.

Comparing their KI techniques is pointless, because they are both did very well techniques at their way.

In result, the attitude of Goku could give him a slight advantage, but it still could go either way.

Also this show it well why Vegetto is still cooler than SSJG Goku, imo.

In what way is Vegeta more "skilled" than Goku? I tend to think otherwise. Goku always seemed more skilled (i.e. had better moves and technique) than Vegeta.

Couldn't have said it better myself. I would even say it is highly debatable that Vegeta has better tactics than Goku.

BotG kind of craps all over the Goku supporters arguments. I know this fight is only taking them as they were at the end of Z, but in BotG, Vegeta showed a clear superiority over Goku. Super Saiyan 3 Goku was destroyed by Bills, and needed (help) to go Super Saiyan god. Super Saiyan 2 Vegeta, however, put up a pretty impressive fight against Bills. It just seems like Vegeta is truly the more powerful hero…Goku is just the protagonist.

@omnicrono: I wouldn't say more like a lot but so slightly.IIRC Piccolo has said Vegeta is a better fighter but I'm blurry on it.Honestly this battle is answered by SSJ2 Goku vs Majin Vegeta fight.Can go either way

Yes and no, BotG supports Goku's superiority in that he was able to access the SSG power through memory (after he powered down).

Regardless, Goku and Vegeta's power is equalized for this fight.

Ok, but that reasoning is unfair since Vegeta never even had a chance to become the SSG, right? All i'm saying is that he fared much better against Bills under his own power than the, supposedly, superior Goku did.

If they are even is power level and such, Vegeta should win.

Vegeta has beaten Goku every time they have fought. Goku always has help, as he does in all his fights. Vegeta would have killed Goku regardless if it wasn't for outside help.

Can anyone else who has seen this movie either confirm or deny the claim below?

@omnicrono: He did, he fought Bills as a SSJ2 whereas SSJ3 Goku didn't really do much of anything to Bills when he fought him. Which if so, then multipliers just became BS cause then it's SSJ2 > SSJ3 for some reason......of course it was just for that moment so I don't think it's permanent, was just a temp thing.

There is the vid.

Here, this is all the confirmation you need:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imiryMHYPB0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AY7g5R7gE8c

It's iffy. Vegeta gets angry when Bills slap his wife and proceeds to hit Bills a few times, when Goku SSJ3 couldnt do anything when he challenged Bills to a 'demonstrative' fight on Kai' planet. Completely different situations that has happened in the past a few times (i.e. a less powerful character managing to hit someone when he gets angry and surprises the someone). Vegeta didnt even look SSJ2 (although Goku didnt had any lightning when he transformed into SSJ2 as well, so is arguable).

Comparing 'SSJ2' to SSJ3 is out of the question to even argue about Vegeta suppose superiority on BotG (which isnt even cannon), when the rest of the sayans (including Vegeta) choose Goku to become the SSG anyway.

What? Vegeta has never beaten Goku? Not even once? It's either a stalemate, or Goku wins like during the Saiyan Saga. (Yes you could say Goku had help, but Vegeta did too; he had Nappa.)

Jmarshmallow

Yeah, the situations were completely different but the results still speak for something. A Super Saiyan 3 Goku was completely outclassed and toyed with by Bills. Demonstrative or not, we both know that is extremely out of character for Goku to hold back on an 'interesting' opponent, and opponent who can really test his skills. Sure, if he was angered he may have been more aggressive, but the fact still stands that he (likely) wasn't holding back yet was squashed. Then Vegeta goes on to make Bills work for his win a little and completely blows the multipliers out of the water. And, I don't know if you know or not, but (apparently) Toriyama was not a big fan of the multipliers or power levels beyond the end of the namek saga. Speaking on that, he even wanted to end the series after namek but was compelled by fans, and bosses alike to continue on. So, IMO, this is his way of ending the silly multiplier business. But, whatever, that's just my take. And, BotG is canon.

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/2012/09/26/toeis-press-release-for-upcoming-dragon-ball-z-movie/

Goku has never fought Vegeta on completely fair grounds.

1st time: Vegeta clearly would have legitimately beat Goku….had it not been for Yajirobe cutting off his tail, or Gohan and Krillen messing around with the spirit bomb. And Nappa was no help at all. Vegeta even killed him before the fight started lol

2nd time: They both kind of 'cheated' in this fight. Vegeta allowed himself to succumb to the majin and Goku was dead. And even so…Vegeta did 'technically' win this fight….

How so? I don't recall anyone winning that fight? Didn't it have no clear winner and then it got broken up?

As for the first fight during the Saiyan Saga.....that was the closest Vegeta has ever come IMO. But even that wasn't on fair grounds really, since Vegeta still had his tail while Goku didn't. So technically, even that one wasn't fair, and Goku still came out on top at the end.

Jmarshmallow

It was a joke. Vegeta 'technically' won it since Goku ended up knocked out in the end.

It's not really unfair that Vegeta had his tail. It's a part of his power set, like a transformation into a super saiyan. So, Goku really is the only one who had an unfair advantage in the fight. And, I don't think Goku even came out on top. Even with all the interference from Gohan and crew, Vegeta was still able to move his body whereas Goku was so beaten up he could barely smile.